Evening Exchange; 2204; Youth and Politics, Weekly News Analysis, Hip Hop Culture

Democrats enter the for both way over Iraq. The mare weighs in with a budget balance proposal and youth culture and politics in the hip hop era. All next on evening Xchange. Welcome to evening exchange I'm calling some people old enough to remember will tell you that Baltimore Colts football great Bubba Smith used to listen to deafeningly loud rock music before games because it was annoying and serve to inspire his controlled rage on the football field. Today Bubba would probably be listening to hip hop being able to select words and beat to fit whatever mood he

wanted to generate for his game. And maybe you can understand that it's what's popular. But nobody ever referred to Bubba Smith as part of the heavy metal generation. So what's this about a hip hop generation. Is this a generation defined by its musical preference. And can such a generation be taken seriously. Making a point with one hand while holding up the pants with the other. Well hip hop mogul Russell Simmons has formed a political action committee and a lot of lesser known members of this generation are doing serious political and community work. Here's Larry Brown Jr. with the report. In this ever changing world community leadership and political activism are experiencing the changing of the guard placing pioneers of the past. Leadership of Congress and in communities across the country. The present generation of activists accept the political torch they are tackling human rights issues from racial profiling to economic empowerment in an effort to reach out to the local

community university soon association to the public debate with the candidates of the 2002 mayoral race. Community leaders believe that leadership begins early age. As an example of the growing number of young activists at the age of 17 the community service Council with the Boys and Girls Club since the age of 12 with the project Christmas and since the age of dedication to leadership praise from those who see her as a role model to her peers. Five days a week Nicole boards a bus and heads to the Boys and Girls Club where she works on projects. As president of the team leadership group the Keystone club she also finds time to help younger children with their studies and homework assignments. I think it is critical that young people care about the community in which we live. And Nicole is a prime example of volunteerism at

its best. Nicole's mother says her daughter's desire to get back started early on. She's wanted to help people for ever since she was a baby. I remember when we moved to where we are now. We had a cat and we couldn't bring the cat with us. And instead of taking the cat to the patio she wanted to give it to an AIDS patient. What motivates me the most and community service is working with the kids. I've always wanted to help people as far as I can remember my mom has always told me it's good to give back. And places I've seen places that have gone really bad and I just really need someone to give bad especially since September 11th that is motivating me even more. Walking the path of pioneers before them these new pioneers accept the challenges of today's complex society to change. This is Larry Brown Jr.. Do these serious young people even consider themselves a part of the hip hop generation.

Well let's ask a few of them. Giovanna Bowles works for the Congregational Black Caucus Foundation good to have you here. Jarvis Houston's chief of staff use of the Howard University student association. And Nicole Jackson you just saw in that package as a community activist Nicole Jackson welcome to you. Do you see yourself as being any different from your peers in that you do a lot of community activism and stars of being different from my peers know I do exactly the same things they do and I enjoy the same things like going to football games and I going to the mall but I take community service as a really important thing in my life. It's something that I like to do. Do you consider yourself a part of the hip hop generation. Yes music is my life I am a teenager. I listen to music when I get home. When I get to the boys and girls I didn't say a big part in my life. Also the boys and girls we are trying to hole a poetry slash phrase Don I said I understand that the poetry of one late to park

record has some to some degree influenced your and motivated your activism Housel. Yes one of my students came from the Boys and Girls Club can't see me one day after September 11th. When came to me with this to pipeline it's a question as in she said Well peace when with a pretty peace on earth and she gave me a moment to answer and then she answered. When Earth falls the pieces which motivated me even more to want to give back. But even before the book around the age of 10 you had what I would call a kind of Huey Newton instead. Of School. Tell us about. Yes. After the movie Black Panthers. It won't have a need even more so I want to give back to my community after us all what they were doing. And. After the black colleges I got a free Healey pay. Safety time and I wanted to pass it around and talk about with their black panthers that Amal was very supportive.

But there was a teacher who was not quite as supportive when she was teaching a class about the Black Panther Party and described them basically as a violent group and you apparently objected to that. Yes. I actually let her know exactly what they did in the community with helping the homeless and setting up different groups lights tutoring groups things like that. What are your plans after high school. Hopefully going to Spelman College or Clark Atlanta. Why those two. Well really I want to go to college and spell math I'm more at home. Well speaking of historically black colleges let's talk now with Jarvis Houston who is the chief of staff of the Howard University student association. I find it fascinating that one of the things you did was organize on this campus one of the debates in the mayo a primary was just took place here in the district. Now most people know that most of our students come from all over the world and all over the country and they're not necessarily interested in D.C. or District of Columbia politics why do you do it. The first reason why I did it was most students don't know who Tim who may or

should go Columbia is that the first reason why I did it students are just not politically involved they complain about Parkin security everything imaginable but they don't know who to talk to to get those issues they want to start our university first but. Don't even know Bill Ward theory and where more one is like you have wards. And that's the problem that we face enough what had caused to the political awareness debate the first reason the new Everyone will come because of it it was a week before the election. No no one would say no. Politically and I knew that the students was going to see their mayoral candidates a war one candidates and at large candidates because Howard University since the war won and we actually see the war won't be 0 6 and same for Skinner is our advisory neighborhood commissioner. So when I told him about it talked to different university students about it. We decided to do it and that's what we had a cause to the political winds debate and it was a great success as do the like. No it was kind of you know D.C. politics it was kind of people in the shouting are going but

