Alaska's Governor; William Egan (continued)

This. Is. Just starting. What I'm going to do is drop them as I go. I only have seven hundred and twenty two questions. And. I always do that for all. Is. That right. No that's why I just begin.

OK. I'm sorry. Every time I've done that when to be Governor Reagan many people say you were the governor of the underdog. Would you agree with that. Well I I never felt I felt that I felt that I was the governor of all people of Alaska. But I've always had a real. Feeling for the human spirit the human side and the for the people who. Were in need of assistance in getting into the mainstream Alaskan society. Yes. Were there any special influences or experiences that brought you to that point of view. Well I don't know I was. Born Invalides as you know and. There were five boys and two girls in our family. And. Growing up there. I remember. When I

was 10 years old I worked in a cannery there. Salmon cannery putting hands in the line this year is empty cans for 10 cents an hour and sometimes during the summer season when this when the salmon running hard. You'd have to work 12 13 hours a day for short periods of days for a short number of days usually during one's period of time. But then if I remember four years later I was catching those cans at 55 cents an hour coming down. At the end of the cannery filled with Sammons. But. You. Know we. Didn't have things all that. Good. It wasn't any there weren't any real good old days. And when people talk about it that. Actually. What is know in those days it was. Really scrounges to make a living your folks and. And the the

people that are that grew up and the people from the far flung rural areas really had a tough time of it. But as did people over in other areas of the United States too. How did your family get to Alaska. Well my dad was a hard rock miner. He was born in Iowa. His folks came from Newfoundland and then he guess he was on went along in life he became a miner in Butte Montana. Where. Copper and and that sort of thing and then he moved the move he had it at a job in some mine near Everett Washington. And the family moved there. My mother was born in Montana and he was the. One. Where he worked for quite a while. And then in 19:2 they moved to Alaska. He had a job at a mine a very productive mine at Douglas Alaska known as

the Alaska Tredwell hard hard rock gold mine. Most of the mining was under the under the ocean there and under Gaston or channel they drilled down in where they found these rich leads. Eventually there was a cave in that the just killed that that mine broke through. But dad and the family that moved to two valleys in 19:4 where he then continued in the mining game and he was the superintendent on many just drilling tunnels that are Gool hard rock gold mines. There were several lucrative. Productive gold mines in that area. And if you remember back to mother. Well I I I was lonely. My father was. I can remember my father but I was between six and seven he was killed in

a snow slide at a mine where he was drilling a tunnel called Normas. Cameron Johnson my shoe glazier about 12 miles southwest of Shelties and then my mother of course she had she really had. But I remember my dad is when he come in from the jobs he was on a really pleasant man and of course you're your father and all and and we really missed him. But my mother then she was she. She took in washing and and raised house plants said us all and at times she was a matron in the court system when they'd have the terms of court Beldi which was a third judicial division court headquarters and in various other ways she raised chickens and sold chickens around town. And when. My mother and my older brother Clinton but he knows him as truck he's still Invalides

87 years old. Now we're the mainstays in those early years of our family. After my father died. And it was just one of those things. What was felt like back in 1980. Well I'd say in 1918 120 which I can remember very real well I was 14 but I can remember that real well when my one of my brothers was in Europe during World War One. I remember when he came home LDS he was frozen and they had to take this transport came in and brought the lot of the people whom are back to Alaska and they had to rendezvous outside of what they call the valleys narrows and then they took that brought them in the valleys these dog teams over the ice but that was about the only time that they really ever froze over that well with the with the ice cutters that they

have now the Coast Guard and it they can always keep ahead of that. But in those days they didn't have all that equipment. But Vendeans was the transportation artery to all of the interior of Alaska it was the only route to except through that long route from Skagway over there that you could trailing that. But it was the only route from north of the Gulf of Alaska to fear banks and any other of the areas in the interior where there was a lot of mining going on and and other activity. And so Baldies there were always I can remember vividly I was really enthusiastic about horses because there were several hundred horses. There were about three different Drage companies there that had horses they had in the summer time they used wagons and pack horses and buggies to carry passengers over the so-called Richardson trail all the way to Fairbanks

and free to use horses and wagons to haul Fairbanks all the freight came from belled through Belize in the wintertime. They used sleds and horses again to carry all the supplies north to the interior mining camps and other activities that needed the needed supplies in that area. So Valdez was really a transportation artery. And another thing too that involved is something happened there in or around 1910 that was before my time. But. There. They discovered a large. Copper large copper loads set up in the McCarthey area out of. Off out of the south of the Rangle mountains and and east of the Copper River Valley and north north of Cordova. About 160 miles north of

