Seven Days; Power in the Legislature/PGE-Enron merger update

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but bat bat bat bat bat bat who it's beans hi i'm stephanie fowler and this is seven days our topics this week power politics in the oregon house and an update on the power merger between the enron corporation and portland general electric let's meet this week's panel nassim rocket is the capital correspondent for the consortium for public radio in oregon

david steele is a columnist at the salem statesman journal the mckenzie is a reporter for the oregonian and hostile hearing is the editor of the albany democrat harold washington county representative jack carpenter brought the oregon house to a standstill when he tried to force a floor vote on a bill banning job discrimination based on sexual orientation carpenter's fellow republicans walked out of the capital rather than suffer an embarrassing defeat on the floor and took more than a day in negotiations to reach a compromise that satisfied carpenter and other republicans the scene why this happened how could one legislator to bring halt legislature to a standstill when wyatt happened has it says a lot about the leadership of the republicans have to realize that right now the republican house and the houses got a very slim majority for the republicans is thirty one republicans twenty nine democrats and that means that the speaker of the house unlike west has got to keep a very stronghold of what's going on in there and he was unable to do that the bill that is speaking about the end of the health care act a bill that would stop discrimination in the workplace for gays and

lesbians on that bill would not moving in this particular committee but chuck carpenter and what were the one of the sponsors of the bill had the votes for it in the house and there's some talk about even having the hope both for it in the senate but nevertheless you definitely have the votes for a new house he was upset that it was being stuck essentially and committee by one person didn't think that was part of the democratic process that he was there representing and so he can by law and by parliamentary procedure move that does make a motion to move that bill out of the committee that it was woodstock and essentially and move it on to the floor for a vote and is used very rarely because it is a direct challenge to leadership right is very rarely and at the end when it has been used and their recollection of the people that are there the building can't remember a time when it's actually been used successfully calm i would say what we saw this week was a successful move by carpenter because there is going to be movement on in and the law it's in between chris ritter and when quizzed group that we knew about

eating in private or in public and which really quickly retreated over there were lots of discussions going on on bathing characterized by represented carpenter has now been very productive and the conversations were in the caucus and those compositions also were amongst the speaker long closed and also representative minutes who chaired the committee where the bill was stuck on and sit and debate these jets representative covering their hand arm tried to move that bill out of ministers committee into the commerce committee earlier on and knowing that that we would've gotten a more easy reception at that point in this piece has not been in favor of this particular representative menace that has said as it is not the end of it that is not a fan of protective nobody really would like to broaden some kind of legislation to eliminate discrimination all kinds in the workplace and the so surprisingly he's talking about is the discrimination against short people by fiat implication i

guess he also thought about discrimination against all people in unions or with people if we can and it made sense that culture has and it's not entirely clear that it's not to me whether he's a serious about those know whether he's trying to use that are that kind of seen as a way to ridicule of bell because the question was it was a really serious movement to move that they'll argue that america's even hold a hearing on the bill on an ingredient re crafted into something that both the democrats and the republicans could support and there wasn't seeing any real serious movement in that direction and the thing complicating it was that in the senate side there is a bill that would help fans of the bans on gay marriage is and that's a honda fit that bill didn't seek did have a hearing and there had been some discussions between the republicans on and the democrats about bill would not have a hearing because those two controversy over and we have to get a hearing we did start seeing movement from represented carpenter it set a date of april

fifteenth there was his self imposed deadline to keep the bill moving he wanted action by men it was monday the fourteenth he saw nothing was happening certainly made as parliamentary effort to get moving on there have been ongoing negotiations are behind the scenes to try to our island get some version of that bill that could move at bala business lobbyists and when the big province with what direction and mrs jennings trying to do he was actually yeah trying to a bailout that didn't specifically on protect gays lesbians from workplace discrimination he wanted to avoid that have specific language which is perceived by cultural conservatives as a special treatment it's really difficult for conservatives to go along with many other problems trying to protect this this group of people without specifying it's and then are you protecting everybody and creating a problem with lawsuits anytime some he's dismissed from their job they can claim that they were discriminated against mass with the business community was

concerned with an hour adam carpenter was really concerned that with what what what little athens was exerting it was going to pay the bill in the wrong direction so he wanted to get it in two different that you didn't always have a certain obligation to get some form of that bailout that included sensory protection for gays and lesbians because i had understood there was an actual agreement that i the republicans were it would pass the job discrimination europe the band and job discrimination in exchange for no one pushing the gay marriage or legalization of gay marriage in a state race that is or any trace attorney general understanding that there was a really uneasy truce of being in the session let's not push more more of a dramatic a sweeping you know gay rights or anti gay rights legislation that would fit right into that kind of an agreement that there was this long ongoing very tenuous effort to try to do something good it makes us us everybody which is to protect people

