Report from Santa Fe; Art Trujillo

... ... ... ... ... ... ... ... ... ... ... Report from Santa Fe is made possible in part by grants from

the members of the National Education Association of New Mexico, an organization of professionals who believe that investing in public education is an investment in our state's economic future. I'm Ernie Mills, this is report from Santa Fe, our guest today, our Trujillo Democrat candidate for land commissioner. All right, thanks for taking the time to be with us, this light in the campaign. Thank you for having me here this afternoon, Ernie. We've seen each other around the state with, you know, your opponent and other contenders for office, and what I found the most successful to do as far as letting an audience know what the candidates all about is not to have it confrontational as such, but to give them a little chance for us on your own background. So tell us something about our Trujillo, your background, your education. Ernie, I'm a Native New Mexican. I was born and raised in Cofax County.

I hail from Kelle and sheep ranch in that neck of the woods. You know, early on in life, my dad taught me the value of land as a resource in that he kind of gave us some some real skills to things like how man, nature, and animal effect land in its surrounding environment. You know, I can tell you that I was really a conservationist long before I was even politically correct to talk about that. And you know, when I left the rent in 1958, you know, we had a family of five, dad said to all of us, you know, he can't all make a living here, so he said, we're going to educate you. And so my dad sent me to the University of Oklahoma where I got a degree in Social Work and Economics. Then I got a master's degree in regional and urban planning and from there, I went to the state of West Virginia. I was a regional planner there for a year, and then I went to the state of North Carolina.

I was there for about two years. And in 1966, they called me home. I came back to Santa Fe and I was a regional planning director for a regional planning agency here in Santa Fe. And you know, the reason they brought me here is because I was bilingual from Northern New Mexico and had a master's degree in regional planning. You know, and that was tailor-made for the job. And, you know, I did some things here. I was the planning advisor for all the cities, county and school districts. I also was involved as a commissioner planning commission member here in Santa Fe. And that's really kind of where all politics started for me. I was a chairman of the Santa Fe planning commission from the 70s through 74. And then they talked me to run in for office and in 1974, I ran for county commissioner in one. And then in 1977, I decided I'd be mayor as well. And so I ran in one for mayor. And, you know, I had a good experience in Santa Fe. It's really my home town as far as politics are concerned.

I, you know, from a business perspective, I was the owner and the owner and the principal of a planning and architectural firm called Mimbras. And we did a lot of projects throughout the state, some of the projects that you're familiar with. I did capital high here in Santa Fe, you know, got a National Award of the Natural History Museum in Albuquerque. It did a lot of planning projects around the state, over 500. So, you know, I have the business experience. I know what it is to me to payroll and, you know, the ups and downs of the economy. So, you know, I've struggled through that process. And my academic background has given me a good handle on looking at resources and planning for the future. And, you know, as a elected official, I've had some good things. And, you know, in the partisan world, you know, I've also been involved there.

I was Democratic National Commitiment for 12 years. And that was Democratic Chairman and Brown Leal for eight years. And so, I've had a taste of everything in life, and I think I'm prepared to deal with this office. Well, you've run for office twice for two offices that I know of, you know, they run for the County Commission and for mayor here. So, that's a positive start. Right. And now looking at the Land Commission post, I'd like to take a few minutes and get your perception of the land office itself, you know, so the public will know how you look at it. And it is one of, I think, one of the most underrated agencies in state government considering the magnitude of the job. Yes, indeed, Ernie. You know, the land office is the legal guardian of all our trust lands in New Mexico. There's something like nine main acres of surface land, 13 of mineral acres, 13 main mineral acres. And the beneficiaries are public schools,

institutions of hiring, and a few others. There's something like 22 billion beneficiaries, but the bulk of the money that is generated from that office goes to public education and the institution of hiring learning. So, this office is really, really about educating our kids and our grandkids. And, you know, one reading figure that I got the other day, a third of all the budget school districts around the state comes from the trust lands. And that's a significant figure. And, you know, over the years, the land office has contributed something like four billion dollars to education and has got one of the largest permanent funds in the world. It's like third. That's in the whole world. Right. Not just in the Mexico City and the United States. Right. And it was 7.4, but, you know, because of the end runs and some of the issues that are facing the stock market, the whole economy is down to 6.6. But so, in effect, you know,

the office is really about managing our resources for the benefit of our kids and their grandkids. And obviously, we have to assure ourselves that when we manage resources, we do it in the sustainability for future generations. You and I both know we've been through an up to legislative sessions to know that every once in a while someone says, well, we ought to use that money now. And they never really spent rather usually not specific about what they want to use it for. And you know this. When we talk about the skinny cats in our world, they got those flakos. They often say they always tell us it's being safe for a rainy day. And then they look at you and say, it's raining outside. What is your own philosophy about any changes that either might be made, should be made or should not be made in the handling of the permanent funds? Well, you know, it's interesting that you'd ask.

