1973 Watergate Hearings; 1973-11-06; Part 1 of 5

it's bad is is in the senate of the united states a resolution to establish a select committee of the senate to conduct an investigation and study of the extent of many which illegal improper or unethical activities were engaged in by any persons acting individually or in combination of others in the presidential election of nineteen seventy two or any campaign pandas or other activity related to it and factoring to washington november six tonight on a videotape coverage of today's hearings by the senate select committee on presidential campaign activities he's a junior

this was republican day before the senate watergate committee sitting in this witness chair to nineteen seventy two california nixon campaign workers a kentucky congressman and a masterpiece official tell stories which were aimed at showing that the nixon campaign was a victim as well as a perpetrator of dirty tricks the committee generated its biggest news of the day they're in a closed executive session this morning the senators and family bought a compromise of a senator like a suggestion that the committee attempt to arrange a meeting with president nixon didn't care more on that there is a balance in washington today senator edward kennedy a member of the watergate committee said in a letter to the new hampshire governor that the committee was a travesty and accuse the democrats of not cooperating with the republicans former attorney general elliot richardson told another senate committee that a court appointed special watergate prosecutor would be unconstitutional judge

johnson america still holding hearings on how and why two presidential changed don't exist whether that the president's personal secretary rose mary words big ol dust off at the white house mr nixon was reported preparing for a national television address on the energy crisis and there was speculation that the speech might also touch on his current watergate related problems and as to the white house to the watergate committee was to go to talk to the president didn't get a report on their ear today's executive session of the committee blasted for not have that was helen senator sam irvin his office the meeting was attended by every member of the committee except senator edward tierney of florida much of the discussion centered around a new plan to get the president to meet privately with members of the committee a plan for suggested by connecticut republican lowell weicker but the committee did today was to instruct chief counsel slammed there's a minority counsel fred thompson to meet with white house counsel's fred bizarre and leonard to have an imminent and the work of them at later sen levin

explained the committee's intentions to reporters it's been at the polls the people at the plant the pope has famously

the unique soundbite of debate and

later this week we can do that they'll be back at the close of tonight's replay to discuss this and other

things will senator howard baker the committee's vice chair alice snedden are buying our guide on how the testimony itself unfolded today in the first hour california republican leader tom campbell said i'm out there were nixon rally with that was disrupted in october nineteen seventy two by a violent <unk> carrying prohibited and some workers union banners he said it was a frightening experience in the second hour another nixon worker in california michael taylor charged its girls' aunt janet's an actor was distributed by mcgovern workers in the jewish community of los angeles wanted that contain the charge that sometimes happens to the people instead of the people to the heavens any news and the gop congressman tim lee carter of kentucky told of being called a mother and then assaulted by demonstrators in front of a miami beach hotel during the republican national convention is it that voters said the enemy then was no more fanatical

than those revolutionaries in la and it also now a boston police superintendent joe alonso been remodeled spend less injured policemen generally attempted is to disrupt a gop fundraising dinner in boston and solomon suggested that the federal government should pick up the tab for protecting presidents and providing security on demonstrators in our interview central bankers summarizing the contents of very academically were introduced into evidence and now to the hearings in the car fb is bleak is be

it's because both witness mr drummond and one man is welcome says like many non presidential campaign accusations of all you're welcome besides says my opening question

law since january of nineteen fifty two i was educated in the public school system in fresno california riverside california at berkeley and the hastings college of the law which is a law department california a republican republicans approximately twenty years and they have served in almost every capacity and chairman of that committee and certainly save california republican central committee executive committee

and in the finance committee for small donations state law you know i'm in my second term and you can't let him do that is you know who i was and this is a value that was staged by the re elected president committee and within the state it was sponsored by the ladies within the party and have a name a people to people consisted of eight so many women of national

prestige of the republican party the object was to conduct a state rallies in the cities and towns these days and conducted in cities and towns in california from sacramento to sell and what we don't know he sees the president german for the reluctant president committee was unable to attend our rally and i was asked to pinch hit and the masters tournaments for the affair that was to be held in the parking lot of our shopping centers the garden village shopping center in fresno and as was explained to me

the ladies who were on the bus are no three who are supposed to be on the bus that will stay the united states the entertainer is how to entertain at a local candidates service began have an opportunity to present their homes so people gathered there were numerous signs and banners particularly among the spanish american people

