Governor convocation

In 1976, he was elected Speaker of the Kansas House of Representatives, the first Democratic Speaker in 64 years. 1978, he was elected Governor. Recently, Governor Carlin led a 20-member trade delegation on a two-week tour of China. The Governor is here today to share his thoughts on China with us. After the Governor's presentation, he will answer any questions you might have. And immediately following our convocation, there will be a press conference in D2. So let us give a warm welcome to Governor John Carlin. Thank you very much. It's indeed a pleasure to be here and I say that with some experience having been here before, it's a joy to be back on this campus. I've had the

pleasure being on a couple programs that were held here as well as to attend the number of concerts held in this very fine facility dating back a few years. We've had some fine students from our community attend your university here and we've had a chance to come down occasion to hear the singing Quakers and to enjoy their presentations very much. So it's good to be back. It's good to have an opportunity to talk about China because certainly the benefit from that trip will be greatly enhanced the more that we can spread the word on the potential, spread the word on what needs to be done to take advantage of what I feel are definite opportunities in dealing with and working with China. I was handed just prior to coming on stage your convocation program for the fall semester and I note that next week you will have Phil and Pauline Ward with you just happen to be showing pictures of China in the Great Walls. So I hope that what I say today will go with what you will see next week. It would be

unfortunate if we give two different pictures. I don't think that's going to be the case but I think it's interesting that you will have two convocations in a row dealing with China. I think it's significant. I think it's great that you are because as we look to China and we realize that one out of every four persons alive today live in China, it's a little past due for us to begin to recognize and deal with them in a real way. And so I'm pleased that you've given me this opportunity and pleased that you are emphasizing the international commitment that we need to make to China and other parts of the world. I am going to make some comments and then as indicated in my introduction you will have the opportunity to ask questions. When you talk about China and in particular to our visit and as I look to the future, I think you have to start with the

people themselves. Not just the numbers, although that is a significant part of looking at China and the people, the masses you see, I said one fourth of the world's population, one billion people in a country no larger than ours, but also a concentration of that one billion, about one third of that land mass. Most of China is a void of population and so it's very heavily concentrated in the areas of China along the coast and essentially the eastern one third of the country all the way from north to south. But the people to me are very fascinating. I'm not a world traveler, I've had very little experience. And I guess as you do travel and you look to other countries you have certain things that you picture or you think you're going to run into. And I

guess in this particular case I didn't know quite what to expect, but I certainly didn't anticipate a people that would be so friendly. And I'm talking about our official hosts, not the people in the government. I'm talking about the people on the streets of Shanghai or Beijing or Canton. People by the millions, literally, people who really want to become better acquainted with our country and our people, people that are a joy to get acquainted with. I would quickly note several things about the people. One, the unbelievable cleanliness that exists. And that may seem a strange comment to make, but when you realize that this population is totally without the modern conveniences that we take for granted, I mean you don't, they don't have washing machines and dryers in any way, shape or form. They don't even have the style that

grandmother used to have. It's all done in a pan at best. And the only running water will be out in the yard in a faucet maybe shared by several families. Despite the obvious difficulties and lack of conveniences, when you go on the streets of China and whatever city it might be or visit the people in the countryside, you find people that are extremely clean, wearing a clean, wide shirt or blouse every single morning. Not just occasionally, but everybody you see. They have great pride in taking care of themselves. They're in as excellent a condition physically as you can imagine. Everybody, very, very trim. The most beautiful teeth that you could possibly dream might be because they don't eat any sugar, but I'm sure it's not because they have a

better dentist. They simply have a different diet. But beautiful teeth and in fine condition, they emphasize a staying trim. You get up in the morning and go out and it's crowded on the streets because people are out exercising or already going to work and they're going to work not to not in a car by themselves, not in a carpool, but on a bicycle and probably riding many miles, maybe taking an hour and a half or two to ride from their home to the job they have. And they do this twice a day, six days a week. So they stay fit. They're also an extremely honest people. And again, unbelievably honest. And I say that not in the sense that we're dishonest, but just to give you a few examples, if you are dealing buying, say, some things in a store, and there's a language barrier, obviously, and sometimes communication is difficult.

But if there would be a mistake, whether it be one or two or three cents or 15 cents that you may have been cheated and you were not aware of, and they discover it, they'll be at your hotel room door before you get back, ready to settle it. If you drop or lose anything in China, you don't need to worry about it. They'll return it. We had a man in our delegation that lost a very valuable gold wristband dropped off as he was walking. He wasn't even aware of it. Somebody came running up to him and said, look, I think he dropped this. He stayed in hotel rooms without locks. You see, literally thousands of bicycles being driven and used, never any consideration giving them locking that bicycle for fear of somebody might take it. So as I looked at the people and I think back to our trip, there are a lot of things I came away with great admiration of. In regard to their country, obviously, their form of government is foreign to us, not acceptable to us. But as you take a look at their history,

you have to also appreciate that despite our lack of enthusiasm for their system, you have to acknowledge they've made some progress because in a relative way for sure the people today are better off than they have been before. Their system is concerned about the individual and taking care and upgrading the standard of living to their people. And they've made some degree of progress. And I think the general happiness and satisfaction that we found was due to the progress, not that they had the standard of living that we take for granted or the progress that we've had, but in a relative way they've made much progress. Looking and thinking back to China and the country without commenting on a couple things like the Great Wall or the food would be a mistake. And maybe you have two extremes there. The Great Wall, as you may have read or been told, is the only man-made structure on our entire earth that can be seen in the powder

atmosphere. I think it was from the moon when they look back. It was the only man-made structure visible. It's something you have to see to believe. And I think the pictures that you will see next week will show you something that's hard to imagine that tells you a lot about the people of China and their country and their history. A history that goes back 4,000 years. You know, I've enjoyed this governor of Kansas helping many communities celebrate their 100th anniversary. And then to visit China and go into a museum in contrast to a museum here, and we deal with a hundred years and they deal with 4,000. They have a long and rich history. It gives you, if you look at that history, it better understand into their culture and why they are where they are today. And certainly the Great Wall is not only a magnificent

structure in terms of appreciation of what bodies can do if you have enough of them and they're dedicated to the job, but also in appreciation in terms of their history as far as their fear of outside forces coming in. And they have been harassed and run over by outside forces on numerous occasions. Obviously much of the interest in building the Great Walls some 2,000 years ago or approximately that of my memory is correct, was because of that. But to see that massive structure stretched for miles and miles and miles, and it's not just a wall at the road, it was also the highway to move troops and supplies from one part of the country to another. It was the wall is wide enough for five horses to run side by side. And when you look at the terrains surrounding that wall you wonder how it would have been possible to ever do it. It would

have been difficult for us to consider even if it had been an ideal location. But it's in a very mountainous rough terrain that it's hard to believe how it was accomplished, but it's there. Maybe the other extreme when you look at China, you see the Great Wall and the other experience that comes to mind is the food. Many of you I'm sure have had the experience of eating in Chinese American restaurants in this country. I personally like Chinese food. The difficulty you find in traveling to China with the food is that there are a few things different over there. The menu looks somewhat the same, but the ingredients have changed. You go into a country where you can't drink the water. You go into a country that doesn't know what meat is. They serve you pork and some beef, but they don't know what meat is. And that's of course one of the things I'll get to in a few moments, one of the potentials I think we have in terms of China. The food,

