Conversations with Eric Hoffer; 1; The Ordeal of Change

the pope we present the first in a series of six conversations between very proper and james daley oh recall for as a laborer for more than forty years he has supported himself at the strength of his hands and back as a longshoreman on the sentences the waterfront as an agricultural worker and as a minor he is also a writer history books and several essays of one in the highest praise of literary critics they are part of a self educated man he never finished grammar school one in the bronx the son of a german cabinet maker eric offer was to lose his mother and his site at the age of seven and his father when he was a teen the eight years of his blindness he recovered his side effect being left him with an enormous appetite for the present were an appetite

that is not that is not diminished the years since he moved to the west coast to become a migrant laborer a minor on a dockworker in nineteen fifty one he published his first book the true believer the study of the nature of mass movements three years later he was to publish two hundred eighty aphorisms under the title the passionate state of mind his most recent book the ordeal of change as a collection of essays that deal with a crisis of self esteem each of us offers one faced with a new and the unknown mr hofer in the opening seconds do your book the ordeal of changes that were all afraid of the new why is this when you work as a as an american i shouldn't be interested in calling the question of change after all we are awfully familiar with change we change our places latino of jobs which and husbands and wives we change it in france just like that the

blast to the problem of go well you know right after the war something has happened everywhere you a nation in africa and latin america that was senate we were told was that it's an awakening that liquid water is under the local police began to mobilize themselves in a hurry you have been bestsellers and sells and asked was so good the eve which is what happens when they want it in under the vote courted the court order he wants to modernize mr goeas but if you practical so what they suggested that if you were also a few factories and it is some hospitals some schools these are all practical day things they're doing at that stage in that house in order to accomplish such sober practical things you want to build a factory in one of the comments was that the full court the court record a corporate loan with all those things without it crowley changing

two things in the marine corps won't find out whether these and i've settled on that the almost implausible think that the real problem is the problem of change it into public subjected to drastic change that means that it's not just that and the sense was that self confidence self respect if you get a chance to acquire those things by my action by proving himself for it doesn't get a chance and easy way and all the easy way to be as open as a self respect he substitutes was he's substitute for self confidence and once you going for substitutes you on apple still passion you have to sit in

their voice they substitute pork supporters his faith faith and really face the nation facing or the courts faith and so it was over the bride before your bible scenes you have a heated battles there you have the bad luck was that if the stage and this was my first apple to actually invisible to mr beatty if you do you know is it in each chapter mr les i caught up with the problem from a different angle ceo of groping around and i did for that problem immigrants to the mall complex he became i could see that that i suddenly realized the changes is actually disseminated not we americans are used to change the current president the bird population the population ever before has

it has adjusted itself to change that when you're not just about was this is the last time the ramadan fifty years we are in the sicilian space it's a day that that these are just the two to wear their world all the actual technological change of all i will lulu what's going on in russia is that the annual human nutrition labels meant that when the audacity they would do differently they just the human eye speech and turned them into material into the best thing that didn't they and you will turn people into good flexible at objects day that they will be ready to love what it takes what they love and we'll the difference between men men truth and lies in order words this is also at the way of creating a population that's the tide i just had to try like why do you refer to a nation and changes a nation of

misfits why must change bring about a misfit why isis itself up business today that if you take for instance eric and a nation that has been living for for thousands of years in a certain mortified and suddenly you drink it then they have to be honest it's we need to adjust themselves the new mortal jesus actually as i thought it was the i just said that we surveyed it change used against humanity in albany our lands development or does climate change was a very rare occurrence but a very brief appearance young award and at the swampy tear open a book it as i guess they're recently a career when the henry adams is a singularly first it doesn't on this original the forests so just before the first debate shows you that the people if i might have that by the

way i believe the way the people live in a sense are the way people in the sea based on it now as you look over the world right now to be i seem to see people lead the leading role in africa it is a chef in latin america but julie farmer stone age into the twentieth century that looting businesses and he said i will break you like doing at the end in that first chapter or restitution i've tried to develop it i like what we thought before before in voices within their id id and operates the idea that the ocean is an instrument of chickens actually a warm ocean is that i productive change its terrace it's the result of human patients the difficulties the

pain that's generated human population by the president change and then turn their work in the change must come first absolutely the second thing that happens is what these injured people as james that's first and then you see the scenes as a solutions a byproduct of doing just that juvenile delinquency is a byproduct off as that passive form form where all right in bed in the distant is a byproduct of the just going to lose them that's an expose of me change is a process other conditions under which change can take place without creating yes i said i'm out yes yes but what was new that puerto rico right there that was in the survivors of the hurricane but it's a band in a silver apples here and why well before the supply with skills the supply which coupled with me is there and the people there are i

