Say Brother; Black Power on University Campuses; 24

There is evidence written in the paper. The black people's problem is no longer hungry bodies, but hungry minds. The black people's problem is no longer hungry bodies, but hungry minds. The black people's problem is no longer hungry bodies, but hungry minds.

The black people's problem is no longer hungry bodies, but hungry minds. The black people's problem is no longer hungry bodies, but hungry minds. The black people's problem is no longer hungry bodies, but hungry minds. The black people's problem is no longer hungry bodies, but hungry minds.

The black people's problem is no longer hungry bodies, but hungry minds. The black people's problem is no longer hungry bodies, but hungry minds. Some actual headlines that have appeared in newspapers recently. Seeking classes on Afro-American culture and more black teachers. Students sat in seeking more black studies. At Kansas State there was $500,000 in damage caused by fires.

Students and teacher strikes arrests, rallies, verbal and physical attacks from the state's governor down to fellow students. Representatives of students and teachers from San Francisco State visited Brandeis. I am one strike because San Francisco State College is the bell weather of American education today. I am one strike because San Francisco State is a test of whether unions, collective bargaining, black studies, higher education will prevail. Meanwhile, at San Francisco State College, 1,000 students tried to block off their campus. On January 8, 1969 at 2.30 p.m., acting out of sympathy with students from San Francisco State College

and with their younger brother and sister students from the King and Timothy Schools in Roxbury, members of the Afro-American organization at Brandeis University in Waltham, Massachusetts took over in administration building, Fort Hall. The men are non-negotiable and must be answered in black and white with appropriate signatures. The men are as follows. One African studies department with the power to high and five.

This means that the committee must have an independent budget of its own. Two, year-round recruitment of black students by black students and headed by black director. The number of students in the TYP program should be double next year and the administration should support and actively campaign for necessary funds. Three, there must be black directors for the upward bound and TYP programs. Four, immediate action on the part of the administration to have black professors in the various departments. Establishment of an Afro-American center designed by black students. Six, written clarification of position of the TYP students with bandage university structure and compensating the areas of financial aid and mission to Brandeis criteria for a satisfactory work. Exposure of the white students who shot a black student before Christmas holidays.

Rochua must be accepted and the present form are only with changes accepted by black students. Rochua must be published immediately. Anticipate the recruitment of African students and the winged program. And there, we would like to see the recruitment of black students for an academic needs rather than say, students totally from members of the aristocracy and Africa and South America. Ten monotheques, Malcolm X, full scholarship for own and off campus black students. This should include transportation from the TYP program, owned up to graduation from the university. I mean, I had also that I've been harassment about officials and other dining hall officials at the university and that also I've received. Ricardo will now be, well, Lord, we give a short history of the harassment, of the changes that we've had to go through here. Well, the statement we've prepared is as follows. We the black students at Brandeis University declare our unanimous support of the efforts of liberation wage by brothers at San Francisco State College and the cabinet of the King Timothy Schools.

The racist reaction of the just demands of our black brothers is not unique to that college or to the school board, school committee of Boston, but has manifested itself throughout the academic institutions in the United States and especially here at Brandeis University. Our efforts to confront the administration with demands that both ex-president Saigon and the president, President Abram, deemed justifiable in quotes, principle, has proven only to be a subterfuge of white supremacy. We shall continue our efforts to promote the rights of black students and all black people to earn respect of our manhood in all quarters of this racist society. Now, Lord, you want to, we applied for and got a budget from the student council which handles all student funds on campus.

We worked with that budget, brought out some other black people around the country's topical Michael Cleveland College. Then in April, Dr. King was murdered and on Sunday, following his murder, the white students on campus wanted to get together and have a guilt session as something I propose. So, we decided to try to organize them around some demands and we spent most of the night talking to them and then we went and presented 14 demands to the administration for the following day, which was Monday, April 8th. We split the demands up at that time into immediate demands in ones which were long range. The immediate demands at that time were an African studies department headed by a black man, recruitment of black students, by black students and directed by a black man, employment of black people at all levels of the university.