you know, we eat over here, maybe go to a Chinese American restaurant, it's a special occasion, we go, you know, one time, maybe go back in two weeks or a month or depending on how well we like the food. And suddenly when you're placed in an area where your only choice is that, and it's three times a day and day after day after day, you throw that in with some seasoning that's totally foreign to us, and you find yourself in a real challenge to survive. There isn't any question we had a great trip. I have no regrets going, but I assure you it's not something that you can relax and just thoroughly enjoy every second because you've got to constantly be aware of the challenge to come out alive. And I don't want to stretch that too much, but most delegations that travel over in China today experience a considerable degree of problem as far as getting sick. And so, you know, I've had a lot of people ask, what about going to China? I think in two or three

years it's going to be fantastic because they're going to get some facilities. They know the potential from the tourists. They know what we'll spend. And so, they'll anxiously prepare to take advantage of that, and they know they need hotels, and they need restaurants. It's served food that will be more attractive to the Western traveler. And I think that time will come when the problem that we experienced will no longer exist. But it does today. And as you think of the food, and you know, the menu, as I said, doesn't look that much different, but when you eat duck in China, you eat the whole duck. When I say the whole duck, I mean the whole duck. One of the lessons we learned, several lessons, and I would pass on to you if you ever had the opportunity, don't ask what you're eating. Because it may not be going down too bad, but when you find out it's stomach linings, and monkey brains, or whatever, it suddenly can come to a screeching halt. And then if you visit a swine farm, you certainly will ever eat pork again,

and I can assure you. It's an interesting experience to say the least. And I am, as I think back to the people in the country, plus as far out way the minuses. And our real purpose, and I'll close my remarks on the discussion of trade and the opportunities, real purpose, of course, was a trade mission. And I would sum that trade mission up by telling you that I am thoroughly convinced that there is great opportunity there, that that opportunity is not going to be beneficial to China, but to Kansas in this country as well. One of the reasons we had the opportunity to visit China as early as we did was the fact that China was aware that Kansas had, in many ways, what they needed. A continual, regular supply of agricultural products, as well as agricultural technology,

as well as technology and petroleum, and the aircraft industry, and a long list of resources that we have that they need. And you combine that with the fact that they want to do business with people they like. And I am confident that we have the potential to establish that friendly relationship. I do see great opportunities. Now, we're going to have to be patient. I've had many people want to know, you know, how many contracts did you come home with? How many deals you got lined up? How many millions of dollars is this going to be for the Kansas economy this year or next? Not that much, really. It's going to take considerable amount of time, although we already have one of the businessmen that went with us, planning another trip back later this fall. He's been invited back, and he'll be back in, and he will be talking about contracts and about sales. So there will be tangible results soon, but not to the extent that we're going to notice it,

not to the extent that it's going to contribute significantly to the Kansas economy in the immediate future, because it's going to take time. It's going to take time for a variety of reasons, and we need to understand those reasons, or we're going to run out of patience, and we're going to lose out. We're going to lose out because there are other countries that have been more aggressive, did get into China sooner, and so the competition is there. We need to be aware that we're not the only one in the world today, that there are others that would like to sell to China, that there are others that would like to take advantage of the opportunities that do exist, and so we need to be patient. Patient because as you look at their country today, and you consider how totally dependent they are, we're doing essentially everything by hand, and you look at the vast areas of a total void of technology, and see these great opportunities

where we could thrust our modern techniques into. You've got to realize that, for an example, in the farms where there are 80% of their population live on the communes that do the farming, to shift that concentrated manual labor to something else, to start using machines on the farm, would yes, in some ways be more efficient, but what are the people going to do that we're doing the farming by hand? So at the same time, you try to introduce technology on the farm, you've got at the same time introduced new industries to take up the slack as far as that labor that's suddenly available, so it has to be coordinated. Now they're aware of that, but we need to be too, because we can better assist them if we understand and appreciate the total program, and what is going to be necessary to make it all work. We need to understand and appreciate

that China, because they've had a long history, and in some ways have not come that far in 4,000 years, they are not a people in a great hurry, they are conservative, they themselves are patient and slow and careful, and if we want to do business with them, we're going to have to be likewise, but I'm convinced that we can afford to be patient and careful and slow with them, that we can afford to take the time necessary so that we will be there when the opportunities come along. Now I don't say that because we just got to sell or the direct income, but one of the things in this country we need to realize, and not just looking at China, but looking worldwide, we need to have a better appreciation of the importance of international trade.

We all suffer for an example from inflation, and if there's one thing that we can do to try to turn that problem around, it's to increase our exporting. We now have too much of a deficit. We buy more than we sell by a significant amount. That is not a good situation over a long period of time, that he roads confidence in the dollar, it contributes to inflation, and we all suffer. So as I look to China and the opportunity to become better acquainted with them, to make a small contribution to moving towards a more stable world peace, the opportunity to assist this country, to advance their technology and improve their

standard of living and the nutrition for their people, I also see a great opportunity for us to help our own economic situation. And I would hope that that opportunity that will be coming along, will be ready to take advantage of it. We do live in a very competitive world, and we must remember that. I don't think we've learned that lesson yet, it's kind of like the energy crisis, we don't, there are some things we do not want to learn, we do not want to acknowledge, maybe because it's, it's not easy for us to accept, but the sooner we do, the better we're all going to be. I can assure you that if we're not there to sell and work with China, somebody else will be. It's not that we because of some historical dislike of communism, that we're going to hold communism back because we're just not going to deal with them, it's not going to work that way.

And we can certainly contribute to a much more stable world condition by communicating and working with them. I had one very important experience that in some ways, if I were to give a highlight to the whole trip, it would have been the experience of meeting with the vice premier, vice premier, you and the great hall of the people on our Tuesday when we were in Beijing. It sort of culminated several days of activity in which we had made a tremendous effort to reach and make that contact, open those doors that we had sought to take advantage of. And as we met with him and had an opportunity meet for an hour and 15 minutes, there was the significance of the fact that we got to meeting because he's about 4th or 5th in line in terms of control of the entire country, the significance that he would take that much time,

and then maybe the most significant thing of all, the fact that he knew so much about Kansas, indicated to me that our visit had been a success, that somebody of his stature would not have spent the time necessary to learn about our state unless there had been a real desire to establish a good communication with us that would be beneficial for all of us. It was amazing how knowledgeable he was. It also amazes me not only in particular with their government officials but the people on the street how many speak English. Now, I am not going to stand up here and tell you that we need to learn Chinese. I think we're going to be fortunate. I don't think we're going to have to. We are going to have to learn the metric system because that's one thing I learned also. They don't like our system of weights and measures. They don't make any bones about it. They're

not going to make any attempt to learn it. They've learned our language. We better learn the metric system and we'll be in a much better position to communicate and work with them. So on the whole, I thought it was a great trip. Great for opening doors, for making the contacts necessary. Obviously, I've said we need to be patient. We need to have an understanding of some of the difficulties that will exist. We also need to very carefully follow through. I said we live in a competitive world because of that competition we've got to go back and back and back again to make sure that the beginning we started is one that will bear fruit for a long time to come. With that, I'd be happy to answer any questions that you have on China or any other subject and I will watch my time piece so that we don't interfere with the next class. Any questions that you might have? Yes. You've talked about China as having potential markets for our goods. What kind of

