¡Colores!; 1401; Albuquerque's Historic Neighborhoods; Interview with Henry Aceves

Let's make this stand up, we need to take this underneath your shirt, bring it up, actually this will be easier this way. Take the scanning connector in through here, pull it down your shirt, pull out the bottom and we can hide the cable. It's here, tell me your name, and let me finish what we're getting there. Tell me when you first came to this neighborhood. My name is Henrias Sebbas, I basically came to this neighborhood in about the middle of 1965. I was a freshman in college at the old college of the University of Albuquerque rather at the college of too many years ago, I can't remember, we'll do that again. What was that? College of St. Joseph's. College of St. Joseph's? Yes, that poor St. Piasis now, he used to be college of course, college of St. Joseph's and then it became the University of Albuquerque until about early 1970's.

Right, let's also mention it. Stop tape? Yeah, if you could just shut up. That's nice, Chris. So tell me what your name is and tell me about your history here in Albuquerque when you first came to Old Town instead of shop? My name is Henrias Sebbas, I came down to Old Town in about the middle of 1965, I was a freshman student at the University of Albuquerque up on the west side and I came down with a friend who had actually been down to Old Town quite a bit and I just fell in love with him immediately. I saw the arts and the crafts under here and at that point I was a leader. My father was a Tumaio Weaver, all his life and I learned how to weave when I was eight years old and I thought how nice it would be to be able to come to a place like Old Town and make our own product and sell it directly to the public.

So I became very enamored to Old Town at that point. Fantastic, all this stuff there. I'm going to ask that question again, if you could basically come to the same thing, just for seeking our end. So tell me about, you know, tell me your name, tell me about, you know, expenses, expenses where you were born and moving to Old Town, you're reduction in that and so on. My name is Henrias Sebbas, I was born in the county of Florence in the Monzano Mountains on the school in Eston, San New Mexico and in 1965 I came to Albuquerque to go to the University of Albuquerque. At some point during the fall of 1965 I came down to Old Town with some friends who liked Old Town, I really fell in love with it. I was an artist at the time because I grew up weaving, I was eight years old when I first learned to weave to my own blankets and my dad had been a Weaver, all his life.

So I felt that it would be a nice place to be able to sell our product and at that point I really felt that I wanted to have a business in Old Town and I started working towards that goal. What year did you start open the doors for business or did you take open the business? I actually opened my own business in 1973 so we're going to be celebrating our 30th year this spring. Could you tell me that one more time but tell me where it was to open your business? In 1973 we opened our first business here in Old Town, it was called a Sevis Weaver. I had three looms in my shop, I was actually weaving during the day and taking care of customers. It was a small shop located upstairs in a location that wasn't the best in Old Town and so we started looking for a larger location in a better location and at that point we found something that was a little closer to the plaza and I started weaving selling our own products.

I don't know. I think they got off track. That's good. Probably a little bit about, this is one of those bigger questions, let's stop take place. I think in the 30 years that I've been here in Old Town it's changed considerably. In 1958 it became an H1 zone or historic zone. People got together and felt that they wanted to keep Old Town as it was many years ago and I had helped tremendously but even though we're very restricted as far as what we can do but we can build even as far as colors that are used. I think it's good because it keeps the old charm, the old integrity intact here in Old Town. But it has changed, it's developed quite a bit. People come here of course from all over the world and because business has increased over the years, development has come in somewhat.

So what do you see? I can only imagine that in 10 years, 20 years there's going to be none of the people who had lived here for 50, 60, 100 years ago, families have owned the plaza, they'll all be gone. Talking a little bit about it. Well I guess basically in 1706 when the church was founded it was actually founded as a living community, as a church with small little homes and farms surrounding the plaza and the church. Of course it's evolved from that into more of a business district, I guess with the onset of the tourist industry it developed around the church where more and more shops have developed. So it's changed from more of a living community to more of a business district. I guess in the last 30 years that I've been here, that's probably the biggest change is that the locals are gradually either selling their property or leasing it out and moving out of Old Town and so there's been some development.

