The world of the conductor; Mozart, Brahms and singers

The world of the conductor. A series of programs in which leading conductors of today speak about symphonic music in the 20th century. The world of the conductor is produced and recorded that station W.H. y y in Philadelphia under a grant from the National Educational Television and Radio Center in cooperation with the National Association of educational broadcasters whose. Thanks. This is James Keeler inviting you to join us for a program which has as its subtitle Mozart Brahms and singers in this broadcast we will again be joined by the concert pianist Natalie hinder us and we'll continue our conversation with Erich Leinsdorf areas of discussion will include the expressive markings in the scores of Mozart and

Brahms and a little bit later on an interesting insight into the world of singers derived by Mr. Leinsdorf from his many years as a leading conductor with the Metropolitan Opera and in opera theatres throughout the world. Last week Mr Leinsdorf was discussing the explosive indications in the scores of Mozart which are included in the new Baron righter edition of The Complete Works. He specifically drew attention to the staccato marking in the shape of a raindrop which the composer used often in place of the more common staccato dot. At this point Miss hinderance observed. Sometimes I have thought of that Mark got us down and it produced not a piano as an express to express it in the sense that there is a certain amount of weight behind it or definitely more over to me and definitely more weight because he uses it. He uses it for when that's used for strings used for piano. So

it it has of course many meanings as one has to one really knows a composer I believe when one is familiar with his own way of using the CBers. Yes and this is why I feel so strongly that we are dealing here with symbols and you understand each composer symbolism only when you know almost that total. I mean it is not it is not and this is why I think teaching comes in to try. To try to get people who studied as to see Beethoven piano sonatas to know the bit of string quartets as well because they're the the inner links of composers are their symbolism their way of example the way Beethoven used the term dollars which is different from that of any other composer you know and then you see something such Absolutely. Even among well trained musician beastly errors in Brahms the Brahms has a son and

I've found believe it or not so many times of people that the sign P at the beginning of a phrase so somebody says to me this is piano for passage and how do you produce a piano for that on a string of innocent there is no known way in the world of making such a sound as piano forte. You can make 40 pianos of instruments of music started aloud and immediately drop. That is F B but B F piano forte cannot be produced to know what is it then. I said it is Brahms as an abbreviation for part of our day because whenever you look you will find that he is if he has a big scar it's on so many lines and somewhere his eyes once spoke of Arthur and then underneath the abbreviated P.S. of pocket of writing you know he says Procopio see or know you not speak at not thinking for one minute that anybody could be so stupid as to what has happened as as to make a new dynamic

piano of art out of it which does not exist. But in this way Now this is an obvious story of little actual merit except that it is funny but this is where the composer's symbolism comes in where the use of symbols. Nobody else put Brahms uses this PFA is not like the term poka farter between Brahms and Martin knew it is very little use now but also of the way apocryphal. The weight of his using methods of torture and V but it again gives you a hint to the whole to the whole temperament of the composer and anybody who comes out in Brahms movements where you have this much book of art and methodology and begins to begin and begins to make a big account of your own thought as receiver is wrong because it is a mistake of in the word personality because when somebody already

uses all of these cutting down yes subduing is a better word subduing terms like methods of object half hours and apocrypha. There's a kind of an inner expression involved and certain of the outward manifestation you know and these things lead you if you know enough and only the the absorption of great quantities of music by composer will give to a performer that kind of freedom which then seems to spell conviction I don't think you can because this is one of the one thing that has always bothered me about particularly about singers and singers singers I know is that they lack so often. Sufficient knowledge of what let's say of what a composer has done besides his vocal music to really I mean they give the impression of they think they understand it but they don't they're not as vocal as they can that's all.

I am I will attempt to harm nor am I just going to say it's true with instrumentalists our time still. Well it is it is true with your display office to destroy you. I think it is true with doctors it is true of composers. It is through with anybody with which wouldn't be true. But you see the I can tell you all because of some singers who are not that way and I think when we say these broad statements again I must say rightly that for example there is in the lives of his friends who do not. Who does not. You don't find in any branch of music a person who is more aware of music and its necessities and bought it only means that she now there was a singer of Egypt Alba who was a completely finished musician in every way who composed I think an operetta. He could conduct. He was and he could play the piano except for his

crippled hand which didn't facilitate that. But there was a super supreme musician and the person was aware of all of these things and I've known many a lesser singer. It is true that by and large the individual performers have little knowledge and that I think it is due to the fact that most of them have to get lost very early in order to make a career within within the limited time allotted them which is of course especially true for singers because you know singer and singers are. I've gone by the time other people know. Other people begin to make careers in this NG is already too old. I've always felt that the singer needs the discipline of knowing bronze knowing knowing well you have these singers not when you have a recital Bye-Bye if you should discover you know then you know again that there is

no doubt about it there is a man who knows his music because you can phrase that way unless you know your music. I think there's an overemphasis on technical proficiency I think that you can play as well as possible but I think that oftentimes we're so interested in getting every no worry about a technique and you think I think that and yes but there's also something else which we have not mentioned so far which accounts very much for the for the lack of of. Concern to the to the knowledge because many of the CPP music is a many faceted and we have really only spoken here now of the. Of the very of the very serious music we have spoken of Mozart and of Bach and you cannot handle that music successfully satisfactorily unless you have the of the broad philosophic approach which we imagine but there is an entire field of music which speaks primarily to the senses.

Now let us face it there are many of the singers especially the singers of the grand vocal tradition. You know the grand Latin tradition of singing they speak to the senses first and foremost and if you find a singer who who warms your blood makes it flow a little faster. Well if your scholarship isn't so great. I'm the first one to forgive him because he speaks to something entirely different. You see I am and when you and when you find that the people stream to hear you are oh well your bialys are your better guns easily attackers you know appeals as they do not go for scholarship that they do not go just as you as your visits to a what shall I say to theatres are. For different reasons I mean if you go to King Lear if you go to Auntie Mame you do not expect exactly the same kind of you don't expect exactly the same kind of satisfaction.

But I think and let us be here most of us here and in the way that we understand every facet of life. If we can get all these things are necessary to do it to make it a really well-rounded art and I think that the people who appeal to the Central will have their place in music too. And from there I don't think we can expect don't expect Marilyn Monroe to have the same kind of. Profundity as they meet if ever. So you know I just saw in London will give a superb performance of Catherine of one who in and I do not expect the same thing from Marilyn Monroe but she gives us so much to it in another way. You know the intent is necessary as is proved by the solo artists have to be reasonably flexible. Yes yes yes. But but yet if one knows that one particular field is not for one now I'm thinking here of am. But you're not that familiar with you know me over the career of those who

went to London after not getting too far in the United States and she is now the same. I mean an announcement of harassment during a bank recital is absolutely tsunami Plus with several It is absolutely sure none of us have set out. And there you see that she knew her specialty and she knew the kind of music she knew that she was not the player to play got spotted in a meeting. And more power to have because she knew it. We've been speaking with Erich Leinsdorf in this program subtitled Mozart Brahms and singers in the series the world of the conductor. We were joined in this conversation by the concert pianist Natalie interests. This is James Keeler inviting you to join us again next week for the first of two programs bearing the subtitle The conductor as a historian of music during the course of that program we'll be speaking with Erich Leinsdorf about the scores of Cloe Debussy

and with me about either one of her and Igor Stravinsky. This next program in the series the world of the conductor. Craig. Thanks. The world of the conductor is produced and recorded at station W.H. y y in Philadelphia under a grant from the National Educational Television and Radio Center and is being distributed by the National Association of educational broadcast news. Thanks. Thanks. Thanks. Thanks. Thanks.

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