I've talked about a concept. It's only a concept, Ernie, because I think it still has to go through some of the real mechanics of research you didn't figure out who it is. And I was driving between Demi and Silver City. And when I was driving, I thought that the fund was $7.6 billion. And I know that education is one of the top priorities in our state. I mean, it's at the top. You know, a recent poll in the journal said that it was like two to one over water, for instance. And you know, there's a real need to get the academic and a livable environment. So I said, why? I asked myself the question, why not? Why couldn't we use a portion of that fund to improve our school's statewide? Because there's talked that it's almost a billion-dollar need out there. And so, you know, I just toyed with that idea

and I've mentioned it, but I haven't given any legs. Only because, first off, in order for that to happen Ernie, it'll require the legislature, the governor, and ultimately the voters of this state to approve it, because it requires a constitutional amendment. But in talking about this concept, you have to assure yourselves that you're not going to affect the revenue stream, and if you take it from it, when is it going to be back? So it requires you to look at the lifespan of our resource, the oil, and gas, and everything else, it's incorporated, and then come forth with a positive project. So if I'm elected, I may pursue that. I'm not sure that I'm going to have to talk to the key folks, the legislators, the governor, and, you know, that money belongs to every new Mexican. It does not belong to the oil and gas, or the wrenching people. But there is a feeling out there that we should leave it there, and at this point, it's doing a job by passing on the revenues

from the interest generated from that. But, you know, I think the rainy day may be here. You're looking at the possibility of using some of the principal, a portion of the principal, rather than just the interest on the money and the permanent fund. I think we all know, once you travel this state, that you build a facility in New Mexico for schools, colleges, and I remember some of the colleges we met at, they looked great, and then after 10 or 15 years, we need help. And we don't usually have the kind of funding needed to bring those institutions up to date, and that funding also would be coming from the permanent fund. Yeah, I kind of looked at that way. And, you know, the other aspect of it is, is that the money that is in that permanent fund came from our resources.

And, you know, I was born and raised in a small community. You know, schools are always a key identification point in the permanent community. I think that people would vote for it, but again, we have to be cautious how we approach it, and I think we may be able to put some legs on it. You know, it's interesting, because we do track, you know, table, what community you're from, and we were down in Silver City, and it's great because down there, you're talking about Raton, Colfax County, being a mining community, but it is. And the areas like that never get the kind of credit they deserve for the amount of taxation they bring into the state, where you're all, you know, with so much of your business being contracted in Albuquerque and Santa Fe and Las Cruces, we have a tendency to forget that the biggest contributor to our tax base is the extractive industries, second farming and livestock, and then the rest follow in that.

So those are the two at the top, and most of our people know that they deserve a little payback sometime, if only a cushion when they're running into bad times. It seems not just feasible, but understandable, why they would want that. What other areas would you look at in the land office where you would like to see change, and then we'll take a look at how the agency's been run for a period of time? Well, I think that, you know, let me just say that the land office is, I think for the most part, at least the people that have been there have done a fairly decent job, and change takes place with different things. All in guess right now is the dominant force. 95% of our revenues come from that. I think that a jambaka started what they call the community partnerships.

I think that's the biggest, isn't it? Right, and that's the big thing. But there's something in neighborhood of 50,000 acres. That's the figure's been throwing out where I've read about that has some potential or commercial development. I think that we have to look at that aspect of it because, you know, all in guess will be around, but over a long period of time may not be the dominant factor. And so, I will try to nurture projects that Ray has started. I said he'll solve projects. In other words, get it in mind, so it produces some real, real income. That Ray is very powerful. And then there's projects like San Cristobo here in Santa Fe. There's the Edgewood project. And again, Las Cruces. But in looking at that, I think the big change that I would make I think the state land office

has to do its own state plan, primarily the water plan. And, you know, every time that you introduce a development it's going to require water, okay? And so, I think that any given point if we propose a community, it should be self-sufficient. In other words, we don't have to take from Santa Fe if it becomes a part of the Santa Fe. And, you know, I was talking to Elude Martinez about the water. And who is... Probably one of the greatest water experts we have in the state. Yes. And he said you need to be looking at a state water plan, only as it relates to state lands. And he said because you need to identify because there is all the water underground that has not been appropriated belongs to you and I and everybody in this state. And he said there's a possibility that you could, in effect, nurture some of these projects with identification of water resources. So that would be one change.