And there's really not a whole lot of property that can be developed within the H1 historic zone so I think that as far as that is concerned you're not going to see a lot more development but I think that you will see what few people are still living in the H1 district will probably move on and turn their homes or property into shops and you know you can say that's good or you can say it's bad, Old Town is actually the center and the jewel of Albuquerque itself and I think with a thriving retail wholesale development going on here I think it's really good for Albuquerque especially if they can keep the flavor of the old world or the old time. Fantastic. It's nice. Very, very good. Thank you very much. It's through the slot paper, second place, but you got it. And in so far as that what still makes it a neighborhood.

Church. Are you ready? Yeah. Okay, we're good. Ready. Old Town still is a neighborhood because we have San Felipe then at the church so it is a living church, a living community, a living neighborhood even though there aren't as many people that live within the H1 zone which is only like about a four to six block square area beyond that boundary is still considered Old Town so the church is the center of the activity for Old Town and because of that there's daily mass of course you know there's weddings and funerals and baptisms and first communing so that brings the local people within the Plaza and the H1 zone. There aren't as many people like I said earlier living in the H1 zone but that doesn't mean that it's not a community. We're going to stop down for second place.

Okay. Rolling. Whenever I'm starting with second place. When I refer to the H1 zone and I'm talking about the historical zone in 1958 there were several people that were very instrumental that went down to the city and wanted to keep Old Town pretty much the way it was in the past, wanted to be able to control exactly how buildings were built if new construction came along or how they were painted, how they were reconstructed and I think it was fantastic that they did that because you go to other historic sites and they've changed and once they change you can never take them back to what they were before so if I use the term H1 I'm talking about the historical zone. Got it. It's not played. Let's talk. As we hurt a lot further into this new century what changes do you see we're coming up on, what changed do you see Old Town is facing, what's going to happen here?

Well our roots go quite deep here in Old Town, my great grandfather actually settled in Old Town right around 1850. He showed up in the first census that was actually taken by the United States and he was shown as a property owner and he also had employees. Now it didn't go into detail of course it just said he was a property owner but I would say from 1850 to the present it's changed tremendously. This was the beginning of Albuquerque when the railroad came I guess that was the biggest change for all of Albuquerque because all the commerce started going to the east to the railroad. Old Town kind of became re-acquainted with business probably in the late 50s when it became a H1 zone.

Artists started moving into the area selling their crafts, restaurants were established, tourists not only tourists but the local people started coming down to Old Town to shop and to die and so gradually it's become more of a unique shopping experience. I think that in the future because of the H1 zone it won't change a lot as far as the buildings are concerned which is great but I think it'll just be a busier place as far as commerce is concerned. People want to visit historic sites usually when like if our family goes anywhere the first place we go to is to the historic areas and I think that's good for Albuquerque. They won't change a lot as far as looks but as far as people wanting to come here I think it's going to be fantastic. Thank you. That was a real comfortable with that. Do you want to do that again?

No. That didn't sound bad. If it's okay with you that was alright. Well I'm hearing edits already so we can make it work. Let's talk about, I like to get a good stop tape for a second, I want to get a nice spot. Well of course when Albuquerque was founded in 1706 I would say that all of the people lived within the confines of the plaza basically for protection. They had their homes and their small gardens within that stop point second place. In 1706 when Albuquerque was founded they built their church and their plaza and I would say that all the people lived within the close proximity of the plaza basically for protection. They started farming and ranching of course but their farms and ranches were extended away from the plaza basically towards the river so that they could irrigate and so there was a lot of farming and a lot of ranching.

As time progressed the railroad came in and the city began to grow and towards the east the whole town kind of just became a sleepy little plaza again and then that's fine we haven't been able to do that. As microphones are so sensitive that they pick up airplanes and things very well so just think of them just like the day the river is going. So do you get the sense that this is still well-intentioned, the church is still still pretty active part of the community? Definitely. Because a lot of people I have talked to and as pie just just pure chance that the people I have talked to the quote unquote old-time research neighborhood they don't quote that church neighborhood. To talk about these different churches. Well you have to know the church and really be a part of it as we are, we're parishioners and I belong to the finance council. All the Catholics from here basically attend church here.

