Kids Who Kill; Willie Johnon interview continued. Dan Rabago interview

He's still talking about the idea of some of the wall needing to come down. This is not so much about you. I think most people thought at one time a year ago say that Dominic was farther along than you in getting where you needed to go. And maybe that's not true now because you've made such good progress. And it seems as though there seems to me an untrained observer that he's still stuck on some stuff. Would you see it that way? Well, I can't say I'm farther than him. That's not even... That really don't even run to my mind to be quite honest with you. It's like we've both grown a lot together and, you know, I'm sure it'd be confusing or anything like that that would happen. Well, I wasn't speaking in terms of greeting you. I don't mean that.

But I can't know how to say it. But that he's still having a lot of trouble dealing with things. Do you see that? I can see that where he was, I mean, maybe this is him, this is who he's going to be if that's his life. You know, maybe he's going to grow more, maybe he's not. I don't know. But I can't see where you could open that many more doors, and I really can't. I just can't see. Well, I'm sure he opens up to you much more than he does to maybe anyone, but more than it appears to us. It does seem as though he closes himself in and he's a very private person. Well, to some people, you can come across like that, yeah.

I mean, I think I would tune some ways to some people just because it is sort of scary to let some people into you, because you never know what's going to happen. I think he's just a quiet person like that, you know? Do you guess what? Really? He doesn't particularly give off the idea of great pain or he did in the marathon, but otherwise he seems fairly tranquil and it's hard to tell what's going on inside him, and I have the feeling that probably isn't a whole lot of pain. Yeah, I know there is, being a friend, I know there is, I know that you can't just think about that kind of stuff all the time, or you would get nowhere, and that's just bottom line.

You wouldn't get nowhere in life. You'd be on yourself so constantly that you'd probably kill yourself. That's probably the end result. Once you start dealing with them, I'm not saying to forget about it, because that's not what the whole plan of the scene is to get better and find out what he was doing, what was going on in that situation, and then I think he knows what's going on, he knows what went on, and it's a struggle within himself every day, not to do anything stupid, to himself or something like that, you know what I mean, because I think it is. I think he referred to it once in a group as taking a vacation from the constant thought of it. Yeah, I mean. And you take those two, you take a little time off? Oh, yeah, you have to. I mean, you gotta, you take the time off just to figure out what's going on inside of you. That's the whole purpose of it is.

I mean, you think about it. You think about all the pain you've caused, you think about all the pain that's going on right now, right to the very second. You think about them not being with their son and that kind of stuff, and then you can only think about that so much before you get so down on yourself that it's not even hardly verbal. And that's what happened in the real days, could we still, you know, and I don't know, I can't say it's a vacation. I think it's more of a dealing with it, I think it's more of just facing up to it, facing up to it, then dealing with it, and then never forgetting what happened, never forgetting where you come from, but also at the same time letting go and getting on with your life so you can become a better person and help other people and give back. That sounds nearly impossible, that balancing act between never forgetting, always having some guilt and yet leading a normal life with normal thoughts and feeling good about yourself.

Can you do that? I don't know, I mean, I have a life beyond the clear, I don't know yet, I mean, it's, you can try, I mean, that's all you can do, you got, it's trial and error, you got to go through life now from what we've done, get all we can, give back, help other people, not to get where we've come from, give to yourself, respect yourself, everybody around you. Do the feelings, and pray, ask God to help, you know? How do you see life after McLaren, how do you see Willie years from now, what are you going to be doing, what are your daydreams at that time? Man, there's just so many, I mean, it's, there's all kinds of possibilities, I mean, life, it's, I can't explain it, it's, you can go, I can go out and, you know, I can give back to the community and stuff, how, being a volunteer program, being a boys and girls clubs,

be there to help somebody that's having a real hard time, be there for the game members that are getting young, I want to just be somebody that people can look up to and talk out loud. But, let everybody know what the life is not about, I mean, you just don't want to go down to this kind of roads, you want to be able to help, to be able to help somebody, I mean, that's, that's what my idea is to help somebody, I mean, even if you just change a couple lives, you know, I mean, that's all worth it, because I know you can make it, I know you can make impacts out there, just got to know how to do it and when to do it in the right way. Well, people will be able to look at you after you get out of here with no fear, whatever. No. Me personally, as I am now, if you come to me, yeah, yeah, I think so. But I mean, being the past tense, people that knew me before, that don't know me now,

