1965 National Association of Educational Broadcasters Convention; Professionalism in ETV Production

I'd like to. Well all his life with special interest provisions without too much for me. We'd like to get right to the only business today that is. We're very happy to have with someone who I think will be of great help to us and is right by the purposes of what we're trying to do with this new professional section in the well being in television I know we're all very familiar with the word credit what it implied. So I would like to if nothing else as an introduction. I'll give you just a list of readings that are speak of the day starting with David Brinkley's journals the inaugural meet the. Second great debate in the Washington director of the on the brink with or without further ado with this time like this. Thanks we know your city in life right.

Those are credits I should be tired but I have enough money in the bank to retire but they were all public service shows up in the air that you work in so that it's a good area. It's an area I like very much. As far as talking about directing shows I'd like to say a few things in the way I approach direction. I think the most important thing that I try to remember when I go to Control Room is the one word listen to listen to what's going on. I used to have a I did a show with a local girl. I will give her name and that she had a priest on a brother and she was asking him many questions about his home and where he stayed and she finally asked him how many children he had surveyed Bashan question for him but he had run and often his phone

so answered 495 and it didn't faze her she kept going she said well we sure wish your wife and your. Child. She went on and finally dedicated to solve my prayer to Him. You may or may not know the words to it's enough so you should listen. It's pretty important before a program we ought to listen to your technicians because they can help you a great deal because a lot of them just unlike values with a different texture of sex which sounds way out there. If you listen you can learn something from the engineers. Listening to a program such as the Huntley-Brinkley show that I do every night David Brinkley quite often well in the midst of the program get wire copy which changes the spot completely when he changes a spot. I don't get a copy of it's done in about 35 seconds before he goes off. So

in a race or scratch out four lines before you before I roped you that has what I have set up on the seat of paper and if I'm not listening and not looking very carefully and he skips over that paragraph before the paragraph and its role here and I don't wait very happily sitting back and expecting the 15 seconds go by he may be looking into that monitor waiting for the film to never come up so far. Were seen doing that. Will not do for having trouble if this happens say there's a little different thing here. Let me think If I go into the show a little bit I'd like to know. I go in about 11 there's producer Bob Mulholland who was in that awful night back in the morning. His main purpose in being there at 9 o'clock is to get the wire copy of the day's hearings down the hill pick up any news items that may be popping up. Read the papers try to find the happenings. Congress and Washington Post we have a very good item article which lists the days of the day of the president the day

of Congress committee hearings where they're scheduled what room all these things have to be looked at and the decision has to be made whether it's to be covered and I was mentioning it was a very bad time for US News wise in Washington in spite of Pentagon happenings. It was I guess last week the president was out of town. Congress was not in session. We finally filed somewhere under the Commerce Department I believe a hearing on peanut butter. They were deciding how many peanuts should go into peanut butter and what should be labeled a section we decided like I'm a bad idea cover that story. I would be dead in the waste 15 hundred feet a fellow whose know nothing usable That is the type of thing that we try to do especially when there's no news when there's news in there. You just love it it's beautiful that way because all you have to do it because your top subjects if Bobby Baker hearings are going to have you know you cover those as a crew and if the president of course the president is

in town there are always one crew there's always one truth possibly two if it's a big enough day if there are enough things happening. All of this film comes into our house by courier. If there's a special pick up if the president meets with the astronauts gives out an Air Medal. We don't have the courier there waiting for that film to bring it up because we have other strip shows during the day put it up and as soon as we get the film into the house we look at it. Decide what Huntley Brinkley wants to reserve because we do get kind of the reserved status and then let the other film be released to the other new shows once the film has been decided what we want then we have to get our producer has to get together with a New York producer who and then in turn gets together with the executive producer and by five o'clock in the evening everything has been formulated into a format and the format is flowing back and forth between our programming systems or on the phone. They take down the time the item and from there we run when we cut our

