Inner-View; Interview with Don Rickles

Yeah. Interview with your host troll soup and. Then here we are with Don Rickles welcome. And I would suspect that that's the short US introduction you have a god. Yes. Thanks a lot. When did you get into show business Mr. Adelson. That's about it at night this is a great opportunity for my child because I figured that with this set up into it set me back about five numbers I did. It's nice to be here. I suspect there are some fans here. I don't know but there always are some say and I'd like to know your name please. Alma Cassaday Have you ever seen this rascal perform. Yes I see his shows. I think his wife because I think it's very funny. In what way.

Oh well he's different. Now if you say funny as just as his entrance alone cracks me up with the entrance. Describe the entrance. I mean I know this show. It just reminds me of a scuse me of Paul. Come on you only can sit here. That was a bunch of yes yes yes with you you know the men around him. And I just say you say they funny. If you do have what looks like an armed guard around you. Well I think what the lady said. What is your first name ma'am. I think what Imus said was interesting because my whole life I've always tried to be a little different than the next guy I think in our business. I when you're a comedian or an actor or whatever you do when you're entertaining the public to be a little bit different than the next fellow It makes your life you have a better chance at it and attaining success. You're also open to a great deal of criticism when you're different but

that's the price but you being different I think when you said that I take that as a big compliment because I think that's what it's about being different. That's right. The same as having a distinctive image. Tell us what. You are sure of Soares that people like right the host is annoying. To have a distinctive image correct all of them think you'll run a sly smile. Would you stand up please sir. You know what you have never seen the manager. I want to go I don't know what he did. Right now you're taking a collection. No but I have this I have some tunes I've written and I'm like you know what the distinctiveness people beauty. Thank. God the need for that distinctive image. Well first of all. I think yeah I think Don is right on one more in the sense I think Don is right you know

you have to look for something different there's a time and everybody's career where you have to find some advantage because the identity follows you from the minute you step onto a stage. And if you don't have that if you're just doing you know for the benefit of the I know you've got some young comics or if you're just doing jokes I don't care if you're stealing them or if you're composing them or if you think they're good and not good or vice versa. You're fall into a category where you're just another comic and you don't have an attitude when you step on stage you know when Don steps on stage like all of his peers and his clash and I think the same thing holds true for Shecky and Hackett and all those guys Newhart so they step onstage there's an attitude that people know exactly where they're going and they know exactly what they're going to do. And there are surprises all the way through but they accept that attitude. It's like Jack Benny Jack Benny goes on stage and right away you know who Jack Benny is there's an attitude and atmosphere that surrounds him and it's his direction in life and I think Don has had the

same one all of his life the wrong direction I might remember. It was what it was it always was it all your life. Did it emerge slowly. Was there a time when you said I'm going to try this in chess today. Well yeah when when nobody showed up and it got kind of hectic for me what happened was really I found that I started talking to an audience when I was not very good at telling a joke from as my fact to this day if you say a joke or say I'm not adept to tell a joke but I was very good at talking with people and making fun of a situation. And so out of desperation doing impressions and jokes and what have you I'm not really making it. I started talking to people making fun of all of us and what we're about and suddenly little by little people start to talk about me. And then it became where I started to build a following over many years and down in Florida in a little place holder. God must approve the kid if there's anyone here but I don't want to ride

anyway. Show where. I developed the style because I found that it started to create a little interest. It created a little worried time on my plot because it didn't always come off the way I wanted it to in those days. When you're an unknown it is very tough to have the public accept you. So it took a lot of courage on my part with my mother is backing and telling me not to give up with that style and I stayed with it and stayed with it and everything was relative when I made that $10 or $20 I never thought about I thought that was the most amount of money in the world because I was doing something I really believed it. I never dreamed how successful I'd be but if I had wound up making $100 a week I said I certainly would have been happy because it was something I dedicated myself to when I said I I really feel good about doing it and it had its moments. But as you see it turned out I wound up you're going to go and your mother your mother. Oh yes she was a tremendous influence still is and well there was a sort of a Jewish Patton.

You never she when I got frightened and backed down and said gee I can't I can't do this anymore she said Oh no no no. This is funny you do it. Dad and I are going to stick with you when you do it because in those days I was in the American Academy of Dramatic Arts I start out as an actor and then I was a graduate the American Chemical Dramatic Arts and they keep it kind of quiet L.A. or New York you know New York L.A. was just just really just last few years with Los Angeles. And I went to school with people like Grace Kelly and Jason robots and Tom Poston. We all worked and studied hard but I could never nobody have accepted me as an actor I tried. And that's when I think that that's sarcastic attacking kind of thing happened with me Rick Rubin could well produce is making fun of the shows and people in it and on Broadway it got around and that again gave me some confidence. So it's a it's a thing if as you say some young comedians in the audience you really have to believe in what you do because if you back down an inch you're in trouble.

