At Week's End; 529; Year in Review

. . . . . A season finale looked back at the Royal economics, politics, and social developments of the past few months in New Mexico and the nation, and a look ahead at what Thomas is to be an unquiet summer, next on it weeks in. .

. We devote our final program of the season to a freewheeling discussion of developments in the headlines over the past few months and some behind the headlines. Joining me are two veteran observers of New Mexico and of the nation at large. Kate Nelson is political reporter for the Albuquerque Tribune and Kathy Robbins is an independent reporter based in Albuquerque. Nice to have both of you back. I thought we'd cover the water front today and really try to get some judgments and perspective on what's happening in New Mexico and the nation. Let's start with the economy, which was big news for this state and for the entire country over the past several months. Are we coming out of the tunnel here, Kathy? It's actually a stop and start situation. Things seem to get better and then there's a little bit of economic news that shows it's worse and I think it's true nationally.

Housing starts in April. It's a good example. They plunged after having gone up. I think in New Mexico there are some forces at work that really could have a great effect and I think one of the first ones is the conversion of the labs. Interestingly enough I spent two hours last week with the Japanese ambassador of the United Nations. He was in town and I was a tour guide for him in Old Town and around Albuquerque and he asked about the labs and I genuinely feel that if this conversion takes place the way it could take place, that private enterprise might be more willing to come to Albuquerque because there could be a greater diversity of activities of research and development activities at the lab that could have good spin-offs in the private sector in Albuquerque. But do you see that happening at the labs? Not probably not quickly enough. I think some of the best reporting on this was done by Bill Broad of the New York Times who came in a few months ago and did a superb story on that. Not only within the labs but on what the activities of the scientists are, the changing activities of the

scientists as some of them leave the labs and go into their own businesses both in Santa Fe and Albuquerque and he covered several of those businesses in that story. It probably isn't happening fast enough. I think one of the things we have to look at at San Dia is there going to be a replacement for AT&T? Do the labs need a private or a corporate entity there? Having a corporate entity might make it easier for them to go into a civilian conversion. Probably they can run on their own if they're running for so long. Kate, how are ordinary folks doing in New Mexico? What's your sense of the tribune of the economics of the home front here? Not doing very well. When we sent reporters out to a number of neighborhoods to ask questions about the election, the big issue is the economy, is education, is health care. There is a bit of a breathing space in here at least for human services department. They seem to have dodged the bullet on the Medicaid and general assistance cuts, but they're going to have to find some money to make that up.

And if the economy doesn't improve, they will be looking at having to modify their programs next year because there won't be enough money for them. APS is cutting back drastically. They need more money desperately. It doesn't look like we're going to have it next year. And will the taxpayers take another tax hike? That's going to be a tough one. I was just going to ask, where is it going to come from? We've got a governor who pledges never to raise taxes. We have a legislature that may or may not to agrast the nettle here. Where are we going to get this money? Because they're borrowing against the future. We're borrowing against the future. There are efforts going on once again to look at tax equity to do some restructuring in their figure out where the money is. And one hopes look at better places to redirect some money. At some point, they're going to have to cut back on state government. It is one of the biggest employers in the state. Maybe it's the biggest now. And meanwhile, public school kids are losing programs. But it's one thing to cut the welfare roles. It's something else to cut state employees who vote. Not something that politicians do willingly.

Kathy, it isn't only the state that's in trouble financially. Cities are in trouble, aren't they all over the place? Yes, I took a tour of some cities in southern New Mexico. Of course, Albuquerque's financial problems that made big headlines. $8 million shortfall, mainly because of the state legislature taking back a cent of gross receipts tax. Well, that action, of course, affected cities all across the state. And I visited a couple of months ago with the mayors of Carlsbad and Hatch and Las Cruces. Three rather different cities in size and in composition and in political makeup. And some of the strongest comments I heard about the condition of our cities came from Bob Farrist in Carlsbad, who's a conservative Republican. And he said since the Reagan administration, he listed some of the funds that the cities have lost. His city lost sewer funds, B.O.R., revenue sharing. Those are never coming back. And he gave me a very bleak outlook for the future. And it was interesting to hear that from someone of his political makeup in his size city.