students learnt a lot about local government and what they should do to get involved in the many students talk to me about get involved with the local government out there at a program for you. Chicago Illinois. Where do you get on this political track. When I started I've been working on campaigns I was 14 years old. So it's back to interest was sparked my interest was I grew up on it with Satish Cogdell and in the city and I never no one in my neighborhood really were was politically involved at all but one of my mentors who was basically like the neighborhood person everyone looked up to he did a community thing and you put me on and is willing to say you need to get involved with politics. And I was like OK I did that when I came to Howard University to be a political science major and to be one day be a U.S. Congress first of all I'm running for vice of you neighborhood commissioner for war won't be there Wolf. I'm not only our universities too to run for the position so very happy about that. Do you have opponents in this race that one opponent had been on that before we invited

you on the show we would have anticipated that after the show airs your opponent is probably going to ask for equal time. Fortunately that is not the issue we're discussing right now but you come from Chicago Illinois you get involved in campus politics you get involved in neighborhood politics you ultimately want to join the Congress of the United States. What's the reason for that. I want to make change what kind of change. Right now I don't know if I want to be a current congressman in D.C. of the delicate or go back that where you actually have a hope like on the House vote on how for and when I was talking to Mark Earthman Danny K. Davis from Illinois told him that when they want to take a seat in the left he's like you can do anything you put your mind to. And I told him I wanted to be basically the person over there is because I grew up on the West Side of Chicago and actually he gave me so many opportunities in turn actually voted recommended yes a no vote will own different Congressional bills and speeches for him that he actually said on the floor so that gave me a lot experience

and that was the reason one of the reasons why I wanted to be encouraged because just broken O'Neill gave me so many opportunities to see the work exclusively with the constituents of Chicago. Do you consider yourself a part of the hip hop generation. If I look really like two bucks you cure them all if I can feed them in a hip hop icon and it's not just people don't really know the real Tupac she cured it. He like poetry he like anything you read so much but because of negative connotation the media propaganda we don't really see the real Tupac she cured. If you read the book by Michael Dr. Michael Eric Dyson you can really see the real Tupac she cured and nobody really knew about. If you read the book of course because of the time that he wrote it Michael Eric Dyson was at the University of Illinois. And that's your hometown So obviously very familiar. I'm just kidding. It is Michael Eric Dyson is a very well-known public intellectual who has appeared here on the evening Exchange now turning to Giovan those who were featured in The Washington Post recently as a part of the next generation of political leaders you know work for the Congressional Black Caucus

Foundation and in that article it was mentioned that you worked previously for Congressman John Lewis who is legendary in the civil rights movement. Tell us how that all came about and if the impact working for John Lewis had on you. The article came about when broken with the foundation the Washington Post called and wanted to follow a young person whose it was their first time at the conference and they wanted somebody who was inside you wanted to be a political leader someday. So I got chosen in college I used to I worked on campaigns and they have put us through I want to have the university OK. But. So we went. When you were working on campaigns you know when I was working on campaigns in the Hamptons sitting I got really interested I took a clip I took a class it was a long tradition I always wanted to be an attorney and my goal was to go to law school all my life since I was like in fourth grade. And when I got to Hampton I got more of a guidance from Professor pointed me in the direction towards politics. He told me it's good to have the lawn is good to know the law but you really get into politics which is I guess and he was basing it

off of the type of person not with individual the type emitted individual was in class and how students it seemed like I would always end up leading the groups and students would always and above me so he pulled me to the side and told me I think you should go into politics. So I applied for the internship because I live in the 5th District of Georgia this continent was destroyed. So I applied for the internship and I was accepted and working in that office was a wonderful experience it opened my eyes to how laws God made and it really opened my eyes to what I want to do and how I want to change this world what do you want to do I want to I want to be a country congressional member one of the member Oh you member of Congress of Congress and as I said working with John Lewis is legendary in his own right but you have different generations do you consider yourself a member of the hip hop generation is that a term that you accept. Not necessarily only because I'm not really a hip hop lover myself I'm not really into the hip hop culture. I consider myself a young generation in America just coming up and trying to take over and trying to move our agenda to the top and get us to where we need to go. I mean the hip hop for me is music just like R&B

or. Heavy metal or classical is just music for me is not necessarily a little then you go to parties and little people of your age which is played mostly at those parties dependent on the party in a month as most of them a pretty eclectic individual I go to lots of parties I can go to a party at a bar and I can hear one thing and one thing and then I can go to the club go to dream or something like bed and hear hip hop on night. It's not necessary but I don't consider myself part of the generation and then this generation the culture of hip hop because I look at hip hop as just a musical type that has taken over. Are there really guys a lot of African-Americans that's just what we like but I don't I don't consider Caucasians of my age of heavy metal generation are of have you heard of their own thoughts and described as a part of the hip hop generation Oh yes a lot of them are but you also expressed the feeling that this generation of black leadership has different issues to deal with than the previous generation what do you mean by that.