Are you saying Don that you attempted root A and you saw that it wasn't working but you knew you you wanted to stay in the business therefore you attempted Route B accidentally. I still look at root day I still believe myself as an actor. I haven't done a film in quite some time. So you create an image and you get this tremendous image of this guy that picks on people and makes fun of them and aggressive and insulting so to speak very hard for a producer to cast you because he fears that that image will come across on the screen. And yet I've had now just lately a few offers where they're starting to think of me again as the actor the last big film we did was a picture called Kelly's Heroes which is quite a few years ago with Clint Eastwood but just recently I did Carroll O'Connor had me on the show. He wrote a special show for me about a man that comes to visit he and his friend Alan Melvin who's a marvelous actor. And I I passed away in this picture I got a heart attack of an argument with Taloqan and I in fact I told that to my mother and she said where was the you where. And I said Well Mom See that's what I'm trying to bring out that was an

acting role that I wasn't out there to say. You're a hockey puck or a yo yo or whatever. Yeah. Would you feel comfortable with gone as if you gave up the comedy and you only saw him as an actor or would you sort of demand that he sort of stays a comedian you know I'd like to see him still assaulting people that's why I came here because I want to know how he does and gets away with it. Your name is Max perhaps OK for an example now Max the outfit you have on is wrong. It's like you're not you know that's what I figured I guess whatever is Max when you insult people the word insult is an offensive kind of thing. I've never looked thought of myself as being offensive or cruel to anybody although sometimes they have written about me and I had that in that fashion but it's not so the idea is when you make fun of someone you have to make some fun of someone in the attitude that you would make fun of yourself. In other words when I pick on somebody I'm not out to hurt them I'm picking on all of our weaknesses all of our habits all of what we all think of and never say I'm the guy that goes to the office Christmas party insults the boss and the next day still has his job.

And so it's pretty much not to be hateful and not to destroy anybody but to laugh at all of our all of our little foal bees and all of our little hang ups and that's what I try to do. Do you remember the first time you really took a chance on and in doing that to somebody in an audience. Well the first time of any great recognition would be like Frank Sinatra because I was so large Frank because pommy Florida. Yeah in a place called Mari Franklin's Yeah he came in with the group of people and they were all satin pencil striped suits and they all talked low but. I I didn't ask why didn't. They just like to talk low. And they came in and Frank was marvelous to me and I I started ribbing him and said Frank I have never met you but personally I think the voice is gone it's over for you you know get some day work and Obama don't but whatever. And I made a great deal of the jokes and it's not but the key was that Frank Sinatra responded had he not maybe that wouldn't of been a Don Rickles in the sense that I would attain success because he

was the key guy he and Milton Berle also. It ticked it off to start to pass the word to say there's a guy down at Mary Franklin's that really destroyed me and he's a funny guy and I think that's a lot of luck to you have to have that kind of luck so I was blessed with celebrity starting to come and see me and at that time I only picked primarily on celebrities and made fun of their careers and so forth and that caused a great deal of talk. But you were taking a chance that could have backfired. Oh sure oh sure. But again if you don't take chances and as Pete said you have to be there's a fella sitting in the wings pepper Davis it was that that Tony recent pepper Davis were a comedy team they worked up in Canada when I was up in Canada I was taking a chance I was at the airport all the time the Mounties thought I was a commuter. I walked on the stage and I said to a guy if you're really getting on my nerves you're knowing was big French fellow and Montreal is very French orientated at that time the guys and I didn't think it funny. I'm going to take an axe and break your head. And I went. And I ranted on so that's pretty much it that's taking a chance.

Sure when you were saying you know you used the word insult. Would you like to change that word in view of what he just said. Well I tried it a few times you know but I lost all my friends. That's what I can't understand he is just wonderful I mean the way he says the scribes and frankly his sense of humor and I'm just wondering that all this time if anybody did hit him over the head to be very honest I've had people annoyed. I've never had an incident per say one on one anybody physically because I think it's a damn fool that comes to a show and really can become that angry I've never permitted anyone to become that angry. And there's a thing for all of us whether you be a salesman the gentlemen that's an insurance man my dad was an insurance man two of us to sew and I had a license to sell insurance but I couldn't close the expression is when the guy said I do want a policy it's a fine and I went to the movies. But I must say that you have to really step on the stage and believe. I absolutely believe that you are in control and look somebody right in the eye even if you think that person is not particularly crazy about your human. Because if you don't believe they're not

going to believe. So you have to have it's almost it's almost mesmerizing that person and when the show's over the the say I love them or I can't stand them but it's kind of good in my case because most people that will say I think he's terrific or they'll say Rose I never want to see this man again. And that's what identity is all about. As sure I would love if everybody said you mob us but that's impossible. Nobody can be that mom. Over the years and the experience is there a moment or is there an instant that you can really tell oh this guy's going to react the wrong way. Is there something that is a tip off. Well I it's nothing I rehearse nothing I've planned it something that's it. Within me that I can pretty much look at someone and know how far I can go with them and how far I can get around with them. If they're very susceptible to most anything I want to say and do with them. And it's not something you can go to a dramatic school and learn this this is something if you're a performer you just have to have like a fighter with his fast with his hands you can't teach him to get fast hands they're usually born with fast hands so it's the same with with an actor you just have an