films. We put our films on tape. This avoids breakage so we don't break the film here. Once we had the tape together we would begin walking the city at 6:25 the show goes on. Right after that but often you see troubles with the breakage on the air or a fail safe fail spot a spot that hasn't come through in the last minute film that comes in we must go we must go live if it comes in at 6 15 6 10 the reporters got to go to our stairs scan the film in five to 10 minutes as fast as you can and get one cut. Luckily the most important thing we hope to get that one God out of the projection is threaded up so we can roll into first thing in the show. When that happens quite often and only familiar with negative film which is what we work work with in this kind of weather where the humidity is high the film will curl and once it goes through the gate you

can propagate and then you're going to grab the phone. This happens in a case that occasions we have failures in pick ups. I think it was just two nights ago we had a big feature in San Francisco and it was a late film that came in from Vietnam. Well somewhere along the line in Chicago he TMT somewhere along the way I did not get the Judas witch so when we switched out there we got the video with no audio. Thanks of the difficult situation with Garrick Utley the umbrellas on on fellow with their lips moving and no sound coming out. It's an impossible thing for anybody else to tell what is in that phone. Only promise knows nobody else has seen it. So to have a chance have they had anything to do an abberation over I would be out of the question so you ducked the spot. You leave it you come back and you continue on with the show knowing full well you have to do another repeat something which nobody likes to do and I think to a glitch in the first time an old tape in a second.

The same routine goes goes day day after day after day. Maybe a show that you have that you're doing on the TV seems rather routine to you the news has a routine to the beauty of it is that the routine changes the interior part. There are certain stories you cover you cover the White House day in day out. A lot of what you do at the White House seems like it's like sameness. One other one of our particular functions one of the reporters functions when the people that's the fellow his function is to make that different to make it worthwhile seeing you second or third time if the president goes to the Rose Garden sign another Bill how do you make a dent. Well it's their job they've got to get their phone they're going to get together the cameramen say to shoot different NGOs. Let's get it from above instead of straight on and so forth and so on these little items connected with the show I I could go into other areas such as sports and

so forth which I also have a love for myself. I don't think I'll do it here. I'd just as soon take questions and answers if you have any I think you get more out of that than than anything else if there are any questions I can answer I'd be happy to answer. No I don't I personally don't. I think that if you have to follow scripts if you have to listen carefully the to be able to call in your own mind while you're trying to do something else over here with a stopwatch. There's a lot more important in getting light but money I found quite often. I try to do as much you know when a football game and I think I get 30 seconds into the game and then the DD was busy trying to connect something over here to get the get the program going and in the 30 seconds I think I had four wrong switches. So I don't suggest that I switch my shot and I would want to. I wouldn't want to be caught in that set of circumstances.

Let me say this if you if you love a question you hear from everybody. And you're not sure whether you have a job the next day. As far as the show is concerned there are a certain number of goofs that are tolerated. Want to show it's not too bad considering I think of books this way. If you go to if you cut away from my plate of broccoli to go to the love of four five words earlier just had three or four times you get talked to here they tell you that it's not nice and please don't do it again. On one occasion we had to redo the show because of that. But you're not fired. If if you haven't let's say you haven't and you have got a film in a double projection

piece of film and you wrote it. You don't and you look at it and it looks all right but you don't put it on tape. But you've had the time to. And then at some breaks on the air and you've got a lot to answer. Otherwise they expect you to have enough sense. Oh it's the 70s if you haven't gotten the facilities you need let's say on a switch the switch to San Francisco. If the people of the 80 the director the 80 hadn't checked you know to make sure that everything possible was done to ensure that switch was to go and you get a good dressing down and if you do this three four five times you can look for a little trouble in the for maybe another job. There are no bad directors wind up in

the news on our new show anyway. As mechanical operators I creativeness comes if we get involved in going out and filming a magazine pieces or if we go downstairs and view film and cutting as and witness the president the bill signing the report is actually going to screen the film. But we can go we go down and help them illustrate it with them. And if there is something that we see that we we just voice our opinion we make it known and it usually is accepted which is nice and it makes you feel good. But as far as far as directing the show is concerned on a day to day basis it's very mechanical. It's a matter of checking the number of tape machines that you have. Make sure you've got enough the number of film change that you need at the lights to correct it you backed up a light if that one goes out on the air that you've got a spare one to throw off. But the biz most are going to work but the spelling is correct.