I think aren't with the civil rights movement and while I respect John Lewis so much he took enemy head on and he faced him. And he walked right into it he knew who his enemy would and he walked right up to him and he took the beatings and had to down trons of whatever the people handed him and he took it. I feel like our generation is facing an enemy that's that's faceless that's colorless this is this generalist. I feel like our generation is facing more of a movement then necessarily an actual targeted enemy of like the Caucasian race and have the majority of them was so dominant and we weren't given fair treatment. Nowadays I don't see us as not being able to use the restroom that we want to use. But more so not being able to have the level of a of a job in a corporation that we will some people even think Nicole Jackson that some of the old civil rights organizations are in today's world irrelevant. Yet you work with them. Actually I think I had the opportunity to work with Intel a sleepy looking for its work with friends. Oh tell us I mean when you say you're looking forward to work with them have you taken steps in that the rest. Is there

something going on. Not all but that is all you want to do. Yes do you see that kind of link between the general and the organizations of the previous generation and the civil rights movement and what you are doing today organizations like the open of the the end of the ACP. Do you still see those organizations as being relevant. Yes because actually the Howard University student association has to end up ICP how we shop there actually they work in our office they have office within our office and they do so many things we have Operation VO buys right now where our goal is to Rich Rich to over 3000 voters and voter registration is highly important and we don't think of just voter registration begins students actually out to the polls which is highly highly important. So you don't see yourself as being really that different from the activists of a previous generation. The difference is time because that was back in 60 this is 2000 into Death A different than actually John Lewis who just spoke at our complication. Actually I had a program with him a fervent political action cornered her University

Student Association last year we had a 30 year anniversary of the Freedom Riders to introduce students to what happened in the path. They actually came with both students about. About the freedom rides then one thing I learned about youth it people just think we did get off the bus and get beautiful No really we had to have training to do it and I didn't know nothing. Actually you had to have trained to do all these like anything. Oh yeth Yes and you talked about the shotgun health that you have to be really good do you have to be trained not to respond when somebody attacks you because your instinct tends to be to defend yourself. So apparently there are clear connections between the previous generation of activists and this well thank you all for joining us. When we come back Iraq the D.C. budget and the barbershop controversy with our news analyst the young and the not so he'll stay with us. Welcome back Mayor Anthony Williams of the district came back from Greece and weighed in on the D.C.

budget. Al Gore came in from the barbershop I guess there's no beard anymore and weighed in on Iraq and Jesse Jackson came in from the movie theater it seems and didn't like what he saw in the Barbershop. Here to help us figure this all out Joe Davidson of the Joint Center for Political and Economic Studies Elie dale of the Heritage Foundation. Todd Limburg of the Hoover Institution and policy review and Carrie Ann Hamilton this campus editor for the hilltop the Howard University student publication and Carrie Ann may be the only person here who has actually seen the barbershop you have seen the movie I presume. But then I heard a few minutes ago that there was another member of the panel who has apparently also seen. The movie. That's right. So chill days like that couldn't wait for the video I had to see the movie. Actually I went to the movie theater to see a different film got there too late so I said Well I'm here now what's playing brilliantly for the carry ons expertise please. Did you think about the controversy involving that part of the movie where Cecille the entertainer is in the

barbershop and apparently says some terrible things about Martin Luther King Jr. and Rosa Parks and Jesse Jackson and later on the Reverend Al Sharpton have asked on the one hand for it to be cut out of the DVD for an apology and on the other from house Sharpton for maybe a boycott of the movie would you. I think for the most part the movie was very funny. But taking into consideration the controversy I think it was blown out of proportion. There is one scene or a scene and a half where reference is made to Rosa Parks and Jesse Jackson Jesse Jackson as well as Martin Luther King. But there were disrespectful comments but it didn't warrant Jesse Jackson preaching about it in chapel and crenata specimen this past Sunday he said. And that's disrespectful and it should be done and should be erased from the movie and from the DVD. I think it was exaggerated I think it was a media hype and Jesse Jackson wanted to make his point heard because he was offended by it.

So I agree I think one of the things that Jesse Jackson Al Sharpton are doing really is drawing more attention to the movie and you know movie stars and movie producers really love publicity so this might encourage more people to go see the movie. I don't hear the studio complaining or I think I think it was. I think yes those comments were disrespectful but I think the criticism is really it's just so much more. It's it wasn't the amount of criticism doesn't it it has been wasn't wanted by the by the comment in the film. Plus from what I've read there were several other people in the barbershop look you go to the Barbershop I go to the barbers right. You know what goes on in the barbershop people say anything they feel and they're there in the barbershop in the film. You know we're very critical of Cedric the Entertainer his character who said those those things and so it was like one person and then everybody else kind of dumping on him. I know what to suggest and reportedly said is that some things are sacred and some things are funny. But it seems to me that even some things that are considered sacred are made fun of I've