goods does China have to sell to the world? What China have to sell to the world? The first one I would mention is petroleum. They have a tremendous resource there that they have not tapped. They're going to need our technology to develop it but it could be the real heart of the capital they need to get into the international market. They'll have others or crafts for the most common now in terms of the export market as you see around the world and they will very fastly move into other areas. I saw a very modern machine tool factory that I'm sure they'll be competing as time goes on with sales to other countries and developing nations. The oil is the principal product that quickly comes to mind that we're interested in and I think a lot of the world would be. Other questions? Yes. At the end of the day, there's no man from the dairy industry. In regard to their dairy industry, it doesn't really exist as compared to ours. There are

communes that do milk cows all by hand. They do not use machines but dairy products are pretty much void from the typical diet in China. Void, maybe as much as for any reason, the fact they do not have any refrigeration. Everything has to be fresh. So there really isn't a dairy industry. Now you'll find and maybe somebody will show you pictures of a large dairy but it's the exception of the rule. Whereas in this country we accept the fact we can have milk and it's available if we want it in grocery stores on a regular basis. That's not the case in China. Yes. Are they interested in our wheat and meat products? Are they interested in our wheat and meat products? They're definitely interested in wheat. They realize that one, this would be helpful in terms of their goal to improve their nutritional diet, a higher protein than what they're now using and that they also are aware that they somewhat

reached their limit and their potential to produce. For an example, we found areas where they now triple crop. Two crops are rice, one of wheat on a single lake or every year. There's not much you can do to expand on that productivity. And with their hand operation, they certainly, you know, weeds never hurt their production and everything is planted on time and a very modern irrigation system, practically all of their agriculture. As far as meat, one of the things we need to do and we need to do it like we do with Japan, we've got to introduce quality meat. We've got to give them the chance and it's one of the things we want to do with delegations that we're going to try with our sister-state relationship with Indian province to get a delegation here next year, giving the opportunity to eat some good Kansas beef. And I think once they've had the taste, there will be more interest. Having had the experience of eating their meat, I can understand why they eat so little. You had a question. Yeah, great many Americans have, if not a fair communism, at least a suspicion of it.

But does the average man in China have that corresponding suspicion of capitalism? As far as there are potential or existing fear of capitalism, we certainly didn't find it. I would think though that I should quickly add that the information that's available, the knowledge to the average person on the street is not there. They know very little about us. They're very anxious to learn. And I didn't see fear. I saw enthusiasm for learning. Now, once they've learned what they're going to think, I don't know. There's a little flow of capitalism that now exists. They wouldn't admit it. Just as we, you know, our systems are not always so pure in terms of how the textbooks explain them. For example, they have some incentive for individual families in a commune by giving them an individual plot and whatever they do on that plot. They can do for their own. They raise more than the family can eat. They can take the product

to town and sell it for their own profit. So they're starting to get a little on it. Other questions? Yes? Do you have any comment on the value of the present trip to Russia by former president, or to China by former president Nixon? As far as the trip to China for president Nixon, my comment or observation is more in terms of it's interesting not just with President Nixon, but Vice President Mondale and others. They seem to be taking the same tour that I took. I don't know if I went over to just kind of show how it's done or what, but there's a certain regular format to go through in terms of the significance of his trip. I think there might be some value in this sense. President Nixon did open the door initially to China. His trip to China,

I think the longer we get away from Watergate and some other things, history will look at that trip as being very significant to American history. China is aware of it. I come back to what I've said before. Their interest in our country and wanting to become friends, his revisiting the country probably has helped keep continued progress towards better communications. I don't see any policy change or whatever coming out of it. I don't think that was the intent, but I certainly don't see any harm and there might be some potential. Other questions that you might have in the light, sometimes I don't see somebody towards the rear so you can feel free to answer or ask questions anywhere you might be. Yes. Was there any interest expressed in educational exchange at all? Was there any interest expressed in educational exchange? Yes. One of the real purposes of our

trip was to take advantage of what we hope would be opportunities in that area. We had President Ocar from Kansas University with us Dr. Lee from Kansas University who very actively pursued that particular course and we will have exchanges in that way. We see it as one of the real means by which we can get some of the technological and educational exchange going to some of our ideas and techniques communicated to China by getting that we will have, in fact, in Manhattan we have a busy professor and animal science on the campus this fall from China. So very definitely and this we want to pursue and expand. I think it will be very beneficial to us. Very beneficial and to get our scholars going that way as well. Yes. Another 80% of the population is farmers. Do they have a lot more political polls than the farmers here do? Will that have anything to do with dreams? The fact that 80% and I live on the farm will that this any indicate they've got more political

poll than the 3 or 4% to live on farm zero. Obviously if their system of government with similar to ours the answer would be a very resounding yes. Their system is different. So consequently the political polls so to speak is a little different as well. Although I must admit to you with the masses out there those masses are the ones that the government is concerned about keeping happy, keeping satisfied, giving them some opportunity to improve their standard of living. And I think it's probably the area they're most concerned about. They have some very serious problems rapidly growing population that continues to add to their difficulty for the future and they can communicate easier with the people in the cities and they can with the peasants out on the communes farm after farm you know this millions and millions of people out there is a little more difficult to get the message out to them and so I think there's concern there and I think there's a

lot of emphasis and the number one priority of China is changing their agriculture so they will be catering to these people in terms the clout they have I think it will be clout because of their importance to the real economy of China not because of their numbers because they just don't vote they don't have that opportunity. So the cloud is there but it's in a different perspective and we would associate it with in this country with our system yes. You mentioned that the Chinese water was undrinkable and with the water pollution worldwide now I was wondering what made their water that way. Well their water problems are not from the standpoint that they have the some of the environmental problems we hear it comes from their lack of sophistication as far as putting together a water system that we just take for granted here a water system where you know we do purify and do check and make sure that the water you have coming out of a faucet or you don't have to question they don't do it all the water they have is

just as is and coming through the pipes as is and so that's their problem it's not you know your question gives me the opportunity to make a very quick point and that is a plus for China in the sense that although I said the water was very bad and that's not an environmental plus I must give them a very high mark in terms of they don't have a solid waste problem in there you know you think the millions of dollars we spend in this country and what we do is solid waste and the continuing difficulty as far as environmental problems with solid waste they don't have a problem there because they don't have solid waste they recycle everything absolutely everything I mean you never give up on a bottle being recycled there breaks it goes into concrete to in a variety of ways to you know it just not thrown away recycled human waste in the sense that they use a prefertalizer and making methane gas to bring back the end of cooked off of so that they do not have a solid waste problem and that respect in that respect their generations ahead of

they didn't have the problem they didn't create the problems yes there are some reports that sense the death of Mao there's a change in more religious freedom that you have any opportunity to observe that as far as religious freedom I think there is a slight change developing in terms of observation of where they are today religion doesn't exist in China now that's an exaggeration but I mean you don't see churches so we're two in Peking one Catholic one Protestant the Catholic Church not recognized with the Vatican primarily now more available and accessible because of the embassies that are there and the foreign workers that operate in the embassies but since leaving China of course I think I follow China much more closely now that I'm in back every AP or UPI story out of China gets my attention when I follow the news and there's been a lot of talk in the last few days and weeks about

