PBS NewsHour; September 2, 2011 3:00pm-4:00pm PDT

Captioning sponsored by MacNEIL/LEHRER PRODUCTIONS

>> Lehrer: THERE WERE MORE SIGNS OF A STALLING ECONOMIC RECOVERY TODAY AS JOB GROWTH SLOWED TO A STANDSTILL IN AUGUST. GOOD EVENING. I'M JIM LEHRER.

>> Brown: AND I'M JEFFREY BROWN. ON THE NEWSHOUR TONIGHT, RAY SUAREZ WALKS THROUGH THE NUMBERS WITH MARK ZANDI, CHIEF ECONOMIST AT MOODY'S ANALYTICS.

>> Lehrer: THEN, PAUL SOLMAN EXAMINES WHETHER HIGH U.S. UNEMPLOYMENT IS A STRUCTURAL, NOT CYCLICAL, PREDICAMENT.

>> THERE IS A MISHMASH BETWEEN WHAT A LOT OF PEOPLE ARE TRAINED OR ABLE TO DO AND THE KINDS OF WORK THAT ARE AVAILABLE FOR THEM.

>> Brown: WE LOOK AT SCANDALS AND TURMOIL OFF THE FIELD AS THE COLLEGE FOOTBALL SEASON GETS UNDERWAY.

>> Lehrer: MARK SHIELDS AND DAVID BROOKS ANALYZE THE WEEK'S NEWS.

>> Brown: AND FROM AFGHANISTAN, WE CLOSE WITH A SPECIAL REPORT ON WHAT AFGHANS TODAY KNOW OF THE AL QAEDA ATTACKS ON THE U.S. TEN YEARS AGO.

>> IN A COUNTRY WHERE FOR TEN YEARS A WAR HAS BEEN FOUGHT WITH 9/11 AS ITS ROOT CAUSE AND JUSTIFICATION, 92% OF AV BEGAN MEN AN OTHER AFGHAN PROVINCES HAVE NO IDEA WHAT 9/11 WAS.

>> Lehrer: THAT'S ALL AHEAD ON TONIGHT'S NEWSHOUR. MAJOR FUNDING FOR THE PBS NEWSHOUR HAS BEEN PROVIDED BY: ♪ ♪ ♪ ♪ ♪ ♪ ♪ ♪ MOVING OUR ECONOMY FOR 160 YEARS. BNSF, THE ENGINE THAT CONNECTS US.

>> WELL, THE BEST COMPANIES ARE DRIVEN BY NEW IDEAS.

>> OUR FUTURE DEPENDS ON NEW IDEAS. WE SPEND BILLIONS ON ADVANCED TECHNOLOGIES.

>> IT'S ALL ABOUT INVESTING IN THE FUTURE.

>> WE CAN FIND NEW ENERGY-- MORE, CLEANER, SAFER AND SMARTER.

>> COLLABORATING WITH THE BEST IN THE FIELD.

>> CHEVRON WORKS WITH THE SMARTEST PEOPLE AT LEADING UNIVERSITIES AND TECH COMPANIES.

>> AND YET, IT'S REALLY BASIC.

>> IT'S PAYING OFF EVERY DAY. AND BY THE ALFRED P. SLOAN FOUNDATION. SUPPORTING SCIENCE, TECHNOLOGY, AND IMPROVED ECONOMIC PERFORMANCE AND FINANCIAL LITERACY IN THE 21ST CENTURY.

>> AND WITH THE ONGOING SUPPORT OF THESE INSTITUTIONS AND FOUNDATIONS. AND... THIS PROGRAM WAS MADE POSSIBLE BY THE CORPORATION FOR PUBLIC BROADCASTING. AND BY CONTRIBUTIONS TO YOUR PBS STATION FROM VIEWERS LIKE YOU. THANK YOU.

>> Lehrer: THE U.S. ECONOMY HIT A WALL IN AUGUST-- NO JOB GROWTH AND NO IMPROVEMENT IN THE JOBLESS RATE. RAY SUAREZ HAS OUR STORY.

>> Suarez: THE NUMBERS RELEASED TODAY BY THE LABOR DEPARTMENT CONSTITUTE THE WEAKEST JOBS REPORT IN A YEAR. NO NET JOBS WERE ADDED IN AUGUST, AND UNEMPLOYMENT STAYED STUCK AT 9.1%. THOSE CALCULATIONS INCLUDED: 45,000 VERIZON EMPLOYEES WHO WERE ON STRIKE; AND 23,000 MINNESOTA STATE EMPLOYEES AFFECTED BY A PARTIAL GOVERNMENT SHUTDOWN. TO MAKE MATTERS WORSE, EMPLOYMENT FIGURES FOR JUNE AND JULY WERE REVISED DOWN TO SHOW 58,000 FEWER JOBS ADDED. JOINING US TO DISCUSS TODAY'S REPORT IS MARK ZANDI, CHIEF ECONOMIST AT MOODY'S ANALYTICS. MARK, WHAT DOES IT IS A ABOUT THE STATE OF THE JOB MARKET THAT INSTEAD OF JUST MERELY SLOWING JOB GROWTH STOPPED?

>> YEAH, WELL, IT INDICATES THAT THE ECONOMY IS PERILOUSLY CLOSE TO RECESSION. YOU KNOW, AN ECONOMY THAT IS NOT CREATING JOBS CAN'T SUSTAIN THAT FOR VERY LONG. CONSUMERS ARE GOING TO START PULLING BACK AND THAT'S GOING TO FORCE BUSINESSES TO START LAYING OFF WORKERS. AND THAT'S A TOWN TURN, SO WE NEED TO SEE BUSINESSES START HIRING AGAIN OTHERWISE WE WILL HAVE THAT DREADED DOUBLE DIP.

>> Suarez: IN ADDITION TO THAT FLAT NUMBER OUT TODAY, THE LAST TWO MONTHS HAD TO BE REVISED DOWN YARD-- DOWNWARD AS WE MENTIONED. DOES THAT MEAN THINGS ARE EVEN WORSE THAN WE REALIZED?

>> YEAH, I THINK IT'S VERY CLEAR THAT THIS SUMMER WE'VE PRETTY MUCH STALLED OUT. NO JOB GROWTH AT ALL. IT'S REALLY QUITE A SIGNIFICANT CHANGE. IF YOU GO BACK TO THE BEGINS OF THE YEAR, WE WERE CREATING A COUPLE HUNDRED THOUSAND JOBS PER MONTH. THE SURGE IN ENERGY PRICES, THE JAPANESE QUAKE EFFECTS ON THE MANUFACTURING BASE REALLY HURT. AND OF COURSE MORE RECENTLY, THE SPECTACLE IN WASHINGTON OVER THE DEBT CEILING, THE S&P DOWNGRADE, I THINK, HAS COMPLETELY UNDERMINED CONFIDENCE IN BUSINESSPEOPLE, THEY HAVE LITERALLY FROZEN, THEY STOPPED HIRING.

>> Suarez: WHAT HAS THE IMPACT OF JOB-- EXCUSE ME, GOVERNMENT SPENDING REDUCTIONS BEEN TO THE OVERALL LABOR MARKET?

>> GOOD QUESTION. A VERY SERIOUS WEIGHT ON THE JOB MARKET. THE GOVERNMENT STATE, LOCAL, FEDERAL IS NOW LAYING OFF ABOUT 50,000 JOBS PER MONTH. SO YOU KNOW, YOU CAN KIND OF DO THE ARITHMETIC. THOSE ARE PRETTY SIGNIFICANT JOB LOSSES. I AM HOPEFUL THAT WE'RE SEEING THE WORST OF IT RIGHT NOW. MANY STATES ARE GRAPPLING WITH THE END OF SOME FISCAL STIMULUS MONEY. AND THEY NEED TO BALANCE THEIR BUDGET AND THUS THE CUTTING AT THE CURRENT TIME. BUT NONETHELESS, NO MATTER HOW YOU LOOK AT IT, WE'VE GOT SOME PRETTY SIGNIFICANT JOB CUTS TO COME IN STATE AND LOCAL SECTOR OVER THE NEXT YEAR, 18 MONTHS.

>> Suarez: OVER THE MONTHS' AS WE TALK TO PEOPLE LIKE YOU TO SIFT THESE NUMBERS WE SOMETIMES LOOK FOR BRIGHT SPOTS. ARE THERE SECTORS THAT HAD BEEN CONTRIBUTING TO JOB GROWTH THAT ARE EITHER STALLED OUT OR UNCERTAIN?

>> YEAH, MANUFACTURING WOULD BE A GOOD EXAMPLE OF THAT. THE MANUFACTURING SECTOR HAD BEEN A KEY SOURCE OF JOB GROWTH EARLIER IN THE YEAR. BUT AS I MENTIONED, THE JAPANESE QUAKE WAS REALLY VERY DISRUPTIVE, PARTICULARLY TO THE AUTO INDUSTRY AND AUTO RELATED MANUFACTURING. AND MORE RECENTLY, WE'RE SEEING SLOWDOWN IN GLOBAL ECONOMIC GROWTH AND EUROPE, OBVIOUSLY AND IN ASIA. AND THAT'S BEGINNING TO AFFECT OUR EXPORTS. AND OF COURSE A LOT OF MANUFACTURERS EXPORT WHAT THEY PRODUCE. AND NOW THEY'RE STARTING TO CUTBACK AS WELL. SO THAT'S ONE SECTOR THAT HAS GONE FROM ADDING JOBS TO LAYING OFF WORKERS LAST MONTH.

>> WHAT ROLL DOES SENTIMENT PLAY IN ALL OF THIS. COULD IT BE MAKING AN ALREADY FRAGILE ECONOMY SEEM EVEN WORSE.

>> I THINK THAT'S KEY. I THINK BUSINESSPEOPLE ARE JUST SHELL-SHOCKED.

>> LIKE ALL OF US. WE'VE BEEN THROUGH A LOT. THE RECESSION WAS VERY SEVERE. OUR COLLECTIVE PSYCHE WAS ALREADY PRETTY FRAGILE. I THINK WHAT WE WENT THROUGH LATE JULY, EARLY AUGUST IN WASHINGTON AROUND THE DEBT CEILING, THE S&P DOWNGRADE, THE TURMOIL IN EUROPE, IN OUR STOCK MARKET, I THINK THAT JUST EVISCERATED CONFIDENCE. AND BUSINESSPEOPLE NEED TO FEEL CONFIDENT BEFORE THEY GO OUT AND EXPAND THEIR BUSINESS, INVEST AND HIRE. AND THEY'VE STOPPED DOING THAT. SO CONFIDENCE IS VERY, VERY IMPORTANT AT THIS POINT.

>> WELL, LET'S TALK ABOUT CONFIDENCE A LITTLE MORE. BECAUSE YESTERDAY, ALMOST AS IF TO GET PEOPLE READY FOR THE BLOW, THE WHITE HOUSE FORECAST THAT THE UNEMPLOYMENT RATE WASN'T GOING TO COME DOWN BELOW 9% EVEN THROUGH MUCH OF NEXT YEAR.