from discrimination just because of the central park ranger for any other make sense of what makes no says to people is that when we ask people about this commission are ways of him as a guest that as a matter of course but then when you ask them exactly what that means of the day think for example that you should be able to discriminate it is people who don't like for whatever reason however yesterday do you think you ought to be or not to hire somebody cause you don't like the sound of their last name or the sound of the first name or that or simply the way they acted in every workplace you have certain class workers who serve at the pleasure of the basically the boss and they can be dismissed for and for all those reasons for no reason at all and if you're going to protect people from you know being dismissed with no big cars and that was one of the problems is that certain people might be given a perpetual employment or else the right to sue and win it isn't there a larger issue here until rather than memo that we're

talking a lot about the issue of gay rights in one from one perspective that is what happened here with carpenter was really part of the larger issue about the relative control republicans have over the house and what this might portend for budget discussions leader and whether it's education or other areas and possessiveness he was pointed out there is that there are only a thirty one republicans and it needs a taste for young people in the house to pass anything so the defection of even a single person will support will simply a paralyzed dollar operation in this case there was a defection to love it with the twenty nine democrats two republicans and a majority say they happen after twenty nine democrats out in support of this bill than a carpenter then the republicans turned pull out a committee carpenter and another republican jim hill to pass that down and that's really it the issue that may or may

not return something for budget negotiations and at the point is how much i think david you wrote i think something like you know i think like there's seven as it's just one of those things that happening and you write the question is well what happened more or ryan beyond budget has all kinds of issues budgets are actually so intertwined with all kinds of other decisions to pass a public school funding budget for example that could be very difficult to pull maneuver like that and win but you can actually eat you can stop things and in that not so coincidentally have those two representatives of the two republicans in the house who are refusing to go on right now with the budget agreement on which include some money for schools which democrats say is inadequate a lot of people think that there's even more than to those released the two american abdi find too that are willing to go along and pointed out that there is also the potential for some kind of rebellion as we saw in the nineteen seventies and most recently in the last session in nineteen ninety five when there was an incipient rebellion was crushed by minutes

but in the senate is if you remember them and a minority of democrats joined the republicans to take over the house on the icy that the speaker that sort of thing could happen again and the commander but they're not in this particular case and what it really illustrates to me anyway is that those people opposed to the very best's far away it kind of is dr salk overhear especially pointed out yellow says while no signs of happens among friends and on the sense that if it and the wrong you'd be out of a job gets even enhanced i really think that that because i think at least on the democrats for example said that the bottom always that they set that they had their respects was bigger and the way this was handled or because he missed his control situation and then he'll well it's just that they say at and strain well i think that in the legislative process in his personal relationships and the legislature that it also

something do with respect and demonstrators are intertwined as i say that the speaker's position is very precarious and he could be unseated him at any moment by two republicans joined the democrats even during the internet pipe at the passion behind passion this week i don't think that that's what we are particularly looking at what but i do think that you know that that list is being seen it's as handling this if you won easily deft he's had to handle it well but if there is a lot still a lot of question about what has is how strong is his leadership in the things that they're pointing to are two different things and one of them being the budget and the other thing that this and other bills out there that that early on in the sessions arab in agreement not to hear these bills not do your bills that for example you don't have votes for on the house floor you don't have votes on the senate floor or just yesterday there was a very emotional promotional hearing about a parental notification bill a bill that that's that the speaker

was told me early on during the week that he had no idea that that hearing was going to take place and there's some question about whether he's really knows what is going on among his own house representative numbers as well that he thinks he has a thing is that to slow cruel moment the republican caucus itself is very real split it is not a unified group and innovators of years ago china preside over a house that is on the one hand this twenty nine democrats are very well in ireland more stories on the anniversary when republicans were really not thirty one republicans unlikely seventeen or eighteen in part one faction and there are some others that you never know exactly what they're the messiah or don't act react a particular issue so this is it as positions especially great week back to avoid the consummate about the fact that the democrats voiced this respect for this week and i think what what that is worth is that well they've demonstrated their they are willing to go along with the couple never republicans if it

