New Mexico in Focus; 509; Lines in the Sand: The Changing U.S.-Mexico Border, Part 2

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foundation in reaching the cultural life health education environment and spiritual life of the citizens of new mexico last summer the president of mexico was talking about an open border have the events of september eleven slammed the border shut us and mexican economies depend on immigrant labor reform could be a casualty of this war find out what happens now in focus his next nominee he's a

lean into lenses hello and welcome to in focus how marcy chopper immigration is one of the great american paradoxes we are a nation largely made up of immigrants and their descendants and we are fiercely proud of our diverse roots yet throughout our history new waves of immigrants have often found them sounds and welcome in their new home perceived as threats to be a culture and livelihoods of the people already living here the debate over whether or not to welcome new immigrants into a nation made of immigrants has never ended and that debate has taken on a special urgency in the past couple of months we had originally intended for this program to examine the importance of mexican immigrants to the us and mexican economies and to ask whether the immigration reform discussed by president fox ambush at their early

september summit would successfully make its way through congress the facts are playing mexican immigrants living in the us were crucial jobs that americans are often unwilling to do at the same time those immigrants and billions of dollars back to their families in mexico as much as seven billion dollars were sent in the year two thousand according to estimates by the central bank of mexico that's enough to make it the third largest source of national income for mexico behind oil and tourism the various reform proposals that were discussed in washington were aimed at setting up the legal framework allowing mexican workers who now often entered the us illegally to legitimately answer and work in this country the fundamentals of the us need for labor and the mexican need for cash have not changed but the events of september eleventh have reshaped the entire political landscape and change the nature of tonight's program before september eleventh there was talk of opening the border now politicians are talking about the need to tighten lax immigration

standards and increase border security it's not clear that reform is dead but its prospects don't look particularly good here to discuss mexican immigration in outlook for reef warm and positive or eleventh america are my guest gloria and yet the chair of the city of santa fe immigration taskforce jared block refugee resettlement director for catholic charities of central mexico pamela kennedy an immigration lawyer and legal counsel for the mexican consulate and laura this couple on administrative officer for the mexican consulate in new mexico thank you everyone for being here today or independent start with you what is the out long before mike well piracy first thank you for having me here and i my opinion at this point is that we're in limbo that there's no movement because of the focus of government and government services and government funding has shifted dramatically since september eleventh mom i think it's a an issue that still needs to be discussed i think it's an issue that needs to be dealt with on it's affecting

commerce off route on both in both sides of the border you know not only the mexican side but the canadian side to so i think that eventually that we will have to deal with the issues of immigration and legalization and citizenship amongst the many people the many varieties of people that live here in this country what are some of the content is why i do what my big concern is a lack of civil liberty liberty he's in india yesterday's new york times william sapphire is a renowned columnist of the conservative than to witness how we agree with and talked in his column yesterday about the the end of the executive orders that are going into basically rob people see any suspects of any suspected terrorists if the judicial process so what we've heard all the things the issues are affiliated with the patriotism active lives and celebrities in concerning in a wiretapping in our email being read this goes way farther because the end result could be that people are executed

without a fair trial or without even a child as we know it that people can be imprisoned that they can be put on trial in a non american style court so that way it would be twelve jurors are any number of jurors and that would be held in a military court setting so there wouldn't be any necessity for a unanimous decision so a person could be convicted of terrorism with three two thirds of the jury convicted them and then can be executed so i think i think we're talking about a much wider range of loss of civil liberties then just wiretaps an email use laws your greater security though i don't see how i mean you know saying we we can be pulled is pulling anybody in into those situations that it could become like in that mccarthy typesetting where people are corridors suspected you know are are treated in a much different way than than anybody else is in the system and that and i think that that

that they're too flawed system exist right now because if you see that the people who are undocumented good can get deported for id debut on where that would have been you know we have people in the mexico with twenty one to twenty five dwi say don't even go to jail let alone you know get deported or sent to a prison without legal counsel panel what are some of the parameters by which an immigrant can be detained at this time anybody who is an immigrant who is not a citizen and states can be detained for various reasons for criminal offenses for over staying out of these safe they are here on a visa on their all oh there are many reasons why people can be detained by the immigration service and these were reasons that existed before the tragedies of september eleventh so but now i understand that they can be changed be detained nearly by suspicion and immigrants can be detained for seven days under the

patriot act for weight without being charged and so the government that obama has seven days to figure out what the charges are against them the immigration service can hold those people for those four seventy seven and these are people that they would suspect some sort of terrorist activity that they can then detain but of course none of us you know who those people are until the seven days of laps and whether they were or were not involved in in any sort of terrorist activity they are then let go if no charges are filed against them so jerry what kind of local effects have these changes had here in new mexico what i've seen from talking with with our clients in the refugee resettlement program these are families from from all of the world including emily east alm is bound kind of two responses i would say on the one hand i've seen a positive response from the community as far as people being interested in maybe who some of these faces are a community they're not