For content. While. This piece to a news editor in New York where she had two separate operations David Teitelbaum is the news editor. He is responsible for the work where the content as to its correctness in Washington David Brinkley writes all of his own copy and this is fed through the producer who also checks and his Check the hours all day. So in that recent respects it's split it's split in New York with the news editor in Washington the producer and they are they are ultimately responsible along with Mr. Brinkley. Now it was more time at the time of. Mr. Brinkley he didn't have he did he felt he did not have enough time to get through the show to keep it in its in its quality its stand. Well if you'll remember it dropped just before the time of the

elections the conventions. It dropped the only May of the year that the that the two conventions came up the elections came up and then the you know the ration and he saw the year he had coming in front of me I just felt that he wanted on that one year another U.S. bases would not be able to do I think he was right I think I think he tried to do that we did a show and gotten into August and September when the conventions were wrong something were suffering the conventions of the show and I I don't think you want to put anything bad on him. And if you drove while we had the Audi man we have the TV. This is reading from right to left looking at the studio. The technical director the director next to him to the left of him. Fm is an NGO and assistant

director and on occasions a reporter will be in the control room in back standing we don't have a place for them to sit because we like people they outside New York it's all different. New York they have the news editor in back of the the same set up from right to left along with the extra engineer a lighting man who is on a PDA. This is because of unique situations. Difference between Washington as a light in Manhattan makes to the audience. In back of the control room people the news editor and usually every Porter and I running and the runner is there to take copy to all three places to link to the director and downstairs to the NEWSROOM if needed. Video shattered our control room and in New York are separated. They have the company did this I think the last five years ago and the video not a video operation in both New York and Washington are all in one central

location which is separate from the control room. It's a very good idea I think because the video man gets into so many technical situations even on the air that if you can isolate him from the control room where you just assume just talk about production. I think it's I think it's worthwhile in New York in the studio six say they were working out of when I did the show there the video man was in a booth next door and they would open to close the door and the door was always closed. Did you date. Did you want to go to the functions of those people I am sure you know you know what Donna I have set up myself. I think we have a speaker system in our studio which I'm sure you will all familiar with that speaker system is cut off when we go on the air by the flick of a button and it automatically cuts off the staging announcement

stage in St.. I have set up a little box which contains an all night hearing a mike speaker arrangement to and fro between Brinkley and I said even if we're on the air I can speak to him without getting feedback and a couple of occasions I have maybe air but it's been accepted as being and I think it was during the time that Johnson was going to lead. You remember the exact thing with you he was doing the White House little theaters we called and he was going to I think it was a steel strike if I can remember correctly. And there'd been a great deal that day long is going to be at 4 o'clock in the afternoon there's going to 4:30 then 4:45 and we kept going and going and by 6:00 o'clock we knew was going to be on the show you know how you do you know this and I you know in a sort of complicated circumstances of is he going to do it right at six thirty five.

Well you can count on the fact that he won't listen any cases you come walking down the hall and you think of something you want to say you know stop and the fellow down there the director has already put up the 30 second notice to you and you've shouted out to Brinkley you've got 30 seconds to fill before you go down to the White House and God stops and starts correct you for a minute and a half. You're a lot of trouble. So the speaker I think at that particular times exactly what he did he stopped in the hall took another 20 seconds and I just punched the button down to Frank and said we've got to fill another 20 or it's going to be 20 more seconds. Something very concise and proper. It leaks out. But it's better and I think the people kind of the shape the fact they're inside of them. The telex said second guessed also that that ability gives it it gives a good thought of the program audio with an interrupt through the speaker system. Daybreak doesn't like to wear the earpiece and. I know they wear them on the conventions. We've even got us to a great deal of trouble to

