Dialog; The Convention Center: No Better Place to Meet

You Dialog is brought to you by Hawaiian Electric Company, people with a powerful commitment. Good evening. Welcome to Dialog. My name is Dan Boylin.

The Hawaii Convention Center costs $350 million to build, contains 200 ,000 square feet of exhibition space, and has at the heart of building open buildings over the next dozen years. It's first large group of convention years. I think it is. 7 ,000 members of the American Federation of State, County and Municipal employees arrive in Honolulu in August 1998. Those public workers will fill 4 ,000 Y .K. key hotel rooms, and that is what the Convention Center is all about, boosting Hawaii's visitor industry. But will its performance match its proponents' promises, or will it become yet another drain on the public treasury? Just as important for Waikiki and downtown residents, will the traffic and the noise it generates unbearably snarled their lives? Every working day, our guests this evening, must struggle with those questions. Dick Walsh is the General Manager of the Hawaii Convention Center. He comes to the islands very recently, in fact, from

California, where he managed the Los Angeles Convention Center for more than 23 years. As its manager, he oversaw an expansion of the LA Convention Center that doubled its size. He is a lawyer by training and former President of the International Association of Assembly Managers. David Carey is the President and Chief Executive Officer of the Outrigger Enterprises Incorporated, the owners of Hawaii's largest hotel chain. Mr. Carey is a member of the Hawaii Visitors and Convention Bureau, the Hawaii Hotel Association, and is the President of the Waikiki Oahu Visitors Association. He too is a lawyer. Sandra Butler -Mirano is the Vice President of Sales for the Hawaii Convention Bureau, and is a certified meeting planner. We'll talk about that, what that is in a moment. She's been in the tourism business for the past 25 years, and comes to us also very recently from the San

Diego area, where she was the Director of Sales and Marketing in the hotel business before becoming Marketing Director for the San Diego Convention Bureau. I didn't say that very well, but Alan Hayashi is the Executive Director of the State Convention Center Authority. Prior to assuming that post, Mr. Hayashi, was the General Manager of Honolulu's Each Power Plant. He is a structural engineer, not a lawyer, who has specialized in highway, heavy industrial, and commercial building construction. Councilmember Duke Bainham currently represents Waikiki on the Honolulu City Council. Prior to his election to the Council in 1994, he championed Waikiki's needs in the State House of Representatives. Duke Bainham is also a physician who works part of the time at the Sex Abuse Treatment Center at the Kapielani Medical Center for Women and Children. Our knowledgeable guests have gathered this evening to answer your

questions about the Convention Center. So please call in your queries to 973 -1000. Neighbor Island residents may call us collect. Again, the number is 973 -1000. Waiting to answer your calls this evening are members of the Oahu Retired Teachers Association. And our sign language interpreter is Loretta McDonald. Mr. Walch, the real question I guess is, do the commodes work? Are the entrance signs in the right places and the exit signs in the right places? Is it really ready to go? We're not used to something being on time in a while. Well, Dan, it came in on time as a matter of fact, a month early and under budget. I think it's ready to go, but we're testing it. We're doing some small meetings. We're bringing people in. We have to test to see if the commodes work, if everything flushes, if you can wash, get water out of the lavatory. And it's to be expected that these kinds of things may not work perfectly. The switch may not turn on the lights immediately. But the contractor is still punching the job out on a construction

job of this type after the work is finished, the actual key ceremony takes place. There's still probably 60 to 90 days work for the contractor to fix the things, where the switch doesn't work, or something doesn't, this circuit isn't functioning, et cetera. So we've got a little time, end of December, probably, first part of January, the contractor should be off the job. You had a little problem with the Hawaiian language. Isn't that the truth? Yes, sir. I found out what an Okino was. Are you working to fix that? Yes, I think Alan can give you a little better answer to it than I can, because he was in a meeting this afternoon, as to, I think, one of the issues, certainly for a neophyte like myself, just coming here to Hawaii is, what is the right symbol and the proper Okina? What's happening, Alan? That was interesting, Dad. We had a meeting this afternoon, and interesting, we had a professor from the university, anti -Pet Bacon, and Momi Kazamero, and a couple other

people, and apparently, in the old, the language is no, no glottal stop, no Okina, so we had an education today. I think the problem came about because we're using a different font, and the font styles, a newer font styles don't have Okina. And so it had to be created, and we're going to fix it. Now, I think we should let people know what our jurisdictions are here and sort of define something. Alan, you are head of the Convention Center Authority, which is a state agency. Which means what? What is the Convention Center Authority do? We charge really with the oversight, the development, the marketing, the operations, and the maintenance of the center, the oversight of all of those activities. Ok. Now, what do

you do, Dick? I'm the manager of the Convention Center, the state hired a private company, SMG, to manage the center, and I am the general manager of the center, and we report to the authority, to the body that Alan is the executive director of. So you're the person on site every day, isn't he? Yes, sir. You're not. You're not. No. Dick is on site. He's handling the building. Now, Sandy, what do you do? Well, the Hawaii Visitors and Convention Bureau is the official marketing sales arm of the center, whereas they operate the building, we sell it. So we're bringing the clients in and we're responsible for the bookings. And this is precisely what you did in San Diego, before coming here. For 15 years. And they've been very successful in San Diego. Yes, they started with no infrastructure there whatsoever, when that center opened and it's a huge success story. And with this beautiful infrastructure, I'm sure that Hawaii's will be a greater success story. David, I know that your company spent a lot of time, over a

