Specifics of General Education at Wichita State; Dr. John Brazille

[Lewis Foster] Hello and welcome to University in your Community, my name is Louis Foster, and today we're concluding our series on the general education program at Wichita State and I am very honored to have as my guest Dr. John Brazille vice president for academic affairs and professor in the physics Department here at Wichita State to conclude our series on general education, an overview of the new program at university. First of all I thank you very much for coming by I know you have a very busy schedule and taking time off to talk to us about general education. [Dr. Brazille] Well it's a pleasure to be here louis, I appreciate the invitation and it's an important topic and series you done it has been a very informative one. [Lewis Foster] Ok first of all could we start by just getting your views on general education and what role do you think it's supply and a contemporary university. [Dr. Brazille] I suppose I would begin by simply giving you some words, that come to mind, as I think about a general education. The first one is a part of the name general, the second would be that word universal, the third would be the word basic, there would be the word continuity, there would be

the matter of remaining in touch with the traditions of the culture in society. And I suppose in summary I would think of all those, in that sense the development, potential for development for the individual, and potential for development collectively, for a society our culture. It seems to me that we all start with a certain potential for development as individuals. That shaped, in part, by the genetic material we inherit, but it's also shaping important ways by our ability to understand, to grasp, to be a part of, and to build, on the culture in which we find ourselves, and the accomplishment of previous ages or eras.It seems to me that in its essence that's what general education is about. It's the effort to provide for each of our students that contact with all those factors, which will make possible their own professional

development, or capacity for development, presonal development, more than professional development in a sense, and I suppose that we have parallel goals for the development of the collective society, which were part, and the hope that the general education from the university contributes also to that potential for development by building on the past. [Lewis Foster] How big a role do you feel universally can have? You talk about society and the development of an individual and the environment that there in? How big of a role does the university play in that? [Dr. Brazille] I suppose if we began with individuals, I don't know what the average lifespan in america today is, it must be somewhere in the seventy year range, and if one understands at a university might have a student for four out of seventy five years of the lifetime of that student, then one might almost

despair of having a major impact, simply in terms of a portion of the total time of that student which you have. On the other hand, the time of college, and the college experience, is for most people a time when they're also shaping their lives in some significant and fundamental ways. I happy believe it's a time when there are more open to ideas, more open to influence than maybe at other times, and that therefore we ought not underestimate the capacity of the university to affect that developmental potential for the individual. In terms of our impact on society, I suppose that's more problematic in a sense. If we believe that, as a society, we somehow behave collectively in ways that depend, on important aspects, on understanding the past, on having values, on being able to articulate those, on being able to grasp the fundamental ideas

inherent in the public policy debates that go on about us. Then I guess I believe we have to think the univiersity can influence that. [Lewis Foster] Why should we, why should we be concerned about general education, and it seems like most of today's students are going to very specialized careers, certain areas like medicine and even education, are becoming very specialized, how do you, why should students even be concerned with general education. [Dr. Brazille] Well I'd assume that not all of their lives or all of the twenty four hours of each day of their lifes will be spent in those specialized pursuits, and that they are our whole entire individuals that they have in addition to their professional aspirations are they have artistic interest. They have intrests in communicating, and being in touch with the culture of which there are apart and that therefore general education is important for them. All so, beyond that of course there are the skills area of the general education

curriculum which certainly are important and equipping anyone with a basic tools that are necessary for such specialization as they may wish to enter. I guess I don't see the question specialization necessarily being in conflict with having a require program of general education. The education program in many ways, are undergirds and underlies that specialization which they will later enguage in. [Lewis Foster] Some people say that the ideas associated with general education don't really take root till a person is out of college and into his or her life choices, as far as employment and things such as that. Do you feel that general education might be wasted on the young? [Dr. Brazille] I don't general education is wasted on any one, and I particularly don't think it's wasted on the young. To go back to the point with which I began and that is the

matter of thinking of general education as being related to capacity for development. It just seemed obvious to me in that context that the capacity for development is perhaps most influenceable at an early age, and that alone would more than justify the idea that you start with a program of general education as early as possible in the life of the student. In many ways it really begins in pre college days. The public schools are involved in very fundamental ways in general education. [Lewis Foster] Do you feel that the general education to kinda go on that point, to carry a little further, do you feel that that the general education areas of pre college secondary schools, is that weak or do you think that needs to be upgraded a little? [Dr. Brazille] Well it's easy and i almost faddished to be critical of the public higher education, I'm sorry public school education, elementary and secondary school education.