hide the microphone. Anybody knows this but we'd like to have no incumbrances on them at all. We just assume have them if if we could get near the cameras or hide themselves and the lights. I'm sure they'd be very happy and they want to concentrate on the news. They want really no outside interference at all. And I think having a having an ear piece on the data frankly is a bit of an encumbrance. Well. Whatever. You know what

else this could have happened only because in looking at film on a movie only you make speeded up a great deal and you miss a few words. And if that film then is cut and that section has something in it that you haven't quite heard but you got the gist of it and you know it's good enough to use and it's taken right to get in trouble at six twenty eight and six says thirty one you put it on here you haven't had a chance to see it. No one has really previewed it so there is the possibility that that that that would happen to those set of circumstances I would say normally the judgment of the other reporters is he's one of he has to answer for later. Even under those circumstances you have to answer for them. I think it would be very logical that he if he were to say that we had three minutes to put it on the air and that this section was done in fast speed on the movie all and I just did not hear you very logical logical reasoning. I would be accepted I think. Now that would have I would think it would have been corrected in a second shot. What you've seen is the first time you

correct the second shot. We luckily only go to about 20 stations the first time. Ron the bulk of our shows go the second time. So we do get to correct our mistakes. Yes. That's right. I can't think I. Can't think of a time when I have no it's always been next. Side by side. And you. What I'd like to see it. I think we want to.

I just think that to my mind when he made what I think he's I think he's pushing news if I can say that where he's promoting News and Public Affairs. Which I certainly want to do too. But I just don't think that the commercial buyers knowing that how they rate the heat and the commercials on a per thousand basis and selling a product. I'd like to accept a show that will maybe maybe only attract a rating of three where they can put on a Lucy show and get a rating of 10. I think they're going to stick with Lucy. And I think even past 970 they're going to stick with that. The movie's from one thousand sixty and sixty five. I think that's a high percentage. I think it's a great percentage if we could get a ride. I get a little richer and everybody in the news department I think be very very happy about it. But I just don't see it coming. That's it. How.

The right goes again this fellow in New York his news editor comes in at 9 o'clock. You reach wires a wire copy the decision is made in a meeting usually around 10 o'clock. As to whether the story is big enough to cover most cases the local station would have been forewarned anyway if there was a news editor can tell the story should have been should be covered. I will pay for the coverage whether we use it or not. And you call the station. Get the story covered. If it's happening at 9 o'clock you know it was happening at 12:00 noon then everything's fine they go into the meeting make the decision whether it's to be covered or not. And they cover 10 and only use three when the call goes out to the news director of the station. Or if we have an auto station to a specific company thank a person for instance and how they would go to Ray Lockhart and Tom Petty in Chicago to fly cover and less less Cristal. And those men will get the word we want the story covered. And please go out and cover it with our man on the scene. They would then cover it and bring it back.

And their judgement out there and the judgment of the news editor reading the wire New York make a decision on how much time to give it that film would then be cut. If there is enough time it would be put on tape and fed to New York or used film wise and fed to New York to be put on tape in New York. So we could play it back into the show ourselves. But if there was not enough time it was going to take us right up to air time the facilities would be set up in the technical vein through B.O. see through the OT in New York for a live switch to Mississippi to Chicago and so forth so there's that. And he changed. Well I think Ray Shero would have to answer this a little better than I. I personally don't but got to vote out of the White House too often to work I was at the hospital a couple of

days. I get a very bright intelligent man from what I've seen of him on the tube and in person. I don't know that there's been any change myself I haven't heard anybody specifically speak of a change. Did you have something specific in mind. Well I think he's I think he's a very intelligent young man and I think he's also young and dynamic in person too Mr. Reedy who also was in a second. And I don't know when you get a young guy in a job who's was interested in what he's doing. I think things improve just generally all the way around. We're not in the

