Focus 580; Tiny Game Hunting: Environmentally Healthy Ways to Trap and Kill the Pests in Your House and Garden

Well in this part of focus 580 will be talking about dealing with pests insect and otherwise around the house and garden and trying to do that in an environmentally sensitive way. And our guest for the program is the co-author of a book that's titled tiny game hunting environmentally healthy ways to trap and kill the pests in your house and garden. It is a paperback book it's published by the University of California Press. And it is not terribly expensive and if you're interested in exploring this way of dealing with pasts you certainly can look for the book and then if you have a question you should call him. And if you are there's a particular for example a particular insect that you're trying to deal with or some other problem and you're not quite sure how to do it. You can call in here and we'll see if we can have a suggestion for you in Champaign-Urbana where we are the number is 3 3 3 9 4 5 5. Also we have a toll free line and that means it would be a long distance call. Use that number and will. Pay for the call 800 to 2 2 9 4 5 5 0 again 3 3

3 W L L and toll free 800 1:58 W while you get questions you can give us a call. Ms Klein hello. Hello thanks for talking with us. Thank you I'm delighted to be on your show. It's I'm I'm interested in this area and I'm sure that there are other people who are too. Over the years we've done a lot of shows on this subject and we've had people from the university on and does seem to me that a growing number of people would like to at least think about alternatives to chemical pesticides and that people are maybe now just a little less apt to immediately reach for a spray can of something then they have been in the past. I think that's true and I think that it's partly a result of all the studies that are coming out now that are telling us that our groundwater has been and affected by pesticides in the contamination and children are being affected neurologically by a pesticide exposure and there's just a lot more awareness now than there was

before. I think on the dangers of pesticides and I think it's something that is worth people thinking about when we talk about the issue of chemicals in the environment. And bit particular if you live in a part of the country like this a lot of attention goes to agriculture and it's certainly something worth talking about and thinking about. But I think people also do have to appreciate just how much if that is if it is a problem with the environment and if we get chemicals in the groundwater and so forth that chemicals that are sprayed on people's lawns that are sprayed on golf courses on in public parks all sorts of things like that. These are very very significant and you know one might not think about it all that much just what you do in your yard but you also have to keep in mind you know what your neighbors do and the people across the street and the people down the block in fact that adds up to a significant. I'm out. That's right and then the restaurant that you go into might have been sprayed if you ride a bus it might have been sprayed

it's just it's just and endless sort of more and more and more and more. And because it's invisible in the lot of times you don't smell it you're just just not aware of how much you might have been exposed to. But we as consumers can stop this toxic tide by using alternative methods and by you know getting other people to use them. We can I'm sure will talk. We have a caller here and I promise I want to promise this person will get right to them in Urbana So they they can hold on here too and we'll talk about whatever anybody wants to talk about. But I think generally speaking I wonder whether there isn't this perception that people have is that you know that when we talk about alternative more environmentally sensitive ways of dealing with past is that somehow they're not as good and that we're still going to have to put up with sort of a level of infestation that maybe we would rather not. In exchange for having less environmental impact.

Nick that's a complete fallacy. I think that once you understand the habits of the pest that you're dealing with you can actually sometimes be even more affective. There are more insects now that are resistant to commercial pesticides and than ever before. And and so they're becoming less effective and and as a result people are having to use stronger pesticides. But if you really I'm convinced that using the alternative method can be just as effective if not more effective. We have again that gardeners are showing now that their that their yields are as good or better than a lot of commercial traditional growers. OK well we have a caller in just doctor of many different people as we can as going through this by showing that we'll start out with someone who is listening in Urbana. And this is line 1.