religion and about a new approach and I think it has changed a lot of things have changed in terms of freedom since the elimination of the gang of four not so much the death of Mao although it was obviously an event that fit into the overall sequence that made it possible for some change but the gang of four which included Mao's why had a totally different philosophy as far as freedom they in their brain for two or three years took took all the private plots away from the peasants and took all the incentives away they thought that there was not pure communism and they've eliminated the gang of four and the current structure is very pro in terms of giving incentives and additional opportunities for the people and I think that will include religious opportunity although I would also know one of the things we could not bring in to the country was a viper would not allow us to bring a viper yes is it right there

good well forgetting for some of the religion who the sum is still the basic religion in China and I went there well I went to can't come to some and well people just still they have their they still worship their own gods but well not not publicly publicly but well I saw some of the performance they had in a museum or some kind of amusement amusement craze and well some of the performance are still related based on the Buddhism yes but but they are even in terms of Buddhism or Hinduism or other religions or their emphasis in terms of their past on Confucius it's very restricted as far as the government

in terms of the government when they talk about the policy against religion it's across the board it's not just a reference to Christianity obviously because of the historical perspective Buddhism for example there would be more behind the scenes activity in that regard but in terms of an open movement in terms of any indication of religious holidays or any recognition that Sunday or any other day as any religious connotation as far as anything sanctioned it does not exist in terms of our observation there was a question down here yes fallen down it's a Chinese government feeling nuclear energy I mean nuclear weapons they own make a new nuclear energy how does it compare with our country in question as a regard to their capabilities as far as nuclear power I certainly am not a expert in that field and would hesitate to even comment although I I would give them credit for probably a or make the assumption that they have the technology to do a very advanced

to develop a very advanced system as far as their military effort to my observation over there was that what they wanted to be advanced in they were like I said I visit a very modern machine tool factory that I think could build anything yet you find them essentially doing about everything by hand and I'm sure although military installations were very much off limits that if we had had the opportunity we would have seen a pretty modern military operation yes the Chinese system is a rare nature that makes we get something that their income that may income is low any significant export of agricultural products from our country to their country would further depress their income how does their government proceed if they have like that's important question is regard to how they're going to handle or really what you're

asking is how are they going to come up with the capital to cash to whatever to make it possible to buy the products agricultural products or whatever and what it comes back to is one they need to explore the resources they have that are unique and interesting to other countries and I mentioned petroleum for one and I think given time that petroleum resource could buy a lot now they do want to do business on a cash basis essentially I think there's going to have to be some loans some credit extended but they're not asking for handouts they don't believe in it it's not part of their culture they they pay their bills they're one of only two or three countries that have paid all their war debts for an example so they they have a history and a culture of wanting to do business above the table and to pay on time and be very straightforward with you so I anticipate that they're going that's one of the challenges it's one of the reasons I say we're going to have to be patient it's going to take time there's no question they just don't suddenly

have the cash flow that the resources to suddenly get active because they need to buy so much and right now have very little to sell and that's a difficulty but they also believe that in terms of making advancements for the future they're going to have to accept that deficit situation for a while or they'll never get off dead center but given the opportunity to advance their technology in certain areas they will have commodities to sell the rest of the world yes sir how far does average Chinese young person get in terms of education how far does the average person get as far as education well everybody goes to primary school and then they call out of you and the rest that pass on go on to middle school and then a very very small percentage good universities I do not have the statistics in nor did they make them available but just by observation in terms of their statements they have a totally different system in ours it's a

couple things I would quickly add as far as their system again on the plus side they teach English and their primary schools now you know I think again I that was one of the reasons I think we're I feel confident that we're not going to have to learn Chinese but it also points out of one of the weaknesses we have here we've we've never got with the foreign language situation like I think we should have they approach things totally different or their system is different they they evaluate their young people at a very early age and those who have the skill get the opportunity and it's not like it is here where you you can take on your own initiative and sometimes limited skills and go a long way if you're determined to be somewhat lacking in certain skills early the ballgame is over so to speak it's one of the reasons that for an example they develop very fantastic ping pong players and musicians and acrobatics and so forth they pick them out when they're about five or six years old they devote their life to becoming the best

when I went over there I expected everybody to be playing ping pong well nobody's playing ping pong they don't have houses big enough they have a ping pong table in yeah when I saw their best their best are fantastic because they they did a little testing when they were five or six years old and found out that it looked like they'd make a good ping pong player and they let them really come I saw some kids eight nine ten years old playing ping pong that you wouldn't believe you certainly didn't want to get involved in a match I should yes your reference to the house I'd suggest that you pass comments about the home nature of family life as you see as far as the home and nature of family life a several quick comments because we're running out of time one comment the family is important in China it's an important unit they stick together there are several generations involved no no senior citizen can go to a nursing home unless they have no dependents as long as they have dependents so dependents are responsible

for taking care of the the elderly we found a very uniform housing situation we found people who were having an adequate food supply we did not find people starving in China I had somebody earlier mentioned you know well what what about the old saying we were always told you know clean your plate up because of all the starving people in China you know you can't waste the food well I'm not taking away from the value of that comment but we did not find starving people in China they may not be eating the best food but they're eating food and that typical home life is built around a very simple diet very simple they're primarily vegetarians because they don't have any meat as I said essentially and it's something on it good meat they also well we found the kids not that much different than kids around here extremely friendly lane cards a lot of energy and excitement of course we caught them at a time when they were on vacation we did not get to

see them in the schools so it was a little different than that respect you find men and women working side by side there's I guess with I don't know they passed the ERA or just we're born with it but they you know finding differential in that in that respect and everybody everybody works everybody has a job you don't have the option of you know the head of the household having the job and other spouse staying home take care of the family the kids are probably taken care of and are not in school by the older members of the family but both the husband and wife would be off in a job but the family is important and considered as important unit and there's a tremendous effort now for birth control I mean it is obvious they talk about it at every opportunity and you can start to see a little bit of results they're aware that they've got to get a handle in their population and they're going to choke themselves to death one last question

then we'll have to cut it off okay are they more concerned with being in need control of the technology or curving it just through just the constraints or control in terms of population they're going to from a variety of ways they're very openly talking about family planning educating their population in terms of variety of ways to to plan the size of the family and when we were there they were talking about tax incentives tax incentives in the sense that anything beyond one child would be very heavily taxed and so they're not only educating but they're going there's going to be a financial incentive because they see it as one of their biggest problems and they intend to get a handle on it with that and look at my timepiece and the necessity for you to get back to class and for me to stay on schedule I thank you very

much for this opportunity it's been my pleasure listening. Thank you for the great honor of bringing our program. We are dismissed very heavily taxed so it's not only educated but there's going to be a financial incentive they see it as one of their biggest problems and they intend to get a handle on it with that to look at my timepiece and the necessity and to look at my timepiece and the need to look at my timepiece and the need to look at my timepiece

and on Thursday January 17th maybe Queen the outspoken founder and leader of the great Panthers presented the University Form Board Lecture at Wichita State University. Speaking on aging and learning, life's greatest opportunities she was introduced by Geontology students, Karen Brown. In the 60s, we of the media were alerted and the public was alerted to racism and to sexism.