Ten Martin, five Martin Luther King, junior scholarships, full scholarships. The long range demands were a 10% of the student body black by 1971. After American studies concentration again headed by a black man, a graduate scholarship for black people who wanted to go to grad school and were willing to teach in a black community for the first five years after they got out of grad school. Well, we told them that we'll find you black students, give us $2 an hour, hire five or six of us and we'll go out and find you the black students. We had a response of over 3,000 people who were interested in Brandeis and we tripled our enrollment of black students on campus as Lloyd said. One of the demands now is to further intensify this because there's now this big backlog of black students that we have to get in contact with and yet the university is dragging their heels on these points because they don't particularly care to look over this big black backlog it seems.

Okay, I take it now, we can kind of fill the thing out to the group and things that you have to say. You know, saying, well, we want more black students, he could make them into more middle class white. I mean, an African studies thing is just one part of a whole university. You know, this is, well, it wouldn't really make that much of a difference. You know, everything else is so white oriented. The whole problem with the black community is that there hasn't been a group of people with skills, you know, so-called middle class skills or whatever you want to call it, who have been oriented to helping the masses of the people. It seems to me that on all, you know, I think that there has, there's a fight that has to be fought on all fronts. And like the white university, this is not, I mean, we, what we accomplish here will make a difference.

And I'm sure that if we, when we get what we want here in San Francisco State and it will encourage schools, black students at schools, both black and white to work for changes. Because the black universities function on the same values and standards as to what universities do. And that's why just a black, just having a black administration in itself isn't the answer. You have to have, as a man, Bill Middleton spoke to us today from San Francisco State said, you have to have a black as opposed to a Negro university. And I think the after American Studies Department controlled, as we conceive of it, to be controlled by black people, it will be operated in the interests of black people. We'll be teaching learning things that will instill the proper values and attitudes that we need to have. And, you know, I think that that is a substantial step.

And I think it will make all the difference in the world or be the basis of making all the difference in the world for change, you know what I mean? No, no, no, no, no, no, no. You go up and down, there's no reason. I don't understand. I'm always delighted to talk to students.

I don't know if they are occasional, but I don't know if you can do so. So I'm delighted to be that faculty has got a new net and pass resolution. I'm in sympathy with the faculty of MapleStone. Justin, they are a resolution. And the point, I think, of the resolution should be is that faculty representing a nurse central, or as a community, do not think there should be negotiations in the university under threat support. The dialogue should be free and open as amongst reasonable people. Interfid and common good. Now, if anything else, I'm going to say, Miss Berlin, do you understand the demands that night we could act of marriage? I don't mind. Rather than I assume, or are these demands that would never present to me help, except, I don't think this is a practical institution.

Not by a won't you? I think there are many things around here that can be approved. And I like to prove that I like to have your counsel in this contestant. So I'm here glad to listen to you. When you leave the building, I'll be going to life. Although the Brandeis Afro-American group has stated 10 demands containing 32 components, the one basic issue is not dissimilar to that in public school situations. What is the decision-making role of students? The Brandeis student group demands that an Afro-American studies department be established and that they select the chairman. Faculty members throughout the country shudder at the kind of precedent that would be set by permitting students to select the chairman of a university department. As a university administrator, Brandeis president Mars B. Abram does not himself have the privilege of making faculty selections. Traditionally, faculty members choose new colleagues from among their peers.

Imposs. The faculty won't give in. The administration lacks authority to give in. And the Afro-American students cannot give in. Meanwhile, with each additional 24 hours of their occupation of Fort Hall, Brandeis functions better and better without the building, thus weakening the students' advantage. I don't think they are coming this way, Mingman. I think they're coming probably the other way, which I hope to do, because I don't want to meet the man as we always go on top. Are you afraid in certain sense of skin? I'm afraid I'm at that. But at least if I get attacked, if I survive, I'm going to come back. Mingman, if the man's going to meet me, it's going to hit me. I'll be killing me, that's my belief. Why would you rather have a killing and hurt you? Because I think I have enough scars on my body. Prove that I'm tired of this nonsense, and this crap that I've been taking away. Since I've been at Brandeis, you know,