Yes I have had occasional cough under and I have had this for years. There isn't any Larch. Infestation at all. It's you know the occasional and here and there. What I do now is just just to kill it once in a while. But I've called the press controlled place. They say that I should sort of spray the outside. But but now what I do is just stand scum and I want to find and we just kill him. Maybe 20 a year. So it's not a big deal. Well you know during the summer is there anything else I should do. It's usually if there's just one and they could be crawling around looking for a place carpenter and now can be quite destructive in your house. No you do really need to be vigilant. There's a bait that you can make that uses using boric acid which is a very effective and fairly safe way to kill a man. And you

could use that but I think I certainly went in when ants are coming into my house I just kill them one by one unless I have a huge infestation and then I get out a bait that will kill the colony. Well where was this Boric Acid be put. You would send it out where you see the ants. I see that there are actually commercial products boric acid I mean a site Carol and I believe Drax you can you can buy those. You just put him away a CVA. Yes and then and then they go. Then the anthro there and they go back to the nest and they kill the nest. Yes that's right that's where they were that the way that most of the ends that come in the house they they take a little bit back to the nest and feed the Queen with it right. Okay okay could you I'm sorry but I don't buy the produce fellows true products eventually. Carolyn T E R O C E R O. Yes and direct

the R x. Thank you very much. Yeah there are questions. One other thing about carpentering and if you do have an infestation you can drill a hole and blow in diet to Maisha earth which is a very fine powder that cut their eco skeleton. That's another way to take care of them if they're inside the walls and you know they're in there. That's something that I know I have heard people talk about as us can way to control slugs if they have them out in the garden a very effective and for a lot of pet cockroaches too. Very good. Well other questions are welcome. All you need to do is call us three three three W. while toll free 800 1:58 wy a lot. I guess this this maybe also gets at an issue. One of the things maybe that people need to think about is just how what sort of environment are they interested in. Do they want to make sure that they're never going to see a single bug in their house

or can you cope with you know maybe you see an ant every once in a while and I think actually I would certainly would say that we have a guy who is an entomologist and extension guy who's occasionally here on the show. And one of the things he he really I think that he has tried to do over the years is to sort of say to people well what can you put up with. I mean what can you can you can you actually co-exist and if you have if you think you have an insect problem ask yourself well now is this really a problem. Because a lot of insects will you know maybe they might be around for a little while but then eventually they'll they'll go away. And so and that's something I've been really interested in that this idea that says Well first of all you've got to figure out just how serious a problem is this and do you really. So what do you want to do about it. Some people say that you know even if even if a pest is eaten a quarter of your plant the plant is still going to survive and the tolerance is a very good idea when it comes to insects First of all they outnumber us so so astronomically

that there's no way we would we could possibly get rid of all of them and even if we did it would be an ecological disaster. And for instance and termites recycle all the deadwood in the world. And if they weren't doing that for us there'd be so much dead wood we couldn't grow any new plants. So it's really really I think an appreciation of bugs in insects is really important. And also the realisation that when it comes to tiny game hunting the very best ones are the insects themselves that prey on other insects. So if you can. One of the mistakes that people make when they when they spray pesticides in their garden is that they kill all the good bugs that will eat the bad bugs a lot more effectively than they could manage on their own. We have a number of callers here now so we'll try and take them in the order they came in again. We'll start here with somebody in Urbana and it's lime.

Follow the set me. Yes I run into a monster I mention about Carol. Yes I had and for several years and I've tried to tear off and it doesn't deter him I have done this here in particular last year and this year both held that Carole stuff out for two months and they just were still coming. OK here's something for you to try that's actually probably more effective than it is. It's not sometimes the Terro tends to kill the ants more quickly than it should and the answer as I said need to take the poison back to the colony and get it to the Queen. But if you can take a cup of sugar and two cups of boiling water and dissolve the sugar in the water and then add two tablespoons of boric acid. Then you've got a homemade ant poison. And all you need to do is get a little canister like a film canister and fill it with a cotton cotton

ball or sponge or something and saturate it with the poison and then set the little canister out where the where the entrails are and that's a very effective. OK it comes out prescription again the recipe the recipe is you take a cup of sugar for sugar cups of boiling water to pop for Roger. Yes and dissolve the sugar and then add two tablespoons of boric acid. I'm supposed to ask for Pat to automat Yes. A bagger. Why does this Carol seem toric for some people and not others. If I didn't work for me that's a good question I'm was thinking maybe because when I when I tried it recently it seemed to kill the answer right away. And what you really want them to do is to take the poison back to the colony. Or do