instinct a feeling and that's always been I've always been blessed with that. There's a kind of a status about being quote insulted by a man like this. Right right. Beautiful and I think even the show a show like this is beautiful because you understand a man. You go see the man in some nightclub or something. You just see his act but you don't understand a man and this way you understand a man perfectly. And I like that I I I know that you know like will I owe that to my wife because I married a value. She just plays around the house and says you know that you'll get the laundry you know. You don't know but you know it's so true what the gentleman said we create an image of course I create a character when I go on that stage. I don't say at parties with my friends I don't get around a great deal sure I do. But I mean my basic life if you can't keep your life and your performance separate you could be a very unhappy individual. And I've been blessed with a lovely wife I got married very late in life. I think that was because of my you where I was so busy trying to be funny at parties and trying to be a wise guy in a sense in a in a in a fun way and that people were afraid of me especially the

ladies. That was that was so it's very interesting because you know it's the old story kiss and tell they thought if we went out there he had his big mouth the world woman. They wanted to wrong was. So I had a I had a tough life in the sense of my social being and finding out who I was and what I am and what I do. And I met this lovely woman Barbara who I've been blessed with for 17 years and she taught me a great deal. She taught me who I am. And that's kind of nice. Can home life be really private or you do well when you have two youngsters. It can be difficult at times when you go out in public. People are very kind but you know if you're a celebrity they made you a celebrity and they come up and talk to you sometimes when you possibly don't want to talk. The interesting thing is my my wife well my mother was was very ill a few times. She's 81 years young and she's had her problems with her health. Thank God now she's doing pretty good. But we went down to Florida to see here and it's a funny thing you go into a hospital and I was very uptight about my mother I thought maybe God forbid I would lose it

and my wife and I were in the hall and I walked up and I was standing in the hall and people came up to me and said Do you really know Frank Sinatra. And I had a little party come out of the side of my mouth and over what I'm trying to say is people don't mean to be unkind but you're just public domain and they don't take time out to realize you're in a hospital. You're not there to tap dance to sing a couple of songs but that's part of it for the same reason when I take my children we just we just it took an interesting trip we went to well on the ship. From London I come out of Boston work in Boston we went flew to London my wife and I my two children just us no want to realize just the four of us and I want to ship with it. With about 800 other people Americans from California and it was interesting they will step on the ship and did one of these. What is he doing here. It was like why am I here. They couldn't believe that I was part of them. And the first three nights out it was kind of tough because they came over and started kidding with me or wanted and you know every comedian gets I got to tell you a great joke and I want to tell you that and you got to go along with that and I respect them for that. But after the fourth night out they found out that I went to the bathroom just like they did.

Even when you saw the president and the other president elect. Yeah. Wow it sure i you're still on the spot a little bit right. Yeah I I well I know the man when he was governor so I have the right to make fun but today that being the president of states it's a different position but yet he's the same man and I'm the same father so when I see him if the occasion comes when it's one on one I can say pretty much most anything. But I'm sure when they have the you know the king of Egypt I mean King the prime minister of Egypt at the White House I will be the featured guest. For the Jordanian king there once again because this will be a riot. What the only thing is it will be a real ride. You have a question I'd like to know how much of your material is actually written or is it all improvisation or you know do you sit down and think about the things you're going to say before and just kind of apply them to the river you're talking to.

No I never do. I have never had a writer in my entire life. Not that that makes me any better than anybody else but reason about a writer because nobody can understand what the heck I was talking about. So what I did is over my life I used to just stand on the stage and talk from the lounge days especially in the Sahara where I learned a great deal in all the years I was in the casual lounge where people are booties and appearing and I used to write down a piece of paper anything I said and had tons of paper. And then later on when the tape recorders start to become popular I started to tape things I said and all of a sudden I found I had a beginning a middle and an ending. So anything I do on the stage all happened by accident by just saying it on the stage because in the lounge days when Pete and I started in pepper a day was when we all worked in those days you could be what they call freeform you know they say. Guys make up an hour there's no such thing nobody can make up an hour on the stage you have to have a beginning middle and an ending. Oh sure many things come up at shows where I deviate I might do five minutes of something I never said before. But each time the show changes because I

deal with the people and if the people change I change. So that's what makes my shows different but there's basically a beginning middle and an ending. You can't change that. There's no way. When we come back let's talk about the whole career on television why some of the shows why you did some of the things and why you did not do certain things will be right but you know why. OK. And we're here with Don Rickles. Well thank you. So

much. Television. Television shows any shock you get. Well I have a question about talk shows. Do you ever find that when you're on a talk show host will become competitive with you. Or do they let you just let you have it and go oh no I find and I think Pete can speak to that also I I find when I'm on Merv Griffin Merv is great for me he's a he's a great straight man and he sets you up for a lot of remarks you make and he gives you that dazed look at Johnny Carson his competitor Johnny Carson is a fine comedian in his own right so actually when you hit him with a couple of shots he comes back with me and hits me and I think that's what makes the chemistry kind of fun if you just sat there and let me do anything I wanted I don't think I would be a one way street and I'd never interrupt you at all. Let me interrupt just like you. The problem of interruption the proto problem of the host getting in the way of that is what I just did. How do you how do you handle that

on. You have to go to a lot of shows like this. I mean you know I think most guys that do this kind of work including yourself a professional and they interrupt for a definite purpose nobody just keeps interrupting otherwise a good show would be on for 20 minutes and no act that would show up if you kept interrupting gels. That's how I know that as a professional and ladies are very professional about it then there's never a problem never really. What about some of the people saying that a comedian such as yourself who is so larger than life in terms of energy in terms of presence that how can you possibly be contained within a small screen and therefore television could never be a good medium for you. Well that is a problem. I would say just the offhand of Frank Sinatra's one of the greatest performers in the world. And yet Frank on television. As is bigger than life and sometimes the world doesn't always watch his shows. Andy he's one of our greats because he's so dynamic of Barbra Streisand on television.