>> YEAH, I THINK THAT'S REALISTIC. I MEAN I THINK NO MATTER HOW YOU LOOK AT IT, IT IS GOING TO BE A LONG HAUL. AND UNDER EVEN THE MOST OPTIMISTIC FORECASTS, AND I'M AMONG THE MOST OPTIMISTIC ECONOMISTS OUT THERE, IT'S NOT GOING TO BE UNTIL 2015, 2016, MAYBE EVEN 2017 BEFORE WE GET BACK TO AN UNEMPLOYMENT RATE THAT I THINK EVERYONE WOULD FEEL REALLY COMFORTABLE WITH.

>> WELL, YOU WOULD HAVE TO ADD, IF THE NUMBERS ARE RIGHT, OVER 350,000 JOBS A MONTH FOR YEARS INTO THE FUTURE. JUST TO GET US BACK TO WHERE WE ONCE WERE. AND THAT ISN'T IN THE CARDS, IS IT?

>> NOT IN THE VERY NEAR TERM. BUT LET ME JUST PROVIDE A LITTLE RAY OF HOPE HERE. AND THAT IS WHILE BUSINESSES HAVE STOPPED HIRING, THEY HAVE NOT STARTED LAYING OFF WORKERS IN A BIG WAY. I MEAN I THINK BUSINESSPEOPLE DID THAT DURING THE RECESSION. THEY'RE VERY COMFORTABLE WITH THEIR CURRENT WORKFORCE. MOST BUSINESSES, PARTICULARLY BIG COMPANIES ARE VERY PROFITABLE. THEIR BALANCE SHEETS ARE VERY STRONG. THEY'VE DONE A VERY GOOD JOB OF REDUCING DEBT. THEY REALLY DON'T WANT TO PULL BACK HERE. IF POLICYMAKERS CAN STEP UP, DO THE RIGHT THING OVER THE NEXT COUPLE, THREE MONTHS, I THINK THEY'LL REGAIN CONFIDENCE. BUSINESSPEOPLE WILL REGAIN CONFIDENCE AND THEY'LL START HIRING AGAIN AND THE ECONOMY WILL START TO MOVE FORWARD AND WE WILL AVOID THAT RECESSION. THAT'S WHAT I AM COUNTING ON. BUT WE NEED TO SEE THAT PRETTY QUICKLY.

>> Suarez: ONE OF THE MOST STRIKING AND FRIGHTENING PIECES OF DATA TO COME OUT TODAY WAS A BLACK UNEMPLOYMENT RATE NEARLY TWICE, FULLY TWICE THE NATIONAL AVERAGE. HOW IS THAT HATCHED? IS IT BECAUSE OF WHERE BLACK WORKERS LIVE IN THE COUNTRY, THE INDUSTRIES THEY ARE CONCENTRATED IN? WHAT'S DRIVING THAT BIG, BIG NUMBER?

>> YEAH, YOU ARE ABSOLUTELY RIGHT. CERTAIN MINORITY GROUPS HAVE BEEN COMPLETELY NAILED IN THE RECESSION. THE AFRICAN-AMERICAN HISPANIC GROUPS VERY, VERY HARD HIT. IF YOU LOOK AT THE JOB NUMBERS, THE GROUPS THAT HAVE BEEN HIT HARDEST ARE THOSE WITH LESSER SKILLS IN EDUCATION. IF YOU DON'T HAVE A COLLEGE DEGREE, THEN THIS JOB MARKET HAS BEEN PARTICULARLY TOUGH. IT'S TOUGH FOR EVERYBODY INCLUDING THOSE WITH Ph.Ds. BUT FOR PEOPLE WITH LESS THAN A HIGH SCHOOL DEGREE, A HIGH SCHOOL DEGREE, LESS THAN A COLLEGE EDUCATION, IT'S PARTICULARLY HARD. AND YOU KNOW I THINK THAT'S GOING TO BE THE CASE FOR A LONG TIME TO COME.

>> MARK ZANDI, THANKS FOR JOINING US.

>> THANK YOU.

>> Brown: STILL TO COME ON THE NEWSHOUR: ANOTHER WAY OF LOOKING AT THE CAUSES OF UNEMPLOYMENT; COLLEGE FOOTBALL PROGRAMS BEHAVING BADLY; SHIELDS AND BROOKS; AND WHAT DOES 9/11 MEAN TO AFGHANS TODAY? BUT FIRST, THE OTHER NEWS OF THE DAY. HERE'S HARI SREENIVASAN.

>> Sreenivasan: THE JOBS REPORT RENEWED FEARS OF A NEW RECESSION ON WALL STREET. THE RESULTING SELL-OFF WIPED OUT THE WEEK'S GAINS. THE DOW JONES INDUSTRIAL AVERAGE LOST 253 POINTS TO CLOSE AT 11,240. THE NASDAQ FELL MORE THAN 65 POINTS TO CLOSE AT 2,480. FOR THE WEEK, THE DOW LOST A FRACTION OF A PERCENT; THE NASDAQ WAS FLAT. THE FEDERAL GOVERNMENT WILL TAKE 17 OF THE COUNTRY'S LARGEST BANKS TO COURT OVER RISKY MORTGAGES. THE FEDERAL HOUSING FINANCE AGENCY FILED SUIT TODAY AGAINST BANK OF AMERICA, CITI, GOLDMAN SACHS AND OTHERS. THE SUIT CHARGED THEY MISREPRESENTED THE QUALITY OF MORTGAGE-BACKED SECURITIES BEFORE THE HOUSING MELTDOWN IN 2008. THE AGENCY OVERSEES MORTGAGE GIANTS FANNIE MAE AND FREDDIE MAC, WHICH INVESTED IN THOSE SECURITIES. PRESIDENT OBAMA HAS OVERRULED THE ENVIRONMENTAL PROTECTION AGENCY AND DROPPED A PLAN FOR STRICTER CURBS ON INDUSTRIAL SMOG. A WHITE HOUSE ANNOUNCEMENT TODAY CITED THE NEED TO EASE REGULATORY BURDENS ON BUSINESS. REPUBLICANS AND BUSINESS LEADERS INSISTED THE SMOG PROPOSAL WAS TOO COSTLY. ENVIRONMENTAL GROUPS SAID THE PRESIDENT'S DECISION COMES AT THE EXPENSE OF PUBLIC HEALTH. THE GULF COAST BRACED TODAY FOR TROPICAL STORM LEE AND A LABOR DAY WEEKEND DELUGE. THE STORM FORMED THIS AFTERNOON WITH WINDS OF 40 MILES AN HOUR. IT WAS MOVING TOWARD A POSSIBLE LANDFALL ALONG THE LOUISIANA COAST WITH UP TO 20 INCHES OF RAIN. LOUISIANA GOVERNOR BOBBY JINDAL DECLARED A STATE OF EMERGENCY, AND HE URGED THE PUBLIC TO KEEP A WATCHFUL EYE.

>> THIS IS A HOLIDAY WEEKEND. I KNOW THERE ARE FOOTBALL GAMES. I KNOW PEOPLE WILL BE PAYING ATTENTION TO AT LOVE DIFFERENT THINGS OVER THIS WEEKEND IT IS VERY IMPORTANT FOR FOLKS TO PAY ATTENTION TO THE WEATHER IN THEIR AREA. TO PAY ATTENTION TO FLASH FLOOD WARNINGS FROM LOCAL OFFICIALS. THIS IS ALSO A GREAT OPPORTUNITY FOR EVERYBODY IN SOUTH LOUISIANA TO PREPARE NOW. MISSISSIPPI GOVERNOR HALEY BARBOUR ALSO DECLARED AN EMERGENCY. HE WARNED THERE'S A POTENTIAL FOR "TREMENDOUS FLOODING". IT WAS UNCLEAR IF THE STORM WOULD GET CLOSE ENOUGH TO TEXAS TO HELP RELIEVE THE STATE'S PROLONGED DROUGHT. IT HAS BEEN A WEEK SINCE HURRICANE IRENE HIT THE EAST COAST, AND CLOSE TO 900,000 PEOPLE WERE STILL WAITING TODAY FOR THE LIGHTS TO COME BACK ON. LONG DAYS IN THE DARK SPARKED CALLS FOR INVESTIGATIONS IN RHODE ISLAND AND FOR REBATES IN MASSACHUSETTS. MEANWHILE, THE GOVERNOR OF NORTH CAROLINA SAID HATTERAS ISLAND, ON THE OUTER BANKS, WILL REOPEN TO TOURISTS WITHIN A MONTH, AFTER WORKERS BUILD A TEMPORARY BRIDGE. IN SYRIA, IT WAS ANOTHER FRIDAY OF BLOODSHED IN THE COUNTRY'S FIVE-MONTH-OLD UPRISING. TROOPS FIRED ON CROWDS OF PROTESTERS IN CITIES ACROSS THE COUNTRY AND KILLED 13. IN ANOTHER DEVELOPMENT, THE EUROPEAN UNION BANNED IMPORTS OF OIL FROM SYRIA. THE MOVE WAS DESIGNED TO PUT MORE PRESSURE ON PRESIDENT BASHAR ASSAD TO END THE CRACKDOWN. TURKEY EXPELLED THE ISRAELI AMBASSADOR AND CUT MILITARY TIES TODAY AFTER ISRAEL REFUSED TO APOLOGIZE FOR A RAID OFF THE COAST OF GAZA LAST YEAR. COMMANDOS BOARDED A FLOTILLA OF VESSELS THAT WERE PLANNING TO RUN THE ISRAELI BLOCKADE OF GAZA. NINE PRO-PALESTINIAN ACTIVISTS DIED IN THE FIGHTING, INCLUDING EIGHT TURKISH NATIONALS. TODAY'S ACTION FOLLOWED REPORTS THAT A U.N. INVESTIGATION UPHELD THE BLOCKADE, BUT FOUND THE ISRAELI RAID WAS AN EXCESSIVE USE OF FORCE. THE WHISTLE-BLOWING GROUP WIKILEAKS HAS COME UNDER FIRE AGAIN AFTER PUBLISHING ALL 250,000 STATE DEPARTMENT CABLES ON ITS WEB SITE. UNLIKE EARLIER LEAKS, THE NAMES OF HUMAN RIGHTS ACTIVISTS, INFORMANTS AND OTHERS WERE NOT REDACTED. "THE NEW YORK TIMES" AND OTHER MAJOR NEWS ORGANIZATIONS CITED THAT REASON IN A STATEMENT THAT CONDEMNED THE DOCUMENT DUMP. THEY HAD COLLABORATED WITH WIKILEAKS IN THE PAST. THOSE ARE SOME OF THE DAY'S MAJOR STORIES. NOW, BACK TO JIM.

>> Lehrer: NOW, A FURTHER CONCERN UNDERLYING THE BLEAK JOBS PICTURE. WHY ARE EMPLOYERS NOT HIRING MORE WORKERS? NEWSHOUR'S ECONOMICS CORRESPONDENT PAUL SOLMAN HAS SOME ANSWERS, PART OF HIS ONGOING REPORTING ON "MAKING SENSE OF FINANCIAL NEWS."

>> Reporter: AT THE WASHINGTON CONVENTION CENTER, AN IMAGE THAT'S BECOMING A CLICHE-- THE JOB FAIR LINE, WHERE AMERICANS WAIT IN HOPES OF FINDING WORK. TWO YEARS AFTER THE RECESSION TECHNICALLY ENDED, SOME 14 MILLION AMERICANS REMAIN OFFICIALLY IDLED. RECENTLY, A RECORD 4,000 SWARMED THE STALLS AT THIS FAIR IN D.C.