serves their interests they also took great pains to point out that they didn't initiate this nie given their respect for the way that the speaker handle the situation that they have no plans to initiate that kind of area of a coalition to take over the house so i think that messieurs schrieber well in the future what does this do for the gathering does it strengthen his negotiating here and i know they were they were negotiating a budget this week in negotiations broke got to do this and then to end this this show is sharing in this audience demonstration of fish aaron and the house thank god i think it strengthens it and in the sense that it's not a done deal that what worked what came out on yesterday in terms of the republican proposal for an a budget it is not a done deal that they can't they will go through the senate it will have the votes in the senate to support and found that it will not pass the house it doesn't have the votes in the house and so it strengthens it because it gives more time for negotiation there's even rumors right now that the senate might adjourned for a while and let the house work out their

budget and zinc and ads and because that is where the arguments are going to be right now our representative carpenter and talking with him today about were things at with the budget he said well you know we've got more than two people that that are not in favor with what republicans came out with and right now they're threatening representative cart carpenters the chairperson of the human resource committee threatening to human resource budgets he doesn't go along with the education budget but they need as though they need his vote they can't punish unlikely business two years ago and after sizing for a while they need the problem with this points to and the dynamics of the whole capital words like general the governor is it there are lots of points of power to stop things and like things on the senate can not go on with what the house comes up with the governor can veto bills but where that the power is to actually move something through both houses and past governors desk seems very tenuous on its cult million have come down to negotiating a compromise deal and people are still too much and that in the

posturing position to take i think it'll happen anytime soon i think it's possible that the government will become a common will be coming out will better for most of the budget negotiations have been moving moment his way to the great big stumbling block remains what to do with a clip from either side republicans of course and then most of the house republicans are adamant that it's going to go back to the taxpayers but it turns out that the budgets and the captain belzer nothing can be passed and is now about the middle of june they're still getting a real fourth of july and then there's two they're staring and august all these guys they make change and as i'm david has pointed out the governor has a very very powerful weapon of of the veto and also and they need his agreement that is no matter how many house with the whole legislature legislature is in all kinds of actions at the other the day they gonna need the governor's signature on whatever they pass and we saw a couple years ago that alton and everything seemed very rosy uncommon

suddenly that refers to fifty something goes by that could easily happen again this time and then you know the whole of posturing now means absolutely nothing cause nothing came up yes i was eleven proposed merger between houston natural gas giant enron and roll in general electric appeared all the dead after the staff of the oregon public utilities commission formally recommended rejection of video that at the beginning of this week video was suddenly back on track go to blame the pc age and ryan are pg of it isn't a question but the portland generally portland general linked because and it was clear that it was going to get through under conditions enabling out and said in essence probably to portland general whenever we pay more if you want this deal done some of that to come up with the money in portland general came out with about thirty five million dollars from their shareholders to make it work why did find some nights it was willing to take more out of its shareholders

the media must have concluded that they were not in a strong competitive position if this deal didn't go through and that there may be worse off personally i think that pj vogt i think that they could've gone on the table and said what wall street and telling and on which is this is an important deals for you and if you lose it and you can do with a bunch of conditions in oregon that has a lot of implications for their sense of the credibility of your company i think we're scared and fiji has been saying and all along that the reason i'm on one of the dvd was that he was such a wonderful company great management wonderful assets a terrific go whale operating a very an efficient operation that's r and a sow this all out by giving him on the sign by pg they there's something visibly and again until the clams of that made the only a few weeks before lewis john o'farrell meeting

you had people like the president of enron saying in public alone out in oregon we funded through on checks of information source is going out there and saying this this deal in critical of enron kind of laying the groundwork for saying well maybe you need this thing will fail and i think wall street basically came back and the senate is critical too and but in london what anymore they animate that they say that you know we were in a take your marbles and i'll find someone else to play with two to threaten pg to get them to get caught up sort of say that for several reasons one because they might have been preparing wall street for the possibility that the deal would go through to because they were trying to say too the staff of the public utility commission that were in play hardball with you and free to say poor in general that if you think is important here to give we're saying publicly that may be another important us important job it during the roll out of the pc and thought like you know you think we were talking about a new agency would step twelve people advising and just three you know

appointed commissioners they're going up against really are a couple of very large companies with assets worth a combined sixteen billion dollars thousands of people sometimes a lobbyist supercuts he wasn't for them to say no we're not gonna approve this unless you increase of the rate cuts from what was it sixty one million to for a woman it was a really gutsy of him and i and i made an observation somebody in a conversation recently that i thought that the staff played the unimportant generally alike are that they will pull in general and among the particular came in here thinking they are euphoric in the riverside this deal went through and and inside right through me and and you know led to accusations you imbibe bias where the commissioner john smith that you know when you think we are just people falling off the turnip truck followed it so they were very difficult position that they thought it would fly right through because on other