He was just very incredible when we were talking about the river point level town. He hadn't been here long enough and maybe he hadn't been. I think it's maybe about seven years within, plus, isn't like that. Well the thing of it is, and talk to me about that. Well you know again old town is very different. It is a living church, a living community but it's evolved into a retail center where there are probably 150 stores here in old town and you have to be very sensitive to your community and to your church. If you're not from here, it's hard to say well we have to basically shut down during the three days of the old town in Fiesta. So there is kind of an animosity at times between the merchants and the church. But like I said, if you understand the church business wouldn't be here in old town at this

point if there wasn't the church. So you know you want to have a good business and you want to have tours coming in. Why did they come to old town? Because this is the center of Albuquerque, this is where it was founded, this is where the plazis is and this is where we have a beautiful church and the people come to see that and along with that they do their shopping. So you really have to believe that it is a community and kind of work with the community. So let's talk about the symbiosis that exists between the merchants and the church. Again, let's talk about that because you started talking about the fact that a lot of people on the businesses here are not from here and let's just talk about the reality of that in Albuquerque. Well, basically if you're not from here, it's hard to understand the church and really the churches in Fiesta that is celebrated the first weekend in June and for most merchants there are a bit put out, there are barricades, restricting traffic to the plaza of old town

and usually it is kind of the slowest weekend business wise, although it's the busiest weekend people wise, but that's because the local people are come out to their church Fiesta and so the merchant thinks that they're kind of put out and they shouldn't have to be. In reality, like I said earlier, if it wasn't for the church, they wouldn't be here with a business. Let's stop down for a second, please. So what do you think a neighborhood is? It's hard to say exactly what a neighborhood is for me, I guess, I guess, you know, being that I'm a Catholic, I would say a neighborhood, a Catholic neighborhood is where your church is, where your home is, where people live, where they go to school, where they can take care of business, do their shopping, possibly even have a business within their neighborhood,

I guess. I would say that's a neighborhood. So having said that, that makes this neighborhood here really very dynamic, doesn't it? It does make it dynamic because you have everything here. There's the church, the school is actually within the confines of the H1 zone, there are shopping centers, hotels even, whatever you need, you can basically find it within the H1 zone or within a block of the H1 zone. Is this the best neighborhood town? It's a wonderful neighborhood, I personally don't live here, but it seems like I have because I've had a shop there for 30 years and day in and day out our business has been open every day of the year, 30 years. As a shop owner though, I mean you have obviously a very good sense of this area as both the neighborhood and this business district.

What's your filling zone? Well as a neighborhood you can go back to the original family of Albuquerque in 1706 and still find descendants of families that were the founding fathers. So a lot of the old families still live either within the H1 zone or the hotline areas. And so for them, old town is their home and it's a very, very important part of the city for them. As far as merchant is concerned, it is turning more towards merchant-oriented area. A lot of the locals are moving out and their shops are being converted into business businesses. And I guess that's good because they choose not to live there if they own their own properties they can lease them out for pretty good money and so in turn they're making money attitude. Excellent.

I'll just turn on this here when everyone talks to her. Oh great. I would like to talk a little bit about, can we stop for a second, stop? Historically, describe this neighborhood at its worst and at its best. A difficult question is to describe this neighborhood at its worst and at its best. I think at its best is the fact that it became an H1 zone where you really can't alter it as much as one might like, but then at its worst is when somebody is trying to do whatever they want and going against the H1 guidelines or there have been people in the past that have really taken that H1 too seriously and have really been over zealous as far as trying to restrict what is being done in the history of, for example, if a person wanted to paint their building as simple as that might sound, they've got to go before the landmarks committee to get permission to do it.