lot of years, trying to make this a reality. You've had to go through it and let's finally be honest with Dick, and is it, how did it come out? Well, I think the facility itself is beautiful. It really turned out, I think, actually better than everybody anticipated, given the lack of available space that we had to build a center. So without, it's a nice facility, it's well -designed, it looks good from the outside. Maybe it's a little further away from the middle of Waikiki than we would like, but I think we, with the way it looks and the way it's built inside, that's going to make up for it. Duke, have you seen it? Have you been inside? Yes, beautiful. I don't think the residents, I think everyone can be proud of this building, and once you go inside, it's unbelievably done. I guess the question is a lot of questions that remain for the residents. It may look good, but it will work good. And in particular, we're worried about noise, and certainly traffic. And I think all taxpayers are worried about whether they'll pay for itself, and if so, if not, how much will we have to subsidize it? So I guess those questions can't necessarily be answered

tonight, and they'll take a few of the conventions to get started to really find out the answers, but I must say the level of anxiety in the community remains a little high. Yeah, I think it remains high in the community at large, not just down in Waikiki. Why is there no convention until next August? I mean, if the thing is ready to go, and the keys have been handed over, and the commodes do work, why no convention until the next August? Well, actually, Dan, it's because nobody wants to be first. Nobody wants to come in until somebody else has had a chance to utilize the building. At the time the construction schedule was adopted, I think many people may have believed that as you said earlier, things don't get done on time, and they don't come in under budget. And this one did and has. So we've got sort of a testing period. We're going to do some small, soft events to open the facility, and we'll be ready for the grand opening, which will

be on Kamehameha Day in June of 1998. Sandra, how do you sell? How do you sell a convention center? What do you do? Well, it's an emotional approach, and it's a very factual approach. They have, we do a lot of comparative data with competitive cities. The major concerns of the clients are cost, distance, image, image in that they don't want to be criticized for picking the most luxurious, to most elegant, resort location in the US for their convention, cost, the perceived cost are very, very high. That's the perception, which we have to overcome. And we do that with customer input and involvement in the sales process. We just finished doing, having a group of customers here, and we had our key presenter was Jim Sweeney with the American Dental Association, selling the customers on the success of his convention and why he chose Hawaii for repeated conventions. So there's a lot to overcome

on the image right now, and that's to be expected with the new center. So we sell doing a lot of customer events, a lot of trade shows, direct mail, lots of activity. David, what do you folks expect? What do people in the hotel business expect now? Are you going to take part in this business of selling the convention center? We've got to, and if you think about our business, right now 95 plus percent of our visitors come here vacation and a vacation only. And so we have been excited about the convention center because for the first time you're going to get people who are going to come here for a trip paid for by the business. So in order to sell that, we're going to have to help participate with the convention center operators, the other hotels and say, you know, look at all the things that you can get in Hawaii that you can't get anywhere else and come and have your convention that you could have in any other city. But when you have it here, you're going to have more. And that takes the involvement of the hotels, the transportation people, the

attractions and government. And I think it's going to take us a while to get that model refined where we're all working together in order to really bring the people here and then deliver on the promise that we all expect of having these new customers who also spend a little bit more and stay a little bit longer. So I think we'll get it done. Is it Alan and Duke, I guess, I'm talking about a state and local jurisdiction? Isn't it going to take more money from the state to sell the convention center, state or city? I mean, aren't we creating something that we've got to market? Certainly. And that's the HVB's charge and it's part of the task force that you were talking about earlier. Certainly, there's an awareness of the need for funding. Yeah, the governor's economic task force that go to 63 million a year, right? Currently, they're funded for about 25 million and the proposal is to go upwards to 60. And certainly, that's important to market Hawaii, to be competitive

internationally. So yeah, there's going to be more money needed. But the returns that come from a center like this at Steadys State, which is projected about six years out, we're looking at a tax inflow, just tax only about $200 million annually. By Steadys State, you mean that it only is fully operational? Fully operational. Somebody wants to know, Alan, why was a New Jersey company hired that hired Dick Walsh here to run this place? Why didn't we use local talent? Well, I think the company they're talking about there is the company has been hired to do the grand opening. Dick's company. Oh, I'm sorry. Oh, I'm sorry. I'm just interested in that. Yeah. But Dick's company does come from Philadelphia. They're well -experienced and runs some 25 centers around the country along with the people with the experience base and the

background and what they can bring to the table. Where are all the parking spaces? They're on the second floor. I don't think that's the question. Well, let me try the handle that because Dick has jumped into this and the State made a decision and it was a design team that when we designed this is really for the offshore market. Blaze Dell is really the venue for the local trade shows and consumer shows and so forth. The State funded some $13 million for that expansion. As such, we look at the offshore market and the requirements of most of the delegates are shuttle buses. They'll be either walking or coming by shuttle and Dick can elaborate on that. But we feel comfortable that only for the very large conventions would we have a parking problem. Otherwise, 800 stalls should be adequate. Did you want to add on to that? Yeah, I can add on to that, Dan.