seen Mother Teresa made fun of him too I think. No I'm with you because you know what I mean. Human beings need humor and I you know one of the Washington Post columnist wrote that this ejection Khosa news conference every time he's offended in that it's it's a little bit like that that somehow this suddenly became about him and not about the movie and that this is seen right I mean if it's a good movie it's a good movie and. It seems like it. This was in proportion and context. I know I've talked with comedians who's talked about you know you see an event like the tragedies of 9/11 and you say to yourself How long will it be before I'm allowed to make a joke about this because I'm thinking about some funny things right now even as it goes on but nothing is really sacred in the as well as some things actually are I think somewhat sacred than them become so that Rosa Parks is pretty close on as far as sacred goes but that doesn't mean that. This is. Deserves the condemnation that's received. I think you know one thing I would add though is I think Cedric the Entertainer was actually rather

brave to be willing to deliver those lines because you know you run the risk of being associated with what a fictitious character whom you're portraying is saying and that's you know that's a risk that the actors and entertainers run on this kind of situation. I think it's a good point. And also you can complain about it I mean if you think of Jesse Jackson or Al Sharpton or anyone else think that these things are offensive and insulting is that I that I would agree with that. Then you can complain about it but that then the kind of take to the step without Sharpton's calling for a boycott. Jeff I think almost certainly will fail. It then also puts him in the light of of overreacting and not being able to follow through. If in fact a boycott does fail and then he in turn makes himself look bad is that as a political leader and this is a man who's considering running for president rising as an exploratory committee has been formed of course but it's not the nation's attention is the debate over Iraq a debate that was joined in a fairly critical manner of this week by several Democrats former presidential candidate Al Gore weighing in former President Jimmy Carter all of them

critical of the administration on the issue and of course also weighing in the Senate majority leader Tom Daschle on that issue but speaking at the convocation of Howard University Congressman John Lewis of Georgia also joined the fray or yesterday every black man in just four years. Today for every black man in college every black man with a college degree that is a brother in jail. How will war solve this problem. However War keep our young people from robbing stealing dope and killing stealing our president proposes war. You propose that we don't strongest nation on earth invade a sovereign nation. He asked every go to war on attack. On Kobo. Unilaterally. I cannot and will not support.

The Iraq. One got the impression going into this that the Democrats in general particularly the Democratic leadership were united behind the administration on that issue. That unity is appearing to crack even though the president said on Friday or Thursday that he expects a resolution coming out of the Congress on this as he spoke with some House Democrats and Republicans but it looks as if there's going to be division here. The Democrats are clearly grappling with how to know how to deal with the Iraq question I think from many of them it goes against the grain of you know they don't feel that they want to support the president they feel that this war is not one they want to support and in fact many of them did not support. The last one against Iraq either. The problem is so that if you look in political terms it is and is a think with where the issue of the leadership probably looked in the first place. It has a lot of traction with the American electorate and. It's it actually

the more they talk about why everybody talks about it the less we talk about the economy and all the other issues that they were trying to bring to the to the fore before the election. And so they are in a bit of a tough spot there. Clearly Joe Davis and the Democrats have been saying to one another. Look the Republicans are using this to their political advantage what do we do about it. And I think the Democrats were complaining that their leadership in the person of Tom Daschle and also on the House side Gephardt were being kind of too cozy with the president on this. And then you noticed after some of those complaints were aired that Dashiell came out with his strongest speech against the president although it was off point. I mean he was complaining about something that the the president had to say about the homeland security bill. But a guy kind of got all wrapped up in this debate about Iraq even though Daschle didn't come out and in any way really criticized the presence of Iraqi policy. It kind of sounded like that news report. Kennedy today however did come out with a very strong speech

about the Iraq policy and how it is not how the president has not presented enough evidence and Kennedy's view to go to war at least unilaterally against against Iraq of course the more the the more this debate goes on the more you do hear the president talking about considering United Nations act in a speech in Denver that sounded I think a bit more like the United States would wait on the United Nations in what he said at the United Nations it's not clear. You know a lot of times the politicians become ways that can be interpreted in a number of different ways. But it sounds like he's talking more like waiting for United Nations action than he did you wanted him to talk a little bit. Is there any way of looking at this while ignoring the fact that we were in an election season if we're in the election season and the president says regardless of the context the Democrats in the Senate are not interested in the national security. It doesn't really matter whether he's talking about Iraq or homeland security. They're going to rise up in moral indignation are they not.

