Wisconsin Week; 333

Wisconsin week is made possible in part by a grant from a NRA pipeline company a subsidiary of the coastal corporation. This year marks the beginning of a DNR pipeline company's fifth decade of providing natural gas service to Wisconsin's homes businesses and industries. Welcome I'm Joe Smith in Milwaukee Dave Iverson is off tonight. On tonight's Wisconsin Wakeford McCoy my clothes after all. Senator Herb Kohl gives us the latest now walkies troubled school district has a new leader this week we'll talk with new superintendent Howard fuller more on the state budget. This week a report on social services spending and a report from a citizen panel on the state's big plans for prisons. Those stories and more next on Wisconsin. Topping the week's news. Wisconsin's Fort McCoy could be closing. That announcement out of Washington today. Fort McCoy served as a major processing point for Persian Gulf

units. The Republican political strategist who helped Governor Tommy Thompson win an upset election in 1996 died this week. Robert buzz business died after suffering a brain aneurism. He was 45 and I. Was in Janesville a 16 month old baby girl died after being left alone in a locked car with the windows rolled up. Authorities say the baby was in the car for about three hours in 90 degree plus weather. The 25 year old mother said she was taking a nap. Authorities took the woman into custody starting Saturday more than a million Wisconsin bill customers will start paying for each local phone call they make. The phone company says most its customers will save money. The state's lottery director says legalizing video poker games would be cannibalizing other games. William Flynn projects allowing video poker would cut into lottery profits by up to 45 percent. The legislature is considering legalizing video poker games. And Wisconsin was in the national spotlight this week when a 13 year old Clintonville girl won the

National Spelling Bee in Washington. Joanne legato won in the Twin. If I'm wrong by correctly spelling and had higher reading. The word means an agent that maybe says U.S. Senator Herb Kohl of Milwaukee says people are jumping the gun when they say Fort McCoy is a candidate for closure. He joins us from his Milwaukee office to help explain news out of Washington today on Wisconsin's military base Senator thanks for being with us. Thank you very much. Tell us why why are we jumping the gun. This is not a foregone conclusion that Fort McCoy will close well by no means is that a foregone conclusion that's all that we've heard officially. And it is official is that Fort McCoy along with many many other centers will be study that their candidates for study today to determine whether or not there is a legitimate case for closure. But by no means Has anybody made that decision nor in any of it would a decision be made probably for. A few years. Although I cannot say exactly when this study will be concluded but it is incorrect to conclude today

that Fort McCoy is going to close it has not been decided by any means given the four McCoy trains reservists and had an awful lot to do with the Operation Desert Storm. Is does that act in its favor. Yes it does I think we need to remember two things about that. The Fort McCoy process is in training one hundred twenty five thousand men and women a year from all across the country thats pretty pretty significant. In addition to that they've processed almost 10000 people during the Persian Gulf conflict. So they are an active ongoing army base which provides a real function. And by no means should they be considered to be an inactive kind of an operation or something that is unnecessary. In fact I might pass this is this information I know we wrote them a few months ago about the situation of Fort McCoy and the idea that the Department of the army answered my office and said that with the closing of four chaired in which as you know is expected to take place in 1903 Fort McCoy's mission was intended to be expanded. So I don't think that

we need to feel that Fort McCoy inevitably is a facility that is going to be closed. So that actually acts in our favor as well. Well the anticipated expansion in 1903. What does the commission look for when it thinks about closing a base. Well they look for its mission and they decide to try and make a judgment as to whether or not its mission is ongoing and important whether or not the mission in which it that they're performing it can be performed somewheres else. And just how necessary the base is in the total and the total scope of things we need to remember in Wisconsin. We have so little of that in Wisconsin I think it works in our favor. You know if we had dozens of bases perhaps they could understand and we could understand how one or two might be close but that's not the case in Wisconsin. So I think that the base that we do have a Fort McCoy is less likely in my judgment to be closed than otherwise. It is it is it safe to say that the process in determining what pace will be closed can be fair objective and non political.

Well that's terribly important question isn't it. Now the the base closing commission as you know has attempts to be a very nonpolitical kind of an operation. And I believe on the basis of what we've seen decided thus far across the country with respect to other bases in other states that have been closed most of the information that I've seen convinces me that this commission does work very hard to be nonpolitical. And I would prefer to give them the benefit of any doubt until we see to the contrary we can expect then that our representatives in Washington will be lobbying in in favor. No question will be working very hard to maintain the base because they say Wisconsin does not have a very much a of that defense expenditure that takes place in this country we have a very small amount of it. I think you can make a very strong case that we deserve what we have both on the basis of that and on the basis of court records real mission which I regard as important and necessary. Senator Paul thanks for the time. Thank you. They walk the schools are in bad shape what with the recent reports showing fewer than half of its

