In Black America; Baseball Legend Hank Aaron, Part II

From the University of Texas at Austin, KUT Radio, this is In Black America. I think what made me unique at the baseball player was the fact that I approached every game and a little bit different than just the average ball player. I used to see baseball players sometimes standing in mirror or make sure that they saw this high, that combed the hand, etc. I felt like, you know, that there was absolutely nobody, there was absolutely nobody that would walk down the kitchen now that could probably get me out. That's wouldn't true all the time, but I felt confidence in my ability to play the game. I felt like there was absolutely nothing in baseball that I couldn't do. Major League Baseball Legend and Hall of Famer, Hank Aaron.

Recently, Aaron was on the University of Texas at Austin campus to speak at the time Johnson Lecture Series. Prior to joining the Atlanta Braves front office, Aaron enjoyed a 23-year Major League career, doing which he rewrote baseball's hitting record book. He holds more Major League batting records than any other player in the game's history. On May 17, 1970, he became the first player to compile both 3,000 career hits and more than 500 home runs. Along with Frank Robinson, Aaron was inducted into the Hall of Fam at Cooperstown on August 1, 1982. As an entrepreneur, Aaron operates Popeyes and Krispy Kreme restaurants in Atlanta and Columbus, Georgia. Aaron sits on the board of the Atlanta Braves, DSW, Medallion Financial Corporation, and the Atlanta Falcons Board of Advisors. He is the member of the Board of Governors for Boys and Girls Clubs of America, and is the member of the Board of Counselors for the Carter Center. With his wife, Billy, he is the founder of the Hank Aaron Chase the Dream Foundation.

I'm Johnny Ohenson, Jr., and welcome to another edition of In Black America. On this week's program, the time Johnson Lecture Series with Hank Aaron, part 2, in Black America. We didn't make much money in Milwaukee. I think, and this is a true story. I remember after I had been in the big leagues for a few years, I remember that Matthews Warren Spawn and myself said, look, why don't we, you know, I was making, I think it was $23,000, I think I was making, and I think Spawn was making somewhere about 60 or something like that, and it was making about 40. And I said to myself, I said, you know, I've never made this much money in my life. I don't know what I'm going to do with it. I said, I'll tell you what I'm going to do. What we're going to do, we're going to all write the Commissioner Baseball, and have him, we're going to deduct all, I'm going to take $15,000 a moment,

and I'm going to tell the Commissioners to have it where I can draw it once my retirement come. And you know, he's sent us a letter back, and he told us, I cannot let you guys do that. $15,000 for Matthews, $15,000 for Spawn, and $15,000 for Mu. He said, I can't do that. He said, what happened if the team go bankrupt? Hank Aaron is considered one of the best baseball players of all time. Aaron broke Babe Roof's home run record. When he hit his 715th home run on April 8th, 1974, he later set the new MLB record with 755 career home runs. Born Henry Lewis Aaron on February 5th, 1934 in Mobile, Alabama, the third of eight children born to Estella and Herbert Aaron. Aaron is sent at the ranks of the Negro League to become a major league baseball icon. He played as an outfielder for the Milwaukee Slash Atlanta Braids for nearly 23 years.

Over that period, he collected more RBI's and more extra bass hits than anyone in history. For 21 straight years, he was named an All Star, and for 20 consecutive years, he slugged at least 20 home runs or more. 1957 was Aaron's best season. He hit 322 that year with 44 home runs and 132 RBI's, captured the National League's MVP award and led the Braids to their first World Series championship since 1914. Recently, Aaron was on the University of Texas campus to speak at the Tom Johnson Lecture Series. The discussion was moderated by LBJ Presidential Library Director Mark Uptagrove. On today's program, we conclude that conversation. I don't know where there should be an asterisk and let them go into the hall, is that what you mean? Well, not so much the hall, but how should we view those records, including the hall? I think they all will be forgotten about, really. That's what I think.

Yeah, I think they should be forgotten about. They're simply not legitimate. You know, really, when you see somebody, because I played the game 23 years, and I know how hard it is for you to hit 20 home runs, 30 home runs. But what we were seeing back in the year and which you were referring to, is players hitting 65 and 70 home runs, that is impossible to do. I'm telling you, I know it. You can do it with the help of somebody helping you or something. But you can't go out here and play the game of baseball and hit 70 home runs, especially in the major leagues. It might be hard for you to do it in the little leagues. You can't do it in the big leagues. You just can't do it because you're playing with guys, you're playing, you're hitting against pitchers who are probably as good as you are as a hitter. And you just can't do that. That's a lot of home runs ahead.

