A Word on Words; 4014; David Hardin

oh no televisions used to be a way of celebrating all things literature and ideas for more than three decades but this is a word weren't jobs once again welcome to a word on words my guest today is david hart and then a writer and editor at newspapers all across the south nashville riley jackson mississippi huntsville alabama is national journalism awards isn't willing to provide here today to talk about his book after the war alliance and reputations of great soul figures after the shooting stopped it focuses on the continuing lives of eleven people from the war five civilians have confidence and georgia elizabeth custer welcome david morton were excited to be here i'm glad they have you here on an idea of what a day to begin with that i think i've learned more about one of america award for

this book than i ever knew before that on an awful well thank you think here let me ask you i i did not know enough about the mad woman i had read about the man woman and issued a spendthrift and eventually end song no phones but the conflict with her son robert somehow had escaped me that that conflict and the former first lady in a state as it's virtually impossible for me to imagine we could ever have another situation as we had with i would hope not fly on she was a very sad figure of course there are two schools of thought

about or talk once you sort of been taken out revisionist too that saved a painter as a woman much put upon you have a right to live her life as she saw fit on the issue is often victimized by a victorian times and an uneven robert comes in for a lot of criticism that he was overly reaction reaction or torture behavior degree my degree he had political ambitions higher so on and so forth the others do of course if she wasn't crazy you probably would walk across the street to major robert had a lot on his hands long she'll she was a spin through she was a shopaholic the colors come out

of popularity and as you know button on what she's been quite a lot of dough and she ran up quite a lot of bills including the white house when i first went to the white house it was almost as if the civil war was about to happen and she went on the white house of course was was a very seedy place at the time somebody i think say look i'm a very rundown hotel and she set about to spruce it up but in the process they him the white house budget the household budget was something like twenty thousand dollars for the entire four year term of all of the presidential first family she spent all that in the first year and then you know run up a lot of the values of the process that were unlike and looking to lead to even have the money and she she later a few severe cuts in the staff in and so when they were out of the stable now and

then you know actors have here is going after the president's last two assassination and she gets the pension she pushes to expand the bench and there isn't a stage yes or share a mistake but she has this fixation about being bankrupt being flat broke as if you were the destitute overlooked and lincoln bodden still she died she was always buying stuff for family and she was buying stuff or so when at the time she died she had over sixty trucks full of clothes and all she wore was black dresses and that's on jews were in the morning chris at her senate to trial or if you're

in a committed to a sanitarium for several months all the young let's talk about some of those issued vouchers live in a hotel and she bought and so the two weeks issues within the hotel something like forty pairs of curtains for what she had no need for one she bought three watches she didn't wear jewelry she just bought so and then she would turn in the end and fear that she was running out of money she cared of stockton bond's inner petticoat and it is a coat that didn't know that either with syria she and she was afraid it was going to be another great chicago fire and shoot at the full eurozone and what the bonds and in fact one time she'd felt the prospect of fire also near wasn't that she shipped out to over thirteen of the trucks off to milwaukee is so you know there was a lot of average behavior is there was let's talk turned

to liturgical wonderful wonderful gesture about a figure in the war and i think this was maybe the most unappreciated allow a lawless owen jones what about the turncoat george thomas might have been the best general on both sides in the civil war he was a writer he was he was born in virginia near the uk and that turner uprising in fact his mother and ancestors fled during the slave uprising just are a few miles ahead of a neon he was a on a professional soldier he served with robert e lee and in texas before the war plan and serve with in at west point when we returned as superintendent he was always will but unlike

lillian jolson johnston who were born virginians thomas stayed with the union and for that his sisters turned his picture to the wall and kept that they kept in there i had nothing to do and all the young people at new in the army that had gone self wouldn't have anything to do with the law they've bought him a turncoat bomb a traitor to his state and meanwhile the union army with which he stayed was suspicious of him while he was suspect there which made it and you know it's a fellow from both sides recovered from both sides lincoln lincoln wood and promoting because it would take off the new york delegation or the ohio delegation is someone else he usually left that job to grant will graham always so that thomas was after his jaw i think is a first the first