>> I'M HERE BECAUSE I'M LOOKING FOR A JOB, LIKE EVERYONE ELSE.

>> IT'S VERY DIFFICULT, VERY DIFFICULT

>> I'D ALMOST RATHER HAVE STAYED HOME THEN COME AND STAND IN THIS LONG LINES. I JUST FEEL WORSE THAN I DID BEFORE I CAME.

>> Reporter: NOW, YOU'VE HEARD ALL THIS BEFORE, OF COURSE, RIGHT HERE ON THE NEWSHOUR. SO THEN, HOW CAN IT BE THAT THE MESSAGE FROM SOME EMPLOYERS WE'VE BEEN INTERVIEWING OF LATE SEEMS TO CONTRADICT THE NO-JOBS STORY?

>> WE DON'T HAVE ENOUGH APPLICANTS AT THE MIDDLE-SKILLED LEVEL AND ABOVE.

>> WE DO HAVE DIFFICULTY FINDING GOOD ALL-AROUND QUALITY PEOPLE.

>> WE HAVE A DEFICIT OF SKILLED WORKERS.

>> Reporter: SO, EMPLOYERS WHO CAN'T FIND WORKERS, YET WORKERS WHO CAN'T FIND JOBS? WHAT GIVES?

>> IN MY VIEW, WE'RE EXPERIENCING STRUCTURAL UNEMPLOYMENT, AND IT'S THE FIRST TIME IN ANY AMERICAN'S COLLECTIVE MEMORY THAT YOU COULD SAY THAT.

>> Reporter: BY "STRUCTURAL UNEMPLOYMENT," ECONOMIST ZACHARY KARABELL MEANS THAT, BECAUSE OF THE PROGRESS OF TECHNOLOGY AND GLOBALIZATION, LOTS OF OUR OLD JOBS ARE GONE, AND NEW ONES REQUIRE SKILLS THAT MANY JUST DON'T HAVE.

>> THERE IS SOME SORT OF DEEP SHIFT GOING ON ECONOMICALLY THAT IS CHANGING EMPLOYMENT PATTERNS, IRRESPECTIVE OF WHETHER OR NOT GDP GROWTH IS 3% ONE QUARTER OR NEGATIVE-2% ANOTHER, AND THAT NEGATIVE-2% ANOTHER, AND THAT ECONOMIC GROWTH DOES NOT THEN LEAD TO SUBSTANTIAL HIRING. THERE'S A MISMATCH BETWEEN WHAT A LOT OF PEOPLE ARE TRAINED OR ABLE TO DO, AND THE KINDS OF WORK THAT ARE AVAILABLE TO THEM.

>> Reporter: NOW, KARABELL'S GLOOMY ANALYSIS IS HARDLY THE TRADITIONAL EXPLANATION OF TODAY'S UNEMPLOYMENT PREDICAMENT.

>> THE REAL PROBLEM IS THAT THERE'S JUST NOT ENOUGH JOBS, NOT THAT PEOPLE ARE INCAPABLE OF ACCEPTING THE JOBS THAT ARE AVAILABLE.

>> Reporter: MIKE KONCZAL OF THE ROOSEVELT INSTITUTE INSISTS UNEMPLOYMENT IS CYCLICAL, NOT STRUCTURAL-- NO GROWTH, NO JOBS.

>> CYCLICAL UNEMPLOYMENT IS UNEMPLOYMENT THAT'S ASSOCIATED WITH THE BUSINESS CYCLE, WITH THE COMINGS AND GOINGS OF HOW... HOW STRONG OUR ECONOMY IS.

>> Reporter: SO, ARGUES KONCZAL, JUST BUILD IT-- THE ECONOMY-- AND THEY WILL COME-- THE JOBS, THAT IS.

>> THERE ARE PEOPLE WHO ARE SITTING AROUND UNEMPLOYED, AND THERE ARE, YOU KNOW, PEOPLE WHO WANT TO OPEN BUSINESSES AND PROVIDE SERVICES WHO COULD HIRE THEM IF THEY HAD CUSTOMERS. AND THEY DON'T HAVE CUSTOMERS BECAUSE SO MANY PEOPLE ARE UNEMPLOYED, AND PEOPLE ARE AFRAID OF BECOMING UNEMPLOYED AND THEY'RE NOT SPENDING.

>> Reporter: AND SO, ALL WE HAVE TO DO IS SPUR THAT PROCESS.

>> RIGHT.

>> Reporter: WITH 4.5 APPLICANTS FOR EVERY JOB OPENING THESE DAYS, NO SURPRISE THAT FOLKS FLOODING THE JOB FAIRS AGREE.

>> I'M THINKING IT'S JUST TOO MANY PEOPLE APPLYING AND NOT ENOUGH JOBS.

>> THERE AREN'T ENOUGH JOBS TO MEET DEMAND.

>> Reporter: KARABELL INSISTS THAT THIS CONVENTIONAL WISDOM IS WRONG; THAT FIRMS MAY NEVER NEED AS MANY WORKERS AS THEY USED TO, EVEN IN TIMES OF GROWTH.

>> ONE OF THE BEST INDICATORS OF THIS IS THAT COMPANIES HAVE BEEN MAKING VAST AMOUNTS OF MONEY FOR THE PAST TWO YEARS. THEY HAVE BEEN EITHER FIRING PEOPLE OR NOT HIRING, AND THEY'VE BEEN DOING SO BECAUSE THE COMBINED EFFECTS OF GLOBALIZATION AND INFORMATION TECHNOLOGY MEANS THAT THEY DO NOT NEED MORE BODIES TO DO MORE BUSINESS.

>> Reporter: WE ALL KNOW THIS HAS BEEN HAPPENING IN MANUFACTURING, SAYS KARABELL.

>> 20 OR 30 YEARS AGO, A FACTORY MIGHT HAVE LED TO 5,000 NEW JOBS IN A COMMUNITY. "WE'RE OPENING A FACTORY! IT'S GREAT!" NOW, EVEN IF YOU OPEN AN AUTO PARTS FACTORY OR A SEMICONDUCTOR FACTORY, YOU MIGHT NEED 500 TO 1,000 HIGHLY SKILLED WORKERS TO MAN A HIGHLY ROBOTICIZED FACTORY FLOOR WHICH CHANGES CONSTANTLY, SO YOUR SKILL LEVEL NEEDS TO BE PRETTY HIGH FOR THAT. THERE'S NO THOUSANDS OF JOBS NEEDED FOR MANUFACTURING.

>> Reporter: AND INDEED, AT MARLIN STEEL IN BALTIMORE, ENGINEERS DESIGN THE BASKETS THE COMPANY MAKES, BUT ROBOTS DO MOST OF THE HEAVY LIFTING. OWNER DREW GREENBLATT.

>> THE ONLY WAY MY EMPLOYEES CAN EXCEED THE PRODUCTIVITY OF A CHINESE WORKER, A VIETNAMESE WORKER IS IF THEY HAVE... IF THEY'RE HARNESSING A TREMENDOUS ASSET LIKE A ROBOT, WHICH MAKES THEM MUCH MORE PRODUCTIVE. SO THEY'RE 40 AND 50 AND 60 TIME MORE PRODUCTIVE THAN A CHINESE WORKER. THAT'S THE ONLY WAY IT'S GOING TO WORK.

>> Reporter: SO, IN THE PAST YEAR, GREENBLATT SPLURGED ON NEW ROBOTS, MADE IN PLANTS WHERE ROBOTS ARE ALSO REPLACING PEOPLE, MEANING A FEW MORE HARD- SKILLED ROBOT DESIGNERS; A LOT FEWER HEAVY LIFTERS. STILL, ROBOTS CAN'T YET DO IT ALL. AND THIS BRINGS US TO A SECOND ASPECT OF THE STRUCTURAL UNEMPLOYMENT ARGUMENT-- THAT FOR THE FACTORY JOBS THAT STILL EXIST, TODAY'S WORKFORCE IS SHORT ON THE SOMEWHAT BROADER SKILLS THAT HADN'T BEEN PART OF A FACTORY JOB DESCRIPTION, BUT NOW ARE.

>> WE NEED VERY NIMBLE, VERY AGILE PEOPLE. THEY HAVE TO BE ABLE TO DO, YOU KNOW, WELDING ONE DAY AND BENDING THE NEXT DAY, OR, YOU KNOW, SETTING UP THIS ROBOT THIS DAY, AND THEN SETTING UP A DIFFERENT ROBOT THE NEXT DAY.

>> Reporter: PROBLEM IS, GREENBLATT SAYS, HE'S NOT FINDING THE NIMBLE AND AGILE. AND HE'S NO LONE VOICE. A NATIONAL ASSOCIATION OF MANUFACTURERS SURVEY DONE DURING THE RECESSION FOUND THAT ALMOST A THIRD OF U.S. COMPANIES FACED SKILLED LABOR SHORTAGES, AND THERE ARE INDICATIONS IT MAY BE EVEN WORSE NOW.

>> THE RESUMES THAT ARE COMING IN ARE EITHER PEOPLE THAT HAVE NO EXPERIENCE SETTING UP A ROBOT, OR THEY DON'T KNOW HOW TO READ A BLUEPRINT AND THEY DON'T KNOW SIMPLE MATH.

>> Reporter: DENVER STREET PERFORMER "ROBO MIKE" HOPES HIS UNIQUE SKILLS WILL PAY OFF BIG- TIME, SOME DAY. BUT EARLIER THIS YEAR, HE TOLD US, HE WAS LUCKY TO MAKE $3,000 A MONTH IN TIPS. DO YOU HAVE A COLLEGE DEGREE?

>> NOPE. JUST A BASIC HIGH SCHOOL DIPLOMA.

>> Reporter: DO YOU THINK YOU'D BE DOING THIS IF YOU HAD A FOUR YEAR DEGREE?

>> PROBABLY WOULDN'T HAVE, BUT THIS IS THE YEAR I FINALLY GET A CHANCE TO GO TO HOLLYWOOD. IT TOOK 25 YEARS, AND NOW THEY FINALLY WANT TO SEE ME. I'M IN A TV SHOW CALLED "AMERICA'S GOT TALENT."

>> Reporter: UNFORTUNATELY, FOR ROBO MIKE, THESE AREN'T THE TALENTS AMERICA'S LOOKING FOR AT THE MOMENT.

>> ITS A NO FOR ME.

>> I HAVE TO SAY NO.

>> I'M GOING TO SAY NO.

>> Reporter: ROBO MIKE'S QUIRKY SKILLS MAY BE CONSIDERABLE, BUT HIGH SCHOOL GRADS LIKE HIM HAVE A 9.6% UNEMPLOYMENT RATE COMPARED TO JUST 4.3% FOR THOSE WITH A FOUR-YEAR BACHELORS DEGREE. AND ONLY 30% OF AMERICANS HAVE A B.A. THOSE WITH LESS THAN A HIGH SCHOOL EDUCATION FARE EVEN WORSE-- 14.3% ARE UNEMPLOYED.

>> I'M JUST GOING TO TAKE A LISTEN, OKAY?

>> SURE.