I'm sure there would be fear there, I mean, I would be, if I was someone from the outsider, yeah, if I knew who Willie Johnson was and say he's gonna come out worse, you know, he's gonna come out and kill again, why you guys let him out, that's what I would be saying. But I'm not, no, this is me now, and I, if I meet somebody, I don't plan on, I don't think they'll be scared of me. If you could put yourself outside of yourself and confront yourself, you wouldn't be afraid. No, huh, no. I mean, it would be sort of cool to see the progress and everything that someone like that's come through to see what they're gonna get back and stuff, what they're gonna do. That's the premise of the film we're doing, that something unusual and very important is happening here. Unusual and important. Would you say it that way?

Yeah. Yeah. You guys, that's how exactly see it. You don't get that many chances, you know, I mean, I got real lucky. Coming here. Yeah, and my time and everything, you know, in this whole situation, I got someone's looking out for me, I mean, Larry, no, you get to make lunch all the time, that was great, and I know what I want to do this again. Real good one. All right. Yeah, it was. So, you have to be myself. So, what do you keep up with the stuff outside, like the news? Yeah, I watch the news, yeah, I mean, you can't, every time you watch the news, I mean,

it's just like, gosh, everything is just violent. That's unreal, I just, maybe I never paid too much before, but it's just like that now. I mean, some notice right now, it's just crazy, just it's scary going back out there. Well, some of us think that the news you see on the air is a distortion of reality, and it really isn't that violent, it's only, but the violent things are what people in the news consider news. No. But it's hard to tell, isn't it? Yeah, I think it does look pretty grim. Yeah, I mean, you look at the, you know, I mean, you should be able to look on the news, and look, there should be a man on the news, maybe saying a person, saying what he did good. I mean, this is, I mean, say you got somebody out there, and, well, I had a, we had a, we had a person, you know, go down, talk to the homeless people, we had to go down there,

and they never did that kind of stuff. They never showed up, all the good stuff everybody's doing. They never showed the, that kind of stuff. I think it should be more. I mean, it's good to let people know what's going on, it's community violence and everything, but it's just, that's reality, that's what's happening, it's just sort of scary to look at it sometimes. Do you have, be a forest worker? I'd like forest a lot, or a wood framer, or something to do with wood, or wood. Did you, before you came in here, is that something you learned in the shop, or, you always been interested in it? That's something I learned here, I think. I'm pretty sure, yeah, I mean, I had, a little nice snacks and stuff, you know, I mean, but it's mostly, I found a little fort here. I didn't think you figured so, but, you know, with lies and group all the time. I know. He lies to us. That stuff, that stuff, I learned enough, other five years and I'll knock it off.

Let's go eat. Okay. These questions are, most of them are going to be really general. And the first one, maybe most general of all, could you kind of lead me through your life, and tell me the high points of where you come from? Okay. And the little points. Whatever you're willing to tell me, whatever is, you think important, whatever comes to your mind when you think you've passed. Well, I don't know, I was born in Oregon. My mom went down to San Diego and basically was raised there to us about 13 or something.

During that time, it was like, I don't know, it was just, I don't know, it was kind of hard actually. You know, because it's my dad and stuff, and the shit he used to do, it was messed up and, can you be more specific about that? Well, just basically, you know, physical abuse, emotional abuse, to mean my mother and my family and stuff and, you know, my brother kind of stayed out of it, so lucky for him. I don't know, after that, my mom divorced my dad and moved up here, well, she got remarried, moved up here to Oregon, and basically I came, I was California, you know, I looked different,