Sammy Davis a lot of people that are very powerful in and their personalities in person that small a box to bring down that intensity and that energy sometimes it makes people back up. I don't have the answer to it. I've tried in my shows that I've done to try to self contain myself. To try to play down when I perform when I act because my energy is so strong. So there is a problem to that sometimes. But as you as you realize that something we have no control over. And you know thank goodness for my energy because that is part of making me Don Rickles successful and certainly with Sinatra and I use Frank as an example because he has done such great spectaculars and so forth but I don't know if he's really pleased with the what he would want to do on television because people just aren't all of them. So I think in my case too it has happened where that little box you have to keep it kind of down and into the story so when you have a personality problem in the sense that you have identity. If I walk into a scene and I say what do you say it is trouble with the with the guys they want to

they want to take the truck and pull a bank job. Now four people go in a minute he's going to call a guy a yo yo what's that. Someone is going to call him an idiot you know and the people get that in their mind. And so you have to overcome that. But the same thing when Franco's Come fly with me and he stops singing going to say Hey baby he's going to talk talk about women or kids around to look for a drink. So you get that great image and people are on guard for it and sometimes can't relax and relate to you on the screen. So it works for as well as a guy that absolutely. Now in terms of in terms of a character situation comedy and any you know any shows or some of the shows that you don't like there's jackies and there was an advertising show you write for a while. Right. Are you satisfied with those kind of shows or do you feel like those shows were never really written to let you be the kind of person you want to be. Well that's a two fold answer. I was I was kind of pleased with CPO Shockey. My problem is if you know shocking first of all it's always bad news when something fails and you start to cry and tell the audience hey I didn't get a fair chance and so forth. And she goes truckies case my time

spot was was not the best. That's a very key thing time spot. Besides having the material in CPO Shuckers case I love playing that chief. I had a lot of young people with me who were a brand new actors and so forth and we were looking. Many times I had to carry the show not because they would lack of talent. It was the way it was written. They had a great deal of me and too much of anybody can be kind of heavy on you to do with it week in and week out. And I think that hurt some of our stories but I think when we went off the air we had a twenty six share. Today a twenty six year would be considered a hit. At that time it was kind of shaky and I think with the right time spot on with patients CPO Sharky would have been a hit show. I think the first show I did when I played an advertising gentleman I think they didn't believe me as the advertising gentleman and I believe sometimes that I didn't believe me as the advertising gentleman. But it was well written but again people have to watch and every time I've had an opportunity on television I've always been in the gray area. Hopefully I hope because by the time I'm finished with whatever I'm doing that I'll have another opportunity and maybe make it.

But how many shows really do make it. It's very very very difficult. My dear friend Bob Newhart is a big success because I think is his low key which he always gets upset about when I say that. I his low key you were is so suited for television he's so America and he's so perfect that I think the character he most any character he would play has a very good chance of being a tremendous hit. Again when you have a personality conflict and you come on strong it's very hard for people to relate to you. And hopefully I'll get another opportunity. I don't how many of you on average how many scripts are given to you for consideration. Well I would say that maybe my picture agent gets about maybe three or four in a month and they're not always said I had an opportunity to do Caddyshack. To play the part. Rodney Dangerfield played and I'm happy for Rodney Dangerfield because that was perfect for him to do for me. I think it would have hurt me. It did a great deal for

Rodney Dangerfield. For me it definitely would have hurt me it was too much. First of all I didn't particularly love the movie itself but the part itself with it would be something that people would believe on like it was too much on the nose too much of the loud boisterous Jewish guy at the Country Club and that's the last thing I want to sell in lieu of trying to get to you. Come on over here and Rush. Don my name's Lou Saul and I have a comedy shop at the Tropicana where I would like to get back to CPO Sharky. And you feel that even though it was a good show and I enjoyed watching it that playing CPO Sharky you still had a problem devoid in yourself from the Don Rickles character in the lines that you were using I saw you in the rat race with Tony Curtis. Fact Yes. And I really love. You were very menacing I mean that was a really a heavy part and I know you know what you can do as an actor from seeing that yet with CPO Sharky. I felt that there was a lot of the Don Rickles character coming out in the CPO