I've seen white students stand up too towards black students. You know, they write notes on your dough. You know, several students found notes on their dough and say, uh, nigger and other kind of things and stuff like this. White students call it boy. I think that most of the kids here young have accepted a position, and they're willing to struggle with a position. I think when you're young, you often deal with the ideal. And, you know, sometimes that is good. And sometimes it pushes an issue and the issue in this particular instance is racism. It has to be dealt with with a kind of third-world view. And if you can't deal with it like that, then you're always going to get caught up in the man's

negotiation process, which is, you know, really a subterfuse for white supremacy. And then the white students feel that they're being racist because what are we doing? We're just standing here. They can't accept the idea that they're actually irrelevant to the whole thing. And so therefore, they got to get indignant, and they have to be afraid to lose their balls. That's all it is. It blacks in this school, just like white students are in a position of powerlessness, and the only power that they have at the moment is the fact that they're inside Ford Hall. And that power is gone as soon as they leave that building. And that's the first criteria that the prison university has put upon negotiations. It seems absolutely absurd. I mean, that's not what I call negotiations. My door has and always will remain open to any member of the Brandeis community, faculty, students or administration, who have grievances to present. They represent the firm policy and practice of this administration.

I met with the decision students in Ford Hall and asked them to vacate the building so that we could begin the negotiations of grievances under conditions for fitting members of a university community. Well, the major thing here, I think, is that there are some demands made to the university, not once, but twice. And these demands, you know about these demands. And then even they were not implemented. And those that were implemented, as I said in my statement, were just to be a sort of substitute of white supremacy here. It's not an easy thing for a black kid under scholarship at Brandeis University to say, to hell with my future in this academic world. Either I can have it. So be relative to me, or I'm not going to have it at all.

It's quite a hell of a decision. And you have so many black kids make this decision. I think it's a tremendous demonstration that they're together, that a new breed of black man is being born and that America better wakes up to this fact. It is doubtful if Brandeis or any other major college institution understands the nature and the needs of their Afro-American students. Efforts toward this understanding must be demonstrated by action and implemented by changes. To discuss the significance of the actions by Brandeis Afro-American students and to help bring about a relevant educational atmosphere, say brother has invited a group of individuals, each particularly qualified to speak on the issue.

The discussion will be modified by Henry Hampton. Moderated, Jim, I hope, not modified. Good evening and welcome to say brother. It's been eight days now since black students at Brandeis University first took over 4th Hall, and the confrontation still continues. Tonight we have several guests from Boston's Black University community to discuss with us the issues, the involvements, and perhaps to offer some prophecies on the future surrounding the situation at Brandeis. To my extreme right is Miss Doris Francis, who's a student of journalism at Boston University in the native of New York. My immediate right is Mr. Ricardo Millette, who is one of the students from Brandeis. He is undergraduate, he is a graduate, pardon me, but he is also a graduate of the undergraduate school or something. He is, presently, a graduate student in the field of social welfare and community organization. To my immediate left is also another student from Brandeis,

who came here from 4th Hall to discuss the issues with us this evening. And this is Randy Bailey, who is a major in sociology. To his left is Mrs. Bernice Miller of Jackson College. She's an associate dean at the college. And to her left is Skip Griffin, who's a student at Harvard University, is chairman of the Afro-American group at Harvard. Before we begin our discussion, I'd like to read a statement from Dr. Lawrence Fugues, who is a professor of American civilization at Brandeis. Dr. Fugues was scheduled to appear on this program. Quote, upon his arrival at the studio, he decided it would be more appropriate not to have a white professor on a program devoted mainly to a discussion of black feelings and opinions on the concerns of black students at various universities in the Boston area. I think we thank Dr. Fugues for his understanding. To begin with, it's been eight days now. And Ricardo, what is going on at Brandeis at this present moment?

What is going on at Brandeis, I think, is sort of a microscopic experience of what will be going on in the United States. We have a group of black students who have determined to make this community, that is Brandeis community, and the educational experience it has to offer relevant to them. And they have decided, we have decided, to make this experience relevant to us by demanding certain conditions, minimal conditions, which would make it relevant to us. Brandeis, do you think the danger of a violent confrontation has passed, now that it's settled down to a, at this point, a day process?

