The American Scene; Job Hor: Performing Arts

Right now, 25 degrees our temperature in Chicago. This is WMACU and WMACU FM and BC in Chicago, Radio Home of Jack Igan. The American Scene, a series of pre -recorded programs, providing a closer look at those things which form our contemporary society. Produced by the Illinois Institute of Technology and Cooperation with WMACU, the discussion today will consider job horizons in the performing hours. Now here is our host, Don Anderson. Good morning and welcome to the American Scene. My name is Don Anderson. The entertainment business is booming. We Americans spend many millions of dollars each year on devices and contraptions, from television sets to radios, to high fives and stereos, simply to be entertained. We also spend a healthy share of our budgets, getting into concert halls and theaters and nightclubs and movies once again to be entertained. Some of us seek entertainment to be enriched, others to escape. But for whatever

reasons or by whatever means, entertainment plays a major role in the American Scene today. Our discussion this morning is going to consider one aspect of the entertainment business, that of the performer. If the demand for entertainment is high, it would seem that the demand for the performer would be high as well. But for several reasons, the number of performing artists seeking employment is always larger than the number of full -time employment opportunities available. For one reason, technological advance has made it possible for today's wandering minstrel to stroll into a recording session or television studio and reach more people with one performance than he could in a lifetime of traveling about the country. The multiplicity of local performers has given way to the few national performers. Another reason is that much of the entertainment business is seasonal in nature. For example, even though the number of symphony orchestras in America has grown from 800 to over 1200 in the last decade, most symphony orchestras have relatively short seasons, ranging from a few weeks to a few months during the year.

The economics of the industry have also affected employment opportunities. As the cost for presenting entertainment rises, the opportunity for unproven or unknown talent declines. In all fields of the performing arts, it appears that the number of people seeking to entertain will continue to be far greater than the opportunities available. Nevertheless, there is always the chance. And as we pointed out last week in our discussion of the fine arts, the person with creative talent and the will to create can find his place in the field. Earning a living as a performer is difficult, highly competitive, and often disappointing. The person striving for such a career must have determination, a willingness to work long and hard, and an overwhelming interest in his field. A love for it so great that despite all obstacles, he would rather work in it than in any other occupation. Opportunities for training are readily available, but the desire and the spark of creativity must be in the person himself. And to help us

assess the job horizon in these uncertain but magnetic fields of the performing arts, I am pleased to welcome this morning, Mr. H. E. Nutt, Dean of the Vander Cook College of Music and Director of Music at IIT, and Mr. J. Marshall, professional magician and comedian. Good morning, gentlemen. Thank you for coming. No, I've painted a rather grim picture of the job opportunities. Oh, a jolly good picture. It says it as well as we could. You think it's accurate? Oh, very, very much so. You say, what about the people who want to go into show business and we say with one word, don't? There really is little hope of anyone. I won't say that little hope, but don't. Well, I'll be selfish about it. I'm trying to make a living in it myself, and I don't want any competition. Eliminate it that way. And you find too much as it is today. Oh, there's nothing quite like having some B .D .I .D. monster, some eager, talented teenager who can sing, dance and breathing down your neck. I mean, he's out to take your job and

salary away. Mr. Nutt, as a member of the music profession, would you agree with Mr. Marshall? Partly, I think you've painted a real good picture of what it takes. It is a discouraging thing, but for those who have it and do have that great desire, there are many opportunities. The opportunities aren't the same as they were 30 years ago. That's for sure. But they're still there because music is big business. Somebody has to do the recording. Somebody has to do the playing in these symphony arcs. Somebody has to do these jingles on the television and radio. So there are lots of opportunities if the person who wants to go into that has exactly the qualities that will make it go. Now a day is one of the problems is there's no place to break in in the show business. You've got a situation where, mostly, unless you're doing a church basement show, you're breaking in under pressure, where there's a lot of money involved. And as a

consequence, some people put it, a performer has no place to go and be lousy these days. You've got to play clinkers and practice and do it for people because doing it for yourself and doing it for people seems to be quite different, wouldn't you say? Well, of course, from the performing standpoint on an instrument, many of these, as Don mentioned, there are between well around a thousand symphony arcs in this country. And they don't require the same finesse or the same experience that they would for a major symphony arc. So in that line, they do have a pretty good chance to build up. And then with recording as it is nowadays, you can record even an amateur can record. And with that tape and off times win an audition with a number one outfit. So it's a little different, I think, in the two fields. But how many times have you seen someone like Jackie Leonard turn around and say, you guys play like you've got day jobs? And this is what's happened. I mean, a great many musicians have to take day jobs. That's very true.