Sharky person itself. And even though I mean I wonder how you felt about that whether you felt that was good got in the way of of your portrayal or what. Well I agree with us so although a lot of Don Rickles came out but that character was such an aggressive kind of guy that the idea is when the network bought me for that show they wanted me to be a lot of Don Rickles and sometimes you get caught in the trap of trying to play the character and trying to leave out a lot of Don Rickles But when the writers sit down they say you can say it isn't so profit would bill be believable as CPO shocking. And there is a tendency of that pitfall of calling into the guy what had you not seen me as a comedian on the stage or seen me on talk shows as the aggressive guy. You may never think you may never have thought of me as being the Don Rickles not avoiding myself from the characters you're following so that there is that trap of trying to make the show funnier. Because I sometimes found out as Pete just did before he was a very good people but it was very very funny. Before you went on the air in the

warm up and sometimes Pete did that or I used to do that in my show do the warm up in the warm up turned out to be funnier than the show. So I said that's a problem. So it's very hard to try to keep within the character especially when you're playing an aggressive chief was yelling at young people. So the role was so tailored that it it it it did make me become Don Rickles are a lot like your family. Right right. That's right. And so you went along with it because it was funny and hopefully you hope people don't compare that way now being an actor as you are and a director somebody that you know but you do a little half hour show you don't have much time to get the people laughing you know I love I love people that said me. What is your motivation I said to get the money and get out of here as fast as possible. I mean that doesn't make me a bad actor I get into but I'm not going to sit around and talk about a death scene it's not taken a death really death. I mean at the moment I'll think of something that makes me get down a little bit and think of myself as an actor and think of death but not actually go home and believe there's a death you know. So I don't know. One of your friends of mine pepper pepper Davis.

Thank you. Thank you. When we're talking about acting on television Oh now you two have a very strong personality but you've done a lot of television acting and how does the comedian separate himself in that in that need to be the straight actor. Maybe you have a role. Well with my situation I haven't done it anywhere near as much as Don has done but done. Character is so strong. OK he's identification is so strong with me it's easier I was never that strong I was never that identity than a fight. So I can go in and play a small little part whatever. But when you talk about Don like I love the CPO Sharky I love everything he does. OK because I go back a long time ago and. I just felt that they really. Haven't captured done yet he is so strong. You know what I mean I felt like they're going too much if there is a nightclub personality and feel it so far as more of an acting ability because

he is an excellent actor. He's a super actor and it's true. So that was my feeling of it you know I just and there is a show for him I guarantee it is a show for him. Just get the right writing team. That must be frustrating though because a lot of people a lot of you feel the same way about you know. Oh thank you. And he's you know obviously one of the great problems of trying to you know tag something onto a talent like this you know must be very frustrating for the people who are trying to really have something true. See now we have something exciting. I had an opportunity which that didn't work out because I modeled on his wife Georgie and just pure bias it was losing us in Lake Tahoe and wrote this promise which would have been modeless. But Ricardo was tied up he was picked up he was worried the fantasy island was going to be picked up again and it was and it was going to be a marvelous idea I don't want to tell the idea because it still might happen but it was a mock Ricardo Montalban and I want to chemistry and then I realized the great the great thing about me which which which we're now talking about Ernest Borgnine and I about 12

years ago did ot couple together and we did it we did a very good ot English he's an actor that just looks and getting depressed. Sometimes. We get activated in a regular theater not that Mickey Mouse little thing. Anyway so I sold out last night that six people are on hold as a showroom. And we'll get to you Audrey. So I'm kidding I love art. So anyway what I'm saying is Ernest Borgnine and I hear a universalist come up with an idea. Hopefully we can get it off the ground. The thing I'm saying is earnest in Ernie's up a strong guy and the two of us bouncing off each other makes a balance and as a great great challenge for me and I would love something like that to come about because I think being with learning in a show was most fun when we did odd couple. And he has identity and I have and I think that takes the this the strain off of Don Rickles to carry the whole thing. So it's not only finding the right script but of course obviously doing the right chemistry of the person and not have to be ideal for him.

He likes Ernest Borgnine as a person and would you like somebody as a person. Oh sure certain mold itself together that would be fantastic. If you would see him do one thing what would what would you create for him. Just knowing him as well as to write for you know just like you said you can't write for Don Don just goes out and talks and you know that's his attitude is just just so perfect. I go back a long time with Don 20 and I know the time when he was doing his regular act before he was doing this. Sophie talked Sophie Tucker remember the dramatization of the glass and then with the glass head man with the glass head and it was super. And he did well he really did we worked out of several rooms together. He was hysterical at 3 o'clock in the morning writing about Washington D.C. yelling out the window of my car with a German dialect and putting everybody down on the street like that you know whatever happened to those days you know you went on Don I'm still having fun.