you also use their ears against your answer do you find where they're coming in and do a little silicone copying to discourage them from coming in that place. I was going to do that but then I got desperate and I sprayed with some poison. So the other thing is if you want to kill them instantly you don't need to use a poison you just get a little soapy water in the spray bottle. Yeah and just a you know scored a dish soap in a bottle of water and spray them and it kills him instantly. Oh right and you don't you know and then you don't have to worry about the poison then when you wipe them up to your floors a little cleaner because soapy water these are coming in under the rhetoric under the run go over my saying. Well you can also you know use a little. Like I said a little silicone caulk I mean barriers are very effective against him are persistent and you have to keep. You know they'll find a new home. And you'll have to cock that up but eventually

you know you will. You'll get the best of them but you'll discourage them eventually. OK well thank you. I don't think so that's And again I think that this fellow that we've had who's done the show with us a lot that is in fact one of the very first things that he says if we're talking about an insect that is coming from outside in. If you can figure out how it's getting in then and plug up the hole and obviously and as pretty small so it could be getting into a small space right. That would be one of the first sort of things that you could think about is try to figure out how they're getting in and then block it up. Exactly. It's it's like not having screens on your windows and thinking the mosquitoes are going to come in. Well OK let's go to next call it would be in Illinois. This is a toll free line here one for Hello. Yes good morning thanks for taking my call for a question that probably pertains to all of Illinois especially in the fall on the south side of a building where the

sun is shining on it it's nice and warm too. They're not really pets so I don't think Box Elder bugs and lady bugs. Got any suggestion there and I'll hang up. Thank you. Yes I have. I have a chapter in my book called occasional invasion and Box Elder bugs and Lady Bugs are both of those in it and as you pointed out they're really not going to do any harm they can just be somewhat annoying and Box Elder bugs of course live on box elder trees and some people have suggested cutting down the trees to get rid of them and I think that's a really silly idea. And if they come in the House of course you can vacuum them up and the same thing goes for the lady bugs which are probably imported from Asia where they like to congregate on limestone cliff and they in this country they find houses that that that sort of really I guess remind them genetically or some in their genetic memory of the Lonesome cliff but they're not

going to do any damage. If you can tolerate them. Or And as both ladybugs are also the people do like to have them around because for the reasons you talked about earlier that is they will eat some of the other things that we would prefer not to have. Actually they're wonderful they're wonderful tiny game hunters. Some people recommend that because they're. When they're congregating like that they might be in a sort of a hibernating stage and they they say scoop them up and put them in a put them in the refrigerator and then you can release them in the warm weather in your garden when there be when they'll be hungry and will do the the pest that you want them to do. The past I think people have been kind of interested in this idea of using insects to control other insects and have. I had thought about using ladybugs that way and mantis and they're actually I guess places that you can buy them.

Absolutely and any places now you can then you can then the idea is to take them out and release them in your garden. The downside though is that there's no way to guarantee that they will stay in your garden where you want to ruin especially for ladybugs. But there is a mail order pest that you can get which is the green lace wing that will stay in the garden and is enormously effective and when you order it from one of these supply houses it comes in a package with these tiny tiny little minuscule eggs and you just what I did when I ordered them was I just got Little Dixie cups and put a few eggs in the dixie cup and stapled it to the leaf of a tree. Around the garden and it it was impressive what they were able to do and what will. What do they like to eat. Well they had a lot of aphids of course. And. There's a whole slew of things that they'll eat. My mind is blank you know a little bit here or there but they're they're

