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Occasionally we meet a person who has strong competitive drives. He wants to succeed. He wants to be out in front with dogged determination and more than moderate ability. Such a person may beat others out. He may get out in front of the group. Occasionally such a person not merely gets out in front but he gets lost. The opposite also works equally often. A person may not have sufficient drive nor sufficient ability he dressed so long to need falls behind the group he falls so far behind that he too gets lost. No one is close to him. Likewise he is not close to anyone like the man in the Bible from whom the Devils were cast out. He tries to return to normal living but he finds that there is no one who wants to be near him. So he looks about for individuals who are worse than himself and he associates with them. One problem faced by delinquent children especially if they are retired or disturbed emotionally is that they find no companionship with normal children. I believe you can see why they don't. Good parents do not want their good children to associate with bad ones.
This is the working out of the bad apples theory. As a result of this bad children have no one to associate with except bad children. The same effect is seen operating when delinquent children are removed from the community in which there are good and bad children. If institutionalized the delinquent is placed where there are no good children by necessity. All his friends and associates are like himself the best he can hope for is to be the best of the bad ones here to conduct an interview with a typical mixed up and disturbed child his father Duffy Professor of Sociology education university. He will speak from the detention facilities of Allegheny County Juvenile Court in Pittsburgh. Father Duffy. We're about to hear Jack 12 year old child who is in the fifth grade of public school at the age of eight he stole a car. At 9 he ran away from home and since then he has been involved in a series of petty thefts. He recently beat up a child in school and intimidated some other ones
with a knife he held the police to a stand off temporarily by threatening to jump out a school window and when cornered pulled a razor on them. He says he's not afraid of cops and whatever state law he has no intention of going back to school again. Jack's mother divorced his father and married another man. The boy hates the stepfather and is rather determined to have him put in jail. Father mother and stepfather are heavy drinkers after having been placed on probation several times. Jack was institutionalized in a training school after about two years he absconded. He associates with 17 and 18 year old boys and I'm sure he learns nothing good from them. He's a peculiar bizarre emotionally disturbed child who was unwelcome at home. He senses this of course and reaction a variety of interesting and somewhat dangerous ways. On her. Record when
you get like that at school you are like how many times right. What do you think that was for. Making up gigs wasn't the right track record. Otherwise it was behavior it wasn't that you were done you don't think. How come you're here this time. Meet up get you and before the last time. Last time this is the last time this is the first time you've been here this is my. Fourth time what was it the third time you. Stole some still some stock $20 bill. From a store person. She called her back. What about the second time you're here what was that store for cigarettes. What about the first time the first time. How old were you then. And what grade we. Remember. Second.
You don't really like squabbling. No. Is it because of the teachers or is it because of the material that you study them because material and that you don't like the stuff that they teach you now like a teacher so you know they were actually happy. Well you may say. One might just. I pushed again you know you. Might have a crack swarms of talking for me. So you are starting to get asked about sex. About home uses to not be home or rather be home. Well. If you have a big family or know your lifetime of no matter what and where you fit. In. The last you know maybe there. Are any of them all not to be married. Are they out of the house. What's the big problem at home do you think. I want to get my stuff in you know what. Why when you
just. Can't. Get in without your help. This. Happened to us. What happened to you. My mother. When she drinks too much. So he was a drinker. And she drinks. That right. I'm. Are these your ass just brother you know. You know not. So much pressure but so what.
The stuff. So he takes off her starts one. Star swatting. One in your room. So each one on a Mac. Mr household. Sister. Even the girl. How does that make you feel. Live in a house like that. You know. What. I think in her way you kind of like her. You think about the first one you ever liked. Then you're like anybody else. Haven't you found anybody likable. I mean do you like them as well.
Yeah yeah. Yeah. Yeah. And you have friends here for the first time. They start I start. How much do you weigh. So you have a lot of fight for your side. What do you like. Do you think you'll ever. Now I'm done with you. Why have you ever been a reformatory place like I've been there for two years but for three weeks vacation you back. This is when she's just like you do.
From different. Have you done any stealing outside the home. And what do you do with a smile. And when you do for money your dad does is very generous with her money. Different places get picked up for that. Not yet. Yeah. I still I got a new car. I must. So when you know it is trouble. And when you go Who are you with somebody else where you or your brother help you. Yeah. Is he. He has got to be over here the youngest one.