And there are many ex -professional musicians, those that have played and real good organizations now, that are finding a ready -use for their talent, though, in these amateur symphony arcs. I guess you'd call them amateur because they aren't full -time jobs all over the country. There, they have a good job, a day job. There are many of the public utility companies and many industrial firms that will hire these people, merely for the sake of having them in their community to play in these orchestras. They will give them good jobs, give them time off to rehearse and to actually perform because they believe that those orchestras are good as a cultural element in the community. So it's a little different. Now, they have security. It's a form of subsidy, though. Well, what about the acting profession? Aren't there areas for an actor to make mistakes these days? Sure. And you've seen summer stock. I mean, I have a situation where I have a son. He's 17, he's, well, 18. He's had Goodman, which is the dramatic school here in town, the Art Institute. And I had a very good opportunity the other night,

they were playing, let's see, it was the Joseph Jefferson Rip Van Winkle show in one of the studio theatre. And in the main theatre, they had Glass -Managerie. And I was able to see parts of both shows. And you see one, you see them working out things, and you see the second one, Glass -Managerie is a finished performance. So they have that place to go and learn, and that's what it is, it's the school, let learning dramatics. Well, that takes the place of the lesser companies of yesterday where the beginning act. Only some what? Only some what? Because, as we were talking about doing this show, for example, when I came here and played in Forteville, I played for an entire week at the Chicago Theatre. And Louis Basel was in the orchestra, and I knew Louis Basel from having played the common in North Philadelphia. And I knew him from having played Low State in New York, and here he was playing at the Chicago Theatre. I mean, this was a thing where we spent a week together, old

friends. And nowadays, when you go in, you play one night in the town, or city. Well, you think building or playing to a similar audience over a period of time is important? Yes, rather than one night in one city and another. Well, look at your television shows where they're doing a quick comedy bit. Now, they've done all the slapstick bits, they've done all the dramatic bits. I mean, you have a situation where they don't have the rehearsal. For example, the Broadway shows go into rehearsal, and the budget is such that they flop or succeed practically on the road before the opening night. And the producer has to be very careful, and he has seasoned proven talent, before he's even willing to start. See, I go back to such things as Ziegfeld Follies, and I was in that. Well, what about rehearsal there? Was it longer than it is today? Well, I wasn't actually at the turn of

the century, Ziegfeld Follies. It was a case that we spent. We opened in New Haven, and went to Washington, and opened in New York, and folded in New York very quickly. Well, we stress that talent is an element that must be present. Now, how can a person determine whether he has talent and music or an acting? If he wants to make up his mind, most people at one time in their lives have a desire to perform. How can a young person decide whether he really has talent, whether he should pursue it? That's a thing that depends on his responsibilities. If he is, I'll say, fancy -free, he can join a company like Theatre First here in Chicago. They meet at the Athenium, up on Lincoln and Southport. I'm sure you can find someone there who'll tell you how to get into the organization. And these are people whose love is to be in the theatre. But they must have something far more substantial when it comes to paying

the rent on Friday, you know? So they do this as an application, and an application that's excellent. Now, if they find that they have become the star of the Theatre First Company, and someone comes backstage and says, who is your agent, then branch out. Well, what about the music field? Well, there are many chances for auditions with people who are critical enough, directors, and producers who are critical enough, that it doesn't take very long to find out whether they have sufficient talent. Then, beyond that, it's a question of this plus element, whether they have the willingness to go through the long, well, I say, apprenticeship, maybe it will take to arrive at the big time, maybe they never will arrive at the big time. But if they have that, and they happen to get the opportunity, well, then they're on the way. Well, a music training has to start at a fairly young age, doesn't it? Yes, that's true, but now, with the thousands of high school orchestras and bands and choruses we have, where they get excellent training,