His city did restore the eight cent tax by simply levying the tax again. But he told me that he had been in a televised conference with President Bush. And he told the president in that conference along with other mayors what the cities were feeling. And he told me if Bush doesn't do something about Los Angeles and New York, we won't have to worry about the rest of the world. And this was before the LA riots, of course. Even before. And that's a Republican talking. This is a conservative Republican, South-Eastern New Mexico. In Hatch and in Los Cruces, the same kinds of concerns hatch this tiny little agricultural town. Very nervous about the impact of the trade pact. Very nervous about what's going to happen to their cotton growers. Already seeing the impact of a more porous border with colonialists, forming right around Hatch. They had to build a new school to take care of.

I hope you will say over and over. The border in effect has disappeared in many ways. What's the solution, Kate? Are there any creative answers out there to deal with this fiscal crisis? I haven't heard any. But that's desperately what we're in need of. I think that's what the voters are saying and supporting parole. Some of the messages that Brown and other of the dropout Democrats were talking about a reinvention of government. And if you look at the plight of the cities now, at the relationship between federal state, city government, at our relation to our foreign countries, something's got to change here. The business as usual is not working. How that's going to happen is so radical. It's going to be so drastic that the repercussions, they're frightening. It makes people drive their feet. Well, in theory, it's supposed to happen in part at the polling booth at election time. Let's talk about politics because everything you've said, of course, is haunted by that. Beginning with the reinvention of government in Albuquerque, we have a mayor here who is under threat of recall. Is he going to survive this recall and does it matter one way or the other?

What do you think, Kathy? I think it matters because it's going to change in 1993. I think a recall will be very expensive, not only financially, but just in terms of the drain on the city's psyche. I think that's the right word. It's going to happen in 1993. I can't imagine him being reelected unless the other candidates are so awful. That could happen. We call it the case in Mexico. But will they get the signatures, Kate? What do you think? The conventional wisdom is that they'll hit the polling locations on Tuesday and get all the signatures they need then. And if there is an anti incumbent voter turnout, probably those people would be very happy. The right people to sign a rehabilitation. So the prognosis for Louis Savaydra is a limited tenure of whatever happens here. But then what about the curriculum mayor hasn't had a limited tenure? Yeah. But not academic, is it that we've got a crippled mayor either way in his last year in office? No real movement on important issues on the agenda. Well, Ruben Smith, of course, has faced or is facing.

I'm not sure where that recall movement is now in Los Cruces. And when I was visiting with him... What is brand new? He's brand new. I mean, what? Year? Less. Yeah. I asked him and the other mayor on the political scene locally, both in terms of legislative races and other local races, are there any mavericks running? Anybody out there in Ruben Smith, he told me, he says, not even mavericks are going to run for office anymore. They can't stand the ridicule. No one can stand this ridicule. Are we looking at an endangered species here that is elected officials? The legislature obviously is going to have a terrific turnover. We've got a lot of voluntary retirees, but maybe some involuntary as well, don't we, Kate? We have a number of troubled incumbents who are facing what we've been calling credible challengers. The primary ones that races people are looking at are Senate Democrats, like gallery, Tom Rutherford, and Shannon Robinson is facing a challenge. Less Houston, a Senate Republican, is also working very hard. These are formidable and familiar names.

Long time names, you know, between them probably hundreds of years. Or at least it seemed like hundreds of years. What are the possible implications here? Change in the seniority, picking order, obviously. Change in committee assignments. Any change in leadership? It's a very big change. Tito Chavez has said that he wants to be Senate President. I imagine we'll see challenges from other people, even newcomers that might want to post it. In Santa Fe, I think CB Trujillo, that race could have a tremendous impact because Trujillo had 13 years in the state Senate before he was defeated in 1980. The signs up in Tows County, where I was just a couple of days ago, return CB Trujillo to the Senate. And he's winning the signs war. There's a possibility he could challenge the current Democratic leadership in the Senate because of his long live leadership. But here's an old established politician. Couldn't be more of a club politician, writing the crest of this anti incumbent wave. That's a kind of irony, isn't it? It's ironical, but if they are going to take the tack that voters seem to be saying

