New Mexico in Focus; 500c; 30 Days in Santa Fe, Week 5

Major funding for in focus is provided by the McCune Charitable Foundation, enriching the cultural life, health, education, environment, and spiritual life of the citizens of New Mexico. After seven years in office, it comes down to this, a stale mate in the final days of the final legislative session for Governor Gary Johnson. Tonight on a special presentation of in focus, we'll ask Governor Johnson and Democratic leaders whether compromise is possible or if it's time to start planning for a special session. Hello and welcome to in focus, I'm R.C. Choppa. Perhaps it's true that fate does have

a sense of humor or at least a sense of irony. For many of us, this Thursday is Valentine's Day, but for lawmakers in Santa Fe, it marks the end of the 30-day legislative session. But while roses and romance are the order of the day, elsewhere chances are there will be little love loss between the Governor and Democratic lawmakers. Last week, Governor Johnson vetoed a $3.9 billion budget that the Democratic control legislature sent him and chances for a second budget bill that will shortly be delivered to him don't look much better. So will the Governor's veto pen replace Cupid's bow and arrow? No one knows better than Governor Johnson himself and he joins us from Santa Fe this evening. Governor, hello.

Hello. How are you? Well, I'm doing fine and it does look like my veto pen is going to replace Cupid's bow and arrow. Oh, it is. So no chance to compromise at this point? Well, compromise at this point is spending more money than what we have and I don't think the people in, I don't think the citizens of this state want to see tax increases next year. I don't think the people in this state want me to be a part of putting this state into what I would consider to be a potential financial crisis next year. So the latest Senate bill that you received is not going to work for you either? Again, I haven't received it yet so there's still time to fix it but as it stands right now it is my understanding that there is little that has been changed and if that's the case why, yes, I would probably veto that bill but I have until March 20 to do that and I am going to carefully analyze the bill and we're going to carefully look over the options that exist with regard to the bill.

From what I understand it includes 19.5 million in projected Medicaid program savings about 3 million more savings than the vetoed bill, how does that stand with you? Well it's, again, it does include a little bit more that's not enough, again it is my belief that next year you might be looking at $100 million in new money for Medicaid unless we address this problem now and I think that it does need to be addressed and clearly the legislature doesn't, isn't doing that, they're not going to do that, that's clearly the message that they've sent. And you seem a little like a day's ago, are you feeling depressed at this point three days or how many days left from the session that things aren't going to get worked out? Are you looking at a special session? Well I'm not looking at a special session, no. What we're looking at are alternatives that have never been tried before, now again we're looking at all those alternatives right now. Government shutdown is not a possibility in my mind that should not be anyone's end result here, but clearly the legislature is unwilling to address this problem.

So if I'm a little lax at Asical, a little depressed, it's the fact that I think elected representatives are elected to make tough choices once in a while and Democrat legislators aren't doing that at the moment. So you have 48 hours left I've been told for this legislative session, what do you hope will be accomplished? I know that the budget is the main priority but I understand that your drug reform bills have also received a lot of, or have looked at a lot of broad blocks too. Yes well again I think that this has been a very, very unproductive session for the legislature and at this point I hold no hope whatsoever that really anything of any substance comes out of it at all. It is a budget session, first and foremost responsibility for the legislatures to pass a budget doesn't look like they're going to do that and how as governor can I sign off on a capital outlay bill if they haven't in fact done the budget, it's like eating dessert before you eat your vegetables and I think they need to eat their vegetables here.

So you're only going to look at a $50 million savings in Medicaid, that's your bottom line. Well we're looking at bottom line is that we bring these recurring expenses down. The budget that I built, the budget that I vetoed, had $80 million in new recurring expenses that were being funded out of our state savings account. That is not a way that you and I would conduct our own households. It would be like buying a new house and saying that gee we have enough in our savings account to make payments for eight months after we buy the house. Well no we don't make those kinds of financial decisions and as a matter of fact nobody will even loan us money if that's our decision making. You know what we've got here if I sign off on this budget bill is we would have tax increases next year. There would be a lot more expenses than there would be revenues next year. So if we're looking at no budget and no special session are we looking at government shutdown?

No I don't think that that is an option and that's not anything that we're contemplating at this time. Okay well let's talk about some of the bills that have been discussed in the past week for example the APS split are you for that are you going to sign that bill? I'll keep an open mind with regard to the bill but of course what needs to happen if you're going to split is you're going to have to see some economy in that. I think that the state has two larger districts APS one of them I think we have two small districts so a consolidation of that whole process the overall result is to pay less for school administration. Is this APS bill going to do that at this point we haven't looked at it to determine whether or not that happens but that would be my criterion for signing it would be that it accomplished some efficiencies. Right you also want to create a new governor appointed secretary of education you think

that's going to happen this session again at this point I'm not I'm not optimistic that anything is going to come out of this legislative session by having this by having this belief maybe I'll be pleasantly surprised by a few things that they do but at this point I'm not again I don't have any expectation at all. Well you have to have a balanced budget so when do you think that's going to happen if it's not going to be in a special session? Well again these are these are we're going to be looking at alternatives that have never been looked at before clearly I'm not going to call back the legislature if they're not willing to address these problems and they're not willing to address these problems. Right well this is this is your last session and you seem really depressed this is probably the most depressed I've ever seen you I mean what I'm not depressed I'm not depressed I'm not happy I don't think people should be happy with the way that their finances are being treated up here we've only got we're one of a handful of states that don't

