Filmmaker Ken Burns; In Conversation

A. Local presentation of New Hampshire a journal is made possible by grants from New-England telephone survey New England's communication needs for 100 years. New Hampshire Higher Education Assistance Foundation helping students build a better future for a better New Hampshire job life America of Concord. Your company for insurance and other financial services insuring the American dream since 1887. And Emma skeg banks provide provider of financial services through New Hampshire. To.

Welcome the New Hampshire Journal. I'm Barbara calls this week New Hampshire is mourning the loss of seven astronauts won a very special woman a woman who reached for the stars and inspired a nation. Sam Fleming was in Concord the day of the launch. The miners are counting down President after all the delays the shuttle Challenger with Concord teacher Christa McAuliffe aboard was finally going to get off the ground. T minus Preckwinkle and we've had a go for auto sequence start. There was a sense of excitement and anticipation in the Concord High School auditorium. It had been a long wait. Chris's day had finally come. Come on. Eight. Seven six we have main engine start for three 25th space shuttle mission and it.

Is. Running normally. Three good to. Going. You. Running up and down you go. We have no doubt. We. Will have a report from the flight dynamics also say that the vehicle has exploded.

Shock disbelief struggled to comprehend. No Americans had ever died in space before. The idea of it that it could happen now with New Hampshire's Crista on board was inconceivable. Immediately the press was ushered out of Concord High School after brief meetings. Students were sent home. Never really upset teachers. I think the school has fallen on fire right now burning down from 10 and watching our teacher go into space. Watching our teacher be made in our lives. I just. I know I have no. Soon after teachers and staff filtered out of Concord High School some waiting to be picked up all eager to get home. There's a risk in anything that you do. And I think that Chris Christie. Knew those risks. And she took them. There's. There's danger. Anything that you truly. Believe. What do you think the school kids and civilians. I mean come on

come away with us in a moment. I don't think so. It was a difficult time and the hordes of media descending on Concord High School didn't make things any easier. I. Don't want to. Look. At the State House legislators and Governor Sununu were equally stunned. SUNUNU watched a television set up in the executive council chambers in silence. State flags were lowered to half staff downtown on Main Street. Business was anything but usual. There was only one thing on everybody's mind. I left my children's school or they go to an elementary school and they were all going upstairs to watch the lift and I got in my car and I drove off and I was listening to it and then I hear this this reporter going oh my god oh my God. And I thought oh no. The legislature wasn't hearing. What I heard and I just felt that with all. My. Good. Days. When Kennedy got shot everything just seemed to.

Leave nothing after that. It's a terrible tragedy. It's hitting us here in Concord. I think worse than any color. Sean. Almost unbelievable. Even though I never would never. I think everybody just got the newspapers got to feel as though they were a personal friend of hers from her. Vibrancy of to TV2 to talk to be so full of life. Most conquered residents grieve without second guessing NESA and what might have happened to the space shuttle which never failed in 24 previous missions. But there were others who wondered. I think the thing should have gone on. I don't think I ready. I think that something or somebody was trying to tell us something this terrible something like this have to happen. Now I wonder how good our security is. I know it's too early to say anything about this but I wonder. Whether it was devastating. I think it's very tragic but I don't think a woman with small kids should have been up there anyway.

At Concord High School. The press was allowed back in the auditorium for a 3 o'clock news conference. We were here to see you again and we are rejoicing in the lift. And we were exulting in rejoicing. We were. Enjoying the entire event. We were celebrating with. A. Stuff. That's. All. It has done. For Foley reflection on the loss of his colleague and friend would have to come later. Now is the time to think of the kids. The shock is even greater today I suppose because nothing like this has really happened before. And I think that's what the kids have seen is that. There's nothing that is perfect. There's nothing that is absolutely predictable and they're going to have to deal with it. And you're going to need. To figure out how to deal with that. I just hope we can. But we want to do is help them understand something about the grief process let them ventilate about their feelings

about it realize that whatever they feel they had was a tip it was perfectly appropriate and to have the support there as they were talking about these feelings. And here is the Kennedy Space Center Concord residents were looking for answers. Why why did this have to happen. Listening to the radio and reading the Concord Monitor helped but the answers weren't there. Obviously this has not been a good day for a lot of us. A surprise to anybody that has a family. I think it's a strong and deep jolt and that could happen to my daughter it happened to me. One night. It is incomprehensible that so brave and large a soul could simply disappear in one mad moment of technology. All right. But it did happen and now we're left to deal with our shared grief. It is an image we will not soon forget nor will we forget the

shattering silence when the horror of it was too much to absorb what happened in the blue sky over Florida slowly settled into the psyche of the nation and we indeed the world began to mourn for. Those who had shared the joy and the pride of seeing New Hampshire's own fly in space now shared their pain and their grief. Perhaps nowhere was that felt more than in Concord. In this city Christa McAuliffe was teacher friend neighbor and when she was selected as NASA's teacher in space last summer Concord became part of the adventure. Now the capital city is dealing with a terrible loss. It's a difficult period for the community and everyone in the community. Many people are searching for what to do about that. That feeling of loss there's a lot of grief. There is

you know people asking why did it happen. And those sorts of things Jim Smith says his city is still small town at heart that everybody knew or felt they knew Christa. For them he says the loss is quite personal. The owner of this store over the past month would hand messages to Christa in his window. So no I'm just up. My wife gave me a card. With a notation on it. Anymore. Just touch your face. We are praying for a safe return home. Still. Not far away in the city at the Concord Monitor. They're saying it's like it was when John Kennedy died where we were that day forever etched in our minds. Columnist Bob Haller just back from Florida says Crista like Kennedy knew the risks of her adventure but made light of them.

She said at times that she was always worried about crossing the catwalk and getting on the shuttle but that she had great faith in the safety of the space program. You know she joked once that stood at this intersection there are has at center and Liberty streets where there's design the stop signs and she goes through it every day and she puts her life in her hands every day there and she says she was sure the space program was dangerous and holer knew Christa Well he talked to her last just 11 days before her flight. This week he shared his remembrances with his readers. He says Christa McAuliffe died yesterday with a few of her favorite things her sons stuffed frog her daughter's cross and chain her grandmother's watch her Carly Simon tape. She died with little things ordinary things. Editor Mike pride says the newspaper wants to be part of the city's healing process. What we need to do is hold up to the community a mirror of itself and just really do our best to convey what people are going through so that there's some sharing that can go on through.

What happens in the newspaper. It's first concern a lot of people's first concern is the kids the kids that saw it happen for. A word. On Wednesday the schools began a process that's likely to last for months helping the kids deal with their grief and it is profound grief. We're going to lean on each other. I think we're going to do those things that people do when a family you get around you throw a hug here and you grab a hug there and you just say Hey. This is a terrible thing and yet you deal with it the best you can. You have to deal with it inside yourself. You have to deal with it outside yourself. That's what we're going to do. We had students at a faculty meeting this morning. Students are being very helpful to faculty as well as faculty to students. This place has turned into a family and it needs for a while to operate as a family.

