Aggie Almanac; 134; Immigration Reform

Till then, good luck! Coming up on Aggie Almanac, three campus visitors with strong views on the tough topic of immigration reform. Most immigrants would rather stay at home.

Fences will not solve this chapter. I have heard so many immigrants saying I have come because I want to be changed by this country. Hi, I'm Hillary Floren and thanks for watching Aggie Almanac, KRWGTV's weekly show with a focus on NMSU. You know, one of the things that makes our region unique is its proximity to the Mexican border. And with immigration reform very much on the minds of Americans right now, NMSU has been making a special effort to focus attention on complex border issues and policies by bringing guest speakers to campus. In today's program, we get their perspective. A Latina journalist. We need to understand as smart people that we are in a country, we are living in a country where several million Latino undocumented immigrants will be here and will stay here.

Along with several million undocumented Canadians, Polish, Irish, Russian, let's not forget. The author of an award-winning book. We're really experiencing the largest wave of immigration in this nation's history. We tend to think of undocumented or illegal immigrants as overwhelmingly men. But today there are millions of women, many of them, these single mothers who have come to the United States from Central America and Mexico and left their children behind in their countries. And the Mexican ambassador to the U.S. respect, fences and law enforcement by itself will not solve this channel. In the past months, all three have visited the NMSU campus to share their views on one of the most complicated and controversial topics in the U.S. illegal immigration. We start with Maria Inahosa, a name and voice you have probably heard before. She's an award-winning journalist, host of the popular national public radio program

Latino USA. And correspondent for the PBS News Magazine now. She came to NMSU as part of the University Speakers series to talk about journalism in America and to share her insights on how Americans view the immigration dilemma. Last week in New Bedford, about 45 minutes outside of Boston, you may have heard that there was a series of immigrant rates that went on in one factory that actually supplies leather goods to the U.S. military. About 450 people work in that factory, about 350 people were rounded up and processed for deportation. The problem was that some people had heard that the immigration officials were coming, rumors have it that four women jumped out of the windows to try to escape from the INS and they died as a result. What does this say about who we are as a society?

The reason why I don't like to use the term illegal alien or illegal immigrant. It doesn't come from the fact that I learned it from some funky, lefty, Latino intellectual academic who just made me come to some clear political realization about how illegal was the wrong term. Now, it came from someone who looks nothing like me and has no kind of experience like me. Ellie Vizel, who won the Nobel Peace Prize and survived the Holocaust. And Ellie Vizel and I were talking one day in the CNN newsroom. And he said to me, you know the reason why I never used the term illegal person. He said, that's how it started with Hitler. They declared the Jews illegal people. He said, there's no such thing as an illegal human being. You may have committed a crime, but there's no such thing as an illegal immigrant, an illegal alien, an illegal human being.

They're living in here without papers, they're living here illegally. But when we start referring to groups of people as the illegals, Ellie Vizel said it's a very slippery slope. I have never heard an immigrant say, I am going to go to the United States because my mission is to change the United States. I want to transform American culture and I want to bring my Mexican culture and my Latino culture and I want to transform that country with Guayan. Never heard that. But I have heard so many immigrants saying, I have come because I want to be changed by this country. Next, Pulitzer Prize-winning author Sonia Nazario, who took a train ride like no other. She followed the trail of a Honduran child named Enrique, who was left behind when his mother immigrated to the United States to earn money for their family. His longing to be with his mother spurred him to take a perilous journey through Mexico

on the tops of trains ruled by thugs. He's one of thousands of children risking life and limb on these trains to get to the United States. Nazario made the journey herself to learn more about what she calls a modern day Exodus and she wrote a series of articles and a book about the experience. I was tense and I was filthy and I was in fear of being beaten or robbed or raped pretty much every day. In the south, it's so hot, it's 105 degrees and you're sitting on a piece of metal. It's so hot you can't touch the train. And it's so humid that these huge moss balls grow on the electrical wires by the tracks. You can actually see the tracks squiggle from the heat. They're warped by the heat. In the north, it's so incredibly cold that people actually freeze to death on the trains and there's ice that forms on the trains. I felt after each train ride that I was at my breaking point, I just could not do more. But I would get off and I would go to a hotel and I would sleep in a warm bed and eat a warm meal.