Yeah and I mean I think it's a perfectly natural kind of political squabble to have the question is who's politicizing what everybody is politicizing I mean if you know you can politicize and you can debate questions of war and peace at the same time much as one can with luck walk and chew gum at the same time. So yeah I think the Democrats are having a very serious problem here and I think it goes like this. The more they don't talk about. The war and try to keep it off the front page and don't oppose it. The more the Democratic base vote which is not in favor of this war gets depressed and angry at their own leadership which could have devastating consequences ahead. On the other hand the more they do talk about it and the more that they presumably act in a fashion that they hope will energize the base the more of a backlash that they provoke and possibly allowing the Republicans to become more energized. So I would not like to face the choice that National has had to face. I think he's put in that we've now put the matter to an empirical test I think the

Democrats were in general doing pretty well in the polls in August and that was when this was not. And what about scandal. Yeah it was corporate scandals. Now we are seeing more opposition and we're seeing some evidence that the Democrat's numbers are sinking in him to some degree in a couple of important races and maybe even generically. So I don't know how I would I would not want to be the party strategist in church or figuring this one out. Carrie Ann Hamilton is this an issue that young people are talking about. This is something we're definitely talking about because at the same time in the classroom we're learning about democracy and diplomacy and the importance of talking with other nations to come to some form of middle ground. And it seems as though we heard so much about a preemptive strike in so much about going in without the United Nations. And I think the the Bush administration's pattern has changed so much since 9/11 because there was so much call for a U.N. bilateral. Walter let me move on to a multilateral approach

to this situation and now it's well it's a demo Democrats over here and the Republicans over here so it's more of a devout divide night rather than a unity unifying back to bilateral domestically and multilateral internationally but here's the situation that now confronts the Democrats they want this issue off the table before the November election is that realistic. I don't think it's realistic and I think that you know Todd's assessment of the difficulty is on the mark the problem with it however is that there's no notion of principled in there it's all political pragmatism it's all political calculation. Is there I mean it doesn't appear that that they that in this case the Democrats are really certainly the Democratic leadership is approaching the issue issue in a principled led way like is it in a sense credibly correct to go to war in the circumstances or not. That doesn't seem to be the issue and I think that's fundamental but it seems to be if we approach it this way will it hurt will hurt us or help us at the polls of reproach at the other way will it hurt us help with the ball and that's that of course is expected. But in matters of war and peace I

think you really need some principle to come into the discussion somewhere. But if this landslide of principle holy deal they lose the election their chances are far as their calculation is anemic their chances of winning the House diminish they may possibly lose the Senate. That's a difficult decision to make wise certainly yes but you know I don't think the solution lies and calling. Former leaders like Jimmy Carter like Al Gore to suddenly pop up and give speeches about it Letters From there are growing every day of my and not former leader at that actually. Who was that Al Gore again. I mean it's sort of close attention to the fact that there is a vacuum in in the leadership in the Congress. But you know where you would want the leaders to be. I don't think that this is a winning strategy for them at all and I'm sorry I'm really really sorting and such a tough spot. Well you may go home sometime in October. They go home there's already a bill that

they have signed onto that they have somehow agreed with with the Republicans in the White House and the United Nations let's just speculate for a while the United Nations has managed to put together some kind of resolution enough time between when they go home and the November election for them to be able to talk about the economy and the corporations and Social Security. It's going to be hard. The reason it's going to be hard is that this issue is really cued up and those can be a lot of news coverage about the preparations about movements of troops and material about what's actually going on at the United Nations I think by the way that you know my prediction is that the United Nations Security Council comes around and there is a resolution that the United States is comfortable with I think what we're doing now is haggling with the Russians and the French and the Chinese over the price. But it's got it's going to be difficult. Now if it is true that as some people are reporting back from the campaign trail the voters also you know are very interested in hearing about domestic issues.

Then you know what you weigh what you know what you know then I think what they're you know there's an opening. But whether it's enough to get everything through I don't know. I think it's being used as a silencing factor. So the more we prolong the argument on Iraq and the war and Americans feeling well we're really at risk then it minimizes the economy it minimises at WorldCom and Enron and Martha Stewart. So people are not so much focused on that as much as I think the Bush administration can. But people feel is so there is really a threat here that you know the economy and other things will just slip by the wayside. Not to mention Martha Stewart but that's another story. The meeting's of the World Bank and the International Monetary Fund begin this weekend in Washington but initially people don't seem to be a sconce cerned about exactly what's taking place in those meetings as they were concerned about the fact that there would be protesters on hand.

Oh no. Oh oh oh oh oh. Your protest is saying let them go let them go. It's hard to think about Third World debt retirement it's hard to think about globalization policies which are the things of the World Bank and the IMF are talking about what's what's going on. I know the message I think has been I think the message of the protesters has been totally lost because there's so much focus on the protests and whether or not the streets are blocked or in this case are you let them go meaning let their colleagues get out of jail I suppose as opposed to canting somebody who previously that you wrote there's been something about what the World Bank is doing and I think there's some very serious issues that the that clearly are behind what the protesters are talking about but we don't really hear them talking about those issues.

But isn't that because the protesters and I don't know if they can but I don't think they have ever articulated a coherent message on these things. And the World Bank and the IMF are they are in the business of helping developing countries and countries whose economies are in trouble. Even if you want to engage people on those issues there are clear cases of Argentina to look at on the one whether it's let's say let's look at the issue said you can address them. I think most of these protests are for the sake of protest. Well I think they have some issues and I think they presented them at a press conference a few days ago. Part of the problem with these and there's been some talk I should mention on Pacifica Radio. That's right that's right there's FIFA's we've been in a lot on it. But part of the problem is they have so many issues. It's not like where you're protesting one particular thing maybe the war in Vietnam nationally but if you have basically a basket full of issues then it makes it more difficult for the public to focus on your malice where there are some issues consistent coherent do they not lend themselves to becoming a movement.