that we want some more accountability, we want some more credibility, okay, I can handle that. You can flip on that issue. And I think that there is enough of a sentiment, and there will be enough of a turnover in the Senate next year, that will see more of a sincere effort on those sorts of reform measures. I'm already hearing from some incumbents who are not being challenged that they're fed up with the seniority system. We're not using our talents as wisely as we could be using them. At some point, they've got to listen to the public. And I think this is the year they're going to do it. Well, I hear the media blaming the leadership, especially in the Democratic Party, which has this large majority after all in both houses, for the inertia, for the failure of reform. But speaking of leadership, we have a challenge to the governor, some question about whether we have a governor, I guess. There are still critics who wonder what Bruce King is up to. But Senator Roman Mayes of Santa Fe has already announced his intention, at least to explore a race.

Still rumors out there about Congressman Richardson and Ray Sanchez, the Speaker of the House, and others. We're going to have a Donnie Brook in the Democratic Party two years from now. I hope so, if you're refreshing change in this election. It would be nice. I don't know. I mean, I can't imagine too many people inside the Democratic establishment that don't see a need for change. It's just that that change is going to cause such a dislocation. It's a dislocation that's required not only in terms of the political parties, but I think there needs to be a real systemic change throughout state government, throughout local government, throughout national government. But is this going to come before we get fundamental and rudimentary campaign reform before we can control the power of money and politics? You know, Bruce King rode into this third term for better or for worse on more than a million dollars. He is one of those politicians who can raise that kind of money. Very difficult to dislodge anybody, whatever their record, when they've got those kind of resources. In this system, as it's presently constituted.

Well, I mean, look at the incumbents in some of the legislative races, including people like Ray Sanchez, and all the incumbents and Manning Outer going. All well-financed. Yes, and taking a look also at the first congressional district, Robert Adagone, also well-financed. It's up to the voters to say no. If they don't say no, it will continue. A year and a half into this King administration. What's your candidate appraisal? Is it an effective governorship? Is Alice King running the show here? I don't know. She's running the show, but she's certainly making her presence known. I would probably give him mixed marks. I think that one of the things this state needed after her father's left was someone who could be more of a consensus builder. And certainly Bruce King is that. He has had some success in some areas that get it right. Children, youth, and families department. However, we have yet to see whether that program is going to work.

He still has a lot of campaign promises. He has not delivered on the education governor education system. The environmentalists still feel very betrayed on a number of issues. Have to go hat in hand to the governor's office to get things. And I have no development. How much have we seen in that area? There's a lot of work to be done. And not a lot of time to do it. And Bruce King's style is not a maverick style to come in and force big dramatic initiatives upon the chambers. He will be working more slowly and remains to be seen. I think it's without question that a change, and therefore a challenge to Bruce King, the Democratic Party, would indeed be traumatic. He is a popular and highly respected figure. And whatever one thinks of his governing style, that's going to split that party and the state right down the middle. The governor is also a product of the state, though. A product of New Mexico. That was very evident in this rather fiasco trip to Mexico. I did some investigating and found that no one in state government

had bothered to call the Mexican specialists at the Latin American Institute at UNM for instance, for a briefing. Many of the people who went down did not speak Spanish. Ruben Smith and I talked about that trip. He found out about it in the Albuquerque Journal. He read about it in the Albuquerque newspapers. And there he is an hour from the board. I was told by a high-ranking source on that delegation that that trip was a veritable disaster. The governor was not prepared and didn't perform very well. In the meetings no one was prepared. The Mexicans were rather taken aback. The other thing is though, but I want to say that's a product of the state. I think in some ways the state doesn't know what it wants in economic development. There's all this talk about a north-south positioning of the state between Canada and Mexico and having that trade flow. But New Mexico's greatest product is its brains, its R&D technology. That's an East West transaction with Asia and Europe. So that in a sense the state is running counter to its own opportunities

and its own strengths. But the state government, per se, is not taking the lead on any of these issues. Reconversion or the orientation. Is there any redress at all in the federal delegation? We've got a congressional primary race going on now in the first district in Albuquerque. Any chance that we're going to get any new blood at the federal level? Well Richardson tried to take the lead on this Mexican trip. In fact it was his trip. It was not an official state trip. But once again it's that north, he's pushing that north-south thing where maybe we ought to be looking at the East West trade a little more carefully. Domenici continues to do his thing of breaking ground at the labs for yet another federal military contract. I mean it's like putting the needle into the face. Yeah, someone said it's like the old dope peddler who keeps supplying the junkie. And we keep holding our arm out there for the next federal military contract. It's a sad spectacle.

