Inflection Point with Lauren Schiller; #104; More than power poses: why self-empowerment is a myth and what we can do instead - Ruth Whippman, author
- Transcript
after that i'm more insular and i feel really empowered today and towering has become description of more of a feeling that rather than anything to do with actual prospects are crap and more insular and that's the day an inflection point the point ina you know
there's a lot of trash last ice age a couple of years ago i talked with grief when that the author of america at the end of her book was about how our pursuit of happiness is creating an nation of nervous wrecks she investigated the multibillion dollar self help industry to see if it was actually making a dent in the american psyche in terms of the return on herself oh wow
like really really low i'm lauren shuler and this season an inflection point for trying to discover how all the quote empowered women are expressing right now lead to actual power set more than a hundred women were elected to congress in the past midterm the rise the new team event the toppling of powerful men like really roger ailes bill cosby charlie rose of this newfound power last will you feel proud to wear that future is female t shirt and three years whose fault is that your main feeling anxious again recently i came across an article that ruth wrote for time magazine right before the twenty sixteen election the title empowerment is awarding women's view of real power so i started to think back on our previous conversation and to think that me the
power like happiness is considered entirely up to us as individuals i went to silicon valley major problems i lived in and inequality and the white guys like violence against women are any more effective than all these things so griffin i sat down once again to sort out exactly how women are supposed to get power if we can simply take it for ourselves and get some perspective on this whole question of empowerment and what exactly needs to change for empowerment to power so i think this is a lot of parallels betraying this i dare of empowerment feminism and the self help industry which is something i really like that a lot when i was in the pit and one of the conclusions i read pretty quickly was this idea that we have this fee that happiness is kind of an
individual responsibility to say instead of thinking you know society's responsibility to make everybody there to create the conditions under which everyone to be happy is like the individual needs debate in a guide to mindfulness classes or even self help books and write in their gratitude journal and doing yoga classes in all of these things to come on and tell yourself up by your bootstraps to make yourself how ms quick punitive approach to happiness is quite a way be individualistic approach i think a lot of the sentence was can be applied to this idea of empowerment feminism so what are some of the ways we've seen women tried to find empowerment or will be empowered waste word empowering i mean you see it everywhere now is come that there was a headline in the onion you know the satirical magazine which is women empowered by everything a woman does things to you to think of everything from buying the right sam pale tech taking that make you pay it isn't yourself and putting them on instagram and you know so one of the set get plastic surgery and if a giant had that was practiced as being something
empowering so you know i think it's become ubiquitous to the point where it's become slightly meaningless and has very very little to do with actual top and it sounds like a lady's elders leaders gave her all about women changing themselves yet to achieve sams since that to see what might well aware that what is where there are jobs to be things that i think that i am in power the word empowerment has been eased so to cover a lot of really important initiatives as well so let's not write off completely but you hate this word empowerment as a kind of feminism which i think of as the kind of lane instead of feminism you know is how soundbites but lane in which is all about being more saturday of stop apologizing speak up in meetings last for a race you know ends this i did it would just be a little more assertive a fruit stand up for ourselves then we would you know we would be paid equally a wee weed free the positions of palau and all the rest of it and i think this idea is quite problematic for a
number of reasons one is that this whole assertiveness model doesn't actually we're coming in general women tend to be punished for these kinds of things rather than rewarded set man can speak up in meetings and darrin old guns blazing and demand a pay rise another estimate and actually for women that kind of thing tends to backfire and there's lots of research that backs this up if i did that deep systemic problems why is sheryl sandberg writing a bit saying unit didn't address to women sang going to monterey is rather than addressing her message to corporations to actually look at them pay stretches and tried to pair a man and when it creates why we placed in the burden on into the two women to fix these problems that's such a good point and i i feel like her thinking on it has evolved since she wrote that but they haven't been keeping up with her writing on its and have you seen anything of where she's been changing her karen she's a tweet the message rather than change the fundamental message said and this is a terrible tragedy and my heart goes out to
show some bad because she lost her husband a couple of years ago a few years ago and i think that led her to kind of tweak some of her messaging around you know have a great partner unusual partners support and she realized actually she's it she was in a very privileged position to even have a partner something similar tweaks than addressing the fundamental message so somebody could be using how thirty two really address pay inequality by targeting companies by targeting man i'm innocent the other things i mean the times and companies by targeting governments to enact legislation around this by targeting man collecting devices always you know women speak up in meetings it's never men lesson in meetings you know it is always the women stop apologizing it's never men here do with a bit more apologizing in its all about decisiveness of the women rather than kind of deference a man comes back to why you know why are women such a wonderful target for this type of thinking why is the burden is always on women to