Is it pretty much the same throughout the rest of your life you won't be paying for things. Yeah I think pretty. Everything is wrong. But it's not your fault. Thank you for. Stopping the shirts and I don't want things just. Oh yeah our stuff sucks. Well. So now I took questions. So he was so so so so. I was just reporting. What do you think is the worst thing you've ever done. You haven't told me about the worst thing. Still for you.
I saw. What was peeling me real fast time. And you were able to do this. Greg Stone What was the scariest thing happened to you Jack. And what was the saddest thing. You can go. From here at your side because you can you know. But I thought you said you were going to go and. I'm going to glean what happened. This year. Let me be like anybody. Else. Yeah. Who. I like my sister. I like. I just got stabbed. So I come
from but the place was copper she wanted to know. So I tried but didn't get what you. Sew. So most of. The things are things from 20 people. So. And so my mother. She. Doesn't know yet. She said she says it was. Rough on. Him but it's a pretty angry House. They sang. And so was I so I was I was getting ready for them so much. Observers take turning the story straight.
I. So I don't. For the street sure you know. So. So what did he tell you. Had so many gotten. So if your problem was. So the start of just me I know Mr. Washington. So Mr.
And so I just asked even Carpi she wanted and said Cash pressure was so so so much. So my step son. My sister's husband picked me up you know. So policeman seemed to play a big part in your life especially. Exciting. So I get a summer comes on the tensions and the trying to got crush on. Her. Going to church on Sunday. She How come. My friend Brad and. I never talk to the doctor psychiatrist. I want to psychiatry work. Have you ever got the ones who are just wonder what you
think. When asked about something. You know she's sure she already let me go. There isn't much but I think it. Might be better off. Talking before I met my friend's ass for anybody ever like you or love you. Your viruses spells or stories. So yes yes. I. I went there every night Larry. Genes are wrong. We're good too. I look. To the every go through the motions. And have you
tried only drinking it. Yes. Every car I can get you fired. Yeah. I was counted out here some Planet Money and some kid you got some money thanks to a way of life. Yeah some kid statues some of find out how much you think it is. To do and. After a lot of money. That any big people are scary. Besides cops. Right. Clearly not crap. I don't tell you. Crap has blander. Yeah you lost your cars. You ran from the upper front of darkness after the second time. Yeah can I just not and chose not to confront him. I. Think I have. I try.
Thank Senora's room for what you are getting. Your Muslims in this evening. So. Yeah it's true I was never I wish to know. You were the first round I know I don't smoke. So so he says. So I was. So two years later. These were kids so and so sucks on the kids blowtorches. Yes trust when was this for. Sure for about cursing out a tree. First
yours first. ST one cares tree. You look to your wish you were anybody else you know. I think it's about time for you to go to bed now shower and go to bed. Want to go out. About eight years ago when Jack was just 4 years old he was referred to the juvenile court on a petition of neglect. I thought time he was a mild timid somewhat fearful little boy. His father was institutionalized for alcoholism. The mother told the boy that his father got sick from staying out in the rain and that she had to move. So the two youngest children were placed temporarily in the detention home facilities. Subsequently the mother divorced the father and remarried. We're now going to listen to Jack at the age of four. You'll see how he responds to attention and affection. If you send out love to him he sends love back again.
It's always a mystery to me that people can send out hostility anger fear hatred suspicion criticism and sarcasm and expect to get love in return. The point is what must have been sent out to this boy during the intervening eight years. He's now sending back what he receives and it's not a pretty exchange of feelings to listen to. As you saw he hates his stepfather and all his family. He's threatened several of them with a razor. He would like to see them all in jail. He hates school and says that he's finished with it. He's not afraid of cops. The psychiatric appraisal of Jackie is interesting but will postpone giving you that until you first heard the same child at the age of 4. I feel that the clue to understanding this boy lies in what happened in the family during the eight years that elapsed between these two interviews. If we knew what went on we would be better able to understand the child who had such a high potential and promise as a little fellow if we understand him better we may better help him to understand himself and help
him to become a little more accepting of himself and those around him. At the moment he's a sort of triggering device he's nasty and mean to others. They're nasty and mean to him. Here then is Jackie age 4. I want you and you're going to Europe for three weeks. Nineteen days you were counting how I'm doing here and how you came here. Proud of what. How about you mommy. She moved away. Can you tell me what's the nicest thing ever happened. Jackie. Well. Now Dan you know it was a good thing
right there. That's very nice to hear them here. OK. In Florida. Your father and I don't have that right. I love you and you because I think you are a very nice boy are you. Yeah I met you. Is it nice at home. No way. I do feel lonesome when you're here. Yeah and how does that feel has it make you feel. Me. You Mommy where you know me. We saw her today.
