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Now down through the years we've had other interesting creative things. We've had the revival. We have them today. But we've had them through the past. Some of them won in the past were much more colorful than the ones we have today. Billy Sunday was a lot more fun on the platform than Billy Graham. He really was. He when he wanted to fight the devil in the frame and he took off his coat pulled up as the leaders of the church and he went out and pummeled what he thought was the devil over there next to him on the. Roof to Greymouth much more. A gentleman I will say that doesn't bite. They do that verbally. But we've had a great many of them. These men and women and don't underestimate Aimee Semple McPherson. Just because at the end of her life it was a gamble don't underestimate her importance. You may not realize there are still 800 churches that women found all over the world.
The fourth church and they're all over the world. They're one of the leading groups in missionary work all over the world and they are the largest single body Protestant in the nation of Colombia and South America. They've been able to get into Foursquare Gospel people a music center. They've been able to get into Columbia and do a missionary program there and as you know a comparatively Catholic country and done a magnificent job there far more than any of the other Protestant churches have ever been able to do in that place. Their strong group nominate Mrs. MacPherson was a very vital force for good until near the end of her life. Some people say that she was misunderstood I don't know whether she was or not. I like some of the choice bits in their biographies the biography that write about her at least she died an interesting woman you know.
When I was a child. Living in Rochester New York with McPherson came to our convention hall put on a revival meeting and that healing service. The woman next door to wate Mrs balding. Was her name had been a chronic invalid for years. One of these that. In those days she was described as being poorly. That was the old word for it. And some days she'd be up out of bed for just two or three hours and the other day she spent the whole time in the soap. Some days in bed Carla and so I'd known that five or six years I'd known so at any rate. Her husband took her down to hear a settlement first and she got in the healing line as they called it. She went up. Mrs. MacPherson I was not there. McPherson put her hands on her and said something whatever prayer she would do you all I know is that this is balling him back home that afternoon. A totally well
woman and never went to bed again except to go to sleep at night. Lived a perfectly normal life and she lived in the late 80s. Now that's all I know. I only know what I see. So when people make snide remarks about me and the First them I like to correct some of them because there were years of great power. There were years of great strength. And here again you see was the offie here again with the person that did not fit the average here who probably would never even invited to be in the atmosphere. Here was another person of great creative thinking. Whether we agree with their doctrine or not has nothing to do with it. Most of the people whom I've been discussing I don't agree with their doctrine. But I think their vitality. And without them we would be a poorer religious heritage in this country. That would even be still the Jehovah with this group. So always has been something being kept alive being kept alive.
It may interest you to know that. The new rabbi in now help literature enters into this picture. The New Thought movement from its inception back there around 18 88 had became a publishing teaching. You see Mrs. Eddy Ltd. her teeth her publishing to her own work and to the other literature which was what in her mind was with them to do. In the other field generally known as new thought or metaphysics everybody rolled up and everybody read books. Now these books round the subject of the power of mind. Almost always on the subject of autosuggestion all of them covering what they call psychology.
Please remember that psychology came to the United States late. The United State had had speakers teachers book magazines scattered from call to call on the subject of mine. The power of mind how the mind makes you think you know how the mind makes you well. Long before. William James started the first Department of Psychology at Harvard University Long before that. In fact it's very interesting that William James while he never became a definite disciple. Of New Thought always Hopewell about. And always said that he considered it the next great religious system to be our power and authority in the world. In his book The variety of religious experience which is considered as
classic Williams games that devoted two entire chapters to what I've been talking about. He called up the religion of healthy mindedness. And he kept that he faith that this will become the next great religious influence. I'm not sure that this is true and I'm on the inside looking out now. I'm not sure that it is true in the tenth church. I'm quite sure that it is true in the sense of in Rome because one of the interesting things is that this general new thought metaphysical psychology before psychology became academic in this country the king is still on and now nearer to the academic level. Our literature has gone out and out and out and it is mainly
read by people who go to the church or at the interesting part of it. In other words in a city like New York City take the little booklet unity daily word. I do not know the accurate about I would estimate that there are 200000 copies a mom minimum that read in the five boroughs of Manhattan. M.. It might be as much as a half a minute. Yet these people that read it in general do no not go to unity talks. They don't go to the Unity Church. They read it in their own home and go to the Lutheran Church the Perth church the Catholic church Sunday morning. Services vary and we made the survey some years ago when I was present at the international front line. We made a survey we did. With various publishing houses in the publishing house of our magazine as to what they thought
was the probable reader ship. Of the United States. In this type of publication and by consolidating figures and doing what the publishers of regular commercial magazines do they estimate that every magazine published is read by five people. Every magazine published life time readers digest these and people say that every magazine is read by five people. Either in a family unit or at this office where 50 people really are around and as you know in New York City everybody is always being in the ash and on the street. That's another way of circulating magazines. Now we have made it. Atwood made a careful research of this that between 20 and 60 million people were reading our kind of literature every day of the week.