acted different, it was from a different place, came up here, it was way different, you know, I didn't know, you know, type of kids which is completely different, it's like kind of like a meaty rejection, you know, and it's kind of made me angry, kind of made me, you know, get into the bad side, hang around with worse people and start doing drugs and, you know, doing destructive things and just being in a rebel, you know, basically. And what way was, were you different from people in Oregon? Well, it was always tan, they were light, you know, I just, I was in a different thing, most people here, you know, they're in the basketball and, you know, sports and stuff, I wasn't into, you know, I was in a guitar and stuff and I was learning guitar and that's what I was into, different music and those aren't really in that many people that shared

my same interests, so. And others put you down because of that? Yeah, yeah, I was new too, it was harder to gain acceptance, you know, when there's lack of interest, you know, in your new, you know, people at that age, you know, they're looking for, look at me socially accepted, you know, you got to fit in with a click somewhere. I guess I never did fit in, so, I don't know, that kind of started me on, I don't know, started me on getting into the occult. So you, you became friends with others who felt like outcasts and, and got into drugs, just a start back there if you would.

Yeah, well, I met a bunch of guys who basically shared my same interests, you know, two brothers and just kind of, we started a band and we're really into our music for a while and that's all we did. We didn't really think about, you know, evil things, but come to high school years when we started to high school, it was like, it was just, I don't know, we were just, I felt, I felt like I had to prove something, you know, it's for everybody else, so people will leave me alone and people stay away from me, you know, I wanted to be, I wanted to be hated at that time and so, you know, I, I said things to people, I gave them, you know, real bad looks and stuff and I just do my best to push them away and, you know, the others followed, you know, and they did the same things I was doing and basically progressed

to the point where I started dabbling in the coat and stuff and reading about it and kind of wondering, starting to believe in it, you know, and then, you know, I can only speak for myself, but eventually it got to the point where it became me, you know, and that's basically all I really loved. How did you first come across that, the occult? Well, I knew about it and stuff because my mom, you know, she's a big Christian and stuff and a lot of religion and false had problems with her against my music, saying it was satanic or evil or whatever and basically I was, I just, I never really thought of it as nothing, but then it started interest me a lot, you know, and so I read about it and, you know,

got a couple books like the Necronomicon, satanic bible and started reading it, trying to see what it's about and, you know, I was reading there and it was saying, well, it's me, you know, that's who I was, I fit in with those people, that's who, and that's where I belong. So I started taking a belief upon that and I just progressed deeper into my beliefs to where I had a deeply strong faith. What's the belief like when you believe in the occult or in Satanism, what's that amount to? I don't, I don't know anything about it. Everybody has their own beliefs of so many different types of satanists out there, you know, on myself, I just believed in the worship of Satan through evil acts, you know, through basically praising him and gaining power and trying to energy from people, you know,

and that, and that was my thing, it was like, it's, it's pretty complicated in some ways, but there's certain mentality that goes along with it, you know, and you build your mentality with, you get deeper into it, the farther you pursue it and you get to the point where you just don't feel anymore, you know, you start seeing things and, you know, and we're, weird stuff starts happening. Seeing things, what sorts of things? Well, seeing and like feeling, you'd feel forces and stuff and it just, it overwhelm you, it overwhelm you and it just boggle the mind and this power, it was real, it was real enticing. It's like, you know, everybody wanted to have that power, that same kind of power, you know, and being able to control the power and, you know, visualizing demons and stuff

like that, people, you know, I've seen that stuff myself and, you know, I don't know if I was so much afraid at the time, but when I think about it now, you know, it's pretty scary thought. Was someone teaching you this or were you getting it from books or were you just inducing it in yourself? Well, I conducing it myself, it was, I don't know, I call upon, you know, I kind of like pray to the devil and call upon the spirits to come inside me and, and take control of me and, and all that, and they did, and they did, and you could see them, well not all the time, but during rituals and stuff, we'd, we'd see them. Did, uh, your music enter into that, or did that, did Satanism enter into your music,

