The Day after Trinity: J. Robert Oppenheimer and the Atomic Bomb; Part 2

<v Hans Bethe>[music plays] The first reaction which we had was one <v Hans Bethe>of fulfillment. <v Hans Bethe>Now it has been done. Now the work that we have been engaged <v Hans Bethe>in for so many years has contributed <v Hans Bethe>to the wall. <v Hans Bethe>The second reaction was of course, one of shock and awe. <v Hans Bethe>What have we done? <v Hans Bethe>What have we done? <v Hans Bethe>And the third reaction. <v Hans Bethe>It shouldn't be done again. <v Jane Wilson>You were very depressed. I came back from San Francisco and uh found <v Jane Wilson>you very depressed. You as as as a in opposition to your <v Jane Wilson>euphoria when the war, uh the at VE day <v Jane Wilson>when we had that very nice party and uh you started throwing the garbage cans <v Jane Wilson>around.

<v Jane Wilson>Uh you were uh very depressed and uh we didn't have a party. <v Jane Wilson>I think there was a party. I don't even know if we went. <v Narrator>Were you depressed? <v Robert Wilson>Oh, [Jane Wilson: yes, he was depressed] I remember being just ill. <v Robert Wilson>[Jane Wilson: just sick] um sick with a the the point that <v Robert Wilson>I thought would be [clears throat] you know, vomit. <v Robert Wilson>I was so uh overwhelmed when it happened. <v Robert Wilson>That that thing had happened. <v Robert Wilson>Still am. [laughs] <v Narrator>What was what was Robert's reaction to the news? <v Frank Oppenheimer>I th- I don't know I th- um. I, I can imagine that it was a very different. <v Frank Oppenheimer>A a feeling <v Frank Oppenheimer>that uh an initial feeling that thank God it wasn't a dud, and then <v Frank Oppenheimer>almost immediate horror of what had really happened. <v Man 1>It did bring home to one how powerful <v Man 1>this is. [music plays]?inaudible? Treated <v Man 1>humans as matter.

<v Narrator>Hiroshima, August 6th, 1945. The first uranium <v Narrator>bomb exploded with a light so bright it could have been seen from another planet. <v Narrator>More than 100,000 killed. <v Narrator>40,000 injured. 20,000 missing. <v Narrator>Burns, blindness, radiation sickness. <v Narrator>It took only nine seconds. <v Narrator>Today, even now, the victims still suffer and die. <v Narrator>Three days later, a second bomb, a plutonium bomb, dropped on Nagasaki. <v Narrator>80,000 dead. <v Narrator>In early September, a scientific team from Los Alamos was sent to Japan <v Narrator>to study the effects of the two bombs. <v Narrator>One member of the team was Robert Server. <v Robert Server>We- you know, everybody, we have defen- defense mechanisms of some <v Robert Server>kind that build up in uh un- under under any

<v Robert Server>uh under stresses of lifetime. Somehow [laughs] you uh you get hardened to <v Robert Server>it in a couple of days, no matter what you see. <v Robert Server>And you manage you managed to survive that way. <v Robert Server>I'm sure it happens to all soldiers in all wars. <v Robert Server>But the mean, the thing that was really astonishing about the whole thing <v Robert Server>that uh ?inaudible? and I wandered around Nagasaki and <v Robert Server>l-Hiroshima, you know, for several weeks. <v Robert Server>Uh complete- you know completely alone on our on our own. <v Robert Server>And there- we had no difficulty at all with the people, they were perfectly <v Robert Server>friendly. Not well wouldn't say really friendly, but but <v Robert Server>but there was no antagonism visible. <v Robert Server>We wandered around the ruins among people whose families had all been killed. <v Robert Server>We had no feeling of danger at all.

<v Robert Server>Uh it's uh piece of the wall of a schoolhouse in <v Robert Server>school room in Hiroshima, which about half a mile <v Robert Server>from uh where the bomb went off and its flash burned <v Robert Server>and scarred by broken glass. <v Robert Server>We can see the shadows of the uh of the window <v Robert Server>sash and the and the uh, and the chord <v Robert Server>of the uh shade. <v Robert Server>And from the the angle of which this shadow <v Robert Server>was cast to we can m- we can measure the height at which the bomb <v Robert Server>went went off. And this was the evidence that it really went off at the height it was <v Robert Server>supposed to in Hiroshima. <v Freeman Dyson>After this was all over about two years later, Oppenheimer gave <v Freeman Dyson>a talk I think at M.I.T.