As we were talking earlier, most of the conventioneers will come to the airport. They'll fly in. They'll be bust over to their hotels. They'll be shuttle bust to the facility. They'll walk back to their hotels once they find where they are. And only the people who are involved in those associations locally are going to drive in. In other words, Sandra mentioned the dental associations coming. The Honolulu dentists, local dentists, who are part of the members of that association, they'll drive to the building. But the other people will come in on shuttle bus. Only the exhibitors may rent cars. And they'll drive nice cars. They will drive those cars. We know those guys in the medical business. What were you going to say? Well, I've talked to Alan Dick about this before. I guess one of the flag was kind of raised when the first convention, not the first official one, has to do with the 442nd, which seems to fly directly in the face of what we just heard is that most are market to the mainland or to other countries. So I think that may have raised some eyebrows there. But I was at dinner the other night and people said, I don't give the

hard rock cafe two years before that turns into a parking lot. And I don't know if that's true or not. But I think it's representative of, you know, we're hearing it tonight that no, we won't need parking. But again, I think we really have to get up and running before all those concerns will be put to rest. I mean, I hope you guys are right. But if not, there's no way heck to pay. It's going to be really important to get a good transit solution from Waikiki to make sure that it's easy for the conventioners to get from all of the hotels throughout Waikiki. Now, the good news at Waikiki, we have lots of hotels and proximity. We need to make sure that the solution that we develop gets them there easily, gets them there efficiently. And hopefully not with too many cars. I certainly wouldn't be in favor of that either. You were talking about money earlier and I think you've hit on a very important thing. Throughout this, there's a state convention center. And while the state has certainly put money into the construction, a lot of the problems regarding the traffic, the real burden is falling upon the city and county. And that's upfront costs. And I must say that hopefully the tax revenues will be able to pay it, but

there's always rumors the last couple of years that the state's going to take away part of the tax that goes to the city and county. And we're throwing up our hands and say, hey, we're in the real money crunch. And this is a state convention center. What's the deal? But your argument again is that at some point, if projections work out, it's going to make so much in tax revenue that these kinds of things can be painful. Well, certainly that's the prerogative of the legislature. But I think there'll be adequate inflow coming in and how is distributed is beyond my perfume. You know, and relative to the issue of local versus offshore, the kind of tax we want to reason it's offshore is because we want people to come from other places to bring their money here and then leave the money here. It doesn't help us necessarily to spread the wealth internally. We really want to create and attract new visitors to come and spend their money here. Sandra, someone talking about this same question, San Diego Convention Center is out of town, not in a busy section. Honolulu's is in a very crowded

area, please give your opinion or comments or comparison of this. Well, actually, the San Diego Center is right in the heart of downtown San Diego. And just very much like ours, just slightly to the edge of the center of the downtown area. And it's been very successful. It's bounded on one side by water, like ours is, with the LOI. And it is on at the same very tight footprint for the building. And there were all the same concerns that are being expressed in the community here that there would be traffic, that the residents living right across the street would be bothered by noise. In fact, that center was such an economic catalyst in the community and everybody experienced tremendous profits from it. And the residents were very happy with it. Sandy, I would think that if I were planning a convention, right, and you said Hawaii, I would respond and say, well, I don't know if we should go there. The images were going to go out there, we're

going to play, we're not going to show up at the meetings. And is that a problem? Well, yes, that's a problem. The problem is cost, the problem is the perception, but all of those problems are really able to be overcome, those objections. On the issue of image, there are some organizations where it's not right for them to come here politically. The image is a problem, and that image isn't just for Hawaii, it's for any resort destination. So we don't target those accounts. Where it's cost, we give them competitive data, and actually Hawaii offers among top convention cities a very competitive price package. And as far as concerns on exhibitor cost, we can demonstrate to them that actually those costs are offset by savings in other areas. And so once we're done with the process, which is a little lengthier, because we don't have clients that have had the experience of the center yet. Then we can sell that center very effectively, and we are selling that effectively, and the pace

is picking up. Someone asked, will there be any kind of water taxi service up the alloy to the convention center? Water taxi works well in Miami. I bet I know who called this in. Is there any thought of this? This isn't a bad idea. Well, we have not, this convention center authority has not initiated this, but I've heard that there are possible plans to investigate the use of water taxis. I think the convention center is concerned about the total environment, and one of the things that interact here are the canoeists, and they're very concerned about water taxis on the alloy and displacing the canoes. We wouldn't like to see that happen. That's certainly something that creates this Hawaiian sense of place. That's like those alloy golfers. You can't fight with them. It sounds like such an attractive idea, but if you think about where the alloy canal goes, it actually goes to the