>> Reporter: CONSIDER HEALTH CARE, A STILL-GROWING INDUSTRY. LIFESPAN, A RHODE ISLAND HOSPITAL CHAIN, HAS PLENTY OF OPEN JOBS, MOSTLY, THOUGH, THEY'RE HIGH-SKILLED.

>> OF THE ALMOST 500 JOBS THAT WE HAVE OPEN RIGHT NOW AT LIFESPAN, ONLY 31 OF THOSE JOBS REQUIRE A HIGH SCHOOL DIPLOMA OR LESS.

>> Reporter: H.R. DIRECTOR BRANDON MELTON SAYS HE'S DEALING WITH A MAJOR LEAGUE SKILLS- WORKER MISMATCH.

>> WE'RE LOOKING FOR INDIVIDUALS WITH SOME POST-SECONDARY EDUCATION, ALL THE WAY UP TO AN ASSOCIATE'S DEGREE, AND THEN BACCALAUREATE AND ABOVE, WHEREAS THE MAJORITY OF RHODE ISLANDERS, AND ACTUALLY THE MAJORITY OF OUR CANDIDATES WHO ARE APPLYING FOR JOBS, HAVE ONLY A HIGH SCHOOL DIPLOMA, OR IN SOME CASES, EVEN LESS.

>> Reporter: SO MANY LOW-SKILLED APPLICANTS; SO LITTLE LOW- SKILLED WORK. MELTON HAS HIS PICK.

>> IT'S GOOD FOR US IN A SENSE THAT WE CAN TAKE THE VERY BEST, AND WE OFTEN REQUIRE, IN ADDITION TO A HIGH SCHOOL DIPLOMA, SOME EXPERIENCE IN THAT FIELD-- FOOD SERVICE EXPERIENCE, ENVIRONMENTAL SERVICES EXPERIENCE, LAUNDRY.

>> Reporter: FOR HIGHER-SKILLED SLOTS-- NURSES, PHYSICIAN'S ASSISTANTS, RADIOLOGY TECHS-- THE COMPETITION ISN'T NEARLY AS STIFF. BUT HE STILL GETS FIVE APPLICANTS FOR EVERY OPENING. SO IN THE END, IS THE UNEMPLOYMENT PROBLEM MAINLY STRUCTURAL? A LACK OF SKILLS? MIKE KONCZAL DOUBTS IT.

>> IF THAT WAS A PROBLEM FOR THE UNITED STATES' ECONOMY AS A WHOLE, WE WOULD SEE TWO THINGS: WE WOULD SEE A LOT OF JOB OPENINGS THAT AREN'T BEING FILLED; AND WE ALSO SEE WAGES STARTING TO INCREASE VERY QUICKLY, BECAUSE THE PEOPLE WHO WOULD BE WILLING TO SHOW UP FOR A JOB COULD DEMAND A HIGHER WAGE. WE SEE THE OPPOSITE. WE SEE VERY LOW NUMBER OF JOB OPENINGS, WE SEE VERY LOW WAGE GROWTH. THOUGH IT IS TRUE, FOR SOME PLACES, SOME FIRMS, SOME INDUSTRIES, IT'S NOT TRUE AT AN AGGREGATE-WIDE LEVEL, IT'S NOT TRUE FOR THE WHOLE ECONOMY.

>> Reporter: THUS KONCZUL'S RX: STIMULATE THE ECONOMY AND CREATE MORE JOBS. BUT WHILE THAT WOULD PUT SOME BACK TO WORK FOR AWHILE, SPENDING THE WAY WE USED TO ISN'T THE LONG-TERM CURE, SAYS KARABELL.

>> THERE IS A PROBLEM HERE THAT WE HAVE NOT FIGURED OUT HOW TO SOLVE. THERE IS NOT AN IMMEDIATE FIX TO THE MISMATCH BETWEEN SKILLS OF MILLIONS OR TENS OF MILLIONS OF PEOPLE, AND THE JOBS THAT MIGHT BE CREATED IN THIS NEWER ECONOMIC WORLD. THAT MISMATCH IS NOT GOING TO MAGICALLY DISAPPEAR JUST BECAUSE THE ECONOMY GROWS 4% A YEAR.

>> Reporter: BUT RIGHT NOW, IT'S GROWING AT LESS THAN HALF THAT RATE. SO WE CAN'T REALLY KNOW YET IF UNEMPLOYMENT, STUCK AT AROUND 9%, IS STRUCTURAL OR NOT.

>> Brown: NOW, KEEPING SCORE ON AND OFF THE FOOTBALL FIELD AS THE VIOLATIONS PILE UP ON LEADING UNIVERSITIES. COLLEGE FOOTBALL KICKS OFF THIS WEEKEND UNDER CLOUDS OF CONTROVERSY AFTER A SERIES OF OFF-SEASON ETHICS SCANDALS. THE MOST EXPLOSIVE INVOLVES THE UNIVERSITY OF MIAMI AND FORMER BOOSTER NEVIN SHAPIRO, NOW SERVING 20 YEARS IN FEDERAL PRISON FOR INVOLVEMENT IN A PONZI SCHEME. HE'S TOLD "YAHOO SPORTS" THAT HE PROVIDED GIFTS, CASH AND EVEN PROSTITUTES TO 72 FOOTBALL PLAYERS AT MIAMI FROM 2002 TO 2010. THIS WEEK, SCHOOL PRESIDENT DONNA SHALALA ADDRESSED THE ISSUE IN A VIDEO MESSAGE ON THE UNIVERSITY WEB SITE.

>> WE ARE GOING TO DO THIS RIGHT. WE ARE COMMITTED TO HAVING THE MOST COMPLIANT PROGRAM ANYWHERE, AND WE WILL MOVE ON STRONGER AND BETTER PREPARED FOR THE FUTURE.

>> Brown: A DAY AFTER SHALALA SPOKE, THE NCAA, THE GOVERNING BODY FOR COLLEGE SPORTS, LEVIED PENALTIES AGAINST 12 CURRENT MIAMI PLAYERS, MOST NOTABLY STARTING QUARTERBACK JACORY HARRIS. THEY MUST PAY RESTITUTION, AND SOME FACE SUSPENSIONS OF ONE TO SIX GAMES, INCLUDING MONDAY NIGHT'S OPENER AGAINST MARYLAND. IN ADDITION, THE UNIVERSITY OF MIAMI PROGRAM ITSELF IS EXPECTED TO BE HIT WITH SANCTIONS, UP TO THE SO-CALLED "DEATH PENALTY"-- BARRING IT FROM COMPETING FOR AT LEAST A YEAR. THE BAD BEHAVIOR COMPETITION THIS OFF-SEASON HAS IMPLICATED OTHER PRESTIGIOUS SCHOOLS. AT OHIO STATE, THE NCAA IS STILL INVESTIGATING ALLEGATIONS THAT PLAYERS TRADED MEMORABILIA FOR DISCOUNTED TATTOOS AND CASH IN VIOLATION OF UNIVERSITY AND NCAA RULES. THAT SCANDAL COST COACH JIM TRESSEL HIS JOB LAST MAY AND LED TO THE DEPARTURE OF STAR QUARTERBACK TERRELLE PRYOR. AND THE UNIVERSITY OF NORTH CAROLINA FIRED ITS COACH, BUTCH DAVIS, IN JULY AMID A PROBE INTO ETHICS VIOLATIONS THERE. IN AN INTERVIEW WITH NPR ON WEDNESDAY, NCAA PRESIDENT MARK EMMERT WAS ASKED IF THE PROBLEMS ARE WIDESPREAD.

>> WELL, IT CERTAINLY FEELS LIKE IT BECAUSE OF THESE VERY HIGH PROFILE CASES. AND I'M OFTEN ASKED WHETHER I THINK IT'S BETTER OR WORSE THAN IT'S BEEN IN THE PAST. AND THE FACT IS, I DON'T KNOW. WHAT I DO KNOW IS THAT IT'S UNACCEPTABLY HIGH. WE SIMPLY CAN'T TOLERATE THESE KINDS OF ACTIONS AND CONTINUE TO PROMOTE OUR PROGRAMS AS HAVING THE INTEGRITY THAT WE ALL EXPECT OF THEM.

>> Brown: IN ALL, AT LEAST TEN MAJOR PROGRAMS HAVE FACED INVESTIGATIONS OR PUNISHMENT IN RECENT MONTHS. AND LAST YEAR, THE UNIVERSITY OF SOUTHERN CALIFORNIA WAS FORCED TO GIVE UP ITS 2004 NATIONAL CHAMPIONSHIP AFTER AN INVESTIGATION FOUND THAT STAR PLAYER REGGIE BUSH HAD RECEIVED IMPROPER BENEFITS FROM A SPORTS AGENT. BUT QUESTIONS ABOUT ETHICS APPEAR TO HAVE DONE LITTLE TO DIMINISH THE GAME'S POPULARITY. STADIUMS WILL BE PACKED THIS WEEKEND, AND WITH RECENT BILLION-DOLLAR TV DEALS, COLLEGE FOOTBALL HAS NEVER BEEN MORE PROSPEROUS. AND FOR MORE, WE'RE JOINED BY KEVIN BLACKISTONE OF ESPN. HE TEACHES SPORTS JOURNALISM AT THE UNIVERSITY OF MARYLAND. AND CHAD MCEVOY, WHO TEACHES SPORTS MANAGEMENT AT ILLINOIS STATE UNIVERSITY AND HAS STUDIED ATHLETIC PROGRAM VIOLATIONS. CHAD McEVOY STARTING WITH YOU, EVEN IN A PERIOD OF BAD NEWS FOR COLLEGE SUPPORTEDS, THIS MIAMI CASE SURPRISED A LOT OF PEOPLE. WHAT DO YOU MAKE OF THE ALLEGATIONS OF WHAT'S GOING ON THERE? WE SEEM TO BE HAVING SOME TECHNICAL PROBLEMS IN ILLINOIS. SO I WILL ASK YOU KEVIN, WHAT YOU THINK OF THE SITUATION AT MIAMI?

>> WELL, VERY TITILLATING. ANY TIME YOU HAVE A FELON SPILLING THE BEANS AND TALKING ABOUT PROSTITUTION INVOLVED IN THE DEALINGS WITH THESE YOUNG GUYS AT THE UNIVERSITY OF MIAMI, BUT IT'S, YOU KNOW, IT'S PART OF A LONG STORIES THAT'S BEEN GOING ON IN COLLEGE SPORTS FOR A VERY LONG TIME. WE'VE HAD ANY NUMBER OF VIOLATIONS LOOKED INTO THIS YEAR. WE CAN GO ALL THE WAY BACK TO THE 1980s. AND EVEN BEFORE THAT, IT'S PART AND PARCEL OF COLLEGIATE LETICS. BUT IT'S PROBABLY GETTING WORSE.

>> HOW DO YOU DEFINE THE PROBLEM. MIAMI INVOLVES A COLLEGE BOOSTER, SOME OF THESE THAT'S IN A NUMBER OF CASES. SOME OF THESE CASES INVOLVE SPORTS AGENTS.

>> RIGHT.

>> THERE'S ALWAYS MONEY, RIGHT?