<v Freeman Dyson>It was then afterwards republished and quoted all over the world and became one of his <v Freeman Dyson>most famous utterances. And it said roughly, the physicists <v Freeman Dyson>have known sin. And this is a knowledge which they cannot lose. <v Freeman Dyson>And it became a kind of motif for <v Freeman Dyson>the for the for the for the whole community of <v Freeman Dyson>physicists. And there were violent arguments. <v Freeman Dyson>Many people who had been at Los Alamos were very angry. <v Freeman Dyson>They said Oppenheimer has no right to weep in public for us since what we were doing <v Freeman Dyson>was an honest piece of technical <v Freeman Dyson>work to win the war, we win no more guilty than anybody else who built weapons in order <v Freeman Dyson>to win the war. And he has no right to talk about our having sinned. <v Robert Wilson>At the end of the war then I gave up my uh clearance and I have not worked on <v Robert Wilson>didn't work on nuclear energy in any uh in any of its <v Robert Wilson>aspect on the development ?horror of? <v Robert Wilson>bombs.

<v Frank Oppenheimer>Uh I I know it's is <v Frank Oppenheimer>somehow um I can't feel that it was something that I should would not have <v Frank Oppenheimer>done. <v Frank Oppenheimer>Um or should not have done at the time that is that the um that the <v Frank Oppenheimer>reasons for doing that, the, the worry about fascism. <v Frank Oppenheimer>They were- were all quite valid in the sense that um there was almost <v Frank Oppenheimer>no way of stopping this from being done. <v Frank Oppenheimer>Um I think would have been good just to have stopped a little sooner, maybe after VE day. <v Frank Oppenheimer>I think it certainly would have been good never to have um used the thing on the city <v Frank Oppenheimer>and certainly never to have used twi- two of them. <v Robert Crohn>They were poised to land on the beaches of Japan and <v Robert Crohn>they knew that the number of casualties would be astronomical. <v Robert Crohn>Those people were happy for the bomb, believe me.

<v Robert Crohn>I was supposed to build some sample catching equipment to go on the third <v Robert Crohn>shot, which was to be dropped on Japan, and I was to go with it. <v Robert Crohn>However, as you know, Japan gave up before there was a third shot. <v Haakon Chevalier>Dear Haakon, your letter, your marvelous warm letter <v Haakon Chevalier>was one of the very few things that brought warmth to us over these troubled days. <v Haakon Chevalier>[crickets chirping] A few days after the surrender, we went over to our ranch for a <v Haakon Chevalier>little time of solitude, horses and the slow return to sanity. <v Haakon Chevalier>We are not sure we'll be coming back to Berkeley for permanent, despite the ties <v Haakon Chevalier>that make us want to. <v Haakon Chevalier>We are not too sure of anything personal. <v Haakon Chevalier>Longing both of us so much for stability. <v Haakon Chevalier>Yet knowing that we have been put in a time and the place <v Haakon Chevalier>where we may not be able in conscience to attain it.

<v Haakon Chevalier>The circumstances are heavy with misgiving and far, far <v Haakon Chevalier>more difficult than they should be that we power to remake the world, to be <v Haakon Chevalier>as we think it. [cheering] <v Narrator>The veil of secrecy was lifted, and most Americans believed the atomic bomb <v Narrator>had played a decisive role in ending the war. <v Narrator>The scholarly professor, the unworldly student of metaphysical poetry, <v Narrator>the former leftist, was suddenly a national hero. <v Narrator>A celebrity, father of the atomic bomb. <v Narrator>In 1947, he was appointed director of the prestigious Institute for Advanced <v Narrator>Studies in Princeton. He was Einstein's boss. <v Narrator>But much of his time in the postwar years was spent in Washington, where his council

<v Narrator>was eagerly sought at the highest levels of government. <v Narrator>He served on two dozen committees, testified frequently before Congress and <v Narrator>was even asked to run for public office, although he advised the government on its <v Narrator>atomic arsenal. He argued adamantly and publicly for the international control <v Narrator>of atomic weapons. <v Frank Oppenheimer>And his sense of what he wanted to accomplish when he was in the government <v Frank Oppenheimer>had less to do with physics than it had to do with, uh, with the with <v Frank Oppenheimer>the um sensible use <v Frank Oppenheimer>of the of this awful instrument that we made. <v Robert Oppenheimer>I have been asked whether in the years to come, it will be possible to kill <v Robert Oppenheimer>40 million American people in the 20 largest American towns <v Robert Oppenheimer>by the use of atomic bombs in a single night. <v Robert Oppenheimer>I am afraid that the answer to that question is yes.