The position of the students in Fort Hall is not one of violence. We are there demanding our rights as students of a university, as black students, demanding the right to get relevant education. And we have not threatened violence. We are in this building to get our demands. We have not stated that we are going to have violence. We have been threatened with violence, but we are not stating that we're going to bring violence. You think the situation will resolve itself peacefully, then? I hope so. B. When we say will it resolve itself peacefully, what would you consider a resolving of the situation? Finally, getting recognition that black people in a university are going to have education relevant to themselves.

This is all we are stating. This is an issue of black people having relevant education. This is not an issue of student power, as was clearly demonstrated in the film. And you've said this because I've been listening to the broadcast, when at the very beginning of the film, we heard young men say our demands are non-negotiable. Has this at any point been spelled out as to exactly what you mean that we're here to stay until our demands are granted, which is what non-negotiable means? They can't be cut down. There's not going to be any attrition. That's it. Has this been said? Yes. I mean, specifically, out of the category of non-negotiable. Yes, in a communication to President Abram, we stated why. We stated that the demands are minimal. The university has already agreed in general principles. They have agreed that they support these demands. They have agreed to them since April 8, 1968, immediately after Dr. King's murder, when we presented them.

Now what we are stating is we want the implementation because we have been negotiating since April 8th at that time. And we are stating that we have not had this situation resolved. I would like to speak. Well, I guess you said it. And then let me answer your question. You're a black administrator in a predominantly white college, Jackson College, as part of Tufts University. And it could very easily. It's conceivable that you might get caught between this kind of response in the part of black students and the administration. What are your feelings about what's occurring at Brandeis right now? Well, of course, immediately, we're hoping that we'll be able to respond to the needs of our students so that we don't get caught. That's a heck of a bind to be caught in. And there's a tightrope walker who walks at line. How do you walk that tightrope? I don't know how one does it. You're doing one day at a time. It's like being an alcoholic. You just walk it and you hope you don't fall off. And you hope you do it satisfactorily. But I have a feeling that has something

to do with a third year. You sort of feel what I feel because I'm black. I kind of feel what's wanted there. That probably is one of the problems of the Brandeis kids. There's nobody who's black, who's high enough up in the administration to communicate across the lines without going through all the channels, like you say, well, I know how they feel. And I do know how they feel. And I know because I'm one of them. It isn't they. It's only they and I because they are students. And I'm not. That's you. Which focus right there for me. I think this is important. And Ricardo, as a black student and a predominantly white predominantly is not really adequate to express what some universities are. But in a predominantly white institution, where do you go as a black student to talk to someone who can offer an understanding year about your problems? And there are specific problems as a black student in that circumstance. Who do you go to at Brandeis? Well, this is a funny question for me

because I've been at Brandeis for five years. And the first year I was at Brandeis 1964, there wasn't many people you could go to because there weren't many black people around. But at the present time, who do you go to? You go, of course, to your black brothers and sisters, students. And I must add, this year, because of increase in enrollment and because of the demand by the black students that we needed a black advisor, Mr. Lathen Johnson, or a black advisor, has performed this role very adequately. He is a very black person. And he is a person who understands the needs of black students and who has been trying to communicate this need to the administration. What's his role in the university itself?

Well, right now, he's been given many titles. The black students prefer to think of him as a black advisor. The administration prefers to think of him as the assistant dean of students. But in realistic terms, he is indeed the black advisor to black students. Other than this, there is the African American Society. This is where most of the black kids go. We hash out our problems. We have seminars each week in black ideology, black thought, black feeling. We iron out our own problems. We've tried to bring soul food to the campus, have our soul parties. And just being minority at Brandeis, as you said, a predominantly white university. The necessity of feeling black is more of a well-ming than it would be if you were to all black college.