>> THAT IS THE KEY. I MEAN THE ROOT OF THE PROBLEM IS MONEY. AND MONEY HAS CORRUPTED COLLEGE SPORTS. AND IN ALL THESE CASE YOU JUST POINTED OUT, IT'S ATHLETES WHO ARE THE LABOR FORCE WHOSE BLOOD AND SWEAT IS THE BACKBONE OF THE BILLION DOLLAR INDUSTRY, THE MULTIBILLION-DOLLAR INDUSTRY THAT IS COLLEGIATE LETICS. AND THEY SEE EVERYONE AROUND THEM BENEFITTING FROM THEIR BLOOD AND SWEAT. AND THEY FEEL THAT WHY NOT. WHY SHOULDN'T WE TAKE A LITTLE SOMETHING EXTRA FOR OUR INVESTS. AND THAT'S EXACTLY WHAT'S HAPPENED.

>> Brown: CHAD McEVOY, ARE YOU BACK WITH US?

>> ABSOLUTELY.

>> Brown: OKAY, SORRY ABOUT THAT PROBLEM. I DIDN'T KNOW IF YOU HEARD WHERE WE ARE SO FAR BUT I WAS JUST ASKING ABOUT HOW YOU DEFINE THE SITUATION THAT WE'RE SEEING AT MIAMI AND SO MANY OTHER COLLEGES RIGHT NOW. WHAT'S GOING ON?

>> YEAH, WELL, I DID HEAR AND I THINK KEVIN'S ABSOLUTELY CORRECT. WE'VE GOT A SYSTEM IN WHICH MILLIONS, HUNDREDS OF MILLIONS OF DOLLARS ARE INVOLVED. WE HAVE ATHLETIC PROGRAMS WITH BUDGETS OVER 100 MILLION A YEAR. WE'VE GOT BOOSTERS AND OTHERS THAT, AGENTS AND SO ON THAT WANT A PIECE OF THAT PIE. DID WE HAVE STUDENT ATHLETES, PARTICULARLY HIGH PROFILE FOOTBALL, MEN'S BASKETBALL PROGRAMS THAT SEE ALL OF THAT MONEY OUT THERE AND ARE INTERESTED IN GETTING SOME OF THAT AS WELL?

>> AND CHAD, WE HEARD MARK EMIRRETTE, THE PRESIDENT OF THE NCAA IN OUR TAPE PIECE, THIS QUESTION OF THE PERVASIVENESS. HAS ANYBODY FIGURED OUT HOW PERVASIVE, WHETHER EVERYONE BENDS OR BREAKS THE RULES OR WHETHER IT'S A CASE OF A SMALL GROUP OF BAD APPLES? ANYBODY KNOW FOR SURE?

>> YEAH, DIFFICULT TO DEFINE, OF COURSE, TO COMPARE ONE ERA TO ANOTHER. WE OF COURSE LIVE IN AGE AND MEDIA WORLD IN WHICH WE HEAR ABOUT THESE SCANDALS ON TELEVISION 24 HOURS A DAY, INSTANTANEOUSLY ON THE INTERNET, TWITTER, THESE SORTS OF THINGS. SO HARD TO TELL WHETHER THEY ARE MORE PERVASIVE OR WE JUST HAVE MORE ACCESS TO THAT INFORMATION.

>> Brown: NOW KEVIN, I MENTIONED THE SO-CALLED DEATH PENALTY. THE LAST TIME THAT WAS IMPLEMENTED WHAT WAS SMU IN 1987.

>> EXACTLY.

>> Brown: A LONG TIME.

>> A LONG TIME AGO. WHEN THEY LOOK NOW AT POSSIBLE PENALTIES FOR THESE SCHOOLS, WHAT'S POSSIBLE AND WHAT ARE THE REALITIES OF THE SITUATION.

>> WELL, OBVIOUSLY THAT IS THE GUILLOTINE. BUT BEFORE THEY GET TO THE GUILLOTINE THEY CAN DO ALL SORTS OF THINGS. THEY CAN DO WHAT THEY HAVE DONE RIGHT NOW WHICH IS TO FORCE PLAYERS NOT TO PLAY ON THE FIELD. THEY CAN TAKE AWAY SCHOLARSHIPS. THEY CAN RESTRICT RECRUITING VISITS BY COACHING STAFF. THEY CAN DO THOSE SORTS OF THINGS. THE ABSOLUTE LAST STRAW OR LAST-- IS THE DEATH PENALTY. AND AFTER WHAT HAPPENED AT SMU AND I JUST MOVED TO DALLAS WHEN THAT DECISION CAME DOWN. AFTER THE HAVOC THAT THAT WRECKED ON THAT UNIVERSITY, I'LL DOUBT THAT THEY WILL EVER DO THAT AGAIN. BUT YOU KNOW, THE ODD THING ABOUT THIS TO ME IS, AND WE TOUCHED ON IT BEFORE, THE MONEY ISSUE. THIS MIAMI CASE IN PARTICULAR IS REALLY KIND OF CONFUSED EVERYTHING. BECAUSE IT REALLY HAS KIND OF PUT A SMOKE BOMB IN THE ROOM. AND ALL OF A SUDDEN WE'VE TAKEN OUR FOCUS OFF OF WHAT THE REAL PROBLEM IS. AND THAT'S ALL THE MONEY THAT IS IN COLLEGE SPORTS. ONE OF THE SCANDALS THAT WE DIDN'T MENTION HAPPENS TO GO BACK TO THE FIESTA BOWL THIS YEAR, WHERE JOHN, THE C.E.O. LOST HIS JOB WHICH PAID HIM ALMOST 700,000 A YEAR. WHERE THE FIESTA BOWL PULLED IN IN TERMS OF REVENUE, 11, 12 MILLION DOLLARS PER GAME. AND THEY LOST IT BECAUSE HE WAS ONE FORCING EMPLOYEES TO MAKE POLITICAL CONTRIBUTIONS WHICH IS ILLEGAL IF YOU ARE A NONPROFIT, WHICH IT IS SUPPOSED TO BE. AND ALSO BECAUSE THEY WERE SHOWERING THE PEOPLE WHO RUN COLLEGE FOOTBALL WITH ALL SORTS OF FINANCIAL GIFTS INCLUDING TAKING THEM TO STRIP CLUBS. THAT CAME OUT IN THE INVESTIGATION.

>> Brown: WELL, CHAD, WHEN YOU LOOK AT THIS QUESTION OF POSSIBLE REFORMS, WHICH HAS BEEN TALKED ABOUT A WHOLE LOT, YOU LOOK AT THE INSTITUTIONS THEMSELVES. THE COACHES ON UP TO THE UNIVERSITY PRESIDENTS. NOW ARE THEY NOT TAKING IT THAT SERIOUSLY? DOES IT LOOK LIKE? OR DO THE BENEFITS OF THE COLLEGE GAME OUTWEIGH ANY POSSIBLE LACK EYES, HOW DOES IT LOOK TO YOU? >>-- I THINK WE STILL HAVE TECHNICAL TROUBLES, SORRY ABOUT THAT.

>> I WILL ANSWER THAT. IF YOU LOOK AT OHIO STATE UNIVERSITY, OHIO STATE UNIVERSITY'S FOOTBALL TEAM, I THINK THE OTHER YEAR BROUGHT IN OVER 67 MILLION DOLLARS WORTH OF REVENUE TO A UNIVERSITY THAT LIKE MOST OTHER PUBLIC UNIVERSITIES IN THIS COUNTRY THAT HAD LARGE FOOTBALL PROGRAMS, ARE GETTING LESS AND LESS DOLLARS FROM THE STATE COFFER. SO ALL OF A SUDDEN THE BOARD OF REGENTS ARE LOOKING FOR NEW REVENUE STREAMS AND WHO DO THEY TURN TO? THEY TURN TO THE FOOTBALL TEAM. SO THE FOOTBALL TEAM HAS TO DO ANYTHING AND EVERYTHING IT CAN, NOT ONLY TO TRY AND WIN BUT ALSO TO TRY AND WIN AND BRING IN, BRING IN MONEY THAT THEY OFTEN GIVE BACK TO THE UNIVERSITY IT IS A VERY, TO MY, A VERY UNHOLDY ALLIANCE THAT WE HAVE RIGHT NOW BETWEEN WHAT IS A REVENUE GENERATING OPERATION IN COLLEGIATE LETICS, PLACED UNDER THE UMBRELLA OF A NONPROFIT INSTITUTION OF HIGHER EDUCATION, WHICH TO MY KNOWLEDGE DOESN'T HAVE A MISSION STATEMENT THAT SAYS WHEN THE NATIONAL CHAMPIONSHIP, PRODUCE ALL AMERICANS, THAT SORT OF THING.

>> Brown: MEANTIME AS WE SAID, THE GAMES GO ON.

>> ABSOLUTELY, AND I'LL BE WATCHING THEM THIS WEEKEND.

>> Brown: ALL RIGHT, KEVIN BLACKISTONE AND CHAD McEVOY, APOLOGIES FOR THE TECHNICAL TROUBLES. THANKS A LOT.

>> Lehrer: AND TO THE ANALYSIS OF SHIELDS AND BROOKS-- SYNDICATED COLUMNIST MARK SHIELDS, "NEW YORK TIMES" COLUMNIST DAVID BROOKS. IS MARK, JOBS, UNEMPLOYMENT REMAINS THE PROBLEM OF THIS COUNTRY, PARTICULARLY FOR PEOPLE WHO GOFF ENIT, RIGHT? IT JUST GOES ON AND ON AND ON.

>> IT DOES, JIM. AND IT GETS WORSE. WE HEARD RAY WITH MARK ZANDI. MARK ZANDI IS PERHAPS THE MOST OPTIMISTIC OF ALL ECONOMISTS. AND HE --

>> HE COULD BARELY FIND ANYTHING.

>> EXACTLY. HE CAN ALWAYS FIND, YOU KNOW, SOME BRIGHTNESS HOWEVER BLEAK. BUT LOOK, IN 6.9 MILLION FEWER JOBS TODAY THAN THERE WERE IN DECEMBER OF 2007 IN THIS COUNTRY. AND THAT'S-- WE ONLY HAD 58,000 AVERAGE A MONTH COME INTO THE WORKFORCE WHICH MEANS PEOPLE JUST AREN'T GOING TO STOP LOOKING. WE USUALLY JUST BY GROWTH WE HAVE ANOTHER 100,000 PEOPLE INTO THE WORKFORCE. SO IT'S-- ACROSS-THE-BOARD THERE'S NO BRIGHT SPOTS.

>> Lehrer: AND YOU KNOW, DAVID, HERE AGAIN TO PICK UP ON WHAT MARK ZANDI SAID, THE KEY TO THIS IS CONFIDENCE. THAT PEOPLE JUST DON'T WANT TO-- THEY'RE WORRIED. THEY'RE SCARED. AND HE CITED AGAIN, WHICH HAPPENED IN WASHINGTON AS ONE OF THE REASONS THAT PEOPLE WHO HAD THE MONEY, IN OTHER WORDS, THESE COMPANIES ARE MAKING ALL THIS MONEY AREN'T HIRING ANYBODY IS THEY JUST DON'T TRUST WHAT IS GOING ON IN WASHINGTON.