<v Robert Oppenheimer>I have been asked by- [audio fades out] <v Freeman Dyson>Oppenheimer tried to maintain control of the atomic energy <v Freeman Dyson>enterprise to prevent the Air Force from abusing the weapons that he had <v Freeman Dyson>created. <v Robert Oppenheimer>I think the only hope for our future safety must lie in <v Robert Oppenheimer>a collaboration based on confidence and good faith with the other <v Robert Oppenheimer>peoples of the world. <v Frank Oppenheimer>I think he felt that he wanted to make a big difference. <v Frank Oppenheimer>Um I would arg- I argued with him quite a lot after the war. <v Frank Oppenheimer>Um I felt that the um the kind of big difference would <v Frank Oppenheimer>happen if one really taught people a lot about the the <v Frank Oppenheimer>dangers of the bomb, about the possibilities of cooperation. <v Frank Oppenheimer>He said there wasn't time for this. He'd been in the Washington scene. <v Frank Oppenheimer>He saw that everything was moving. <v Frank Oppenheimer>He felt that he had to change things um from within. <v Robert Oppenheimer>History again and again shows that we have no monopoly on ideas, <v Robert Oppenheimer>but we do better with them than most other countries.

<v Freeman Dyson>He was a philosopher king in his own mind, a man of wisdom who could <v Freeman Dyson>get along with other men of wisdom, who also had power. <v Freeman Dyson>He had the way of impressing himself very strongly as a wise man <v Freeman Dyson>on people who were influential. <v Robert Oppenheimer>But it is certainly not possible to take the definition of atomic energy and <v Robert Oppenheimer>the prohibition against indus- helping other nations industrially, literally. <v Robert Oppenheimer>And it is certainly not possible to do that, Mr. Senator, because everything we <v Robert Oppenheimer>do is contrary to it, [Senator: Everything is what?] contrary to it. <v Narrator>It was a different world after the war. <v Narrator>Americans perceived a new threat. <v Narrator>Russian and Chinese communism. <v Narrator>Arms control was an unpopular idea even before the Russians shocked America <v Narrator>by exploding their own atomic bomb in 1949, far sooner than <v Narrator>anyone expected. [whistle blowing] The arms race

<v Narrator>began in earnest, and Oppenheimer's Council for International Collaboration <v Narrator>was now less attractive to policymakers than the advice of his fellow scientist, <v Narrator>Edward Teller. Even during the war years at Los Alamos, Teller had <v Narrator>urged the development of a secret weapon radically different and radically more <v Narrator>destructive than the atom bomb. <v Narrator>The hydrogen bomb. <v Narrator>[typing] The general advisory committee to the Atomic Energy Commission, chaired by <v Narrator>Oppenheimer, issued a secret report opposing immediate development of the hydrogen <v Narrator>bomb on both technical and moral grounds. <v Man 2>I'm sure he thought that there was absolutely no need for <v Man 2>an- a hydrogen bomb. That there was no need really for any of these bombs. <v Man 2>And he felt that way even though he had worked on on the arsenal of <v Man 2>of fission bomb. <v Narrator>Despite the committee's advice, President Truman initiated a program to develop the <v Narrator>hydrogen bomb. And scientists at Los Alamos began to design the new

<v Narrator>device. Robert Oppenheimer was not among them. <v Narrator>[explosion] This <v Narrator>is an atomic bomb about the size of the one that devastated Hiroshima. <v Narrator>By 1950, it was considered too small for our defense. <v Narrator>The hydrogen bomb being developed would have 1000 times the destructive force. <v Narrator>One morning in November of 1952, the Pacific island of ?Elu Gallup? <v Narrator>was vaporized by the first hydrogen blast. <v Narrator>All that remained was a mile wide crater on the ocean floor. <v Narrator>[explosions] A <v Narrator>disbelieving America saw the Russians explode a hydrogen bomb within the same year.