The experts reached out to the community through the media to help the parents and teachers ease the children's pain. I think adults need to look out for signs that children's beliefs and their heroes now has been shattered which may generalize to their belief in the infallibility of their own parents of other family members of their teachers and maybe a real loss of security because of one hero can go. And what about the other ones that I love and that are really close to me. There needs to be a process occurring in the schools in the community where children are allowed to express in various ways their feelings about Christa about the tragedy that happened about what it means for their own lives and their view of the future in schools across the state but especially in Concord counselors were available to the kids. But on Thursday Concord school superintendent reported students were on the mend thanks in part to an outpouring of condolences.

I was so blown up with enthusiasm over the outpouring of feelings from the people of the United States of America. There were flowers there were telegrams. It is absolutely unbelievable. It is almost as incredible as what has happened at the same news conference city manager James Smith announced official observances for the city for January 30 first. A memorial service of this sort obviously. Is. In honor of the person who has left us under such tragic circumstances. But it's also an opportunity. For the community to share their grief their grief. With each other and to express some of that grief in a way that allows them to surface it and perhaps bring some closure. To this tragic week. The wounded community will come together again as it had before that week.

He was here at St. John's Church in Concord that Christa McAuliffe celebrated her last Christmas. We. Say. You know the deal. Is you know. You. See. A. Father while we're told the congregation there are no simple answers to the question of why Christa

died but the task ahead was to follow her example. Why. Do. They. You. Really. Do. When. The days of mourning of past New Hampshire will be left with a legacy a wealth of memories of a singular woman a cherished citizen who shared her love of life with all

of us. Eliza Hopson prepared this remembrance of Christa. Sharon. Christa McAuliffe will be remembered for her infectious sense of fun her unspoiled outlook on the world and her desire to share that sense of wonder. Her strength of purpose will not be forgotten nor will the clarity with which she conveyed her ideas. You. We have the video ready for your lesson. Good morning. This is Christa McAuliffe. Live from the Challenger. And I'm going to be taking you to a field trip where to start out introducing you to two very important members of the crew the first one is Commander Scoby who is sitting to my left and the second one is Michael Smith. Now Commander Scoby is going to tell

you a little bit about flying the orbiter and Commander excuse me pilot Smith is going to be telling you a little bit about the spot which is the computer that is used onboard. Christa may be remembered most for putting the ordinary person in the limelight. I would like to humanize the space age by giving a perspective from an astronaut because I think the students will look at that and say this is an ordinary person this ordinary person is contributing to history and they can make that connection and they're going to get excited about history they're going to get excited about the future they're going to get excited about space. Last summer in Concord McAuliffe students rejoiced in her selection as teacher in space. Even though Mrs. McAuliffe was a great economics teacher I think what I learned most from her was outside the classroom she taught me that the little person counts and that anyone can make an effect on our society and on the world she proved by being the first private citizen in space and being the first teacher in space. I think is a tribute to her profession and we're all very proud of her.

Krista students had grounds to be proud. Eleven thousand teachers across the nation had applied for the shuttle trip. They were narrowed down to 114. After further screening the group slimmed down to 10. These teachers spent a month together training. Testing. Trying their spaceflight. In July Chris to understand it. Barbara Morgan received top billing and true to form Christa reached out to the common cook the teachers who didn't make it. It's not often that a teacher is at a loss for words. I know my students wouldn't think so. I've made nine wonderful friends over the last two weeks. When that shuttle goes they might get one body but this going to be 10 souls that I'm taking with me. And so began the transformation of Christa's life. The high school teacher was active in community affairs in Concord. She was wife of Attorney Steven McAuliffe

mother of nine year old Scott and 6 year old Caroline overnight. Christa was snatched from the quiet life and thrown headlong into local and national celebrity. It's just such an exciting experience. I still can't believe that I'm really here. Well you're there without being too humble about it maybe you can tell us why you think you were chosen. Well it's really hard to say. There were so many people all 10 of us who were excited about teaching we love the students were good communicators. I almost felt that the committee was going to have to put our names in a hat and in just pick one out. Was there any one thing that you said or did or anything that you think may have made your application stand out. Well in my application not only am I very active in my community but I also feel that fostering a real good national and international awareness is really important in students lives. I also made my shuttle project something that everybody could identify with a journal a diary something that would connect the

ordinary person to the space age with Christa in constant demand and away from home much of the time Steve and the kids had adjustments to make prepackaged dinners to eat. But Steve felt it was well worth the extra effort. You know you're talking about a human being being free of the bonds of gravity orbiting the earth there aren't many human beings that have done that. So I think both of us feel that whatever the price in terms of readjustments for my taking on things that I probably should have been doing before anyway and hadn't done whatever those prices are they certainly pale in comparison to the opportunity. What about your eight year old son and five year old daughter. What do they think about this. Well unfortunately I really haven't been able to talk to them today because the lines have been so busy but I know that Scott is just so excited. He understands a little bit about the program. Caroline's a little concerned that I'm going to disappear for a little bit of time but this is a once in a lifetime chance and I know that she's going to be excited to tell Terry she's tried for fashion.

They say they have increased his absence a guest teacher taught her class one day. The secretary of the U.S. Department of Education William Bennett brought celebrity home to Concord. He told the press Krista had reached students across the nation and some of these visits talking to the students students first asked me if I know the president and what the president was like. Second they'll say you know Christa McAuliffe to say that this has not made an impression on the national psyche. I think would be a mistake it has. People think it's excellent She's got fans and cheerleaders all over the country. As for Christa she did not intend to let celebrity change her. And I would hate to the thought of being able to let's say go into a school of people not wanting to talk to me because oh well you know Wolf she she's very important to me. And I don't want them to look at it that way. I look at it as a wonderful extraordinary year out of my life. I mean the whole thing is so.

I just want to bring it all back into the classroom one way cruise the minute to teach kids about the space program was to keep a space diary a journal of her observations during the Six Day flight for later use in the classroom. In part it was that notion which won her seat on the shuttle. We had to propose a project and I wanted something that was unobtrusive it wouldn't get away with the mission. Something I could do. I'm not a science person. I'm not math inclined. So I needed something because I'm a historian. That would tie in with my classroom journals seem very very easy. Something that again would connect the students to history and I also have been developing a course called the American woman and it's a social history. It deals with the common everyday people behind the military and the political and the economic events. So in this way it would also tie in with my course Christa had also planned to lessons in space. One called the Ultimate field trip was designed to show children how the shuttle worked and what astronauts do on board. It was meant to be

beamed by satellite to schools across the country. He's going to go over to the locker locker open again while I'm explaining why things have to be secured. He'll hold the locker to the camera so that everyone will be able to see it. She intended not only to show the mechanics of space flight but to discuss the reasons behind the space program. Children she said should be excited that space travel will be part of their future. They've got to get ready for this. Their grandchildren are probably going to be on space stations. They're going to be totally different fields. I mean there's going to be space law there's going to be business in space. Students have to prepare for that future and I think this will help them do that. She. Was able to inspire youngsters and motivate them and as she often said if you want to motivate kids to get involved in space or in any field or in any endeavor then you excite the teachers and they excite the kids.