students end up graduating. But this week there's hope new hope for Milwaukee students hope in the form of a new superintendent. Dr. Howard fuller comes to the school district after his tenure as Director of Health and Human Services here in Milwaukee County. Welcome and congratulations on what you've got an enormous job ahead of you what's going to be your biggest challenge. Well I think there's really only one challenge and that is to develop a system that is going to educate our kids at a very high level so that when they graduate they can be competitive and productive and I think that we have to set that as our one and only goal. And we have to measure everything that we do against that goal. And if it supports that then we need to do more of it. And if it doesn't we need to get rid of it. Do you feel an enormous pressure on your shoulders as you take this job actually. Another song strange but the reason why I don't is I don't really see that I'm taking this job for a week. I mean I I mean I represent a lot of people in this community who supported me and so I feel like we're going into this

job and we're going to do it together. I understand that that's an abstraction because I'm the person who said there but I just really feel that there is a lot of support out there and that we can call on a lot of help and I'm going to do that. You you can into this job with an enormous amount of support not only from the community but from the school board tonight is your old phone you were not surprised by that. Well. I was gratified. But you know there were times during this process when I could not honestly say that I thought I was going to end up with an 0 vote on the board. And I'm very gratified and I think the board members for it. But I think I also have to thank the people in this community who come out and just you know amazing numbers to me in support. And I also want to take this opportunity particularly since I'm a Wisconsin we thank all of the state legislators who voted for the bill to thank Governor Thompson for his support and also to think Byrd Grover for his support and I'm in it a whole lot more from both of them and the legislature.

You come into this job at a time when when the budget is being cut and. Programs need to be cut. One particular program which it seems to be vital is his fourth grade kindergarten for you're going to go for your guy. It seems incredible that that could be cut given that you believe that you need to start at a very young age in order to grab children. Well I think and this is not the doctor but the understanding that I have with the board is that this budget is by Peter King and the board's budget. And so I really don't want to comment on it. And what you got was disappointed. Well to say I'm disappointed is a common one. So I really don't have any comment and I think it's also important for people understand that it's early in the process and I think the board is listening to the community and we'll see what they ultimately come up with. You will have a honeymoon period. I really don't think I'm going to have much of a honeymoon. You know like an old face. Is it because we know you know you know that you're not you're not going to get any breaks here.

Birds What's the first thing you're going to do when you see you start the job on Monday. Yeah the first thing I would do is go to a school and the reason why I want to do that is I want to make it clear that this job is about kids and it's and if change is going to take place it's going to be because it was done out in the schools. So I want to get out into the schools and you know I got to be sworn in and so I do that and then I'm going to start a meeting with various administrators and began to you know get on board in terms of the issues. Well we wish you the best of luck. Well thanks a lot and I look forward to talking to her again again. I'm sure we will after how it felt. Thanks. The governor wants less spending and the legislature more when it comes to shelling out for welfare and other programs for the poor. This week the legislature's budget writing committee joint

finance took up health and social said services are Hackett has this report. The budget that I'm presenting today is designed for Wisconsin's hardworking taxpayers. When Governor Tommy Thompson presented his budget in February it proposed more of the welfare reforms he's trying to become known for things like learn fair which penalizes families on welfare whose children skip school. The budget expands lawyer for learning for children ages 6 to 12 so that our youngest children will never fall into the dangerous habits of skipping school. But the learn for expansion has been targeted for rejection by key members of the legislature's budget writing joint Finance Committee and the governor's projections on the effectiveness of welfare reform are posing problems for legislators. Thompson's budget staff assumed a decrease in the number of people on welfare and they projected that learned fare would cut welfare costs by three million dollars. But learn for sanctions are not as numerous as expected and recent figures used by the Legislative Fiscal Bureau show the

drop in the welfare caseload will not be as great as expected miscalculations involving these and other welfare programs mean over 13 million dollars in additional costs. The joint Finance Committee asked a balance at Tuesday's meeting. Committee Democrats accused the governor of sending in low ball estimates to force the committee to accept proposals such as giving people on disability programs food stamps instead of cash. All right. But it wasn't so. For Sensitive Both players were very sure I answered. You're not the only way you get older. Whoa whoa whoa. There is no you here. Despite the low estimates when Committee co-chair Representative Barbara Linton put out the final call

for additional health and social services proposals the wish list had a seventeen point seven million dollar price tag. San Francisco you have your list. I mean they're getting insurance. OK. A number of the items fighting for inclusion in the joint Finance Committee version of the budget are preventative care programs including several being piloted here at the 4th Street Clinic in Beloit. Has there been Regina Simpson of Boyd is involved in one of the programs she's pregnant with her first child. The program is called care coordination city of Beloit public health nurse Bonnie Cunningham says the goal is to provide health care and advice very early in a woman's pregnancy to avoid babies born with problems the cost of taking care of a low birth weight baby is just astronomical. And if you can save having a few low birth weight babies and stay with