She came and we know you will sing. Then I'm going to room and you say mommy. I want you. I'll I'll play out of here. Outside Yeah you know. Where you were and what we was then I'm in this house. We are not out. You know you got me mixed up. I don't know where you are. And what's curious in those you think. Butterfly scary when out. Warning. Yeah you know what I want to do when you bite their biters it. How about this thing that ever happened.
Never happened. And that's it. You know. But I'm not in that White. When you like something. You know I love me. Yeah. Mommy. Who cried. Anybody.
I want my kid. You choking back you choking tears back. You want to cry now. You can cry the moment. OK. If you're trying you don't cry and cry a lot of people cry. You think you're a good boy or a bad boy or what I think you're right. And when you grow up I'm going to be. Oh I see. And what is a woman going to be a lady. So.
Every think of what you like to be when you grow up to be and then what will you be an older man and a lady or just a lady that you like to be a lady when you grow up. What do you think. Would you rather be a lady and a man or you better be in there. You have me mixed up I don't know what you want if you ever have scary dreams. I didn't do well the other part which is part of this is a listener. I think we learned everything from you that we care didn't we. When you're 3 years old 4 years old. OK we're going to take your brother now and then afterwards we'll have the two of you together.
Jack is the kind of boy for whom it is impossible to do anything at least as a layman. Medical and specifically psychiatric help is needed by this child. All we can do is recognize and refer it would be helpful to see the psychiatric evaluation on Jack in part it says this. We have here a healthy sturdy unkempt boy of 12. He is hyper active and impulse ridden. He engages in Rapid Fire talk his observations are illogical irrelevant and out of context. He is cheerful and raucous. His talk is disturbed threatening incoherent and is marked by inappropriate giggling. He is self centered. He is a manipulator who seeks his own way. Taking no account of consequences for his actions. Such a child can of course start up our sympathy. But the danger potential in him is high.
One should never postpone the inevitable. The boy needs medical help. Nothing would be gained by hoping that he can make it without such help. You have been listening to exploring the child's world. A program in which the child speaks. Father Francis Duff a professor of sociology at Duquesne University has conducted the interview with the child and to find the outlines of this world in the summary that followed. I am. This is been a production of the radio service of Duquesne University in cooperation with U.K. and sociology department technical director Fred McWilliams program director and announcer our older man. Listen again next week for another in the series exploring the childs were in.
Exploring the child's world III
Psychological profile
Producing Organization
Duquesne University
WDUQ (Radio station : Pittsburgh, Pa.)
Contributing Organization
University of Maryland (College Park, Maryland)
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Episode Description
Jack, 12, is sturdy, unkempt, hyperactive - an impulse-ridden child with rapid fire talk, illogical comments accompanied by inappropriate giggling.
Other Description
Interviews with delinquent and disturbed young people who are encouraged to discuss their experiences and express feelings. To protect individuals, each program is a re-creation of an actual interview using different names and places.
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Producing Organization: Duquesne University
Producing Organization: WDUQ (Radio station : Pittsburgh, Pa.)
Speaker: Duffy, Francis
AAPB Contributor Holdings
University of Maryland
Identifier: 64-5-11 (National Association of Educational Broadcasters)
Format: 1/4 inch audio tape
Duration: 00:29:18
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Chicago: “Exploring the child's world III; Psychological profile,” 1964-02-20, University of Maryland, American Archive of Public Broadcasting (GBH and the Library of Congress), Boston, MA and Washington, DC, accessed August 16, 2022,
MLA: “Exploring the child's world III; Psychological profile.” 1964-02-20. University of Maryland, American Archive of Public Broadcasting (GBH and the Library of Congress), Boston, MA and Washington, DC. Web. August 16, 2022. <>.
APA: Exploring the child's world III; Psychological profile. Boston, MA: University of Maryland, American Archive of Public Broadcasting (GBH and the Library of Congress), Boston, MA and Washington, DC. Retrieved from