And I think that that's exactly what she did. It was her theme from the moment she was picked. As she saw herself as a pioneer exploring space. And I think that kids see you as that and they want to be the pioneers. The explosion of the Teacher in Space Mission was a blow to New Hampshire's National Education Association and to teachers everywhere. But Marilyn Monahan does not think that'll stop another teacher from reaching for the stars in the future. She inspired a lot of teachers who will take up that mission of being a communicator to try to make it real to students in the classroom not only from the science and technical viewpoint but from just the human element. And then there might be other teachers who say I need to try to achieve this to carry on Christian name. So I think it's too soon to to figure out how many but I think they'll be still plenty that will want to go as far as the teaching profession goes I'm hoping that a lot of people will look at the teaching profession now

maybe as a career opportunity. When I talk about careers in my classes and ask the students what they would like to do in a few years because I have seen year often teaching is not something that comes right to mine. And I'm hoping that as education gets a lot of good press this year and as people look at the schools in a very positive way that more people will be interested. They're saying in the teaching profession or in choosing that as a career I would say to them to to believe everything they believe before. And to read even more carefully the words that you spoke to them in terms of reaching for the stars. I mean it's her words are more applicable now than they ever were. And that person would want them to believe that and to feel. That into internal that Christa McAuliffe was cut off in the prime of her life the last her family is incalculable. But for the millions who loved her and looked forward to learning from her the memory of the Pioneer

Woman of 1986 will be as bright and constant as the North Star. So. Local presentation of New Hampshire Journal is made possible by grants from New-England

telephone surveying New England's communication needs for 100 years. New Hampshire Higher Education Assistance Foundation helping students build a better future for a better New Hampshire Ceb life America of Concord. Your company for insurance and other financial services insuring the American dream since 1887 and Emma skeg banks provider of financial services through New Hampshire. Whatever you do you ought to teach these people how to. Fix a Flat. My answer is What can I say. I.

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Tires. Mechanisms all rusted out. I'm. All in a day's work. Ahead of me. This. Comes a time. When. I. Thought. Actually. End up in the workforce the rest will continue to depend on state and federal

support. This new approach to treatment shows much greater promise. It will. Take a. Without any special treatment. 12 percent of people with severe mental illness will end up in the workforce. The rest will continue to depend on state and federal support. There's a new approach to treatment shows much greater promise. I wasn't. Say. Night. Without any special help. Take care. Ready. Yeah. And.

Without any special treatment. Twelve percent. Just. Take. One. Sir. Come right. Now. No not. My. Worst. OK. Without any special treatment. 12 percent of people with severe mental illness will end up in the workforce. The rest will continue to depend on state and federal support. This new approach to treatment shows much greater promise. Well. Without any special treatment. Twelve percent of people with severe mental illness will end up in the workforce. The rest will continue to depend on state and

federal support. This new approach to treatment shows much greater promise. Hi.

Think that our committee will do the usual All tough nitty gritty work that it

does it will do it as fast as it can. It won't get the budget over to the Senate. I think the difference we're going to see is that when the Senate makes decisions on the budget those decisions will not be made behind closed doors by a small group. But those decisions will be made a lot of them on the Senate floor after full debate. And I. Sorry go ahead. No I think that in some ways will affect the work we do on appropriations because I think by very nature of the number of people on appropriations and the fact that we are so closely monitored by interest groups and by the press and by people as we do our process everyone always knows how they feel on appropriations. And so I think that we will take a certain comfort in knowing that the debate we've had will not be simply done by the Senate behind closed doors. Do you say that because of the new makeup both the Hardison says the Senate and a conservative moderate liberal says if you think because of the

new makeup of the Senate you're going to find that proposals not to cut this stand cut this or not to cut this and rearrange situation here with revenue. Things that make you think that the end result in the proposal this committee comes out with what the state budget will be more positive. Another tough question. I think the timing on how this budget works will probably not affect what this committee comes out because the House Appropriations Committee gets the budget directly from the governor. We have a first whack at it. As I said earlier I want to try to do it fairly quickly. We will not at that point. We have a feeling yet for how the Senate is going to be voting on things. But. I go back to say we'll do our usual good thorough work on the budget and I think that we will all probably at least behind the scenes or

in our own minds take heart with the fact that we know that any decisions we do make as tough as they are are not only going to get full debate in the house that they will be getting full debate later on in the Senate. That said I guess the last time in this budget process where. There were almost 40 50 million dollars in one time additional revenues that came into play and that helped bail out what was a pretty tough situation that we don't have that. But the demands are just as tough when the revenue increases are down affect the revenue itself in many areas. How are you going to make that fair. The ultimate question and I really don't know yet. I don't know other than to say at this point. The psychology of the state house and psychology in general of state government especially after government Greg's statements after his win in November are that more cuts can be made

that indeed we don't need to do anything making any major adjustments in revenue in New Hampshire. And there are no programs that can be cut that we can do. Do you believe that. No I don't believe it. I've been working with all the lines of this budget now for too long to believe we've cut the fat. If there was that I think most of it's gone maybe a little bit left we can get a million here and there out of it. But the kinds of. Money the kinds of big money we're talking about I don't know what the estimate is that we haven't gotten an official one but everyone acknowledges it somewhere between 35 and 100 million to get even the low number the 35 million is going to be program. And I'm not talking about programs that no one cares about. I'm talking about real programs that affect real citizens. Lives Hagar you chair Appropriations Committee thanks for being with me. I'm Ron Paul. Straight to the ford. Focus. Some voters have the ultimate say

as to whether the small is going to be built or not. There is some benefit to putting a vote for the town at an early day to find out in fact whether the town wants this project to go forward or not. Though the. Once that goes take a good day and the result is less than any traffic study we're read and suddenly the water underneath the land the all of these situations when those studies. Well the developer is very smart because the developer knows that if this zone is approved that the zoning channel change is approved that they will essentially have carte blanche to go ahead and build a shopping mall. And basically what they have told the town told the planning board told all of us voters is that trust us allows us to get the zone changed allow us to build the mall and we'll solve all of the other problems we will solve for you your traffic problem we will solve your water problem will solve your environmental problems.