residential areas, up and down the alloy boulevard, and the hotels are actually in the center of Waikiki, and so I think it would be actually hard to execute and make it really work effectively, and get the people where the hotels actually are to the convention center. So as attractive as it sounds, I'm not sure it would help us. The convention center is beautiful, but someone is concerned about the area across from it. What are the plans to improve that area? Well, I think the thing I'm most proud of that's happened the last couple of years, and I got to give Mayor Harrison his administration a great deal of credit, as well as the city council, is to generalize focus to improve Waikiki, not only beauty -wise or amenity -wise, but also the day -to -day activities. I mean, this last couple of years, a lot more plants and trees have been planted. I think the infrastructure is slowly but surely being improved, and I think that we're also trying to tackle the city council some of the tough issues of hand -billing, prostitution, news rack stands, all those things which seem simple, but when you're spending $350

million for a convention center, these small things have to be taken care of too, so it's really going to be a joint effort, but I will give the convention center, it's sort of become a beacon. We know it's coming, and so I think it's trying to accelerate a path that we were already going down. Sort of helps to focus people's direction, I think. Why did the convention - Oh, here it says Alan Hion. Why did the convention center authority replace perfectly good toilets with new toilets with sensors? Well, we haven't come up with a good question. Yeah, we have, they work, but now we feel that certain areas in the convention center, the urinals and such should be fitted with these sensors, and interestingly, we heard the other day that some of the women don't like the autoflush toilets, and so we're rethinking some of that retrofit. But, I think you find them at the airports all over the country, and so certainly there's a place for them. He didn't

speak to toilets, which I don't know why we're talking so much about them, but it's very important, aren't they? You bet. And I must say, I thought one of the best innovation there was the part in the men's and women's bathroom that has this movable divider, so in certain conventions you can expand the women's bathroom to get more stalled out if that was great. We call it gender sensitive, so we can move them back and forth. However, the mainland economy is taking off like a comment. Why is no one booking in Hawaii's convention center? Is it just a white elephant? It's been proclaimed a white elephant already. Are the bookings not as fast as you had expected? Well, the bookings didn't really start until ground was broken, which was just a short 24 months ago. Most of the conventions are booked five years in advance, so that leaves a very narrow market share left to book. But no, the very major conventions are booking, the American, Dental, Orthodonist, the Lions International. We have a great deal, Oracle Application

Users Group, one of the top software companies in the United States has just booked and meeting professionals international, one of the industry shows that all destinations are seeking very competitively, so we're getting very credible bookings. I mean, I don't think it's the stature of the company's booking. I think it's the number of bookings that people raised to me. And it may go back to how the convention center was sold. It was sold on there so many hotel room nights and a very rosy projection. And I think when you look at the EIS that was prepared, I mean, you look at the actual bookings were far behind. That may be because of a lot of factors, but I think that's what's concerning people. Excuse me. I'd like to comment on that just from a past experience. That was in the development of the convention center in California, the same occurred. The EIS was a very rosy picture. And that gave great support to developing that center. However, when you

really looked at it realistically, those numbers were overly optimistic. This center is going to have 20 conventions that's first open year, and that is really a very successful first open year, particularly with just getting started so late in the game. Is that your experience today? 20 is good. 36 is what you'd love to have. That, if you pick New Orleans, a convention city, three conventions a month, 36 a year is great. 20 is tremendous. But let me back up for just a minute to the other issue. I think one of the reasons that the bookings have been slow in the minds of the populace is that for a long time, there was a controversy here. Would there be a convention center? Would it be at the international market place? Where would it be? Would it ever come to pass? And in the industry, a Sandra said, people book far out, and you're not going to gamble on a maybe. Now, the ground is broken. They're going to wait until they really see it happen before the people are going to begin to book the convention. So part of it industry

-wise, they are not going to get in a position where they are booked into a facility that doesn't really come to fruition. Sandra, if I were you, I wouldn't let Dr. Bainham complain until he delivers the AMA convention. The land that the center sits on was oil and gas soaked down. And isn't the state going to be sued for exposure to hazardous waste? Well, when it was a Loha Motors, right? Yeah, it was the old Loha Motors car lot. When we took over the property, we asked for clean bill of health. And the former owner had to guarantee that. We've since had all of the studies done, and the site was declared clean. And so I don't think we've got any problems out there. I spoke to you about this earlier, David. But I wonder what people like Outreger, this is going to change some of your properties, isn't it? I mean, properties that you folks have, I understand hotel people say properties. Who tells that you have

closer to the convention center? Are suddenly going to take on new value, right? Well, they certainly are, and in fact, some that aren't. I mean, it brings a new market to the table. Again, it brings someone who's here for business. For example, when in the last time the bankers were here, all of the restaurants were full during that week. That doesn't happen very often. When the doctors come here, the average rates go up. The activities, the telephone calls increase. So not only will it be, I think, popular for those that are close to the center, but it should change the mix throughout the year. And it also typically helps because some of the best conventions are usually in our traditional off seasons. There are less of the big ones in the summer. There are lots of them in the spring and the fall. And there are times when people don't come. So, you know, we're optimistic about that. Should bring more business people, you know, and there's a side benefit for our airline partners too, because we like to see more people buying first -class tickets so that our air carriers can get a little higher yield. They get a little higher yield. They'll look more favorably on Hawaii as a destination and hopefully