these people who have it, and carry on from there, it isn't too hard for them to determine whether they have enough talent to go professional, then it becomes the other. Not forced to make a decision of that. No, they don't have to make a decision. In fact, they could hardly make a decision that early age, but as they view their future, trying to make a career of it, there'll be people who will be able to advise them, and I like his way of saying don't. I never encourage a young one to go into professional music. They're going to go into it in spite of you. That is, if they have what it takes, and they are so dead set on that, you can't stop them. But when you say don't, or I don't think I would try it, then you have to give them reasons, and you can say about the short season of the Symphony Orchestra and the uncertainty of a job, you work on a two weeks notice, you have to play all kinds of jobs if you're an instrumentalist. But in spite of that, they're going to go ahead, but they are warned, and then one thing I do tell them,

if you get a good education, then after you're tired of the glamour of the professional work, if you do get tired of it, then your education is like an insurance policy. You know that you can get a job in any one of dozens and dozens of things, in which the performing ability, your musical training, will pay off in a good, secure job. Then you can do what he says about the application, you can go on with your music as a performing art, and which you'll get a little pay, and an awful lot of pleasure. That's why we have as many symphony arches in this country as we have. It could not be built on professionals alone, and many of these amateurs play, let's face it, a professional is one who's making money off. But we have many amateurs who play just as well as the professionals, but they have chosen to do something else. At Illinois Tech, we have men who are studying to be engineers, who could audition and play in most any symphony arches in this country. But they have elected to use their music as a sideline for their own pleasure rather than be professionals.

We didn't ask Don, but I would be willing to bet he's grooming himself to be a radio commentator and planning on running one of these shows. It's a little more difficult for an actor or a magician to amuse himself with his application. On the contrary, there are magicians conventions going on all the time. There are worldwide organizations. Magic does happen to be one of the things we do. As a matter of fact, I run a magician's supply store here in Chicago. Well, this leads us pretty well into an area of what other kinds of occupations can a person who is dead set on becoming a performing artist look to in case he cannot support himself as a performing artist. Now, there are all sorts of related industries, obviously. The great story where Sinclair Lewis was supposedly giving a class in writing. And the opening line was, what are you doing here? You should be a home

writing? And this is it. I mean, practice. Well, that's not going to help you get your pay your rents and get your food, though. I mean, I'm talking about other ways of supporting yourself when you can't support yourself by performing. Well, in the music business, I can say this. There are many, many opportunities to make use of what you have learned in music. Teaching music is a great teaching. One of the most secure professions, because there are not enough people who prepare themselves seriously to become teachers. They have the performing bug. Many of them rather hate to, they feel that they're lowering themselves a bit to teach. But they don't have to teach. There are many things in which they can earn a good living. The sales nowadays, a person who has a good background in music. There are many angles and sales. Records, instruments, music. There are so many angles in

which they can use all that they have learned in music to a good advantage. I know a young man that works in for a record shop. And he's crazy about his job. He loves to hear the records. He does. Listen to a great deal. He's able to recommend records. If I go in and say, I'm looking for a certain type of record, say, I have one here that'll interest you. He studies his customers. He has that knack picking out the thing. But I depend on his knowledge of music. He was a fine performer. And there are many of them that sell instruments. I know a number of ex -professional selling instruments and their professional experiences. A thing that sparks it that helps a great deal. So there's no end of that. Sure. I mean, if you're going to buy a musical instrument, if the fellow can play Melancholy Baby on a trumpet, it's certainly going to be a lot more effective. And if he says, what you do is blow in through this end. And the sound comes out here. It goes around and down and down. In your field, the opportunities of being that directly related to your art are fewer. No, as a matter of fact, see, I'll say I go any route to make an honest dollar. Well, for example,

