The Line; 105; LaDonna Harris

SRT Captions File Generated by MXFplus >> : A CENTURY'S OLD BATTLE

>> : A CENTURY'S OLD BATTLE AND NEW OFF-RESERVATION INDIAN OPPORTUNITY, TO DISCUSS WE'RE UP NEXT. >> : EDITOR AND PUBLISHER OF MARGARET MONTOYA, PROFESSOR JOHN DENDAHL, SYNDICATED HARRIS, FOUNDER AND PRESIDENT OF CAUCUS, AND MEMBER OF THE

SEEMS LIKE SOVEREIGNTY IS UP AND WE'RE TALKING ABOUT THE AND WHETHER THAT IS SOMETHING >> : WELL, IT'S NOT -- IT'S IT'S JUST VERSED -- IT'S JUST JOHN'S ARTICLE IS ONE OF LIKE THE ISSUES THAT YOU GOVERNMENT OWES ITS TRIBES AND THAT IS NOT A SOVEREIGNTY AND IF IT WAS A BANK OR ANY INCARCERATED BY NOW. BUT SINCE IT IS THE FEDERAL I MEAN, IT REALLY IS ABUSED >> : JUDGE LAMBERT MIGHT

BUREAUCRAT IN JAIL. TREASURY SECRETARY IN CONTEMPT PARTS, AND YOU CHALLENGED THE NOTION OF INDIAN SOVEREIGNTY AND TALK ABOUT THAT FOR JUST A THAT COLUMN WAS THAT INDIANS AND AND I MADE THE POINT AT THE INDIANS, MAYBE NOT A MAJORITY, WHO BELIEVE THAT THIS WAS PARTICULARLY, THE TRUST STATUS STATES ON COMMON GROUND. SPECIAL STATUS BECAUSE OF OUR HISTORY WITH THEM, IF YOU WILL. THERE OUGHT TO BE A DEPENDENT SOVEREIGNTY, WHICH IS AN

>> : YES. STATES. THAT'S WHAT IT WAS DISCRIMINATE ACCORDING TO THEIR >> : LET ME CONTEXTUALIZE IF OUR FOCUS IS ON THE U.S., IT IS REALLY GLOBAL AND HEMISPHERIC. >> : NO OTHER NATION HAS BUT WHAT WE DO HAVE NUMBER OF NATIONS THAT ARE NOW AMENDING THEIR CONSTITUTIONS IN ORDER TO RECOGNIZE THE SPECIAL NOW MAKING A DECLARATION -- OR IN THE PROCESS, I MEAN -- AS HAVING A DIFFERENT STATUS.

>> : WHEN I BROUGHT THIS UP POINT THAT I WAS VERY ANNOYED BY, AND I STILL AM, IS THE CREATE THIS WHOLE DEAL AGAIN, FOR WHATEVER NATIVE HAWAIIANS ARE. BY RELIGIOUS DISCRIMINATION. THE TESUQUES, WHO WANT TO KEEP PEOPLE OFF THE SANTA FE SKI PETROGLYPH DISCUSSION BY VARIOUS AND WE CAN'T ALLOW A ROAD CLIMBERS. VATICAN. PHYSICAL ENTITIES TO GO AND WORSHIP, MOST OF US.

AND THAT NATURE, IN EFFECT, THAT'S WHAT WE IDENTIFY WITH, SO THAT'S WHAT MAKES THE IT IS NOT A DISTINCTION IT IS JUST THAT WE DON'T HAVE >> : AND WHAT YOU SAID IS FREE EXERCISE CLAUSE OF THE THE ESTABLISHMENT CLAUSE, BUT HAS RECOGNIZED THAT AND SAID, WE HAVE NO INTENTION OF INTERFERING PUEBLO, OR ANYBODY ELSE IN THEIR RELIGIOUS PRACTICES. SACRED, AND THEREFORE, WE ARE DOCTRINE THAT IS REALLY INVOKED BECAUSE I THINK THAT WHEN WE PETROGLYPHS, I THINK THAT MANY