And what amazed me was that Enrique and these other children endure months of danger and misery sleeping out in the open in the elements. And he talked to me about how he would sleep in sewage culverts and how he would sleep under crawl spaces, under houses to hide from the immigration authorities in Mexico. Kids talked about sleeping in trees to protect themselves from animals, from predators. And Enrique talked about begging, they have to beg for any food that they get along the way. And he told me about how he had gone two days without any water until he felt like his throat was swelling shut. These kids describe going up to five days with no food until they would literally fall off these trains with hunger. I couldn't fathom what these kids went through. But Enrique, these obstacles were nothing compared to his incredible yearning to be with his mother again. I've written about immigrants for 20 years off and on.

But there were some things that I really didn't understand until I made this journey on the trains. For one thing, the incredible desperation that's driving these mothers, these women out of these countries. I mean, in Honduras, there's 42% unemployment and sub-employment, 42%. And the newspaper ads tell women, if you're 28 years or older, don't bother applying. You're too old. I wanted people to put themselves in these women shoes. Who wouldn't consider leaving their children if they were crying at night with hunger? And the cupboards were absolutely bare and they had nothing to give their children. These women know that they're coming here illegally. And they know that that's wrong on some level. But what American would not at least consider doing that if they were in the same shoes. But I also came to understand that these levels of undocumented immigration, about 4% of our population now is here illegally, have a huge downside as well and can't continue at this rate.

Those who are most hurt by this influx are the neediest Americans. The one in 14 Americans who do not have a high school degree. And one study has shown that those Americans has seen their wages drop by 8% between 1980 and 2000 directly because of competition from immigrant labor. And those are mostly African Americans and previous waves of Latino immigrants. Immigrants who come here are predominantly poor. And because of our system of taxation, because they are poor, they pay a third less taxes than people who are born in this country. And they and their children qualify and use more government services. I found that the cost-benefit calculation was just as troubling for the immigrants themselves. It's undeniably true that these women, that these mothers in sending money home to their children, they're able to eat, they're able to study past the third grade.

But what I also found was that after years apart, these kids felt abandoned. To me, it seems the media coverage of immigration proposals in Congress really have failed to convey some important facts. We've tried better enforcement. We've tried a temporary guest worker program. If you travel immigrant routes, you really have to come to one conclusion many people say on those routes. Which is that you have to tackle this issue, this exodus, at its source. You have to help create jobs in the handful of countries. And it's four and five countries that are sending 80% of the people who are coming to this country undocumented early legally. And what people are calling for in these countries and along these routes is a new foreign policy by the United States that centered around the issue of immigration that helps to create jobs in these places. They talk about the need for the United States to encourage more democratic governments that will distribute the wealth that exists in these countries more equally.

And to push for a reduction in corruption in these countries and overpopulation in these countries. Most immigrants would rather stay at home with everything they know, their culture, their language, their family, then come to a totally foreign place and start all over again, start a new life. The women say that I talk to, that it wouldn't take radical changes to keep them at home. Finally, this is Mexico's ambassador to the United States. He came to NMSU with a message from his government about immigration that it backs comprehensive immigration reform and both countries working together to deal with the immigration issue. We're also partners on security matters, partners in trade and bringing economic opportunities to countries, partners in the fight against terrorism, organized crime, why then can't we be partners in managing together the migration flow between our countries in a legal human. Human, safe, dignified, orderly way.

We are having first a humanitarian issue. We have hundreds of people that every day are crossing the border unnecessarily risking their lives, risking the lives of others because when you have had more than 20 years of only enforcement, which I respect, if you don't have a comprehensive view, and if it's only one sided, then there can be unintended effects. And we have not created in Mexico the necessary social and economic opportunities for our people to stay in the country. We are not avoiding our part of this responsibility, but we believe that there is a shared responsibility. Our responsibility on this side of the border, because the American economy is a great magnet, needs people, it's hiring the people.

So in the one hand, we don't want them, and on the other hand, we're giving them jobs, jobs that the economy needs. In our case, we haven't created all the economic opportunities needed for our people to stay, and we need our people to stay. There is no future for a country to develop itself further, if we don't find a way to keep our young, brave, daring people, hardworking people, you know they are hardworking people. In our own country, our future at the border depends a lot if we are able to take pressure out of the border. If we are able by a comprehensive reform in the United States, that will combine security with verification and interior, with a gas worker program, with a solution for the hardworking people that are here, so that we can recover circularity. The United States cannot cope along with this problem, Mexico cannot cope along with this problem.