Just trust us. Give us the zone and we'll solve the problems. Why do you think that people are people and how. Poor are other people in town. Who. Are trusting. The developer. I mean do you go to the post office or whatever and do it when people me this debate come up often. And. What are some of the reasons why people. Just assume that developers would take care of it. Well I feel there's a lot of wishful thinking on people's part. I think it's it's a anxious time in terms of the economy the tax situation here in town. I mean our national tax situation I think we are a country that's kind of in a stage of wishful thinking that somehow these problems could go away. And I think people are really hoping and wishing that all of this is true and I that there are many who are wishing that their taxes would go down

on wishing that things would somehow be taken care. Of. For them. You know the fire department will get some new equipment. You know it's kind of to me it's kind of like well let's have big daddy fix everything for us. And and I would say that I believe there are more people in town who are saying we're grownups we can take care of things ourselves. We will be responsible we want local control here in the town we don't want someone from New York running our town for us. I think they're on one of those people and. I hope they are. Bill let me ask you this. You have to for a long time and know a lot. I assume that there's a good portion or some portion of the residents that live here who weren't here for a long time. They were absolutely what they say cause I'm having a hard time. The massive rising property your.

Local presentation of filmmaker Ken Burns in conversation is made possible by a grant from Chubb life America who proudly sponsors this broadcast on behalf of its employees insurance and financial service agents and the community. You have on your door over here under neath Florentine films logo. I. Can't read it. This. Kid says we are looking for ideas large enough to be afraid

of again. It appeals to me to be attracted to an idea that is in some ways terrifying. That may be bigger than one can chew. If we don't bite off more than we can chew and then learn to chew it. We don't grow. Implicit in that is the idea that you can fail but you can also experiment and I like it. We are looking for ideas large enough to be afraid of again. Walpole New Hampshire on the Connecticut River here in this farm house momentous things are happening. Film Productions productions that have attracted worldwide attention and have made a world class reputation for this man. This is 35 year old filmmaker Ken Burns. He may be the best and he certainly is the most successful creator of historical documentaries in America. Two of Cannes films Brooklyn Bridge and the Statue of Liberty

were nominated for Academy Awards in all his films have garnered more than two dozen national and international awards. Reviewers are quick to note two things about Ken Burns films. One is his exquisite use of light. The other is what he calls his chorus of voices. Readings from actual diaries and clippings of the time his films take place. Ken has just completed two new documentaries a history of the United States Congress and a film of the life of American painter Thomas Hart Bantam. And yet for all his grand themes can always tells his stories through the eyes of a real person. Having an emotional aspect is the essence of it. I don't want what history doesn't matter to me unless you tell me that there's something that I can loosely describe as emotional in the Congress film for

example. What could be worse history than having to memorize what the compromise of 1850 was when we look into the compromise of 1850 you find out that Henry Clay that one of the great orders of that time was so weak he had to be held up into the chamber and yet spoke for three hours that Daniel Webster had suffered for Insan and from insomnia for weeks and took drugs to fortify himself. Both of these men were men who enjoyed their whiskey their high living gambling and regularly took contributions from supporters to vote certain ways. This is great stuff. This really tells you no longer will you forget the compromise of 1850 once it's brought along with ease in this great sandwich. You know so I think history is often just bringing in the familiar aspect that we like and the motion and the poignancy of that. Talk to me about the films that you made from the time you were in Hampshire College you say you started out with a form on old Sturbridge Village to looked like a

progression here my first real film the one that I. I put my signature to is essentially my senior thesis at Hampshire College in New Hampshire emphasises a self-initiated curriculum and self-discipline in the studies and I went to Old Sturbridge Village and they did me and we agreed that what would be the equivalent of a final project thesis if you will would be a film on work in the early 19th century and I finished that for my thesis and graduated from Hampshire and formed a film company called Florentine films. I was not interested in making films for clients I really thought at that point very naive that what I wanted to do was make self-initiated films continue this Hampshire model. That is of course a near impossibility and we starved for a few years and did freelance camera work. But along came this idea for making a film on the history of a bridge and people set an hour on a history of

a bridge you must be kidding at that point the centennial was a far as far away as 1995 is for us right now something you just don't plan for. And I didn't. I just set out making this our film on a bridge and I looked perhaps 12 or 13 years old and got turned down and every funding opportunity people laughing and saying this kids trying to sell me the Brooklyn Bridge. An accident occurred on the 28th of June. While Mr Roebling with his son was engaged in surveying for the bridge. He was standing on a string piece inside the Fulton Ferry right. On seeing a boat approach. Mr. Roebling stepped back on to be not a protuberance of one of his feet. And the pressure of the oncoming boat crushed it. My father was a drop of it and I had decided I'd use of his own. He refused to listen to the surgeon I brought. Dismissed him and proceeded to cure himself with water until he died

17 days later in the most horrible agonies of love. Joe John Roebling had proclaimed that his bridge would be the greatest in existence. All his son had to do now was build it. Here I was thirty two years old suddenly in charge of the most stupendous engineering structure of the age with only preparatory plans. Nothing fixed or decided. The prop on which I hit it to lean and fall. And so forth I must rely on myself. Washington Roebling. To our good fortune we made a film that we were proud of and went on not sort of duplicate that success but once again to bite off a little bit more than we could chew in a project and that turned out to be the Shakers where the Brooklyn Bridge had been glamorous and urban and singular and a very strong biography about a person. Here was a story that was pleural and rural and very elusive like trying to grab

the cake of soap in the bathtub and shakers defied our attention for a long long time. But we think we came to know them or at least deep in our original question about the people which was Who are the Shakers. My mother passed away when I was seven years old and my father remarried and my stepmother didn't like my little sister tonight because she had it in a girl of her own. So my father eventually shake in Maine. So he placed us and I was delighted because that is just as true. You wouldn't believe that they were relatives because they loved you and they took you when they make your life happy and no matter where you went you stop that love you know. And you know that whatever I came up you could go to any of them and get counsel and they loved the Shakers believe that ideas could take form and that God will in the details of their work

and the quality of their craftsmanship. They aimed at nothing less than the transformation of earth into heaven. So they strove for perfection in everything they did. There was no ornament or wasted effort. Craftsmen rarely saw their work. It was a simple way the gospel of Christ was simple. From that point on I went on and made a film two films simultaneously one on the Statue of Liberty. I had heard of all the grand hoopla for the celebration and felt that wow 5300 Elvis Presley look alikes might add to an appreciation of the Statue of Liberty or that a great aircraft carrier in the harbor might be an appropriate accompaniment. That this was in fact one of the few countries that has as its great symbol not a statue of a warrior or in any kind of belligerent posture but in fact a woman carrying a book of laws and a torch that illuminated. That was good

news and I wanted to tell the story of not only how she got to be where she is but what the idea of liberty meant. Newspapers on both sides of the Atlantic printed every word every speech in all the songs in the Times of London however looked upon the proceedings with skepticism regressed. Why Libert she returned from Iraq. We drove too little to America which was too much. Nobody said a thing about welcoming immigrants. At the same time I worked on an almost opposite sort of subject a sort of darker vision of the American promise which is the story if she read long which is a Shakespearean tragedy of incredible to mention how a man of such incredible skills and