and others some things that i've read that they thought it would take a year for this in the negotiations to happen and that i would think that an arm as a worldwide corporation is look at how long it's taken to get anywhere with indian all that they had to do there but as worldwide corporation know some difficult negotiations could it be particularly when it's regulated really have a regulated situation so i would think that they knew that this is kind of difficult and that they knew that there had to play hardball with the little things that you see you know that i don't take anything away from prisons and before they meet again as you pointed out they have taken great affair really gutsy stand on behalf or to consumers but they also operate our in politics don't operate to some kind of action it almost in the entire reaction from from generally from consumers and from anybody else who contacted that you see on the sign was to hang tough indiana writes i don't necessarily need this merger we don't care he or disapprove that in fact these guys from texas well that was one of the things that i think

i called all the time from from wall street analysts calling me and saying look i'm running mate fordham in iraq for sixty one menorah for how can you possibly reject this year's of being too greedy the public will rise up in protest of the pews he rejected nicety that hadn't been ordered because the overwhelming sense is that enron nasa public knowledge the dow lost literally on the pews he could have rejected that thing which is no negative consequence of politically it happened they keep on working at it easier is the art of it is on a contact a deal or the ecb as energy will be deregulated then the state well i think that you see like any other organization it's like washington or any other government they're professionals so when the deal is done to a certain degree the center of the table and say ok alex well it wasn't as those who are completely hostile sort of timing the negotiators with these utilities and pnc have agreed on all kinds of things even before that my

adolescence and the thing starts but the i'm sure umpteenth there's always a certain hostility that hostility but sudden kansas area relationship between utilities and history of the people who was forced to regulate and that's why if you the organist i was three member commission because we thought at least there was some some feeling among voters a single commissioner wouldn't be sufficiently insulated from all utilities well the last scene that doesn't really work for a while although although i think in the following up on both of your comments that in this case i think there is some he goes to get involved here it's only goes got bruised there is going to be some lingering personal animosity from this i know that some members of the pc felt that some people in an important general behaved inmates improper manner an insulting manner in some cases and certainly those kinds of feelings are critical want to get over we were talking as if this is a dandy out that the commission still has the commission itself still has to

approve the deal are there issues laughter or is it essentially we're there are the the enron has come back with honor and forty one million dollars but they have not spelled out the agreement doesn't spell on their proposal and spell out how that would be divided among different customer classic commercial customers residential customers small business customers they've to propose some different language regarding penalties they've proposed including a reference to a memory or a memorandum of understanding they reached with environmental and public interest groups and i don't know whether they've had any concern that being included in it it won't be a slam dunk but my senses of the commission and the staff are ready to work with them and that is probably will go through thats why the stock jumped aboard this offer an interesting about this is in a mesh with his resume in a bill on is that in other areas where it is move to competition didn't mega mergers between utilities

on is going on it's a little bit in the northwest where historically we've enjoyed very low rage without an abundance of hydropower on we've had powerful delegations in congress to protect this great deal that we got and generally what separates years here to accommodate this move to say about actually for what do they have to gain forty one million bees conversation for what's likely to happen and i don't think anyone knows that happening when you talked with feel like our trunk from tootsie rape and he's not sure what that number should have been and they started off with one hundred and eighty nine and now they're one forty one and they're not sure what that compensation should have been or benefit should have been on and on if you remember came in saying that that that repairs shouldn't have any benefit that they should just have no harm and that's one of on the wrong foot with organized again the poetry <unk> that this is not quite a done deal and while signs that hasn't quite been the side of those that the other shareholders

of pg are generally accept this was the surprise shares of that i get to the question why did pj at blank if they're in this position and i think portland generally because they perceived that it was more troops they are disadvantaged enough to do the deal that they would know what that perhaps it would be an attractive merger partner for somebody else that competition coming to the region might put them at more of a disadvantage and that they needed this deal with and obviously and to convince them that whatever their fears were they would just say about local was long one whirlpool operatives if it doesn't say that it is long enough to be able to survive well as those subsidies are really important in their third day of concern in the legislature is trying to lay some time ground work for solving our for answering these kinds of questions the bill has been proposed that would do that would mean really the groundwork for some kind of competition unlike boehner's heart and

bite and in three years i guess when i'm writing but two thousand and one but the details are not work out all that is going to take years to have to work out what happens to people's utility bills that realistically given the fact that they're there in the movie's toward national elite competition an oregon and the northwest has the lowest rates in the country is there any possibility except that rates will go up here well actually the numbers that is it would and listen to that would suggest that our regional level where they are would go down that time that this guy has a very nasty rock band and steve thanks for joining us this week and seven days and thank you for watching the night the plane came to

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