Cordova and the Guggenheim interests were really well known. Financier's who were in the mining business and many other business activities throughout the United States. They were they bought these properties and they knew they had to have something to bring the war out the tens of thousands of tons annually. And so they they knew they decided to build a real world. And they began building that railroad out of Valdez which was the natural route to the copper Valley and then Spurr off to the Kennicott and McCarthey area. They got as far as his tomb canyon and there was a company known some people Invalides without that kind of financial support started or what they called the Alaska home real railroad of their own. And they were selling stock and everything and there was the had a bitter battle and Keystone Canyon. The Guggenheim interests that actually built their road to

his tomb Canyon and the others had put a I think to put foot rails down but they had a gunfight and Keystone Canyon and at that because of that gunfight the Guggenheim interests just pulled out of buildings and went to court over. There and. That's for the friend of the copper river river road out of court over to chitin on and copperas my car at the end. Kennicott. It's always been I've always felt that if if the whole history of transportation north of the Gulf of Alaska surface transportation would have changed if it hadn't been for that group of people that cause the the people who had the the financing to build the proper railroad into the copper Valley and then over to Kennicott and McCarthy that if that fight hadn't happened and that they'd been permitted to go ahead and the natural thing then would have been to build it

on to Fairbanks and to other areas in the north and probably the last real number came into being until 1924 and President Harding drove the Golden Spike. But there's no doubt and he has at that time in those years there wasn't any really real increase that amounted to anything. And there wasn't a sort it either really. And so you're you're real would would have gone north would have gone to the mines. And I didn't. Undoubtedly it was eventually if had you to had a whole different kind of system you'd had a real network of rail that sort of thing. That's right. And covering a lot more communities and and fanning out as some vision even call it a real real world could do if properly supported from the standpoint of economics.

But those kind of things occurred and then gradually as the. As the then is the Alaska railroad came into being the fading over the richest highway or richest and the that was the only route in the trail or road to anywhere north of the Gulf of Alaska there wasn't any plan Iowa either. Anchorage wasn't connected with the Richardson Highway or with Fairbanks or melodies or anywhere else. It was just that rigid and trivial out of all these jihad. But when the Glassborow came into being from beginning at Seward to to increase to fear banks and that that really hurt the transportation. Industry and in the valleys area because. In the wintertime. Insofar as everything used to shut down except when they had the horses and sleds. In October say and there wasn't anything then that everyone over Thompson passed to the interior until maybe

May or June or sometimes July the next year because of this tremendous snow. And as a matter of fact the people of El these used to go out I remember on Memorial Day year after year and shoot with shovels and help shovel snow up on Thompson pass so that their road could open sooner. You know that sort of thing. But but Beldi is let's say. That area was a gold mine where many gold mines were produced millions of dollars there are still leads that are available. I'm surprised that with the increase in price of gold that even though it's very costly to get a hard rock for it's mind boggling that somebody hasn't invested at least in one of the properties that are there. I work at one of them for all the truth most of the parts of two or three seasons in the Ramsey Riverford which is what

it is. Forty four hundred foot level on a mountain looking right straight north some melodies on the back side. And you had to pack supplies from Belding's four miles to the Belges glacier that's practically disappeared on the face. Now it used to be very difficult. Getting on to the face of all these waves or so that you could then hike over the top and then go on to wherever you were going up on it like to the Rams or with some of them or far you have to pack and pack for about four miles to the fish the glacier and then eight miles to where you turned off to go up the switch back to the Ramsey Rutherford gold mine which had produced millions of dollars. This is the area that fiber you use to fly in. Yes it. Now Reeve came to help these 1932. And. About how old were you. Well I was just I just graduated from high school as a matter of fact the first time I ever saw