do the changing you know why do we always have to shift our norms and cultures wise see in that that the male partner is that that apartment that ever comes back to the fact that we as women tend to have this massive appetite for their self regulation an atf at the gale says that they we did we buy these batiks i mean we're the ones he bites but when i was there much to my back and i was looking at the self help industry eighty percent of self help books are bought by women man did not want to change radio announcer directions that i went to the doctor that they need to be made that are about you know we feel like there's there's so much more we could be doing and not only treated her so that we can teach people around us right exactly and the burden is on us and i did come across these are ones that i notice when i was three my research for american actions there's whole series of books called women head and it's women who love too much when they think too much we know
you do too much when they never see the titles here men who love to little old man who do too little think doolittle whatever reason is because not by those picks a massive industry it's a massive industry to make to getting coverage women to feel bad about ourselves the law actually does that is that really what we are so we are sort of making a generalized statements about you know all women are mad and obviously within each turn there and across the gender spectrum there are individuals who have different approaches different feelings about this raid but i do wonder of now would be the time when the man whose theories could actually throw your heart were getting more introspective about the systems that they're perpetuate a yes and especially with young boys i mean you see this paradigm with with boys and girls as i have three boys and you need our into that kind of clothing section of todd and you say to all the old ideal wherever and every gust hits it as a kind of speeches sierra dark power you know all of
this and the boys you know do the things that boys are still little monster little tara a little nfl chest yesterday as she's so for the very first time i went into target of bias at my son and i so the set we said be kind of met in tonic or don't take into account that hadn't been accidentally left there from the girls section as an inmate at and then i saw the war there was a picture of a boy wearing a shirt it's really quite extraordinary eat do not say that message that his boys he should be doing the changing all in a day and it's been on boys and men to actually even made them more female standard so i do think you're right to do things in vegas starting to slightly shift was recently we've all grown up in a systemic and for some reason just eat out because they've grown up in it we accept it that's how it airs and so are we as we men are trying to find news oliver smarts and abilities to navigate within the system when that we actually could have this opportunity to just seems completely and expectations in the ways that we do but we work and i say well even
the system only five days where he pets the baton on the the powerless person in a situation you know you laugh we talk about personal responsibility it's a cut bait and switch in a way it's a kind of you're taking the responsibility of the powerful people and says shifting on to the powerless person and i think you know this whole idea of empowerment it's become so divorced from anything to do with actual power it i think oh they seen as champagne and makeup tips in bikini body jennings announce that when reliable all those things as empowering it kind of takes us away from thinking about power who has power why they have power and what we can do to change that kind of obscures the message i think that will be caused is taken over by companies wanting to market their product on this quote unquote trend of feminism in the future is the now empty of girl power in an area i grew up in
the camry changed feminism into girl power with they were despised does it mean new today i mean i medicate in adele already it's in france arising innocent woman power at something cute it looks nice on the spot is he said it's pretty eight minutes non threatening and said it wouldn't comment tends the one about the word empowerment united that anybody in any actual position of power would never ever use the word empowerment set it wasn't my parents never say a man saying you know oh here's my naked fighters of my post prostate surgery by day and find his empire and that will never ever happen you know you would never hear the president saying oh it's so empowering having these nuclear launch codes you know it's something that people use when they are very far from power this is an inflection point i'm orange seller
speaking with proof whitman author of america the anxious for more stories of how women rise up bronson power and subscribe to the podcast at inflection point radio dot org and while you're there consider a contribution to support the show so we can keep telling will be right back the patient to patient the petition
bishop it's just sad this is inflection point i'm lauren shuler speaking with a wreath whitman author of america the anxious we're talking about female empowerment having sam's and it being clearly very aware of the world that we live in here knew what are the kinds of things that you talk with them about having this big question i mean my oldest son is just hand i said there still are young and you know this is very interesting and scary time to be raising sands i think up until now people with those as i say i think see themselves as part of this big grand femme this project change the world and he would sense of kind of been allowed to make noah and i think we've reached a point with you know the cavanagh them situation with the current president with unit this cut them a