Kate, any new bright faces in the congressional primary races? Any new potential? The Democratic primary has a really interesting field. In the first congressional district Steve Schiff's seat, it's very questionable though whether any of them composed a challenge to Schiff. He has a big war chest. He's reasonably popular. He has taken actions in the past that will help him stave off the anti-income but through the bump out business giving up that pay raise three years ago. Minimizing his bad checks. Exactly, exactly. But in addition, the Democratic primary has been very quiet. I was telling someone today at the candidates all over the ballot had spent as much time yelling at each other as they had yelling at me. It would have been an interesting campaign. Are the voters just still turned off in this state as they have been for a very long while? I don't see any excitement out there. Do you know no real enthusiasm? Very low voter turnout. I was just talking with the county clerks office and they've had about half as many press reps into ballots as they normally do in a presidential year.

I think it's not only that they're disgusted but they feel very detached from the system. They don't understand it. They don't know if he's running. They don't know if there won't make a difference anymore. Well, let me suggest one guy who's going to be running. It probably in certainly in New Mexico and in most of the nation, Ross Perot. What's your judgment, Kathy Robbins, about his prospects here and in the nation? I talked to Ray Powell this morning, of course, as a chairman of the state Democratic Party. They take him quite seriously. They're upset that he's intruding into the primary process. On the other hand, I went to the Clinton rally a couple of weeks ago. I saw one Perot sign, a hand scrolled, nothing very organized. Apparently there were no Perot turnouts at the Jerry Brown rally. So it's hard to tell. I mean, he does have four offices in New Mexico. I did see signs up in Northern New Mexico for Ross Perot. But it's hard to gauge. I don't know if there are any polls, private polls being taken in the state. In the end, it doesn't make much difference because New Mexico is at the small state.

I think Perot is going after the big fish in California and other states in Texas and Florida. So I'm not sure how much of an insight. He is very popular here. There have been some polls down the last one. It is somewhat dated by now, but at that point, he looked good against Bush and Clinton. And the support for him is there. It's growing. It's deep. And the people are out there working. They've finally been given an opportunity to get into this political system that they felt detached from for so long. And there could be a lot of benefits in that. If the traditional party machines figure out a way to channel some of that support to themselves, maybe they could rejuvenate. But how ironic. I mean, here we are alienated from a system that's corrupted by money. And we're about to turn to a billionaire businessman who says I've got $100 million to squander on the election if I need to. And whose ideas, after all, may be interesting in novel and some respects and rather undeveloped in others. Is there a real sense that Ross Perot would be good for New Mexico? I mean, here we are.

It's just say a little anarchy wouldn't be good for the system at this point. It's not working the way it is right now. Who knows what he would do? He has been so cagey about when he came down on any position. And the conventional wisdom again says that will be his downfall when he does begin talking about positions. But he's a good old boy. He's got that Texas twang and that Texas air about him, which after all many of our fellow New Mexicans had in this state. And like the whole state of New Mexico, he's a defense welfare case. I mean, you know, that's where he made his money. He was on defense contract. There's empathy right there. I mean, we've been living off defense contracts for 50 years and so is Ross Perot. I mean, he should be right at home here. Well, any of these politicians at any level make any difference to the kind of ongoing, sometimes quiet. But nonetheless, omnipresent crises in the environment in this state. We're fighting battles in the north and in the central part of the state. Gold mines and the Ortiz mountains, the Santa Fe ski basin development. All sorts of problems with the PNM power line.

They're trying to push through the the Hamas. And it does another boiling and bubbling issues in the environment to pollution and Los Alamos environmental hazards here and there. Where are we going in this state? A kind of slow poisoning of ourselves regardless of political developments? I think that there is enough activism on the other end of that. The PNM line isn't through yet. The wilderness bill for the Hamas, I think, is still alive. Although it's going to face a very tough course. So far, we've done okay. But given the economic situation, the temptation to cut corners on the environmental end in order to boost economic development is going to be sorely tough. I saw that. I was in Chaco Canyon on Monday. As you know, when you look at the visitor's register, there's been for decades this battle. Pave the road. Don't pave the road into Chaco Canyon. And the battle seems to be drawn between among the out of stateers. They're the ones that do the battle.

