thumbnail of 1973 Watergate Hearings; 1973-08-03; Part 4 of 5
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it's been when he received a phone call and john ehrlichman the next morning mr eckman informed me that john dean would be handling an inquiry into watergate for the white house with funding concerning the investigation and that was to being present mr wittman and i then discuss the matter a procedural safeguards against leaks i told him that we are having this case as a major special with all of our normal procedures in effect i also indicated to him that we were going to conduct an aggressive and rigorous investigation and would probably be interviewing people at the white house on my return to my office at ten
am an arranged to meet with him at eleven thirty am in my office on june twenty one nineteen seventy two but i mean we discuss what made this sensitivity of investigation and the need to avoid leaks in a political year he also informed me to be have the responsibility of this inquiry for the white house and would sit in on many interviews of white house staff person now studying stated that he would be there in his official capacity as counsel to the president i know that i specifically asked mr dean on two occasions if he would be making his reports directly to the president i believe that this was one of those occasions and i believe that the other occurred when we were discussing the transmission of the p i fall material to him to assist yemen is incorrect i asked mr dean it would be reporting directly to the president are through mr haldeman are mr
erlichman in one day that he would be reporting directly to the present this meeting with mr being there was no discussion of whom we were going to interview our where our lead might take the investigation we get to discuss the scheduling of white house interviews through most of the game and is sitting in on the interviews as counsel to the president on thursday june twenty second nineteen seventy two after being raped by mr charles w bailey is assistant director general investigative division regarding the latest developments in the watergate hearings and undoubtedly is the result of information develop at that briefing i telephoned director arms of the cia i told him avoid thinking that we may be looking into a cia operation and i asked if you could confirm or deny this he said he had been meeting on this very day
on this every day with his men that they knew the people that they could not figured out that there was no cia involved i met again with mr peanut six thirty pm the same day again discuss the scheduling of interviews of white house staffers and now and to arrange the scheduling of these interviews directly through the washington field office rather than throughout the idea or at this meeting i also discussed with him our very early theories of the case namely that the episode was either a cia covert operation of science are simply because some of the people involved have been cia people in the cars ari cia money chain rei political money chain quite pure political operation for a cuban right wing operation or a combination of any of the i also though mr bean that we were not as
harrowing in on any one theory at this time are exploding it but that we just could not see any clear reason for those burglary an attempted intercepted communications operation i believe that it was at this meeting on june twenty second that i told him of our discovery of a bank account in the name of bernard barker who was arrested in the watergate burglary and the fact that a twenty five thousand dollars check the associated with kenneth awkward and forty x drawn on a mexican bank payable emanuel of their ale and the total amount of eighty nine thousand dollars for the positive in the park are out i do not have a clear memory of telling him about my telephone call earlier in the day the director helms regarding the question of cia involved it is likely that i would have discussed the nuns called him in connection with our discussion of the theories of the case
and for me that there was no ski area on friday june twenty three nineteen seventy two as debates met with me again to brief me on recently bought a telephone mr dean following my meeting with mr bates i'm quite certain that this fall again involve the park are banking on a new aerial and got her chance either in this color in the meeting of the preceding evening mr dean first raised with me the idea that if we persisted in our efforts to investigate this mexican money chain we couldn't cover our become involved in cia operation i remember telling mr bean one of these early telephone calls are meetings that the fbi was going to pursue all leads aggressively unless we were told by the cia that there was a cia interest for involvement in this case but one thirty five pm on friday june twenty three nineteen seventy two was to
being telephone me and said the general walker's deputy director cia would be calling for an appointment that afternoon and i should say mr dean you know something about one fifty six pm on friday june twenty third nineteen seventy two the secretary general is call my secretary and asked for an appointment and he was overseeing it mr dean call me again to nineteen pm and that is my recollection that this was a call to ask if i had scheduled a meeting with general motors for that afternoon i told him that the meeting had been scheduled for two thirty pm i seem to remember that he asked me to call him after the meeting i met with general motors it to thirty four pm on friday june twenty three nineteen
seventy two he informed me that we were likely to uncover some cia houses or sources that we continue our investigation into the mexican money today i understood that statement to mean that if the fbi says that we wouldn't cover cia covert operations and that the cia had an interest in masters of our own ballpark and in nine hundred and fourteen thousand dollars in all he also discussed at an ad agency agreement under which the fbi and cia agreed not to uncover an expose each of each other sources i had not read this agreement and still have not but it was logical to me at the time and i did not question them a lot i and that is that the general is that we will have all this in a manner that they're not around for the cia and that i would have to make a determination that's not how the fbi would proceed with our investigation in this area