abilities could poison himself by his own ambition. And yet leave us with a doubt about methods and how things work in a democracy. That's good stuff. Other freshmen senators with big reputations back home had been dwarfed when they got to the Senate itself. Not Huey Long Senate convention holds that newcomers are supposed to not only be silent but invisible but on his first day he bounded onto the floor slapped one distinguished senator on the back thumped the elderly Republican leader on the chest and strode around the chamber telling everyone the kingfish had arrived. All the while he chewed on a big black cigar in violation of Senate rules putting it down on the clerk's desk just long enough to be sworn in. He refused to serve on any committees that took time away from his speechmaking which could go on for days at a time long fortifying himself with glasses of milk and fistfuls of chocolates. Well his style was of course flamboyant but he was a powerful speaker

and even when he the lead he was not telling the truth. He was very persuasive. One day he told a group of senators a mob would attack the Capitol below him hanging them from the rafters. I have to determine he said whether I will stay and be hung with you or go out and lead the mob. Nobody laughed. I began after Hughie thinking of the possibility of doing a history of the Civil War the Civil War has been an influential aspect and every single one of the projects that I subjects that I had been involved in before the Brooklyn Bridge would not have been built without the steel that the Civil War helped to sponsor this new metal. The man who built the Brooklyn Bridge Washington Roebling got his practical training as a bridge builder during the war. The shakers would not have declined so precipitously if not only economic changes but this sort of psychic and spiritual changes that took place in this country after we'd murdered six hundred and fifty thousand of our own hadn't really turned the

attention of the country away from the question of the soul's survival which was the Shakers great question. Huey Long's Parish was a poor dirt farmers parish in northern Louisiana that refused to secede from the Confederacy. They thought it was a rich man's cause the holding of slaves and that perish later became a hotbed of populism and radicalism that produced that Great Swamp Thing Huey Long that we can all sort of enjoy at a distance. The Statue of Liberty was originally intended as a gift from the French to Mrs. Lincoln to commemorate the survival of the Union despite the death of her husband. It was only the delays and the changes afterwards that turned it into a more international symbol that it became. So the Civil War continually beckoned us and called us and finally we decided to do it. We are producing and approximately ten our history of that war which is now in its fourth year of work. I also ended up working

full time on two other projects both of which sort of arrived over the transom men were too close to my heart to say no. The first was a documentary on the great American painter Thomas Hart Benton the muralist who lived in many ways of life very similar to here. I'm interested in men who represent themselves as something they're not. Thomas hard bitten liked to pretend that he was a Yoko the way Huey did and yet had a fine fine mind behind it and had a life of incredible tragedy along with a good deal of triumph in his art. He declined precipitously for the last thirty years of his life as an artist. Many other artists have. One would say the good fortune to die or to meet with some accident or something like that. Jackson Pollock wrapped his car around the tree when he perceived his work not so great. Thomas Howard Benton lived another 35 years and had an incredibly interesting roller coaster of a life and I was interested in making a film about an artist from a biographical and historical point of view.

Not preaching to that narrow world that occupies the space between Greenwich Village and Easthampton but a whole American continent and to our great fortune Thomas hard bent and subject matter was that great continent and its history. I claimed heresies around New York. Remember I wanted more than anything else to make pictures. The imagery of which would carry unmistakable American media needs for Americans he believed in America. He believed in the spirit that was in the country and he he felt that the arch had come from the country. To be clear like the American soul and articulate in a simpler way. Not abstract but down to earth. I set up painting American history French. In defiance of all the conventions of our art world. And he

started working on a series of big canvases which he called the American Historical. At the same time I was approached by the historian of the House of Representatives and the historian of the Senate and the curator of the Senate's art collection saying there had been no good film on the history of Congress. And. I said at that point that I would make a history of the United States Congress which now looking back I'm not even sure I would do because it was so difficult. Now however looking back I may have made my best film many people think that it is an incredibly difficult to like the Shakers to fit into an hour and a half this 200 years of an incredibly complex institution more than 10000 members in a country that would rather have its history understood when it cares to understand it

from the perspective of the presidency and so much of what's happened in our country's history has really come from Capitol Hill and not from the president the president has either taken credit for it or has actually been completely not there that we forget how important they are and because they are us. And because there are so many of them they represent sort of cheap and easy targets we make jokes about our congressmen much more than we make jokes about our presidents. And I made a film that without. Being a puff piece and it is very critical of them at times has tried to celebrate an institution and a building which is if anything our national temple 200 years of extraordinary dramatic history. And I think we've done it and I'm really very pleased with that. In your film you have a wonderful sense of light shake a film that could open the Brooklyn Bridge of course. What's your

theory on that. What do you sit behind the camera person. Are you the camera person. What do you look for here. It's not enough to have that and a historical appreciation of an event. But in the case of the Brooklyn Bridge the Statue of Liberty or the Shakers you have to see them as well and bring them back. Most documentary films will schedule three or four weeks of shooting and then come back. We film in the minimum over a year and a half so that we can get that subject in every time of day at every light from every vantage. And we try to do that what it looks like in those various times especially the magical hours of sunrise and sunset with Emily Dickinson called the fire theatricals of day which I think is a great phrase for sunrises and sunsets is this kind of truth about the subject. And so we're sensitive to it. Do. Formalize all others do you storyboard any of that stuff or is it looser of them.

For us the actual making of the film is a process of discovery. We do not finish writing the film or even knowing it until we are done editing. So we work on a script independent from shooting not worrying about whether there's images to fill these words and not we're worrying whether they're words to fill these images. It makes our editing incredibly difficult. But instead of merely illustrating our scripts we now do something that's a little bit different. There's a there's a little bit slight twist to a real documentary. I think so what. I've used the term equivalent if we don't have to every time you say Lincoln show Lincoln You can range in the midst of the Gettysburg Address for example not on him but across the the dead of Gettysburg and sit and speak volumes. It's a case where word and picture one and one don't make just two but can at rare moments make three. And that's what we're looking for.

As each new state was added to the union it threatened to tear the country apart in Southerners fear the north might forbid slavery northerners slavery might move west. There was never a moment in history when slavery was not sleeping sure. Lay coiled up under the table during the deliberations of a constitutional convention. Thereafter slavery was on everyone's mind. If not always owners don't. I had been experimenting in the Sturbridge Village film with using first person voices in addition to narration. That is a chorus of voices who speak off camera the diaries and journals of the period and I had done it with some success it gave a certain very similar to the to the past. Huey Long and Thomas heart bent and don't have those because they are twentieth century subjects and they enjoy an equivalent bunch of witnesses and newsreel footage. They give life to the character but these

nineteenth century subjects statue Brooklyn Bridge shakers the Congress the Civil War have to be animated by these first person voices and I read after I finish this Sturbridge Village film a book by David McCullough who has gone on to be the narrator in nearly every one of my films. Benton's The only exception he will be narrating the civil war as well a fantastic book called The Great Bridge. And in it one of its great qualities was that he allowed the people to speak in it in long extended quotes. And I thought Here is a marvelous story told in the words of the people who lived it. This would be a great documentary film. And little did I know that it would take another two and a half years before I expose the first film of that project. But I'm glad I stuck it out because it allowed me to experiment over the next two years of actually making it with this method of telling history that way. And my goodness this history in our country has become castor oil.