SAY, "WAIT A MINUTE. DIRECTION. THEREFORE, AND I THINK -- SEEING A $176 BILLION CHECK BOTHERING YOU IN YOUR COLUMN -- QUITE A WHILE OF SOMEONE YOU HAD A LOT OF COURAGE TO IN THE INDIAN COMMUNITY? >> : OH, THEY WERE APPALLED. HIM WAS AT A MUTUAL FRIEND OF OURS. FRIEND AND GOT STRAIGHTENED OUT

ARTICLE. LET'S SAY I HAVE THE MAGIC WAND, I WAS GOING TO SAY, OKAY, WE'RE GROUND. STARTING WITH TREATIES AND -- >> : -- THE LAW OF THE SORT OF GOING ALONG WITH WHAT JOHN WROTE. MEANING THERE ARE A LOT OF ACTIVITIES THAT GO ON ON THAT THE ISSUE THAT YOU'RE ADVOCATING IT JUST SEEMS TO ME IT IS >> : IT'S ALWAYS BEEN GRAY. CAME TO BE HERE, AND WHEN WE

THEY DIDN'T WANT US TO BE I'M VERY SYMPATHETIC TO THE OF THE HISTORY THAT'S IN THE >> : COBELL; SORRY. SO I TRIED TO CLOSE THAT THIS ISN'T GOOD FOR ANYBODY. >> : BUT THAT'S WHAT THE WE'RE GOING TO PUT YOU ON A YOU'RE GOING TO BE BETTER OFF. GOING TO BE BETTER OFF. MENTALITY. YOU'RE NOT MAKING PROFITS OFF

YOU THINK OF IT IN A ALL MAKE PROFITS OFF OF IT? HAS CREATED THE SITUATION. TRUST LANDS, WHICH BEGAN WITH IT SORT OF LIKE DISAPPEARED ON THE INDIANS OVER TIME. EVEN IF ELOISE COBELL IS OFF BY A FACTOR OF TWO, IT IS STILL SOVEREIGNTY IN THE -- >> : IT'S ACTUALLY BRINGS ABUSED IT? >> : THIS IS A CASE, JUST IN EXCHANGE FOR LEASING IT AND WERE ALLEGEDLY NOT EQUIPPED TO

DOLE IT OUT TO THEM OVER THE COLLECTED -- WELL, IT'S BEEN CASE. SO FAR, THE INDIANS HAVE BEEN BECAUSE THEY NEED SOMEONE TO >> : TO THE 1897. AT LEAST A THIRD OF ALL OF AND THAT'S WHAT THE >> : RIGHT. IN THE LAST MINUTE, WE ARE >> : I JUST THINK AFTER NINE OF RECORDS LOSS, AND THREE, YOU WERE SAYING --

BUT WHAT HE SAID IS, LOOK, LORDS, WE ARE GOING TO LORD OVER AND IF WE DON'T LIKE WHAT WE >> : BUT IT'S THE FINALITY, >> : THAT'S ANOTHER CASE. >> : BUT WHEN THE CASES GOOD FINANCIAL SHAPE. WE'VE GOT THE CHICKEN FLU COMING FOR US. THERE ARE BILLIONS AND THE FEDERAL GOVERNMENT CAN AFFORD A PROPER SETTLEMENT. STATES, CITIZENS THAT I ARGUE MONEY, THEY WILL JUST HAVE TO

IS, ALL OF A SUDDEN, THE INDIANS GAMBLING. >> : BUT LET'S BE CLEAR AND OF THOSE, PROBABLY 200,000, BECAUSE 300,000 HAVE SUCH DIMINUTIVE CLAIMS. >> : RIGHT. FINALITY, I WAS REALLY MEANING MISUSE PROCEDURE. >> : YES. >> : AND THAT'S WHY I DON'T TOWARDS THE COURTS, OR THE >> : AND APPEALING EVERY >> : I'LL BET YOU THAT THERE COURTS ARE IN ANY BETTER I'M NOT INVOLVED IN THE

THAT WAS MY FIRST THOUGHT WHEN I WHAT ARE THE COURTS DOING PEOPLE, COULDN'T GET OUR >> : YES, THEY ARE. >> : IT'S A GREAT STORY. UNWIND EITHER IN THE CONGRESS OR JUDGE LAMBERT HAS JUST BEEN THE INTERIOR DEPARTMENT AND THE >> : AND THIS IS JUST ONE THE REASONS THAT I WAS TALKING THAT IN DOING ALL OF THOSE CORPORATIONS WHO WERE DOING POPULATION.