<v Senator Joseph McCarthy>There are no secrets uh in so far as atomic and hydrogen bomb <v Senator Joseph McCarthy>developments is concerned from the communists. <v Senator Joseph McCarthy>I think- ?inaudible? I don't think we have any secrets from them at all. <v Narrator>Senator McCarthy's anticommunism dominated the 1950s. <v Narrator>When he mentioned Oppenheimer's left wing past publicly, it meant to some that <v Narrator>Oppenheimer was fair game. <v Senator Joseph McCarthy>Affidavits to the effect that he had been a member of the party that he had recommended <v Senator Joseph McCarthy>uh communist or work in the A bomb H bomb plants <v Senator Joseph McCarthy>uh ?inaudible? of course communist. That doesn't it doesn't make him a communist, but his <v Senator Joseph McCarthy>wife, admittedly, was a a the wife <v Senator Joseph McCarthy>of uh official of the Communist Party uh brother, a very <v Senator Joseph McCarthy>active man. <v Narrator>McCarthy did not attack Oppenheimer directly, but he had helped create the climate that <v Narrator>prompted President Eisenhower to seriously consider a letter from a former congressional <v Narrator>aide charging that Oppenheimer was a Russian spy.

<v Narrator>13 years of surveillance by campus police, the FBI, military intelligence. <v Narrator>Wiretaps. Reports from informants. <v Narrator>As many as five agents shadowed him in a single day. <v Narrator>Most of it was old news material disregarded in the past by General Groves <v Narrator>and others. When Oppenheimer was considered essential. <v Narrator>But in 1953, when presented with a thick dossier, Eisenhower immediately <v Narrator>ordered Oppenheimer's clearance suspended pending a hearing. <v Hans Bethe>He had very much the feeling that he was giving the best to the United States <v Hans Bethe>in the years during the war and after the war. <v Hans Bethe>In my personal opinion, he did, but uh others did <v Hans Bethe>not agree.

<v Hans Bethe>And in 1954, he was hauled before <v Hans Bethe>the tribune and accused <v Hans Bethe>of being a security risk, a risk through the United States. <v Hans Bethe>Risk to betray secrets. <v Narrator>The proceedings were conducted by the Atomic Energy Commission in secret. <v Narrator>There were no photographers, no reporters, no television, even Oppenheimer's attorneys <v Narrator>were excluded when classified material was discussed. <v Narrator>At issue was whether Robert Oppenheimer, a principal architect of the atomic bomb, could <v Narrator>be trusted with state secrets. <v Narrator>Along with numerous accusations relating to his Left-Wing past, Oppenheimer was <v Narrator>specifically accused of opposing the hydrogen bomb on technical, political and moral <v Narrator>grounds. And of having misled security officers in matters <v Narrator>relating to his old friend Haakon Chevalier. <v Narrator>During the war, Oppenheimer had reported George Eltonton's attempts to share secrets

<v Narrator>with the Russians. He told a story in such an ambiguous way that intelligence <v Narrator>officers were left with the impression that Haakon Chevalier was the center of a spy <v Narrator>ring and that he had contacted several physicists. <v Narrator>This mysterious fabrication was to cost the unwitting Chevalier his job and <v Narrator>was the most damaging evidence presented at Oppenheimer's hearing. <v Haakon Chevalier>This friend of mine who was the closest human being to me really <v Haakon Chevalier>uh at that time, that he had betrayed me in this way and told about <v Haakon Chevalier>me a lie which uh constituted <v Haakon Chevalier>if this had been true, it would have been a criminal conspiracy for which I would have <v Haakon Chevalier>been I could have been sentenced to a ?pretty long? <v Haakon Chevalier>prison term. <v Narrator>Oppenheimer never explained to Chevalier, nor to anyone else, why he had for 13 <v Narrator>years failed to undo the lie. <v Narrator>Also damaging to Oppenheimer was the testimony of his former Los Alamos colleague,

<v Narrator>Edward Teller, the father of the hydrogen bomb, had previously complained to <v Narrator>government attorneys that Oppenheimer was a complex and vain man who had, <v Narrator>for moral reasons, impeded development of the hydrogen bomb. <v Narrator>Teller was somewhat more restrained at the hearing, but he did testify that Oppenheimer <v Narrator>should not be granted clearance. <v Narrator>Although the majority of witnesses, Nobel laureates, government advisers, <v Narrator>even General Groves, came to Oppenheimer's defense, it was to no avail. <v Narrator>The Atomic Energy Commission found that Oppenheimer was a security risk and his <v Narrator>clearance was never restored. <v Narrator>He was never again asked to advise the government of the United States, and he never <v Narrator>again worked in nuclear energy. [music plays] <v Hans Bethe>He was not the same person afterwards. <v Frank Oppenheimer>I think it really knocked him for a loop.