teammate met with this kind of toxic masculinity just re late out there that i think people of parents whose sons really have to address this and i think the urgent work is on us really uncertain in the cost patients that were having i think we just started i tried to talk with my son's about an early version of constantin you know who'd been standing back and listening it's how what a minute these are hard conversations to have his hard to talk about consent before you took a lot of hugging radar a yes exactly so someone to having increasing but it's you know that they're having this comes as <unk> you know this is kind of an elephant in the rim which is the man the main thing hasn't really been addressed and that's the hot comes as it happened i know parents and sons in a frenzy the priest and all kinds of different ways everything from expiring absolutely everything upfront at the edges to you know this one friend to you know really living this is a discussion to have about purity and fire in an accordion in the middle when it comes to the budget but the question of consent is also
i feel like it's tied to other issues like listening to a man or respecting them when they're being assertive or not expecting the career girls to apologize you are things that you were just talking about dressed as women being imported into meetings that work in you know all actually get all ties back to how we relate to each other as as young males and people i mean we're living in a time i even managed to memorize it is as to buy dairy calves graze changing a lot as well but yet even working within that that there's consistent is absolutely and i think you know one question i've had to ask myself is you know we say women shouldn't be apologizing point i think is a good thing and so maybe you know a man and by session my boys should be apologizing more that we've had this this idea that whatever is the male culture standard is automatically the battered tortoise standards set in a men's makeup in meetings therefore when it should pick up the meetings rather than saying you're turning on its head and sang or women tend to listen well emitting some interesting cars man
to do that now i would love to say you know i like every day when it's time for summer camp in i sensed my boys to summer camp and i see these lines of girls or going off to summer camp and its assertiveness camper girls camp you know it's all about getting girls to speak up and be a sense of what i love to send my boys to deference camp this summit you know i would love for them to get and life skills of skills that he cannot and heavily heavily socialized into barrels and not into poisoned in all kinds of very very subtle ways but things just didn't exist and she read there's an article in the new york times that came out just recently which was all about boys grapes which i think are all about and they and this man an emotional intelligence and i think these things are just starting to emerge but you know not in any kind of major mainstream way i would really love to see the yankees battling a much more productive response than some of the other responses that i've heard
from parents of boys to feel achy well you know with all this focus on girl power what about my boy you know it's a totally different powering for my son to have to defer to these gear to these girls then what's their future going to look like and you know he's an ex you're expressing fear that somehow by women actually having more power or into the now congress you know approach to interactions are becoming the standard is actually bad for what it's a tough question because you know under siege as a marco as a parent you kind of fighting your way to the tennessee which is like i want everything for my kid and i want my kid to have the best of everything and antique you need to do well and to succeed and to be happy and to be as as having to do it and that's you know that's the individual verses the collective i don't think you have to see those things in a position that you know i think there is plenty of success and happiness and everything for everybody if we can old learn to communicate effectively and to learn from each other you know what i'm not saying to my
boys you know you have to stand back and that you know maybe girls can succeed now and you know that's not really the point it the point is that we all communicate in a way that's respectful to each other and then everyone's given an equal chance what a concept right so what about for you growing up as a girl on you grew up and in the uk and so i kind of wanted to fall question which is why in the you know i'm curious why girls growing up you know if it cost the pilots were tied and specifically what you were taught versus view it wins happy you're here in the united states around around that same time which i'm just guessing you're born somewhere between them late seventies early eighties that defined area and said i'm like and then i meant the generation x which is this real sway air a fascinating time for me because when i was growing up feminism really was a dirty white i mean you had to practice every e m
mild s statement for some kind of equality ways i'm not a feminist but you cannot offend public what led to be pope is either the man i better not mention it lists saint as of them isn't the same as something to distance yourself from it was seen as an unattractive day of an anchor a and m the man heads saying wade that i mean this is going to get enough and set size of intrepid league head when i was growing up it was oh it was a time of rising prosperity it was a time when you know we were all into this kind of and chair and lighthearted jarrett i think that really cemented this kind of mail how it was all ira may and attachment and it wanted to be appear to ernest ok to invest in things as they see kind of tropes of pop culture from the eighties the main you know the brat pack maybe sixteen counts them in the things really now as things like great crowd chatter hands and in a inequality at eh it's actually