Now that a large group of people 80 percent. That outweighs most old church members have anything going to nominate out of this secondary field called the self help book deal. We started it years ago all with a best seller called into the in the mint written by Ralph Waldo rock. Back in 1910 it sold 1 million copies and there were no Doubleday bookshop there your own Vaal bookstore. Sold over a million it is now over six million in reprint and the sale does not diminish very much each year. During the Depression another bestseller came out. By Dr. Remen Bach called the cameraman on the mound.
Harper wrote. This has gone way over the million mark it did during the Depression. Heaven knows how many million he's gone into now. Been translated into twenty six languages published in 26 different countries. A tremendous bestseller. Then there began to come along about ten years ago. A different market. Book such as the magic of believing by Claude Bristol. Which as you know started Phyllis Diller run away. I hope you all know that. She gives credit for it you know in our own book. She says that she would not be where she is she would still be a housewife. California if she had not discovered this book the magic of believing and it started her off. You're limited. Done quite well. Others came along. We've had the phenomenon only in the last three years the phenomenon of a book called Psycho Cybernetics with
the fact I just laugh at. It are terrible. Every time Dr. Balt goes to the bank he thinks it won. And that it was stolen over him and that you have fall way over him in a few months ago. Simon Schuster took the reprint rights paper bound and put out eight hundred thousand copies one self-will and three months later they had the reprint of this exam paper right after the crop a million. If you went into a bookstore 20 years ago and asked for self help literature you probably would have found him books. You walk into Doubleday's today or any big book shop in your area and you ask about help literature. They will show you rack after rack after rack and on the cover of each one of say eighty thousand
copies sold to date 20000 copies 18th printing. Now I would say what background to do with religion a great deal right. You remember that for many many people in college you have taken the place of the church. They say they cannot. Go to their church any more and believe what is being taught. Now there are many that can. But I am talking about the people who just can't. Accept the standard theological that the name of. The people that are saying wait a minute if I am going to put men on the moon and bring them back then the universe is the result of an intelligent. And
order a system of laws. It is not at the whim of a deity. And these people have needed and are now buying. In self-help literature or another form of buying. Another form of football affirmation. Another way of getting by and they are encouraged to think in quite different terms then they would have been even 25 or 30 years ago that the universe is the out picturing a spiritual something. That is obvious in the material world and the cosmic order. It is obvious in the way man and him were. Both inside and out. Because psychology for me at least has not taken away any
spiritual depth. It is only strengthened. That the creativity of mind is probably down through the ages. We have called God and man to evolve and I believe in evolution. As man evolved. He gradually took a different form of his come up to God and each time it became static. Each time. It was given him each time a new god appeared in heaven and saw. So today I'm thinking of a universal intelligence of creative power. Call it what you like. The universe is not created. You are not related. I am not free. You probably want me to in the last few minutes here. And I am literally got to the floor with the question and answer period. What do I think is the future market religion. I don't think they'll
be very much change in the future of organized religion. All of the Lard. Well crap we can probably. Are now in a. Financial security. And when you are by a man we think you are. You don't change. You have no need. They have tremendous wealth great wealth. Well. Figures that are never public. Figures would bark. If they were called. And I am sure of that by the very back background of well they have their universities or colleges or seminaries. Many an approach and many of them traditions. All the power of tradition. I played by students many a time. Just because a thing is old doesn't mean good. Just because the thing is older doesn't mean it's good.