i knew for mr deans earlier telephone conversation with me on this day of dollars would be coming to see me i have no recollection of memory whatsoever of general walter is informing me of this meeting that he was coming to me i'm talking to the white house that he had talked to the white house at all i understood him to be staging a cia position not a white house mess at this point i would like to comment on what waters memorandum of this meeting which i understand the dna evidence before this committee the inspector general is making an end to these memorandum that is a quote is great problem without a loopy this modern ottomans launched unquote i may have sent word this effect to let him know that week we would handle the cia aspects of this matter with kid gloves i
can speak categorically our that in the sentiment of that time expressed by me was an effort by me to abide by the cia fbi agreement and really it's only the possibility of exposing cia covert activities in peru sued of our investigation into mexico the sentiment expressed that in no way that related to any effort by me or the fbi to locate the watergate investigation in fact the fbi did not locate the watergate investigation generally and inspections reissued at the outset of the investigation and regularly thereafter to ensure that this case is a major case under the immediate supervision of the special agent in charge of the field office which investigative leads were referred by the washington field office or any other field office setting up leads to be pursued with respect to the rest of the
paragraph i may have mentioned the eighty nine thousand dollars in general what i do not remember but if i did i would have talked in terms of four checks in this total amount not a checkers his memo states simply because for texas were involved i probably also spoke with the name of taylor as well as a solver simply because these two men associated in my mind with the eighty nine thousand dollars in four chance he'll carry on checks and with a twenty five thousand dollars and one cashier's check the bulger check which were traced to the bank account for an art work with respect to general is common in paragraph three of this memorandum that i said this was the most awkward manner to come up during an election year they certainly possible and in the course of my conversation with general offers i may have expressed the thought at the watergate case was a hot potato for a new acting
director in the fbi in an election year and for the president too i know that i expressed this thought too many people have various times quote what it is just what i needed unquote was a refrain i know i struck with friends on numerous occasions jen all those references to quote ej would see what he could do and unquote and quote the gray would have to study the matter and see out the us unquote they only related might not a desire to pursue this investigation without compromising cia assets and resources no way shape are on that i say or seek to imply the general officer to anyone else for that matter that the fbi investigation would be other than aggressive and thorough the only conceivable limited an exception was the alleged national security considerations being presented with me for
being whipped as the record will show brought about a delay in the interview of several persons for a period of ten days to two weeks as a matter and as mike testimony will make clear in more detail i ordered our agents to continue to probe the mexican money chain and the daughter relationship during the period that the personal interview with mr glover with mr alvaro was being held in advance and mr bulger was evading us as we tried to interview them finally i have no recollection whatever general others making any statement as he alleges imperative for these memoranda the fact that his job had been an awkward one and then i was the potter i fell upon this to be a meeting of dollars i tour mr dean of the middle our interviews
the early and work around this problem until we determine what we haven't done three fifteen pm i telephoned assistant director bathes to tell him of my visit and dolphins and to tell him that the cia had an interest in this matter and that we may have uncovered a cia money came in this telephone conversation i undoubtedly ordered <unk> babies temporarily hold up an interview with mr olvera to continue to conduct appropriate investigation of uncle internacional of mexico city regarding before oh gary objects to continue to follow mr colbert movements and to continue to obtain to local records of his long distance phone calls as we sought to interview him on the afternoon of friday june twenty three nineteen seventy two
i again telephone list of being on two occasions once the three twenty four pm and once the three forty seven pm i cannot be absolutely certain that the names of their ailing dahlberg were mentioned in connection with the cia situation it is my best recollection however that they were and i emphatically told him that we would continue our peripheral investigation because of the depravity inconsistent reports i have received from bombs and mortars he requested that we not conducting interviews that would expose cia sources in connection with our investigation into the source of the hundred and fourteen thousand dollars in chess again determine what we were uncovering on tuesday morning june twenty seven nineteen seventy two i