In the 70s, when we saw older people largely talking about clareol, geratol, and preparation age. And we learned that anyone over 30 was really not to be trusted. There was a voice that confronted us with another form of prejudice, ageism. Maggie Kuhn, convener of the Grey Panthers, commanded and demanded our attention. After her mandatory retirement at 65 in 1970, Maggie Kuhn and the Grey Panthers called attention to the need for better health care, nursing home reform, better housing, and employment. The mandatory retirement age was raised from 65 to 70. The media was made aware of the need for sensitivity to older persons, and Johnny Carson found it necessary to revise his Aunt Blabby routine. Our built-in responses to people because of their age were called out to us.

We were asked to begin to look at authentic maturity. What it means to accept yourself and your years. Maggie Kuhn is active politically and is involved in a broad base of political issues. She's been called upon to advise presidential candidates and legislators. As an author, she is also a former editor of social progress, which is now the Journal of Church and Society. Her books have included, you can't be human alone, and she's been the subject of two documentary films, as well as being a frequent talk show guest on television. She's a graduate of Case Western University Cleveland and has completed graduate work in sociology and ethics at Temple University and also at Union Theological Seminary. She is taught at various universities. In the 1980s, we hear the voice of Maggie Kuhn once again calling out for the uniting of groups to create a livable environment.

She looks upon older people as being the potential value impact forecasters. She has stated that universities and colleges have first priority because it is there that the future lies. It gives me a good deal of pleasure to introduce the author of Let's Get Out There and do something about injustice, Maggie Kuhn. Thank you for your lovely warm and gracious introduction, and thank you all for your presence here and your welcome. I always regarded a very special honor to be on a university campus, and I feel deeply honored today to be before you this day.

I'll remember this day for a long time, and remember the time that we had together. The introduction didn't include my age, and I should be quite honest about it. I'm going on 75. I have my 75th birthday in August, and I expect to live to 90. I have much work to do, and I won't be able to do it in the 80s, so I feel sure. I have many wrinkles, as you know, in gray hair. I cherish the wrinkles and the gray hair, and I regard those as badges of distinction. I've worked very hard for them, and I'm not going to try to cover them up. I was very pleased when the former force lady, Mrs. Ford spoke out with such honesty about

her own experience with breast cancer. I thought she was helpful to many, many women who have had that problem too. But I deployed the fact that she thought she had to have a face lift. How sad that she couldn't have worn her wrinkles. As a kind of triumph, as she bore her bout with cancer, aging and learning should be linked together as they are in the title of our day together, inseparable they are, and they are indeed life's greatest opportunities. Old age, as we see it, should be the flowering of life, a kind of triumph over all the vicissitudes of human existence. And the sad part of it is, in Western society and particularly in the United States, it

is not that, except for a privileged few. It's a judgment upon our contemporary society that so many people in their later years are so demeaned and diminished and powerless and out of it. Now, some of it is by our own making and designing. We take ourselves out of the ballgame. We cop out. But we have been profoundly influenced by the theory of disengagement that this gerontologist dreamed of about 25 years ago and was now declared bankrupt by the people who perpetrated it. But it got into the bloodstream of American policy of decision-making and it is the basis I profoundly believe for the age segregation that we've absolutized and that HUD has put millions of dollars into age-segregated housing.

We've declared war on ghettoization on the basis of race, but now we're accepting another kind of separation on the basis of age-segregation and age-segregated housing. I think there ought to be a moratorium of at least 10 years on every age-segregated housing arrangement. We ought to stop them down, close them cold. And everyone that now exists ought to be desegregated. Every one of our housing projects ought to have a daycare children's center, you know, for little kids. Every one of them ought to be connected with a big community garden where the children play. There ought to be not the isolation of the old from the young. We belong together and we need each other and we must get together. To make attainment of a great age, a triumph is to stamp out the myths that our society has created.

Our acquisitive, profit-centered society that has created those myths has served, has been served well by those myths, if you follow me. If you can declare old age a disaster, a pathological state, then there can be ample justification for strashing people at 50, 55 or 60, when making it impossible for people to enter the labor market or to keep in the labor market. A very sound rationale. And if you can make it quite clear that old age is mindless that you can't learn anything after 30 and, you know, and after 50, it's just a question of time before your brains get soft. Then you've got ample justification for people who say, well, I just can't do that anymore. But the damage has been done to people's minds and some of us have been brain-damaged by those myths.

So I consider an opportunity like this to be a great thing for all of us. We can purge our minds and our spirits from the kinds of destructive self-hate and self-deception that society has fostered and foisted upon us. In this new view of aging and learning in this new age, I profoundly believe the following. To age is to continue to grow and to learn right up to rigor mortis. Nothing short of that. And I rejoice at the age diversity of this audience, I rejoice at the fact that there are young learners and middle-aged learners and old learners entering the classroom together. And I rejoice at the forum series that this great university has provided for the enrichment

of this whole region. We need to close the ranks between the ages and the matter of scholarly attainment and the enhancement of our minds and spirits of knowledge and learning, our empowerment. And in a society where so many people are powerless and afraid and apathetic and cynical and despairing, we need a new kind of energy and a new kind of power. To age and to learn is to be more fully understanding of ourselves, our own history, our strengths, our weaknesses, our relationships with others, self-knowledge, a new kind of self-awareness I envision in the days to come, particularly in the 80s as we get comfortable and used

to the idea of scholarly efforts pursued on an age-integrated basis. And ages to be more fully aware of the world in which we live, and more fully involved in contributing to this world of all ages. And the fact that there is such massive disengagement from public controversy, from public issues, from public responsibility is indeed a said judgment on our democratic institutions. To age and to learn is to deal in a constructive way with anxiety and tension. The angst that exists in a six-society, and you have just to contemplate the Middle East to realize how much there is, how much fear, how much hostility.

And age and learn is to discover a new kind of ecstasy. I like to think that today we are doing two things. We are engaging in a massive immunization campaign to rid ourselves of all forms of gerontophobia. How about that? Do you know what gerontophobia is? It's a very fancy sociological term that means the fear of old people and the fear of growing old. And there are sociologists and very shrewd social analysts who say that we are suffering from a massive epidemic of it. It's everywhere.

And we need to immunize ourselves, to protect ourselves from it. And it's ravages on our minds and spirits and bodies, and certainly the ravages that it creates in the society as a whole. I like to think that we are also today envisioning the future. This is the new decade. And we are trembling as we enter it, what's ahead. By no means do we discern the future clearly, but I think there are evidences of the future that we can see right now. There are evidences that we need to judge and to put down and to eradicate. And there are evidences that we need to encourage and to allow, to grow and to flourish. See, Wright Mills, who was one of my favorite sociologists, he died much before his time.