have had the chance to acquire some of this isn't respect what about subsequent police action against a resort of sensibilities of an expose of that you can't have the real thing the real thing is here the report itself over this was always a more the rate is so witty and you're not absolutely confident years ago though he gets to go overseas saying that self respect like if you have to have faith in something it has to be absolutely because you have to blink them do something that's outside yourself as the surface as a substitute for full first choice seat yet convinced yourself that this is not so much a saturday as the real thing see after all they believe there is not really a subject that you know it's not that this isn't that this is a seat that these convictions set the new leads you said that pride is also a substance of the surface this would also get

you come across a passionate pursuit you can almost say automatically that these men is pursuing as such it is pursuing something that would serve a second or something lost or something all the catholic bishops are practically always tip a shoot for four percent if they didn't see people the story about the man we was lucky he was a lot of disappointed that somebody comes in the best music on the outside these online identities this guy is looking for sex what it rivals or models or wrist or wind must these these nations are speaking that are so potentially explosive while most basic substitutes why can't they seek self respect how do you get so

first how big voices loudly the easiest way to self confidence forces dispatched an awful what happened in the school in new force for good year in france for millions of thousands of europe to these corporate and change elijah also when i see the global menu board revoked and we'll fly in that they came from sleep into the villagers warmed criminal as life and suddenly they were dumping on this continent strangers and to get a cold war and yet the evolution here to the last moment here why because it permissible to these false self assertion from a visible duties for really there were formidable duties for acquiring self confidence and self respect so

now you'll see that it was so the court is not muscled underdeveloped countries that are modernizing themselves in our city that they're really good chances for being the lead you so the key thing is worth these individual respect an individual because they're they have to be to get that impunity with substance with the question of change was even much deeper i thought it was that they could change all was a cadence and human nature you know you get it when you change all of a sudden at the city from one mode of life to another bit you actually did you actually get the key to have to convince yourself you know that you are now as something altogether different than what you were yesterday see you have the choir the losing the only

knew that i had to have a new life now the annual scene only case where drastic change is taking place this that is that staging of a play there's this vision of being you know that's something that was born but something on president that is taking place as and as i said i started out with these data under the vocal tricks and only two was indeed i realize is that what is now happening in the end of the parties has actually happened to the opposite too but we had a madhouse we too had explosions all over the place by the choices that the growth of nationalism of socialism of common is doing modern times you know the last hundred years or so was also hit a byproduct of you know off of the drastic change of transforming millions of peasants into economies into industrial

workers of course some of these peasants' acquired a new identity by crossing the ocean and coming americans this this was indeed unlike because in order for breast exchanged was enormous that you need the people who are experiencing them prosecutors must have a chance to walk write and why they must have a chance to feel good that the new people that i'm leaving in life of a president in a lot of his country actually was illegal it wasn't there yet and their new language get to eat different food was dressed differently changing is the day and now we can see something similar had been making his or here or there you have it something different after they shopped in prison correctional center the middle soldiers and families and there again there's a new life coming out every month and you lived in through language and everybody will just fixing made changes in his name there is a new

identity because in europe or there was as the acquisition of a new identity as a german forces with a change was was most struck me because germany had to pitch up he didn't want to have some feeling that you lived the girls did you ride the job member of the nation of warriors and see whether there is a us exchange you have these mysteries you have these acts do these plays new us ewing jr author saint of a warrior or the pioneer cd and this is what about what biden to now an enormous debate about the benefits change that the negro is an aspiring four dollars to support any group that's all he asked for supporting its equine suppose he gets the segregation was still the problem there was because

that would just say it that i just it really takes root really becomes and you only with decoys and we see with a tv movie with it with a faith in a new live cd this is just what many western governments are using the negro community to be best to perform something that's when the wind it down racially whole world see so that every negro can be proud of all these new community over its leaders are all think it means you've spoken of pride as a substitute for solving just substitute in the skies you see he pleases the plight of the it's a terrible plight especially i can see is their survey the negro individually in that unit in that white environments and a

white in america is always an eagle first and only secondly you no matter how old studies at events as he cannot say verdict and more grace of life see weed out an identification with a prominent negro community see this is what baroque gold this is what was so the eighth inning and the children will visit wondering middle class to go and they have to act or all the actors union on the negro community they have to change the arrival of the community they have to be they have to create that you might look mr lee you become built this that you made about less moses wanted to perform a simple thing you want to think a crime of slaves out of egypt into free so we didn't get it right well has