voracious eaters. I. See. The other thing that you can do when you when you order these what I call mail order mercenaries there is a little bit of you can also get a kind of. The bugs like a little bit of wheat and you can spread that around a commercial kind of honey dew that will keep them in the garden and keep them from going away. OK. Well that the green lace wings will eat mealy bugs to rip. They are and they also eat the eggs of a lot of worms that like your plants very well will keep going next to a caller in champagne. This will be like number two. Hello hello. Yes. Yes I have a problem which is fairly typical I understand and I and Illinois I'm fairly new to central Illinois and that's with spiders. We seem to be constantly cleaning and getting rid of spider webs. And also we do have

ants in our house so that's one of the questions. What I saw an infomercial on TV for a product called test the phones. I don't know if you're familiar with that. And basically what it is is you plug it into the Rock outlets of all outlets and it sends some kind of electrical. Intel throughout the house that apparently annoys a pass and they go away. My concern is they say this is safe. We have a little 3 year old daughter and I'm very concerned about her the impact of anything like that on her. Are you aware of anything like that. Yes I'm I'm very aware of them and and they they tend to sell a lot of them for mice and rats. OK. And I worry about them too. We humans cannot hear the sound that they met. Right. We do you how do you know that it isn't in some way going to be harmful to us. Exactly unless I was and now they say that FCC and all have approved this and it's been proven safe but I'm not sure I mean it's obviously a commercial for their products so if there is a doubt any doubts about the safety of product A They

wouldn't say it but I wondered if you can shed any light on that it's more one thing when it comes to pesticides. We don't have a very very good history of claiming something that you know is safe and then having it turn out to actually be safe. OK. May I ask another question. We also have rabbits who eat pretty much anything we plant trying to get a particular thing but I would like them to. I'd like to offer them alternative. I believe it or not even made a fresh salad for the one so I put it out there. They seem to ignore it they like plants and flowers and it just has to to sway them. One of the things that I do think just is that you that you might try planting a little a little sort of barrier garden that would be just for the rabbits. Ok but also rabbits you can use rebalance against and they don't like things like blood meal and then again blood meal that says

that you can sprinkle on the smell of fish is sort of offensive to rabbits so you can take fish emulsion and mix it with water and spray it on the plants. OK onions are another deterrent. There is a difference because it tried to have gone to stores and they've suggested certain plants plants for example I can't recall the name but there seem to be actually more popular with them. They suggest a dried blood than you know some other chemicals pester power. Since nothing has worked and I don't like to put up fences because that you know has a negative a side effect. Well you could. The other thing I don't know if you've tried sprinkling hot red pepper. OK you know I have. Make sure the plants are day on a little bit damp for so it will stick on them. OK I think they can be pretty much of a problem Gunks only eat them. So all snakes skunks brood rabbits. Yeah. Wow my

one. I think that this is this is also a case where your best defense might end up being a fence but try some of these things first. I'll do it. Thanks Joe I think that's also wee wee in the growing season we now for a lot of years have done regular gardening shows and this is one of those questions that's. I'm up a lot and we've talked about people have suggested these various kinds of alternatives. I sort of have this feeling that maybe when it comes to rabbits if they're eating your plants what it does come down to is constructing a physical barrier that's just going to make it so that the rat the rabbit just can't get at the plant that may be the thing that that is going to be the the final thing that's going to be going to be the most effective thing. Yeah. And I think the only other thing I know also from time to time we've talked about the devices like that that are supposed to drive away insects or things like mice and rats and I guess the consensus of all the people I've ever talked to about them is that the dist they just don't

work. What we say in our book is that if you are tempted to buy one be sure that you get one that has the money back guarantee. Think good thoughts are about midway through this part of focus 580 I guess I should introduce Again our guest We're talking with Hilary Dole Cline. She is the co-author along with Adrian winner of a book that's titled tiny game hunting environmentally healthy ways to trap and kill the pests in your house and garden. It is in paperback. Published by the University of California Press. And if you're interested in exploring some alternatives to pesticides when you're dealing with pests in the house and garden you might want take a look at and of course questions are welcome here if you want to call in. 3 3 3 9 4 5 5 we also have a toll free line good anywhere you can hear us. 800 to 2 2 9 4 5 5. Our next caller is in pain line 3. Hello hello. Yes we are here each group has the word antique log cabin and we have a