either way? Well, yeah, there was, there was bands that, uh, believed, you know, or that we assume believe like we did, and, uh, listen to those bands, because we relate with those people, you know, and there's a lot of bands that aren't into that though, but, uh, bands I, I mostly listen to with the most satanic bands and part of the heaviest bands in death metal, uh, that was the stuff that got me going, at least. But it was like a, with my music, it was more like a just a release, you know, it was a release, you know, for me, so I did it. When you played, were you playing what you consider satanic music? No, in the, uh, through my lyrics, would be, my lyrics would be satanic, uh, like what? I don't know, just, uh, butchery and talking about destroying God and all, and all types

of shit, you know, it's just, I don't know, just the worst possible things that, that anybody can think of, you know, is what I try to put in my lyrics. In the marathon, we saw, um, you talked about your crime, even though you didn't, uh, take part in the beating, you acknowledged being in charge, is that, is that right? You, you, you got these guys to do the beating, you think? I, I feel I was the main influence, I feel that I was the main influence. How so, why were you in what way were you? Because all these guys felt basically the same way I did, and, uh, I myself, I was, I was blowing up at that point, you know, and I just felt the urge at all times to kill somebody.

And, uh, one, you know, one time me and my partner were bored, and I suggested to them and just sound like a good idea, and, you know, when I seen that, he was actually considering it, you know, I did my best to make it happen, you know, to my best to pump him up and make it happen, to pump him up, talking to him, try to make him, try to make it seem like it was okay, like this is, this is what we're going to do. I got the impression that you thought that you had somehow telepathically told them to murder this person. I did, well, I did use my mind, envisioning it to happen, but I didn't directly try to affect it, his mind or nothing.

But in my mind, I envisioned it, you know, I visualized it, and I willed it to happen, you know, so I feel, you know, basically that it's, it's my fault. When you got here to McLaren, were you still a Satanist? Yeah, but I wasn't really admitting it to anybody, and my heart was, I was just hiding. But changed, described that, when and how, why? Well, I think, you know, all the time is listening to other people, and just really thinking, absorbing it, and I mean, I came here with an open mind, but I still kind of worship Satan, but I wasn't as committed to it.

And I came here with an open mind, and the more I heard, the more I listened to other people started realizing that, well, my problems, you know, aren't really any different than anybody else's. And I know that realizations hit me, you know, of other people suffering, you know, and I started feeling again, you know, it was a long time before I really felt, but I started feeling again, and that's when everything kind of crashed in on me, and I came with the realization what I did, you know, and things that led up to me not feeling, and led up to what happened. crashed in on you, described that, well, it was like, it was just a series of things, you know, people tell me that I learned and grew, you know, and a lot of times I'd be,

you know, I go to sleep at night, and I kind of think about it, and I think about it happening to someone I cared about, you know, and so I kind of associated with that pain at that time. It's when I really started feeling, and I just started the worst possible things that can happen, and I started, I just started feeling it again, you know. You've been psychologically numb for some time. Yep. How do you feel now? About anything, how, what's your general frame of mind, how are you happy, sad, depressed, encouraged, are you better, anything, any way you can describe it?

Well, these days I'm, I'm real eager to learn, you know, more about how to control myself, and basically to get all the bad shit inside me out, you know, I'm just seeking knowledge these days, you know, trying to learn from other people, trying to learn, you know, in every way, you know, I'm a lot more emotional these days, you know, I feel a lot more of my, I'm pretty intact with my emotions, but sometimes it takes longer for it to come, you know, and I don't know, I kind of felt a freedom that I never felt before, you know, even locked up, I feel more happier and more free, I never had my whole life. I have a group, a great relationship, it's real important to me, my guitar playing is

skyrocketed, and I've learned, I'm learning to express myself better and relate to people and like people, you know, more, instead of, I just don't feel the hate and the rage I used to feel, I feel set free. I understand that. I know I'm a lot more emotional than I do, I feel like I'm a lot more emotional.

I know I'm a lot more emotional than I do, I feel set free. I know I'm a lot more emotional than I do, I feel set free. I know I'm a lot more emotional than I do, I feel set free. I know I'm a lot more emotional than I do, I feel set free. I know I'm a lot more emotional than I do, I feel set free.

I know I'm a lot more emotional than I do, I feel set free. I know I'm a lot more emotional than I do, I feel set free. I know I'm a lot more emotional than I do.