I doubt there is still time but is there should be a lot to talk of. Yeah and I put it as a problem where he is you know in many cases what is being protested what is being demanded is actually what the people behind those doors at the International Monetary Fund the World Bank spend most of their days thinking about and trying to work on. You know poverty educate I mean these kinds of things. So you know in principle what the protesters are asking for is something that the system is kind of willing to to give them which kind of one presses I think the coherence and meaning of the protest becomes more symbolic theater a good time. And the students from the Howard University campus as far as you know involved in the protests not that we know of. But it seems to me based on looking at the clip and the reading on the IMF protests for weeks now how they're going to shut the city down. I think that we can compare it to marches and each year the IMF meets. We have more and more protesters they get louder and more boisterous but we never quite hear the

message. And it's based on Todd's argument it would seem as though the IMF and the protesters are on the same page so what exactly are we arguing. When I got over there on the same page but they're suddenly discussing many of the same age issues. We're running out of time very quickly but Mayor Williams came back in style here in the city council have reached agreement on all of the major items in the budget so it looks as if the three hundred and twenty three million dollar shortfall will be overcome in the meantime the mare now has a new challenger in the race car resource the Republican candidate has come forward what are her chances. Well I would say zero to negative actually. But you know I say Carol I think likes to run she likes the chance to talk about the things that she cares about. You know she's an attractive politician who she's well-liked in the district. And I guess you know I can see a case for assistance for Republicans in the district that you're meeting in there you know in that little phone booth where they are where we gather every year saying you know look let's let's put up a candidate let's make a run of it. Why should this be an automatic

carry on home and you get the last word on that. I think it's good to have people like Carol because they keep the politicians who are in the limelight and check bringing the issues to the fore and making people and collect voters aware that keep issues and you can better believe that's what Carol Swartz is going to do win or lose. Thank you all for joining us whether or not you believe there was a hip hop generation there definitely is a hip hop culture a multifaceted culture so stay with us. That's. It.

If you're wondering what all this talk of hip hop culture is all about if music videos then allow Howard University senior Kristin Forbes to school on the latest. The term hip hop conjures up images of music videos current trends in urban fashion and dance. What many adults over the age of 40 don't know is that hip hop is more than music videos backward caps and bling bling. And what you hear is not it are the basic elements of hip hop culture are breaking records CD emceeing and D.J. was born 20 years ago in the barrios of New York by neighborhood deejays taking to the streets their turntables words and dance style. The face of hip hop was a mixture of African American and Latin rapping and breakdancing with hip hop and yours is a great noble Puerto Ricans agree number to many kids are

just you know the whole complex a lot of that that never been nor. Never brought up in the process. You know with. Meeting. With breakdancing you know with you know D.J. you know all that you know there's. This. Tremendous. Latino fluency. You know. If. You think reflectivity. You know we have. What we have a picnic with me. I'll be there maybe so but they were hip hop so much you know reggae. Which is you know it's if you go to the pub in general what once was considered a passing fad has evolved into a worldwide phenomenon. Today the hip hop generation has gone beyond the beat box. The hip hop theater has become the latest in hip hop culture to reach theater alleys across the nation. This new artistry combines hip hop music song and dance with hard hitting urban issues. I don't drive one contemporary place such as the hip hop nightmares of Judy Brown a rhyme

deferred and slam received rave reviews. Local playwright Robert Alexander recently mounted a hip hop play entitled A preface to the alien garden at the Trinity repertory in Providence Rhode Island. Hip hop that is definitely bring it in a much younger audience will slightly change the demographics of who comes to see theatre but is making the self's assessable to a different demographic and hopefully in time as the older generations audience began to doubt that it will reach this younger audience and they will replace the old audience chivalry may be dead she said. But the soul and hollow traditional folklore in storytelling transcends generations and this generation has taken to the spoken word and poetry open mike nights of hypnotic urban poetry have taken on a cult following folk in the face from a soup pot and they just hang around cause of who

are climbing up the television rating charts as Russell Simmons Def Poetry Jam on HBO hip hop has become a multimillion dollar business. The attraction of Hollywood television sports and music is making millionaires of young American hip hop culture the face of a new generation. For even exchange This is Kristin Forbes. We're talking with Howard University Law School alumnus and entertainment lawyer John Mercer. John good to see you again. Good to see you. You have been practicing for just about as long as the hip hop culture and hip hop movement has been around. Could you tell me a little bit about how the entertainment industry has changed with what we now know as the hip hop culture. Well there have been some you know what I've seen is some mammoth changes you know in in the music industry in the recording industry in attainment in general and