proclaiming their dislike for president nixon proclaiming their affinity for the candidate george mcgovern demonstrating their opposition to proposition twenty two thousand farm labor initiative on the california ballot last november indicating that they did not like this is ben wills and generally the crowd was milling around on the bus arrived in a very organized matter these people are really about to the point where we were i might say that if we had a microphone and we had

speakers we have in dallas and we were unable to be heard or even to continue with a rally at all and many of the people are because of the no is the close proximity the jostling the pushing and shoving many of our people who had come to hear the speakers laughter so please it happens to be president organizations in fresno and she was strapped to the extent that she required medical attention similarly was

injured in the jostling i might add that there were many others who love them receive similar my love to as i was on the podium was that whitney handled one of the partners are signs that was being carried out listen live in one yes i think that the way that statement at that work for you you mentioned that with us seasons provocation and in my opinion the

fact that it was a plan that provocation for more violent activity has in progress none of the top searches or physical abuse was turned into confrontations avoided the people who were on the bus as a matter of fact if you haven't even got off and as i indicated in my statement i don't believe that mrs van willis was even on the bus at that time for that reason many of it when it became apparent that the rally was frustrated and could not be conducted because of the noise of the intimidation that was being carried on a lot of the people were on the bus somewhere the bus and the bus left

let's listen they knew the name yes sir we're similar included refused to things aren't many details so they didn't want to be disclosed oh yeah the people live there

now we haven't seen before she's been recognized by i think that i recognize some from pride demonstrations that i have tended to have attended the time in other areas of the state we have our office when i say we the republicans have openly and a ten story office building in fresno the homebuilding and this building is located are mall which is a four or six o'clock central mall down a memo has know

and on one occasion be entrance to the whole building was locked at a demonstration was held in front of the building although we occupied only two small offices of americans for a building yes so when i said preventive know people could get in or get out that many difficult and unpleasant there wasn't our idea you know and and the same people were chanting and really about the entrance at that occasion and many people who would have attended there turned away instead of

see through the militant group that was standing and talking at the entry to that effect what this was is also you know far more of the mystery that is new information with limited to be during the campaign shopping center i received a communication from our i believe it was jack gleeson and lyn nofziger who are having the california campaign to re elect president and they advised me that they had certainly evidence to support such a statement to it the

united farm workers were being supported by the mcgovern campaign they furnished me with the certified copies of general accounting office records and to the best of my memory a simple misplaced those particular activities the best to the best my memory of it was approximately fifty two thousand dollars the money went to an organization called bill and several members of that organization professor gao report yes i called these were the reports filed for july or august of nineteen seventy two and again i'm looking for man and the money

these money contributors those rules who were members of the activist group supporting it one of which i believe and richard shows her relative to cesar chavez was the worst worker who has been active in identified as a united farmworkers supporter you say you don't know what you saw morrison reports about the emergence of a group of those youth commission was more

support let's listen jordan on august twelfth and the papas of incentives that would indicate the gao report and what is worth living information with them thank you you know

and anybody the affidavit there that i saw some of that simply showed that their considerable financial support was given to the united farm workers mr kelly yeah oh no listeners one man the

tunisians the leaders of the re elected president committee were outside of the crime and the local people the chairman was local but the people who were moving the campaign along where outsiders and they were in effect superimposed upon our our local party structure and when a committee we supported their efforts of course and furnished much of the legwork to make the campaign a successful in fresno county and as a matter of fact we substitute our judgment for theirs for the end of the campaign when it appeared that the interests of the party and the interests of the re elect president committee were

some divergence one of the differences there's a committee instructed that all persons who could be identified democrat or republican who would support the president should be turned out at the polls in other words we would identify a voter regardless of party affiliation who had indicated a preference for president and we determined and i say we the official audio amp the county determined that this was not to the advantage of the republican party and let me give you know the background we have two assembly districts we have still to assembly districts after the reapportionment thing in california

have that time to have a thirty second which was approximately six percent republican district thirty percent and we had two incumbent republican assemblyman in those two districts and we thought that it was to their distinct disadvantage for us to encourage it people who were the opposite party who agreed to vote for the president to come to the polls because the history would be that although they supported the president for one reason or another on voting or negatively are with regard to george mcgovern nevertheless they would vote in the democratic party i've taken otherwise so this was one of the big differences that we have with their elected president canadian