One of your contemporaries on the field was Pete Rose. Should Pete Rose be inducted into the Hall of Fame? Well, I think Pete Rose have to feel the same way that the guys that was taking steroids. You know, so funny thing, and Pete and I, I know Pete, I played, I happen to play against him, and he was a damn good ball player. I mean, very good ball player. And I had a long talk with Pete. I talked to Pete, and I told Pete, I said, if you were guilty in any kind of way, I said, what you should do is to come clean, just say, I did something wrong, I asked for your forgiveness. And I said, you'd be surprised at this country. This is the most forgiven country in the world. I said, all you have to do is say you're sorry, because we all have done something wrong. But he decided that he didn't want to do that, and that's where he is today. Lesson is.

Listen to Henry Aaron. I don't know whether you want to listen to me. Evidently, he did. What athletes do you admire today? There is quite a few of them. You know, it's fortunate, this country, especially here in the United States. We have some very good, very good athletes. I mean, these kids today is just absolutely great. I mean, when I played baseball, I weighed 170 pounds. The most I ever weighed in my life in baseball was 185 pounds. Of course, you can't tell it now. But these kids today, even my grandson, my little guy, boy, he is 16 years old, and I'm telling you, he's much taller than I am, much bigger than I am. All these kids are just absolutely fabulous, you know, really.

Is there someone who you think is the role model that you would like to see athletes be today? Is there somebody who sort of exemplifies what being a role model is all about today? Dera Gita, in baseball, I would say. I don't know too much about basketball, but I would have to say, Gita, as far as an athlete, probably, would be somebody that I think that I would like to have my kids copy and be as. It strikes me that he has your work ethic. Yeah. He came out there to play every single time he played injured. He was a member of a team. It was never the, never made himself the star. You know, I was, you know, I consider myself being very lucky at playing baseball. You know, I played 23 years, and I've said before. And I played about eight of those years in Milwaukee, Wisconsin. And the reason I bring that up is because even back then, in playing with players like Warren Spahn, Haydermath, Houston, et cetera,

who is now in the Hall of Fame, I felt like I was lucky. We didn't make, we didn't make much money in Milwaukee. I think, and this is a true story. I remember, after I had been in the big leagues for a few years, I remember that Matthew Warren Spahn and myself said, look, I said, why don't we, you know, I was making, I think it was $23,000, I think I was making. I think Spahn was making somewhere about 60 or so, and it was making about 40. And I said to myself, I said, you know, I've never made this much money in my life. I don't know what I'm going to do with it. I said, I'll tell you what I'm going to do. What we're going to do, we're going to all write the Commissioner Baseball and have him, we're going to deduct all, I'm going to take $15,000 for my money and I'm going to tell the Commissioners the habit where I can draw it once my retirement comes.

And you know, he sent us a letter back and he told us, I cannot let you guys do that. Now $15,000 for Matthew, $15,000 for Spahn, and $15,000 for Mew. He said, I can't do that. He said, what happened if the team go bankrupt? And I never thought about that. And $45,000 is what he was talking about. He couldn't do it. And nowadays, what do these players make now? They make $1,800,000. And I couldn't do for $15,000. But it was a funny story. After that, we played for a few years, and we won two championships in Milwaukee, two championships. And I never forget that after we won the first beat the Yankees 7 Games, I remember that, oh, I was trying to raise a family and I needed my money. And they were slow at bringing the money. And I'll cut. Each player cut for winning the World Series back then

was $8,000. And I said, I said, boy, I need my money. I need it bad. So I went to John Mullin, who was the general manager. No, John Quinn, who was the general manager. And I asked him, I said, what did you check on? He said, just take your time. It's coming. So sure enough, my three weeks, it was three weeks late, but I got it. But I got all my money, $8,000. And it was $8,000, I think. And I carried it to the bank. And I never forget, I put it up to tell him to tell us that Mr. Aaron said, what would you like to do? Would you check on the counter or save an account? I said, no. Nothing. I said, I want you to count every nickel of it out. Put it on the counter. And I'm going to put it in a sack. And I'm going to carry it home with me. I'm going to have chance to look at this for a while. And no way. He counted it out. He gave it to me. I put it in a sack, carried it to my house, closed all the doors, and put it in a bag.

Put the $8,000. I put all the money on the bed. And I looked around and made sure nobody was looking at me. And I said, I looked at it for a while. And I said, oh, this is what money I've hated my life. Eighth. I mean, this is whoop. I said, oh, I called my mom up. And I called everybody up. And then finally, I decided I said, well, Hank, you better start paying some bills, son. And when I start paying bills, I ended up, I think, with $150. But that's a true story. That's a true story. What is your most indelible baseball memory? A lot of people want to say, you think the home run. I think the one thing I think about most, and the thing that I am proud of, is the fact that I was in my baseball career,