met with mr davis and with <unk> mark felt acting associate director to receive everything on the latest to fall the latest development recall involved establishing a chain of custody for the contents of our website and is providing us with photographs of certain white house staff members who lead us in identifying an individual who had been the minister of the miami playboy club in december of nineteen seventy one in this conversation i also told mr pineda mr balter continue to evade us he would be called before the grand jury although i cannot pinpoint the exact telephone conversation i believe are by this date <unk> dean had requested that the screwball were not being interviewed because of alleged cia interest in this same conversation i also told us that being that it was extremely important that the fbi
continue its aggressiveness until we determine the motive reasons and identity of all persons and all i said that i might be called upon to testify before congressional committees and we could not have the fbi accused of not pursuing this case to the app following everything i telephone directory arms of the cia and asked him to tell me specifically at the cia had any interest in this job jarrell that would prevent us from interviewing him and also asked that in several others meet the following day to thirty pm in my office that means this default and this debate's to review our respective positions in this investigation record homs told me that he would not object to
determine whether the cia had any interest in the strawberry own call me like i advise <unk> felt that this meeting and also asked that we notify most of it director helms call me back later that happened and told me the cia had no interest in mr gary owen confirmed are meeting for the next day just seven minutes after director helms call me mr dean called me three forty seven pm and although i cannot be absolutely certain i believe this was a call again requesting the whole law interviewing mr varela mr golliher because of cia interest in these men i cannot recall i told him that i had just talked to director announcement warning that cia had no interest in the strawberry ale and that i was going to order that was through karaoke interview i seem to remember that must've been said that neither of these men have absolutely nothing to do with watergate i cannot
remember whether he said this to me in this conversation or an earlier conversations on wednesday june twenty eight nineteen seventy two ten twenty five am studying fell upon me and talked about rumors of leaks from the fbi material wants a previously delivered to the fbi rumors of a slowdown in the fbi at least from the fbi concerning the tracing of the hundred and fourteen thousand now once again i believe there was some discussion about our bureau in culver and it is my recollection that i was asked if i had ordered the interviews of the barrel and all well if i was going to order the interview there's discussion that i arranged for me director helms and the police deputy director waters that to thirty pm that
afternoon to try to get the cia situation we saw but i cannot be positive that idea and twenty five am on the same day mr hedman okay i was not available but i returned to squalid eleven seventeen am his first words issue the broccoli or cancel your meeting with helms and waters that day is not necessary i asked him for his reasons and he simply said that such a meeting is not necessary i don't ask them white wine was going to make the decisions as to listen to the interview he responded do you do i then felt on the record comes to tell him that i was counseling are meeting i also have violin lessons of all of the constellation but stated that the three of us would mean in the same conversation that made director helms
requested that we not interview active cia man paul wagner and john kass well i pass this information minister told an instructive that these may not be interviewed before reporters could get to the field however as thick as well have already been interviewed i met with west about the midst of aids and my office sent to thirty pm on this wednesday afternoon june twenty eight review the cia situation this meeting i was brought up to date on all the latest developments in the case that i can recall specifically discussing with them the alleged compartmentalization of the cia or the right hand is not supposed to know what the left is doing in sensitive operations in knots with this could occur we agreed that it was possible but unlikely in
the absence of some special white house interest in the highest classification of national security interests where they need to know was rigidly controlled his debates pointed out that under no circumstances should we back off any investigation the request of cia without forcing them to leave you completely their interest in this matter we all agreed that the fbi its reputation was at stake and i've heard them that i would not hold back the fbi in this investigation that anyone's requests including the president of the united states in the absence of overriding and volatile considerations i told them that if i were ordered to do so without valid reasons i would resign it was at in this meeting that i believe i gave mr paul and mr bates instructions to go ahead with the interview mr aguero and to continue our efforts to locate and interview mr balter
three fifty eight pm june twenty eight mr dean called and i was not available i returned the call up or thirty five pm and i believe now that this will involve a request i'm ester dean to warm up on the interview was happening now for the reasons of national security until she returned from her vacation in england i'm sure i said we would hold up for the time being witty without being interviewed so i can recall saying that we will interview her in england unless she returns from vacation and every day mr dean gave me her address in this conversation i believe and i passed it along the cool must have felt in which i instructed him to temporarily discontinued leads to interview and investigate ms kathleen should now in england in the evening of this same day wednesday june twenty one nine seven to