aside from the normal day to day her differences that we have by reason of there being an ad hoc and separate organization oh no within the military as tripper statewide my counterparts in other areas indicated similar disclosure some of the counties or follow the directives of the re elected president and or so four and afterwards i believe we lost lover call assembly seats statewide presidential

campaigns oh yes i've been active in republican campaigns since the nineteen fifty two and it is just i've been active in the age of the presidential campaigns says that pam malcolm taylor the president downplayed the extent and nature of direction from all speak on the national campaign headquarters or state headquarters well we've always had the direction from either the state or the national committee and it has always in the past then no i'm not was

superimposed or even superior to the party of the question was this incident involving the demonstrations oh yes in fact the police were present at the time whether my advance notice of a problem or as a matter of routine there were several are representatives of the sheriff's office i don't believe that any us renee the rally didn't materialize it was something that was attempted and frustrated the demonstration as

well as to attack that is true but the assaults were of those sub rosa very close and the assaults were mainly of the type that would provoke a retaliation so that perhaps something more serious could've developed well the police or shadows and i would not be able to see these as all that is right to strike ty cobb the people it from the sheriff's office were on the problem is in that these incidents in very close proximity police officials assured there's no not that i know you you say you recognize some of these people

are just another demonstration of what is the basis upon which you identify these demonstrators of being members of the united farm workers there as their slogans occasionally you know any of them that they were members of the united farm workers that will when you say statement a unique capabilities of you know the fact that you recognize anyone of the demonstrators as being a member of united farmworkers as a matter of fact no doubt this committee and mr campbell is receiving testimony from us to hold them and then it's a great anthem of the memorandum and that it was a party a part of a strategy when this rally and volunteer election president

involving president nixon really how the demonstrators were to be brought to the scene and that they could masquerade as us apart is now is it is a possible or for a base of your testimony well yeah slogans and posters of them as unhappy members in a robert well anything's possible but this is quite an improbability at times prior to the campaign for reelection the president the same people and people that i recognize without identifying by name demonstrated marched and participated in and united farmworkers affairs without regard to any political campaign was going on a young

farmworker thing has been going on in the balance of california for two or three years i wouldn't say that or the other demonstrations the united farmworkers marches in the street rallies in a courthouse car demonstrations in the fields and other incidents of this kind with regard to the campaign itself know unlimited the campaign and now you also mentioned that there and i think this year is shown an exhibit with contributions made by a government campaign to demand far more testimony and if it's money the campaign

was you get into them for this purpose for disruptive demonstrations been like yeah that's true i can't say any particular dollars a lot to disrupt a rally or two because of fate in the presidential campaign oh i haven't the slightest idea was a general support thing after the fact there was a statement made by the democrat leadership in the valley that the money was used for registration purposes registration provisions it's hard to identify dollar for dollar that that was using that we know you have no basis to disprove it i have no more bases disprove that that i have to disprove that dollar for dollar the money was used to disrupt republican allies no evidence presented as a committee was that it wasn't

that is right the interrogation this is what i want since we have been asking witnesses like yourself who witnessed this kind of activity of what what kind of legislation would you recommend to prevent this kind of activity from taking place well it's difficult to legislate morality i think are not an area where legislation would be particularly beneficial we have many laws on the books personally wish a good thing i can think of no specific budget legislation that would be beneficial except closer supervision which would involve enforcement of the legislation that because

california that would take care of what what happened here and that's right in that you can't legislate against it violations of present laws you can't effectively legislators dirty tricks send in campaigns we all a boar that kind of activity and i would hope that the lessons that are being learned here and this committee and its activities that will make an awareness that perhaps will solve a problem and neither the questions continue and sequence that would have been the occasion of the winds our guest campbell i would call your attention to the first

sixteen which reaches followers to establish a select committee of conducting investigations study of the extended family in which illegal improper or an ethical and unethical activities were engaged in by any person acting individually or in combination with others the presidential election of nineteen seventy two on any campaign campus or other activities related to it i wasn't your testimony inaccurately read what some re supplied by step that's my understanding of testimony that on the occasion question during the campaign of nineteen sixty two that a person well so called with a number of republican ladies campaigning on behalf of president was approached by an unruly crowd and certain physical violence were done to those when vigil last night for me the number of people involved in that disrupted that excessive could you tell me who they were in terms of their authority a relationship to the