up their capacity. Because if you've been on the west coast, it'll likely be in trying to get a flight. They're pretty full, but it's all fairly low rate customers. If we can get a few of the business guys to come here and pay a little more money, that'll help us. Bingham's doctor, friends. Half of our program is gone, so we must take a short break. But we'll be back with more dialogue about Hawaii's new convention center. With Alan Hayashi, David Carey, Duke Bainham, Sandra Butler, Moreno, and Dick Walsh. A story well told, a mood unbroken, to lift you to another place, and into another life. It's what makes us dramatically different. And if PBS doesn't do

it, who will? What if animals could talk? What would they say? Would they say anything at all? At PBS, we know a silent gesture says more than a thousand words. After all, it's in our nature. Maybe we just need to listen. Creating an oasis in the storm of life. If PBS doesn't do it, who will? Welcome back to our dialogue on Hawaii's convention center. My name is Dan Boylan. And answering dialogue phones this Friday evening are members of the Oahu, retired teachers association. And they're volunteering their time to take your calls at 973 -1000. Dick Walsh, we've got a high unemployment rate in this state. And we have several calls about how and when can one apply for a job at the convention center? And what kind of jobs will be available at the center? Well, there really won't be as many jobs at the center,

Dan, as there will be working in the industry. The decorators, the carpenters, the electricians who will be setting up and taking down the shows. That's where a great deal of the work will be at the center. There really are no job vacancies at the moment. There won't be until the center opens in June. And as you said, the first convention is AFSCME when they come in in August. And so there will be openings at that time. But for event attendance, as we call it, to some crafts people. But not a great many people will be hired. The convention center per se will not have a large staff. What's your guess? How many? Well, we had 155 full time in Los Angeles. And that was a building that was four times the exhibit size of the convention center here. I would say if we're in the 60 to 80 range, that's probably where we'll be. Someone talked about people walking back to their hotels. Are there plans to widen the sidewalks to take care of heavier pedestrian traffic? Yes.

There's been several attempts to fund a bridge over the Alewa Canal. The money that we put in in the city and county last year did have the stipulation that had to be directly parallel to either Kalakawa or the Alamoana bridge. But I think everyone knows that you can now handle that volume of traffic without wider sidewalks. So yes, city and county and the state are looking to do that. I might say Duke has been very helpful in working with us, the CCA and SMG to try to accommodate these problems. I mean, it's telling me, you know, while a lot of people had doubts, you know, whether it was a good or bad thing, but it's definitely there. And we all got to make it work anyway we can't. It's definitely there. Well, you know, I mean, and the pedestrian experience that we can offer in Hawaii is something that you can't do in a lot of centers. In Detroit and the winter, you can't walk outside. And there are very few days here when you can't walk back and forth in Hawaii. Someone's, again, several concerned people concerned about New Jersey getting the contract for the opening, I guess. Is that right? Will the

Convention Center use local people to work there now? Why was that decision that have a New Jersey company do the opening? Maybe I can help. I wasn't involved. And so I inquired the same, I asked the same question. The authority selected a committee of its members to interview and review the bids that came in from firms, party planners, you would call them, who are going to handle the opening. And apparently this New Jersey firm, which had opened, helped the opening planning for Atlantic City, made the best presentation. 80 % of their fee will be spent in Hawaii. They are going to hire subsidiary and or subsidiaries. And they will be the planners. They're kind of the, they're going to organize it. But it will be carried out here by local people. Alan, you want to answer something? Yeah, I think one of the big factors was the experience part. That they'd gone through several of these openings. And one,

lately, the Atlantic City Convention Center. I think that played a big role in the selection of this firm. They're from New Jersey, but I think they understand the sensitivity of the local market and the local customs. In fact, they're planning a canoe parade down the Alawaii, which hasn't happened in some, maybe 30 years. So that should be quite a nice event. And this parade down the Alawaii waterborne. So we're looking forward to creating something for everybody here during that weekend. Please comment on the choice of art for the center. Who selected it? And also, how is it Hawaiian? I haven't seen it. Who selected it? Okay, I'll take that. We had a committee set up. Several people in the art community here. George Ellis from the Academy of Arts. And several others, Momikaze Mero. And

they were very, very instrumental in selecting from a wide array of artists and almost all local artists. Either living here or having been from here and now live on the mainland. It's a difficult choice. Art is something that is a very personal thing and not everybody likes every piece. I think from the comments I've heard that we've got a good cross -section. Some people like some and others like other pieces. So I think we're going to be okay. What do you think, Dave? Well, it's certainly stimulated debate. I think the stats... Well, the statue out front is certainly distinct. And I think that's the one that's been kind of the lightning rod. I kind of like it, but a lot of people don't. Someone says here, why spoil the center with an atrocious, eyesore statue? And I think it's beautiful. You know, last night... I haven't seen it. What's it on? It's a kneeling figure of a Hawaiian male who is a gift of water.