For people it's this terrible terrible medicine that they have to sort of hold their nose and take and it does not need to be. It is. The great teacher. If you don't know where you have been how can you know where you are going. And these stories whether they are seemingly innocent moments like the Brooklyn Bridge tell us so much not only about what happened but what is happening. And they pointed us to where we are going to go. And you know Harry Truman said The only thing that's really new is the history you don't know. I agree with him completely. You agree with him or Thomas Breton too. And I agree with all of those. I hate that Harry Truman thought Thomas had been the best damn painter in America. And and he had he hit with history what our what our mission is in a way. I spend all of my professional efforts trying to create those moments in which the

past for a brief second comes alive that you no longer look at it from the position of the safe present. But as if you were there at no point in the civil war do we tell you how it's going to end until it ends. Now we all know how it ended. But we wish to place you there. You'll hear the words of the people that were involved in it. And I think appreciate what we have now 130 years later forgotten which is that we did murder one another if only to become the kind of country that can't conceive how that was possible before the Civil War. People said the United States are plural. After the war they said the United States is our film is really an investigation and how that simple verb got changed. I can't imagine undertaking anything with the scope of this project.

You don't look like that brave person. Excuse me. You're too young to remember the person. It is absolutely as you say you've hit the nail on the head. It is incredibly terrifying it is the most important event in American history. And as a world event is it is of supreme importance to tell it not only generally but fairly comprehensively at least in terms of television is a terrible terrible challenge. Henry Adams before the war as he saw the country heading inevitably towards the conflict and saw how the conflict was being flamed by the growing country and the expansion of manifest destiny he said there are grave doubts at the hugeness of the land and whether one government can comprehend the whole. It's a marvelous sense of anxiety the great 19th century anxiety. If we grow Can we see it you know up to that point the country had been a

manageable colonial territory. But could it comprehend the whole. And that's our great struggle with the civil war in order to tell it correctly we have to comprehend the whole. And how can you. So we are humbly laboring in the vineyards. Man is after all a very finite being in capacities and powers of doing actual work and when it comes to planning. One mind can in a few hours think out enough work to keep a thousand men employed for years. You came here with a dream ten years later. What is the reality. Ten years ago I was actually asked the question What would I like to be doing. I was then still living in New York and hoping that I would be able to free myself from the tremendous gravity of that city and break free to New Hampshire and I told them that I wanted in 10 years to be married to Amy have two

children and be making still be able to make documentary films. So I'm very lucky person because all of those things are happening. For me. Q When. You were. Q. Your. Que. Que. Aug. 27 1864. And. Most inspiring sight is the flock you're constantly hovering over waiting for these. Words at least an option because the both sides are.

Like. True. Washington Roebling. I see a progression here. I see you going from Sturbridge Village to a bridge to the Statue of Liberty to the Civil War Hammer Congress what's left for your word. Where do we go wrong where the universe. Baseball. Presentation of filmmaker Ken Burns in conversation was made possible by a grant from Chubb live America who proudly sponsored this broadcast on behalf of its employees

insurance and financial service agents and the community. Is. Good. My name is Kate Alexander. I'm the mother of two grown sons. I'm a computer software consultant. My work from my home. I go out to different corporations and do jobs for them and I sort of use that as a as the cash cow for my pastime. Which has been the shooting. This is what we call our age zone many

many moons ago it was a violent survivor and that I think a lot of women will will relate to sort of put you in the space of your own. I needed to first understand who I was and learn who I was after. After the math and and grow from there. When I started taking matchlocks because I thought that that was a step to strengthen myself and in the end what I truly got out of it was not necessarily the self-defense portion of it but an inner knowledge of who I was. Through all the self and through all the hands on things that even though they were wonderful tools to train with and wonderful pieces of my self-defense package they didn't give me what I was really looking for. And what I was looking for was an equalizer an equalizer that I didn't have to getting close with a firearm does that for you. It

equalizes the situation it gives you a balance. I feel safer I suppose. But you're never 100 percent safe especially when you're reading about all the crime that's happening and everything. Let's say that I feel more comfortable with my ability to take care of myself if anything happens. A firearm is like you know the coiled snake kind of thing. It's harmless as long as you leave it alone but somebody who picks it up doesn't know anything about it can end up causing all kinds of destruction. If it were in a public conversation and I and I hear someone is anti-gun at the table I don't just come on say hey you're over the gun. What a jerk you are. I don't get into that kind of thing. Matter of fact I steer everything away from it because I'm very sensitive to other people's feelings. They have a right to their own political beliefs but they don't. I don't always get the same courtesy back. I'm being lumped in with people who are considered fanatical. I'm unreasonable for thinking that I needed to carry

a gun. I'm paranoid for thinking I need to carry a gun. There's so many phrases or adjectives that are put to to what I'm described as. And I never considered myself any of those things. This case story hit home with you it does with an increasing number of women and men who no longer feel safe in our society without the need for a gun it is nothing new. This country was founded on armed revolution and every Independence Day we celebrate the heritage that began with the shot heard round the world. But increasingly we are facing the reality of shots heard round the neighborhood. There's now an estimated 220 million guns in this country nearly one for every man woman and child or about the same proportion as in our early colonial days. But the dangers we now face are no longer those of nature or the frontier but of too many guns in the wrong hands and little prospect of retrieving them. So how do we secure our safety if we can't disarm others. Do we

arm. Should you own a gun. Officer safety be on the lookout for new hampshire be a 8 1 6. 1990 red Mitsubishi Mirage. It's Tuesday evening and the Manchester police are getting ready for another night on the town suicidal. He's armed with a shocking. New Hampshire State Police when viewed from inside a police car. Life and our society can seem pretty dangerous but this ended up being a quiet night as most have been since the Manchester Police launched Operation street sweep last summer with extra patrols aimed at getting guns and drugs off the street. I think the biggest thing that I've noticed is just driving around at night. Is definitely not as many people hanging out in the street it. Seems to me that people have you there. Gone inside or more been pushed out of the way you just don't see the

groups or so-called gangs hanging out on the side of the street anymore. But is the fear that some feel actually justified by the reality. If you rely on statistics these seem to be the good new days in New Hampshire the bad old days were the 80s when the murder rate was twice what it is today. In 1987 there were 32 murders in New Hampshire last year there were 15. And according to the federal Justice Department the rate of violent crime has remained fairly steady for the past two decades. But it's not all good news. The Justice Department also recently reported there were 1.3 million gun related crimes in 1993. A rise of 18 percent from the previous year. It's easy to get lost in statistics but here's one more that is a measure of how much our society has changed. In 1960 there were three police officers for every violent crime reported by 1993. That ratio had reversed to more than 3 violent crimes. For every cop.