Bob you know who he was. So it was the Lambert moniker and I stepped out and said that was a darn good landing. He said or something like that. And he looked. He had this little old clothes torn pants and was very you know. Snow white skin and all and no white Serafin. And then you started telling me about having been with Pan-American Greece Airways and South America for some time before he came to Alaska and he didn't you know them pilots were really the swashbuckling type. They had like to see the scarf around their neck real sharp a few pants hiking boots and all. Bob didn't look that way to me. I wondered if he would just give me a line or something and then sure enough he went a fellow in town that had an airplane on me and also legal out by plane. The pilot had

broken up some up on a place called Jack seen a glacier way up in the business area. And. We've been telling him so much about how he knew what he knew about fixing airplanes and fixing engines and this sort of thing so they had this fella to really test them out. He had this airline from Cordova she was Colcord over here sir as well the name of Kirkpatrick took leave him there with parts and sure enough he stood up and put back to Baldies eventually and then they knew that he really was. From then on he started to get a couple of Fairchild folding airplanes and was he working out of things. He was worth. Yes. He started Invalides and he was there until 1940 when the planes burned up in hangar and another one had blown over him in a windstorm. And then he left the house and get him some military

contracts. Up in the north to begin with as I remember it. But did you ever work with him. Yes I did. I was kind of his grease monkey for a while and at times in the wintertime and he would haul you load his airplane. And oftentimes overloaded and that was the thing of the day with all pilots that there were there weren't any inspectors around once every twice a year had sent the U.S. Department of Commerce with Senator Specter around so they couldn't move a little to about half again what the airplane was raided to carry away. It wasn't profitable. And I remember one morning. I went out there and and the wind was blowing beat the dickens from the east which gave him a cross wind on a very short runway taking off. But when that occurred you'd have me hanging around on the strut to keep the airplane from my brown loopy to the right on the takeoff before he got enough speed. Then when he get

enough speed and I saw that the skis were about ready to break and I drop off into the snow. And he went early because there was a crust on the snow early and later that would get sticky. Well this particular morning I remember throwing my arms around the strut and it was a folding wing airplane. So you get more than one of the many anger where ordinarily you just get one very fine airplane to a larger plane for those days. But then in addition to the padlock that padlocked the wings to the fuselage when you close that there were some books on the strap. On the main street that they would put at them there was that they put that can on the side of the airplane. Well when I threw my arms around it this particular one I caught my blazer. Police are in this book and when I started to let loose I saw the skis start to break loose and it was going really going. I knew he was airborne. And I tried to get loose and my arm was stuck at home this way and you don't have much left.

Somehow I got that thing torn and got out of there and I fell he was off the off the snow and ice me. Another 30 seconds I've been high enough you know that you could really get them done bodily harm but I I saw him just as I broke loose I saw him look around and he was incessantly smoking a cigarette. He had this cigarette. This is the shot of his helmet to helmet and his eyes were Boji because he didn't realize something was holding that thing down. But that's something with me and I broke loose. But. No. Other occasion. He had. Mining Company and Reeve had engaged me and an old fellow I shouldn't talk about old people but an elderly man named Louis Townsend to her just to grow up take some. Some. She I had worked up the Rams or their feet and so had Louis Townsend years before that.

But to mark a place in the mountain where the stream comes down. Where we were figured that he could live with this. Fairchild 51. And with supplies but we had to put black black flags in the snow so that when he came in he could judge the distance because when he came in off the glacier he made us turn into the mountain. He was no turning back. You couldn't get out. It was he had to land. So he we put we hiked up there and gone two or three days and came back. Put up these wooden black flags on sticks in the snow and they were sticking three or four feet above the snow. And so then it snowed a lot. Invalides even and didn't think enough of it. So then when one went in with the first trial to land I was with him. And I remember when we turned off the I was trying to point out to him I was standing behind him in the plane. He was there. The airplane was one that his kind of pointed no