>> I THINK THAT'S PART OF IT I THINK THE UNDERLYING THING WAS DESCRIBED BY ECONOMIST YEARS AGO S WHEN YOU HAVE A FINANCIAL BUBBLE WHICH LEADS TO A RECESSION, IT'S DIFFERENT FROM A NORMAL RECESSION. AND IF YOU LOOK BACK AT FINANCIAL LEAD RECESSIONS IT TAKES A LONG TIME, SEVEN YEARS OR SO TO GET BACK. AND IN SOME SENSE THE STAGNATION WE'VE SEEN EVER SINCE IS PAR FOR THE COURSE FOR THIS KIND OF RECESSION. BUT THAT DOESN'T MEAN IT'S NOT HAVING BIG EFFECTS. AND THAT DOESN'T MEAN IT'S NOT HIGHLIGHTING SOME UNDERLYING PROBLEMS. AND I THINK AS THIS THING DRAGS ON AND ON, A LOT OF PEOPLE LIKE IN THE REPORT TODAY ARE SAYING ASIDE FROM THE CYCLICAL WHAT IS STRUCTURALLY WRONG. WE HAVE HE'S AN ECONOMY THAT HAS BEEN TOO CONSUMPTION, TOO LITTLE PRODUCTION, TOO MUCH DEBT, TOO MUCH RELYING ON HOUSEHOLD INCOME, TOO MANY RESOURCES AND TALENT GOING TO WALL STREET. WE HAVE HE'S SERIOUS STRUCTURAL PROBLEMS, WAGE STAGNATION, INEQUALITY WHICH HAVE NOT BEEN ADDRESSED. I THINK THE LONGER THIS GOES ON, THE MORE POLITICIANS, BOTH OF THE RIGHT AND LEFT WING VARIETY SAY WE HAVE TO LOOK AT THE UNDERLYING PROBLEMS NOT JUST WHAT ARE WE GOING TO DO TO PRODUCE JOB GROWTH.

>> Lehrer: IT HAS BEEN PUMPED ON TO FIX THIS.

>> IT HAS AT A TIME WHEN CONFIDENCE IN THE POLITICAL SYSTEM HAS PLUMMETED TO A NEW LOW. RIGHT NOW ACCORDING TO ANALYSIS COMPILED BY BILL-- A REPUBLICAN POLLSTER WITH NO PARTISAN TILT TO IT AT ALL, SHOWS THAT QUOTING "THE WASHINGTON POST" SURVEY, THAT THREE OUT OF FOUR PEOPLE HAVE LITTLE OR NO CONFIDENCE THAT WASHINGTON CAN DO ANYTHING TO FIX THE ECONOMY. SO THERE-- THAT IS, AS THE PRESIDENT APPROACHES THE NATION NEXT THURSDAY NIGHT, HE IS TALKING TO AN AUDIENCE THAT IS DISTRUSTFUL, MISTRUSTFUL, SKEPTICAL, IN SOME CASES ALMOST CYNICAL.

>> Lehrer: WHAT SHOULD BE THE EXPECTATIONS ABOUT WHAT THE PRESIDENT'S GOING TO SAY NEXT THURSDAY NIGHT?

>> WELL.

>> Lehrer: WHAT ARE YOURS?

>> I THINK WHAT THE PRESIDENT HAS TO DO IS I CAN TELL YOU WHAT THE PRODUCT OF THAT EVENT AND THAT EVENING HAS TO BE. PEOPLE HAVE TO COME OUT, IF THERE IS A POINT WHICH BARACK OBAMA HAS LOST SUPPORT AND LOST CONFIDENCE, IT IS A SENSE AMONG MANY OF HIS OWN FOLLOWERS, THEY DON'T KNOW WHAT HE REALLY WOULD FIGHT FOR. WHAT IS THAT POINT IN WHICH HE WILL GO INTO THE FOXHOLE AND SAY BEYOND THIS POINT, NOTHING. I MEAN THERE WAS A SENSE ON THE DEBT CEILING, THERE WAS NEVER,-- THAT WASN'T CLEAR. ON THE HEALTH-CARE PLAN, THERE WAS NEVER THAT CLEAR SENSE OF EXACTLY WHERE HE STOOD. WHAT HIS FINAL PRINCIPLES WERE. WE KNEW IN GENERAL OUTLINE, THAT IT WAS LET THE LEGISLATIVE PROCESS WORK ITSELF. WE'RE FAR BEYOND LEGISLATIVE PROCESS WORKING ITSELF. HE BETTER COME OUT OF THAT SPEECH NEXT THURSDAY NIGHT WITH A SENSE ON THE PEOPLE'S PART WHO HAVE HEARD IT, THAT OKAY, I UNDERSTAND WHAT HAS TO BE DONE. THE PRESIDENT HAS CONVINCED ME OF THAT. THAT WE NEED TO DO IT. AND THAT I AM-- I HAVE A ROLE IN SUPPORTING HIM TO DO THAT. I MEAN AND THAT IS NECESSARY WITH THOSE-- AND-- MORE THAN 3 POINT TO IT.

>> Lehrer: THAT IS A HIGH BAR.

>> THAT IS A HIGH BAR. HE HASN'T DONE THAT SINCE BUT HE HASN'T REALLY SET OUT AN AGENDA WHAT IS THE COUNTRY GOING TO LOOK LIKE IN 2020. HERE'S WHAT MI SHOOTING FOR. AND I DON'T THINK HE'S DONE THAT. ALL OF HIS SPEECHES, HE HAS HAD MANY DOMESTIC POLICY SPEECHES IT'S BEEN A SPECIFIC PIECE OF LEGISLATION OR AS PART OF A NEGOTIATING PROCESS. NOT REALLY THE BIG PICTURE. AND SO WHAT ONE EXPECTS FROM THIS SPEECH IS A SERIES OF MODEST JOB PRODUCING THINGS FOR THE NEXT QUARTER. MAYBE SOME INFRASTRUCTURE SPENDING. MAYBE THE PAYROLL TAX REDUCTION, MAYBE SOME PORE GREEN ENERGY TALK. BUT I DON'T THINK PARTICULARLY THAT FAMILIAR STUFF IS GOING TO INFLUENCE AND IMPRESS THE AMERICAN PEOPLE. I REALLY WOULD GO DOWN TO THE FUNDAMENTALS LIKE I SAID BEFORE, AND SAY WE'VE GOT SOME FUNDAMENTAL PROBLEMS. HERE'S WHAT GOVERNMENT SHOULD DO, WHICH ARE SORT OF REPUBLICAN IDEAS. MAYBE SOME CLEAN TAX REFORM. MAYBE LOWER THE CORPORATE TAX RATES. HERE IS WHAT GOVERNMENT SHOULD DO, SOME DEMOCRATIC IDEAS, SPEND MORE ON HUMAN CAPITAL, INVEST IN TECHNOLOGY, STUFF LIKE THAT. MIX IT ALL UP. AND I DON'T THINK THAT'S ALIEN TO WHAT HE STANDS FOR BUT HE REALLY HASN'T LAID IT OUT IN A BIG COMPREHENSIVE FORM.

>> Lehrer: DOW EXPECT HIM TO DO THAT?

>> NO, I DON'T. I THINK THEY'LL GO-- I THINK THEY ARE SO FOCUSED AS ANY ADMINISTRATION IS AT THIS POINT IN ITS TERM ON JUST TRYING TO BOOST JOBS BY ELECTION DAY. AND SO I THINK THEY'LL FOCUS ON THE SMALLER THINGS.

>> BUT WHY IF IT'S SUCH A BIG DEAL, SUCH A MAJOR MAJOR THING IN THIS COUNTRY, AND HE ACKNOWLEDGES IT AND THE WHOLE COUNTRY ACKNOWLEDGES IT AND HE'S GOING TO A JOINT-- APPEAR BEFORE A JOINT SESSION OF CONGRESS, WHY DO WHAT YOU SAY HE'S GOING TO DO?

>> WELL, PEOPLE IN THEIR THIRD YEAR OF OFFICE ARE EXHAUSTED. THEY ARE REALLY ONLY LOOKING TO THE SHORT TERM. SECOND TO DO A BIG PROGRAM THAT LOOKS AT SOME OF THE ECONOMIC FUNDAMENTALS, YOU HAVE TO MESS UP YOUR BASE. FOR DEMOCRATS CAN, THEY WOULD HAVE TO SAY PROBABLY SOME CORPORATE TAX REDUCTION. FOR REPUBLICAN ALSO, TO FIX REALLY THE DEEP STRUCTURAL PROBLEMS, YOU HAVE TO DO THINGS FROM EACH PARTY'S COLUMN. AND THAT'S HARD TO DO IF YOU REALLY WANT TO MOBILIZE YOUR BASE.

>> I DISAGREEMENT I THINK IT HAS TO BE A HOLY COW MOMENT. I AGREE WITH DAVID ON THE SMALL THINGS. I MEAN THAT YOU ARE GOING TO DOT UNEMPLOYMENT EXTENSION, YOU'RE GOING TO DO THE PAYROLL TAX EXTENSION. THERE WILL BE THOSE. AND THERE MAY BE SOME OTHER, BUT I THINK THERE HAS TO BE SOMETHING BIG THAT IS DIFFERENT. IT CAN'T BE THE CAT'S AND DOGS WE'VE HEARD BEFORE. ONCE HE STARTS TALKING ABOUT GREEN JOBS, IT JUST GOING TO BE EYES ROLLING AND PEOPLE ARE GOING TO BE SAYING IT IS ARENA FOOTBALL ON THE OTHER CHANNEL. I MEAN IT'S GOT TO BE SOMETHING WHETHER IT'S FAST WHICH IS THE PROPOSAL TO FIX THE SCHOOLS IN AMERICA. IT'S GOT TO BE LABOR INTENSIVE. IT CAN'T BE CAPITAL INTENSIVE OR MACHINE INTENSE YOU HAVE. IT'S GOT TO BE JOBS FOR PEOPLE.

>> Lehrer: LET'S SAY DE THAT. LET'S SAY DE EXACTLY WHAT YOU THINK HE SHOULD DO. WOULD THAT BE WELL-RECEIVED BY THE REPUBLICANS?

>> I THINK GIVEN WHAT WE HAVE RIGHT NOW, I MEAN WE SAW A HEMORRHAGING OF SUPPORT IN THIS COUNTRY. WHERE THE PRESIDENT IN THE MONTH OF AUGUST AND THE REPUBLICANS. REPUBLICANS EVEN WORSE, SMALL CONSOLATION FOR THE DEMOCRATS BECAUSE MUCH THE WAY THE DEBT SEALING WAS HANDLED IT WAS NOT ONLY THE PRODUCT THAT CAME OUT THAT DISSATISFIED PEOPLE T WAS A SENSE OF DISGUST THE WAY IT WAS DONE. SO I THINK, JIM, RIGHT NOW THAT-- AND THAT HAS BEEN COMPOUNDED IF ANYTHING, AT LEAST COMPLICATED BY THE WAY THE SPEECH WAS KED ALLED.

>> YEAH.

>> Lehrer: I WAS GOING TO ASK YOU ABOUT THAT.