However it has the power of tradition and many of these visions are very beautiful. The traditions of the church many of them are of meaning to the people who accept them. And there is warm. There is color. There is great music. There is great fear. And I say that in the right sense of the word. No I don't think the older systems of religion are going to change. What do I think of the newer smaller systems of religion. I think they are going to left them somewhat. I think there are going to be more of them groups than it and I think there perhaps. Over a period of time if greed is good maybe not so much in harmony. As how many readers are with magazines the book. And all the rest of it. Because this has been the great power of what we call the New Thought move. The credit
through we've had brilliant teachers who we have had great man. We have had some very excellent books written very badly written books but the power's been 8 them in new thought while going to the Orthodox Church. I tell you one thing years ago when I was minister of a church in Rochester New York. And our usual church very nice church not rich but a going along all right. And I was invited to speak in Miami Florida one month the month of January the minister wanted to take a trip. So I went down to Miami Florida and who should be sitting right in the front pew and every time I gave a talk. But one of the wealthiest families of Rochester New York. In Rochester this is the celebrated name of great wealth. And so after the first lecture and the second I said nothing but when it was time for me to go back to Rochester I went up to them and I said Mr. and Mrs. whoever they were we forgot.
I remember the great mansion home. And I said I do hope now that you have heard me here that when you return to Rochester that you will be a part of my church although not in Rochester we are paid only in Miami are we. Unity. Now this is why. This is why The New Thought metaphysical flourish in California in California it is a new thought metaphysical church on every corner and in the middle block almost as many as there are bars. And you know why. Because everybody had migrated and the person was a Baptist in Providence Rhode Island out there goes to a metaphysical church because no one that's gone nobody is going to know it. And hilly back home doesn't know. I didn't know it. And so everybody's happy. And that's how we grow. And thank you very much. On
I on ya. You heard Dr. Raymond Barker minister director of the First Church of Religious Science in New York as he spoke on the subject of creativity in Western religion. This was another program in the series. Peace love and creativity the hope of mankind. On our next program Arthur de Danto a professor of philosophy at Columbia University will speak on the topic. William James and the will to believe these programs originate at the Cooper Union in New York City and are recorded by radio station WNYC. The programs are made available to the station by the national educational radio network.
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Peace, love, creativity: Hope of mankind
Creativity in Western religion, part two
Producing Organization
WNYC (Radio station : New York, N.Y.)
Cooper Union for the Advancement of Science and Art
Contributing Organization
University of Maryland (College Park, Maryland)
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Episode Description
This program features the second part of a lecture by Raymond C. Barker, D.D., Minister-Director, First Church of Religious Science, New York.
Series Description
This series presents lectures from the 1968 Cooper Union Forum. This forum's theme is Peace, Love, Creativity: The Hope of Mankind.
Media type
Producing Organization: WNYC (Radio station : New York, N.Y.)
Producing Organization: Cooper Union for the Advancement of Science and Art
Speaker: Barker, Raymond Charles
AAPB Contributor Holdings
University of Maryland
Identifier: 68-10-22 (National Association of Educational Broadcasters)
Format: 1/4 inch audio tape
Duration: 00:20:54
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Chicago: “Peace, love, creativity: Hope of mankind; Creativity in Western religion, part two,” 1968-04-30, University of Maryland, American Archive of Public Broadcasting (GBH and the Library of Congress), Boston, MA and Washington, DC, accessed July 13, 2024,
MLA: “Peace, love, creativity: Hope of mankind; Creativity in Western religion, part two.” 1968-04-30. University of Maryland, American Archive of Public Broadcasting (GBH and the Library of Congress), Boston, MA and Washington, DC. Web. July 13, 2024. <>.
APA: Peace, love, creativity: Hope of mankind; Creativity in Western religion, part two. Boston, MA: University of Maryland, American Archive of Public Broadcasting (GBH and the Library of Congress), Boston, MA and Washington, DC. Retrieved from