This was Toscanini; Part two

Rehearsal. And I will never forget to strangle his wife. I stood right in the orchestra and I thought I'd die myself because it was expressed at the point of it was the struggle to survive. It was such an extraordinary you know spoken word. This experience it's an experience. I was. Another beautiful thing I remember friends and Stephan Transfiguration

in the memory off the person who was just dying it is based on a poem where a man was about to die you know real lives his life and he sees his childhood and all that it was all so beautiful and then and then the struggle and everything everything everything that the man did was the convent or something. I remember the overture to the Flying Dutchman business something which I unfortunately has never been published on records yet. He did it with the NBC Orchestra sometime I think in 1946 and I was standing again like I always did during all the rehearsals in the orchestra behind the contra bass section and the opening bars it was just the wild the sport the whole atmosphere of that Flying Dutchman it would be just as if suddenly a new world would descend on

you. And you could feel the power of the ocean it is just incredible I can only hope that there will come a day when this overture will be published because there's a wealth of recordings that yet have to see the light some time. But it was his unique gift whatever he did whatever he did whether it was an opera or a concert whatever was in the music. The music spoke. How was Tuscany able to convey this musical understanding of his to the man and his orchestra. Well I think it was simplicity. He sighed. Instead of like other conductors who would go into great long descriptions about playing the soft and loud and this and that Toscanini simply saying. I remember a wonderful incident at the missis Ole Miss in London in one thousand thirty nine. It was during the May Festival and in the Benedictus of the Muse so there's a beautiful violin

solo and then a magnificent sequence of chords by the brass and Maestro stopped them at the rehearsal and he said to the brass section do you hear the violin. He sings you play. And after he said that it was the most fantastic transformation because I never heard of brass choir play with such extraordinary and jelly. If they are real beauty it was something you. It was sound it was it was just singing. And I think it was one of the outstanding remarkable characteristics of Toscanini's orchestra it's sand. There were spots so minority it was not just playing. I remember in Vienna people were amused. They used to laugh and say well he always sings and it is the most normal thing because

you have to have music in your soul before you give it to others. When he sang at rehearsals his voice well was old and croaky and people laughed. To me it was the most beautiful voice in the world it was the most expressive voice in the world. There was no singer with the most gorgeous voice who could sing as Toscanini did. He was music personified. Do you have a recording of his singing voice. Well that is a fabulous wealth of Toscanini rehearsals in the archives of Walter Toscanini and I consider it a great privilege that Mr Toscanini has permitted me to give you here. Two examples of his father's voice which I am taking from a record which the Toscanini has made available to the musicians Foundation in New York. The name of the record is a memorial tribute to Arctura Toscanini. You will first hear Maestro singing the day I would Giovino from La Traviata. Which was recorded during the

first orchestral rehearsal without the psoas. But when Maestro sang all this solo parts himself. I'd love to hear what he sounded like when he was talking to one of the musicians.

It was as if you never got the whole of your own life but none of. You know. What I know. Yeah but we all know you wanted it with all life long.

So I thought yeah. I did. You. Know I mean you know the old guard that you know you can run run run. I think there will be people with my eyes still. No no. No. Oh no I mean yeah. It was. OK.

How did he react to your taking pictures of him when he was actually at work. Well actually he didn't know about that I took pictures. The funny part is that until very recently I thought so his son Walter just told me about two months ago that he knew because you really could keep nothing from the old man. But I didn't. I am not quite sure whether he did because the vast bulk of the photographs I took in great hiding I had the camera mounted on a tripod with a large telescope lens. And I would put this tripod for instance in the back of the orchestra which was seated on tears on the risers. And I would shoot through the legs of a man neath the legs of the chair. There was one poor trumpet player who for three hours had to keep his feet on the side the poor man walked out bowling. But I covered the camera with my

jacket so that it would deaden the click. I would aim it focus it for a minute and then just simply click. And there was one recording session where I had a blister on my thumb. I took 11 rolls of film of 36 exposures each and I got some very very beautiful picture and he was to say but there was one occasion when I was very brave it was during intermission and. He talked to me show me Shook of the concertmaster he was in a marvelous mood and I figured out well I might as well come out of hiding and I went real close by and just took a picture. He was so immersed in the conversation that I thought he was completely oblivious. So I went click and nothing happened then that took courage and I clicked again and nothing happened. And so after the fifth click you suddenly got up like lightning. And he grabbed me at my collar and made a fist to punch me at the chin and he

grinned at me and says all the oh so and so. But I got a magnificent picture out of this. This sequence and this particular photograph happens to be in the antique book at the end of the chapter visit with Toscanini. Do you have any idea how many pictures you took of him altogether. There were about 15 photographs altogether. And I started to work on the book way back in 1947. I took the pictures. I think the first pictures I took in forty five and then. Until 1953 but the main bulk of the picture was taken during 46 and 47 and their recording sessions and Carnegie Hall and at the time when I took the pictures I spent of course weeks and weeks and weeks in the darkroom making and larger ones and I wanted to make at the time a book of my own calling it Toscanini and

recording. And I would lay out sequences of pictures on the floor trying to recreate what I would see every day in these sessions. And I got a very beautiful layout together but the thing that I never had was a good text because I am not a writer and though I would have poured my heart out and nobody to write and it was very shortly before Samuel antic died. That I called him and I wanted to ask his permission to use that wonderful article of his that was published in The Saturday Review of literature. Toscanini is eighty fifth birthday I believe it was. And antic said well let's get together. I would love to see your pictures and Dick saw me of course taking all the pictures but he never saw the pictures. And as things go in this wild crazy life I never got together with antic. And well he he died and then Vanguard published a