Another predominantly white institution is Harvard. Skip Griffin, Harvard seems to have avoided the kind of confrontation that Brandeis is undergoing. What are some of the factors that avoidance? Well, I think each university is different in response to black students. Harvard has not taken a rigid stance like Brandeis or some of the other schools. To this point, been somewhat understanding. However, the whole process of negotiation seems to be slowing down. We still haven't had a black curriculum developed. I think the main reason why there hasn't been any conflict at Harvard is precisely because they're trying or they seem on the surface to understand the problem and are trying to move towards some solution. Do you have some plan by which you can determine

if they're moving fast enough or if they're moving in directions which you've actually required? In other words, at one point do you say things are not happening quickly enough or happening to our satisfaction? Well, that point comes February 11th when the faculty decides whether or not they're going to approve the CEP's recommendation to establish a black studies department and to hire black professors to head up this department and to establish an Afro-American center as a place where black people can go and socialize and discuss ideas about what they want to do in the future. To this point, Harvard has a process through which you go through to make any innovations in the school. And the CEP is the first major step and they have approved the program. CEP is a committee on educational policies. And is there an executive job involved there? Will there be one single person, for instance?

Are you demanding what you'd be about? I'm demanding that there be two people to head up a black studies department and that they'd be selected by a committee of students and faculty members. We would like to think, well, we'd like Brandeis feel that it is necessary essential that we approve the person who's selected to head up this department. There is, you go to another university, which seems to have been part of what it trouble. Boston University was the scene of a black takeover. I believe it was the administration building. Was the president's office? President's office. And yet that was successfully resolved without a violent confrontation. Well, I think the major difference between BU and Harvard or BU and Brandeis is that there are different personalities involved. And we happen to have a president who was chosen because he's a very good-looking man, and he's a perfect PR man.

And he never comes off looking badly in the press. And he, when it became known that the building was taken over, he held an immediate press conference. And he immediately worked to see that things would be done. And as a result, we have these things that people at Brandeis and people at Harvard are asking for. We have a center. We have also increased enrollment of students. And they've made room in the dormitories for Roxbury students to come and live, which is something they didn't do. If you live near enough school to commute, they usually wouldn't give you a dormitory room. But they have made efforts to see that black students from the surrounding Boston area could live on campus. Were the university students at Boston University able to choose the person who heads up programs mainly concerning blacks? Well, as a matter of fact, the man who heads this center, John Cawt, right,

I understand that there's a lot of dissatisfaction with him. People like to toss around words like Uncle Tom. And they call him Uncle Tom. I know the man personally. He was in my school, a professor in my school, a public relations professor. He was divided into schools. And in my particular school, school, I'm in. He was a professor. And he did me a very great favor once, because I was a black student. And I feel that the man is trying. The kid's main gripe with him is that he is part of the administration. He tries to work with the administration for the kids. And everyone is sort of bomb throwing bag. These days. And so there's a lot of dissatisfaction with him. They wanted to pose him. But they haven't. It got a real case. Randy, I've been listening to Radio Talk shows this past week.

And you've managed to become the starring topic of conversation. But seriously, you are risking quite a bet. You're risking an educational future. You're risking conceivably bodily harm. What series of incidents took place to bring you to the point where you were willing to risk a future and good health to achieve a certain goal? Well, as I stated on April 8, 1968, right after Martin Luther King's murder, we presented a series of demands to the university, which was spoken to in the film. And one of those demands was the setting up of an African-American affairs advisory council, which would be made up of five administrators, five faculty, intense students, seven black and three white, which were going to make sure that these demands would be implemented. Now, in July, President Abram before he became president of the university, became a member ex officio of this committee

so that he would know what he was getting himself into, when he became president of Brandeis. And then he chaired this committee since that is inauguration. Since September, he's been chairman of this committee. And this committee has been trying to get these demands implemented. Now, the demands that we have presented are the same demands that we presented in April, but except for number seven, because number seven happened right before Christmas and not at that time. And we have been negotiating and negotiating these demands through this advisory council. And what has happened is that we have not gotten what we wanted. We asked for an Afro-American and African studies department. What we got was a concentration, in fact. And now, what we are stating is what we have to have,