republican or democratic our organizations in that campaign i can say that they were carrying and i say today not everyone but they were variously carrying united farm workers' banners in second an optimist them understood that your testimony but the point in which employers this i gather from your examination of mr thompson most days that you have no firsthand knowledge of whether they were employed by are encouraged in the political organization the substance of your information is that they were then they weren't fighting disrupting a legitimate campaign activity is that correct now that's why reporters for sixty to yemen as important as you pointed out to understand that you can't legislate that someone will not i like a wall the percussive function of this committee is to identify those generations and political conduct those undesirable aspects of

political conduct and have no place in this chemo politics in america regardless of republicans or democrats and well established is that you're testifying at a hundred or so people did in fact disrupt and physically abuse a number of women we're campaigning for republican candidate is out that women are just as i understand your interview mrs weiss every year old was struck about this and about which you receive medical attention mr clooney mr spinney was struck on the top of her head with a sign that says pryor was pushed a job and this is what were had a legal doctrine political enthusiasm of the day going in my peers teachers shake hands with the crab they get back in the boston that was worth what they are i as i indicated was the masters

for the event with microphones and amplifiers and speakers chanting in unison you and others from speaking out and then did it after the destruction of the camp i absolutely did in fact prevent you from exercising your right of free speech and the ladies their own political matter absolutely an amazing period of course if you don't know who organized the market was responsible if anyone for their activity how is the fighting frightening for many of the people that were there many of them didn't get off the bus is a matter of fact and many of our people left to avoid what could have been a very bad problem

i'm not asking you to testify to matters if you dont have knowledge ah but i am asking you to verizon her state of mind you know other situations in california or elsewhere where candidates or supporters have been shouted down or physically abused so that they had a disruptive effect on the campaign efforts of either republicans or dumb as americans say yes is that part of the common knowledge in the political community in california that sort of thing didn't occur and seventy two yes now what i'm having for dinner is gamble is whether or not that pattern of conduct in activity and is that during the chanting shouting down physically abusive trouble was lonely as terrible impact on the organization and pages of california hasn't had a deterrent effect or do you know as a better deterrent effect on the willingness of people of women to be involved in politics well that's yet to be seized an israeli kurd about five or six

days before the election in the room or you can all that campaigning in the united states of course regardless of who didn't republicans democrats are mum wants regardless of that yet it still had a disruptive and animals reflect on the pre selection process of elections in the united states is that you're in sen leland judgment is a politician sort of thing has been in the ascendancy of the more frequent in recent elections in the previous elections this program inquiry in this committee decide not only how we can legislate against such disruptions but how we can identify such disruptions and provide a deterrent force to their occurring in future elections but anyone organizer district would you agree with me that one of the most fundamental

transgressions against free speech it's a crab last year's or chance or engages in physical violence to the extent that it prevents a candidate or his supporters from staging their point is that a basic abridgment of a constitutionally guaranteed or course any suggestions about how we determined and i think that along with several states that that could be utilized to prevent such things but the area of free speech on on both sides and it's difficult to legislate morality justice it is perfectly legal and constitutionally protected they gather in a public place even in huge numbers and demonstrator demands over the summer and demonstrations justice it is appropriate and constitutional to do there so is it not also appropriate and constitutional for anyone to expressing the way his

demand for a present from a star and a campaign without fear the tripoli an elderly mau your opposition or anyone else will stop you from making your views no yes would you agree with me that politics will be a loser if we can't find a way to limit freedom of speech and letters but this scam on a lecture that we are entirely clear what we're trying to say so i reiterate my interpretation of her testimony you're aware of a serious disruption of a legitimate campaign ever the presidential campaign of nineteen seventy two and california in which there was shouting and cheering and physical abuse two ladies involved in the campaign you're not aware of who organized it but you are aware that it was effective and it did in fact

stop that campaign effort and prevent the expression of you and that is you believe that there are indirect indications these heavy d science identification the financing that would point to other organizations but you play no firsthand knowledge in that respect and finally to conclude that that sort of conduct is destructive political process not to be stopped either by legislation or by the deterrent effect of identification agreement so to know why this campus is one question has won was a lot like who get your opinion

president nixon it was difficult to say frankly i i think that the president was going to be reelected specifically regardless of what happened we elect a president and i was not going to be well it helped on a party there's a backlash to this kind of thing i think maybe this is what you're getting at and certainly there was there was that nevertheless for whatever good the people the people rally was designed to accomplish campaign was it