But last night I was at a neighborhood board with Duke and a lady came up to me as I was leaving and usually we get tough questions. She said, you know, I love that statue. It's a wonderful piece. So you've got all of these different perspectives. You know our client, Jim Sweeney from American Dental, said the same when he saw a beautiful statue. Can you have small ones made and give to clients after they have their convention at the center as a gift? And thank you. But I think we've tried to incorporate Hawaiian art. I hope people will come down and see it and judge for themselves. Why should we subsidize the center using the TAT? That's the hotel room tax. Why should we do that, Dan? Well, it's a user pay's idea. In other words, the transient accommodation tax is really paid for by the visitors. And so you turn around and use the money that's brought

from offshore. Turn around and reinvest it in the product in order to make sure that more will come later. And very frankly, I mean, I believe that we will develop a lot more revenues in taxes. And then the associated jobs and other things to help not only pay for that, but to help keep our economy viable here as well. Will they close that rock star cafe before the first group to use the center? I think somebody picked up on your, and it's a rumor that's all around town. Well, it's not related just to the hard rock. I think everyone continues to speculate what's going to happen to the clubs across the street on both sides. And I think certainly if other locations, convention centers, or any example, there are, once you get a convention center of that size, and that means visitors, there's going to be a lot of economic stimulus. And so I think people are a little leery to figure out what's going to go there. But in some instances, it can only improve the area. Because corporations will send people to conventions here, and families might travel with delegates. What kind of activities are being planned for them? Anything?

Yes, each of the organizers, if, for example, the convention organizer is going to come in, get space at the convention center, and get a room block so that he can bring his or her convention in. And then the spousal group, the family members, will be taken to, well, the Arizona Memorial, for example. And they will go to different social events. They'll go to a reception here, a lieu out there. All of that's part of the package that will be offered to the delegates who are coming in to make it more attractive, to bring family members with them. When will we stop having tourism used like a cattle drive, hordes of tourists and buses flooding the aisles? Well, you know, one of the nice things about the convention market is hopefully it brings as much quality as quantity. Typically, a convention customer spends more money per day. They tend to stay a little bit longer, and we believe, and in Hawaii, the history has suggested

that they stay a little bit, or they arrive a little bit early, and stay a little bit later, and go to the neighbor island. And if they come once, and they like the experience, then it makes it easier to get them to come back. Okay, from those airport surveys, it shows that the convention delegate is staying an average of 8 .75 days, yet their programs are lasting 3 .5 or 4 days. So they are doing that historically, those that are coming here for business. They're going to the name of islands or their state. If you look at it from a hotel perspective, for example, if we have somebody who's staying for just four nights, that counts as one person. And then if they have another person staying for four nights, we've got eight room nights. And we have to check them in and check them out. We have to process them on the desk, and we have to find the customer. But if we get one customer to stay eight nights from a hotel's perspective, we're in the same place, and yet there's less pressure on the infrastructure. In fact, I think, isn't there one group that's got the perfect profile? They're going to every one of

the neighbor islands. Yes, the orthodontist. 15 to 18 ,000 orthodontists are coming here in 2003 in May, a low season, one of our valley seasons. And they are going to all the islands. They're having meetings in Oahu, and also on the big island in Maui and Kauai. Bring on the AMA. You're right. We'll solve the economic problems of the state. You know what, when you think about that convention, I wonder how noisy they'll be. I guess I'm trying to work in a noise question. What about the noise? Because that's really what most of the local residents. So you were talking about San Diego earlier. I was there a few months ago. And when you look at the residents in terms of proximity to the San Diego convention center, I mean, there's quite a distance. But when you go up on that rooftop, I mean, you can practically hand a Coca -Cola across the rail to them. I mean, it's quite close. And obviously, as you know, there's been quite a controversy about alcohol being served out there. And I just think this may be an opportunity for us to discuss it. I'm looking at the

possibility, and I've talked to the state, about introducing legislation to try to control the noise and limit it to a certain level and to certain times. But I think a lot of people want to know that that will be handled. Sure. I think Dick is going to be right in the middle of this, but I think certainly that there has to be a sensitivity to quite enjoyment of the neighborhood. And we're going to work toward that with Duke's help and the city, and we'll work toward making sure that there's a period for people to enjoy their homes. Alan, what is the estimated extra tax revenues that will be realized with the center? I think you said 200 million per year if it's running. And what is the cost benefit and analysis of the convention center? Please explain the analysis. Well, if you look at just on a revenue cost base, the debt service and operating costs run roughly $35 to $38 million. So if you've got

$200 million, or even if you want to half that to be conservative, you've still got a big difference that can go to schools or neighborhoods or whatever you want to use it for. And I think that's the economic advantage of a convention center. Plus, it brings large revenues to the state. One convention, the Lions in the year 2000, with some 35 ,000 people. We did a pro forma on that one group. And that brings in $73 million over that eight to ten day period. That's all new money coming into the state. That's more than a pocket full of change. I'm a tax paying resident. Oh, excuse me. There's another point about the convention center in Waikiki that's worth bringing up relative to the tax room. Over the last several years, we've seen a decline, rather serious decline in the first time visitor to Waikiki. And that means people