a key program was sent to a gap in mexico city instructing him to interview mr aguero concerning the port checks in the aggregate amount of eighty nine thousand dollars this order was issued in the afternoon meeting with mr felton mr bates i've only because of the phone call i made that record on sunday and twenty seven asking if the cia had any interest in mr aguero and his reply to the fact that cia had no interest eight fifteen am on thursday june twenty nine when nine seven to carter's council the interview of a strawberry ale and to instruct the minneapolis field of vision to make no further attempts to interview most of all are the two continued to obtain records of his long distance call i'm fairly certain that i did so as a result of a telephone caller steve mr dean at all that my department to dulles airport for an inspection trip to san diego in phoenix
it gathers that these interviews be although our national security reasons or because of cia agents i called mr phelps or his office and gave these cancellation marks on my own initiative i also ordered that george munro cia a station chief at mexico city not the interview because i know that in one of the many reports the cross my doubts that us cia station chief in mexico city in san diego on friday june thirty or is the default risk default in for me that assistant united states attorneys over one of the fbi to interview mr david young mr aguero industry now that our washington field office recommended interviews of mr mitchell just two young minister now i inspected mr paul thomas to being that we
were going to interview mr mitchell mr youngest now than any other is that we must continue and i also told him to get the message again the message from assistant united states attorneys over just as we have received sabina call me earlier that morning to complain bitterly about alleged leaks from the fbi and this conversation is my recollection at again raised the question not interviewing mr gary owens for baltimore and stated that they have absolutely nothing to do with watergate i cannot be certain mr dean call me again that you know i do not recall other not just a bean and i discuss mrs of arrow and older in this conversation i do know that must've been asked me to consider setting up a special group in the fbi to investigate the entire matter of weeks i told him that it was not necessary and that i would not take such action as to that
afternoon the report that must've been informed him that lester young and is she now would be available for interview during the first part of the coming week he also told me that mr dean still complaining about alleged leaks from the fbi on monday july three nineteen seventy two i scheduled a meeting with mrs felt quite simple special agent in charge of the washington field office a renewed investigation today and to consider revisions of a possible sea area involved this meeting lasted from two thirty pm until just about four pm and we discussed every possible theory the conflicts today in cia interest or not and the compartmentalization alleged existence cia was treating call it forty pm and i'm really told him that i was in a meeting and then i would return his call
this meeting as they did that i was not going along any longer on this phase of our investigation the request of anyone unless i receive from syria written request not to interview mr gary owens for dollar the thing i'm working for you i believe it's quite likely that in one of these phone calls michael mr bean that the fbi was going to interview a burial and awkward and lastly either writing the cia requesting that we not do so on wednesday july fifth at five fifty four pm i telephoned collins my contemporaneous notes of this call read as follows seven five i think through
web radiation for one thing i think it basically dollars then in parenthesis i will need a request in writing rather than the verbal requests to refrain from interviewing of maryland all part because the cia in its possession of developing investigation indicates there's cia involvement in some of these men and used by cia and part and there's indication some are currently being you there is the dollar playing either cia or political i do not want to uncover and surfaces cia national security operation in pursuing these leaks but i must for the record i have been writing from cia to request a refrain on the basis of national security matters are monstrously is that he would respond not later than ten am tomorrow
i said that i would order the interviews that i did not have the writings by ten am and at the bottom of this telephone memorandum i've written the tv above information jw dw on the cw be from six pm to six ten pm now gaining in those men are masters being open rates but this one i would like to comment on their waters memorandum of this phone call which i believe is an evidence before this committee with respect to general over statement that i told him that the pressure is on me to continue the investigation were great i am quite certain that i did not so express myself it is entirely possible however that on the limited question the alleged impact of the investigation on cia national security matters the only topic general lovers and i were discussing i mean the messes of cairo and
over clear that their interviews were a necessity was only the players' expression of national security and that should prevent and that the fbi for the sake of his own integrity would refrain from conducting interviews only have we receive such a written requests from the cia respected understatement of the great talking john dean why have no specific recollection of telling the lawyers that i talked to john being it is entirely likely that i didn't tell them a lot is that i haven't promised fifteen that the fbi was going to interview mrs of their island all her unless we have a writing in the cia requesting that we not do so on thursday in nineteen seventy two i met with violence i remember that he delivered to me the writing that i requested