The other... I think we've got to do a little better in the environmental area. I think we have to manage our resources. I think what's happened, you know, it becomes a paper process. Every five years, they renew a lease. But we need to go out there and figure out what the health of our resources are. For instance, there's... in Hobbes, Lee County. You won't believe the pollution problem we've got. You know, people are drinking their own water. And so what I think I would do is look at instilling regulations, not regulations, but requirements right away so we can avoid some of the environmental problems that we have now, avoiding for future years. No. You looked at just a summarize for a minute. When we talked about the lands that could be traded, and that's like the gym bucket thing that's done in Albert Kirkking, do we have much land that would be traded that has anything built upon it at this time

to your knowledge? I don't know that, Bernie. You know, I've been running for a year and a half, but I don't have all the answers. It's interesting in that, because there are stories now coming out of these coasts, looking at towns like Philadelphia, where what they're doing, their big problem, isn't finding land that's vacant. It's what to do with land that's already run down. You know, everyone goes into downtown Philadelphia, and the experts say, you're missing out on the area that's almost irretrievable. And this is people just walking away from investments, walking away from land, walking away from houses, saying they're not even worthwhile keeping up. And it would seem to me that this is an area that starts early enough. It would preclude that kind of thing happening in New Mexico if we take those steps early on. Other areas on the land commission, and for example, I'm looking at what about

the computerization needs? You think there's set up now to handle the amount of computerization they need for data? Well, you know, the on-guard system you refer to is in place, but I believe, and only from information that I've garnered from people, that we need to update it and bring it up to where it is doing a job. I mean, there's something like 8,000 leases that the state land office deals with, and they have to document that. I think in a very, I don't know all the details about it. Yes, I think we need to deal with the computerization and make it more efficient. Not only that, but we have to make it compatible because it involves the tax revenues and the land office, and I think some other agencies. So we have to be on the same page,

which is our data has to be consistent in the same. And 70 areas we talk about, for example, on water now. Almost every candidate for major offices says we need one water plan. When you're looking at New Mexico first, for example, and they make some suggestions in this area, we don't need a whole bunch of little plans. We need one major one for the whole state that will be able to weigh everyone's needs. When you're looking at the land office, you're looking at them looking at a plan of their own. Would that be able to coordinate with any state plan, you know? Sure, it has to. And you know, you're talking about something that I, that comes, that I'm real, real concerned. You remember the former late Governor Campbell, you know, back in 1963, I was going to school at OU, and came back to a, well, I went through a, what do you call it when you're in school,

and you come back to an internship. I came through an internship. We call it emotional cathode. Anyway, you know, he was working on a state planning program in 1963, and you probably know that because you've been around, and had went after he left, they, they, they, they shelved it. I think this state, and I've talked to Bill Richardson, obviously, because he's, he's on my, he's on the same label I'm on, the Democrat, I said, you need to get out of the maintenance situation. We need to put together a state plan that looks at the future of this state, the chart out the course. And I said, that's not something that pays off, but we all have to make decisions. And, and the reason I said that to him, I said, you got to look at water education, everything in terms of a policy plan, because every time the legislature meets, they throw, they throw water at the, at the fires, and I think it would be nice to look at, say,

we're not going to be 50th in, in, in, per capita income. We're going to be maybe 20th and 10 years. And, and so we have to gauge, you know, come up with some basic targets to get there. You bring a, an interesting bell there, because I had a lot of listener and viewer input from the statement I made about looking at goals that are attainable. And almost every election we have, someone comes up and says, well, all these ideas are brand new, and we're going to shoot from 50th to 49th up to one, rather than set a goal. It's discouraging to set goals that are not attainable. After a while, you get tired of sitting down, talking about the plan, and never seeing it come, come to fruition. Have you got, well, let me ask one thing, on the state planning officer. This was interesting, because I, again, ideas have a tendency to go around on the wheel. And the state first state planning officer, believe it or not, did come under Jack Campbell,

and it was Jack Flynn. Yes, I were for Jack, okay. And he was the first, and there were some shots at it, David King at one time, had, had worked in the state planning office. But again, it, after a while, had never got a priority as such. And I think it must, only because, you know, when you look at, we're first in poverty, our education achievements aren't there, our precaption come, our health care, things, you know. The plan is nothing more than things you do at home. You've got to plan your budget, you've got to figure out how you're going to buy a car, you're going to, and it seems to me like, if you did that, you know, it would take you maybe two to three years to put it together. It's not designed to control land. It's designed to get us to set some real basic targets for ourselves and say how we're going to get there. Right now, I don't think we have that. You know, everybody talks about a water plan, but you can't do a water plan without integrating land use.

