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Right we are nation building is the problem. Economic or economy building. The basic business of developing an economic structure. A very difficult task indeed the Bush you just don't get out of the economic structure. You have to make some basic decision is. So philosophy of economics what kind of a kind of you walk about in the first instance or your hair or your purse. Be on the structure itself. How do you want to target subsistence economy are sound on the radio if you like to forget but essentially how you transfer throw a toy away and subsistence economy is not going to the top of the way the market is a closer and how do you break I'm going to do it with option for the markets again versus how do you get out of production for the in the current market was I suggest that you are. Long after the rest of the export out who served in turn all these other basic kind of the Planet of the bros and after that it was destroyed
and right behind that the fourth Test was the problem the very basic problem of technological marvel ization. After it was a very strange gap next year the last of various automated up weapons and techniques. The most underdeveloped backward if you like her sister those integrity is doing everything. I've used the example of the Army and I suggested to you they are the ones who aren't jerks. This is quite true and side by side and close juxtaposition you see on the ground. You will be able Sara Lee was used to her good lead for a laugh or was done. Heads and backs of there's no hierarchy in the past but hey she said. You don't have graduated types of transportation and this is true of every field of the capital city to find a new Martin medical institution. The most annoying hospitals in the universe. But 15 or 20 miles of the capital city of fire
which in this fashion is practicing without. An agriculture you have a tractor or. Sure. Enough I was though of trying to deduce that there was a bit about most of those who will go out on the ocean with a piece of work that. Morning when you swear to hear. What Africa needs it is a total technological rationalization that we should somehow related technology to there you go under the table. Well it was the whole problem of labor kinds of production techniques to be thought out of the larder he brought on were serious in terms of patient sterile Hartley's doing so. So the problem the psychological transformation. Essentially to the machine it was a waste of the doing the right places most. And filing the first task and by no means the restall who aren't perhaps the most difficult. Is the brunt of social
reorganization social restructuring them going after traditional societies. It is very European person so. There's no going back. Get back together a very traditional institutions have been disrupted. Additional ways of life changing or pressed. On the other hand new systems new structures are not in the developed replaced to a transitional situation of the old and the new. And I like the plan as to where most of the African countries what types of social system social structures and you will find almost anything in Africa from a bizarre country like Guinea for example to develop or as they say reserve the plaster society beginnings. Once I was a Marxist. If they are strictly deviation this is they do not accept Glasgow. Then neighbors are a classless society. Right there in the Coast Guard your arse was a leading example is the leading example of a country
driver about a social pattern like that Tyler familiar with the West. If they live right outside the larger world. Last year we were like prayer is somebody who is rushed or after or in many other African countries you have everything from designing for back to ourselves and you know as the new year to design two new types of messages and those who go experimentation. And where this all comes out it's very hard to say. But it's very basic and was terribly related to the type of nation building you do with the logos off. So that Africa really has really difficult tasks that I have to see a lot of lawyers. Unfortunately this cannot be done. Sequence they are interrelated they affect one another and time of weight on the other not be done altogether. And there are two more subsidiary tasks and to test for these five tasks.
First very own problem is that you should know what part of the developers to do shit to do all of these dailies do Nation State Building week another person Touche and so training situations. Problem training how do you develop the personnel and staff to do all these things to run the institution's dual use of both of these are extremely difficult. But this land. Well once again first dire problems with a sense in the head. But unfortunately you can get first five problems in and say there's a certain way to do our solicitation is America so our way. Perhaps it's more accurate to say that after as you said if it was hot ones and any number of African countries are going quite successful at one to us really easy but very few with any war and as a result many of the adults in the end of the week was one to us realise how selfish it. So that we go rarely and if you want to understand very much the
badly and general political is that of the military coups the burden are stagnation that Africa derives largely for the very banal problem of coping with these far very overwhelmed tasks on the two subsidiary tasks or loans. As I suggested to you I don't know. It was the timing that Africa had the preparation for this and so forth of that because of. That solving these problems is not a somewhat race proposition. The African problems are long term. What time the start of you know unfortunately despite the expectations of the additional events leaders this will be one generation is going to be several races and then it's on and the Africans need to understand any understanding of yes I. This is what they're doing in the first instance this is a story to the.