have to cut back we should be we should be very happy for that you know that the city of Albuquerque and the state of New Mexico really the finances have been running congruently city of Albuquerque is laying off hundreds of workers we're not doing that well that's not by mistake RC we've managed things differently here at state government I'm not going to leave I am not going to leave the state in a situation where that where those things happen next year they're not going to happen this year I mean I could make this easy on myself but I'm not going to do that I wasn't elected to do that and my first obligation here is to myself this is something that I very much believe in and I would be again I wouldn't be able to sleep at night with myself if I were to let this budget pass that they that they that they overspend well let's change the subject your thoughts on what's happened to your drug reform bills well again I think they are common sense

approaches to reducing death disease and crime I think that overall we would spend less money in the state of New Mexico we would offer treatment for those that needed treatment so we would provide better education in the area of don't do drugs we had a lot of senators this year who changed their mind from last year saying that they weren't clear whether legalizing marijuana for medical use violated federal law and I think that that was the big factor this year that that changed a lot of the particular Republican senators the opposite direction well I'm a firm believer in states rights the states are the laboratories you got 50 laboratories going on for better government and the federal government takes the lead from the states here it is we're going to somehow take the lead from the federal government I don't buy into that and bottom line a person who's suffering from cancer but that individual might find relief from marijuana and currently are finding relief many

are finding relief from marijuana do we really want to lock these individuals up well under the laws that we currently have these people are criminals I think these people should be afforded that kind of relief I think again I just think it's common sense and we're criminalizing an activity that is happening anyway here we are about 90 seconds away from the end of this interview and the home stretch I guess if you will of your tenure and your term as governor your thoughts at this point my thoughts at this point are see that I hope I go down as my fingernails in the carpet as I'm leaving this place I'm not going to leave this place in in shambles and that's my pledge and right now this budget that I have before me leaves the state in what will be fiscal shambles all right well governor thank you so much for your time today and I wish you the best the next 48 hours yeah happy Valentine's day likewise what do the Democrats have to say about chances for compromising with the

governor will find out from speaker of the House Ben Luhan and senate majority leader Manny Aragon next together my next to guest have a combined total of 57 years of service in the New Mexico state legislature only they can tell us whether the last seven years under governor johnson have been their most challenging but as leaders within the Democratic Party they have often found themselves at odds with the governor and this year is no different joining me via microwave link from Santa Fe our representative Max Cole chairman of the House appropriations and finance committee and senator many at a gun senate majority leader thank you gentlemen both for being with me today you heard the governor he said this has been the most unproductive session he's not optimistic that anything will be accomplished especially since you're not making the tough decisions that need to be made so that you don't face a financial crisis next year do you think that might be the case you know

I don't think that's the case at all I think we're trying to work out a responsible budget we're working real hard on it and you know we've moved at least halfway towards the governor now it's time for him to make a move towards us if we're going to compromise this and get out of here why I think it's his move next senator Aragon how do you see his comments saying that you're not making the tough decisions that need to be made well you know I think the the New Mexico legislature has responded well to the economic circumstances in Mexico faces we are blessed that we won't that we don't have to cut tremendously into progress and I think that our finance committees and House appropriations have approached the problem prudently and conservatively and we all know that revenue projections are usually addressed in the middle level and they're higher level so a $19 million roll of the dice to protect health care for the people of the state of New Mexico especially it's most vulnerable

children and adults with serious illnesses is as hardly anything to be concerned about at this time I think that what we want to do is get out of this session and do little harm that look forward to the future when all things will improve well from what the governor was saying it doesn't sound like he's going to approve this latest version of the budget I think this is a Republican plan and he says there's no special session and if there's no government shutdown how do you balance a budget when is it going to happen well you know that that is kind of a peculiar way to respond or see because you well know that if he does beat to it we're going to have to come back to avoid a government shutdown so perhaps I think it's a real telling story that he does see a lot of good things in the budget and that he may be able to surgically go in there and veto some portions of the bill which the legislature has taken into consideration and given him opportunities to do so I think that that's a telling statement and we'd have to go to look at it carefully do a surgical veto if we see if we see fit but otherwise I think it's a very

positive statement for him to make that we're not going to come back here well he mentioned several times that they were going to be looking at or he's going to be looking at alternatives that have been looked at before do you know by any chance what he's talking about and if not representative Cole do you know what he's talking about you know I'm not clear boy and I can't read his mind I don't know what he might have on his mind he's the better one to ask that question if he wants to play coy I don't think that's the way to do it I think everyone needs to say where they stand where we need to try to reach the compromise and I think the the legislature is working real hard to try to get there do you think the citizens will be looking at a tax increase next year if you don't pass the kind of budget that he wants to pass which is what he said you know I don't know what our revenue supply will be next year I don't know how well we'll recover from the recession nor does the governor I think we all hope that we'll be in full recovery by then and we'll have a nice upswing in our revenue picture but we don't know nor does