and i remember that it indicated the cia have no interest in a very overt altar after reading the documents i concluded that there was no reason for us not to interview mrs of maryland author what in my office at about ten twenty five am and thirty am i ordered the interviews of bulgaria and altered immediate my recollection of the conversation with dollars at this meeting differs with is in several respects my principal recollection is his preoccupation with the fact that he was unable to give me a writing stating that there was a cia interesting of maryland all right and he's telling me that he would resign the ross are directed to give me such a writing this talk to me several times during our conversation i call the devil always indicated
a feeling of irritation and resentment at the extent to which white house aides that involve themselves in the question of cia but i do not recall is giving me any details and i have absolutely no recollection of his closing to me false report may i ask i too was concerned in this third of the contradictory reports i've been receiving director helms was fifteen dollars with respect to cia and others and at the abrupt cancellation by mr lippman of the meeting i had scheduled with director helms and then a lot of sun june twenty eight my recollection is that you and i then engaged in a general discussion of the credibility and position of our respective institutions in our society and the need to ensure that this was maintained
toward the end of the conversation i recall most vividly that john oliver is a lean back in the red overstuffed leather chair in which he was sitting with his hands behind his head and said that he had come into an inheritance and was not concerned about his pension and does not going to let these kids came around anymore we stood up together as he prepared to leave i cannot recall which one of us suggested that we ought to call the president to tell him that this confusion and uncertainty that had been uncovered in determining cia and kristen those cia handlers i believe it was done a lot of those who suggest that at first because i can find the recall saying quote that you should call the president you know him better than i i believe is that no i think you should because these are persons the fbi
which has to interview we did not settling who had fallen but this time i would like to comment on some aspects of journalist memorandum of our meeting and your six respected tell him to cease future investigations on the grounds that it would compromise the security interests of the us even less so but i write him a letter to this effect we did not have any specific detail and our telephone conversations like that i had asked him specifically about this is a burial and older and i'd said to him that in interviewing them we did not want to uncover and services cia national security operations and on july six meeting i most definitely
recall general awkward saying that he could not write a letter stating that our investigation of a burial and alter it would jeopardize would jeopardize national security i distinctly remember that his inability to write such a letter to the fbi was the strong central theme of his comments raucous meeting with respect to general motors a certain power grab one and he read himself into american involvement that he could not possibly have suppressed the investigation of this murder i did not discuss the watergate investigation of mr haldeman anytime except that during my confirmation hearings in nineteen seventy three but the request of senator kennedy by telephone mr haldeman asked whether mr dean had shown mr haldeman copies of the fbi reports of interview at no time that anyone ever order our request me
to suppress the investigation as i've testified i was obviously aware of the hot potato aspect of the investigation sensitive to any implication that the fbi would not do a thorough job and that it killed any number of people perhaps including mr eckman certainly including mr dean at the fbi would follow its leads wherever they go i was saying privately as well as publicly and i made a little low but there was just no way to stop or divert an fbi investigation once it began i was making the point publicly and response to press inquiries that no one man could do it and to control an fbi investigation would require intro to many people from the attorney general down to the casey i was also saying at this time and later
that even if an attempt or maybe control and direct an fbi investigation the details of such an effort would lead and in this election i probably mention that koalas by saturday june twenty four one nine seven to meeting with our washington field office agents on the subject of allegedly to the fbi information with respect the power's assertion to concerning his report to meet with his white house conversations i have no recollection of being fought by general walters that he and director announced that met with white house about persistence and a gentle others have been directed to tell me that i see that the investigation will uncover cia covert operations i have absolutely no recollection of any kind of being told i don't want it had been inspected by white house
aides to bring a false ideal to me concerning cia handlers and so on june twenty three i am sure that in general was had told me this i would remember india i was shocked when i first read newspaper accounts in may nineteen seventy two actually based on this memorandum i have no recollection of mentioning any visit our discussions with his tv as i have already indicated i do remember that he repeatedly stated his inability to write a letter indicating that the cia hadn't been masses of gary owen ballpark and that he would resign and record producer i'm quite certain that he spoke of such a coarse as dangerous to the president and i know that although i do not recall his use of the phrase march i know