instance of the how to break a show I don't know if there are some stations actually use it but I don't know of anyone who could really put a new show on teleprompter. You could put maybe the latter part of it on but this would make the front part of the difference from the back part I think new shows in most instances can't be put on telephone or they're just not known. Your copy is not put down on paper that far in advance and it must be at least I would say 15 minutes 20 minutes before hand if you have to tell a freaking story you're not going to get on the telephone. Most most news casters have to learn to operate without them. Right that was what he wanted me to know. Relationship with Dave. Me as a writer as to what your own is or were you with me in these areas. I know you know me or about your lighting situation which responds more to you as a direct relation by the

actual getting together there isn't much of it I probably see David for five minutes before a time line to say goodnight as he's leaving and while he's on the to what he expects of me as the fact the fact that he wants the lighting correct he insists he has a set up now that we've used not for five years. I am as the director responsible for making sure that lighting is as it should be that given particular day any day in the week I am expected to get the film in a position that if you put it on the air without any trouble that is when we have the correct number of film change that we may be transferred if we've had the time to videotape. So it can be put on without any possibility of break that when a camera switch comes up for a visit well that I will let him know. V-A the speaker that I have been telling what paragraph I'm going to switch to the other camera and back again.

So it actually all comes down to a technical function a technical follow up to make sure that everything works in rhythm A B C D F G and when he comes and sits down he's nice but the desk in the store at the right height at the camera is in the right position and we've got the right lens at that lens isn't the right to average a set of all of these little details. He expects to be taken care of I mean if if the guy you want Snow White but watch those things are all accomplished he comes in sits down and does the show and there are no goofs. He's happy and I'm happy and I think that's that's pretty much my side of the directing on that particular show. I start as a page when I was 15. At the same station to the RC the movement went through music rights. Sound effects and sound effects for a couple of years. What I was doing sound effects I was asked if I

want to move to television I was making forty seven and I didn't I didn't because I was making a lot of money in sound effects and I felt that I shouldn't take a pay reduction to go into another medium. I talked to a gentleman by the name of George wheeler. What that time was a general manager assistant general manager of the new RC he had talked he talked to me for about half an hour about going into TV and convinced me that it was the place to go and I went I was at that time everyone was a programmer system. There was a general manager a program director and then everybody was a program assistant. So you did everything from ot work to film work directing to stage managing and if I remember correctly a couple sent you all would go into Bill sets just for kicks. Well you know in our local station now we have I want to have news we have a half an hour

of local news prior to him frankly. We have a half an hour of honey pranking and half an hour. After the break. I find they have a great deal of trouble filling filling time. So for me to answer expanding that I don't know but I've used the word cover if you if you get Jack 15 more camera crews you can cover 15 more stories. I can see that there if you expand your staff said if we take our 60 million dollar budget make a dime out of 20 million I'm sure we could go another half hour of news and we could fill it with that phone. Sixty me is the is the NBC News budget for you. Not that a picture can be seen. We don't like either. Why.

Well the idea first you've got to sell the idea first. If the idea's been sold you'll usually get a reporter down here. And they'll go out of shape to shoot the story. You want Sure we'd love to have the final shape if it's acceptable. But they just they still want to National. I would think a rough cut and then I would suspect if they buy a story from me they would send a reporter job. And if you have the film at a certain place a reporter would come in and cut it with you so you get a final edit at your area. We're here. With you. You anymore and you know there are more.