us and you're going to save a tremendous amount of money in your health care dollars. Cunningham says the incidence of low birth weight babies born to women in boys pilot program is well below the state average. Even though the women in it are considered a high risk population for problem pregnancies other states have been doing prenatal care coordination and I hoping Wisconsin will do it as a whole from the state. I think we're ready but the cost of state wide expansion is four million dollars. Governor Thompson has vetoed the idea twice before and Hanny Thompson recently appointed to head the State Division of Health says the program is not fully tested yet. The reason cordon coordinated care prenatal care works is because it is truly tailored to the area and to the population and to the wrists within those population. So you can say well wait let's say for that for a million dollars and we'll spread it around the state spread it around what.

But those who are pushing statewide expansion say federal funding for the program would not have been authorized if it didn't work and free. That is why the Federal Government put it in is because it's proven been proven very successful in other parts of the country. So the model is it is not something that has to be tested it was because if it is successful when they start to have cereal. Meanwhile joint finance already put in money that will lead to more people joining the Healthy Start program. It's intended for people like Michelle Windsor and her 4 month old son Jody. It provides prenatal and pediatric care for women and children who aren't poor enough to qualify for medical assistance. This is also something the governor didn't ask for. State health director designate Haney acknowledges these programs save money in the future. The problem is they cost money now. We would have to look at what kinds of back and savings that we could get one two three years down the line in order to fund the front end. Well if you're going on an annual budget my annual budget I mean that takes some very very

careful planning. They have a very tight budget. But you either pay now or you pay later and I think that putting in place good policies that will prevent you know prevent large expenditures down the road just makes an awful lot of sense. Our tech is reporting with more state money to help poor children at issue a Democratic chair of the children and Human Services Committee joins us from the Capitol. Representative Becky young of Madison also on the committee on the other side of the aisle. Representative Peggy Rosensweig awak Tosa Republican. She joins us here in Milwaukee Welcome to both Representative Rosa sway of the Democrats say that the governor's program is short on prevention and as Jeannette Bell says Is it pay now or pay later. Well Joe I think that there is a consensus that we should pay some now. Instead of later the question is when you're strapped for cash in this state

as we are currently how much and I guess from my perspective the governor gave us a budget that can use some help in working on preventive measures. The question is Where do we get the money for myself and several other legislators. We're looking at a five cent increase on our cigarette tax and we're calling it pennies for prevention. Just to address the kind of issue that you were talking about because it does have the care coordination for healthy start in it. But I have to stress we need sources of revenue both the federal dollars and a new source for our state. Sorry Becky young is that good enough. Well I certainly do support with Representative Rosenzweig of the care coordination for the high risk mothers in the medical assistance program I think that's an excellent idea and I disagree with Ann Hanny who says they payoff is years later. That's not true the payoff is immediate about 4 percent of our babies

born in the state of Wisconsin cost us about 56 percent of our health care budget for. The birth budget. So you're saying it will and you pick it up in the first year. All right so what you're saying is that we need to spend the money now. You bet on prevention. Well the governor probably would argue with you and say that in some respects some of his programs like learn fair are a prevention of sorts. Well that's an interesting argument the governor's made but everyone who has looked at learn fair and objective bases that is who has not been a political at point A of the governor am in Milwaukee the legislative Audit Bureau which is a nonpartizan arm of the legislature even Region 5 in and in Chicago have all said that learn Fair has some serious problems and of course a Judge Terrence Evans pointed that out too. And in addition when that when the governor claimed last year that. They learn fair program was

getting 70 percent of the kids on. Who had left school back into school. One of the statistician they the analysts and his own department of health social services said no no no no that is not true. OK those are not the egg I make you know. So I think that when we want to spend money we have to look at what is the most effective way of investing those dollars and in that instead of an learn fair which has not indicated there is there's been no tried and true evidence that that succeeded. We ought to look at alternative ways which are tried and true in terms exist succeeding like that OK. All right OK. That was a good not OK let's not take learn fair and certainly you would and take it out. I would enhance learn fair and I'll tell you why. It is the fact that the numbers are what we'd like that one in four kids are back in school that weren't there before. The fact is that learn Fair has had some problems which in fact show most problems when their star

programs when they're starting up have some mechanical difficulties. I think that many of us are looking at ways to work those out. We can all agree though I believe that children ought to be in school and that any way that we can do to bring them back in and to give them a good education is what we're about. And I suggest that we do that together. All right now what about what about all the money that is spent on prevention and. And it doesn't work. And as a as a person gets older that they're on to drugs. Then what offsets all of this. We were throwing good money after bad is that what's happened or will do when some accountability here don't. I think that's true but I also raise the question we are still in a position where we have to care for those people whether they're incarcerated or we have to build special programs for them. So while we're putting money in the front end which we would all agree we should. And prevention but it's how

