Interview with Anti-Busing Activist (1976)

statement, and then I can ask you some questions afterward. I think it's a sad way to celebrate this nation's bicentennial and a sad day for American democracy. The Supreme Court of the United States which is supposedly dedicated to protecting the rights of all Americans today, and now its refusal to listen to the legitimate appeals of hundreds of thousands of citizens of Boston who opposed forced busing on constitutional grounds. The Supreme Court in my opinion. are a pack of flaming liberals who are definitely out of touch with reality, out of touch with the people of Boston and out of touch with the times. I would expect this type of judicial oppression, from the Soviet Union from Cuba or from China but not from the Supreme Court of the United States of America. I shudder to think what effect this latest and most insulting decision will have on the people of Boston the parents are frustrated. The

children are frustrated. Today's completely shocking decision plus the harrowing experiences of the last two years will result in the greatly increased escalation in white flight from the city which I consider will be the downfall and the demise of our beloved Dame Boston. Apparently the Supreme Court of United States is more concerned with the grievances of criminals than with the legitimate grievances of the law-abiding citizens of this country. All I can say at this point is God help America. God help us all. In your opinion or in your near certain knowledge, is this the end, is this the last attempt through the courts. Well we still have in Boston in the First Circuit Court of Appeals

an appeal on the receivership of South Boston High School. They have not heard that yet. I hope we will get some relief and that the Court of Appeals will find for the people and vacate the receivership at South Boston High School. [unintelligible] [unintelligible] But you say for the immediate future it appears as if the federal court at least the Supreme Court has decided not to take this case any longer. What do you think will be the reaction of the people in Boston? Well anything I can say at this stage of the game is pure speculation, I'm sure the people are frustrated and they will resist. What form of that - that resist- that resistance takes, at this point I'm unable to predict. Uh, as an anti-bus-er and as a parent of a child in the Boston public schools. I am totally disappointed, disgusted, frustrated beyond belief and empathize and sympathize with all of the mothers and fathers out

there. I think it's time for the anti-bus-ers in this city to come together once again, and to demonstrate their opposition to forced busing in whatever ways we have legitimately left open to us. One of them I see as being the legislative route. The ballot box. Elect those that will reflect our philosophy. Throw out those who do not. And finally come in one great voice and say we've had enough. This is it. We will not take any more we will not. That our rights as Americans and sovereign citizens of this country and of this state be trampled upon by any branch of the government whether it be the judicial, legislative, or executive. [unintelligible] ran anti-busing ticket. Yes I did, well... and you know that people voted for you because of that. yes. Do you feel now in light of the fact that the people voted for you because you

had that expressed feeling and yet you still haven't been able to accomplish it, do you feel the something wrong with the political system, or the governing system? Well I think there's something definitely wrong when it's no longer a government of, for and by the people but government to the people. We and we have to always be aware that our liberties were hard-won and that eternal vigilance is the price of maintaining that liberty; we have to always be alert and aware of what's going on with and within the government, so that we can submit legislation to affect some change for us. Now you speak of legislation but legislation - it appears is not going to change that... - That's because we have people in there who are not representing our philosophy. But if the courts can override any legislation that's passed doesn't it appear as if the route has to go through the courts and if the courts won't hear, what recourse is there then. There has to be a groundswell from the grassroots people to support

to unite throughout the country. The entire process and those who are conservatives tonight throughout the country to put pressure on the elected officials. What about the case in Wilmington which involves the suburbs and you think the people in Boston if that [unintelligible] case is entered, if the Justice Department goes into that case, do you think Boston will go in on the side of the Justice Department to keep the suburbs from having to integrate the schools with the cities. Well Chris I am am very opposed to Metropolitan-ization I am opposed to forced busing for anyone, whether it be urban or suburban, I think it's wrong, and it's wrong as it applies to me and it's because I live in the urban city and my children and the children out there. It's also wrong for the suburbanites. Forced busing should be abolished; it is a social experiment that has flopped and it has not proven to be what it was intended to be, an educational boon for minorities and poor

students. In fact it has greatly diminished any educational advance that had been made in the past and it has polarized the people of this city and of this nation. You indicated this new, when, I believe, I can't remember which news person it was that asked the question but that the same question I asked you before about the response of the people you indicated that you thought there might be some disruption because of this and that you felt in a sense or you said that you didn't really think you would blame them if they did that. I can't blame parents if they're frustrated and I am opposed to violence in any way shape manner or form. I don't know what they will do at this point. I did hear from Akron, Ohio today from Tulsa, Oklahoma, from many other states, who called and asked "What can we do? Can we help you? Can you help us?" We want to get together and see just what actually should take at this point; I'm very interested in doing that sort of

constructive whatever. If there were to be any disruptions in the city as a result of this - I wouldn't be surprised, I certainly wouldn't be surprised; I don't know what end it would accomplish, except to demonstrate their - our dislike with the federal court the liberals that are in there. What do you think the response of the anti-busing leaders will be to that if it happens or to know ourselves specifically? Myself specifically? what would my response be? I'm sorry but... Perhaps we're going to be called again to be the Patriots. And save our democracy. I want to move legitimately. But I can see that people should demonstrate their opposition in every legal way. Pickets, demonstrations, we're still allowed that under the law I don't know how long that will last.

If it goes beyond that. I have never done an of violence in my entire life. [unintelligible] But there are some who are ... gone beyond belief to put people in South Boston and Charlestown who've had no relief. Then nothing has been forthcoming from the courts for them. They are poor people by and large; they only want to send their kids to neighborhood schools with good people. I can't express my sorrow enough at this stage of the game. Do you feel a conflict, now, of being a leader of an elected political leader too. A feeling that you have to encourage people to obey the law and yet sympathizing. With her. I'm not, I'm asking them to go out and to legitimately demonstrate their opposition to forced busing, I'm not asking them to

do anything that's illegal and [mixture of voices] legally. They have their right to picket, they have their right to demonstrate and use it, use it. They have their right to lobby for legislation; use it. They have their right to go to the ballot box and pull that lever for the person that's going to be in there and pitch, pitch in with them and help them out of this terrible situation. Some of these mothers, their students, their children have been out of school for two with three years now and it's it's horrendous that these children are losing gotten a good education but I can't blame them I fear for my own children's safety. I can understand that said they they have that fear, for goodness sakes, I worry when my my son isn't home after a half hour, I'm looking around for him, and their mothers are still the same they don't want anything from this country other than to live their life in peace and to bring their children up as they see fit.

That's all they want, that's all I want for my own. And if they think this government is going to deny us that. Well I think the government is wrong; I think we have to do something about it. We have to get rid of those people that fail to listen to us. The Supreme Court or a faceless pack of bureaucrats to me they mean nothing. I could care us about what they decide in the Supreme Court as far as my children and the children out there, their their parents want to have the say, they don't want the Supreme Court making the decisions where their child should go to school. They want to make that decision for themselves. I want to make that decision for myself. I don't want