know and that's how i was so i i ain't worth the various large organizations in at the play my twenties and such a house was completely and utterly alone well we waited to have conversations at night you know i was at the reception at the time and we just completely accepted as normal that man in power when it's actually assessed every way to talk amongst ourselves about it to avoid the most inane another debt and be in an elevator with batman in the third you know what about but don't say to question this to hire with autism is his state in this patriarchal thing that it at that now i think i'm at a movement especially given us on a pair of goggles to see the world in a very different light in it meant that when i worked them tv station and we were asked by the powers that be to pitch ideas for series which was president that the night and justices in british society says that in episode on each one
and i pitched an idea about feminism and literally people lost me out of time so we can do that i mean that would be ridiculous let me ten years ago you are a lad suggested the most forensic pinky a hat designs bedding and they love is to not that many bats an album an evening i think it's really massive each item is the accent she's such a chance i'd say in the last ten years and i think that probably is the diversity and he can the us on that but you know i think the difference now betraying them you know the way and soon as good as they say it's because they see the difference between the way people respond to play it and it's a hell and why people respond to kristen doesn't forget that she made i'll
say that i'm lauren shuler and this is an inflection point as we've seen in the past few years it's time we gain ground those in power to push back and then blame for not working hard enough being assertive enough not being ambitious enough organs having too much ambition isn't the american dream where the american gas light i asked greeks to respond to something we heard earlier in the season from dr garber adams an organizational psychologist and diversity and inclusion and smart yours are all that is based on this myth of meritocracy that no it's going to go to the hardest worker and they are the people who are going to succeed is the smartest people blah blah blah but that basically implies that if you are in the black candidate or you're the woman who didn't get ahead was your fault
and it ignores what's really happening and what occurs in a system is designed to help ensure that you don't get ahead because that's where all of those by z's are built an app so i think bob adams expresses it brilliantly i mean i think this idea of meritocracy is a very very steely thread running through american society people in this country have this very very strong belief that if you just work hard at that being happy being waged being standing successful been healthy pink everything then you can achieve it and yes it is a mess and it's absolutely is putting the onus on the wrong people and it's it's absolutely does not acknowledge as baron says it does not acknowledge the systemic injustices which absolutely run through this contract and all of the obstacles in getting to that point i saw a lot with the happiness industry that we know
that the self help industry when i was recessed my big idea is this idea that you have this individual responsibility to be happy and you see these names that on facebook things like happiness is a choice in it so the idea is you know if you're not making that choice and you're not working hard enough then you have no right to be happy and then very you know positive psychology and startup industry absolutely minimize the effect of our circumstances whether that's up her personal circumstances or our kind of demographic circumstances in terms of a class on race or gender absolutely minimize effect all those things absolutely play up to the max this i did that of individual asset and into vigil control over these things we can just try harder it is to scare these straps approach to happiness and sam with autism unites this is i did just well the reason why you're not big headache <unk> have a pastor rasor men in iowa fifty power poses in the restroom that's it so that the patriarchy plays kym it might play in a court if it
does offer a lot of those are getting messages and capitulation poses in the restroom before amazing and seven i might listen i'll bet it's a in a typical scene that typical precious that's like the governments let's look at legislation that's like a real way is to actually address these very very thorny issue it is when you think about the rise of these women's only space as yoko women's coworking space says i mean you mentioned the girl you know the girl assertiveness camps and things like that you know i think the idea is that would that it's a you know it's a male free zone so there's no navigating the gender dynamics then you have the space to we go to fail or to express yourself without being shut down et cetera et cetera and i don't know what would you think about those kinds of spaces where many spices have their place after show and i think you need to absolutely say i think some of it is to do with threat in ac women's refuges and there are places where women can get because i literally and
farah says now violence in the us are overseen very important thing to maintain that you know in terms of coworking spaces and all the rest and absolutely i think people judicially who have been disempowered in there are various ways really benefit from hiring nine spice it's actually interesting way i was it was written as ask about boys grapes and in the new york times and i think that is an example of laughter mal and the spices can actually be productive as well i think that said that this isn't the one issue because of the mandy spices in historically have been used to exclude women from power from someplace the power but i think the boys in their eye though was a boy is in this ask to express in this i did that you know they fell i usually they feel like they have to one of the guys are impressed when nana or whatever and it was a safe space to kind of express emotions so when handled carefully i think those things can be important to me yeah i feel it