was in the cockpit. And I stand behind I was trying to point out where these guys were there were little flags. And so he knew he was running up against him and to cut the switch and they just boom went into the into the into the snowdrift. I thought that was it you know because that happened to them and nothing happened to it. We worked all the rest of that day shoveling those skis out it didn't even really bend over the middle propeller. It didn't even bring in the prop it didn't break the skis but it took us all day to almost dark it was about 3:30 in the afternoon. It's getting dark when we finally got it inch by inch. We went up to Monkhouse that was up there at the mine and we got some. There were there wasn't anybody there at the mine at that time. I was in the middle of winter. And. But we did get that airplane turned around and headed down the mountain. And of course spot for me with your Republicans for not having. Well I said my God we didn't know who was going to snow 10 feet here. That's about what it must have. Covered the black flags and

everything else. But then we got here. He didn't return. We got finally turned around got it started the engines drove Jim then started down the mountain down towards Valdez glacier. That was it. And then on he landed there many times. Other times when. Before that we would drop supplies take the door off the airplane. And when I was with him he'd tie a rope around the tubing in the airplane in the fuselage inside the fuselage and then take a box and throw it out of this or that or the other thing even dynamites. And so. But this one time and I threw it out and I kept on doing the work. He tie and I grabbed the on the sides of the door. That too was tubing. And he said he saw it. I forget where he swung. He was in the turret. Whenever he do that he'd be in a turn when you

drop. And he swung the other way and I guess that helped throw me back in. After that. No one ever dropped things out on an airplane without a. A. Real. Sophisticated system of tying her through to the airplane you know to those my flying on your own. I mean did you do any commercial flying. Not really. First flight I took two people to different places and my own little plane was so high but I never was license's as a commercial pilot. How long did you fly. I soloed first in 1932 and. And. Each one of those years after that I flew I had about 100 hours all together in a plane of my own mess and sound like much but it's quite a lot of time in here. And then in addition to being with other people. How old were you when you bought the plane. Well it was. I came over here and bought that airplane that was

manned by the name of nuncle who had the will of creakier lucky shot mine. He had a C3 around they call it and many people call it a bath tub type it was. It was a place. And. It had. Two big cylinders. And a wooden propeller. And I bought that and I remember the inspector came out to spring our lakes for mine and I was testing it and playing it a little bit. And and it was Inspector by name of Charlie BROOMHEAD here. And. Anyway I figured how are we going to get all these. Well it the name Larry. I think his name was Larry Larry Davis he had a cub agency Piper Cub. See here he is then and what he suggested he get a five gallon milk can you know with the kind of big top you

put him in. And to get. My lay forward fuel pump. And then he rigged. A hand wobble wobble pump on a wobble handle on it so that you'd put. From inside the cockpit along side of me there was this five gallon can full of gasoline. And then he had this the wobble pump that was the Mondli for a diaphragm but you could drill a hole in my windshield out the gas cap was out front and see. So we took it and then were you get how much gas you got this thing you stick the metal stick used to stick up or down as it went down. You know you're getting short of gas. Well we had to take that out and then put this tube through the windshield and then down into the hole and the gas cap. And so you just we agreed that what I would do all the way to hell these I would pump a little pump pretty fast to get a little out of this pump.

Well long story short the inspector came around and said What are you doing with that airplane. And I said one. Funny to take it to veld he said you better ship that down to Seward and send it over there on the boat. And so that's that isn't the type of you want to be fooling around between here and Beldi. Anyway you said you're only a student pilot. Well anyway. When he left but you know that'll be the day because I didn't have enough money to take the air wings off that airplane and ship it on the boat was about cost me about 10 times that amount of money I had. And then fly it to Sir. He said you could fly it. Sure. Well I had decided long before that I was going to fly to Belize well anyway. I made a. Friend of mine came up with me early one morning to lakes and our weather didn't look good but two or three days before that Jim Bridger a friend of mine in Belize and they had a plan they had a piper cub. I had wired the only way to get communications in between like Belize and the Fringe was by

telegraph and sent a telegram. And so I sent a telegram to them one evening one afternoon is here where were they. I'm planning to bring this plane back to the LDS and I was thinking of going on skis and. And and because I had some real meat skis that have been built here for. But the wire came back the next day from Jim derringers said don't come on skis come on wheels and you can land on that bottom end of the runway and leaning towards the tide flats and on the tide flats towards the runway where Tommy Donaghue landed with Tommy Dunning who was a lawyer from Cordova whom Fairchild 24. And I remember one day he came in a commune on wheels. There was lots of snow. I got a circle around and he then he landed on the beach on the beach and then on up to the bottom of the runway before he gets in all. The trouble was when I got between the time.