>> THE BACK AND FORTH ON THAT. KIND OF A CLEVER GOTCHA IN THE WHITE HOUSE. HEY, WE'LL DO IT ON THE 7th BECAUSE THAT'S THE NIGHT THEY WILL BE DEBATING AT THE REAGAN LINE RAERK THE REPUBLICAN CAN DATS, WE'LL STEP ON THEIR STORY, THINKS SOMEBODY. AND YOU KNOW, FOR WHATEVER REASON, AND THEN JOHN BOEHNER HAVING BEEN PRESENTED WITH THIS OPPORTUNITY WHERE HE COULD LOOK BIG, IF ANYTHING START THE AMAZING SHRINKING MAN. BECOME THE FIRST SPEAK NEVER HOUSE TO DENY A REQUEST TO SPEAK SO THEY BOTH COME OUT LOOKING SMALLER AS A RESULT OF THAT BACK AND FORTH.

>> Lehrer: YOU SEE THE SAME WAY.

>> I AGREE. IF WE ARE GOING TO LUNCH I CALL YOU UP AND SAY WHAT DAY IS GOOD, WE JUGGLE DATES AND FIND A DATE.

>> Lehrer: ISN'T THAT HOW THEY'VE ALWAYS DONE IT.

>> YEAH, BUT I'M SURE AGAIN, PEOPLE ARE REALLY ANGRY. AND SO THE DEMOCRATS SAW A CHANCE TO STEP OVER THE DEBATE. AND THE REPUBLICANS SAW A CHANCE TO STEP OVER THE DEMOCRATS SO THEY TOOK THEIR CHANCES. BUT EVERYONE ELSE THINKS WHAT ARE YOU DOING?

>> Lehrer: I READ A LOT ABOUT THIS. WE ALL HAVE, THAT THERE'S NO PRECEDENT FOR-- FIRST OF ALL, A PRESIDENT CALLING A JOINT SESSION OF CONGRESS WITHOUT TALKING TO THE PEOPLE WHO RUN THE CONGRESS, WHAT DAY LET'S DO THIS AND THIS. AND APPARENTLY THE WHITE HOUSE, OBAMA WHITE HOUSE DID NOT DO THAT, IS THAT RIGHT?

>> IT'S VERY HARD TO PARS. PEOPLE HAVE DIFFERENT CLAIMS BUT THAT SEEMS TO BE THE ESSENTIALLY THE TRUTH.

>> THEY SAY THAT THEY DID. THEY SAY THAT THEY DID TALK TO THE SPEAKER'S OFFICE AND THERE WAS AGREEMENT. BUT THEN THE SPEAKER SAID THERE WASN'T A SPECIFIC DATE. SO GENERALLY AGREEMENT BUT NOT A SPECIFIC ARRANGEMENT, SEEMS TO BE. BUT YOU'RE RIGHT IT WAS -- THE PRODUCT, THE NET PRODUCT, THE PEOPLE WOULD SAY MY GOD ALMIGHTY, HAVE THESE PEOPLE-- IT IS LIKE THAT COUPLE YOU DON'T WANT TO BE AROUND, CONSTANTLY, DID YOU SEE WHAT HE DID, YOU KNOW, ISN'T SHE TERRIBLE.

>> FOR THE WHOULS THIS THEY HAVE TO UNDERSTAND HOW BAD THIS MONTH HAS BEEN. THIS PERIOD HAS REALLY BEEN BAD. MARK MENTIONED THE FAITH IN GOVERNMENT. OBAMA WANTED TO RESTORE FAITH IF GOVERNMENT, NOW WE ARE AGAIN AT HISTORIC LOWS AND OBAMA'S RATING HIMSELF HAVE PLUMMETED, DROPPED SIGNIFICANTLY THIS PAST MONTH. PART OF JUST THE WHOLE ATMOSPHERE. SO AMERICANS JUST NOT GOING TO TUNE IN THAT MUCH UNTIL ELECTION DAY. HE'S GOT A FEW MOMENTS TO MAKE PEOPLE A SOW-- SAY OH, THAT'S DIFFERENT. I KNOW THEY ARE LOOKING FOR THAT MOMENT THIS MAY BE THAT MOMENT, EVEN THIS WILL BE TOUGH. HE DOESN'T HAVE MUCH TIME. HE'S GOT BETWEEN 8 AND THE TIME THE FOOTBALL GAME STARTS.

>> 7 HE'S GOING TO DO IT AT 7.

>> Lehrer: DOW AGREE WITH MARK THAT BOTH SIDES LOOK TERRIBLE ON THIS, THIS WAS A TERRIBLE THING FOR THE WHITE HOUSE, ALSO THAT BOEHNER ALSO VIOLATING PRECEDENT THE WAY HE DID, LOOKED SMALLER AS WELL.

>> YEAH, PEOPLE WILL JUST SAY AS THEY SAID ON THE DEBT CEILING DEBATE AND A ZILLION TIMES, THOSE PEOPLE IN WASHINGTON DON'T PLAY BY THE NORMAL RULES WE PLAY BY.

>> Lehrer: YEAH. WELL, ANOTHER THICK, OF COURSE, THAT CAME UP THIS RECENTLY WAS ERIC KANTOR, THE HOUSE MAJORITY LEADER RAISED THE ISSUE ABOUT SET-ASIDES WHICH ON HURRICANE RELIEF, DISASTER RELIEF THAT IF YOU ARE GOING TO GIVE MONEY TO THE VICTIMS OF HURRICANES, WE HAVE TO CUT THE BUDGET SOMEWHERE ELSE TO GIVE THEM THE MONEY. AND HE BROUGHT A LOT OF PEOPLE DOWN ON HIM ABOUT IT WHAT DO YOU THINK ABOUT THAT?

>> IT'S A NEW POSITION FOR ERIC KANTOR. BECAUSE IN 2004 WHEN TROPICAL STORM, HURRICANE TURNED TROPICAL STORM GASTON HIT CENTRAL VIRGINIA AND DUMPED 12 INCHES OF RAIN IN TEN HOURS, THE FIRST PERSON TO REQUEST DISASTER RELIEF WAS CONGRESSMAN ERIC KANTOR FOR HIS-- AND THEY CAME UP WITH 20 MILLION. AND WHEN GENERAL OF TEXAS, REPUBLICAN MEMBER SAID NO WE HAVE TO HAVE SET-ASIDES FOR THIS, ERIC KANTOR WAS ONE OF 127 REPUBLICANS IN THE HOUSE WHO VOTED AGAINST IT. SO HE SAID NO, NO TIME OF EMERGENCY YOU HAVE TO COME UP WITH IT. YES, HE'S RIGHT IN THE ABSTRACT THAT SHALL DID --.

>> Lehrer: YOU HAVE TO PAY FOR EVERYTHING.

>> YOU HAVE TO PAY FOR EVERYTHING. BUT YOU KNOW, WE HAVE WARS IN IRAQ AND AFGHANISTAN THAT HAVE GONE UNPAID FOR. WE HAVE ALL SORTS OF TAX DEALS FOR THE VERY BEST IN THE COUNTRY THAT HAVE GONE UNPAID FOR AND ARE OFF BUDGET. WHY START WITH PEOPLE WHO ARE KNOCKED OUT OF THEIR HOMES IN CONNECTICUT, IN NEW JERSEY AND VERMONT. I GUESS BECAUSE THEY'RE BLUE STATES. WHAT DO YOU THINK.

>> THEY SHOULD PUT A POST UP-- POSTER UP IN CONGRESS TO SHOW THE DIFFERENCE BETWEEN A MILLION, A BILLION AND A TRILLION. OUR PROBLEMS ARE IN TRILLIONS. AND TO ARGUE ABOUT MILLIONS IS POINTLESS. SO IT IS'S A PROBLEM OF SCALE HERE. WE DO THIS ALL THE TIME. WE THINK OH WE'LL CUT PAY FOR CONGRESSMAN AND SOLVE THE BUDGET DEFICIT. WE'LL CUT AID FOR FOREIGN AID, NO, THAT IS TRILLIONS. THESE ARE MILLIONS T DOESN'T REALLY MAT PER IT IS SENSELESS TO FIGHT ABOUT THE THINGS WHICH LEGITIMATE GOVERNMENT SPENDING ON STORM REPARATIONS AND WHEN THE REAL PROBLEMS ARE IN THE TRILLIONS.

>> DAVID'S RIGHT IT WAS SOMETHING WE DID VERY WELL. THE GOVERNMENT, AT EVERY LEVEL. THE STATES DID IT WELL, LOCALS DID IT WELL AND THE FEDS DID IT WELL ON THIS STORM.

>> Lehrer: NOBODY QUESTIONS THEIR RESPONSIBILITY TO DO IT.

>> NO.

>> Lehrer: OKAY. THANK YOU.

>> WELL, RON PAUL.

>> Lehrer: THANK YOU, THANK YOU, THANK YOU, THANK YOU.

>> Brown: FINALLY TONIGHT, A LOOK AT WHAT 9/11 MEANS TO PEOPLE IN AFGHANISTAN-- BOTH THE PEOPLE WHO LIVE THERE, AND THE AMERICANS FIGHTING THE TALIBAN. SPECIAL CORRESPONDENT ADAM PLETTS WAS EMBEDDED WITH U.S. MARINES IN SOUTHERN AFGHANISTAN AND PUT THAT QUESTION TO BOTH GROUPS.

>> Reporter: HELMAND IN SOUTHERN AFGHANISTAN IS THE PROVINCE THAT HAS BORNE THE BRUNT OF THE FIGHTING BETWEEN TALIBAN AND COALITION FORCES. WHAT WOULD AFGHANS IN THIS WAR- TORN PROVINCE THINK ABOUT 9/11 AND ITS CONSEQUENCES? BUT FIRST, WHAT WOULD THE MARINES THINK OF THE SEEMINGLY OBVIOUS QUESTION I WANTED TO PUT TO THE AFGHANS? JUST WANT TO ASK YOU GUYS-- HAVE YOU HEARD OF 9/11?

>> INDEED.

>> YES.

>> Reporter: AND WHAT DOES IT MEAN TO YOU? AFTER A LENGTHY SILENCE, WHICH PERHAPS SAID MORE THAN WORDS COULD, THE LIEUTENANT IN CHARGE VOICED SOME THOUGHTS.

>> THE WHOLE APPROACH THAT WE HAD COMING INTO ADULTHOOD, IT'S KIND OF HARD TO SEPARATE THAT, AS I SAID, BECAUSE WE GREW UP WITH IT AND GREW UP WITH THE SHADOW OF IT.

>> Reporter: SAR BANADAR VILLAGE IS TYPICAL OF MANY IN HELMAND-- POVERTY AND NEGLIGIBLE, IF ANY, GOVERNMENT SERVICES, TOGETHER WITH THREE DECADES OF WAR, HAVE PREVENTED VIRTUALLY ANY DEVELOPMENT. WITH THE HIGH RATES OF ILLITERACY AND THE LACK OF INFRASTRUCTURE, THE VILLAGERS ESSENTIALLY LIVE IN WHAT'S CLOSE TO A MEDIA VACUUM. AS HELMAND GOES, HOWEVER, IT'S AT LEAST RELATIVELY PEACEFUL. BUT THERE ARE STILL VERY REAL THREATS. ON THE FIRST DAY THE MARINES SET UP NEXT TO SAR BANADAR, THEY FOUND SOME 12 I.E.D.s IN AND AROUND THE VILLAGE

>> JUST A HEADS UP-- WE FOUND ANOTHER I.E.D.