My own sense is, that if one considers both the ranger persons reached, as well as, the depths of the treatment of the topics which are covered in those situations that in many ways you have to be impressed with public education in america. We reach a significantly larger percentage of our total population with those experiences than is true of most of the cultures and societies of the world. So that in many ways, I think that we are to be commended for the effort we made to include everyone, in the society, in that education experience, in the way in which we do in america. Obviously there's room for improvement and my own sense is that it's in everyone's best interest the universities, as well as, the public schools, to try cooperatively to develop the improvements that do need to be made. [Lewis Foster] How do you view your own responsibility towards general education programs?

[Dr. Brazille] Well I suppose that the vice president for academic affairs has certain university wide responsibilities in general education is one of those. We organize our universities today largely around departmental structure, And if one asked where does the responsibility rest in the university for the development of sound program in mathematics the answer is very obvious it rests first in a fundamental way with a mathematics department. There are a number of areas of activity for university where there is no obvious answer of that kind, and if you ask where does the responsibility for general education rest, within the university, then there is no department of general education. It's somehow a collective responsibility of the university. Every faculty member had some responsibility for it but it's certainly among the functions of a vice president for academic affairs

to try to see to it that the collective actions, of all of the department's, makes some sense for the point of view of general education, as well as, from the point of view of the specialized programs of those departments. [Lewis Foster] The goals of the Wichita State program mention attempting to help a student gain a sense of the past or develop a considered value system. Now obviously is a very somewhat vauge and abstract. Is there any real way of measuring these type of goals of the general education program. [Dr. Brazille] The whole problem quantifying or measuring in concrete terms of the outcomes of education process is a very difficult on once you move outside of skills areas themselves. That's probably particularly true for the goals of general education that framed in the language of your question.

Helping students to gain a sense of the past, or helping students to build a considered value system. I suspect that you have to rely on a large measure on the testimony of students, about whether that has or has not happened, as a result of their experiences in the university. I do believe by conducting interviews with students, over the full span of their collegent career, that you can make some valid judgments about whether the institution has or has not help that student gain a sense of the past or develop a value system. [Lewis Foster] If you're limited only one objective for the general education curriculum what would be? [Dr. Brazille] Well I suppose I should object to being limited to one objective [Laughter] for the general education curriculum and so i'm not sure I would choose to answer in terms

of a single objective. I suppose more than anything else I see the objective as being, equipping persons to make learning a lifelong process. To assume their responsibilities throughout their lives and careers for a continuation of the learning process.In all of its dimensions not just in specialized areas of theirs profession, or their trade, or their practice, but in the broader areas that relate to the overall quality of life. The things they enjoy the aesthetics of what they're engaged in the value systems they have and how they reflect that value system in their daily lives and in the collective lives of the community and their role in that community. Their sense of the importance of the past of the culture that they live, and their willingness to make commitments in their personal lives

to the furtherence of the development of that culture in the future. All those seem to me, in the final analysis, to be things that individual must assume personal responsibility for and I guess my objective for the general education curriculum, if I had to settle for one, would be that building into... we help our students to build into their own character and being the capacities for that independent reflective responsible kind of a life. [Lewis Foster] The idea of general education especially to students and even to some faculty, is is not a very popular concept, almost like something just to get out of the way or something that keeps you from graduating if you forgotten something at the end of your four years that you haven't taken. How are you feel that we can get students to appreciate, or explain the values of a general education?

[Dr. Brazille] Well I'm suppose that I'm more convinced of the importance of our continuing to try to find ways to do that, than I am convinced of my ability to tell you what those ways are. In a very fundamental sense, what we've all in this series probably describe as general education is central to the whole process of education, and if we can't communicate it's important for our students then we failed in very fundamental ways to educate them, or to assist them in assuming responsibility for their own self education in the future. It seems to me there are some things we can do. We may be able to change the tenor of the conversation that goes on our counseling and advising session. It may be not that students have difficulty in grasping the importance

of general education, but that we aid in abet that in ways that we may not always be because concious of, by the tone we use and the way in which we treat the matter in the advising process. I would certainly think that each of us who are involved in the advising of students could rexamine how we treat general education in that setting. In other ways we may be able to address the problem by, from time to time, sponsoring seminars or workshops in which we try to address specifically the issue of the importance of general education to students. I suppose this series broadcast is in a way that kind of a workshop- [Lewis Foster] Hopefully, yes, hopefully we can enlighten students and some of the faculty, also, to try to become a little more positive about general education. Well thank you very much for comming by I have appreciated and enjoyed talking to the general education. My guest is been Dr. John Brazille, vice president for academic affairs here Wichita State, and we've been speaking on the

general education program, and thanks very much for comming by. [Dr. Brazille] Your certainly welcome. [Lewis Foster] This has been] University in Your Community my name is Louis Foster, feed production assistance from Dave Causloy. stay tuned a new addition we'll continue after this.