that i use in my subsequent conversation with the president that seems quite likely that i picked up the phrase from donna lowe with respect to general while his assertion that i'm on him that ayatollah khamenei general findings that i could not suppress the investigation never that i have any occasion to say to the attorney general that i could not to suppress the investigation even the fbi and i certainly do not believe i said this to join a lot i had no reason to lose them i believe that general motors may be confusing my possible references to my public remarks in my thoughts at the control an investigation of the fbi everyone involved my contacts with his findings were extremely limited throughout the investigation
never involved the discussion over the details and always assumed that the investigation will be fully unfurl in fact at the outset of the investigation i had a telephone conversation with his findings in which we explicitly agreed that this should be a vigorous investigation i may very well have mentioned this to dollars with respect to get all this recession are very tricky gray at all the women that he would prefer to resign but his resignation would raise money questions that would be detrimental to the president's interests i have no recollection whatever having made this statement in general is i certainly never made such a statement to me to muster an economist at all i have expressed myself in the context of our discussions of our
determination to proceed to interview masters of barrow and all hard unless we received a written statement a cia interest and now have a memorandum prepared by assistant director basis of the journal investigative division recounts a meeting between mr paul is today sunday on june twenty eight nineteen seventy two i quote from that moment on the wall i must've they pointed out that under no circumstances should we back off of an investigation at the request of cia without forcing them to reveal completely their interest in this matter mr falk and i both pointed out that the fbi reputation was at stake as well as with the various positions but we did not be about the usual back under any circumstances unless the reasons therefore were publicly expressed mr gray made it plain that he would not hold back the fbi's investigation that anyone's requests including the president of the united states and if
you are going to do so he would resign and go it's certainly possible that i discussed this conversation with <unk> openness debates with a gentle work with our waters and the context is telling me but if they were directed to write a letter serving cia interest in this is a very involved or he would resign with respect to get all the sensation and three that he made was haldeman mitchell about the other i have no recollection whatsoever of mention specific names and do not believe in that idea but it is certainly possible that i've told a lot is that i would take the investigation wherever it with respects donors assertion however agree that the great felt it important that the president should be protected from his would be protectors he had
explained this to beam as well as haldeman ehrlichman is possible that i express the sentiment contained in the first quarter the sentence in the context of responding to the general expressions of irritation but white house aides i heard from them a lot i could not have told him that i explain this to be alderman and ehrlichman because i never express such a sentiment in any event i had said that being on several occasions that the fbi would investigate the case no matter how i have led and they were told that the general with respect two dollars a session in progress read that quote he said he was anxious not to talk about joe because he was afraid that his confirmation hearings he would be asked whether you have talked to people about the watergate case anyways to be in a position to apply negatively unquote it's quite possible that
i express myself along these lines if i do and i'm sure that it was in the context of our discussion about expressing our concerns to the president typically who have not the president himself would be talking with specter dollars a session in paragraph three that the great city would like to talk to the president about it but the great fear that request from him to see the president would be misinterpreted by the media my recollection concerning our conversation about talking to the president has recorded above and i recall nothing further but it is possible that i did say that i believe a request by me to see the president would be misinterpreted by the media respect a gun alters assertion in paragraph three that oh i said that if i were directed to write a letter to him saying that future investigation of this case would jeopardize the security of us and covert operations the agency
i would ask to see the president explained in the service i thought this would do to his injuries the potential danger to the president in such a coarse or outweighed any protective aspects of my mother figures in the white house and i was quite prepared to resign myself on this issue i answered him as they didn't love i absolutely do not recall done a lot of saying are implying that white house aides had directed him to write a letter falsely claiming cia employees but the gentle fought in this excerpt about danger to the president and to serve as for the president's interests that general motors would be directed to write such a letter a when i recall as being the son of the central part of the discussion gemma watters and i engaged with respect two dollars a session i'm very gratified that i could not sit on this
matter and that the facts would come out eventually i probably did say the general officers the facts would come out eventually as i always believed they were what i would have had no reason to tell you that i did not but the fact was that we were not set on a sitting on we were investigating it on high priority basis i met anatoly and that there was no way for anyone man or group of men to control an fbi investigation even if one wishes to do so after the office i sat at my desk quietly and mulled over our conversation i was confused uncertainty and unease i was concerned enough to believe that the president should be involved i decided to call our