>> Reporter: THANK YOU. WHERE IS IT?

>> IT'S RIGHT OVER THERE. YOU CAN ACTUALLY SEE THEM, DOWN OFF THE SIDE OF THE CLIFF.

>> Reporter: WHILE WAITING FOR THE DE-MINING TEAM, ONE OF THE MARINES WANTED TO COMMENT ON THEIR SILENCE WHEN ASKED ABOUT 9/11.

>> IT'S THAT, NOT SO MUCH EERIE, BUT UNDERSTOOD SILENCE BETWEEN EACH OTHER. IT REMINDS YOU OF WHY YOU'RE HERE AND EXACTLY WHAT YOU'RE DOING HERE. BUT SOME OF US STILL HAVE A PERSONAL VENDETTA WITH THE BEINGS THAT ROAM HERE, BEING THE TALIBAN, AND STILL CONNECT THAT TO 9/11-- I DO MYSELF. YOU KNOW, HERE COMES THE TEN- YEAR ANNIVERSARY AND I STILL FIND IT VERY PERSONAL.

>> Reporter: THE LIEUTENANT ALSO HAD A FEW WORDS ON WHAT THE AFGHANS MIGHT THINK OF 9/11.

>> I THINK, AT THIS POINT, IN A SENSE, IT IS ANCIENT HISTORY TO THEM. AND RIGHTFULLY SO, BECAUSE THEIR PROBLEMS ARE VERY MUCH IN THE HERE AND NOW-- PROBLEMS OF SECURITY, PROBLEMS OF ECONOMICS, ETC., WHICH ARE PERHAPS A RESULT OF SEPTEMBER 11, BUT FAR REMOVED, AT THIS POINT. OSAMA BIN LADEN ISN'T RUINING THESE PEOPLES LIVES.

>> Reporter: THE FOLLOWING DAY, I GET A FIRST OPPORTUNITY TO ASK A COUPLE OF YOUNG AFGHAN MEN WHAT THEY KNOW AND THINK ABOUT 9/11?

>> NO, THEY NEVER HEARD ABOUT THIS.

>> Reporter: CAN YOU SHOW THEM A FEW MORE, AND CAN YOU ASK THEM DO THEY KNOW WHERE IT IS EVEN?

>> HE SAYS, "WE'RE FARMERS, WE'RE JUST WORKING IN OUR FIELDS, SO WE DO NOTHING. WE DON'T KNOW ANYTHING ELSE ABOUT THE WORLD. WE DON'T KNOW, SIR, BECAUSE WERE FARMERS. WE NEVER HEARD ANYTHING ELSE ABOUT THE WORLD."

>> IF YOU DON'T MIND, I'VE GOT A COUPLE MORE QUESTIONS FOR THESE GUYS. I JUST WANTED TO SHOW THEM WHAT THESE PICTURES... AS YOU KNOW, WE'RE HERE FOR YOUR SECURITY, BUT YOUR SECURITY IS TIED TO OUR SECURITY. BY KEEPING THIS AREA SAFE AND KEEPING YOUR FAMILIES SAFE, WE KEEP OUR FAMILIES SAFE, AND THAT'S THE REASON THAT WERE HERE.

>> Reporter: THE TWO YOUNG MEN HAD CLEARLY NEVER HEARD OF 9/11, BUT MAYBE THE ELDERS AT A LOCAL SHURA WOULD HAVE MORE TO SAY.

>> NO, THEY'VE NEVER SEEN IT.

>> HE'S SAYING YOU JUST CAN SEE THE SMOKE FROM THE BUILDINGS AND THAT'S IT. "THAT'S THE ONLY THING I CAN SAY."

>> WHEN YOU GUYS SHOWED US THAT PICTURE, THIS GUYS SAYING, "I THOUGHT IT WAS KABUL."

>> IF I'D JUST GOT HERE, I WOULD HAVE BEEN SURPRISED, BUT HAVING BEEN HERE NOW FOR SIX MONTHS, I'M NOT. THIS IS PRETTY MUCH THE STONE AGE IS WHERE WE ARE.

>> Reporter: AND WHAT DID YOU THINK ABOUT THEIR REACTIONS?

>> OH, I THOUGHT IT WAS FASCINATING. THE GUY WHO SAID IT WAS KABUL HAD CLEARLY NEVER BEEN TO KABUL. JUST SHOWS YOU HOW ISOLATED THEY ARE, EVEN IN THEIR OWN COUNTRY. IT WAS NICE TO GO FROM IRAQ TO HERE. IT WAS A LOT EASIER TO UNDERSTAND WHY YOU'RE HERE-- YOU HAD THAT PICTURE, YOU COULD ALWAYS PICK UP THAT PICTURE TO REMIND YOURSELF WHY WERE HERE. I DON'T LIKE LOOKING AT THOSE PICTURES. I HAVEN'T LOOKED AT THOSE PICTURES. I'VE INTENTIONALLY AVOIDED THOSE PICTURES FOR TEN YEARS NOW. SO TO SEE THEM PULLED OUT HERE AND TO SEE THE AFGHANS LOOKING AT THEM, IN THIS CONTEXT, WHILE WEARING THE UNIFORM AND CARRYING THE RIFLE, TOOK ME BACK.

>> HE'S SAYING THE AMERICANS SAY, "WE'RE GOING TO HELP YOU." "ONE OF THEIR BUILDINGS WAS DESTROYED, AND HOW MANY OF OUR BUILDINGS WERE DESTROYED? AND THEY SAY THEY ARE GOING TO HELP US. WHERE IS THE HELP?"

>> I DO SYMPATHIZE OR UNDERSTAND WITH WHAT THEY WERE SAYING. YOU KNOW, YOU'RE BUILDINGS WERE KNOCKED DOWN, BUT HOW MANY OF OUR BUILDINGS WERE KNOCKED DOWN. SO WHEN YOU CAN'T EVEN FEED YOURSELF OR HOUSE YOURSELF, HOW ARE YOU GOING TO CARE ABOUT SOMEBODY 6,000 MILES AWAY? SO I CAN UNDERSTAND THAT.

>> Reporter: AMAZINGLY, IN A COUNTRY WHERE, FOR TEN YEARS, A WAR HAS BEEN FOUGHT WITH 9/11 AS ITS ROOT CAUSE AND JUSTIFICATION, IT TURNS OUT NOT ONLY WERE THE VILLAGERS OBLIVIOUS TO 9/11, BUT SO WERE THE AFGHAN POLICE, AND EVEN SOME OF THE TRANSLATORS WORKING WITH THE U.S. MILITARY. BUT YOU DON'T KNOW THE HISTORY OF THIS EVENT?

>> NO, I HAVE NO IDEA ABOUT THE HISTORY OF THIS.

>> Reporter: HAVE YOU EVER SEEN THESE PICTURES BEFORE?

>> NO, I DIDN'T.

>> Reporter: IN FACT, AFTER SHOWING THE IMAGES TO DOZENS OF AFGHANS, I ONLY FOUND ONE PERSON WHO CLEARLY RECOGNIZED THEM AND COULD CONNECT THEM TO THE U.S.'s INITIAL REASON FOR COMING TO AFGHANISTAN, AND THAT WAS THE POLICE DISTRICT CHIEF IN MARJAH.

>> ( translated ): THE TALIBAN TERRORISTS ATTACKED THE BUILDING OF NEW YORK AND KILLED MOST OF THE PEOPLE. THEY DESTROYED THIS BUILDING. SO THAT WAS THE REASON AMERICAN FORCES TODAY CAME TO AFGHANISTAN.

>> Reporter: BUT THAT POLICE CHIEF IS AN EXCEPTION. A SURVEY TAKEN IN 2010 BY THE INTERNATIONAL COUNCIL ON SECURITY AND DEVELOPMENT FOUND THAT 92% OF AFGHAN MEN IN HELMAND AND OTHER AFGHAN PROVINCES HAD NO IDEA WHAT 9/11 WAS.

>> Lehrer: AGAIN, THE MAJOR DEVELOPMENTS OF THE DAY: THERE WERE MORE SIGNS OF A STALLING ECONOMIC RECOVERY. JOB GROWTH SLOWED TO A STANDSTILL IN AUGUST, AND UNEMPLOYMENT REMAINED ABOVE 9%. THE JOBS REPORT TRIGGERED A NEW SELL-OFF ON WALL STREET. THE DOW JONES INDUSTRIAL AVERAGE LOST MORE THAN 250 POINTS. THE FEDERAL AGENCY THAT OVERSEES MORTGAGE GIANTS FANNIE MAE AND FREDDIE MAC SUED 17 MAJOR BANKS. THE SUIT CHARGED THEY MISREPRESENTED THE QUALITY OF MORTGAGE-BACKED SECURITIES. AND TROPICAL STORM LEE THREATENED THE GULF COAST WITH A WEEKEND LANDFALL AND UP TO 20 INCHES OF RAIN. AND TO HARI SREENIVASAN FOR WHAT'S ON THE NEWSHOUR ONLINE. HARI.

>> Sreenivasan: AMERICANS FROM ALL ACROSS THE COUNTRY HAVE TOLD US HOW SEPTEMBER 11 CHANGED THEIR LIVES. FIND THOSE COMMENTS ON OUR 9/11 VIDEO QUILT PROJECT. THERE'S MORE FROM PAUL ON TODAY'S JOB NUMBERS, INCLUDING HIS "SOLMAN SCALE" INFOGRAPHIC, WHICH EXPLORES THE DATA BEHIND THE LARGER UNEMPLOYMENT PICTURE. AND FOR A VERY DIFFERENT TAKE ON THE QADDAFIS, JEFF TALKS TO "GUARDIAN" ART CRITIC JONATHAN JONES ABOUT A LONDON EXHIBITION OF THE ARTWORK OF SAIF AL-ISLAM QADDAFI, SON OF MOAMMAR QADDAFI. THAT'S ON "ART BEAT." ALL THAT AND MORE IS ON OUR WEB SITE, newshour.pbs.org. JEFF.

>> Brown: AND THAT'S THE NEWSHOUR FOR TONIGHT. ON MONDAY, WE'LL LOOK AT THE STATE OF ORGANIZED LABOR, AND THE IMPACT OF 9/11, THEN AND NOW, ON A GROUP OF CHILDREN IN A SCHOOL JUST BLOCKS FROM GROUND ZERO. I'M JEFFREY BROWN.

>> Lehrer: AND I'M JIM LEHRER. "WASHINGTON WEEK" CAN BE SEEN LATER THIS EVENING ON MOST PBS STATIONS. WE'LL SEE YOU ONLINE, AND AGAIN HERE MONDAY EVENING. HAVE A NICE LABOR DAY WEEKEND. THANK YOU AND GOOD NIGHT. MAJOR FUNDING FOR THE PBS NEWSHOUR HAS BEEN PROVIDED BY: ♪ ♪ ♪ ♪ ♪ ♪ ♪ ♪ ♪ MOVING OUR ECONOMY FOR 160 YEARS. BNSF, THE ENGINE THAT CONNECTS US. CHEVRON. WE MAY HAVE MORE IN COMMON THAN YOU THINK.

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