the 23 years that I played, and you mentioned this before, is the consistency in which I played the game. You know, what you could see, you could go out to a ballpark today and see me hit a home run, you might come out two days and see me hit another one. Those were the things that I think that made me feel proud of my career more than anything, was the fact that I was consistent in what I was doing. As Coach Gerito suggested, we not only admire you for your grace on the field, but because you're a civil rights hero. Given what's happened in Ferguson, and the fact that racial strife is alive and well, and the United States of America, what can we be doing to heal the racial divide? I think we can do several things. I think we can start judging people for the way they act, rather than by the color of their skin. I think people can start understanding that we are all our brothers' people, you know,

no matter who we are. Judging people, it's simply because of the color of their skin and it's certainly not what you should be doing, you know, really. I think there's things that no matter who you are, no matter how you look, you know, I mean, that's, I think you should be judged on your character rather than by what you do. That's what Dr. King said. Yes. That's what Dr. King said. Yes. That's what Dr. King said. Yes. That's what Dr. King said. Yes. So how do we achieve that? I think you achieve that by... Well, I think one thing you can do is to understand who is next to you, who's sitting inside of you, who's your brother's keeper, you know. And rather than judging someone, simply because of the fact that, you know, he doesn't have as much as you have. He doesn't have a car, and I drive the same car as you drive. Today, I heard...

You talk about Tom Johnson. You know, I mean, Tom, I remember when I first started working at CNN, and I went to him and talked to him about what I should do. And he did one thing for me. He said, we're going to create an airport channel with another friend and two of us. We started... He gave me the chance to do that. So I think that that's what we need to do. We need to understand that, although all of us don't have the knowledge of doing all the things that we want to do, but it's given the opportunity, I think we can. That's all. You've got to make the plan for you just a little bit of level. Have we progressed on the issue of race as much as you might have imagined when you hit that ball to begin the 1974 season to break the... I think there's a lot of things. There's a lot of... We still have a long way. We have four ways to go.

We still have a way to go. You know, in spite of, and I don't... Of course, I'm not here to talk politics, or try to get involved in politics, but I do know that in watching... When I first started... Well, when I first started playing baseball, there was absolutely no one in this country. No one. I can think of whatever said that we would have a black president, no matter who you talk to, you know. And regardless of whether he is... Or the people out here think that he's doing a good job. I have something that I don't exactly like the way that he's doing, but by the same token, you know, I think that we've come a long ways in that regards in some ways, you know. Yeah. You were given the... The Medal of Freedom by President George W. Bush. You were right. You were right, too. What is your greatest hope for America? Let me just say...

I would like to see. I would like for people to understand that as I mentioned before, the playing field, just make the playing field level for everybody. Yeah. And just to give everybody a chance. Because I look at my situation, if I had not had someone like Jack Robinson coming before me and giving me an opportunity to play the game, then I would have... That was been lost talent. Yeah. Been lost. So I think that in some ways, I think that that's what happened. Yeah. The montages, as I mentioned to you earlier, included a picture of you being greeted by President Johnson in his oval office. And that's after a tour that you made in South Vietnam, visiting with troops with four of your major league baseball counterparts. Can you talk about that experience of meeting President Johnson? By the way, I will mention to you that Henry has not seen that photo, and we'll see it later tonight. But that's one thing that hasn't made its way to your office.

I haven't seen it. Yeah. What do you remember about that? I remember going to Vietnam. I was... I was a... Jotore myself. And... who else? Killabru. Stan Muzio. And that was one or two other. We went on what we call a high neighborhood tour. And here's the story. The President at that time made all of us who telekernels in the army. And the reason for that is because he said that if something happened that we would get the same pay, we'd something happen while we were there. We were endangered. You know, that was thing that happened that I can tell you that I was a little shaky about. But anyhow, you... I went over there with all these guys. And at that time, Stan Muzio, only one of us had a Nikon camera. That was when Nikon first came out with a camera. And I remember Stan Muzio taking all these pictures,

all these pictures over there. We stayed over there 14 days. And every one of them was in the front line. The front line. We wasn't in the back. We was in the front. That's where we were. And we were over there to entertain the troops. When I said entertain me, I don't know what I was doing. We was talking baseball. But they were happy to see us. They were very happy to see us. And I'm so happy that I'm so glad that I was over there. And I stayed at 14 days. And the most amazing thing, the scariest thing about the whole thing was the fact that when I was over there, I saw little kids, not American kids. These kids that was Vietnam. Little kids over there must have been 12, 13 years old. And this was what really hated me more than anything. When I saw these kids carrying guns, 13 years old, this, some years ago, carrying automatic rifles

and having scraps on their pelts, on their heads, and all this. So I kind of felt kind of bad. And I thought we did a good job and stand musier after taking all these pictures. And I saw Stan, and he's no longer with us. And I saw Stan. I said, Stan, I said, what happened to the pictures? And he told me he took every one of those pictures that he took was the floorboard of the helicopter. There were no pictures of nobody else. There was a floorboard of the helicopter, you know? So I didn't have any pictures at all this show. I had been the Vietnam. But I've been there. I've been my wife and I was able to take a tour over there a few weeks ago. I'm not a few weeks, about a couple of years ago, with some friends of ours, beautiful country, beautiful and I really enjoyed it. Really, the people were very nice.