these things which have been negotiated all this time. I'm trying to reach for that personal decision-making level. One of the young men has taken to consideration the whole history of black people in this country. It's not only the present situation at Brandeis. It's what that situation and the confrontation symbolizes. It symbolizes a demand by black people to gain power in an environment that influences their lives. Now, a lot of these men and women I should call them, and not kids, because they have made this decision, come to realize that their father before them, their great-grandfather before them, been living in a country which have not allowed them the right to be men, which have not allowed them the right to assume

that the decision-making processes which influence their lives. And these men and women in Ford Hall are demanding the right to be that men and women. And they're willing to die. I have me die for this right. It's a simple matter of power. It's the whole way you achieve victory. We have to achieve victory the way we wanted. We do not want it handed down to us like, well, this is a piece of pie. I'm going to give you because you behave a good boy. And this has been the general way in which victory is always been given to the black man. And we are not taking that anymore. We want victory the way we've outlined it. We want a piece of that power. Either you want to give it to us or you're not. We hope that this seed, this temperament,

will be one which would be planted at Brandeis and grow and blossom throughout the United States. That's why I stated earlier in the program that what's happening at Brandeis is a microscopic example, a model of what will eventually happen in this society. What kind of look in view of Columbia, for instance, which is one of the first takeover type situations, places like Columbia. And this recent takeover at Harvard, the white student sitting in on the faculty meeting, and the results that at Harvard, they were on probation, I think they were suspended at Columbia. And nothing has happened at Columbia, in spite of all the blood, all the pictures. How is the decision reached to take over the building? What makes you believe in the efficacy of taking over the building in view of the fact that people who have taken over buildings

have only failed with administrations and with schools? Well, you're asking me what was the rational plan behind taking over a ford hall other than any other place? Yeah, taking over ford hall rather than any other kind of demonstration. Why that sort of a demonstration in particular? First of all, ford hall houses the communication, the switchboard for the university, and it houses some valuable equipment. Plus the fact it houses the one little room where Mr. Johnson, I said it before, the black advisor has his office, and it's one room or center, ironically, that black people have come together to hold their meetings and to speak with Mr. Johnson and so forth. And ironically, that's the building we happened to be in the moment we made the decision. So things just happened like that.

I've got to challenge one thing you said to our student, you said that they had been failures, but for example, in San Francisco State, I think by no stretch of the imagination is that a failure, particularly, because anytime you force the people in the state to confront the trustees of that university and their rigidity, people like it, Rafferty and Ronald Reagan, and actually begin to create significant changes in the university structure, or at least pose the question about change. It's not a failure. But a stake, a stake college, I think, would be different than a private college. Do you see what I mean? People wouldn't be paying taxes, and people would probably have a lot less at stake. The public, something like Columbia, a highly private university, something like Harvard. You know, say Harvard is one of the most powerful businesses in the country. I don't agree, some kind of president of Columbia would agree that the students had failed, but. No, well, when Mark Rodriguez here, he said that they had achieved nothing, that all they got was that the dean's office doors were open,

and he said that in spite of the fact that they, you know, that there was all this fighting and everything that he said that it had done nothing, the demonstration to change Columbia. The fact is that this is not another Columbia. What we are in fact stating is that there are not black faculty people at Brandeis. There is a visiting lecturer, but there is not permanent black faculty people at Brandeis at present. What we are stating is the black people at Brandeis now consist of the students. And this is not a, you know, just student power. It happens that we are students, but the essence is that black people have to control their destinies within the white institutions of this country to make it relevant to us. And we are not stating, approaching this, you know, million level of student power like at Columbia. This is an issue of our black people going to control our destinies in the institution.