The only time I ever saw him stuck for words was when he got married he came back from the honeymoon at Torrey and I went downtown was coming to town and I had a boat it's like meat at the time and we decided we were going to give Don a honeymoon cruise on Lake Mead. So excuse me I went down early Tony was bringing down a barber down and Tony may she rest in peace. His wife was with us Judy and one of my wives were out of town anyway so I go down to the harbor master the Lake Mead and I rode on cardboards welcome to The Don Rickles honeymoon cruise and I tacked them all up at the lake and I said to the harbor master I know it's a drag for you. Put on a jacket look nice as I bring it Don Rickles now. Now there was one boat on the way out of the slip to where my boat was that was half sunken in the water. It was about a 20 footer and just about was thick enough. Now I'm walking with the cooler and with the chicken and Tony's with the diamonds behind us with Barbara and I stop at this boat and I set a tone. OK put down

a barber on and I'll go and I'll start I will come back and get it and he took one look at the boat that was half sunk now Barbara knew it was a put on. He wasn't too sure but he's not sure he's got a little laugh like a little giggle. That's what I was starting to get that yeah yeah. So that's that's it that's the crew. Oh my good you got your chance now actor. Nothing funny I just want to say this. Coming here today when you mentioned Don Rickles last night Don and I go back an awful lot of years to his first engagement in Las Vegas in the lounge and he was a fat. Burly kid I was had a group a little group alternating with Don Rickles and I can't even remember how many years ago. And after the first show or any show within the first week I tried to watch it all right. Meanwhile glug glug glug glug glug he was going doubles triples anything to get up is no the show was all right sweaty Don it's ok it's ok. But what I actually came here to say

and I'm delighted that you asked me because it's nothing in a comedy but I do want to say to Don and publicly to have worked with him at the very beginning in Nevada at the Casbah theater of the Sahara Hotel many many years ago. He has stayed exactly the same as a human being. And that is the most wonderful part of knowing that I've seen him maybe every year once every two years once every three from the time I saw him last to the present day outside the studio. And I said hello. It's been a good many years. Same done nothing has changed become a superstar from a lounge act. And I just want to say to the public and to the UN it's wonderful know him so wonderful human being and deserves all of this. But. I don't I don't know if you will. I don't know if you know that anger was on the original Broadway Open House and one of the featured in and of course the the lead crazy person with the Kirby stone

for know your name again please I want you to stand up Marie Dressler. Just want to extend a little something that Don said when you're talking in this segment mainly about television and you have to remember that before you start discussing his situation in relationship to television that in all of television and all of California there are six writers who know what they're doing. Everybody else is a lame writer everybody else really stinks and they're very mediocre in terms of right you know when you're talking about Don. And you have the good comics the top comics today you talk about these guys don't know how to write for them they're incapable of writing quality shows you know Bob Newhart is lucky great writers and the whole MTM groups are great writers all along there but most writers what happens is when they write a CPO Sharky they get something good go and then they write the second show and it isn't quite happening at the first read through.

So right away they go right to get done this to get done this and they're just trying to save their lives so they write again for Don Rickles and you can't do that for him to have a success on a sitcom. The writers have to think in terms of who is this it's Don Rickles. He's an actor and he's going to play a part in a sitcom. And we have to create this part and it has to be this. And he's not a guy who's doing put down humor doing jokes. He's playing CPO Sharky and that's a character isn't an OK when we come back let's pick this not coming back that we are going to go I don't know who we are. I don't know who you will be right back I hope so. And here we are back with the guy who's going to rally right

now. Right. Don is here doing my show doesn't you do you agree. I'm sure you'll agree to everything I said. But we made this up when we came in here I agree with your name again this is the door this is the door where Johnny Carson walked through and I'm broke a cigarette. I know the nature of the business is. Is it changing or is there a chance for young comics to hear we have three young comics here. Here's Don who came up through the lounges and all these places all over the country we hear this sometimes becomes a cliche though. There were so many opportunities. But today if you had to start he'd have to start out and auditioned as it were in front of 10 million people on the Johnny Carson Show Is that accurate. Is that the problem you guys are in.

Well my name is Gary Brown Don and I go back 45 50 minutes back and I went on. You know what I was saying before was an inspiration. Sometimes it confuses if I feel like I'm doing what I want to do and everything else. The better you get or the more well-known you get locally in this town the more your personal life seem to fall apart because you keep pushing for one thing and you lose everything. And as long as when you hear that it's OK and it's really not the money you're after. You just want to do it I mean last week I lost my socks and it doesn't. You just keep going after stuff it doesn't matter you just when he says that it's not the money because it isn't the money you're after is the fact you do what you want to do and you don't feel wrong about other people say you have it you're pushing your whole life into this has got to be a second there is no second cause you're not going to be happy working in an office. So that's an inspiration when he says that because it really is what is so it's all about doing what you want to do. So that's the inspiration not to kind of back saying go get it you'll make it big. It's a very cool at the center but I I disagree. I don't think you have to be on Johnny Carson show to make it today I think these young people like Saul has these comedy

workshops more and more all over the country out oh yeah that I mean they're popping up all over places but when I was not going around with pepper and all the heat that it was like the Slate Brothers and there were 14 comedians in line trying to get in there in California a lot of the end of the boulevard and the place sat maybe a hundred twenty five people and you fought for the job and some of the guys that were well-known started to work there. And a young up and coming guys it was very very difficult I came out with what it called its band in the guy the guy with the with the oh god I can't sing his name went like this. No no Ben Bernie I never like this had not when I came out with it I'll talk about him and I came out with a big band and I and I worked in a place called Saudis jazz land in downtown Hollywood and so you've got to get lucky. It's not only is you sacrifice you've got to get a little lucky to be. We hear all the time local here like comics like yourself I came down for Joan Rivers and yourself and rich let it talk about times that can't be repeated. But I get I feel good about it because right now we have like Loo