request to inform the president of what i would tell them i decided on this innovative because i knew it was close to the president had his fans and fifty one am thursday july six nineteen seventy two i spoke to most innovative santa monica california be a white house with and i told him that that was an irony in concern about the confusion that existed over the past few weeks and determine with certainty whether there was it was not the cia interesting people but the fbi was just interviewing biggie is of course are not my exact words but they do express their thoughts that i conveyed to him again although these are not the exact words i also conveyed to him the thought that i thought that people on the white house that were careless and in different in their use of the cia and the fbi
i also expressed the thought that this activity was insurers insurers to the cia and the fbi and that these white house that people loaning the president i asked if he would please inform the president and it is my best recollection of the city without thirty seven minutes later at eleven twenty eight am on thursday july six nineteen seventy and to the president politically express his congratulations to the fbi and asked that x vs congratulations to the agents in san francisco who successfully terminated a hijacking there the previous day i thank president and that's that then set him into the very best of my recollection these are the word of the president there is something i want to speak to
you about the robbers and i feel that people on his that are trying to mortally wound you by using a cia agent fbi and by confusing the question of cia interest in on marvin people the fbi refused to interview i have just talked about greater and i asked him to speak to you about that there was a slight pause and the president said that you just continue to conduct your aggressive and thorough investigation following this conversation concerns of his i believe that if there was anything to the concerns i expressed to the president pardoned mr mcgregor that i would hear further in the mother i did not i came to the
conclusion that gentle others and i have an alarmist i believe i held for many months the longest at my office again on july twelve nineteen seventy two at this meeting apparently gave me a memorandum which i am now on conveying information to the effect that the cia punished certain it is his humility uncertain until i really many officers of the united states attorney for the district of columbia containing a notation of its receipts and my handwriting i have no recollection of this memorandum i still do not recall noting its contents at the time i am npr i'd
probably gave it to my secretary to put in his date at general motors thought my aunt it is also possible that i may have radical message felton bates as i know i did with the july six nineteen seventy two memorandum at general motors brought to me i know that it has been suggested that the information in this memorandum concerning the aliases of medium pot would've been material assistance the fbi watergate investigation since libyan use those aliases wyman letter and some of their pre watergate trials which were under investigation the insinuation has been made that i somehow purposefully suppress this information to enter the investigation this is nonsense first is i have stated i do not recall noting the significance of any of the information that the times second i am
positive that the fbi had by then clearly establish that lilly and one or one pen letter and if i had any intention of suppressing this information i would certainly not have left it in my state in short any suggestion that i had any improper invention in my handling of this memorandum is absolutely false i have also suggested that the path and then you refer to in this memorandum was in fact used in the break in and the office of dr ellsberg's psychiatrist i stay categorically that i had absolutely no knowledge of such an event are the plans for such an event until it was reported in the newspapers this spring at this point i would like to comment on the lovers memorandum of like thirteen with respect is meeting with me and they're like whoa with
respect to get all his assertion and three and he thanked me and said that this case could not be snuffed out and it would leave quite high political i do not remember our lives subject could have come up with this meeting in any event i could not have said would lead by ty politically because i have no basis for such a bully i suppose i could have speculated that it could really quite eye politically or stated that in a case of this nature there's no telling where leagues might not i do not remember any part of the conversation which might cause me to be talking about stopping outbreaks after the july six nineteen seventy two writing was delivered to me and i ordered the immediate interview investors oh galileo and all her we have no problems with cia interest on non interest and our prospect the interviewees with respect to general motors assertion in paragraph three that dollar is in
the clear yet gotten a check morey spends and have deposited it in the mexican by i do not remember talking to him about the barber chair he may have asked me in any event if we didn't discuss it i could not have made these statements the facts were that mr paul burton an interview these monies and it was just there these funds to the best of our knowledge in the fbi would never deposited in the mexican bank and stand not giving chat mr bulger mr balter gauge that spans i do not recall discussing this with john waters but if i did i would certainly have discussed it on a factual basis i think he was mixed up and writing are dictating his memo simply because