dream and and then I want to get the name of the commercial products we might use to. Get rid of him. OK well the diatomaceous earth which is a giant summation should I spell that. Yeah OK it's d i i. In a minute. You have it in front of me d a t am i c e o u s. She first started to Mission Earth. Yes it's actually microscopic some fossilized tiny little microscopic razor sharp. Granules. And you could use a powdered PI read through. I mean

yeah I read through in combination with silica gel dust ring. Now under the threat of silica gel dust which is also similar to diet to Mission Earth it effects their eco skeleton and dries them up and kills them that way. When you just put it when you put the ocean near the mast I can see is it out of the of the nest outside Are they inside the weather and how long I can see. If you can drill a little hole in it you could blow blow these products right into the net are you. That sense can also be baited Like I said with that with that diet to mention certain sugar bait. You put the earth's rich I'm sorry the sugar and the boric acid

bait that I talked about. I remember you. Yeah I heard that. OK acid and sugar bait. I could make that up couldn't I had kids kept carpenter ants like sugar and they'll leave their nests and forage for food. That's what the boiling water and gases. Now another simple thing that you could try. Where you see where you see the you know traces of their nests is just try putting them back human there and trying to vacuum them out. Oh and around I mean to spoil myself. That's sounds like right. Well that's just fine I'll see if I can find someone you can. Good luck and I think so. One thing probably We just want to mention as far as people handling the diet to make this earth. Yeah it is something that you do want to be careful handling. You really you know you don't want to get it where

your eyes you don't want to breathe it in. You probably if you can avoid getting it on your skin. All those sort of things and it is a it's a powered It's like a dust so you don't want to inhale and you're right very very right. On the other hand they do feed it to animals too to control intestinal parasites. So you know it's not going to poison you if you ingest it. Let's go next to a caller. Somebody in the Chicago area in number one. Hello. Hello yes. Oh thanks for taking my call I have a two question actually one. I was wondering when you were talking about the boric acid I had the impression that you had to be very careful about where you put this because it can be toxic to people and animals. Yes if you if you this is why when I was talking about making the bait you would put it into a little film gamester with the with the.

And it would be maybe a good idea even to label it as to what it is because it does have specially since you put the sugar in it it might taste good. It will make it won't you know an animal or a child but it would definitely make them sick if they if they ingested it. Yes. Now I have a lot of organic products of food in my house. Yes. And Periodically I get an infestation of cereal my. Yes. And the way I've tried to deal with it is to find out what kind of food they have found that they're betting on. And even when I've tracked it down what else can I do. They have some wonderful traps that you can buy now that there are sticky traps that you can put in your pantry and they have a pheromone sand that will attract the mob into the trap. Oh but if you ever find them in any food that food has got to be thrown away.

Oh yes I do that automatically I've learned now I keep things very tightly contained or in the fridge. But once in a while but now I think I can't find what they're eating but they seem to be driving somewhere. Sometimes I'll get there might be a little flour or something in a cracker crevice and they'll get they'll have gotten into that and then I discovered that. Now what kind of traps where do I get them and you can get them a lot of garden supply stores at least here in California are carrying them now or you can get them through the mail through organic gardening catalogs like gardeners supply. I see they're pretty easy to find now and I just called the real monster pantry pest trap pantry pest trap. Yes OK and my last question is I didn't quite get the name as your book Tiny game hunting. OK thank you very much Jack. And these these traps that you're talking about that they work just because they

attract the insect in and they have something. There that just grabs him so they don't have any pesticide or anything that they decide to have so they're perfectly safe. And keep in mind that that has like like my sin. And don't they rely very very heavily on their sense of smell they don't even see that well. And so pheromones are dreamily effective. Ah great. OK good thank you we'll go to Belgium for next person here. Number four below. Hello I would like to point out to your just that we here in the Midwest in Champaign-Urbana the central Illinois area have a serious pest and Asian Brown butyl that looks extremely a lot like the ladybug. And I don't know that it's the same thing as the ladybug but it's a very big pest that was introduced into this area just to control a pest in southern Illinois. And now we live with a