The magnitude of American economy will continue, even if we do better, and the only way to tackle this is to cooperate. One of the presenters in that segment, Maria Inohosa, is no stranger to public broadcasting. You can watch her on the PBS program now, right here on KRWGTV, Friday nights at 8, and Sunday mornings at 9.30. We'll be right back. This is an area that needs to be decided by the federal government, and so because of that lack of direction of the government, we almost have anarchy and every state is left to deal with this issue on their own. Welcome back. We continue our look at the thorny issue of illegal immigration, and in a moment we'll talk to an NMSU immigration expert to get her insight on the topic. But first, where are we now on the issue of undocumented workers? Well, it turns out what happens regarding immigration reform is very much tied into the US presidential elections.

Whatever happened to immigration reform, last year, more than a million protesters turned out in cities across the nation, demanding something be done about the legal status of the estimated 12 million undocumented immigrants in the US. After those marches, the Senate passed a measure that would have provided a path to citizenship, but it was never reconciled with the Republican-controlled House, the legislation languished. This year, immigration rallies were held again, but the crowds were much smaller. Organizers blamed the low turnout on recent immigration raids that left immigrants afraid to speak out in public. USA is supposed to be freedom, so I don't know why they're treating everybody like that. Those who did march wanted to send a message. Not to let immigration reform take a backseat to the 2008 presidential elections. They want amnesty, a path to citizenship, guest worker programs, and an N to immigration raids. There are just honest citizens of other countries who do just the same thing that citizens of this country do, which is try to raise a family and support your family.

Politically, immigration reform is a hot potato issue. We do need to work together on comprehensive immigration reform. All the Democrats running for president favor immigration reform, but they know there are voters outraged by the idea of amnesty. Republican candidates are divided for favor a legal path to citizenship, for remain opposed, too will consider the idea. What gives these protesters hope is that President Bush supports a guest worker program, and the House and Senate are under Democratic control. But with Americans so divided on this issue, it's not clear whether there will be enough votes to get an immigration measure passed. In our studio to talk more about immigration reform is Professor Nancy Oretzkin, who teaches law in the NMSU Business College, but she also served as the director of the U.S. Mexico Conflict Resolution Center on campus. That's a group that facilitates dialogue on immigration issues between the U.S. and Mexico, so she knows what she's talking about. Thank you for coming in today.

We've just come out of two pieces talking about the different immigration issues, a lot of problems, a lot of issues, a lot of opinions shared. Why has the U.S. failed to come up with a policy so far? Well, I think the reason that they've failed to come up with a policy is it's a very difficult situation that actually touches the emotions and the legal aspect of almost every American. There have been a lot of proposals that have been put forth by the Senate, by the House of Representatives, and by the President, and there's been no agreement. And this is an area that needs to be decided by the federal government, and so because of that lack of direction of the government, we almost have anarchy and every state is left to deal with this issue on their own. You talked about the emotional side of the issue, and you've gotten to deal with that in your work. Talk about the U.S. Mexico Conflict Resolution Center and what your job and experiences have been there. Well, actually, the work of the U.S. Mexico Conflict Resolution Center has been suspended since 2004 because we are in a funding problem.

But this was a center that was established with a congressional earmark that was supported by Senator Domenici, and it was set up to provide conflict resolution, support, and education, and services to businesses and people that were going to be involved in different areas of NAFTA. With respect to migration at one time back in the year 2000 and 2001, we ran migration dialogues and had people from the U.S. and Mexico come and talk about different aspects of migration and the center facilitated this discussion. What were some of the findings of those discussions? Well, the findings of the discussion is that there is a lot of misunderstanding from the different groups. We ran these dialogues for three distinct groups. We had one that involved academics, one group of the media, which is blamed for reporting or misreporting lots of issues all around the world, but especially in immigration. And then we had another group that involved sociologists, and we had some undocumented migrants in the group to talk with each other.

And the purpose was just to have a facilitated dialogue to come up with some possible ideas that the U.S. Embassy in Mexico City could support. And since then, there's been a change of the personnel, and so any of those suggestions are still sitting in somebody's desk. But they were made in the dialogue was going. The funding problem came at an inopportune time, but are you looking to get back on track with that? I know you're hoping for more funding. And at some time in the future, I mean, at the point that we were doing this, the dialogue started at a time if you'll recall where somebody drowned in the Rio Grande trying to cross from Mexico to the U.S. And there was a media person videotaping this drowning, and it raised all kinds of emotional issues. And so at that point, the U.S. Embassy in Mexico City said, we need to have a open dialogue to talk about these issues. And that's essentially what has happened in the U.S. since then. There's been a lot of talking, but there's a lot of disagreement.