Well while what I was thinking specifically of overseas I guess I was she's covered certainly needs boosting And I think they're planning it. They have opened up and are starting to build up a London office. But in Europe I think who's I don't know exactly I would guess we have 10 to 12 crews and one on that on the side to six or seven stringers hired on a piecemeal basis. But certainly that that area could be built up as far as the top national stories are concerned I think we cover most of them pretty well. Either I don't live or film. The only way it could be done better is the addition it d additional crew on the story that you only have one crew on for the better or better coverage for the cutaways for the for making the story appealing really really well. He

said Yes yes well I don't know specifically how to break that and in the particular area that we're in in Washington at this particular point where Congress is up where Johnson is out the president is out we are searching as I say we consider this peanut oil here seriously because we have no film in the house and land hearing is slowly going downhill. We're getting nothing out of that it down to the last group of witnesses. So we are searching for in Washington for stories to cover certain to realize there is an update in that show a certain segment of the show is to determined by the executive producer in New York what section This shows a sponsor maybe a one minute film piece it may be a 45 second felt pad and fill the stock market area. It may be a one and a half minute story that we did on Vietnam which which will need updating we know for sure

and that will be done by man out on the West Coast you know normally it's rainy and they look out out of the tape go to Neil live and from there that half of the watch he will fill the time period and then they will go back to the area. Right we're going in a documentary if I can talk in that area. I think it's a relationships it is just that they're married. I think that not only the writer and the director but also the producer. And again the film cameraman if you're filming all must be a unit. They must all go out and shoot the film together. I did a special called our beautiful home which is so beautiful and that was the subject matter of the film. We covered sewers and we went

into plants filtration plants and into a lot of areas that we didn't particularly like me to but we all went together and it was it was kind of fun to do it that way. He didn't like going into a place that smelled bad if you all went together because you're on the out. The same problem. As a result we also got some pretty good film shot. I worked with the Department of Agriculture man who all his life had just kind of shot things in the studio USD a bigger cultural reports and they were strictly for putting in the files holding the files he never never got seen one by anyone. And it's a whole new area for him and he loved every moment of that and he'd say Look let's get down here get into the water. We'll see what it looks like flowing over topless. And he loved it he thought it was great. And so at least things were you know were coming from all different sides from the producer and the writer from the from the film cam for myself as a director. And when we got back to the house

we cut the film cameraman out of the editing it because he'd be kind of which I don't suggest by the way but in this particular instance the way it worked which brought it down to the producer who was also the writer and the director. The two of us and the film editor and we were the three of us worked on the show we made six shows on and won the Sony Ward which is very nice. So I suggest the DSA do you know a possible times be married to each other until the show is complete. You know really. We don't like the scripts very often on the new shows. Well I have done many other shows recently. I've never got a script that I can run I'll take that back. I got a script for a show which we're in which in which we inaugurated the opening of our station was General Eisenhower Vice President Nixon and I got a script which after the first three minutes with throughout because everything went haywire the band was delayed by five minutes in the motor of

the house for Roger the president was six minutes delayed so we had to throw up. We had lead and went for his live half hour show and it was an hour and a half. Special events. I don't see how you can script you can you can do what NBC does do which I think is a great idea. They give a Facts book to the facts book go to the reporters and to the producers for the inaugurations they'll put out a 50 you know. 500 page book which will give information on every inauguration of of of all of our presidents even down to the details of whether or not it was like the excerpts in the speech. So for a song. Well for just the producers and the talent to read this I think is a mistake I think the director should read if you could ever get a technical person interested I think they ought to listen. And some of them are some of them are truthfully interested enough if you can get the book for an hour away from one of the producers to give to their flock and you'd be surprised at

pretty interesting things come out of it from this last inauguration security measures I can't remember specifics but security regulations were at a maximum and they had also been this it also been true after after the Lincoln assassination. So there were comparisons to make. So in reading through this this hit me I made a little note for the capital set up so that when we got around to it I had cameras preset to shoot the top of the Capitol on the House side and see the police standing up on the roof. We could not see who seek to serve we search like crazy for before the show they were headed up above the canopy. Oh. In what was a cheesecloth range they could see out but you could not see it and we were not high enough to see down. Well let me ask the second question first