horrible mess. Every fall when they try to get in our houses. So introducing species into areas is a very dangerous little trick to be doing. Consider. It certainly is and a lot of them are I guess they were introduced to control a fence in trees right. Not exactly sure what they were used to control I do know that they were imported more than once to get it done and when they finally got burned it to do you what do you do what do you know that they can they can get into if they get into your house. They can be quite a nuisance just a terrible nuisance and they also some people say they bite some people so they don't decide I'm not exactly sure about that. But they look at a very great deal like the lady. Yes that's normal ladybug we see except brown in color and their spots are darker. Right there I'm an orange color right at once. Yeah that's right. Some and some people call them Halloween beetles. Yeah cause they show up about that time however. Yeah

but heck you mean the map. Oh if you can try anything you want. There's millions of them all. There's no way the kind of horrifying when it happens. Yeah it happens all the time here on. And sure other people can attest to the same thing. Thank you very much thank you for the call. And here and the next person in line is in Champaign that's one too. Hello. Hi there thanks for taking my call. I rent an apartment and this really old house in the basement hasn't been cleaned in years. There are spider webs everywhere and I'm just wondering I know the spiders are in every way. But I'm wondering how they can survive in this space and what I can do to get rid of these webs or get rid of the spiders or. OK well if that is a spider web of dusty chances are it's not being used by a spider anymore and it's perfectly OK to back them up. OK. Spiders are performing a

very good function in the house because they're eating all kinds of much more dangerous pests like fleas and mosquitoes and flies and things like that. And as long as they're not poisonous spiders it's a good idea to try to tolerate them. OK well how do I know if they're not poisonous. Are the only two poisonous spiders and I'm not sure if you even have them in Illinois but here in California we have the black widow spider. Right. Which you can tell because it has the little hourglass shaped red spot. Underneath the belly I have we have drawings of these in the book and also a spider called the violin spider which is I think it's more of a problem in the south and I don't think we have. But there is another aspired that we do have in Illinois that that can be a problem that's the brown recluse. Yeah well that is the violence by all that is violence that spider is spreading. It's traveling throughout the United States.

It's the bites are fairly rare from that spider but they can be very very very unpleasant. I've actually been bitten by one of those really. So that's why I'm sorry that you have a.. I'm sorry in the place where you live right now. Oh no this is actually in Missouri where I know they're really prevalent. Yeah. They had back you mean and so it's a good way to get rid of spiders. OK. OK thanks a lot. Thanks and I guess understanding about the brown recluse was that it was aptly named because it was reclusive and it was yeah it was the kind of need that you would you almost have to go out of your way to to find one. Because they're they're not going to be out in the open they like. They like to hide they like to be in places like in woodpiles and right in our little out-of-the-way corners and you get in the house one of the things they might do if you happen to have a habit of throwing your clothes on the floor and leaving them there they might crawl into them.

You have to make them a little bit dangerous so they say that you know always shake before you put them on if they've been on the floor. Spiders creep me out. Sorry that's something I have a hard time coexisting I know I've been thinking a bit about that and I just think we have must have it must be because some of them are so dangerous that we have an instinctive aversion to them. And that's a shame because we kill WAY too many beneficial spiders for the wrong reasons. About 10 minutes left in this part of focus and again we're talking was Hillary Hillary dole. Klein one of the authors of a book titled tiny game hunting which looks at environmentally healthy ways to deal with pests in the House and the garden. It's published by the University of California Press it's in paper it's not terribly expensive. So if you need some pest control advice. You can either look for the book or you can try calling us 3 3 3 9 4 5 5 toll free 800 to 2 2 9 4 5. Next caller is in Peotone and its line 3.