you know for example when when when I started out in the entertainment. Area you could count the number of black lawyers who are in the area and in D.C. There were maybe two or three. And those two or three I worked with you know in my office so. So it's changed in that respect and that's significant because as the entertainment area has evolved over the years black lawyers have gotten a bigger piece of the client pie and that that is one of the side benefits of hip hop rap popular music music culture is that a lot of these young people have come to black lawyers. So it's really benefited us because we used to read stories over the years about how black artists music writers black ranges have been quote unquote ripped off over the years. Are today's artists more aware more financially aware or more business

aware than the artists of a generation ago. I think they are. And one of the one of the things that made that the way that it is you know even in D.C. for example the hip hop culture has grown. Rap music which is part of that came it started to develop it around the same time the gogo music did in D.C. and being in the D.C. area I represented many of those groups. You know for example the groupie you that later want a winner and someone with Spike Lee's movie did the but Spike Lee you know his vision of the kind of peace that he wanted in his schooldays picture. I did remember that you represented that right. Right well that group I had represented that group for seven years before the opportunity to do that that movie with Spike Lee. But as the entertainment business has evolved the reason that you came to me to represent them is because they didn't have any money.

And that's one of the things that happen with a lot of the early read allow me to put a scenario to you about not having any money. I create what in the hip hop business is known as a big right Ice Cube somehow. Here's my beat. And he wants my beat on his next CD. What can you John Marcey do for me. Well you know the a couple ways of looking at that now. One thing now there's a beat and there's tracks Now sometimes those those terms are used to mean the same thing. OK. If you put together musical tracks that is the music and the rhythm together is in my basement in your basement. What you have done is you've created a musical composition and that musical composition can be incorporated into something that's being done by Ice Cube or whether you know Master P or whether it's ludicrous or whoever it is may be interested in that they have to listen to that material all the time. They use that material that beat that rhythm that track is the vehicle to carry you know

what's a written then a rabbit you know that they they write lyrics and they speak those lyrics as poetry over that. So that's a fundamental part of what they need. You can become a very very rich person by putting together the right musical tracks you are the one who will negotiate the deal between me and Ice Cube or between me and the record company that Ice Cube is going to do and what I'm going to do is I'm going to negotiate the deal between you and the artist. The one the lyricist. Who wants to collaborate with you. I'm going to do that deal and that's that gets to the point of what the difference has been in the hip hop music arena because these kids who have done this have become owners of the intellectual property that did not happen long ago. You know what happened when you had the R&B artist and long years ago in many instances they never were credited as the writers. Now these young people are being credited as the writers

not only the young people are being credited but now some of the writers from the old days it will give you a specific example to records that are recently in the top 10 both of I think the number one and number two still on Billboard done by the hip hop artist Nelly. Well if you look at Billboard magazine in Billboard magazine on the chart list when they show who's on the charts. They put the name of the song behind the artist and you will see listed the writers of the song and it produces. Well if you look closely at what Nelly songs you'll see SEE Brown next to the record is getting hot in here. That's Chuck Moran. Wow background go do you see who was co-writer of the number one song because his music was was put into that song. So once he has somebody like you representing him he gets some income from that. But what we're seeing with hip hop is that it's not just the music it is a culture that is not at this point restricted racially.

It's a culture that cuts across race and class lines can you explain absolutely what is happening is that the hip hop culture the rap music is part of the hip hop culture. And the hip hop culture has expanded its base beyond where the music had originally gone. Now it's a culture is truly a culture because of the expression is more than musical. It is in clothing it is in dance. It is in film. It is in our day to day lives it has become integrated in into what we do but it is essentially a youth culture that is accepted around the world so it is stimulated tremendous you know business in a prizes you know for example if you look at the clothing lines that have developed in hip hop if you if you take a magazine like Source magazine which is one of the top by the way was put together by some students from Harvard University. But if you look at Source magazine you cant get to the articles for the advertisements in there of the clothing or Vibe magazine.

So as a culture it is a highly commercial culture and that is where people like John Marsa come in because at every step along the way whether you're talking music art theatre or any aspect of the culture representation is needed for the people who are creating different aspects. Exactly because. As a major part of this US economy has been more and more involved with intellectual property and licensing. Then they they call the entertainment industry as a matter of fact when I teach my students I say is paper intensive because as you know from being in a thing interview you got to have a release a license and you have to have something for almost anything that you do. And so you have to have good legal advice when you do these things and you'd be surprised at how many of the advisers and the agents and the lawyers are coming out of Howard University the Johnnie mostly Many of them are coming out here and I teach some of them who come out and all of a sudden they're huge Cino after a couple of years. Thank you very much for joining us continued good luck to you. Okay thank you.