familiar with mom but then i've also seen responses as far as i am quite being questioning and suspicious maybe before being curious or and i worry about that response we've had some particular instances that i've been involved in where agencies in town have been questioning the legality of our clients being here in fact in one case where there were accused of being a potential terrorist so i think it really changes how song people are looking at immigrants and refugees in our community and i think that's you know one of the casualties of september eleventh is the suspicion the outcome of people looking over their shoulder at newcomers in a community with the suspicious eye and i think that we all need to be aware of that and be proactive as far as getting information out in the press about who the immigrants

and refugees are community what rights do they have as well is the residents are in and it reminds me also of the discussions in california in the past years when they wanted to try to to be formed what they said were their laws and restraint are the engines of immigrants into the state of california and with governor wilson as soon as he began his dialogue it allowed people to say things that they might not have said before that and so when somebody in power says something against a class of people approve for people in alaska other people say that's ok and we can be more restrictive of the rights of certain people are and just by the way the local or their immigration status and that's the danger of some of the dialogue that you're hearing now i think i was in california during twenty seven campaigns and you know ran one of the only successful campaigns in santa cruz county that that overwhelmingly did not support twenty seven ende what i discovered is that we as like the no's have

become he identified problems with the state based on what the government's saying you know you'd see commercials with voice overs of the governors say they keep coming and they keep coming years fighting a watchful waiting here all walk you know and so we've been contributing one and four partners in this democracy and and that's the thing that terrifies me too because it's like we keep hearing this analysis that's based on your evil were good you know and that's not to say that we're you know it's just too simple analysis and i think that a threat to people's lives and safety you know to give permission you know we it's locally that seeks up in espanola have been having some problems and they went to the white house to talk about the number of hate crimes that their community has seen since september eleventh and so i think that it has a very real effects in terms of language that we use and how we identify people as as threats as migration into this country changed as a result of this as anybody information about the border from mexico to hear whether it lets people are coming more people are coming in

cancer offices around the word and us consular offices around the world the process has slowed i think it's slowed down substantially around the date september eleventh and eighties picking up somewhat but it is slow and they are doing more background checks there is a list of specific countries and specific groups that they are looking at more carefully in terms of issuing the sense yes even tell you about this they think that that man we received call saying that maybe the border was going to grow that that was going to be costs into the price of something about that we never saw that i mean of course maybe the oldest last line i mean they have to stay not nice over there but there are still grasping and that be the borders didn't pass i think day economic impact should have been very very widely banknotes just workers and erudition right now he's very classic this of course so an ad that point

i think we don't have specific numbers somehow it has said agrees that the aide would make you play that i think it's ongoing which isn't in four people are still need to come here for jazz singing remember thinking i think there's a i mean they also go for as balin things that should be below the borders i mean the commerce its very great eu is not a country of gaza because they need a second and it grows food or something that they're the thing is that they're here then mexico and then they keep funding nicely go from mexico and eventually got to see that that does for example of us citizens that was inundated with his chipper i mean their mission and demons well and i think that one of the interesting things that happened during those this september eleventh time period was that the big flag on their water inside i was flying at

half mast you know and that president fox called of the depo on the ideas he says the city and they know that you know in solidarity that was a very strong statement i thought for more from our neighbors to say where there with you i think everybody appreciated then eventually getting our president was at one of the first to say that cain that that he was sorry for what happened what kind of information it giving people right now who are concerned about their of their status ain't there something the regime and meanwhile the us maples many different things one of them is even more impatient to them you know he had been shunting why they have to do an election and they shouldn't do i think there's a few meat ration well we have we always have tried to advise him do that their documentation and to try to do have them innocent legalize their status or something but whenever a filibuster levees we have to advise them to be careful in the way they as

conduct themselves and to try to respect the laws that's what we can do at least one thing i think you were telling me earlier that anyone with a false id would be in very big trouble well and right now it owes her life and then these to use whether the saving always i'm robin looked at those air person that carries that i thought maybe i mean can hatch orders and got in here for a second bag so we don't want to do and being that situation especially now in common than not to do that it mac os individually each is set a kind of mexican eighties which had been meticulous fossilized thing and neo soul and i were posted her son something that contacting authorities summer day our knees to that end there are some great fun writing these ninety of identification for domestic so that we can it carried eleven information on the ins restructuring in and how that is going to change now i know that the era that attorney

general ashcroft announced researcher and this week and probably pam army the glory would be better to answer that question and i'm not a well i'm not i completely understood with the new announcement and what that's going to mean i do know that the discussion has been about splitting the department into two different directions one which would be enforced and one which would effectively be helping people to process the applications etc and kind of recognizing that come due to have someone different goals and so really try to be clear about that not exactly when he announced that they would be spinning immigration services an immigration enforcement into two separate girls can you tell me what that's going to mean well i'm not sure anybody knows really what that's going to mean i think the complaints in the past have been that the enforcement and the what we call the educations side the

side that says here's the benefit huge or permanent residence or future citizenship and enforcement which are the people who do the arresting people violate their status those two deployments were very closely linked and may be too closely linked and so i think that's one of the arguments to split up the immigration service into enforcement and two on education schooling mom i think the concerns about the proposals that we've seen are that the hands of those two divisions may not i don't have the power that they need to get the job done and that the focus will be on the enforcement side to the detriment of the adjudication side or that side that gives benefits issues the permanent residency issues just visas for visiting whenever issues of citizenship people are eligible and i think that historically the problem that they have more resources have gone towards the ian enforcement side and you could see i