Hello. Yes yes thank you for taking my call. Diets in Asia earth itself get killed the root worm the root worm larva that that is a disaster certainly affecting our corn not only the larva eat the roots and then the adult beetle eats the silken pollen and keeps corn from PA pollinating and it's a cheap material I think. I came acquainted with it. I began. Found it in a by product from the food industry they use diatomaceous earth as a filter in processing certain in in the food industry and I use that as a waste product. Applied it to my farmland and I find that if it controls all of Roebourne right that's a very very noxious Spencer Lerma. Yes and they they aren't and it's a we have to use a quite poisonous I don't know of Laura's band or different different types of poisons to control room form a larva. And. Is anything

being done or what why can't we use more of this fight tenaciously. Great that you're using that how do you apply it. Well I apply it and I are injected into the soil with the waste soybean waste product. I just yes I injected into the soil in large amounts. I don't know if there's that much dye tenacious syrup because it comes off filters. They also use it in the. In storing green it as you said if it irritates and kills you know beetles and fleas and whatever's in the grain and then it doesn't hurt it doesn't hurt or not sell it doesn't hurt us. So you should spread the word on that about your success with it. Well I yes I shouldn't about I was warning if I think possibly one of the reasons that we aren't hearing much about it is it's not an expensive product. I don't know you know I know it's a diatom you know this prehistoric word words that come from words that my entered you know I think about I think it's my.

Mind is some of it is mined here near where I live I'm in Santa Barbara California and there's a in Lompoc on the coast north of here they mine it. OK well I've seen it at our local elevator grain elevator. Chances are you know we end in pound containers to be used for ants and I've used it. It works well. That's great I'm. It's wonderful to hear from a commercial grower like you admitted that it's now a fact of it is it. Yes it is. It is effective and B and I think possibly the reason that it isn't use is because it it's cheap it isn't you know it isn't a product of corporate America right. Right may be right. I've got another question. I've got some evergreen trees that are dying I think just sticks to it. Is there or do you know anything about the beetles or whatever could be that I know that some some people come in and just cut down the trees because they don't because they haven't really figured out what to do with them I'm not I'm not I'm not an expert on this. There

there there might be. I think you'd have to get an arborist to come and tell you some of the Beatles might have natural enemies that could be introduced but I'm not really sure. I might have to take my diet any surfer out there. Thank you all legs of the Co. Let's go to south eastern Illinois and have somebody else here line one. Oh yes I came in late in the program and I think surely somebody must have already asked the question but what about roaches. What about with roaches. OKOK roaches. Do you have them in Illinois. Oh yes cockroaches are probably the most most loved of all the insect pests. And again the boric acid is a wonderful pesticide for cockroaches because they haven't developed any kind of resistance to it the way they have with a lot of commercial poisons. You just sprinkle it around don't you. Well in the case of a brick acid in cockroaches it has to be applied very carefully

because cockroaches are very clever. And if it's in if it's and it's if you applied it in such a way that it's in a clump they'll just walk around it. So it has to be sprayed in such a way that it's just evenly evenly colored the floor and then the or the Preferably the cracks in the recesses where cockroaches like to hide and then they walk through it and then when they groom themselves they ingest it. There are some wonderful. Traps that are coming out though for cockroaches that are using things like fungus and that they attract the cockroach in there and then kill it with non toxic methods and I think we should keep an eye out for those and buy them when we find them. Are there some things that are they developing things that mess up their breeding.

Yes exactly the the the. Juvenile growth hormone regulators that they can that of the which are also something I think that if you see them you should try that and one other thing I don't have birds problem at the moment but I have been there in the past and another one I don't have at the moment but what about I think they're called silverfish they get in brown books books. Yes. So other fish. There's said there are traps and you can buy a little packet that you can buy that I also believe contain boric acid for silver fish you also should make sure that the area is very dry where they're store where you're storing books and vacuum constantly. And you can also sprinkle if you did have to store books you could sprinkle some diatomaceous earth in the bottom of the box. To take care of them. OK thanks little to so many fish packets seem to work they look like little almost like little packets of sugar and you can spread them around.