But there was one interesting comment that I saw on Monday. Pave the road. We need the jobs. And it was written by someone from New Mexico. And that was a comment on the economy versus the environmental. Well, I'm not sure you can call Chaco Canyon environmental issue, it is. But it's more of a cultural resource. Well, it's often an uneven battle between the citizens groups that try to pull together expertise and some legal help, usually pro bono. And the large corporations that do make the economic argument, we need the power. We need the jobs, et cetera. But jobs obviously have an effect, don't they, on this, unfortunately, all two topical subject of social unrest in America. They had an impact on the riots in South Central LA. Do either of you see any prospect of unrest in New Mexico over this summer of 1992? I think a lot's going to depend on what happens with the Reginald Denny case, the white track driver that was beaten so badly. And South Central LA might not go away as quickly as watched it because of that case. That's going to keep South Central LA.

And the whole question of racial relations in the headlines and in the news for months. And in some ways, it might be a good thing. I think the Rodney King verdict among whites was quite a shock. And it's causing many white people to take a second and third look at criminal justice and social problems, leaving aside the aftermath. In terms of unrest in New Mexico, I think that's going to be a matter of gang activity. I heard somewhere that the last six homicides in Albuquerque have been gang-related. But that's here. That's a plague here. That's with us. And that has racial connotations and social connotations. And I get it, they're spreading north. It's not just Albuquerque. They're into Santa Fe and into some of the communities of the north. And they've been in the communities of the South. And while I was in Las Cruces, I think it was a high school and mid school student was shot. And it was apparently gang-related. Kate, I'm reminded that June the 5th is hard to believe. The 25th anniversary of the raid on the courthouse in Tierra, Amaria.

A memorable event in the history of ethnic relations and civil rights and racism in New Mexico. Racism still alive and well in the land of Enchantment. Sure, it's alive and well everywhere. And I don't see anything, any one addressing it, trying to make it better. And no one addressing the old issues of land and a general disenfranchisement of... That's true. It's almost a quaint historical story. You hear about it now, particularly the courthouse raid. That it's sort of something that's right under the surface. There's the race problems here in New Mexico. And in many states, and it rises to the surface in LA or in New York. It's not a problem here. We don't need to address it. And when I was at the Clinton rally, and there were a number of Hispanics who were upset about a perceived snub, not getting a visit from Clinton, some of the comments I heard was, it's not just L.A.

And it's not just blacks. It could happen anywhere. It could happen here. The force is just beneath the surface here. Just a few... Not so far beneath the surface. I saw a billboard on U.S. 64, a couple of days ago. Tieta, omwete, June 5th, land or death. I mean, that's still alive up there. It's still alive. It's not under the surface. It's right there. Right there in a billboard. Just a few seconds left. Some predictions. Let me get you out on a limb. Who's going to carry this state in November? Let's assume that it's a pro-Clinton Bush race. Kate. No way. No way. No way. I think it's... I think it's... Even the experts won't put their names on that. Kathy Roberts. First of all, I don't think Perot's going to last. I think the press is going to rip them to pieces. So it will come down to Bush and Clinton. And in that case... I can't get either one. No, I can't. It's going to be up for grabs. Will there be a major challenge to Bruce King for the governorship in 92? Will it begin to develop over the next few months? As it must, it seems to me if the timetable is going to work for any challenger.

And he had a major challenge in 90. It has to happen. There's dissatisfaction in the state. We have a lot of problems. And the person who's the head of the ship of state is going to have to answer for that. On that note, we'll look ahead to the excitement. Thank you very much, Kate Nelson and thank you, Kathy Robbins. And thank you for joining us. Thank you for joining us this season for it weeks in and for all the wonderful producers and support people here who make this program what it is. I'm Roger Morris. For a video cassette copy of this program, send $29.95 plus $3 for shipping and handling to,

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