Kurds to the situation they find themselves that. They have to do it obviously these are problems but they do you understand and that is there is a lot of resources and this is about Israel. Mr. Arnold Rivka speaking on the general topic projections Africa Mr. Rifkin then responded to questions from his audience. The first one being do you foresee future political upheaval in Africa. Yeah I think we're already continuing. How are. The. Blue Boy as though he were to break their chairs in various places of voice as well as they and their friends and going about subsistence level. In fact really for today
there is more frustration and disaffection and just intent and I was aware. Because the very major systems living in Syria was this kind of thing and laser systems satellites and Africans to go back to as it were to this type of learning. And this sort of run state in Africa. And Africa has taken if you live in the interference and I have there's a two minute Kyra as you wrote the first question there's a I asked you for it in the past this is being displayed here and I think we're in for a long period. Yes. Yes. Will the situation you know you used the second get me more than your share. Well I think we've got to you know. One of the Treasury
one of the great threat of the use of Nigeria was the most promising. And I tend to be optimistic in the long run. The affair with the one of the one of the most promising countries in terms of having a structure. Transitional has two shoes and works right where the most. Been more effective than most though also a bit more of that terror structure. On the range of these civil wars in ways that you know the situation the friends i.e. both of them. It was for a while there are a lot of OOA here but they are holy and these are thought of as not too slow. Closer but in that chair was given was just love. There's no easy way
for us to go out for a very long time. DD and I light a fire incidents after the Nigeria things of a systematic kind of an awful lot of destruction goes on. They have the capability to know how to fight North Korea. Very good you know I don't know what I was if I was fortunately devastated and it weighs in for a good deal of the sort of thing where you know interestingly enough very little of the Xterra investment is not actually done there during and after it was. Right. Reasonable. So are bears in the battle was to win so. Therefore there's a real self-interest and I'll just
draw it with Kate. It's interesting where for example a very large B he show a fiery be off. Which offers a foreign target is what it does not lack the ability to do it. Yeah it's the same guys I play because I really really try the shows all indications are doing though this may go there for 6 months of every fight no far really has been seriously there. Yes. Very much more and he also you know all. Of that terribly much for that I asked for this for the purposes but too much real. Pleased me to say that American foreign aid as little or no water polo. We do have two countries where we would avoid Oh it was due to Ethiopia like there are a historic reasons.
But I was out to get Africa. The Soviet Union was trying to send the fellows nothing while it was then so long as you have. Blow it up was and this is the rush to get you know it was like the Rhodesian situation over the course of these terrorists they have terrorist talk like terrorism and they do get a fair load was brought to those verses good money for these various military. Some harder for example. It's an incredibly large OEMs Soviet Union and probably part of the reason I suggest to you for it was a virtual ghost maintained. So what was the works. Why does. The Tories have brought Mr. REVKIN was asked what
realistic suggestions he could make toward the closing of the gap between the African countries and the remainder of the world. So far I've actually done business or whatever. This is it at the moment and I want to read and for your rather difficult fiction I tend to be an optimist I believe in on the loan business so that I am well thought out. However I do not want related terms of goes well again I think this is a rather formulation and misleading word or something feeling it is literally a physical or mathematical impossibility. Those get. Serious The rest of this century and probably for the part of the next century. Countries with personality was of 40 50 I don't know whether I was doing two of those which is the part that you saw from South Africa. And the post again. There are a few although I was greatly frightened off.
The annual increases in United States across the National Run for your billion dollars. Which is far in excess of the total economic output. Oh yeah. While you can because I was just like he would have you know I was today just staggering. However when you look a bit low. And I really mean this and I think this is the important thing is you can approach there look very real picture. Don't put me in the house there is the educational standards the food into it. You've been taught or stand up in front of the school parking is you know this was a new religion and these are your goals and I would never do anything different to the way we live in our country but. It is usually these are the realistic goals and these are things which then determine what kind of car.
So if you take these Creoles you then concentrate not at all. Proving their cost of production out of it after that is perfectly capable of doing. You approve the processing right. Bottom line is you start introducing live industry but you know start at the end of the spectrum of pollution with the way it was perhaps you know good to have you noticed that you know about it for a long time the currents turn for. These things you need to know more than these other hard things together as a harnesses. But the basic economic structure basically composition of the economy lost on you getting worked up after ghastly things going for it if you love the development of those characters. The population pressures are bad. The agricultural capability in terms of literal physical capability exists as. The lack of institutional barriers to change which is a very real asset this is not like Asia where you ancient Highers
traditions which linger in our institutions like the following throughout Southeast Asia and India. There's no individual who just acquired the structure to this change by a large was a very real fast. And they can change his or her visit to a school. And I think those countries are just out of this. It will actually get closer. But I just did I prove this to prove it and you know unfortunately. Mr. Rifkin Most next asked to discuss the role of the World Bank in bettering the lot of the underdeveloped nations. It's obviously a separate. World Bank like the rest of the developed world. For my stuff the record is of the world for like five years ago it was just recent
years where it won't but it was very low. There was nothing wrong with it and I think the important thing I was knowing my luck turns out of the right height and he was right there as well as the thanks that. We now live in the very serious life with no fear with it so it was a very low before and this is no major again where I was so I'd say he's lying but certainly I see his plantation farm country for tomorrow or so or so of life Zoe in his last and overshadowed by the world lived over to NAFTA to make loans for
education. Do these in the larger sense and the monks who saw. The walls of the first time was his usual run for office as we have two branch offices. And I for one am he John from the West African area. Why do you think he's you know and the personal functions of the branch offices in Africa levelling my project for if. We had just done a series of experiences the African was not being there in the way it was just as you. Have not been able to come up with about bribes you know live without portfolio with the two of us and used to shoot you saying here we are right. So we have a way for the first time to be able to tell you the title bar literally identifier right there in the result. And then when it was. Learned to have done for the bank doesn't like to do that. Quite frankly because the person was our friends actually.