So I left here on wheels instead of skis like I planned to do. And it would take quite a bit longer with that knew when I got out here and I had to go up and up I remember I was 90 500 feet which was real bad I had no business being up there and no instruments no nothing except the airspeed being turned that sort of thing. And I got in the soup and got going up and up and I knew then I had to be over portage and over Prince William Sound but I could see nothing and that airplane was bouncing around and and to make matters worse you know that that pump I told you about the thing the connection started leaking gas had it all over me and I had to have a rule of friction tape. And I wrap that around the fitting but I couldn't tell how much gas then was going really was no way and I was out there a long time when I could. So I just kept on going and finally I finally I think it hit a downdraft that went down. Twelve hundred feet. That little

airplane I got down lower and lower and I was still pumping that up still leaking a little bit. And boy the weather wasn't all that good and I knew that country of Prince William Sound a boat you know in the end by air real well too. But I finally found a home that looked to me like it had to be a place called Freemantle about that was right off of Columbia Glacier you know way to make sure is and I figured that that must be the beginning of bounding design. I went on him even though the weather was so bad and I got to valleys and I looked. Around and the wind was blowing to beat the dickens it was bouncing around like a beam in the school it really was. And so. I looked at the valley as it went about half the town came out. You know see we didn't see the crash. I saw Head wheels and down there where they were where tumbling down the hood landed with wheels that was all full of snow to snow and ice there was no way.

So I went around a couple times and I could see I could see a lot of people I knew. Oh my God. I wish they'd have stayed home. But anyway so I circled around my feet well there's no place like when it was to in front of the hangar as possible because they knew where they were that I could see there lots of snow and wind was going to beat the devil. And I set it right down the snow with the school that just went kerplunk in. And you know that never never it never busted. Piece of the winning year it didn't break the profit in any labout like that time. How are you. How old were you when this all happened. Well I was. It was 1937 so I was. I was 20. When he was 14. I was born on 23. Yes I'm old enough to know that. Yes. You bet. And then some. And I made up my mind in the battle that he is in this state ever jump me in that I was going to tell him that I landed I had some gas cast up and I could get to the base in

port wells. But. Anyway that was a real experience. And I had some other experiences too. But was it fun growing up and all these things. Yes it was the scene. I think that was the same as it was for anyone else in their home town. I was very small. Yes it was. And then like I say back in the days even when I was just a small boy there might have been two or three thousand people around there when the when the horses were all there where the Drage when the freighting all went down to Fairbanks by the horses and wagon horses and sleds and the passengers all the horse buggies and that sort of thing. But then it would go down to where they'd have five or six hundred population period that would be about it. And then then as things would happen why it would come up again. Of course you see before. With. The price of gold. When it

went it. In 1933 the price of gold went from the $21 an ounce to thirty five. That's when a human being like where the Rams rather than those mines opened up again. Then in 1940. There was a general freeze on that kind of activity. All gold mining was ordered stopped because the last or yes because of the war and it never did. The courts money never did come back. Placer mining up north or as is a big theme today but people are taking out millions all the different. You know you were here in Alaska during World War 2. Yes I was stationed at the. Landfill for well out of left field for about 35 months. The war period like here was just like a war zone. Well yes Alaska was one of the theaters of operation the Jepp the Japanese said Mom and. Dutch Harbor. And then they landed

on it too and Kiska and you just you never knew of the further you years through. Nineteen forty four it was difficult to tell what would happen next. And then me. They had that had that front with the Japanese here. And then the Germans and the AM in Europe and there and the Russians supplying them on the eastern front with aeroplanes which I think is really. I don't think the full story of that has ever really been told how all that those planes got those planes went right on through the land field too. They came from a lot of them came through Dayton Ohio to Great Falls Montana to Edmonton and then to lead FIELDFARE Bange Russians took to pick them up at hairbands and reinspected them there and then. And then. I mean the Russians were in Fairbanks. Yes they were very much so. And. And the officers and men