Robert Alexander is the hip hop playwright. You saw in that earlier piece he joins us to talk about hip hop theater and here to talk about the multicultural oranges and effects of hip hop is Alberto them ingots of the Latin American Youth Center. Welcome to you has the Latin oranges origins of hip hop culture to some extent been ignored in the mainstream media. I think recently there's been a focus sort of like a refocus especially with the passing of big time Fat Joe with his new album the beat now it's finally being recognized as a legitimate group that's you know produced their own beats and you know you sampling says you know what's popular now in hip hop. I think now there's been sort of like this refocus on you know well Latinos aren't hip hop. We do have a voice in hip hop but in the past I think you know pre Big Pun and there was. Million I mean I would say

millions of tons of artists who have lent origin and was ignored I think. I think it was ignored because we have a tendency to look at the big breakout stars and big pun was I guess the biggest of the big breakout stars of hip hop and among that among Latinos I think is the lack of history its lack of understanding of anything has a history any culture we're calling it the hip hop culture you need to understand well to any culture there's a history to that culture and I think you have to look at the origins of the origins aren't being passed down in that or you know then that culture doesn't necessarily permeate in its truest sense in its truest essence. You can also look at media I believe to a certain extent maybe media has something to do with the fact that they just want to put one color to the culture itself or to that sort of hip hop game with that rap game but it seems that hip hop has itself transcended all of that in the top producing stars if you will of variety of colors that it cuts across all lines domestically racially and it cuts across all lines internationally we'll get back to that in the second the driver of an exam.

How do you describe or define hip hip hop theater tries the last of the basic elements of. Hip hop graffiti deejay and sampling and rapping rhyming verses in 1990 I wrote a play called I ain't your uncle. The new jack revisionism Tom's Cabin and I sampled Harriet Beecher Stowe's Uncle Tom's Cabin and I brought it to a new generation. The subtitle my version of the new Jack revision is Uncle Tom's Cabin Smith that it was coming to you from a hip hop point of view that my version of Uncle Tom's Cabin was going to be much more in-your-face than previous all play that we were used to. It's hip hop's theater still kind of underground art form or as of now in the mainstream or now entering the mainstream. It is underground but it is also beginning to rear its head in the mainstream. For example you can go see. Version of hip hop the unit right now at Arena Stage is a play by culture classic rock anthems I've

seen in which they've incorporated elements of hip hop theater. They certainly have they do have a little bit of Gogo in there but that's a whole nother story to hip hop is hip hop theater intended to appeal to a younger audience or is its intention really to bring in all and all audiences because theater is a very conservative industry in a very slow moving right now hip hop theaters out in the margins and the audience that is reaching kids from the margin kids the voiceless kids that does stuff gives voice to. But I think if we continue to see examples like Anthem at Arena Stage there will be a time where things that are in the margins eventually become mainstream. Really just I mean hip hop music itself was underground and now it's pop music. Tell us briefly about your hip hop play entirely entitled A preface to the alien guard. A preface to the alien garden was a gangsta rap play it was inspired by me listening to NWA and listening to the most negative aspects of gangsta rap.

It tells a story about a young woman who's selling crack in Kansas City Kansas and she's recruited by a group of Crips to move from L.A. to Kansas City to open up a crack house. And it follows her struggles through the hierarchy of that of that gang. It's about the gang turning in on itself and the violence that comes with the crack industry. So it got to raise a lot of controversy when it was produced in Providence Rhode Island at Trinity Repertory Theater. But hopefully is going to come to being in a city real soon. Alberto Dominguez I can't tell you how surprised I was to get off an airplane in Cuba about a year ago and standing there in the airport lounge and look up at the television set and there are these Cubans all doing hip hop with the exception of language the same thing I would expect to see in New York and of course at the recently held Latin Grammys there were several Cuban hip hop artists who because of visa confusion because of all of the stuff that's going on. Didn't that mile get to participate. If so even though it has Latin roots in New York it's now it's

seen spreading around the Latin world. Definitely like just to feed off of what you are saying. Hip hop is as a culture now it's in Germany. It's in South America it's and there's a number is it around the world. I was recently Cuba myself last year so I got an idea of Cuba is interesting because you know like you said it's the culture there but it's the language that's different. The beauty of it is that culture is language. And I think that that languages being that language is being conveyed I'll be in English or Spanish and you know despite the embargo against Cuba the groups of people who tend most to be attracted to Cuba tend to be artists playwrights actors and obviously you know hip hop artists themselves. Is there a comparison to be made between say hip hop theater and Aaron McGruder. He was a hip hop comic strip artist in mainstream newspapers now kind of introducing a lot of people to the culture.

Well I will say one thing that we can look at hip hop in terms of who consumes most of the music that gets created by black youth white kids in the suburbs are the biggest consumers of hip hop. The other one is by the most baggy jeans and was about the most Snoop Dogg albums. They are the biggest consumers of it and therefore. As they get older and as they work their way through middle America you will see hip hop's influence grow larger and wider. To answer your question about Aaron McGruder I don't read as his strip on a regular basis but I know that he tries to bring he Newton back through in one of his characters by naming him but you are right and I would say that he does have a hip hop sensibility. Do you feel as as Robert does that hip hop is indeed going to be around for a long time because of the way it's spreading. Yeah. Hip hop's here to stay this stuff are here to stay. Here's what we hope this edition of the evening exchange may have accomplished. The next time someone says hip hop generation or hip hop culture to you your eyes

won't glaze over and you'll be able to see beyond the gangsta rap videos. Whether or not you like what you see is up to you. Hey thanks to all of our panelists we're joining us most of all thanks to you for watching. Stay well. Good night.