I was here on NBC in September. They ran the show in November. But I was one of the puppeteers in Quillo and the Giant. It was George Latzor's puppeteers. And George is a very talented fellow, lives in Cleveland. Wonderful job. And here is a sort of a case in point. A brilliant, talented puppeteer who, I won't say, has a hard time making a go of it. But between shots on NBC, where he's doing Quillo and the Giant, he is playing schools and... Yeah. High school. And there's not much money in that. But there are circuits that... Oh, yes. Oh, sure. Yeah, very definitely. And that's growing. The need for live music in schools is growing all the time. And there are many circuits in which you can book for many weeks at a time. And that costs for all kinds of artists. And they even use magicians on this. Oh, no. It isn't just... They like a variety. Sure. Because people do like to see people performing. And as long

as there are people, they will be live performers. I mean, there is always that type of showbiz. One of the things that I've been doing lately, I mean, I try not to do it outside of too many miles away, and outside of Chicago too much anymore, is selling or attracting an audience with one of the tricks at a trade show. For example, I was in my comic place just a couple of weeks ago during the houseware show. That'll be three weeks ago when this is aired. And this is mid -afternoon. It isn't morning. What your readers should know, your people. Anybody watching this? I was at the auto show a year ago. And this is a thing where you... This is a growing area then for the performance of the industrial show. And industrial shows are tremendous things. Well, you mentioned industrial. There is a great need in this country, and there are many people building this kind of a thing now, directing musical organization in industry. Many of the steel companies

and many large industrial firms have their glee clubs, they have their bands, they have their orchestras. And they do that as a means of holding their workers. They provide these opportunities while they don't say they won't make much money off it. But it is a way of holding. And the director who does that has a real nice job. The Dal Chemical Company of Midland Michigan has a tremendous set up. They win... I have worked with them. Well, one of our boys at Tech graduated and went up there because, in his interview with Dal Chemical Engineer, in his interview, they found that he had played Clarence the band, saying in the Tech Men glee club. And they said, well, here, you will enjoy working for us, and we will enjoy having you because you fit right in with what we do. And he is in his third year, and he says he expects to stay there. And the director has the training and their ability to do those things. And they regard that, and they pay well for that, too. Well, let's talk a little bit more about the training

that is best for today's performing arts. In the old days, there was little formal training in acting. People almost not. People went out and did it. They went out and acted and got their training that way. Now, the opportunities for going out... Now, while we're waiting for the gigantic two -and -a -half -hour Burlesque Show, which is going on on this stage in just a few moments, we're going to call this gift item number one. I mean, this used to be a great form of show business. Burlesque, carnivals, circuses, riverview park. This is still a show business. There are very ultra -forms of show business, and legitimate theatre is probably the best example of that. But you've got to have something that starts you. And as long as you're working for people, many times actors are happy. Well, then that kind of training is no longer with

us. So what kind of training? Well, they're still carnivals. Well, the view park hasn't... It's only open from the end of May until Labor Day, but there's more formalized training available now. Oh, well, that's why my boy is a good one. I think he'll come up with something from there. And one of the problems is you've got so much competition. You have people, for example, on television shows. Anyone around these studios knows that every day someone comes here and will pay to get on the air. They won't pay enough to sponsor their own show because that's the way they can do it. But they will practically pay just to appear on a show like this. Matter of fact, here. You know the problem. You don't have any problem with people turning you down. And everyone's anxious to get their face on the television screen. This doesn't provide very good training for the actor, though. That's very true. So the kind of training best suited for today's performer would be found in the universities,

in the formalized schools of acting or music. Well, one of the things, one movement, I think, should be mentioned in that regard is that practically all of the universities, the state universities, and even private schools too, now have opera departments and drama departments. And which people who formerly might have gone into this hit or miss training idea, now find in the training that they haven't got what it takes. So it stops a lot of them from going ahead because they try it and they find it isn't for them. On the other hand, they have turned out a great many, fine performers, I'm thinking of several universities right here in our own area, Indiana University of Illinois, University of Michigan. And Northwestern University, they have turned out quite a number of fine performers that have gone places. The opera departments in these universities aren't fantastic because they give a very marvelous training. And as a result, we have amateur, well, semi -professional opera being given all over. And many of those people have made a goal.