From my point of view, he taught sociologists, as you probably remember, some of you at Columbia University. And his last great book was Sociological Imagination. He was also the author of the Power Indeed. See, Wright Mills wrote in Sociological Imagination about the marvelous interaction between the public and the private spheres of life. And he was saying that your biography and my biography intersect every day of our lives with the world's history, with the society's history. And the intersection, the juxtaposition of our life in the historical stream, constitutes for us all in this room, every one of us, a new kind of public awareness. And Mills says that there isn't any private pain or anxiety or trouble, that we can think

over that any one of you has experienced personally, that can be fully understood or dealt with apart from public resolutions. And can talk about any of our aches and pains, for example, without recognizing that we desperately need a new healthcare system. We've got sickness care, we don't have healthcare, we don't spend any money to maintain health. To teach people how to use our bodies and our minds and our spirits so that we can achieve maximum health for us. Maximum well-being, wellness should be the goal, but it's far from that in our present sickness care system.

We can't have health unless we all are willing to support the Dolemsville, how about that? To establish in the United States of America a new healthcare system. And I dare say in this enlightened audience and in this enlightened place, it is a socialized medical system. We need to nationalize the hospitals. We need to nationalize the drug companies, like quite a difference. Now we do have socialized medicine. Remember the armed forces, every member of Congress, every member of the federal establishment has access to socialized medicine. And nobody thinks that's come in a stick, it's just, they're just, do they? And if it's okay for Mrs. Ford to have her mastectomy under that socialized medical system, it should have been okay for me to have my radical hysterectomy three years ago under, you know, the same system.

And it should be okay because I have, I've had cancer three times and I'm well, very well today. But I have to go undergo some very expensive tests from time to time to be sure that I maintain health and I pay for all of those tests. There's nothing in the present Medicare system that reimburses for those tests. Stupid, stupid, so we need a new health care system. And we need to recognize that our private aches and pains have a social solution. Now likewise we talk about social issues, unfairly global terms, you know, the nuclear are threat and I hope before we leave each other that you will join with me in saying, no more nukes, no more nukes, no more nukes, thank you. We have to be putting down every effort to proliferate nuclear power plants.

We don't need nuclear power, it's destructive. We don't know what to do with the nuclear waste. We don't need nuclear weapons. We just need to make peace, to wage peace. And you can't think of those of the whole question of the Middle East and the troubled Afghanistan, firstly defending their land and their way, their religion, without recognizing what it does, what we are now doing to them and what we did earlier when we insisted upon it, of giving the shore all that power. We cannot really understand that crisis without understanding the personal, the intimate involved under the people there. So the intersection of the personal and the private and the public and the social and

the societal have to be within our purview and I assume that it is in this context today. And to age to summarize is to be intensely and profoundly aware of the whole created order. If we take seriously the fact that every living thing ages and that age is not something that happens when you are eligible for your first social security check, are you first to turn a gray hair, oh horrible, a gray hair. But aging begins with a moment of birth. I used to say before the right to life is attacked to me that it began with a moment of conception. And I've said to theological audiences which I occasionally have a privilege of addressing that it begins really with erection and ends with resurrection. There's some of you may not follow the theological impact of that statement, but you can certainly get aboard the physiologic or biological end of it.

But quite seriously, to take seriously this business of aging, it is to be profoundly related to the whole creation. Something that lives is born of seeds or seed and the tours and grows and flourishes and bears fruit and progeny and withers and dyes. And we too follow that great circle and in the dying we finish the earth, only American funeral practices pretty much defeat that. So we're talking, we're blowing the whistle on those. We ought to be able to be buried in a plane-bind box in our backyards or cremated and have our ashes thrown to the winds or over the sea or over a beautiful river. We, there's no prodigal of us that is lost ultimately.

And I think particularly is the experience and the skill and what we have learned by our survival that ought to be shared and made available and deep-plowed into the continuing social order so that no particle of us, no aspect of our living ought to be lost in this new age. Now what are the characteristics of this new age? Well the elders are a new breed, I really believe that. They're 24 million of us in America today over the age of 65, more than 31 million of us over the age of 60. Every day there are 5,000 Americans who achieve their 65th birthday, 3,400, 3600 die every day in their 60s, leaving in that gain of about 1,400 every day. So we are the most rapidly growing segment of society and I'm very glad I rejoiced to

hear Dr. Pope earlier reporting that you are on this campus encouraging older learners and that you have many people in their later years and in their middle years on this campus. And I think that's wise not only for their sake and their empowerment but for your survival as an institution. When the old were outnumbered the young in the year 2020, I like to think that's the year of perfect vision. The old were outnumbered the young and then if we don't make some basic changes in our society who is going to do the work and who is going to pay the bills, very important questions to ask. But you are futurist, you are forecasting the future of this campus and guaranteeing its survival by your new admission policies and by your outreach to older learners. There are all kinds of demographic changes.

I'm understanding today that the House Select Committee on Aging of the United States Senate made a very significant study of longevity and discovered that there are now living in the United States of America more than 13,000 people who have achieved their 100th birthday and who are living beyond the century mark, isn't it amazing? I met in the fall a marvelous woman from Greenville, South Carolina who was on her way to meet the committee and to testify before it as to her own survivorship. She was 101 and she went to the senior center every day. Her parents were slaves and she worked as a child in cotton fields. She worked in cotton mills as she was growing up. When she reached her 65th birthday and was forced to retire, she took up practical nursing

and got a certificate. And as now nursing at the age of 101, a beautiful, strong, caring person. And she said with pride, but I'm not so special. I know some others like me. Now that's a new kind of person, a great inspiration to us all. And then I think in this age, there's a convergence of the liberation struggles. The last job I had that I was forced to leave because I had reached that special age of 65 was with the United States Veteran Church, the Office of Church and Race. I was one of two white people in a multiracial staff. I loved what I was doing and I hated it to leave, depressed and angered me.

But that was the rule. You're out at 65. And in those days, the black women, whom I worked and whom I loved as colleagues and co-workers, were not sharing my feminist views. And they couldn't see at that time why it was that I was interested in the women's issues. But now I see in the women's movement today, women of all races coming together, women of all ages, understanding a new dimension of sisterhood that I find so beautiful and so affirming of life and illustrative of the convergence of forces. I think of racism, sexism, ageism and American economic imperialism as all evils that have to be engaged in and rooted out. And there must be a great grand strategy in dealing with those oppressive, demonic,

diminishing forces. I see also in the present new age, alarming threats to our environment, the dumping of chemical waste. And I hope you on this campus and your families and others whom you can influence that you will use whatever power of analysis and data gathering and protest against the chemical waste that may be endangering your survival. I visited the great panthers in Buffalo, New York recently and they've been angered in being a part of the exposure of the chemical waste that had been dumped in the love canal. And that horrible incident has alerted people all over the country to the toxic waste that they're being dumped so indiscriminately. But I think you cancens have a particular role to play in terms of the preservation of

your crop land. You are one of the great agricultural states in the world. And Kansas top soil and the productivity of your land have been celebrated for generations. But it is impaled today by agribusiness. The family farms that some of you grew up on and some of you might have owned had passed into the hands of conglomerates who do not care about the land or about you. They just care about quick, quick cash crops and the high profit yield. Millions of acres of crap land are being lost every year around the world and that land is irreplaceable. When it is gone we are all hungry, we've been giving generously to the starving Cambodians but all of us will be starving unless we change our land use policies.