men and women too were part of their armed forces. And then they would go take these planes to Gallina to refuel and to refuel men over to to through Siberia right to the front. The 39 speed 63 is and the fighter planes. And then there was one later one but they they never did. And then they got the G20 finance and an 8 a 20 attack bombers and see 47 a DC 3. You might say that lots of them went to war but they were always they never got like they had B-17 or the B-29 and all of these planes the B-29 and all of them were test where they were tested at Lad field before there was a you had an organization called cold weather test and before they ever sent them out on. I mean they tested them there first for any any any faults that would

occur in the in in 50 60 to grow degree weather wherever they might be. But none of those. There were always a step. Behind. They never give the Russians all the latest models but that was that there's no question that that helped mightily and being able to turn the tide. Russia against Germany on the eastern front. Did you get to know Russians while you were. Yes I worked with them very closely and in air air core supply. And they would come in to have them on the hangar floor and. We had several. I know one time I went we had some parts that they've been looking for and I went out and I forgot about that being Russians out there and I went out and I went no one was around the plane I went up into this B-25 I knew there was somebody in there to hand them this part. There were three or four of them around there there were while they were friendly and all they were very ones the ones that airplane was turned over them they didn't want any Americans or

anybody else touching. They wanted to handle it themselves and that would be I suppose that would happen if it was Americans taking it over from them they'd be on to be sure that their crew was the one that were the ones that decided if it was in good shape to leave with no one in town to remember it one night would get with it. Never was in a bank there in Fairbanks during the time it was at Lambeau Field. And I forget what she was with but some of us were out at a place called the wagon. We have a night spot for eating and a whole. Bunch of Russian officers and men in there different in that in that place eating. When we went in I remember. This shortly after we got there with us Russian call the waitress over and he said something about when are we going to get our food. And she said. One minute or what four or five minutes or something like that.

Because you said five minute five minutes five minutes by the clock that big five minutes by the volume that I remember even going that what they bought. Anything they could buy him in Fairbanks. And took them over and these empty C40 sevens which were used just to transport us over there washing machines or anything else that people would sell them in any way. The people in Fairbanks are well aware that they were there. Yes you know there was no no secret word at that time. They were our. Allies. But still there was a woman. Some people are. Wondering what. I remember when. After President Roosevelt died. That. They had a. Service memorial service on the outside. I mean hangar land fill the American officers and men came around one corner and the Russians came around another and could see as they went up

cross the stand you could see them with tears running down her cheeks when they were. It was a different meaning now. But those kind of things come back to you. How did you get into politics. Well I guess from the time I was in even before high school I had some my older brother took her still there and held as he at the Congressional Record all the time. And I would read it and I was active as a kid you know from the Democratic precinct committee and they were pretty active around there and and just kind of. Come into it and I remember one day I was crossing the street and we had. A territorial senator. My name is James Patterson. From Valdez and he here he was he came across the street as I was crossing over to the post office

and I remember that well and he says says Bill why don't you think of running. He was. He had announced that he was retiring and he wasn't going to run again for the Senate. And he said why don't you try for the territorial house and I said no that's too much for me I can't. There's no way that I can do that. And then he talked to other people obviously and then he came back to me and he talked me into filing for the territorial House of Representatives. I was elected that year and the. Third Division Beldi is was a very small place and there was the third division included Cordova Anchorage Seward Kenai Kodiak all the Aleutian Islands and and. Down the Homer area is now the whole campaign and that is just campaign from Valdez I never had the slightest idea I was going to be late to really. I ran because it's because several people were talking me into it.

And like Jim Paterson. And rather than being bugged all the time I just it's just ran I feel this way and right here I sent out cards and people helped me and they just Card saying that you know that I was a candidate Invalides was the candidate and would send these cards to all over and over getting the voting list from from the various districts all the way out there. Yes. And so then when I was elected I was nominated by on the Democratic side and then and then elected in the fall. But in those days there were four or 16 representatives in the territory of House of Representatives and eight territorial senators in the territorial Senate. There were four representatives from each of four judicial divisions. The Fairbanks North was was the the Fourth Division the norm in the north the barrel was the second division and this area was the third judicial division the Southeastern was the first