Oh it was probably her city the size of the world and it's not a terribly good position to be on those. But it was a letter in order to change or develop the will of those who do this. I was a racist on the air of those who are cruising to let the low participation young lady on the audience. Asked Mr. Repton What is the outlook for communism in Africa. Now the communists made headway in subverting any of the new nations has been very remarkable where I mean is it likely to be the first place and it's quite a subject that was very very quickly in the short run but I don't know that I won't you know history is that over the stagnation it was on but today the person who love it. The Saudis
try this time it was like who's that he lied or position today. Oh yeah importance timeless time. Either the Soviet Union the communist china You seem to make headway with the country. But this doesn't last for a very long time I think the way the Soviet Union was going very badly they wanted the D-line and the friends and found nothing before even the last deviation was for example the Soviet Union. Propagating Leste was already what is the. Original life prior self treatment and I mean you know plastics aside here the one our state briars I was on the wings of the whole mess of our lead.
Partly because they were getting tired of ourselves and so on and I remember when the Soviet Union with their very rare ideology you just inform I was in Ohio it was so well they did not change the ideology. We are in the right area with sort of difficulty in that sharing point came in late writing 61 of the Soviet ambassador was absent from getting good news because the par excellence of Soviet regime they overplayed at least a terrorist just a little bit of apprehension in the pan in Africa itself. Instead doesn't mean that I think there's a great skepticism. In communist China. Oh by the way the very worst don't believe they said show me to Africa and you may too are very much. There was a feeling of
sort of an identity with this trial or this was a parallel power steering the country this was the of it and all the stuff of its own bootstraps. That they swear was actually bravos of rationalism are. Now for those that have it well I'm showing here unfortunately for the Communist Chinese and others there's a farewell speech he made this a liar is who is leading the country Thailand. And he said these new countries which was here starts with their independence revolution. And their own nationalist governments. That Africa was running around loose with you no matter how this new revolutionary leaders felt. Yeah it's a lot like showing I was talking about was going to revolution of course. And as a result of being a Communist Chinese presence has been limited to silent on Iraq places where the mega saturation left us as I hope the successes. Were born I think this is a time for steady nerves in the West and I think it was not overly
concerned at the time it was headed for a show of fear over the Africans have a self interest in maintaining there and was very skeptical which is the first instance of a Western national relations as well and so I was. Fortunately I think they tend to be more skeptical about Congress and I'm not the last. That's good and I think if we have reasonable and. They're all passionate he rose and I was down yeah yeah no trade we saw what we are doing a very sad thing. So I thought it was earned respect. This has been the fifth in a series of seven programs about United
States foreign policy entitled demands of the next decade. Our guest today was Arnold Rivkin development advisor for the World Bank and regents professor of African studies at UCLA. He spoke and responded to questions on the general subject of projections Africa. This program series is based on presentations from the foreign policy associations traveling foreign policy conference. These programs are designed to stimulate the thinking of an informed American public about some of the issues to be faced by our nation during this coming decade. Today's program was presented in cooperation with the World Affairs Council of Oregon the Oregon great decisions Council the Foreign Policy Association and TIME magazine. This has been a public affairs presentation of Oregon educational broadcasting. This program was distributed by the national educational radio network.
U.S. foreign policy: Demands of the next
Projections: Africa
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KOAC (Radio station : Corvallis, Or.)
Oregon State University
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University of Maryland (College Park, Maryland)
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For series info, see Item 3721. This prog.: Projections: Africa. Arnold Rivkin, of the World Bank, looks at policy today and in the next ten years.
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Producing Organization: KOAC (Radio station : Corvallis, Or.)
Producing Organization: Oregon State University
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University of Maryland
Identifier: 68-41-5 (National Association of Educational Broadcasters)
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Duration: 00:28:03
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Chicago: “U.S. foreign policy: Demands of the next; Projections: Africa,” 1968-10-07, University of Maryland, American Archive of Public Broadcasting (GBH and the Library of Congress), Boston, MA and Washington, DC, accessed December 1, 2023,
MLA: “U.S. foreign policy: Demands of the next; Projections: Africa.” 1968-10-07. University of Maryland, American Archive of Public Broadcasting (GBH and the Library of Congress), Boston, MA and Washington, DC. Web. December 1, 2023. <>.
APA: U.S. foreign policy: Demands of the next; Projections: Africa. Boston, MA: University of Maryland, American Archive of Public Broadcasting (GBH and the Library of Congress), Boston, MA and Washington, DC. Retrieved from