don't know about Waikiki. Where we see the convention center being able to help is to bring that first time visitor back. Many people may take the chance to come on a convention. And we believe that once they're here and they understand the city experience and all the things to do, that that helps us in the future because there's a whole generation today that really hasn't had the Waikiki experience. I'm a tax paying resident. That's a good question, Dick. I want to know this. Is there any plan to open the center for me? You know, just Joe Blow. But a taxpayer. To have a chance to see it before the center opens, you start bringing in all these orthodontists from New Jersey. Dan, you certainly are going to have a chance to see it as a local resident. During the grand opening ceremonies, there will be open houses, the communities expected, and we want them to walk through and see the facility. I think we've answered this. How does the center help neighbor islands? Well, the center will be referring a lot of business to the neighbor islands. They'll be the reconvened meetings. They'll be pre -imposed convention travel. There will be new exposure for them in

terms of special events like a Miss Universe that can be held in the center. That's broadcast to 70 countries worldwide. There'll be the corporate exhibitors coming in that have never been to Hawaii before, who will then start planning their corporate meetings in Hawaii on the neighbor islands. So there'll be a lot of value to the neighbor islands. And we're also going to have planned within the center a presence for the economic development board. So while it's located here on Oahu, it's really a statewide asset. And the state certainly looks at it that way and promoting it that way. Where is the bus drop -off for conventioneers? Also, where's the drop -off for big containers for big shows? We saw some, but it doesn't seem sufficient. That seems like a pretty congested area to bring in big trucks and stuff, isn't it? Well, the loading dock is on the alloy side. You can't see the loading, the public doesn't see the loading dock at all where the containers will come in. That's at the back

of the exhibit hall, as I say, on the alloy side. They'll come into the loading dock. They will exit out onto Kalakawa. The buses would drop at the Port Co -Share in front of the building. That's where the buses will be dropping. I mean, I think you've had a ball in a real big issue and that's transportation. And, you know, people have been repeatedly saying that there's not enough bus bays. One of the things that I must applaud the groups for in the Convention Center Authority, is at least we're now finally to the stage that they are listening to the residents' concerns and have agreed to do a dry run. My hope is that this will greatly put all our fears to rest. Yes, there is enough bays. They can deliver as many people as are coming to the convention in a timely fashion with minimum disruption to the neighborhood and to the intersection. Because that's an intersection of a lot of people used to get down to. They're going to work. They're going to work in like a kid. Don't you think the Convention Center could turn the economy around overnight if we

turned it into a gambling center? What do you think, David? I don't know. I think the, you know, there's been a lot of talk about gambling. But, you know, gambling is not an overnight solution either. I mean, that's a serious issue that's going to take a lot of community time. And if they're going to do that, it has to be in the right place. And I'm not sure a convention center that close to that level of the residential community, even if it was a good idea and even if the community adopted it, that would be a good place for it. Any thoughts, any other thoughts on this? Can the alawaii bridge be widened? Pedestrians crossing there. They're going to be more of them, apparently. In all likelihood, is there any discussion of this? The, there was an appropriation year before last to widen the bridge. And Duke, maybe you want to, you want to address this? No, I mean, just the city under Department of Transportation Services is moving ahead with that. There are some concerns, I mean, it's quite complicated. It's on the historical register that you have to do quite a bit of permitting.

You have to get the core of engineers. So it's not overnight thing. Clearly, it will not be done for the time we open the convention center. So that's one of my concerns. And unfortunately, it will work against the pedestrian use early on. It may be that, given we'll have to see the demand. And if so, maybe we can expedite this process. We're working constantly with the city. They don't track just out of phone call today. So we're, we're trying to get that done. Someone calls and says the show has loaded, has loaded the panel with people who are doing fluff for the convention center. Yes, it is. What is the percentage of construction workers hired from out of state? Heard many of the state workers that Canadians and others were hired. Was there a large percentage of people from out of state? Very, very few. Out of the 650 or so that were on the site,

I'd say there probably no more than 50 at the very most came from out of state. Primary steel workers, high steel workers, and some of the administrative staff from PCL who are headquartered in Seattle. But other than that, it was almost all exclusively local labor. Discuss whether someone wants to know where the glass will cause excessive heat, all the glass, thus higher air conditioning costs. From what I understand it will not, you have the tempered glass and you have it tinted. And the way the building is laid out with the sun and the way it strikes the building, there should not be a problem with that. Collar would like to compliment and congratulate Mrs. Moreno and Dick Walsh who are from the mainland on their pronunciation of Hawaiian words. That's the last time anyone will ever compliment you on that.