At Brandeis, the case is that the only black faculty member that there is at the moment is a visiting lecturer. And so the thing is that we don't have the, this is not the same thing as Columbia. This is not just student power. This is the whole issue of our black people finally going to be able to control them. We are not stating that we want the student power of Columbia. We are stating, you know, do we have, do black people have the, right? We are putting it at this that issue. But we say black people have the right to control what is their destiny within the institution. At Brandeis, it happens to be that the students are the people. Yeah, well, don't you think, don't you think that student power is involved if students are going to choose a faculty head? Isn't this, isn't this a big issue, there's a big issue that everyone is against? No, I don't know. I think there's a danger in interpreting moves

made by black students as student problems per se. Because I like to think that black students are an extension of the black community. And that the struggle on universities is just an extension of the struggle of black people. And I think the rationale behind taking over a building comes out of the understanding of the relationship between the powers that be in black people. I think black students today understand that we are powerless people and that these universities are power groups. And we understand that power never conceives anything without a struggle, whether it's a moral struggle or a physical struggle. This is exactly what we have to deal with. The other thing is that taking over a building represents a new form of protest, a non-acceptable form of protest. And this whole manner is hooked up in gaining one's freedom. If one protest by the rules which have been set down by the power structure, one is really not

becoming free from the man. He's still under the man's grips, you know. Yeah, well, let's follow that. But you're a person who's got what foot in the academic community and the other very distinctly in the black community. Where are we going from that perspective? Well, I was going to say one thing. And I think we ought to clear that up very carefully. I would think that if we sat here and talked very much about the, we can talk about the tactics because we've seen those, you know, taking over the building. But I'm sure the tactics are a part of a strategy that was very well planned. And if this is true, and we do think of the black campus as a faction or a part or an arm of the black community, certainly we aren't going to go into a large conversation about strategies on the air. I hope not. I'm certainly not going to be a part of that. So that would, you know, that would take care of that. I think it is really, very true that large power groups

do view power in a mercantile sort of way, like a discrete item. And if we give you some of it, we have less for ourselves. And I think there's another way to look at power. It can be shared. I think this is what we're talking about in the community that when we govern, we wish to govern in a group of students, parents, and community leaders. This is the organizing principle behind the King cabinet. I think if I'm reading you, this is what you're saying. I don't think that you're really saying what it's been interpreted to us as. I don't think, I think it's exactly what you say it is, that if you take one, if you take it out of one group's hands and give it to the other group, then you have the same kind of situation of crewing. What you're saying is that you want a group of people of your choosing with representatives from each segment in the university to sit down with each having an equal vote

to choose the persons that are going to do this thing that you want done. Is that what you're saying? What we have sent to the administration, the whole question here is the selection board. Who's going to select the director for the African African American Studies Department? Now, the proposal that we sent in a while ago was that the three black students of Brandeis would be on this committee. And three black academicians, which we would choose. And the dean of faculty from Brandeis, who is white, we would accept this person on the committee, that this would be the committee. Red from Virgil Wood stated this very eloquently yesterday in the Martin Luther King birthday service, which I attended, which I spoke. And he stated the issue very clearly that this is the area of black culture. I think that all of us here agree that when it comes to black culture, which is in essence, the African American African Studies

Department, that black people know what black culture is. I'm sure we have had courses where we see that when the students, the only black students, are the only black people in the room, it becomes a process of white people picking our brains to find out what is it like to be black. Now, we already know what it's like to be black. And that is not the issue of the African African African Studies Department. We already know what it's like to be black. And for us to sit there and to answer to white students, this is what it's like to be black. We aren't getting anything out of the course. And what we want is black people there controlling this. And we are stating that it's not the selection board that's going to control the department. The selection board wants to make sure that we get the right director. We want to state, once we have examined every possible person that we can come up with, that we have chosen the person that epitomizes what we want at Brandeis, what we had as black people. And I would assume black people all over the country would assume that this is what we call the person who

is going to lead the way in this department. And then that person is free. The selection committee is dissolved. That person starts through the university procedures in directing that program. Now, we have stated, we want a department with the right to hire and fire, which clearly states that we don't want the selection committee does not want to control that department. We want to make sure that it gets set off right by a black person, which we have full confidence in, which sign the selection committee goes into, is no longer in effect. And we assure that this person, the director, or the chairman of this department, is the one who is involved in the hiring and firing. The selection committee clearly stated in that to me, and is not that the selection committee control the department, but that the department, chairman, control that department. And I think this is the issue right here raised by this. Our black people who know exactly what