indication the end just how ambitious the most is that we were that he was nervous about jokes i think george thomas was probably the one man in the union army and i'm on grindstone anyway graham thought that any favorite your money always favored sherman over thomas and a cost conscious thomas i think saved sherman's army he got a grand out of the jail matter at chattanooga buys men marching of missionary ridge while sherman can break free be on he was the formidable post in sherman's march to atlanta and then of course they set him back here to nashville to the financial and they stripped his army they ship some mobile home to vote for lincoln in illinois and others sherman marched off went to the city and there wasn't really any big army in front of a german i might thought i might the comment that it took a large army along in case it

is scarlett o'hara's where his loyalties to that and thomas had to throw together an army and on fortifications to the financial from whom you know that you can there is a total change a patient and in the storytelling as we move from thomas to someone you just mentioned camp william tecumseh an avenue his nickname has come for white collar from white collar the tension between the two of them over the memorial grow up to be a catholic priest shocked me they had an older son named william are willing who dead during the war and he took part of us

part of sherman's heart with him sherman was always a high strung person and senate he ran in the family and his mother's his wife sherman a grownup and her family's house sectors his father died when he was about nine years old his of his wife was more was like a sister john but she was a she was a very own dedicated catholic and she wanted the second son too to grow up to be a priest and she starts at very early in life very early in life and even when the child was two years old and then when willie god beyond the pressure mounted from sherman's to get out of the way to be the the leading son willie died of typhoid so in memphis he turns his focus to tom

mary won stronger sherman's a religious person the ones tom to be a businessman or a warrior or some such and pushes him toward that he was all his wife own i wanted to be a priest both of them saying that they're not applying pressure to show once and an impala sprees for those eu just joining us on darwin david harden about after the war the story of what happened after the shooting stopped and these are these people who were caught on both sides of the conflict they've just a day when you think about the olympic mountains sherman for a moment i didn't understand the depth of just how your religious people didn't hear much about the marchers sure of faith and visit there's a letter he

writes thirties pat awful brought about i don't want that boy to be a priest in the lead and grow bigger man let him grow up and be a good man that's always you know he should let people like wobbly whether i wanna believe he's got no problem with a religion but many believe that it was really violent europe not be a soldier or preached and he did not want to be a soldier and you made that very clear the soldier which is something surprising i think is hard when he wanted them to believe he on he took the writer tom on a tour of the west a year after the custard massacre in an actual bighorn tom got a heart attack and sleep on the ground and all that sort of the line with the soldiers life and then the

following spring prom graduated graduate from last to wall in st louis and a week later wrote chairman a letter sherman was in washington journalist simon hughes could be approved and german could never reconcile himself to the business and almost broke up his family farm the young he's held his wife responsible there and she denied it and you know there is a home fun for some big award winner over the jumps and then it's the aftermath of that prison took the voyage that tries to do that the reviews that the place that's right buddy

had conflicts on his side to the media generals food i didn't think much of one of the joe johnston says measures to recap the blanket the earth i think one of the one of the interesting things to come out of the book was how the soldiers the generals are ways to one side saying to get along with the generals lee fought against better than the generals who are on their side and joe johnston ended up the he'd been france course a lot of these people were were soldiers to gather before the war the boston kept his friendship gone with george mcclellan whom he defeated during the war in virginia there was a poll where the general but he was also paul weyrich grants this through and finally as sherman's to all these generals who beat him in battle but at the same time he was he was livid when it comes to the influence of jefferson

davis and annoy john girlhood and then mothers of bor garden a few others that he thought challenges reputation when of course john stallone johnston being a male all where a german still called the pneumonia that would kill him so he on its he was always losing two yankees if you were if there is an interesting chapter in the book and there are many but if they won the nation's undergraduate listeners that remains of the whole forest you know i've written about nathan bedford forrest diverse the only written about but has lectured me on mars as you point out there were in the head three

i guess there was self inflicted wound three disabilities that really damaged the tradition of three specific answers they are on or forced to officially retire this was before the war that got him bankroll they ended up as a big landowner in mississippi the selling really made his money and he was a millionaire hand before the civil war began that decline that the war cost him a million and i have dollars this about women and work the millionaire dallas i came out by growth the other the second was the fort pillow for the magnum photo massacre and done they're the thrust of his flute the responsibility that far is ted pease says this man as army did get out of control for about twenty