Mahalo. How will the convention center employees offer true Hawaiian experiences for our visitors? Is there any attempt to do that? That's something that the authority wanted to be certain SMG, the company that employs me and the employees that the convention center will do. We've been talking with George Haley to establish a training program for not only the rank and file employee, but for management as well, from the top down to get everybody into the spirit, the Aloha spirit. How much of this is done in the hotel industry? Well, we've used Dr. Haley as an advisor to help us do that, and you know what's really great about living here is the inherent Aloha spirit here is tremendous. And when we started talking about as a hotel company involving the Hawaiian culture in our activities and providing some training, we thought it would be kind of hard to do. But what's amazing is as people are exposed to the elements of Hawaiian culture and have

the opportunity experience for themselves, it's been fantastic. I mean, it's really helpful. So I'm very optimistic that it will be successful here because we have such a wonderful population that lives here. How is the convention center going to affect our environment with tens of thousands using our waters, roads, et cetera. I imagine the environmental impact statement dealt with this? Well, you know, to answer that, we have a limited inventory of hotel rooms and David, we only have so many people here. We've had them filled 90 % many times in the past years. It would be no different. They'll just be conventioneers rather than FIT travelers. But Dan, you raised a good point and someone earlier asked that question, you know, how much longer are we going to depend on tourism? I think the point that Alan's making is when I want to emphasize that as long as we don't build additional hotel rooms, then you know, we will just fill the ones we have. I think the big debate will come if you try to raise the hotel

cap and bring more people here than the smallest stress infrastructure that's already under attack. So I think that will be a debate for another day. But you know, there's some of the buildings that we have in Waikiki were built a long time ago and are in need of renovation. We've got a number of buildings we'd like to fix. Again, to do that right, it may not be able to do it with the existing inventory and that's going to be a hot topic I'm sure going forward. I mean, I think this is just me for interrupting, but I don't think anyone's saying not to replace the ones that we have. I think the point I'm trying to make is we're at that crossroads, do we add additional rooms if you can't fill all the ones that you have now? And I think that's going to be, like David said, a big debate. And further, we're going to move some to the neighbor islands. I mean, some of these people will be moving out to other areas through the hotel, I mean, through the chain. With the convention, as I said earlier, if we can increase the length of stay so that the customer stay longer, that means less transit. And

more people, you know, more people staying longer and that helps. I would say that a quarter of these cards still deal with the parking problem. The discussion of using Alamoana Park was in some of your planning, using the UH Manoa campus for parking places, using Coppillani Community College, is that not correct? I mean, people think that's absurd. Are we going to create a monster here? Well, certainly, this transportation management plan that will be coming out had these sites in its draft. While we are not a local event venue, we're looking at the offshore market primarily. If we do have a large local event, we have to be prepared. These are some of the areas that could take overflow parking. We have since removed the Alamoana Park, but I think that was misunderstood. The use of it is certainly

only going to be used at night. It was qualified by having to be permitted and possibly an EIS prepared. So it was a possible site, probably low probability. It's not just parking. It's the staging area for the buses. If you have a big convention emptying out at a certain time in the afternoon, a lot of these people will want to get on the bus right away and go back to their hotel rooms to get ready for the evening. That's where a lot of these questions come. It's just not the few number of parking spots, 900 versus how many people will be using. But we'll be able to get enough people there on time and then get them back to their hotels at the end without total gridlock. These gentlemen and ladies say yes, the residents still have a question mark. Well, not just the residents, I would say. I mean, everybody who comes into town somewhere, some time or another, every third trip goes through that intersection, it seems to me. It's a very busy understanding. I mean, I'll say again, the Conventionary Authority and the Management team brought in a team from San Francisco

to show how they did it. I think that went part of the way to making people worry less. But I think until we have that dry run, all these fears won't disappear. A question in common. Are there any plans for rerouting traffic to relieve congestion around the centers? It's heard for years about alternate bridges being built across the Alawai. Is there any discussion of that going on? No, I mean, there was at one time, at the last minute last year, the legislature put some money in for a bridge over the Alawai, but it was not determined whether it was going to be a pedestrian or a vehicular bridge, but the governor did not release that. And so that's why in the city funding, when we have talked about the bridge, we put the stipulation that has to be parallel. The other good news is that there were at one point on the traffic management plan, a possibility of routing some of the buses through Hobart Laneary, Cheryl soon put a stop to that of the department

transportation services. So that's one of the big concern is, you'll be rallying all around Alamo on a boulevard and then down Attsicton. Will that hold up these showmen say yes again? Sandra, somebody wants to know several questions, actually. Any chance of having a national and international beauty pageant? Yes. Are we still in the running for this Miss Universe thing? Yeah, we're still in the running. We just had a sight tour the other day with it. With all the female beauty we have in this town, why we have to bring in any more, I don't know. But we're out of time. Many thanks to Sandra Moreno, Duke Bainham, David Carey, Alan Hayashi and Dick Walsh. We appreciate their sharing, their evening with dialogue and with our viewers. Many thanks as well to the good folks from the Oahu Retired Teachers Association, who always print well for volunteering their time. Next week, I'll be back for yet a fourth installment of dialogue series of programs on Hawaii's economy. This time we'll be talking to various critics on the recommendations of Governor Ben Coyotano's economic task force. House Republican leader Quentin Kuwan on the Coa, Tax Foundation Executive Director, Laurel Kalapa, and the League of Women Voters Astrid Monson will be

among them. So if you'd like to contact us by email for that show with any questions, our address is dialogue at kgt .pbs .org. Until then, for all of us at Hawaii Public Television, thank you for watching dialogue. Aloha. Dialogue is brought to you by

Hawaiian Electric Company, People with a Powerful Commitment. Thank you. You're welcome. Thank you. Good job. Thank you.

Thank you.