was difficult things going to happen to us and that's probably where we're going to cut it. I think that was there and I'm having a little trouble hearing oh this year it's blocked up. He said that's the most difficult thing was going to want to oh oh oh oh oh oh product you ask income help. Biggest problem is going to be getting film processed in time. We actually have big a specific problem. He's covering a hearing on the hill at 10 o'clock in the morning recovering the same hearing at 2 o'clock in the afternoon having the morning session covered in color in the afternoon session in black and white as a necessity and how we're going to put the two together. Well he's just going to have to put together color in black and white. This gives us all kinds of technical but gives me problems technically it gives them many more problems in cutting film. But I was certainly going to create a lot of problems. It's going to make David Brinkley want come

first of all there's going to have to up the likes the lights are going to go up to 200 to 250. They're 85 now. That's comfortable I guess they could be just like a house like the cameras. The fact that you have to have them you know worked on an hour before air time in four years increases our costs. That's a problem. Believe me that's the fact that you have to transfer something well. For instance we're going to not be putting our kind of film on tape on the tape. We have to run out of film on the air because once you put that kind of film on tape in New York it's it's going to be first generation can't be second generation you want to accept second generation. It's going to be second generation of the coast. They'll settle for that. So this means you have to not put your film on tape to run your film the route you take as a backup. So you've added a chore there a lot of little problem with the route a little and not be

so not good on some people will be uncomfortable will be worked out and eventually the new guy will come out will be able to get a five foot canvas and we'll all be happy again. It's a record black and I teach a lot of the old black and I'm talking about black and white. We open the camera up to about five six I'm not there they're normal too. I would guess that would be I had about 200 hours. I try to remember I can't remember how long we keep it to bed. I would guess for the network four to five hours and I would I would say it's not right.

While I think this is the 70 percent that Mr. Friendly talked about Israel is a wonderful area for education to get into. When I spoke to Don in South Carolina recently we all had to get together after the talk of Thursday and what are we talking about. According to the law courts this is an area commercial television can get into. Well we want to for the news purposes what we would want to do obviously is going to cover a 30 second cut and minute cut but covered all day. Well you can so beautifully go in and if it's got to be disguised if you've got cameras if you've got it you can you can afford to do this without the commercial approach you can use it and you can cover a court a courtroom trial for a week for two weeks I think and I think you can put a series of programs on the take the best of the day's court proceedings. We did this we did a thing on.

Marshall television covering the FCC hearings on the way she's been three years ago we met a half hour show out of Sunday mornings 11 o'clock that I think no one saw. I enjoyed it very much I thought there was great shows. I enjoyed hearing the industry talked about. We left out a lot of very good material boiling down six hours of testimony a day two and a half and I was pretty hard to do and get all of the meat. We did we got some of the meat and in some cases we took it for us. And Larry you know to make it appealing I think in this area that you've got to get Congress I think to the educational people can make the breakthrough in Congress I think good enough pressure enough talk enough getting together. Congress has been talking in this realignment of Congress about to put in closed circuit television and senators offices. They talk about a lot of things something new someone coming in with the unit

with the material with the cameras to say let us televise without interference not without interfering. We'll hide our cameras will block you do whatever you want. Something that in the commercial realm we might not do go as far as because we again are committed to time problems we can't send a crew in for six months we can't have a camera sitting down there. Being black being hidden we've got to pull him out and go to the White House and we gotta go to Bethesda. But this might be a beautiful area that you could move into and put six cameras for cameras on a pool basis of one camera from Pittsburgh one camera from New York and tied into one central set up and cover Congress day in and day out. The commercial broadcasters would love it they come down here as you take so if they want to. Buy like I do other things other than Huntley-Brinkley. Now typically as I say it's

kind of a routine thing DAY TO DAY. The car is a challenge coming up which is going to make my life interesting for a couple weeks. I get a big kick out of special events if a special event pops up and I can go out on and be a part of that to me is just the most fun of his business. And I think more and more special events are going to be taking a part of you being the biggest problem once you get out of a special event. Because that said this is great. I can see you trying to do things differently. I think they're wonderful and I wish we had was and I think they've kind of gone down the drain and I keep asking this question around the place myself I say what has happened to our instant specials. They just don't