been generally don't know that this apparently simple thing is that is all about simple sweet and easy the whole fabric of the largest meal and the geological as fabric of the old testament shows what fifty five and some older sure what valls has tried to do in order to enable those leaves to become generally freeman he had to invent a jehovah and one the only god who hadn't won only people he had to invent via probably ideal the promised land and after i mean this he went all these is still wet and ed tribal slaves could really become free man he decided he had to wait for a new generation so we don't but i was a student of the dozen and waited for years for the liberation of i'm only the new generation does the morning there's the bread what if you're going to become a

free people so you can see what i did this book did they actually get any change is this is that that was the most explosive process and the funny part of it is the only lately i realize there is one change one versus changes going on all communities letter of what stage its invasion that and his the change but we know it's an explosion across as everybody knows that the <unk> is there a little bit and that it has that awful lot about the juvenile delinquency the way nationalism socialism is the tournament was your station's operations going to they love change the ordeal of change one issue which they desire for change in asia for example mr oliver is a communist vegetation pay a casting off of colonial oppression

are casting off a corrupt governments you see the idea that the reporters you're the war has not something to all the court was i mean you would argue that you look at india you look at dick in louisiana look at all these quotas in africa the war is not something that war has been a turning point in an up to the second world war there were revolutions of course by the colonial powers were not convinced you know that the end has come some day is the one who knows how that spirit came abroad it's kind of change to prove that we can see you see

the list is almost an imagined what it took for a deal and say the booms fish you its own abilities reward knows what's going on inside a nation as it is a crime and he says they have to be able to step in each at hp it's really something of course there's a bit of russia they don't pay our competition with russia our fighting for only needed four schools with it is it also possible for these it's not just beginning what about the soviet satellite

countries one of your chapters entitled popular upheavals in communist countries and here is an area where suppose americans of hope for change of sounds you'll when i want to do believe are actually working you know before he killed first draft as i predicted that the irs economy's got you will come when the constitution it will relax when it comes to leadership will fight with a little less sleep you know what's one and one that would be good like what the moment the people lived it will get a piece of the good life then one should expect an explosion in england one would not expect explosion one day when stalin was in power there when when people were released as they had their windows in mud you know it's when their situation is the worst is not the time when i'm

all requests to see that but then if the beets hope it's the day in the deep hole the end feeling that you what you also have with us then what he does when people become rebellious then it is what would become the lead advocate you could almost think that you were maybe a votes in india's eastern germany in the air in hungary important always going to as a surprise nobody really expected anything lola believe that the only senator norm was going up the russians and duty to and consumption people there and the theory was there seeing you see is many years before that or something you can predict almost what porters they did the day of the regime might

break out some so there was my breakout you can't predict the future but you did select eastern germany as well places where it was most likely to want to sell because you see all anytime that i consider the question of revolution i am always go away you know that the individual buys cannot accomplish much what his powers are being divvied york by himself is visitors authority is this a short lived in ways that is finished in order for the individual to do they get out with hundreds and five he needs to identify himself with something outside it's something at her it's something but it's something impressive that we inhabit the eastern germany the identification with something outside themselves this is the most that western germany and war

was really really was open you could actually cross into building and see what what you know what is it what you do you identify yourself and i suggested also you know that that's that those nations we prowl the fighting isis because it was likely to rule raul colon about allowing big checks much the checks have a synthetic that's stacey jackson cautious is that renewables reaching seoul in other words you wish you had and ask you your hand and that you expect some sort of explosion once who ships that it wants these successes of this that started to relax their hold on the people what can these people identify with today of them western germany or western variations of course

america's normal a norwegian farmer restraint will that warns but it's a united europe yes all that is it will soon for human babies that i think about it your eyes what a tremendous object of identification that unite the euro would be for the year of the cat populations in poland in hungary incentives like eating every in every satellite never recorded just outside the bay area and natural borders off of a fear of soviet pressure really that it's breathtaking when you receive a whopping nine eleven might've europe would be that people dont often win because after all we are we are just as a reason for european pride and medicare was created by the undesirable was just out where you

are he added undesirable element the debt much there and your bits of the us draw from one to continue this conversation in our next meeting and ask you something about the role of the intellectuals and this process of change because i know from what you've written you have a great many thoughts on the roving collection will pursue that to the rule of the masses and a week very much what was the first in a series of six conversations between or a call for and james day general manager of kqed assistant ag national educational television