<v Frank Oppenheimer>Uh he wou- he he felt frustrated in accomplishing what he hoped to <v Frank Oppenheimer>do in the way of of getting peace. <v Frank Oppenheimer>He felt um really injured <v Frank Oppenheimer>by not being part of the of the by not being respected in government <v Frank Oppenheimer>in official circles. He wanted to get back into that, I think. <v Frank Oppenheimer>Um I don't know why, but I but I I think it's one of these things where there's a- when <v Frank Oppenheimer>you get the taste of it, it's hard to to not want it. <v Man 1>I think to a certain extent it actually almost killed him <v Man 1>spiritually. Yes. <v Man 1>It it achieved just what its opponents wanted to achieve. <v Man 1>Destroyed him. <v Man 3>Uh Mr. Oppenheimer could you tell us uh what your thoughts are about <v Man 3>what our atomic policy should be?

<v Robert Oppenheimer>No, I I I can't do that. <v Robert Oppenheimer>I'm not not close enough to the facts. <v Robert Oppenheimer>I'm I'm not close enough to the to the thoughts of those who <v Robert Oppenheimer>are worrying about. <v Man 3>What your thoughts are about the uh proposal of Senator Robert Kennedy <v Man 3>that uh President Johnson uh initiate talks <v Man 3>with a view to halt the spread of nuclear weapons? <v Robert Oppenheimer>It's 20 years too late. <v Robert Oppenheimer>It should have been done the day after Trinity. <v Robert Oppenheimer>[explosion] <v Narrator>The atomic bomb Robert Oppenheimer built and the hydrogen bomb he hoped could <v Narrator>never be built are now facts of life.

<v Narrator>[explosion] Since <v Narrator>the Trinity blast in 1945, there have been more than 1200 nuclear explosions <v Narrator>on the face of the Earth, the largest has 4000 times the force of the bomb <v Narrator>that leveled Hiroshima. <v Freeman Dyson>I felt it myself. <v Freeman Dyson>The glitter of nuclear weapons. <v Freeman Dyson>It is irresistible if you come to them as a scientist. <v Freeman Dyson>To feel it's there in your hands, to release this energy that fuels the stars. <v Freeman Dyson>To let it do your bidding and to perform these miracles, <v Freeman Dyson>to lift a million tons of rock into the sky. <v Freeman Dyson>It is something that gives people an illusion of illimitable power. <v Freeman Dyson>And it is in some ways responsible for all our troubles I would say. <v Freeman Dyson>This what you might call technical arrogance that overcomes people when <v Freeman Dyson>they see what they can do with their minds.

<v Man 1>I expect the human race may live on for a while. <v Man 1>And the differences between us and any possible opponent <v Man 1>are not that great. <v Man 1>In fact, I don't know any part of history where it would be proper <v Man 1>to use one of those very powerful bombs. <v Frank Oppenheimer>Nothing turned out quite as well as one thought it would. <v Frank Oppenheimer>During the war, we all thought that with this um

<v Frank Oppenheimer>device, which was a thousand times more powerful than anything else, we could really <v Frank Oppenheimer>influence the way nations talked about war. <v Frank Oppenheimer>And this is what my brother was so involved with after the war, because there <v Frank Oppenheimer>was no there were no vested interests. <v Frank Oppenheimer>There were no manufacturers of atomic bombs. <v Frank Oppenheimer>Nobody knew about it. One said, here is a fresh start and <v Frank Oppenheimer>uh s- a weapon that you can't use for war. <v Frank Oppenheimer>Um we can it can produce a change. <v Frank Oppenheimer>But it didn't. Uh everybody regards the atomic bomb as just another weapon as <v Frank Oppenheimer>part of our security. <v Robert Oppenheimer>We knew the world would not be the same, a few <v Robert Oppenheimer>people laughed. <v Robert Oppenheimer>A few people cried. <v Robert Oppenheimer>Most people were silent. <v Robert Oppenheimer>I remembered the line from the Hindu scripture, the Bhagavad <v Robert Oppenheimer>Gita. Vishnu- is

<v Robert Oppenheimer>trying to persuade the prince that he <v Robert Oppenheimer>should do his duty and to impress him <v Robert Oppenheimer>takes on his multi armed form and says, <v Robert Oppenheimer>now I am become death, the destroyer of worlds. <v Robert Oppenheimer>I suppose we all thought that one way or another. <v Robert Oppenheimer>[music plays] [PBS theme plays]