And so therefore, there's been no decision. And meanwhile, the immigration issues continue, and I don't think a day goes by where in one newspaper in the U.S., everybody reads the heart-wrenching stories. Because essentially right now, there's no federal regime that's being followed. There's federal rules on the books, but meanwhile, corporations continue to employ undocumented people, and although currently, they're cracking down and deporting people in no regimented way. Different states are passing different laws. We have minute men on some parts of the border. Every state now is left to come up with their own situation, and it's created a huge unrest, and it's our own war in the U.S. on the southern border. And the numbers are staggering, too. You're mentioning the individual stories that are heart-wrenching and that really touch your heart, but 12 million illegal immigrants. And then talk about the New Mexico numbers. I know that in your research, you've come across a few numbers on how New Mexico itself is affected.

According to a report that I found that this is from 2000, that they suggest there's 39,000 undocumented people living in New Mexico, and New Mexico authorities requested $2.8 million from the federal government to compensate for the incarceration of this group. And I'm not sure that this is correct, but New Mexico is one of the hardest hit states because of its location to Mexico, right? It only makes sense. Well, the previous legislation aimed at curbing the flow amnesty. Talk about that. Well, rather than just address that, I mean, currently, I think what Congress the President and the House of Representatives are looking to do is to come up with a program that will address the variety of issues. And essentially, we have a number of issues. One is, how do we recognize the undocumented people that are here and give them legal status? That's been addressed with amnesty, and that's a huge issue between the political parties. The President currently believes that they should have a path to citizenship, but coming up with what that path is is difficult.

The people in his own party that oppose him in a number of Democrats say, well, then you're giving legal recognition to people that broke the law to begin with, so then they suggest that these undocumented people have to leave the country and possibly stay out of the country for a period of time, and then come back, and that doesn't make sense. Because then they lose whatever source of income they currently were. They have. And so the amnesty issue is one that somehow the different groups have to come up with how we can give a legal status to people who came here unlawfully. And I don't know the answer to that. Well, we did discuss before we came on the air that there is no one answer that's going to make everybody happy. That's true. But the amnesty is one issue. The other issue is the continual flow of undocumented people into our country as it is. Since we all can recall, the U.S. has had a sign to say, come to the U.S. This is the land of opportunity. Your dreams can be met here. We're one of the countries who have advertised that forever for your parents, for me, for my kids, and now all of a sudden we are saying, no, you can't come here.

And we don't have a comprehensive plan of what allows somebody to come here. I mean, we have rules that say you can come here a certain way legally, but we have a lot of people who have come here illegally. We don't have enough security on our borders. And we now have a huge problem with a large number of people dying in the deserts as they cross to come in to the U.S. And they're crossing in Mexico's southern border from South America and on Central America. And so it's a huge issue that isn't just our issue. The U.S. has to deal with the other countries and their governments and work very hard to establish economic incentives that people can reach dreams in their own countries. And then their attraction to possibly just come here will also kind of abide. How is the presidential race impacting this? Well, currently, I mean, we've just seen two huge debates between the eight or nine perspective candidates from the Democrats and the Republicans. And we talk about the war in Iraq. And one of the issues that is supported for the war in Iraq, irrespective of your political affiliation is we believe in the U.S. to export the rule of law in a democratic way.

Well, here we have an immigration issue that hasn't been adequately addressed because it's difficult and they can't come to a decision and it's created our own war. So it's a little hypocritical and we are all very hopeful that possibly they will look at immigration and establish some clear cut rule of law guidelines from the federal government that then the states can follow and probably address our own war here. So I think eventually it will become a major issue. I know our governor is a contender and he's very passionate about coming up with a workable humane just situation and I'm sure he'll bring it in terms of an issue to the floor. A lot of work still to be done. I can't believe we're out of time. We barely scratched the surface, but thank you so much for coming in today. We appreciate your time. Thank you. And time now for our amazing Aggie of the Week when we honor someone on campus involved in something that we think is amazing.

This is some of the award winning art of Virginia Maria Romero and the artwork will become even better known thanks to the help of some NMSU business students. Romero approached NMSU for assistance with a marketing plan for her company, Arte de Romero, the company markets ceramic tiles with images from Romero's original artwork. The project was given to the Arrowhead Research Center which specializes in helping small businesses get off the ground. It was Arrowhead's first time helping an artist. Arrowhead assigned the project to a graduate business class which did a market analysis on how she could expand her business. Romero says she's already using some of the recommendations to grow her company. If you'd like to nominate an amazing Aggie or have any comments about the show, call us at 646-2818 or send an email to Aggie Almanac at Yahoo.com. And that is our show for this week. I'm Hillary Floren. Thanks for watching.

Thank you. Thank you. Thank you.