I think we have to cry out in this age against a kind of military stance that I see revving up again. I hear intimations that the draft is going to be a great way to take care of all the unemployed young people. Get them all marching, Uncle Sam's bugles, despicable future for the kids. And as a profound cynicism and despair about it, what can we do? Well you can resist the draft. That's what a lot of people did in the end against the war in Vietnam and we stood with the kids. This was the origin of our great panther movement, a wholesale protest against the war in Vietnam. And I see us having to march those bastions forward again. I think we all have to get with a new kind of anti-war effort that I see this necessity

of in terms of the way in which we're coming together around military forces and military spending in the Carter administration. We face in this new age the sheer terror of nuclear annihilation. I said earlier that we don't need MX, we need Amtrak and you need it. Now if we the elders are immobilized to heal and protect and humanize our troubled world, many are the ones who are most free to make change because we have nothing to lose. I like to think that we can take on in our old age and in our middle years, join with the young and being prepared for these new roles on university and college campuses like

this one. I'd like to cite for you in the remaining part of this period with you some new roles that I think desperately need to be done in American society today, new jobs, new responsibilities that begin to address a big backlog of public need that are not going to pile up huge profits for the conglomerates, but they are going to improve the quality of life for all of us. First of all, I think of old people as being educators, educating the young, educating ourselves, educating those who come after us, transmitting to those who come after us, what we have learned by surviving, we who have achieved our seniority in this new age have coped with more technological, physiological, economic, social changes and any other human group in recorded human history.

I personally can remember going to bed by candle and lamp light and we had gas lights in those days. And last summer when I was leading a tour group and the People's Republic of China, I discovered some enormously exciting things that were done with laser beams. In one short, relatively short human life and my earliest form of mass transportation was riding in a horse car past my grandfather at my house in Buffalo, New York, where I spent some time as a young child. And now I fly thousands of miles every year in jets, the big super jets. And once lifetime, those changes, we have coped with change, we have mastered the art of survival in the midst of change and that needs to be shared. We'd like to see, and we've been working this week with the Environmental Protection Agency

and the federal government and we're developing with their help and assistance a program that will equip older people to go into the elementary schools, particularly the first three grades and teach little children about the environment, about what they can do to keep it safe and healthy for them. And it would be beautiful if you, with access to the resources of this university and your own concern about the land, could be a part of that pilot, it would be a marvelous thing for the old and the young who were in it together. In the second place, we think that old people ought to be monitors, watch dogs and might I say watch bitches of public bodies. It would make a difference in the courts if there were people wisely watching, a guardies

of public bodies, it would make a difference in the utility commissions, it would make a difference in the planning commissions, it would make a difference in the housing authorities' deliberations, if there were older watch dogs and watch bitches watching and occasionally barking and biting when they need to be, when they need to cry out when the public good has been violated or endangered. That's what watch dogs are for, to keep things safe. We're testers of new lifestyles, we don't have to compete in our old age, we don't have to win most of us are losers in old age, we've lost our jobs, we've lost income, we've lost our spouses, we've lost our neighborhoods, many of us have lost dear old friends, we're

losers, not winners, and we can't be independent anymore. So the new lifestyle is interdependence, affirming a new humanity, can't be human alone, we have to find fulfillment and satisfaction in joy and community involving ourselves with others. I like to think that we can blow the whistle on the kind of worship that we've given to bigness, fast, size, big cities, big companies, big businesses, big profits, and look at smallness, small as beautiful, the way in which small groups of people can tear for each other, can be aware of each other, can develop a new lifestyle protecting each other.

Small groups of activists taking on the giants, we close down the forest all building for the whole afternoon on September and October 30th. We marched in a great company from the White House grounds to the forest all building and shut it down, a relatively small number. We can be advocates of consumer rights, including patients' rights in hospitals and nursing homes, and there's a new profession of patients' advocates that is emerging. And I'm told by insurance carriers who underwrite insurance for hospitals, Mount practice insurance for doctors, that the cost of Mount practice insurance would be cut in half if there were patient advocates installed in every hospital and every nursing home.

There are 1,800 patient representatives, which is a form of advocacy now on the payrolls of some of our private hospitals. And I would hope that there could be some encouragement in that direction. We can be monitors of corporate power and responsibility. I like to think that we can take part in, and I would hope that some of you would really interest yourselves in this. The Environmental Protection Agency is entering into a longitudinal study that will go back 25 or 30 years, and they're asking for volunteers to be a part of that study, who will look back over where they have lived and where they have worked in that 25-year period, in that 30-year period. To discover in that work history and in their history of living arrangements, what has been hazardous to their health?

Because we now know that diseases of old age, the chronic diseases, which we have in growing numbers in the United States today, are largely the result of environment and work-related conditions that have been perceived in retrospect to be highly toxic and dangerous. So we think of this kind of historical view of our environment as important to its protection for the future. There ought to be the investigation of where U.S. pension funds are being spent, and the employment practices of the companies that once employed us. And further, we can be builders of new coalitions, young and old, and rich and poor, bringing together the people whom our society has divided. And we can, in the seventh place, be the healers of our sixth society. We can use our weakness and our definitions and our ailments as powerful social criticism

and levers for change, widows helping widows. One of the most important public testimonies that I ever witnessed was given by a woman with very advanced lupus. She took part in a large public body that was bringing evidence to a massive cross-action suit against the Department of Transportation of the Federal Government, suing the Department for accessible barrier-free buses, where people with handicaps could safely ride. And she brought to that hearing a box that was the exact height of the bus step. And she showed that she couldn't get on the box. No way, and the powerful chair of the board tried to help her, the two of them couldn't make it.

She had lupus. She died two weeks later. Her legs were bandaged and painful, but she used her ailment as a very powerful social lever for change. The suit was settled out of court. And hopefully, in this new decade, there will be accessible barrier-free buses everywhere, including the state of Kansas. And finally, we can be critical analysts, social critics who wisely and truly ascertain our materialism and our values in this too plastic world. Most of the massive fraternalism that is dumped on us in nursing homes, and indeed in many of the centers for older people, they helping professions not empower us, they disable us. Well-meaning people render us powerless, and instead of mature responsible adults, we become

wrinkle babies, and wrinkle babyhood ought to be out in this duet today. It's just a shred of difference between the care giver and the care taker, remind yourself of that. Now, what are the issues that we should engage? I've already spoken about the environment, and it's in danger, destructive forces that we can destroy it. I'd like to speak for just a moment about the defense spending. I've been doing some very interesting analysis of what we could do with federal dollars if we would take them away from the defense budget and invest them in four major industries that desperately need to be upgraded and developed.

If we were to take $14.3 billion away from defense and invest it in these four industries, we would immediately generate in the next year 777,000 new jobs, think of it. At the present moment, in the defense establishment, by spending $124 billion, the defense establishment puts to work only 88,000 people. But if we were to invest in these civilian technologies in these civilian industries, think of what we would do for the economy of this country. But it takes a national commitment, a national will, a mobilization of all kinds of people to say no more guns. We need railroads.

Now, what are the four industries? We need the railroads, I'm distressed, a poor, but you, the largest city in the state, don't have a railroads. How did that happen? You ought to find out who goofed there. We need mass transit. You need buses in rural areas, there isn't any reason why there can't be an inter-urban connection of buses in this state. We can get people to the moon, but we can't get a bus running across the state. We are putting our billions into nuclear power that's going to ultimately destroy us. I'm not satisfied that we're going to make it safe before somebody's going to have another accident and a real good meltdown. And that'll be that. We need the sun and the wind. I'd like to see windmills whirling on this campus. I visited one of the community college campuses in Dallas.