traditional division. So there were eight senators and 16 Representatives for and down in Juneau in the territorial Senate oftentimes. And they utilized it the canned salmon industry the transportation industry in the last year and the. And the mining industry sort of joined together just as a natural thing and they had lobbyists in Washington and they had lobbyists in Juneau all the time. And they would if they didn't like a bill that was coming over from the house. After the thirty fifth day of the legislative session was the sessions were limited to a 60 day session and it just made it was made to order for lobbyists to stop bills and when it took it took a two thirds majority to receive a bill in the House or Senate from either the other house after the forty fifth day. So in the Senate all they had to do was get

three three senators on their side to block it. They could block anything. And then when the first bill I ever introduced that was the first bill ever introduced on the subject of a referendum on statehood. I had to do it in my first session in 1941 wrote and introduced it. I finally get your people laughed out of it I got it through the House of Representatives. I thought we were going we could get to the end of this it didn't get out of there in time and in the Senate they turned that down. This five to three thing and taking it in so we didn't didn't see the light of day. Then later in 19 I was in the Army then I think in 1945 Stanley MCCUTCHEON had put it was it was passed by the legislature and they had a referendum for the next election and it was voted 3 2 to 4. It was very close. The salmon industry asportation the mining industry generally those people were opposed to it because there were there wasn't any regulation there were any taxes I'm

reasonable. They were leaving at that time any reasonable amount of fun things to help with social programs or anything else here in the territory you have had been here tonight to realize what was going on but all that was an upward fight on my first then I was selected in 1942 again and I served and 43 and then went in the army. Then I was re-elected in 46. 46 and served in 47 and served in 49 51. I was I went to the Senate in fifty two I was speaker of the house and 51. You also serve as mayor. Yes yes I did. I was. As a matter of fact I was in the Army and I and they didn't tell me about this but they put my name. This was in the latter part of March 19. Forty six and they were. I was discharged. I was discharged the last year in March. But in the meantime they had filed me for me here. And well the

Is and the election was I think early in April. And just about the time I got home I had the election and I was with me or yes. And then I served him a chamber of commerce and various other city council before that. But what led you to put in your put in statehood is the first bill. Well I felt even even being from Valdis I felt that if we didn't I was convinced that we didn't have. Didn't achieve statehood. We'd always be a stagnant. Part of someone else's. Lifetime or something. And we were don't know really I realized then I read the organic and read and talked to people about what what prohibitions had ever been in any other territory. And. We were prohibited.

Alaska and Alaska one of the organized territories of the United States west of the Mississippi River. Where we're prohibited from many things that there to other organized territory that was prohibited from doing the ostensibly congressional act that sets up the area as an organized territory to prepare them for statehood. And the the pressure was there to create Alaska's unorganized territory but it wasn't there to do away with all these this peculiar organic act which prohibited Alaska from having a truly local local government system. In other words you were you couldn't have it permitted first class city under certain certain conditions you could have a first class city status you could front or borough You couldn't form you couldn't form a county or prohibited from that kind of local government

activity you were prohibited from having a court system. They did permit like local magistrate limited by federal law you and me and the order and the first class cities but you couldn't establish a for a court system. Such as we have now or said or anything else and territory instead of every other territory could do these things. We couldn't select any land area of the territory as it became as they became organized territory as they did get part of the land in their ownership and the land area was specifically prohibited from that any kind of selection of that nature. We were prohibited from managing me the expiration or production of any of our natural resources managing the fishing industry or anything else which were all prohibitions and there were others that were never

foisted upon any other territory including Hawaii. What had happened to Alaska and Hawaii. They weren't because at the time I said I can only imagine that the time Hawaii came in as an organized territory that they were way out in the Pacific and no one really there wasn't that kind of mainland interest in Hawaii even mentioning Hawaii to Hawaii when Hawaii became a state. For us we had everything to do in organizing the state government. We had to change everything and create everything our departments had to be recreated as as we would want them pre-heated as a state entity. You had all these things before they became a state they had a court system they had they had a natural resource department that did have authority over

the natural resources or most of them and they had local government write down. So they practically just as they as they as they became a state it was just a matter of calling changing from calling it a tear to the territory of Hawaii enjoying the state in Alaska it was altogether different. All these things had to be accomplished after statehood or were that where the proponents of statehood back then the sites you well at that time there was little in 1941. Anthony. Diamond Tony diamond then delegate in Congress who asked for statehood and he I want I should I should have mentioned that he was from Belize and he talked to me about he felt strongly I talk to him about the statehood thing many times when he was home as a young man. And there were too many that were espousing. Statehood they use the idea that there was no way that you could pay for it.