AND SO THAT THIS IS A LONG, EVEN IN THE CLAIM. THAT'S OUTSIDE. >> : NOW THAT RELATIONSHIP, INDIANS, THE SOVEREIGN POWERS, HAS CHANGED DRAMATICALLY BECAUSE LOCATE CASINOS ON THEIR BUT DOES THAT GIVE THEM THE ANA COUNTY COMMISSION HAS VOTED STATE, 200 AND SOME MILES FROM >> : THAT'S RIGHT. >> : NOW, THE JEMEZ HAVE IF THEY GET THEIR DUCKS ALL SET

UP IN A ROW -- I DON'T KNOW WHY ON THE OTHER HAND, I DON'T CASINO IF HE WANTS TO HAVE ONE. A CASINO ON IT, THEY HAVE TO GET AND IT IS A DISCRETIONARY ACT. SHE CAN EITHER DO IT OR NOT. THAT'S THE STANDARD. IT'S IN STUART PAISANO, THE GOVERNOR OF THE SANDIA PUEBLO, THEY'RE AGAINST THIS. HERE REALLY ISN'T. CASINO IN THE STATE, HANDS DOWN. WHAT ARE YOUR THOUGHTS ABOUT

OF BRINGING RESOURCES TO GOVERN. I DON'T LIKE THE LOTTERY. THAT WE DO. THE LAW OF THE LAND. AND NOW WHAT WE'VE DONE, BY MEXICO ON RESERVATION, THE WHOLE STATE HAS GONE INTO GAMBLING. SO I DON'T REALLY HAVE A COUNTRY. HAPPENED IN THE PAST. >> : YES, AND THIS HAS BEEN IN CALIFORNIA AND OTHER MOVING THOSE PRIVATE LANDS INTO TRUST STATUS, AND IT SEEMS TO THINGS THAT WE WORK WITHOUT IS

CONTRIBUTE TO THE STATE, WHETHER IT'S THE FEDERAL DOLLARS THAT >> : WE KNOW THE PERCENTAGE ONLY THING WE KNOW. ALWAYS GOTTEN OUT HERE WITH A ALBUQUERQUE. PUEBLO ITSELF. FUNDS FOR A COUNTY OF 15,000 PEOPLE. THAT'S PRETTY GOOD DIVISION. MISSISSIPPI CHOCTAWS -- OF GAMBLING. PROBABLY THE SECOND TO THE TOP, IN MISSISSIPPI. WELL, THEY JUST SAID, OKAY, REMEMBER THE BOATS THAT CAME MISSOURI RIVER.

DON'T WANT TO HAVE -- THEY CAN'T HAVE GAMING FOR THE STATE, >> WAS IT MANNY ARAGON THAT PROPOSED GAMBLING ON THE SANDIA? BOTHERED ME ABOUT THE LACK OF KNOW THE POSITIVE IMPACT THAT NO ONE HAS SAID -- THERE WERE THIRD OF THE REVENUE IS TAKEN IN BY SANDIA AND ISLETA, RIGHT HERE THE REST OF THEM HAVE GOT TO THESE ARE NOT PEOPLE WHO ARE ARE LOOKING AT CONSTRUCTING A THEY KNOW THERE IS ONLY SO MUCH MONEY IN STATE. A 220-ROOM HOTEL.