I mean, you know, in Dallas, they do put things even bigger than Kansas, I must say. And there was a huge windmill that the president had ordered. He had to go to West Germany for it. We don't make those. You know, we just make nuclear power plants. We don't use the wind. And that one windmill, which was a beautiful thing, like a Carter sculpture, oh, it flowed the romantic fashion in the sky, oh, it's gorgeous. It lighted the power, it lighted the parking lot with huge floodlights, a big parking lot. It air-cooled the buildings under the Texas sun, one windmill. He's ordering another. So for me to sell power to Texas power and light, me switch. I spoke at a rally in Washington recently, and I said, I'd like to see some windmills

whirling on the White House. You know, there ought to be windmills everywhere on all the public buildings. The forest are building ought to be powered by windmills and solar panels. And I hope very much. I've seen some remarkable solar experiments in other parts of your state, and I'm assuming that there was a runderway in this campus. I would certainly hope that you would put a lot of energy and a lot of thought and a lot of very social, contrive social engineering into solar power. It's cheap, it's economical, if it's decentralized, it can be in place tomorrow. There's nothing wrong with the sun. You know, in conclusion, to age and to thrive, all of us need these things. We need a goal, a very, very important goal that goes beyond our own survival. We need a new sturdy self-esteem.

We need to value our history. We need to value what we have learned by survival and living. We need a new kind of attitude toward others. We need to close the ranks between ourselves and the young. We need to have new roles and responsibilities that bear upon the public need, and where we can make a useful contribution until death pops us from this present land. And finally, we need, in order to survive, even into our hundredth year, a new community, a loving, supportive, beautiful community. And I think of those communities as being constructed and resulting from the interaction and the vigorous rapport and response that I see happening on university campuses today

as the old and the young and the middle aged get together and discover life and all of its glory, all of its agony, life that we affirm and celebrate. Let's join in saying, Hail, Son, Hail, Life. We love you. Thank you. I guess the answer to my question, you kind of spoken to in some areas, but one of my main interests is in the area of the rural elderly, there is not a lot of things for the inner city and for those individuals who are living in the large cities, but in the rural farm area, transportation, all that sort of would you mind speaking to that please?

I'm glad you reminded me that's a very real issue. You should know that in December 1981, there will be another White House conference on aging. I'm going to be privileged to serve on the National Advisory Committee for that conference. There will be state committees and state meetings preliminary to the White House conference. And we are encouraging as great panthers and also as members of the advisory committee that rural areas speak out much of the federal regulation and guidelines for the Older Americans Act and various other services are being to urban areas. And the rural places have been grossly neglected. I would hope that you would document the isolation of old people. We have been saying that there ought to be many vans, mobile services to churches, to schools.

There ought to be some grand strategy within this state that reaches the rural people who are so neglected and so isolated. I would hope that the change could come when you point out the need for change. Those of us who want to help you, probably one of the best things you could do to get some buses going. This afternoon at the workshop with the Gerontology students, I'm going to talk about some advocacy programs that could be directed to transportation. I think transportation is a key to a lot of it. And there isn't any reason why we can't get transportation. One of the things that I'm hoping that you might fire yourselves up to do would be to

have a statewide demonstration and to bring all of people together or explain this in detail later. All of people who need transportation ought to be loaded into volunteers, cars, many buses and vans, school buses, whatever, vans that churches own and use only on Sunday. And you drive, load the buses with people and picnic baskets of food and sleeping bags and tents and you drive in caravans across the state to the governor's front lawn. And then you unload the buses and the people get out and you unpack the picnic baskets and you spread the picnic claws and you unpack the sleeping bags and you fit the tents and you say to the governor come and feast with us, we're here until you can get us home again. We share joy, share joy, everybody would have fun.

Maggie, you have certainly invigorated me to extend my life expectancy beyond what I had already hoped for, but hang in there. How old are you now, ma'am? I'm 54 and I think I'll live to be 90. I was aiming for 80. So what I most intrigued about what you had to say and mostly is because I have both feet implanted in the medical care system right now, my husband has terminal cancer. Right before our last elections, I had a son in the hospital for quite a while too. I was approached by the doctors there as to who I was going to vote for because one of our candidates was a doctor who was running for Senator and I was told that you know what's going to happen if we get socialized medicine, indeed I do know.

I wish you wondered if you have any statistics which we who are working in this area could use with the coming elections to point out just how favored our legislators are with their trips to Walter Reed Hospital and some of the other facilities and that as you pointed out is socialized medicine in action. I would like to have some of these statistics. I tried to get some through our representative and our senators and I haven't been able to get anything really hard that we could use in our favor because I think that I see I think the leading cause of bankruptcy in the United States is high medical cost, isn't that right? And I think this is one of the areas that we should really go after and if you have any of those statistics I would like very much to be able to plug into them.

Would you be willing to write me a little note? And I'll send it on to our health committee. We have an enlarged health committee that is working on statistical data and some strategy for support of the Dellens bill and documenting what parts of it are now in place and well established and functioning but we need data. How does the Dellens bill differ from the Kennedy? Well the Dellens bill would be, it's a service and it approximates what is now in place in Canada, particularly in the province of Ontario and in Saskatchewan. It would be free to all. It would be paid for out of general revenues and out of payroll taxes. It would be delivered by salary employees. Now some people say that's an anathema but 40% of the licensed physicians of America

today are now salary. Removing more and more into a salary delivery system rather than the entrepreneurial system. It's a better salary than what most of us here get. Of course. Very good sound. Thank you I will write you. Yes please write. And we've discovered that there's a lot of interest in the Dellens bill but there's been almost a complete news black out about it. Mr. Dellens is a leader of the black caucus of the House of Representatives. He's a very, very great member of Congress and he's pioneered in some truly important legislation including the Health Service Act. Yes. I have you be two years. You do. I salute my, I salute you, I salute you. I heard a comment the other day that what ruined England was socialized medicine and the remark to that was no it was a loss to the empire. Could you comment on that?

It was a loss of the fight. A loss to the empire. Yes that's right. Well, at several of, I've been to England twice this past year and I met the deputy minister of health, Her Majesty's deputy minister of health and I had, I was, and I, he took me to some of their facilities in the Lower East Side of London and I was, I gave me a lot of very interesting material and I saw with my own eyes some of the very, very inventive and creative approaches that they are using in, in, in Her Majesty's system. The people who, who, who, who, who badmouted and who, who, who, are, are, are, the people who, who, who did not approve it and, and who came to this country, heps of a menuine, the, the sister of the, of the great violinist has visited us in, in Philadelphia and we have visited her as we've occasioned to go to, to England and she says that the, that there's

nothing wrong with the, the British system, in fact she thinks it's, it's a, it's a great system, but it has, it has fallen into some neglect in the new administration because there hasn't been the public commitment to it, that there was, under the old order, the fact your government has, has been a part of, of its, of its weakening and she deploys that. Aging and learning, life's greatest opportunities was the subject as great Panther Leader Maggie Kuhn recently addressed an audience at Wichita State University. Next week I would assay will provide tape delayed coverage of a public hearing before the Kansas Corporation Commission concerning a proposed rate hike for the gas service company.