I felt there was no way that that you're ever going to pay for it unless unless we got some of these things that the other territories had when they were in territorial status that if we didn't break through those shackles we would always be just a colony of the United States paying all federal taxes all all and every other regulation that the federal government imposed and having no vote in me in the Congress of the United States. Mr. Diamond the Dila then delegate was a boatless delegate. And even if Tony. Know I remember him as a real fine man. You know he resigned in 1944 he was like the first in 1932 and then Bob Barr came into the picture who was a tremendous asset in the in the in the statehood cause and when he ran when Bartlett ran for the after Diamon announced that he was coming home and he was appointed a federal judge and

was here in Anchorage Tony Diamond is a federal judge later. But Bartlett to use the statehood cause in his campaign was there were there were those who told Bob Bartlett they'll kill the office. No no no way you can you can make it that you know there's no way that you're going to become a delegate to Congress if you use state of people just couldn't see it. And even some of his good friends told him that I didn't. It wasn't made by Vice I told my guys it's about time. Right out in front of everybody that you stand for that cause and he was elected with a good majority and continue to be elected continue to fight for statehood in the Congress the people we're turning around are that time and supporting him. Well I mean the same because that was before Bart was elected. That was before the statehood referendum did go through the legislature in the 1940s. 6. Wait a minute.

Forty five. See that he was elected before that. But then when they saw that Bartlet was elected using that theme state territory why then more influence came into the picture and then he had the referendum in the 1946 election but there until 1941 there never been a bill introduced in the Territory legislature. Proposing that the people of Alaska vote as to whether they wanted to statehood or not. How do you think that the important leaders in Alaska when you were starting out in your career. Well of course their political leaders were would be Diamon or in a screening or screening had just come in as governor. I think he came up here for instance thirty nine or 40 I went to to Juneau in 1941. And he was that was

his first legislative session in the spring in 1941. And as far as I was concerned he. And his social programs and see fighting to rape almost from the beginning to see that the Medieval Eskimo populations were accorded the right to vote and ask Alaska. Up in many many villages they never did. They never did vote. And now down in this area out to they changed the values and those people were they they voted but the Eskimo was up in the north. They was rare that they that any of them voted and they didn't take take and make any efforts to see it. And the mining interests didn't want that to vote. They thought that. I say that by virtue of those who were a representative of the mining interests in the Territorial Legislature. Their attitude and all. But Bruening also saw right away that you had these big

holes in the ground from curch dredging and from. From or from Placer dredging and gold and and encourage mines and go cord's mines and holes from huge copper mine up that I put in a cod and like it or other Beldi is in various places and there were there were no reasonable they left no reasonable amount of. Support in order to. So the Territorial Legislature would have anything to to build on all necessary humanitarian programs or social service programs that were vitally needed. And Greening was was really. I'd. Say. Right out in my book in that respect Dan Dan captured the imagination of a lot of people who did have the

best interests of all the people of Alaska and not on any special few at heart. And it wasn't until 1949. That that some of his his programs really came into being. What did you hear. Oh. My. God. That sounds great. I like to move a little bit. How bad do you get. More Beacon Hill. Rival.

On. Tape and. I mean. Here is the parade of cars on the left hand side. OK. And I can switch to. That. Argument is one of the tools of oppression and

I don't buy it and I don't like that kind of argument on need to how many petrochemical facilities are there already in the country and how many in the rest of the world not just the dollar company. And then there is how many altogether what kind of products do they produce and in what amounts you know which are the ones that are really essential and which ones are superfluous and things that we can substitute natural products for. You know Ken can't we just cut down on them do we really need to expand all the time. How essential to human survival. Are any of them are. How many of them. I guess that's that's all that I can say. I just I don't want to care. I don't want a petrochemical facility in the city that I choose to live in. I don't want to see it develop in the state that I choose to live in. I would prefer to see it cranked down rather than grow in the country that I live in and in the world that I live in.

Thank you. Thank you. Jane Grey