HOW MANY RESORT HOTELS BASED >> : WELL, WE HAVE ENOUGH FOLLOW -- >> : AND THE ENTERTAINMENT IS DOING -- I MEAN, SUDDENLY, I THAT -- OF COURSE, THE STATE HAS SUCH A CONCERN ABOUT TOURISM, RIGHT? >> : TOURISM IS THE BIGGEST THAT'S RIGHT. THIS STATE. FACE WE WANT TO PUT ON THIS THING? >> : WELL, IF YOU ASK WHERE THEY HAVE SURVEYED PEOPLE,

THE DIFFERENT TOURIST -- >> : WHATEVER; THOSE LITTLE SECOND FOR INDIAN CULTURE. >> : -- SUDDENLY, AS THE INTO -- INVEST. AS THEY SHOULD HAVE BEEN DOING ALL ALONG, HOW IT SHOULD BE SPENDING ITS TOURIST DOLLARS. >> : SO GAMBLING AND TOURISM IN THE LATE EIGHTIES, AND WHEN I TOURISM PORTION OF THAT FROM SANTA FE, A LONG-TIME FRIEND OF MINE. SEVERAL OF THE TRIBES -- THE

INDIANS HAVEN'T HAD AN AND IT'S ALSO NOT TRUE THAT AT LEAST SOME OF THEM HAVEN'T DONE SPECIFICALLY INVITE PARTICIPATION BY THE 19 PUEBLOS, >> : SO ARE GAMBLING AND THESE DAYS? REALLY DEPENDS ON WHAT NEW FALLEN THROUGH THE CRACKS. >> : YOU'RE PROBABLY RIGHT INTEGRATED INTO THAT WHOLE SO THAT SOMEBODY ON IT HAS REPRESENTATION. GOING TO USE THAT IN THE TOURISM

IF YOU'RE GOING TO WANT TO LOGICALLY. THE INDIANS IN TOURISM EFFORTS EXCLUDED. AND I STILL REMEMBER WITH HE SAID, "THIS WAS ANOTHER ASKING US, DO WE WANT THEM TO WEREN'T EVEN ACCESS ROADS TO THE PUEBLOS. GET EVEN ON THE HIGHWAY. OTHERWISE, THEY WOULD HAVE >> : WE ALSO HAD TO HAVE A THAT RUNS BOTH WAYS. TOURISM EFFORT IN THIS STATE,

IT'S GOING TO GO TO FIVE I WORKED AT FORBES FOR SIX VERY EXPENSIVE. OUT THAT THERE WERE 14 SPONSORS. STATE?" WE DON'T KNOW WHAT IT COST THE LITTLE AD, HERE IS THE AD >> : THE GOVERNOR'S OFFICE ADVERTISING -- BERNALILLO COUNTY, ECONOMIC -- COMMISSIONS. AT CROSS-PURPOSES TO TRY TO INTERNATIONAL P.R. AND

STATE'S TOURISM BUSINESS. ONE OUT OF LONDON, AND BUT WHAT'S GOING TO HAPPEN AT TO PLAY THAT. WHAT STUFF WILL BE CONSISTENT. PROFESSIONALS BEING SENT IN YOU'RE THE TOURISM CZARINA, WHAT >> : I DIDN'T KNOW WE HAD A >> : YES, WHAT DO YOU DO AS IS GAMBLING THE ANSWER TO MULTI-CULTURAL ELEMENTS OF THE INDIAN PUEBLOS. >> : ARE WE EVER GOING TO BE I THINK THAT'S KIND OF SILLY. >> : WHO WANTS TO?

ATTRACTION, AND EVERYONE COMES HERE FOR EVERY MULTI-CULTURAL AND NOW WITH THE EXPANDED AND SANTA FE. WITH VEGAS. IT IS ALSO SAID, CAN NEW MEXICO COMPETE WITH ASPEN AND BECAUSE THE GUYS IN THE EXAMPLE. OPPORTUNITY BETTER THAN TAOS. >> : WE'RE OUT OF TIME. E-MAIL US AT THELINE@KNME.OR CROSSWINDS WEEKLY