get this specific operations that went into effect in el paso and along the san diego home tijuana border and do you know their investment in all like the altar you know the night vision goggles and all that stuff then all the sudden the finance hadden and was using to try to stop it you know that the crossings and end at the expense of people who had been waiting for five years to become citizens and then they are processed getting delayed even longer when i was on the am we used to sit on a congressional committee aunts on immigration and then another one on citizenship and you and in that haven't dealt with the whole issue of like had a deal with enforcement howdy howdy you invest resources into supporting the people who have come here illegally have gone through the process and you know won't become citizens waiting and they played you know so i think that historically that we're still talking about the same thing but formalizing it even farther so that it is to separate entities but i would hope that they would you know not put so much

emphasis on just enforcement and and you know we because otherwise it's a very clear message in us it all the you know we don't care that much about you becoming a citizen and it was a time to be doing these for years and the congress the years in the department of justice to split the agency and this is not necessarily the time to oppose these sweats when we're trying to deal with other issues in terms of terrorism and who are we who how can we better patrol or enforce our own lives the laws that we already have on the books happily they're forced those and to protect us from what happened on september eleventh are we discussing how we could've done it better how we could have used the laws that we have we have lots of laws houck we improve the communication amongst agencies and not go directly to this issue of schooling in a very important agency at a time when we'll have the time to sit down and do it with calmness and with some

clarity about how we want to be without borders and reports of injury they distracted emphasis on going after physicians in oregon you know more you know do an assisted suicide is like is this an issue of national importance and one other issue to keep in mind is it's not just the immigration service in fact a lot of the people that are being accused of being terrorists that instigated the prawns on september eleventh were infected should be says at an american agonizes consulate abroad and that's the us department of state the issues those visas so what kind of changes are being made within the state department to tighten up with their own rules and so as not to allow certain kinds of people in the country on and not deal with these enforcement issues which in the past have been directly it directed very clearly at the southern border scott

garrett three million undocumented mexicans in this country how is this going to affect their status and then three million when that festival more that's what some of the research that i did three million undocumented how is going to affect them and it will there be detentions and a lot of well they have access to legal representation we've always had access to win representation minimally arm when there is and when when the mexican consulate when a private attorney gets a call from someone like that often there's not much juan can do for them to prevent there being removed from the united states but they are always eligible for representation that they pay for themselves there are no public defender kind of armed groups that can represent people in detention i think that i am we were hoping to have sung

at some new immigration laws directed at legalization and some people within the country i think those talks while they are still ongoing walk in it's a whole lot longer too to come to sound to create a law that that then can be passed and signed by the president so that process is going to take a whole lot longer than we had anticipated any other specific reforms that have been put on the back burner as a result of this now i just wanted to point out what they would say and in our case for example the us consulate used to go every day boucek okay the person they're going to be sent to mexico and that's a weight also who i mean tractor company in a way and try to see eads and soundbites in sometimes our co workers have been able to stop searching

the date i send out the message home when they have papers or they have other thing so we have in we had to try to point at somebody and aloe year something to stop that so we admit it had not going to they're going to have to increase in a way over we got about a minute haven't i just wanna ask everybody around the table if there is any reason for optimism at this point to to feel that some of these reforms that were being talked about previously will still stay at the table and an end many positive things happening correlate to your first clip say i'm certainly a dispute right you know i'm always an optimist so something will change and me we know what was going on you know that airlines are obese are different when we woke up on the morning of september eleventh and i dont want changes to happen in that manner but i i feel like i'm you know there's always elections is always a political process and if we continue to have our voices heard that i think that that we can cause change jerry going would add to

that that the wake of this terrible that one of the things thats happened is i have seen numbers in this community locally and actually looking around to see who are the ed unfamiliar faces in our midst as i mentioned that as it's a negative connotations but it's also had some some positive outcomes there are people asking who are the sikhs in espanola who are the the muslims in albuquerque or arabs who are these other faces i think has been very positive in interest in the other an unfamiliar hamill i also if you can have if you have any information where people can get information if any legal assistance if they or define himself detained and i think if they are armed persons from mexico they can certainly call the mexican consulate in the lotus can give us that information i think other than that that people who are detained on ought to call our to exert their right to make a phone call and call their family members and or call their

attorney have their family members call an immigration attorney make sure they know what their rights are not waive any of the rights that they might have i'd like to add though one thing about the immigrant community i think that those that i deal with on a regular basis i think they're very pragmatic i think they're very hopeful and i think they were all pleased to have been in this country and been here to support us sharing these awful events of september eleventh and i think the immigrants in new mexico are hopeful that with the help of all of us that they can remain here and can be safe and can become citizens eventually will we had and that their entire time thank you everyone for being here today that concludes our program for this evening tune in again next week for another edition of unfocused marcy chop up for everyone here and focus tonight to respond to this program received weekly email previews of the show or to find out more about him focus visits deanna focus web page and w w w that he

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