means when one is that your business well it's coming out other women i mean the bottom line is that something about that that is just feels relaxing and shiites iran and we have a different way of talking with each other than we have been talking with managers you know it is how is it is it that way because this is the system that we're present is that i was a goal is that like i don't know no but there i think there are definitely pros to it but when i start to worry about is that we're heading toward another weird kind eggs segregation of the sexes you know that we're like eh by accident and going backwards you know we really were trying to do is create respect for all genders together in the same place where we can be a source of power for each other regardless of their gender yeah absolutely and i think you know i mean it's a very complex issue and i think it's so much depends on the circumstances and why people a dentist in and watts situation then and says you know yes i did think that then the features such as not to completely segregate the two genders and you know have
you know another way and will happen is this i think absolutely right that that the future is fossil cooperated on their hands to communicate and see that render this unit ridiculous system of gender stereotyping and segregation and and you know all of these tribes that we have in place about what you saw can be because you're born on them out of him this is an inflection point i learned seller speaking with richard whitman author of america the changes we're talking about female empowerment will be right back thank
you this is an inflection point i'm orange seller speaking with a wreath wittman the author of america the anxious or something about female empowerment he read an article in time out right before the twenty sixteen election which was called election anywhere we talk about is that empowerment is working women view of raw power and you could see the dial could be healing can you talk about who she is is so is it done as it is a writer and journalist as his fantastic and that she you write this very long island one for an influential piece about hillary clinton which tracks i am amongst other things tracked people's attitudes to ward's hat and defense addresses that when
there clinton was in office in whatever role people regard as her very highly but when she was seeking hand next office says when others kind of vitriol an anticancer stuff would come out and wants she concluded was that it was something that this act of asking for power which made her unpopular as a once it was her performance in the job people and pretty much though she did play which is actually in the job but when she was saying trying to seek power people became very very uncomfortable and did this so there's a certain way that we're living in a different world now but you will a soldier in elections just opposite spirit of fear rage against hillary clinton fall and she was you know i think she did she was scrutinized in a way that no male candidate has become in a trump clinton there was this kind of adage set an example of this principle that you know a man can get away with virtually anything a woman can get away with virtually nothing when it comes to power and this was such an extreme example of
it that's uniting his corruption reaches levels that are quite extraordinary and seed hands her emails on a certain a problematic email server and yet she was the one that is eike utterly leveled is corrupt never sat in the co op when you know andrea that's another story but yet they said this this is a very very strong example that i encourage you to go and meet the essay it all pays about ten year old is also itching to me is it the quote the idea because the absence of prejudice against women caught in the act of asking for power yes i would actually stood out to me is that not only the idea of you're striving for something more than we have been a problem but the notion that ej that we have to ask for it but it's absolutely i mean that is the whole la nina without getting too much into the semantics of an empowering it's like somebody is handing power to the disempowered person and who was the somebody handed power because they oversee still in a mentos the same power hierarchy yes why do we need to go and ask for power in in
that way you know i mean it's assumed that men are the ones who buy rights naturally have the power and women once it and seek it and yeah i mean people are very very uncomfortable with that yeah ish and i think i actually think we should spell of a worse time on the semantics of empowerment because the more you read about empowerment and more i know sometimes i'm like that's great you know the un is empowering girls by ensuring that they have more education and in third world countries and able to read and therefore take her their families immigrants and hundreds are silly that kind of harm and i'm like yes that's inherently has in fact a powerful entity is giving power to a less powerful entity yes it did sometimes i read about empowerment and it just feels really fluffy and like meaningless because we don't throw the baby out with a bass was et slash an apparent that yes absolutely of course under the banner of empowerment there are many wonderful initiative which each name to sound and you know i think he started his words started with the air