did not it was completely frustrated and didn't come off now so it was a local candidates we're prevented from speaking now in fresno we have the time to republican assemblyman but we also have a democrat congressman and a democratic state senator who were but at the same time these people particularly the congressional candidate those present was prevented from speaking out and two what effect her campaign was damaged by this event that no one can say in in truth and in fact he was prevented from giving a message through something

like that the camel's back this is a supposedly workers an israeli and that land preserve in going on innovation and limited too because another organization in there now i want to make this thing i'm not trying to say

that the mexican people there or being subsidized by any political organization to disrupt the republicans want to campaign on no i think that what i'm saying is that the new one lincoln's day money from the mcgovern campaign nationally to help of local mcgovern and then into the united farm workers union and two unnamed individuals within that i'm saying that they would support of the organization i can't say that all these people belong to the organization i can even say that they were far more because many of the people demonstrating who have appeared in the demonstrations are not necessarily for workers it is peak of violence and is it not true that ssri and his organization paul is advocating peaceful means

i think that everybody agrees what do you mean exactly what you what you mentioned you're seeing her in a farm workers air strike picket line items on his officers and i've seen you know we haven't heard about us now there were other demonstrations earlier in the campaign against mcconnell's by some mexican militants and also against the hanley ramirez who is the director of a now run into may again level

committee speaking in the asian just go area i knew where those incidents well specifically about a memo that you love reading the newspapers are you have other incidents one masked militant group i know our population twenty two was a very important issue in that particular campaign was that close and it was designed to curb the powers will find workers in the primary in california was not i didn't do it that way you know i viewed it as striking some balance certainly farm labor new movement and according to farm laborers the same rights as other workers have in other industries and could this demonstration had been sponsored by the front runners to try to create sympathy for

proposition twenty two sponsored by it could've had a sponsorship look different their political structure in that campaign committee or even the nixon committee or even see it the no so i take it that you draw inferences that the mcgovern committee on the democratic national committee are the local democratic committee and anything to do with this particular thing in the fact that fifty two thousand dollars were contributed to it as well khamenei then on from the fact that these foreign workers with their band around their arms identifying themselves as such had participated in the demonstrations oh you said no influences i don't think that's exactly i

think that i've really influence that circumstantial evidence would establish but i can't say that any particular dollar was used for any particular proposal that there was general support right how many people head identification making him to work the united farm organization that's it's our chance to demonstrate for us for the unveiling demonstrations by a new name instances of these are subsequently campaign that we've had several confrontations in the fields

of this past harvest season when the phone records of volunteers it's bleak you know the president has an organization in california join us you know many contributions made by the republican national committee to any national organizations is no i don't to any mention political organization nor added you have to hear republican committee make any contributions to a mission organizations let me put it

this way we have within our republican party in fresno county a spanish speaking republican group and then general support from the party and my secretary on the central committee for example is a spanish american and she is a very active in the mexican american activities political and otherwise and did you make any contributions to understand i can't say that i direct contributions were made but it's possible that we did supported financially these republican subdivisions of the party that would be identified with the recipients of these competitions to find this particular demonstration about which is the key well let me say this about that today said that we have mexican

americans on our central committee and as members of musicians and other organizations republican rally and if the republican politics generally but there has been no contribution of dollars the other then as soon as you have to attend and for that was sponsored by innovators patients don't you think that right without though engagement disturbances on lesser don't you think that when people

resorting to new tactics for the matinee mr right to be heard that they are demonstrating that lack of understanding of our american system of what the first amendment was designed to do as curt i may disagree with which is the other one the least compliant the bow what was this really love the things you say without them to fly to save her and the people and eighty eight mr a practice which is totally incompatible with the americans when they bought mohawk anytime to come up with the ransom of america as they swallow that these may be this is not exactly what i

want oh and business demonstration mention another instance though prefers more importantly for unocal really a part of that or mm hmm good morning one event that i attended in ways to solve social and into lake county iowa the same type of activity was carried on only not to the same extent and not to the same effect that particular event or was killed within a

building and although selling with us the speakers could be heard and the event was not motivated and talented on that is true what kind of time the red armbands with a local people were placards same bright yellow send type and i mentioned at the beginning that were present at the nixon proposition twenty two materials and he was

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