Thank you. We'll go here too we have somebody else cell phone line for we're right there. Hello. Thank you for taking my call I don't know if you've answered this question before but you have so many solutions for you those are black flies or when you're outside. Hundred percent all right. Yes I we don't exactly recommend DEET but we have a wonderful a formula here in the Bronx that you could try that's a great repellent for them and it makes use of. Have you heard of using Avon Skin So Soft after oil. And you would mix one cup of that with one cup of water and add a tablespoon of eucalyptus oil. Oh OK. And that's a marvelous repellent wonderful. OK very good thank you very much. Thanks. I know this is a product and the Avon folks didn't set out to make an insect repellent but somebody apparently discovered that it would work

at least some people found that it would work. I tried it myself and it doesn't seem to bother the mist. One bit high but there some folks have have had a lot of success using. Well maybe you can try it with the eucalyptus oil. Well now that might that might just be the thing there that the extra added wrinkle that would that would make a difference. Problem because the heat is so effective right. People you know want to be bitten. Yeah and but ice but I know that some people are a little concerned about DEET and particularly when it comes to their kids too because you know the labels don't let your kids rub their eyes I mean who can and who can keep their kids from rubbing their eyes. Nobody. So this so this is it's that product and you mix it with some water and assume eucalyptus oil is the kind of thing maybe you can a natural product store or something like that you know a store that you'd be able to find. OK. Well there again some people to try. Let's see next we'll go

to. Better for someone else right here lying to you. Hello hello. Yes I have had a little tiny bug in my house for the past several days. It's about a sixteenth of an inch long and an even less wide oval shaped kind of brownish color. And I finally tracked it down in my cover that was in a serial serial do you know what that is. This surprised me a full saying. Yeah it's some sort of a pantry test to be sure to throw away the serial serial Yes and don't just dump it in the garbage you know. See you know it before you throw it away. OK you know these pantry pests can I put it in the compost pile. Well you could except that you just don't want it coming back in the house.

And I'm thinking that you might it might be a drugstore beetle drugstore beetle. You know I'm not exactly sure which one you have but it's very tiny very tiny yeah probably not even a sixteenth of it and it was probably in the in the product when you bought it. I don't know. Probably was. I think that generally is the way it's stored be stored product passed so I think that pretty much the way it is that there actually are. The product of that's the way they get into your house for the good in the first place. Yeah ok but you don't have any particular name it's just you think that that's a particular name drugstore butyl I'm not exactly sure whether it's that it could even be maybe even carpet beetles. No it's not crap appealing I don't travel for that. OK now I know I'm not exactly sure what it is. OK well I just wanted to know. Thank you. Thanks. One guess will do one more here and Chicago line three. Hello hello.

Yes did you ever hear the formula of cocoa powder sugar and pork as food for roaches and ants. I said I love it. Well that would be similar to the one that I'm recommending but I I actually hadn't heard of adding cocoa to it that's what they're after would be my great idea. Try as you might bring him in from somewhere else just to get an A if you had a mosquito. As a nurse. Breed a small fish in a pot that the fish will eat a mosquito virus and call the gumboot Biden said G A M B USA and in the stack of time with that you don't have any a mosquito virus I have a great idea. I also once heard they just just pour some oil on the water today. What is it the poop prayer to whatever they can't breathe that is blocked by the oil and water. That's right. Yeah that's an old. How do they when they built the Panama Canal they had mosquitoes malaria down it what did they do in that case just live with it or did they

have some of those 1912 was pretty terrible I got a lot of people just died. Yeah well but they must have learned something since about. I think they learned one of the things I think they did down there were I think figured out about draining ditches and stuff that you know of the standing water is wet so I certainly don't envy anybody that had to work under those conditions though. We're going to have to stop because we've used our time and say thanks to everybody who called again if people are interested in reading them or about the subject this book that we mentioned it's titled tiny game hunting and it's published by the University of California Press in the paper by Adrian winner and our guest Hilary Klein thanks very much for talking with us today. Thank you for having me on.