one of the day which was to take power in the hands of disempowered communities for whatever reason and was kind of reaches out to his innocence or less and i think as this is a book called the word has become associated with this kind of feminism like this kind of event feminism as a bunch of the self help industry somehow that and hiring his butt time ago description of more of a fear rather than of anything to do with actual power structures say you know we talk about you know funding is so empowering what we describe it when we say that is kind of this you know a feeling of pets and say aw yeah cafe ok it's you know self worth rather than anything that actually breaks down any actual cars stretches open itself in a position of authority i recognize position of authority of cases let's talk about how are going to change this mcintyre met right here
guys aspire ok so i am and other and other guests on the shows rebecca traister who has a book out now called getting mad and she talks about anger as a tool for evolution or is it i mean we are i feel like we like it's not just it's not just the bridges you're angry radio and you heard her theme is really that we need to listen to the stories behind people's anger and and take a minute to understand where they're coming i'm from and why they're angry and that's not just about all of us women getting out there you know with our pitchforks and marching and really down the street for anne and demanding teens but then but the question here is for me and i feel like this ties in with your work and the happiness industry or the self help industry at mit which is like how are we actually getting done in iraq has mattered each other all the time that's a lake so i think i mean about it has set is wonderful and i haven't yet has just a republican i've i've read lots around and i've heard her speak on those occasions and i think this is so important is i did that you
know women's anger has been a race through his trade that a we need to listen to why women are angry over a set where we perhaps not wise is exactly as you said i don't think and their tracks miki at a new air progressive ideals i mean i think that our men a very very angry people in the water the moment and i knew some of them are share my ideas you know fox news is an incredibly angry space where people are either hate this being fought against an intensive hands and yet against away man against all sorts of things and i wouldn't necessarily say that that was productive that i was at sixteen the unproductive so i think it just i let hamas it does the way i think is a good starting point because i think and it can motivate people but i think you know it is it's a much more complex and messy failed denton that perhaps suggest that i think about a test it to be fed does acknowledge that as well and
i was eighteen you know this is a kind of political driving force but then as a society and as a as an emotion as a as a feeling and i think that anger can kind of clout just thinking as much as it can clarify it is good to recognize the reasons why we should be angry and end an act on those but at the same time i think we're all just a giant rachel the time that's not necessarily going to lead to come a skillful change and a lot of genuine challenge comes sometime in chrome mantel policy at you know trying to get into the nuts and bolts of what things actually worked and what things don't work in it and i can use is tedious work but isn't so important work as well and i think you know i thought being a dad right thing is it's like you know that there are parallels air with women's increasing anger is also demands increasing anger and that's quite scary prospect many states men's rights activists on twitter tatiana in online i think there is this business she'd spewing forth of male anger at and
you know it's almost as a response to eight women seeking power women becoming angry ina men began and i think as you say that i don't ever want kind of racial the time is not as you put it play a productive way for it that maybe the next billion dollar industry and your manager getting caught what he thinks some of the answers are in terms of shifting the way that we think about power and who should have it and how our is how our world works in it on a daily bases i mean is it getting more women in office is that one piece of us putting women in office is definitely a piece of it and you know women and being involved in causes is hugely important i think it's also focusing on man and you know this is an app you know person a religious or personal style i think it's about targeting man and how men behaved in public and yet it starts with young boys and working on that i think
that's a huge piece of its lamb i think legislation is corporations that needs to take responsibility for these people in power you know the next show a sandbag is rising their feminist manifesto please can you target it at companies or governments you know that the people needed the systems of power rather than individuals and that's a huge that's what we should be focusing on i'm lenin and that also that also speaks to when we get more women leaders inside these companies who have worked their way up through the existing sister and it seems that in some cases they tend to just perpetuate the system that they absolutely demands to succeed at an absolutely so how i don't know that we have the answer here but how do we had a we had a we get the women who are making their way up the corporate ladder you know breaking that glass ceiling to then look down and say that really stopped the way that i had to get here and i'm going to do for the next one and yeah i mean i think that gave a cautious hand is a complicated financing you
write that it in any way a man in power don't necessarily make things better forever women once they get there they are working within the system and you know i think cultural change takes time and i think that's we are in a period of very excited culture change it you know we got pushed back and then we've got a generation ago by some measures i think things are changing i think the next generation of readers have grown up in a very different world than the one that's that i grew up and say it as it does well happen but it's about educating men and boys it's about you know as the sentimental education for women it's about targeting innocent by acknowledging the reality of it and stop a unit trying to stop this attachment that we have to the site eras the individual being the one he can affect change i think we have to acknowledge that systems need to change laws needs talent companies need to change and people in parliament to change and if we stop selling this strain of the