shopping working a big show where we get to work a big room we have Alan had us in the cast bar lounge for a long time we get to work and we have something now that maybe nobody's achieving extreme success but 10 or 15 years from now when we're when our generation is in the position to take the hold we'll be able to tell somebody where we work at a time when things are bad in the showrooms were I couldn't pay for the entertainer so they put unknowns in a show and we have an opportunity now although we don't realize it but we do have an opportunity it will never get to work again. And someone from here will arise out of that saying I got my experience back in a time when you young guys that are 20 now will never get that term so it is a positive thing that's happened to us even though the business doesn't seem well. Do you feel the same way about you know your time will come soon. I hope so and I started out working in nightclubs and fabulous in any man as Robert Allen and. My whole career has been based on building a nightclub act and I get a little shaky because let's face it especially in this town the nightclub situation in terms of the lounges is pretty bad. And I wonder you know what direction to go. Because having spent you know quite a

few years on my ACT and working for a nightclub situation well how do you feel in terms of you know the coming future do you feel that it's going to go basically television and that's basically the only media left to sell. No I don't think so I think God Engler is as of age and talent buyers will tell you you have to go and I work every possible thing you you can work I mean within reason. Elks Club blues club go to walk in as ations go to an agent like a lot Anglo and say hey the money is not a big problem with me. Any kind of function. The more you appear in my case the more I appear the more confidence I got and the more I realized I had a chance and we didn't have television in those there was no such thing I mean if you got on Ed Sullivan you fired a rocket it was unbelievable you know that was like saying the Almighty in his house you know. So I mean so don't don't feel that you have to be on Johnny Carson on Marv Griffin to make it that's not true. What you have to do is try to appear that and see like a city like Los Vegas forget the lounges for a moment. There are organizations there are functions there is small little

conventions that people that gather that Elks once a week or sometimes you appear for nothing for a benefit try to appear at as many benefits you as you can try to get on don't have to be the Jerry Lewis Telethon any kind of telethon because places like and with California it's not only here but out of the outside of the Lake Tahoe area those small places Sparks I mean you know there's a lot of places. Truckee where you just can't necessarily Las Vegas. So just look for work I haven't got the full answer for you but I think if you really look for work and are willing to appeal most any place within reason I don't say you should appear in some terrible you know place it's a place to go but you're trying to appear you're your name and what it really looks like Gerry Cooney. Yeah. Do you have periods in life when you can't really think of new things you see. I know I have to go on time but I don't feel funny things in my life are going crazy I can really only get into this way it will add to the stores I hang up my T-shirt and can't remember where I hung it up.

So we all have those moments they're all moments just now. Will Osborn that was the name of the band. I went blank for a second. So we all have moments of don't ever feel that you can stand on a stage some night and sing a song that you know 100 years or you've seen it with the Perry Como or Frank Sinatra anybody or comedian and you suddenly go blank. But you have to think on your feet and recover from that and do something to make it funny so all of us have that problem of saying what do I say next. But I forgot she forgot. It's it's perfectly normal. You know you can actually get the microphone. If I could have just one short thing to that and I know Don will understand this and pepper and all the other comics you're right. There's a point in your career where you work a lot this goes back to what Donna saying and I'm really a disciple of that work a lot and don't trap yourself into just working in comedy clubs or comedy showcases because certain people go to those things and the people you see at those things you will not run into at a senior citizen B'nai Brith. That's a completely different group. So don't

try to herself into working to just comedy showcases do what Don said go to Dives everywhere in the country and move geographically too so that you're working to liberals and then conservatives and then the working class and then the professional people. What happens is what the gentleman just said is you ever have those spots as you gain more and more confidence and work more and more places. Those periods in your life will become less than what Don is talking about is forgetting a line or forgetting that the show is 9:30 instead of 9:15 tonight. That's you know negligible. But what happens is when you stand on that stage in front of an audience if you aren't perfectly. They're selling confidence in front of the audience. That's when you go run into small lapses when you say gee I don't feel you know comfort with like a ball player when a guy's. He's got a hitting streak going he's perfectly confident loose at the plate and they say Boy is he seeing the ball well it's just that he's got a streak and he's loose and he's not worried and you know it's when he gets in a slump you see him try and all the new things trying to come out of it. Well when you work a lot and you appear before a lot of different

groups different kinds of people young people old people hip people dumb people square people you build up a confidence so when you walk on stage and like Don he walks on to any stage anywhere. Sure he has the adrenaline going because he loves the business. But he's he knows that he's going to get the audience. He doesn't know the first second or the first but he knows he's going to get him. And so he can think it's when you're on stage and your little uptight that your thinking process is Mr. Charles if I may just say one thing than just mention an answer to some of the young comics about the question of lack of television lack of lounges cetera how does one pushing pushing pushing volley maybe get some recognition. A very good example happened right in this time with a musical group called the Checkmates who appeared at every benefit every school function every augmentation. They never turned on a thing wherever they were asked to go and do something if it was in the backyard for 10 minutes they do it unpack and play by the time they opened. Caesar's