For instance, you're going to have to make decisions. What are you going to do with communities, these traditional communities in Northern New Mexico that use water? What are you going to do with the farmlands? You know, that's all integrated into a plan to make some basic decisions for the future. You know, it's not for you and I or any, because you know, I'm not going to be around, you know, forever. But I think our great-grandkids need something to, they've got to look forward to. How do we continue the cultural education so that the young people know, for example, the problems of these saykees? We have, again, when you're talking to Elyud Martinez, he brilliant as far as he's an artist. He was with the National Bureau of Reclamation, top man there, and highly respected all over the world. But one of the things he always talked about was the necessity of letting people know what happened before. You know, this is not magic where you turn the faucet

and call the plumber. You've got to know something about water. What's kind of situation you see like with the saykees? And it's not just up north, they got them down in a deming and places in a southern part of the state. Well, you know, Ernie, I haven't really thought that much about it, but I'll tell you this, it's part of our culture. It's part of our traditional ways. And I would say that we need to keep them in tact as long as we can, because that's what we're all about. You know, we have a lot of culture, a lot of history and the state is beautiful, beautiful. I mean, it's, you know, everybody that comes here talks about the sky, talks about. I would say this to you that it's incumbent upon us as part of a process to save our asekis, to save the things that are really memorable to you and I and to our great ancestors, because, you know, we can destroy history like that just overnight

and we need to preserve it, because even our language, you know, it's really important to me. I'm really the last of my generation in the Trujillo family that speaks both languages, you know, my kids don't, but my kids get out of school right now and as you know, in the next century, the Hispanic population is going to be a big, big population base in this country. And I told him, I think I may want to send you to Mexico to learn the language so you can come and converse with me. I think it's time to take a minute or two and let the people in our audience know why they should vote for our Trujillo for State Land Commissioner. Only I would like to say that. I think our Trujillo background fits the office right to a T. I have, well, first of all, I'm a Native New Mexican, so I understand rural New Mexico and I understand the ranching and everything that's rural about New Mexico.

But more importantly, I have had the opportunity to run two public corporations. And you've been a resident of Santa Fe. And you know, Santa Fe is not an easy town. I mean, you've got a melting pot and got a lot of growth here and I saw that when I was mayor. But I have that in itself that I can say that I was able to deal with a budget, I was able to deal with the management of folks. You know, at that time we had like almost 1,000 employees. I don't know what they have now. But so I bring that to the table. And now the other aspect is that I am a businessman. And you know, I have to make some decisions that regarding payroll. I pay the taxes and everything. And so I understand when I deal with people in oil and gas ranching that we almost have to be partners in order to succeed. You know, the partnership is very important.

That's how I would view people I do business with. So that's key. You know, that they understand a guy that only knows how bureaucracy but has run a business. And academically, you know, you brought a guy out of the country and said you're going to be an urban planner or a regional planner. But you know, I have those skills but I still understand New Mexico. I understand the country. And those, the planning background in itself gives me the opportunity to, in the past I have to look at development issues, environmental issues because I totally understand them. And lastly, I've been a good consensus builder because I've had to be a consensus builder when you run a town like Santa Fe or the county. And lastly, I would hope that people would look at me because I'll do this. I will commit to being accessible. I will be a listener. And I will make decisions timely.

And I will hire competent staff to assist me in being a year-land commissioner. And Ernie, I, not only need your listing, not even spoke, but I need yours. Okay, thank you. And to our good listeners, I'm Ernie Mills. And our guest today, Art Treheo, Democrat candidate for State Land Commissioner. We want to thank you for being with us on report from Santa Fe. Report from Santa Fe is made possible in part by a grant from the members of the National Education Association of New Mexico. An organization of professionals who believe that investing in public education is an investment in our state's economic future. Music Music

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