minutes they're half empty a contentious always been there from the naysayers the forest ordered it there's no evidence of that certainly i think brought him to trial in the post war period if there had been and the third thing of course is is his association of the klan the ku klux klan this right he was the first brand was here he was not the founder of the klan founders were a bunch of their troubles and lawyers down in to ask you want some new strategy for themselves a social cause and eventually evolve into the klan but it was prominent portion and those are very very terrible times until a say after the war because you had a contagious governor and he had a lot of trouble as a lot of fun

political infighting gone as well some problems in reconstruction going on than but the indications end of a very very well brought out that the forest resign from the clan before eating certain and of course the clay continued with his role in it can indeed forrest was well where like a lot of the suddenly she started to separate themselves from the clan a town that was meant for business forest was in the railroad business at the time he was after investment and they became friends for the cyclists is that nothing else with a lot of northerners followed a lot of investors even had barbecues for unknown in alabama became friends with republicans so on and so forth

and late in his life even tried my commands and some of those disappearances came out for for all black vote supported that none of those solutions is papa rushed and assessments of forest don't go in very much to the times actually what the klan and seem to be focused entirely on these two years right after the war and i think is unfairly caught in his reputation as a us the supreme military commander of the civil war all today sort of brushed aside incidents the klan when you when you think about reputation

as their reputations about largely because of a loving loving wife you know never from childhood on singer of movies about custer you can still whelan saying they're off limits are on all move is so awesome and so smart look liane you know i look at that photograph in the book and i thought this is not the man i knew what i didn't have the long curls handsome swashbuckling hero was on leave he was never unkind cause they're awful and it arrived on the idea that the picture was almost an embarrassment to him but it is fair to say there should be just would not let it lee

true story of a terrible tragedy and misjudgments on bring those revelations she stayed with him i think so i think she had two reasons one of course she loved him too madly in love when the second time was that she had no charts watching any money ball and i'll think she wanted they pointed out as the most of the poor starting with a woman than the money you know shoved into the rear so she might yourself now in his shoes that's what writer her books are still out there are hardly recognize that sense settled is quite interesting and she came to be greatly respected for her defense of custer and a lot of people who wanted to write another view another newborn respected or to the extent

they're saying well i wanted to add wellness as custer's allow people were a little more gently delightful we wait wait till she doesn't know russia both ships just about everybody's you have imagined that until nineteen thirty three and so of course in hollywood took up the story and i suppose i have to wait until the until the nineteen sixties in this country were wearing things like that were getting punctured a lot more than usual one woman's reputation took it took a court declined issue concern where about three minutes left us talk about the legend on robert e lee who made the decision at west point video of the confederacy

remains in history a beloved figure in essence are under the grant is caring for as he said those four more years before the womb michael moore's not to abort my poor boys on what about the image of three much of the legend i think he would be a question for us about what they were alive today they thought himself a failure the thought of glitter about it down an important factor and the years that you live though no other northerners who want to bring the trial congress was suspicious of and he kept a very low profile much he was c was of course beloved in the south you knew it wasn't a given that he was the outstanding southern leader during the war a lot of people thought that maybe stonewall jackson my a bit of jazz and had lived in iowa we would want that

sort of them ah and again lead that they can himself pretty much of a failure and really his reputation after the war was part of the southern run his autistic son to france and pride takes in prior store self esteem or suppose you've cited day virginians took the lead on in pretty much again rewrite history a little bit but mighty about that time of the turn of the century and the and northerners began to start looking for something to do and started to accept that the more romantic view of the self and at the same time the uncritical picture of lowly that by then was being presented on leave not grant is the second foremost figure over so warm manly couldn't pass and yet really himself would be the first to admit that awfully old

i was a fan and i think he would be quite surprised the thumb was adulation hello foreign in some quarters now won the set asides as i mean i lost everything cautious of what they want erica loves carly was washington until you die neue washington and lee which was another great well we've run out of time but it's not the power of phone by malcolm thank you so much for coming in talk about these heroes after the shooting stopped like a guy who's going to thank all of you for watching and dancing and gone words keep reading it's big