the governor senator oughta gone is there a possibility that you would consider tightening eligibility requirements for Medicaid well I mean there may be a possibility of doing it at the higher level from 25 to 185 but right now that doesn't that doesn't do much I mean all we gain in that particular situation is somewhere between four to six million dollars and that is a good to solve anything we need to strengthen our health care infrastructure delivery system and your Mexico not only look up for the health care needs of our people but make sure that we hold on to the infrastructure that we have our medical personnel our nurses our support technicians and our hospitals and our clinics throughout rural New Mexico so I don't I don't see us moving much further than where we're at right now and like Max said it's time for the governor to fess up and move our direction for once well you've got 48 hours to to to enter the session and he said that this has been the most unproductive session he's ever been to do you

agree with that or do you think that some things have been accomplished well under the circumstances that we have I think that trying to get 112 people to to agree as a heck of an accomplishment and so far the last budget I think was was approved with significant support from both sides of the aisle and I assume this one will have the same support so it's easy to be one person criticizing 112 I think my hat's off to to Max and just in the trunk even I don't know our finance people for being able to conjure up the gym majority in showing the support that they have from a bipartisan group of the New Mexico legislature. Let's let's change the subject for a moment and one of the big issues that that was discussed late last week and early this week is is the option of splitting up APS do you think that's going to happen do you is there support in the house and senate for this. You know I see some support in the house I think APS is too big I think that the capital funding has always been in trouble the height seems to kill any proposals

that will put schools in the valley and we need to split it up so that people are kind of in charge of their own capital outlay their own property taxation issues and I'd like to help them do that. Senator Atagon now you know I see I go back to my pickles river uh senator uh participation and look that if you know we always do what you've always done you'll always get what you've always gotten and the best way to predict the futures to create it I think it's time for APS to be broken up and to give people an opportunity to help shape their own destiny and to manage their own finances and and money to remain available to put their kids through the best educational system that they can conjure up so I would hope that there's enough support in the state senate to follow the house's lead to change things and change the status quo in New Mexico and especially in the APS system. Do you think it'll increase the bureaucracy as one legislator had said?

Well I would hope not because I think the parts of the APS system especially from Iraq, home in the south valley are looking seriously at getting management help from companies such as Aniston out of New York and another alternative that would be available so hopefully we'll get the opportunity to look at those rather than stare down the same old dark hole. Well can you can you split the district up at a cost savings which I think the governor would probably sign it at that point if you could. Well RC you know that sort of have to be investigated this is going to be done overnight and even though I think Max and I support it of course we're going to look closely and to our Department of Education to check the finances and double check and do and do some performance based measures on what's going on here but all in all we think that it will be more efficient and more more up to keep up with what people need in those areas that are being affected by low productivity right now. Drug reform bills. They didn't seem to go anywhere this session. Are you surprised about that?

Well I mean they did a lot better last year you know I'm happy to at least have the asset forfeiture bill in the house and and we do have a couple of bills that are maintaining some interest. I'm really kind of disappointed in the medical marijuana bill because there are people who could use it to improve their quality of life while they get treated for serious illnesses but all in all you know I just probably was predicted to predictable as a result of Republican opposition or altering and prior to the session that that whole program is pretty much locked out before we even got a chance to discuss it openly in the legislature. I don't know Max feels about that. How do you feel about that? I think that we need to encourage the courts to get people into drug rehabilitation programs. I think our courts are doing that fairly well with drug court but we need to put more money into rehab because I think that you can't ever punish anyone out of a habit. There's just no way to do it. You have to try to help them get out of it with

rehab programs and you know I speak from experience. I'm an alcoholic and I've been dried out for many many years. I quit drinking in 1964 before I ever started in the legislature. Well we have about a minute left any final thoughts or we had it for a special session or? Well let me just say that the Republicans in the House have proposed the budget bill that would cut four and a half percent across the board. We don't need to do that kind of drastic surgery. It would cut some 24 million out of the university budgets. It would cut great monies out of the public school system and they say that they they would go for a Medicaid at the same level if we do that. This is House Republicans that are proposing this and I think it's a bill that is fairly absurd. Is that about a gone final thoughts? Well I'm here and I think we all came in here to make sure that very little harm is done by any of us. The governor included or the legislature and I look forward to an election where all these issues will be once again

discussed and hopefully next January we'll have a better attitude in trying to address all these problems with everything on the table. All right gentlemen thank you so much for being on the program and again good luck to you in the next 48 hours. Thank you. Less than 48 hours left in the session. Will the governor and Democratic lawmakers find a way to patch things up or are they headed for a Valentine's Day massacre at the roundhouse. Join us at our regular time Friday night at 8 and find out. I'm RC Chapa for everyone that in focus. Good night. To respond to this program receive weekly email previews of the show or to find out more about in focus. Visit the in focus web page at www.knmetv.org. Major funding for in focus is provided by the McCune Charitable Foundation in reaching the cultural life, health, education, environment and spiritual life of the citizens of New Mexico.

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