A lot of minor things I think ought to be able to be done, but yet they still have to go through the process of securing equipment to do them and so sometimes that seems a bit cumbersome. Talk to me a little bit about, I don't want to talk about the Church so much, but I mean, the neighborhood of merchants here, is that even, can that even be said, can you even call it a neighborhood of merchants? I guess you can call all town the neighborhood of merchants because their basic goal is one and that's to make some money. So the merchants have had to unite or the last series of decades, I guess, you could say that there have been different types of disasters, it's not all, you know, fun and games as you might think and making money.

Old town has really had to work and unite to bring people to Old Town, either through advertising or trying to work with the State Department of Tourism to help to bring not only the locals into Old Town, but the tourists. You know, if you don't have the tourist money or do it, stop saying, let's take that one again. I know I will be able to come back to do it the same way, but no, sorry. You're talking about the merchants of Old Town being a community. I think that they basically are, they've had to in order to survive. Over the years, business hasn't been what it was at one point. You know, we've had a lot of natural disasters and the economy hasn't been the greatest and so they've had to unite, they've had to go to the city to try and get support from the city as far as advertising. They've had to go to the State, to the Department of Tourism and show a united front and

try to work together not only through advertising, but just in doing their own promotions. Great. Let's start taking a second place. Let's talk a little bit about, talk to me about that, can't that picture for me? Well, I'm talking about Old Town and how unique it is. It definitely is. I mean, if you go back to the old days when the album was first founded, it was a small community. It was farming and ranching community. It's evolved from that to more of a business community when the railroad came in. A lot of that went away, but as it became more of a tourist arts community, it's kind of changed. It was quite a living community. We've seen most, a good percentage of the residents move out and see more development in Old Town so that it has become more of a tourist destination.

Little on with that, we've seen a lot of development, not a lot within each one's own, but a lot very close to the each one's own so that the Old Town area, I'm not talking just about the historic area, but beyond the historic boundary, it is quite a thriving community. There's big business. There are hotels. There are a lot of business, a lot of technology that has come about. So, we've seen it go from the little sleeping village to really a center of Old Town, center of Albuquerque, and it's keeping up with Albuquerque and really the nation. But we're glad that we have the each one's own that kind of brings us back to a reality check and kind of shows us what it was like a long time ago. Right. Let's talk tape, please. Anything?

In 1972 is when I basically started my business. We had a booth at the Spanish village in at the State Fair and that really wanted, really opened my eyes towards wanting to sell my own product in Old Town. I'd always wanted to do that, but I never thought that I could and after 1972 I started coming down to Old Town and in 1973 I just made the big move. I said, I'm going to start my own business and sell my own product. And so, I've seen Old Town evolve a lot, simply because of my business and my customers in old days. One second. One second. Instead of personal, I'd always make money. Sure. Sure. You could take it from it in the old days. In the old days, I had a small shop with three looms and looms and I would sit there and I'd weave all day long. It was great because I could talk to the customers on a one-to-one basis. But as our business grew, I got to the point where I was no longer able to weave, but we

still had contact with the customers. And that was a great feeling in the world to see people come from not only our own country but all over the world and to talk to them, to listen to them, to find out what their customers were in relationship to our customs here in Old Town. And so, that was pretty neat and we had customers from, like I said, all over the world. As our own business grew, we lost that one-to-one contact and I really have missed that over the years now. It's been nine years since we built Plaza de la Lleise and once we did that, I was unable to continue leaving. And so, my fondest memories have always been of my mother and my father actually helping me in the store. My father was, like I said earlier, he was 72 years and when we built Plaza de la Lleise, I named it after my father, Luis Aceves.

But his greatest pleasure was to sit down in our Plaza and talk to the customers or whoever would listen to him. He would tell him stories about the old days and how he will evolve all his life and those are the things that I miss about Old Town. Fatemites. Good. That's wonderful. I think we're good. Thank you very much. Great job. That's a wonderful interview. Let me get my sister in line. Let me stop tape. Let me get my sister in line. Let me stop tape.