he was not as familiar with the facts in these particular transactions is i what i may very well i told him it was undoubtedly a political contribution was political money all along when the fbi thought this to be a cia covert operation the cia money changing political operation a political money washing operation or a combination thereof with respect to my report to get all those of my phone call or the president including the statements attributed to me but the president asked if i talk to get a lot of the leads that the president asked for my recommendation in case that i told the president could not be covered up really quite high and that the president should get rid of the people that were involved have already testified as did my entire recollection of my telephone call with the president version of my conversation with the
president and i have to say that it does not square with my memory of what i said that the president on what i said don't want us about the call from the president this july twelve nineteen seventy two meeting with general it is my best recollection that i'm really sad that i had spoken to the president last week on the subject we've discussed when the president of the sinai that i certainly did not remember discussing the conversation other than to tell him just what i said to the president i'm not saying the president would not be covered and i had no recollection whatever telling him that it would be quite high and that i felt the president should be admitted that people remove all and i'm just as positive that i did not make such remarks to general i probably being shut out owners that on several occasions i had told john dean that this
investigation would have been exposed to have risen ball no matter how i am et that was it he's my conversation yesterday with my conversation with the president he only responds by the president by now recall part of every called my remarks was that we should continue our thorough aggressive investigation with respect to get all those assertions are a creed that later on that they may have thought that dean and repeatedly conversation i'm deena said okay gray had heard no more on the subject he asked whether the president spoke to me that i said he had on another matter that have now brought up this matter what may
i could not have said that i thought the mr bean and repeated the conversation that i did not at any time though mr bean that i have spoken to the president my last moreover show no call to our prime minister bean and no visits with mustard being on july six nineteen seventy two through july eleven nineteen seventy three i get asked now if the president had spoken to him about my car he said he had trouble president but not on this subject i did tell him that i've heard no more on the subject from anyone with respect to joe all his assertion that her for that great and said that the us attorney had subpoenaed the financial records of the committee to reelect president it had been suggested to him that he stop its infighting could not talk to the attorney general to see if there was any way to any legal way to do that is he
could not i i have no absolutely no recollection of anyone ever contacting me to stop any city i believe i would record certain events that occurred i would certainly have to record any such increase to the attorney general assistant attorney general of the united states attorney i simply do not know other organs could have received as thought it is possible that we could have been discussing a news story if there was one about the fbi not subpoena inappropriate record but i do not remember discussing the subject the general law with respect to dollars assertion in progress for that quote he said that he had told the president in nineteen sixty eight it should be aware of his subordinates who had tried to wear his command and she just rights and quote i probably said this job just because i had expressed has talked to the president in a letter to him just after his election in nineteen
sixty eight with respect the general motors assertion and five about resigning i have no memory of again discussing regional waters our respective resignations at this meeting and to my office again on july twenty eight nineteen seventy two at eleven am to meet with me as he says in one of these memoranda to clarify the last memorandum he had given me and replied to the inquiries from mr palmer a cleo i now know that mr palm was a special agent assigned to the fbi alexandria va loans i do not recall remember the details of this meeting with any degree of decision it is possible that i recounted the details of this meeting and either one of them may have a memorandum and their files regarding why the fbi files may
contain other relevant information on mr cleo i know that i did have a telephone conversation with mr helms regarding mr cleo and this could very well have been the subject of the call and maybe mr helms on thursday fb
1973 Watergate Hearings
Part 4 of 5
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Robert MacNeil and Jim Lehrer anchor gavel-to-gavel coverage of day 35 of the U.S. Senate Watergate hearings. In today's hearings, Vernon A. Walters and L. Patrick Gray testify.
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Politics and Government
Watergate Affair, 1972-1974
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Anchor: MacNeil, Robert
Anchor: Lehrer, James
Producing Organization: WETA-TV
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Library of Congress
Identifier: 2342046-1-4 (MAVIS Item ID)
Format: 2 inch videotape
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Color: Color
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Chicago: “1973 Watergate Hearings; 1973-08-03; Part 4 of 5,” 1973-08-03, Library of Congress, American Archive of Public Broadcasting (GBH and the Library of Congress), Boston, MA and Washington, DC, accessed March 2, 2024,
MLA: “1973 Watergate Hearings; 1973-08-03; Part 4 of 5.” 1973-08-03. Library of Congress, American Archive of Public Broadcasting (GBH and the Library of Congress), Boston, MA and Washington, DC. Web. March 2, 2024. <>.
APA: 1973 Watergate Hearings; 1973-08-03; Part 4 of 5. Boston, MA: Library of Congress, American Archive of Public Broadcasting (GBH and the Library of Congress), Boston, MA and Washington, DC. Retrieved from