unit to stop apologizing and os horizon then suddenly it enemy fire i think you find knowledge that that is a mine of mine a piece of the puzzle then i think we can start to look at the bigger picture yeah i'm still here in california recently when jerry brown last acts as governor was it to sign a law that by the end of twenty nineteen any california based company had to have at least one woman on the board what you know on the board and by the end of twenty twenty one that had to be at least three at the notes on the board and it is a sad depressing state of affairs the missing made that low at least one women on the bottom is it is really such a lamb body is that he's at least one women you know and i think it's good that we're that there's an commands attention that way i would have preferred to see fifty fifty but you know that we can but what i think we have to look at the kind of nuts and bolts of how we make that happen you know how women can rise to the top but edith what we have in place in times of flexible working in terms of maternity policy in terms of top hats and those things that actually help women to rise
up and there's to be doing things to let happen again that's unit the devil's in the days how often yeah i mean sometimes i think that there an initiative's it's a kind of well intentioned but you just think a mechanism and one that has so recently with them and and that pressure is damn about goldman sachs paying festival staff to airfreight that breast milk from wherever they are traveling in the world back to that baby unit of a young baby oh my goodness we've got something very long hair and are fretting about because they were slightly missing the point about that even when they behave with their babies and you know what we really need is a show and paid maternity dave and they either legislation make usually a dentist of irony come back infected child had those sorts of things i mean you know it's not the actual milks says the city has a long way that i'm having and having flashbacks of traveling and pump and in my in my hotel room and having to call the hotel staff to come and get it because the refrigerator the room was not cold enough to freeze it and then
getting it in the their the hotel kitchen until it was time for me to leave and with that they return to you that i'm baking dish on him about suppress my little black punching bag back and went to the airport where they then opened it up and we're like what and within like a double baby pump action back from a press note that is a very american and it i mean is something about this country where there is like a six week and potentially rich is isis ultimate disability rather than no federally recognized mackenzie some awful little corner of the office where do the pumping away while on this but he wasn't anymore and he began to see that in your tears their eighth appetites ain't with tent city for the first year i mean at the uk is not the best in europe for this but at least you do have i can remember i think it's thirty five weeks of paid spanish and slave and you know there is
legislation around this so i think that that image is to sunset in american society got david what i mean that to me sounds like actual empowerment can actually empowering to all right there were absolutely absolutely yeah and you know we see i think it did low as a lot of the things that can write ten days of them as to get in and out of the sheets thing which is not popular there is unions and any representation is is a really important piece of this because these organizations that i can actually bought into january and material change the workers and the women and there you know there's a reason why companies for years and that's because the union workers have much better conditions than the non union like a septic tank in a collective bargaining is a huge piece of the puzzle as opposed to this tiny individual in a pow uprising in the western piece of the puzzle well what's the possibility of ever been given about how to recognize a situation where if the onus is
being played i knew as the individual to make sweeping changes in your world when really it's not actually up to europe that somebody else to be in charge what he denied the jewish and how that's a really it's a grand i didn't ever been given a specific piece of advice on that because i think it said if this idea of the individual making the changes say baked into cultivating i was really thinking in those terms that's yeah having thought about this quite a lot i think device the past i would give is that if you're in the situation and it feels wrong any daylight you're exhausted and have a bird in the hand you know why should i be one day one of this unit stop and think and to call her out and said this isn't made this is the system and yet he's really uncharted he really has the power and he should really be making the changes you know it's about cooling things out for what they are not accepting that we're the ones an
article in time magazine was tortured is working against you self empowerment as the twenty first century equivalent of pulling yourself up by your bootstraps which was the twentieth century version of let them eat cake which was the eighteenth century version of i have no idea what the problem is here in all of these concerts were thought of by people in power who lying to the advantages they had on their own rise to the top and as my producer eric pointed out to me you can physically pull yourself up by your bootstraps if you the question is if the people in power refused to change the system that gave them air power and that people without power exhaust themselves or attempting to make change so everyone has power how will we ever make a more equal world well we won't of course we need to continue to ask for what we want to be assertive project confidence and as long as for speaking