large manuscript which I never knew existed I thought that it was only the George article that was published. And they asked me for pictures and when I read the manuscript of antic I was just so deeply moved because it said everything that was on my heart and I knew that providentially the pictures were made for the text and the text for the pictures. Mr. have I think you must realize that in the book it's really quite an amazing thing to the reader. You read this text and then you turn the page and it's almost a motion picture like quality that you've achieved. You see what you've been reading. Well I can only say that the idea was that. When you see the book you can look at the pictures by themselves and the pictures will tell a story. And when you read the text the pictures will illustrate the text. And when there is no particular picture to illustrate a particular line in the text the

general atmosphere that is created by a sequence will fit in with the text. It's a great labor of love. Obviously I you know we've been talking about sequence but then I kind of had to pull out one particular picture about one of my very favorites is one at a recording session. Everyone is obviously listening to the playback of a recording that's just been made. And he's in a trance conducting again. Yes that picture I remember he listened to the playback of Bach's Air on the G string. And he always did that in listening to playback. He would he would just conduct. He wouldn't go through the violent motion of course but you could see he was completely carried away in a trance and was a great experience to watch him listening to playback I had once or great a privilege. You asked me earlier about my personal meeting with him

and this was perhaps one of the most beautiful ones. I was asked by RCA Victor at the time to cover the La Traviata recording on which I had worked. That was before the LP issue and we made a recording on 78. And I sat right next to my store listening to the whole opera and waiting for his comments. And to watch him listening and it was very funny because there were certain portions where he listened to a rehearsal and he really blew up and was very very angry and very angry in the loudspeaker and he would just sit there. Paying no attention to it. That's quite a recording isn't it that when I think you hear him more than you hear Dan. Well I don't know. I want to talk about this there was one of a tremendous meeting that I remember a friend of mine and I had bought a manuscript in the auction a letter of Toscanini to Puccini.

And I told Walter Toscanini about this letter and he was very interested because they said it was a very rare thing that Toscanini wrote to put Jini because but she never wrote a letter to him so there's no sense in writing a letter when you don't get an answer. But this letter was written on the occasion of the world premiere of monoliths school and he describes to put she need the. The circumstances of the singers and asked him whether he could not come and listen to it and Walter told his father about this letter because I was going to show him this letter which I did and he told me the moment I mention that letter my father remembered everything about it. And that letter I short term I think it was in 1947 and the letter was written I believe in eighteen ninety eight. Sometime around that time. So it was a thrilling experience for me to sit down after the recording session and for stressing Rome to show him the letter and Maestro read his own letter. And there was one passage where he said in

the letter that the ten was I made it to Norway and he mentions the name. It won't get the No. So that's an indication that certainly you know and when he read this line his face all up I mean it just lit up. But then he said but he made up his defect with a very beautiful voice. And you could see when he wrote this letter he was just carried back to the old days and then I said something which of course was very stupid because I said Maestro would you would you know sign this letter of now and put down the date New York 1947. And my eyes for a look at me says Bob my idea I wrote this letter. I signed it now you want me to sign it again me. How do you and the Legion you keep it the way it is. According to this was one of his favorite expressions wasn't it be intelligent or yes or no. If you haven't mentioned his son Walter was there any time in his life for his family.

Well this I really cannot say but I only know that Toscanini has been most devoted to his father and has in nineteen. Fifty in the early fifties started a tremendous project. The Riverdale project where he has transferred on to tape all those priceless acetate recordings made of broadcasts and has really created archives of his father's art. And I think that the preservation of maestros art will be very very largely to the credit of Walter when weather was broadcast began Mr.. The broadcast started Christmas 1937 with the NBC Orchestra and when you mentioned that memorial year's 10th anniversary of the death and his 100th birthday There's more to it because Christmas 1967 will be the 30th anniversary of the first

NBC broadcast. And I could only hope and wish that these broadcasts will be played again over the radio because through the 17 years there was a magic that went over the air. And I remember a few years ago some educational radio stations started to rebroadcast. I think it was Christmas several years ago and then every week they continued with the following broadcast. And they say magic that went over the airwaves in 937 and the following years went out again. And today there's a new generation that has never heard them and it would catch again and Lord knows there's a need for great music. Who is in control of these tapes now. Well it's a matter between A and B C and Walter Toscanini and of course there's always the difficulty of. Orchestral payments and sponsorship and the sad thing is that money enters into all those things that are the most priceless recordings

that exist of the Salzburg Festival is 1937. There's a complete recording of The Magic Flute and Maestro singing fall stuff he did and also a few Delio with Lottie Lehmann. And these recordings I just have so often has that something should be done to publish them but it involves an enormous payment of of royalties to singers to orchestras and the record buying public today just is not interested. Do you think they'll ever be a conductor who can replace Toscanini. There is a young conductor who has many qualities of Toscanini and in my esteem those closest to Maestro. He's Vincent le Silva book the present musical director of the Trenton orchestra and undoubtedly much will be heard of him. I think that the void left by Toscanini will be covered by LE Silva but

no one will ever replace Toscanini Toscanini. Not only was a unique conductor but he represents an era. He knew Verdi. He knew put cine in many of the other great composers of that time and he conducted the world premieres of some of their works. Toscanini was absolutely unique and I think until the end of time he will always have been one of the greatest musicians to walk the earth. Thank you very much Mr. Hooker for telling us about Tuscany and about your book. This was Tuscany we would also like to thank Mr. Walter Tuscany for permitting us to use recorded excerpts from the Toscanini archives. And.

And.

You're. Right. This program was produced by bridges and distributed through the facilities of

national educational radio. This is the National Education already on network.