seem to be as often as they have it. It was a I guess a again a trend of the business Jeff Hagen was the one who the start of the instant specials and they were very successful Gulf oil bottom. Again this may be the reason that they're not on not gulf oil has gotten itself involved with the issues with the gender issues not being not having a sponsor to back up your suspensions you sometimes do that are so expensive. If I had to make one guess it would be to get that guess that they've because they've lost the Gulf sponsorship but the U.S. specials are as often as they used to be. I like them I thought they were great. What I say is if you're I don't know how many of your

groups have mobile units of the BRC has two and neither one of those are called eye to units so useless when we have a big set up. We bring units in from New York from what we used to un see TV. We bring their mobile unit up we don't use their people because it's a union problem in the areas where it's a union problem it's going to remain a union problem and it's you know it's going to be unsolvable. But in all other areas I can see nothing but a kind of gradual getting together I think that if we suddenly decide to do we're going to have a parade of the astronauts in college and therefore educational stations we know about with colored living you could be calling them on the phone every night and day. That's what we've got we've got to use or use the equipment when it comes to film clips and that sort of thing. If you if you get into the

court rooms if you get into the Senate or the house if you can cover five hearings we can only cover one with air for one or two with our film crew. And something happens at that hearing that we can only talk about. But you've got the fellow. No question about the payment of money whatever. Whatever is needed. I know you were told and you were going around when there's a closing as a network directory. Myrtle right. We used to eat the stage you were constantly you know how vision but comparison by our view of whether it be a trial in the classroom are in the home. Nobody's organisation or here the network. Besides our engineering our technical differences I want to take from the directors and one of you how can we within the content of our program our visual visual as a group. Oh what would you say would be

our main points to work on in putting our production together in working with you working with now at your trial. Let's say we're programming against not only deal Billings. How can we in the dark you know they put out a nice new product a sponsor with you thinking you know. Why are in the. It's a very serious question. You need to pull funding. I don't know I think the first thing is when you're working with I'm going to talk and I have on the car the wheel in the commercial industry anybody who's been in the commercial industry for more than 10 years has worked with them for three years for that matter because there are changes all the time in our business and the real key to it and the fun days for me in television were the early days putting programs on the air with everybody there for 12 14 hours a day when you get a little tired of it after a while and I realize now I could do them too well

but I think that if you have everybody can get together. If your teacher would devote more time than just that 15 minutes before and after all that phone call and here's what I've got. If the technician who's your artist we all get together with you as a director producer on a specific show on a specific subject that I think from everybody you'll get ideas and putting those ideas into use and you get more cooperation from me you want a better shot at CAA It's the old gimmick of if you bring up if you bring a guy in from fellow who has a film camera and you say I've got a live studio show he's going to try to sell you on shooting film for that show because he wants to work he wants to keep busy. And if this is true when you get into the show you get another added element. If you bring your artist in you get an added element of the of the gimmicks that Doris can come up with

appealing backgrounds which is very important. All of these things and if you if you bring people together more often in your organization about a given show I think you know a lot of good ideas a lot of good improvements. This is how shows are improved. And you say that the one major thing that we can think of commercial they know they can even the words they would be the extremely strong unity team we're relations you know. People are lonely when you're there. I think so I if I can use Hadley Brinkley again as an example when Really Frank started the show at the half hour show. He needed a lot more people in different areas and he handpicked them in the areas he would go into Washington and say I want that film cameraman associated with the typical show. I want that that is my associate producer because you know

these were people who worked as a unit with him before in other productions. You know what he could count on for you know if you call them up and said I want this. They get it done. He knew the workings of those people from having it with him in the past. He also knew that the whole giving ideas which I thought about it was one thing I can say is that when you work together his business the better off everybody is your technicians your state people even your runners the guys that own copy back and forth. They found mistakes and helped us out. I've enjoyed it. I hope you'll.