Clearly even when the FBI reports the crime is actually down that is little reassurance to many Americans who feel too much has already changed. My parents probably would not have felt the need to carry a firearm when they were growing up as they had no need to lock their doors or worry about their car getting stolen. So we have gone a tremendous culture change in the past 30 40 years. Mike PELLETIERE lives in a nice neighborhood in Manchester but he feels he's as vulnerable as anybody. People rely on nine one one when there's an emergency. But any criminal would know this is. Box is just about every house in America and it's very simple as this wire here shows. They come in and basically sniff that wire. And then and you're done there is no more phone service to your house. If you do something like that something you consider that communication is part of safety. So for Mike jimmies safety has a certain sound. And one of the main points of a firearm is that in a deterrence fashion if you feel

threatened the mere presence of a firearm will often deter a criminal especially if you know something that goes like this. If they here they know they're are facing a shotgun and they're going to get the hell out of there whether with a shotgun or a handgun. Surveys of gun owners reveal that two thirds say personal protection was either the only or an important reason for buying a gun. We try not to be father confessor to people. People's privacy is not as important to them but. There are people who make known the situations under which they need firearms. Women tend to use the reason as working at night or having to walk to their car through a dark parking garage. And all of those are you know pretty valid reasons. If you have to work at night in Manchester the phone company and the phone companies lots a long way from your place of employment 2:00 1:00 in the morning. It's frankly a frightening thing.

But how much protection a gun gives you is a matter and not all victims of violent crime will agree on the answer. One of the most infamous crimes in recent years was the Newberry town hall shootings two years ago in which two women died and a third. Carol Hawk Meyer survived after being shot five times. Her scars are more than physical. I don't think. I'll ever feel safe. I don't feel safe when I'm in a car. I don't feel safe when I'm at home. It's it's a strange feeling. It happened the day after Halloween at first Carol thought the shots were a joke. Leftover firecrackers. And then she saw the killer. He said something like I'm not taking any more bullshit from this time. And then he shot me. And I put my arm up here. And I got. Shot here. Where it took out a section of bone in this arm and

I have nerve damage to this part of my head. And then. I he threw the gun on the floor. I say the gun jammed or something happened and he took out a pistol and I ran screaming through the building. He shot me and he shot me four more times. Despite her wounds Carol managed to lock herself in a bathroom. Shortly afterwards the gunman killed himself. Even today Carol is still coming to terms with her experience but she has resolved one issue whether having a gun would have made a difference. That day in the town hall. Would you have been safer or no. No. I don't think so. Police say if you have a gun the most important knowledge is self knowledge. Train with that gun inside. Now before you even take it home and then continue to train with it. But probably just as important maybe more so is when the time comes are you going to be ready to use it. Because if you think you're going to take that gun pointed at a

bad guy and tell him OK I'm going to shoot you. And if he doesn't feel you're serious about it he's just going to keep on coming. Now you get a bigger problem. He grabs a gun from you. And pointed at you. And there are other potentially fatal complications from owning a gun. Just ask Karen Sullivan whose son Tim was accidentally shot by a friend who found a gun in his parent's unlocked closet. There was one round writing in the chamber he didn't know that he moved his arm. The gun discharged Tim was struck and died. The students at Garrison's school in Dover were luckier than Tim Sullivan. On September 29 the grade 5 student brought a loaded 44 caliber handgun into this classroom in his backpack. He reached into his bag and. I don't know what happened. He took something out and then threw his bag in there was a big bang. The bullet exited the backpack for about a quarter of an inch half inch where it hit the floor and then ricocheted up about a foot

maybe a little less than a foot and lodged in a student's backpack about four feet away. That backpack contained books and a deck of cards which stopped the bullet. No one was hurt but it was a sobering experience for everyone at the school. So when you found out that it was a gun it was a big gun and this bullet had flown off and buried itself in the girl's backpack. What what did you think. I was surprised because I didn't think that would ever happen in Garrison's school. Neither did the concerned parents who packed a special meeting looking for answers. There is not a kid a garrison elementary school that walks into a library in energy in the reference section pulls out a gun. The guns are at home with parents and this is where we start. Honestly ladies I'm not looking for applause. I'm not

advocating any position. Gun control no gun control nothing. I'm advocating safe kids. This is where it starts. It starts with people who have guns in the home making their children aware of how serious a gun is it's making sure that those guns are locked up. Many were troubled that no charges can be laid against the parents who owns the gun. It's not common sense. It's not responsible but it's also not illegal. We can't forget child it's not a specific statute being violated. And my understanding is that the legislature in the last session specifically considered such a statute and rejected I don't know all the circumstances behind it. That's that's what I was told at the state of Florida had an all they still do but they had such a law. They will hold the parents accountable if a child gets hold of their firearm. But you need that kind of statutory language in order to do that.

Somebody said that other kids knew that this guy was in the backpack. It could have been prevented if one of those two or four or six or 12 kids had told an adult that none did. As a reminder that too many children don't understand what a gun can do. But despite the fears of Garrison parents and teachers gun accidents involving children are on the decline in New Hampshire from 1985 to 89 14 children died in firearms accidents in New Hampshire. From 1990 to 94 three died. Far more deadly is our suicide problem in New Hampshire. Two thirds of all teen suicide is by firearms. A recent study showed from 1987 to 91 63 New Hampshire teens committed suicide with 40 of them using a gun that suicide rate was up by a hundred and fifty percent over the previous five year period in our teens suicide rate remains 50 percent higher than the national average.

In fact of all Americans who were killed in firearms incidents last year more than half killed themselves. It is a shocking fact and one that is often cited by groups like the center to control handgun violence. One other pamphlet States a gun at home is 43 times more likely to be used to kill a family member or friend than a criminal intruder. But what does that number really mean. To figure. We don't want to have to come back to those family members or friends often include estranged husbands or abusive boyfriends. So if a woman is attacked and she shoots that family member that death is statistically lumped in with children killed by accident the result according to criminologist Gary Kleck is numbers that may be accurate but are meaningless says the crucial measure is not criminals killed but lives saved. Kleck wrote the 1991 book Point Blank guns and violence in America. In his recent research Glock used various surveys to

calculate that gun owners use their firearms defensively. Two and a half million times a year one in six of our 20 million estimated defensive gun use where at least perceived by the people involved to be life saving. That would be on the order of 400000 lives saved. I don't think it's anywhere near that high but it sort of puts it in perspective for you in light of the fact that calling about 40000 lives or. CLECs research showing that armed victims who resist crime are better off than unarmed victims has earned him a lot of criticism. I still hear the NRA news kind of stuff anyway but many numbers cited by Klak are startling. According to a national survey of crime between 1979 and 85 victims who used a gun to resist assault. 12 percent were injured but victims who didn't resist at all were injured 27 percent of the time. The implication if you're a crime victim the better off resisting and you're better off

are. That point has been taken up by an increasing number of women who now have their own magazine women and guns with articles and ads tailored to their needs. And there's more. In the past few years leather makers have added a new wrinkle to personal protection specially designed purses that allow you to conceal. And quickly get to. A handgun. We've seen an increase in ladies purchasing handguns over the years that not a substantial amount but some. Speaking for domestic violence. One out of three married women will be abused at some point during her marriage as head of the New Hampshire Coalition Against Domestic and sexual violence very Macmichael would not advise getting a gun but would not advise against it either. There are a lot of people out there who are in violent in violent relationships or in the proximity of violence living in

certain neighborhoods are going to certain schools or working at night. So I think there's a lot of violence and I could understand easily someone feeling better. Owning a gun. But even if you feel better owning a gun you may not want to talk about it. That's because gun ownership has become such a contentious issue in our society. Increasingly neither side is willing to understand the other which has social as well as personal consequences. Well as a single guy women it can be a fatal flaw in relationships the woman does in hunt. Hunting oriented or isn't interested in maybe dealing with the game or. Hold you in battery regard if you happen to kill Bambi. Representative David Welch says New Hampshire still respects gun owners rights and as chairman of the house public safety committee intends to keep it that way.