You've had a truly remarkable life. What is your proudest accomplice? I think the thing that I think about my accomplishment is what I try to do is try to give back. You know, I feel like God has been good to me. He's given me a chance to do some great things. And I try to give back. Later on, I guess you might hear about my foundation, Chase and Dream Foundation. In that foundation, we try to help kids in college. And I feel every day that I can give back to, you know, whatever money or wealth that I have, don't have that much. But whatever I have, my wife and I have, we try to share with other people. You know, we try to share with those who are less fortunate. And I feel like every day that I'm blessed beyond when I can be able to give other people no matter what it is. No matter what it is, you know, I feel like

it is not mine anyhow. It belongs to everybody who had a hand in it and shared with me. Talk about your foundation, Chase and Dream Foundation. Well, I can tell you how we got started with Mr. Tom Johnson. You know, I have to bring him in. And my wife, the two of them, I can tell you the story how we got started. When I retired from baseball, I was trying to keep a foundation called Chase and Dream Foundation. I was trying to fund it by going to court shows, signing autographs and putting money into the foundation. Till one day, my wife told me she said, you ain't going to ever do anything. This is never going to work. She said, let me handle it. Let me do one thing. Let me try to have a birthday party for you. I said, fine. So I guess she went to Mr. Johnson. Tom.

And she talked to Tom. And Tom and her decided that they were going to go to some of the high rollers, Coca-Cola and et cetera. And sell them tables for $50,000, $60,000. And when she told me this, I said, I said, for what? I said, we're trying to have a birthday party. Well, let's just keep it like $50 or something. No, she said, let me handle it. And she'll love. Tom and her got together. And I'm telling you, Tom, to this day, I feel like I've been blessed to know you. The night, fast forward, the night of my dinner, I've never seen anything like it. They had over 1,000 people. They raised over $1,000,000. Am I saying right? Tom. $1,200,000. That's what they raised. Did you put it on your bed? She, and Tom.

And I have to say that if it's not for Tom, I mean, sometimes Tom, I cry about it even now. If it hadn't been for you, that foundation, I would still be out trying to sign autograph. Thanks to you that you've done so much for the kids. I mean, you helped them so much. And I certainly appreciate it. And my wife, the two of yours, did it. And thanks to you. Thank you for lending him to us. Please, thank you. It's a testament to your legacy that there are so many young people in the audience tonight. Yes. What would you tell young folks who are chasing their own dreams? I would tell them that no matter what you decide to do, whether it's baseball, football, basketball, whatever it may be, that remember one thing

that there is no shortcut in life, absolutely no shortcut. I think that I've seen too many of our kids think that simply because they look at me and they say, well, they, not now. They look at me and they say, oh, he had 755 home runs. How did he do it? I can do it. I can do the same thing. Well, they probably can. But then they look at somebody and they say, I got to do it. I got to do it no matter what happened. I'm going to do 700-5 home runs. And they'll do anything to get to that. But I would say that success in life doesn't mean that you be successful for the day and tomorrow you're successful. That means that you got to take one step at a time and that's what I would tell them. That's what I try to tell all young people that when you start looking for shortcut in life, that's when you're going to get yourself in trouble. To the young people that you come in contact with gives you hope. Most kids that I talk to, yes.

You mentioned Tom Johnson. And Tom said of you, Henry, you never disappointed us, not once. Long after all of us are gone, your name, the name of Henry Aaron, will symbolize what I believe it really means to be a genuine American hero. I want to thank you not only for coming here tonight, but for all you've done to foster the American spirit by chasing your dreams. Well, I certainly appreciate it. Thank you so much for being here tonight. Thank you. Thank you so much for being here tonight. Thank you. Thank you, Aaron. Major League Baseball, Legend, and Hall of Famer. I would like to thank the Tom Johnson Lecture Series for their assistance in the production of this program. If you have questions, comments, or suggestions ask your future in Black America programs, email us at jhansonandkut.org. Also, let us know what radio station you heard us over. Remember to like us on Facebook and to follow us on Twitter. The views and opinions expressed on this program

are not necessarily those of this station or of the University of Texas at Austin. You're going to have previous programs online at kut.org. Until we have the opportunity again for a technical producer, David Alvarez, I'm John L. Hansen, Jr. Thank you for joining us today. Please join us again next week. CD copies of this program are available and may be purchased by writing in Black America CDs. KUT Radio, 300 West Dean Keaton Boulevard, Austin, Texas, 78712. That's in Black America CDs, KUT Radio, 300 West Dean Keaton Boulevard, Austin, Texas, 78712. This has been a production of KUT Radio.