much it's how much and how much we're indebted to at the other end. And we still have our obligations to me and the governor is left with having to make sure we balance our books and we take care of our obligations. And Becky young you would agree that if we threw more money at this that we would have a better chance at at least a bit more survival here. Well Joe I think there is no question that there are demonstrated there's demonstrated evidence that programs like Head Start like prenatal health care like the care coordination pays like early intervention for abused and neglected children. These programs all work to save the dollars and the long term and even in the short term for very high cost institutional and we have to leave it there. We are always short on time. I thank you Becky and thank you Rosenzweig Thanks reached him. Alternatives to the governor's prison plan. That's what a citizen panel picked by assembly

speaker Walter committee have been looking at in recent weeks. Today that panel was in the midst of formalizing recommendations on a state prison plan. UW Madison law professor and former state corrections chief Walter Dickey joins us from the Capitol and here in Milwaukee Richard Cox with the Milwaukee County Sheriff's Department. And on the planning team for the new jail here welcome to both Professor Dickey let me start with you what did you come up with. Do you agree wholeheartedly with the governor's plan and if not what it what was your idea. Well the problem really is this even since the governor's plan came out the projections for the number of new prisoners has increased substantially. And the fact of the matter is the cost of that is just astronomical between now and the end of the decade. All right what are the alternatives. Well the panel concluded that some building was necessary or some acquisition of additional beds in the near run to try and provide some immediate relief. But the panel's chief recommendation is that we ought to adopt a new sentencing form called intermediate sanctions which would be a

combination of Shock Incarceration camp intensive supervision community service restitution when necessary electronic monitoring as a way of having an intensive though shorter duration sentence that would be much more inexpensive and in the committee's view for the community substantially more protection because of the degree of supervision that the offender would be under. So the idea is not just build build build and add more prisons. Well the lesson from other states pretty clearly is you cannot build your way out you know. Michigan tried to do that. And has now reached the point where they have a couple of Prisons they can't even afford to open. Illinois has got two prisons that they've built that they cannot afford to open. And the experience of other states pretty clearly is if you simply build you're going to have the exact same problems at a big expensive system on your hands to boot. Richard COX We're building a brand new jail here in Milwaukee and already it's probably going to be overcrowded as most of the prisons in the state are. What impact will some of

these new ideas and new alternatives have not not only on the state but in particular Milwaukee County given that most of most of the prisoners come from the southeastern part of the state. The correlations of the process that we undertook to plan and build a new jail to what we just did as a committee and looking at the prison systems jails are just like prisons they've been crowded throughout the country. We are experiencing severe crowding within Wisconsin. And at the jail level we provide screening at the front end to make sure only those people that need to be locked up for the protection of the community are locked up. And that's precisely what the committee's direction has been and recommending intermediate sanctions we want to get those people that can be better served outside of a prison bed and to some treatment program into some other type of sanction so that those people that need to be in a prison aren't put OK so take the money that you would use for building and put that into treatment. Is that what I mean and other educational alternatives for you. The people that are committing crimes that need services that aren't

always provided in a prison setting is so let me ask you Professor Dickie are is the message that we're sending here is that we're getting soft on crime is that. Is that accurate. I certainly hope not. Some people would say that sitting in a crowded cell and watching television all day is being soft. We plan to be substantially more demanding on offenders though I really do think one of the questions we have to ask ourselves is if we do want to punish offenders and I think we do can we do it in a way that doesn't also punish ourselves. Let me ask you how much clout is this report your final report going to have given that it was handpicked by Speaker Walter connect. What is the legislature going to listen to this is this is the governor going to listen to this Richard. Well one question I would ask anyone is going to consider the plan is what is the state of the person you want released back into the community. Do you want someone to go to prison and sit for a while and come back worse than they were when they were then what do you want the person is going to respect in the community someone is going to receive treatment. And that's

going to be supervised more closely when they come back in the community making it safer for the citizens. So Professor Dickie is this going to have any meaningful results so when when the legislature looks at your report I only say I certainly hope so. The panel tried to do what they thought was right. And objective way and I think the panel really did a tremendous job. We've done our part and now it is for the political leaders to review the recommendations that we've. Made and make that more sensible policy decisions for the state. All right we will find out what happens with that. Professor Dickey I thank you very much and Richie Cox thank you for the time. Thank you. Thank you as well that's it for this edition of Wisconsin we have a good weekend and a good week. Wisconsin week is made possible in part by a grant from a DNR pipeline company a subsidiary of the coastal corporation. This year marks the beginning of a on our

pipeline company's fifth decade of providing natural gas service to Wisconsin's homes businesses and industries.