out for ourselves we need to insist that the individuals running the system specifically white men learn from our strengths her strength and listening and making room for new perspective as their strength in empathy and vulnerability and humility their strength and focusing on the greater good this is how we all rise together this is an inflection point i'm lauren shuler has got or inflection point for today's all of our episodes on podcasts media public stitcher and npr wanted to it was a five star review and subscribe to the podcast no one in with a great resonant story let us know importantly radio dot org and while you're there and they do support inflection point the monthly or one time contribution
to your support women's stories from disco inflection point radio dot org inflection point radio and follow me on twitter and foundation i have to find out more about the guests you heard today and to find out for you know organic inflection point radio dot org complex of plaintiffs are accused of partnership of kalw ninety one point seven fm in sanford go and pr kerry added and content manager and your health so you haven't given to the venue to the cracking it because of this conversation that has the word feminist in all caps on a lightly paying put my chemical attack yes they're tied talk to me about that is this aaron this night because probably eight by a great example of this kind of and pellman
feminism i typically this is a gift it is paying it has gold lettering it's very feminine delegates alice has to have amazon and i think what feminists bed and in this kind of empowerment feminism sense has got this kind of cultural cache as long as it's good as long as is pretty anticipating his golden ears lovely though can surprise that sir it a sudden it's got this kind of cultural add in a culture cache that it that it never had before he uses all here i needed another contestant has this kind of fairness creates intimate connection oh yeah beautiful i say what i say if i'm beautiful i say if armstrong you're not determine my story i well and she met with a day that's another example of this my individualistic tank on feminism because actually you know we're we don't write our own stories tonight extended of them society the paycheck he writes the
stories that my life and you know and this idea that unite tomei and cause i am i am and my in person i just make a power pose in the strength it's not quite that simple as turning on it came it was a long time to develop a voice but now that i have it i'm not going to be silenced by madeleine albright's anyway that madeline of myself and the silence that and the fact that you know it was i did it just about women speaking of five thousand other than this is it's a fantastic life when she's done so much vice versa
- Episode Number
- #104
- Producing Organization
- Inflection Point with Lauren Schiller
- Contributing Organization
- Inflection Point with Lauren Schiller (San Francisco, California)
- AAPB ID
- cpb-aacip-cc9812824c9
If you have more information about this item than what is given here, or if you have concerns about this record, we want to know! Contact us, indicating the AAPB ID (cpb-aacip-cc9812824c9).
- Description
- Episode Description
- Author Ruth Whippman has been studying the self-improvement industry for years. She’s come to the conclusion that empowerment feminism is, well, BS. According to Ruth--the author of "America the Anxious. How Our Pursuit of Happiness Is Creating a Nation of Nervous Wrecks"-- systemic change doesn’t come from trendy girl-power t-shirts or aspirational Instagram quotes. In fact, Ruth thinks the conceit that women could make equality happen if we just...empowered ourselves more shifts the blame for a system of injustice to individuals with the least power to effect change. So how women are supposed to get power if we can’t simply take it for ourselves? I sat down with Ruth to gain some perspective on this whole question of empowerment---and what exactly needs to change for empowerment to lead to power. And when you’re done, come on over to The Inflection Point Society, our Facebook group of everyday activists who seek to make extraordinary change through small, daily actions.
- Broadcast Date
- 2018-11-26
- Asset type
- Episode
- Genres
- Talk Show
- Topics
- Psychology
- Women
- Media type
- Sound
- Duration
- 00:54:24:01
- Credits
-
-
:
:
:
Guest: Whippman, Ruth
Host: Schiller, Lauren
Producing Organization: Inflection Point with Lauren Schiller
- AAPB Contributor Holdings
-
Inflection Point with Lauren Schiller
Identifier: cpb-aacip-aab84b9d96a (Filename)
Format: Hard Drive
If you have a copy of this asset and would like us to add it to our catalog, please contact us.
- Citations
- Chicago: “Inflection Point with Lauren Schiller; #104; More than power poses: why self-empowerment is a myth and what we can do instead - Ruth Whippman, author ,” 2018-11-26, Inflection Point with Lauren Schiller, American Archive of Public Broadcasting (GBH and the Library of Congress), Boston, MA and Washington, DC, accessed November 4, 2024, http://americanarchive.org/catalog/cpb-aacip-cc9812824c9.
- MLA: “Inflection Point with Lauren Schiller; #104; More than power poses: why self-empowerment is a myth and what we can do instead - Ruth Whippman, author .” 2018-11-26. Inflection Point with Lauren Schiller, American Archive of Public Broadcasting (GBH and the Library of Congress), Boston, MA and Washington, DC. Web. November 4, 2024. <http://americanarchive.org/catalog/cpb-aacip-cc9812824c9>.
- APA: Inflection Point with Lauren Schiller; #104; More than power poses: why self-empowerment is a myth and what we can do instead - Ruth Whippman, author . Boston, MA: Inflection Point with Lauren Schiller, American Archive of Public Broadcasting (GBH and the Library of Congress), Boston, MA and Washington, DC. Retrieved from http://americanarchive.org/catalog/cpb-aacip-cc9812824c9