But now those who don't make a goal, it means that they have chosen not to, not because they don't have a talent. And they have the training too. But on the other hand, there aren't the kind of opportunity, they just feel maybe they aren't up to it. They don't want to go on that. Then again, there's a thing where the amount of money that you make on these shows, as you branch off, we'll say, as an actor, you work at first for an equity scale. And you find you can't live on that. So there's a story at Austin Bean used to tell. One time he was working at nightclub in Boston. And they booked him in Montreal. And the years have gone by since this happened. But he was booked there for something like $75. And it cost him $125. What was when he lost him in the exchange? And he wondered about that. He said, this is not very good, is it? And this agent Washington, Dr. Schegar, or Ms. Malvin, said, Deshan, you've got to save up for them out of

town jobs. I want to get back to this training aspect here for a minute. The formal training will give the person the chance to decide before he has to go out and try and go living. I think very strongly. So especially in the music, because there will be plenty of competition, plenty of opportunity in performing and comparing performance with others. And now we have recordings that in every, I don't care how small the town, or even not in the country. We have tapes and we have recordings. We have television, we have radio. And so they have more of a standard to work from. It didn't used to be that way. You might be the best in town. You thought you were some pumpkins. But now all of that has changed very materially. And we have state contests in which I hear kids I have judged you a great deal. I hear kids play it. It's fantastic what they do. They don't know that they're doing something as difficult so they go ahead and do it. And there is a tremendous town, a great deal of that that is being developed in that

way. Remember the great thing with the musician arrived late and he's walking down the street with his violin case? He didn't know his way around town. He said, he followed playing in the doorway, but also playing a violin. He followed with the violin case, and he said, how do I get to orchestra hall? Practice. It is. It's a long hard training time before one can expect to make a reasonable living at it. That's true. There's some of these kids start in fifth grade though. And by the time they get to high school, they've had a real good apprentice training. And some of our bands and orchestras would amaze you how well they play. And in many communities, members of the high school orchestra are playing in the local symphony orchestra. They're getting a real good experience there, apprenticeship. Well, we've said pretty well during this half hour that... Has it been that long? Have we held up that side as this go -to -close that a person, Mr. Yoder, should really think twice before deciding to pursue this? Well, actors follow the line of least persistence. I mean, if it

comes easy, they'll go on to start them. Well, no, that's the problem. Does it come easy? How does it come easy? It's the talent. It's the opportunity to perform. And the personality. We have to consider the personality, too, the person. He may be able to work under pressure. And maybe he's optimistic and will go on. He has consistent in what he does. He doesn't give up. Because that means everything to him to do that. Determination. The determination is a great factor. The majority of people in the business, what kind of living do they make? Do they make a reasonable living? Well, I think actors' equity, for example, publishes in one of their annual reports. The number of members of accurate equity, a number of people who... It comes a dismal figure. It seems that if you compile all these salaries with a number of actors in the membership and divide by that, you wind up whether they make $185 a year. But this is a false figure. That's right. Because,

for example, some of them may be... Well, there's a fellow who walked around for three years. And the fellow said, you haven't worked in three years? He says, no, I know. I'm thinking of giving up show business. Just by maintaining membership, does not mean that he's a performing artist. That's true. And he doesn't want to be a performing artist. Right. Well, some of them have been for a time in the music angle. Have tried it and then decided they don't go ahead. But they keep their membership, even the professional organization. So as he says, it is a false... It is a matter of a false figure when you try to give it. But you can make as much in the music business as you want to make. It's up to you. There are many opportunities there. The next one is this, you know. He's giving signals. Jay, thank you. It goes like this, we're in trouble. Thank you for passing the signals on. And I guess you're right. It is time that we close this morning. And I want to thank you both for a very informative and enjoyable point. I might get on this show. And thanks again, Mr. Nuts and Mr. Marshall for this. Thank you,

Mr. Anderson. And I'm glad you're having you on the American scene. This is Don Anderson saying, good morning for the American scene. This has been the American scene. Today's discussion, job horizons in the performing arts. At his guests, Mr. H. G. Nutt, director of the Vanderkook College of Music. And Mr. Jay Marshall, professional magician and comedian. Host on the series is Don Anderson, the villainy tech. The American scene is pre -recorded and is produced by the Illinois Institute of Technology and Cooperation with WMQ. Next week's topic will be, job horizons in physics. And we'll be discussed by Catherine O 'Brien and Robert Eston as we continue our investigation of the American scene. Music Results count. And when it comes to the fight against heart disease, you can count on your heart association for results.