I think we. Have more people of firearms in that state than perhaps any other state. And maybe because of the rural character of the state. We have a lot of hunters. We have a lot of people who live in areas that are rather isolated. And I think we have people who don't look on the firearm as something mysterious. It's a tool it's a tool like any other tool that is made for a purpose and not necessarily to kill people but to defend yourself. Like many legislators David Welch has gotten his share of prank phone calls over the years. And also like many New Hampshire legislators and he exercised his right to carry concealed weapons everywhere at the state house except the House chamber when it's in session. The reason I like this is because it's small. It's very very hard Trego polls not to go off accidentally. The thing I like about this the most Is the noise. Is extremely

loud. And one of the things I'm not looking forward to going around. Killing people. If you want to attract some attention this will do it. The Texas legislature made national headlines not long ago when it legalized the carrying of concealed weapons for the first time in more than a century. But that's long been the case here in New Hampshire for just about any adult of sound mind and clean record can carry. Last year in Manchester. Fifteen hundred people paid $10 to get or renew a concealed weapons permit. Good for four years at that rate between five and six thousand people can now legally carry concealed weapons here in the state's largest city. So if you do carry or just have a gun at home what are your rights and responsibilities. You're permitted to protect yourself or a third party a loved one your wife your children can you proceed to tell someone about this deal cause of you or another you can protect that person or

yourself. And if you're in the dark and you hear somebody thrashing around. You have to be careful. You have to know what you're doing. That's why I feel very strongly that if you are going to purchase a gun for self defense you know the ins and outs about it you have to look at it and make sure it's right and there is lots of training available. The National Rifle Association has instructors around the state will start anyone with the basic question will you even have a gun. Well the first thing I would ask you is we reflect on your lifestyles and do I have a. Do I live in a high crime area are my next door neighbors perhaps some questionable individuals with a lot of question with Traficant. So. So you really have to assess that realistically and you also have to ask yourself you know knowing my own makeup and why even tempered. Am I responsible individual or am I the kind of person that loses things easily like my car keys and things of this nature so you really have to do a

self-assessment based on your situation and knowing yourself knowing the potential hazards you might be encountering in your lifestyle. And the purpose for you is the protection of family and property if that ever should arise do you get people coming to think that a gun is going to solve their biggest problems. Some people do and quite frankly we we try and dissuade that because of what I talk to people basically say when you decide to purchase a firearms particularly if you decide to purchase a firearm for self defense. This is where your thought processes and your responsibility sort of caution increase almost geometrically you have to be a much more responsible individual even if you choose like a chemical weapons which is pepper gas or something of that nature. And even if you choose no weapon that doesn't mean you're defenseless. Just knowing your neighbors can make a neighborhood safer rail yard organized the first neighborhood watch is in Manchester 8 years ago and is still spreading the word neighborhood of

Wise's doesn't mean that you are going to find the crime element that no one neighbor was about. That's why the police are there where they're able to do it you it and you call it and if you don't want to call it we'll call real provide for them and I will call it a group bleaters is what we call and that's what we're trying to get that again and it works. Believe me when you see a good neighborhood watch at work in a neighborhood and look at it over a period of time what kind of change do you see in the people. What do they feel that they feel better they feel better about themselves they feel better about their neighborhood. If we were to go through the city right now I could point out some neighborhoods that have come together they're cleaner now. The atmosphere is livelier. The people stay out a little later at night. They're not afraid they don't as soon as the sun goes down they don't jump behind closed doors and lock up. A gun. I don't like I'm not a gun fan. You know I was around guns when I was in the military. I've been a prisoner for 11 years I've been around guns. But I can tell you if I wasn't a cop I

wouldn't own a gun. I don't think that I have a need for a gun. I don't hunt. I'm not an outdoorsman. I just would have a gun. To me it would make sense to have a gun in my house. Especially a small child. I wouldn't even be involved with. In. The past 20 years we've seen a lot of laws and regulations passed against firearm owners and I've debated this in my mind back and forth and I came to the conclusion either right or wrong the past couple of years. I no longer care what those laws are or what public opinion polls are or. People on TV say I've got firearms. I use them safely. I'm going to keep them. And that's that in spite of differences of opinion there may be more consensus than we realize. Whether it's Mike PELLETIERE putting a trigger lock on his handguns for safety. Ray Alvino are trying to organize neighborhood watches or Carol Hawk Meyer organizing gun control petitions even as she carries pepper

gas and a sonic alarm. We are all like it or not living in troubled times. How we deal with the choices before us may in the end be less important than a realisation that something must be done. As a society as individuals all of these choices are ours to make. Before we go the last word goes to the first person we met when Kate Alexander made the decision to buy a gun. She knew the first and most important thing to do was to learn how to use it properly. That's a lesson she's now passing on to others. It is now a certified police firearms instructor with a wide range of students from law enforcement officers to women who are as Kate once was in search of safety and empowerment. Talk about the challenges ahead. When I teach women students I see a lot of myself in them. I see the days when I couldn't hit the paper with the with the with the rounds. I mean I felt like I wanted to throw the gun. I would be more effective. Matter of fact when I bought my first semi-auto

I thought I was buying a $500 club because I wasn't sure I was ever going to be able to shoot it properly. And I see and feel the same frustrations in my women students. But I also feel a success a quicker learning curve for them because through my frustration and learning I've been able to package this a lot closer so that when I teach for them they don't have to go through the same frustrations. People are generally surprised when they find out that I either own a firearm or that I teach firearms. I think they get the impression that I'm a middle aged mom kind of person and they just they don't perceive me as Annie Oakley or Ramban or anything like that. And that gives me an edge to let people realize that I'm not much different than a middle aged mom. And they listen to me. I think that makes me more effective as an instructor in this. Act.

I've had students take the course and do a wonderful job in the class and come to me afterwards and say you know one thing I've decided not to buy the gun and I'm really glad your class was here so I could learn that it's a personal decision. It's a real personal decision. To