Espejos de Aztlán; Dr. Tomas Atencio Discusses Cleofes Vigil

Broadcast of this program is made possible in part by La Montanita Co-op Supermarket, a member-owned natural foods grocery store featuring local and organic produce, bulk foods, earth-wise cleaners, vitamins, and more. La Montanita Co-op Supermarket, at the corner of Central and Carlyle, in Albuquerque's Navhill Shopping Center. The mayor of La Montanita Co-op Supermarket, is a folk hero, and he is a folk hero in New Mexico. He was born in 1917 in Arroyo-Ondo,

but he passed his life in San Cristóbal, and he is the mayor of La Montanita Co-op Supermarket. He was 16 from June of the present year, in San Cristóbal, New Mexico, in San Cristóbal. Mr. Cleoph is Vigil, he was a rich, poet, musician, and artist of what he was called, the nation of the mountains of blood of Christ. He accompanied us to the studies this night, Dr. Thomas Attencio, lecturer in the Department of Sociology, here at the University of New Mexico. Thomas, tell us a little about what you remember in your relationship with Don Cleoph, Vigil. Before I found Cleoph,

I heard a lot about him. I remember that he was very well-known, as well as the Alabansas, the Alabados, the Inditas, the Corridors, but I remember that there was a lady from San Cristóbal, Jenny Wells Vincent, who welcomed a lot of the folkloric matter of our people. And once he told me, as in the 1960s, he didn't know that Cleoph is Vigil. He was interested in a American coming as a Cleoph. And he said this because he helped in the beginning to publish or record the Alabados of the German brothers of Luz. But when we started in 1968, in order to organize the new race academy, he wanted to collect the wisdom of the Mexican people, the North and the Mexican people,

and that Cleoph was immediately immediately demoted. He was one of the founders of the new race academy, we would not say that he was an administrator, he was the philosopher, he was the one who gave us the direction and the one who taught us. In terms of what so many people could learn from Cleoph is Vigil, what would you say that were the most powerful cultural aspects that Cleoph was able to share? Cleoph was his brother, the member of the conference in our Father Jesus Nazarene. And he practiced his experiences, spiritual, social, that he had with the conference. And he always left us, taught us all that the most important thing to be North or Mexican, or to be born of the mountains of the blood of Christ was to be the brother,

to recognize each other as a brother, to help each other and to have that profound commitment of a brother. And he reminded me that he practiced and sang the Alabados, and he always said to us, they considered us as ignorant, but this was the ignorance of this people, the Armandá. And that was, I think, for me, one of the most powerful messages that Cleoph left, there are many, many more, but that is very important. Of course, he was caught up in the thinking in terms of the relationship to nature, the relationship to the Mother Earth, he practiced, if you want to eat the Earth, you have to eat this meat, and work the Earth, to carry it. And maybe not to carry it all the time, you have to stay with the Sadoon, with the Cavador. I understand, but I hope, because it is another point that is very necessary, because we have two things here, philosophically, very important.

First of all, the Armandá, among human beings, and secondly, the Armandá with nature, or maybe not the Armandá as much as the knowledge that we are children of the Mother Earth. So, you have been doing this for years, through the Rio Grande Institute, you organized a meeting in the Ghost Ranch, and Mr. Cleoph's Vigil was participating there. We have recorded part of that speech that he offered, Mr. We are going to listen to some comments that Cleoph's Vigil made about the fact that he had to seriously learn to speak English, and we are also going to listen to some words. I am talking English, but English really is not my language, my second language. In Spanish, in Castig, in languages of my grandfather,

and my ancestor. When I finish my song, please, don't ask me to translate, but I sign it up. If you want to understand what I sing, that's your problem. Yes. Yes. Yes. Yes. Yes. Yes.

Do you think that Cleof was a man who was supposed to share his wisdom or kept the understanding that he had of life? Cleof was always ready to share his wisdom. Not only did he not only have the wisdom of intellectual but also of heart. And this is an example of his singing, especially the salabas of the salabans. He was always very ready to share his wisdom. Although he was not talking to you when you had to speak English. But this is part of the mountains of the blood of Christ, right? Cleof was very frequently mentioned this concept of the little nation of the mountains of the blood of Christ.

How did you interpret this concept of Cleof? Well, the studies have always been known in New Mexico, from San Marcial to the South of Colorado to the Bay of San Luis. As we say in English, it is a cultural enclave. And we have called and we have called the Manitos. And this is a unique thing within the population of Hablispana in the east. Cleof began to name this place. It should include what we say from San Marcial to the South of Colorado. And this is where he lived, the South of Colorado. Maybe they could compare us with the concept of Iceland.

The concept of Iceland that comes from the myth of the Aztecs, the Aztecs, originated here in some place called North of New Mexico, south of Utah, Colorado, Arizona, where they were from here to Tenochisland. This concept was developed strongly during the Chican movement. We, the Manitos, were related to this concept. But they were more loved to a place here in the north. And Cleof was the philosopher who named it the Nation. And he also gave him life to that knowledge because he came from the land. The Nation is like we say in English, it's a sense of place. It's a place where we come from. We are like the Aztecs, we get out of the land. And Cleof was a spirit and gave him knowledge and gave him a lot of reflection. And he began to say, in the place of Iceland, it was the Nation of the Mountains of the blood of Christ. They were also in Spain, right?

He always recognized the importance of the indigenous people, the people as much as the Genisaro, who left his tribes, if they were to go there with the peoples of the North of New Mexico. The Nation was a force of giving us a sense of that we are a nation that is tied to a space and a place. And what was the philosophy of the Nation? Well, the philosophy of the Armandá, right? And there he was tied to everything. Thomas, we know that Cleof was recognized by the Smithsonian Institute of folklore. And it was also premiered in 1985 with the Governors Awards for Excellence in Achievement in the Arts. I wonder if you had the opportunity to talk to Cleof about these recognitions, how did he interpret this recognition? Not only that, but recognition that he was giving to the Nation.

Well, he was very grateful that he gave this recognition. Because for many years he was singing and he was telling stories, he wrote poetry and he wrote through many newspapers in the North. But sometimes even a lot of our own people did not recognize the aura that Cleof had and what he could help us. And it seems to me that when Cleof was first recognized in the first days of the Chican movement, when Cleof was with Montoya in California or with other places, he always sang very happy. He said, they are listening to me. They are listening to me. That's why he gave us so much support in the academy. This is a vehicle for me. This is a good tradition.

Follow them. It seems to me that when he was recognized in Washington by the Smithsonian, he said, look, until Washington was recognized. And when he went there, there was where he dedicated, first, what he called the National Anthem of the Nation, of the Mountains of Christ, which was a Cleof's composition. And that he could be there, so that they could get up. And he was very grateful. And I also studied with him in Washington, but when he was recognized, he was like that. I was there, I was practicing a lot and I was very happy. And I was very grateful to Cleof. It was very important that he was recognized, because many times they have to recognize him outside and then people start to recognize him here in Mexico, right? We are going to listen to a little bit of the tape that has been prepared by Mr. Frank Contreras. And in this segment, where Cleof is talking about the enamoring,

when the Spanish love with the Indians, with the indigenous people, and then we are going to listen to another song of Cleof's Vigil. Naturally, young men, Spaniard Francis, Bascos, Mord, they start admiring the beautiful Indian girls. Naturally, they were pretty. Okay? And what happened? Listen to what happened, okay? Okay. Okay. Okay.

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