it's like to be black, going to sit in black courses to have white people ask us what it's like to be black, or our black people are going to be running this program and working within the framework of, we already know what it's like to be black, in which the white students will get out of this, plus the added dimension of black people demonstrating what black art is. This is the whole issue of the program. This is essential, if any black studies, as we call it, African-American and African studies department, is going to be of any relevance to black people and to white people. Now it's just relevant to white people. They're asking us what it's like to be black. We're telling them we aren't getting anything out of it. And this is the situation that we've been at. But let me ask you, we can clear one other thing here. There's been a lot of confusion about the number of demands. Ten, the president said something about 32. What is the fact here? I think we can address himself to that question of more explicit like man. As I stated, these demands had already been negotiated. They already know what these demands were. And we presented them in shorthand form.

Now, stating just what the demand was. The administration said, we don't exactly understand what you want. So we wrote out, on each demand, point by point, what this demand means. And now they've added this up in state. This is 32 demands. Now, an issue right here is the fact that we have stated that the brochure be sent out. The brochure called the Blackstone of Brandeis be sent out immediately. We have been writing this brochure. And the administration has been editing it. We started on June 9, 1968. Now, the answer to the administration, the fact that the brochure has already been sent to the publisher. Now, what we stated in a point of clarification is that the brochure go out immediately. In any future thing, the administration asked the African-American organization to do. In behalf of black people, be done by black people. Now, we want a recruiting program which the administration says are going to give us. Now, we need a film for recruiting.

This is going to be a vital issue. Our black people are going to be able to make all the film do the editing or is the administration who is mainly going to tell us what is relevant to other black people. This is the only issue here. The administration has started to address himself to this particular issue. And this is why we are still in the building. They have not addressed themselves this issue. They have not said, yes, they have not said no. We are waiting for that answer. Yes, I know. Let me ask you another question here. Do you think that what's been occurring in Fort Hall has been fairly and accurately reported in the White Press in Saudi Abastan? I don't think you can fight a black revolution with the help of a white press. Lately, in the last couple of days, the press has been attempting to be a bit more objective about it. Oh, like newspapers, we try to allow any black reporters in. They most probably try to report objectively what's going on in the building.

And of course, they have to send it to the home office. And the home office is going to take the most controversial aspect of it for editorial papers. They have to sell their papers. And they're also white. I think it's been basically in the last couple of days reasonable. Not totally. It has improved in the last couple of days. What I think has counteracted the false and equivocations of the press is that we've gotten this black bullet now, which has been written inside of the building by the students inside of the building. And this has been the most objective report, or press release, he can say we've had. Has the university made any offers for the use of their public relations department or help of that kind? No, the University of Not. I knew the answer before.

Very quickly, can we just get around Robin opinion here of is this kind of seizure and confrontation process going to continue? Skip? Well, he just touched upon a point that I'd like to extend on a little bit. I think confrontations will continue. But only if the process of negotiation fails. See, what most people don't realize is that confrontation or seizures are not the first step. These people have gone through a process of negotiation. The people at San Francisco state went through a process of negotiation. We at Harvard have gone through a process of negotiation. Do you think it's going to continue in that fun? Well, if the negotiations are not fruitful, then you have to resort to other forms of protest. Because the demands are essential to the survival and development of our people. Maybe we only have a little time left. If we didn't have to go college by college, as I say about the black community school

by school or neighborhood by neighborhood, and we wouldn't have to go this long route and finally end up with a frontal kind of thing. But I have no feeling that we won't have to go that route. And I believe what you say is that it is true that we're going to have to bring it out in the open. After it's all been negotiated out, and then it comes to what will you settle for? That's really what the last stage of the negotiation means, will you settle for this? We both hope that very much the same. I'm sorry, we're out of town. I might find it enlightening and interesting experience. I'd like to thank all of you for having joined us tonight and wish, especially, Randy and Ricardo, the best of luck. I'm sure you were going to make it, if not in this particular instance, and we will all make it within days. Black power on the university campus, slightly altered, but equally effective. Say, brother, thanks you for joining us, and we'll see you again next week. Good evening. Good evening. Say, brother.

Say, brother. Say, brother. Say, brother. Say, brother.