Palace many years ago after doing all of these freebies constantly they were big and within a very short period without benefit of recordings without benefit of television exposure. Nothing they said they became ten thousand dollars a week. Now many years ago that was an awful lot of money and I think that's part of the answer. When Don mentioned that do it all do anything freebies run go out on that stage and work for people. And suddenly the Checkmates became stars. They really did. One of the things we take for granted is that your power of concentration you were alluding to before as you read people on the stage we we as an audience take for granted that the power of concentration that must be intense because you have to be that as Pete was saying boy if you just drop it for one instant you've you've lost a kid. But I trained and I could tell you a whole war story and say I go home at night and study books and it's nothing like that. It's just something that it

happens for me I've never thought I could stand backstage with you and talk about the Dodgers losing the doubleheader and be depressed about that and walk out the stage as if it was going to but without any kind of a time period of just no not really unless unless I have a personal problem let's go off a bit my mother was not well my wife my son didn't feel good at something and then I would walk off to the corner for a few minutes to gather my little my little energies to speak a little bit lost me hello hello and you know what I must say so that's what I pretty much do. I don't it's not something that's planned and never has been with me. The anger you know went the way you just did that you looked around and they were look that's what should be one of my convicted of. Anger. I've heard it said and I've you've heard it said that just below the surface of every comedian is a very angry person. Is that accurate.

I can't speak for every comedian I I know in my beginnings in my struggling years I became angry at times. I know once in a while I can get ticked off at somebody in an audience which the audience won't now but I'll know because they'll be sitting in it with a certain attitude or expression that might annoy me I'm human. But the idea is not to show the audience that you're angry but to show the audience you can be funny with your anger. So I take any anger if I ever have anger and that doesn't happen that often but when it does I convert it into you because you know. What about your anger of you. I know you know well enough to know that bigotry is something that gets you very angry. Yes. And so you deal with this by making a funny attack on it. That's what kind of dealing with that anger you're angry at the bigot or you know I don't I I grew up with a man I can't say I grew up with 20 over 20 years together is pretty much like a brother he's a black man and his name is Harry going and he appears with me on the stage. He travels with me. He lives with me when my wife is not in town. We are brother is black or white we're

really brothers. I never looked upon him as a black man and he never looked upon me as a white man we just look upon each other as two people that love each other. And there comes times when we travel and somebody will say something about a black guy and I'll jump all over them in fun and I get my point across for the same reason if somebody says about my being a Jewish valet he'll jump all over him in his way. So I I don't I'm not a crusader but I'm a guy that is very aware of tolerating people and being kind to people and treat them as they treat you whether it be one Jew to another Jew. And we're very sensitive about the state of Israel and the problems and so forth. But if a guy's a bad Jew is a bad Jew there's no way I'm not going to put him on a pedestal. But I am very aware of people in general. My father was that way. He was the kind of go on I could put his arms around I hope that explains why he's the kind of guy that could put his arms around another man's wife and never be dirty. And you would never think about it twice. And I like to think of myself that way. So I'm very tolerant of people and very aware of people. I think that's important you have to find yourself particularly in the younger days of your career of poking fun at

yourself before anybody else could get around to doing it. Well I'm the kind of guy that lets another comedian top me. I think that's very healthy. As people are brought here today very very funny and very entertaining. Some guys get very up tight about that they say hey I'm the funniest guy here. I think it's a fool that does that. I bet on the Johnny Carson Show when I thought I came up with a little when he came back and just wiped me out I was the first one to laugh. I think that's healthy. I think it keeps your perspective and I think you realize that there are other people in this world that really really can knock you off a pedestal in 20 minutes if you think you're that great. And he questions she gives me a lot of things I think is just natural with Don because you see a lot of this. He was born with a lot of comedians have to go had to learn a lot of things. NaMo salesman I was a salesman all my life. Now nobody ever taught me anything. I went on a road I learned everything myself and it was just natural like Don says he could read people well when I walked up to a customer.

I can tell right away from my experience on a road that you know a customer is going to buy and you don't know a customer is not going to buy is going to fool around. You can try to reach the person so I think that's what down a lot of us lot of us natural right and a lot of its learned ability. You were primarily on the West Coast now do you have any plans to come to some from the New York area. Well I was you know all of them in Monticello really. I was born I used to work up in that part I don't I was not so much of what they call a mountain comedian but I was up there quite a bit. It's up in Congress and have a straw ride in my summer as a young man. My only thoughts of New York is someday to do a play I've been offered a play it is so difficult to do a play to leave. The lucrative career I've made so far and with my home in California and my wife and my children especially in school and their friends to pick up roots that's why it's so difficult to go on location up to do a film but as far as the East is concerned it's very difficult to go to New York because there's not that much to do except a Broadway show and then you have to commit most times to six months and that's a long time it's very hard for my wife and my

kids at this stage in life to travel back and forth. I hope hopefully to God that they'll go to a great college and get their grades up and so I don't so my son don't study football and go to a college and that way we'll be able to travel back and forth and maybe a play in the near future but as far as the East is concerned with the economy it's very very tough now in the U.S. there's not that much. Show wise I was thinking working the hotels or going to Concord enough only in places Oh yes but again not that I would do sure. But the occasion hasn't come up and my schedule is such so far has been that I haven't had to do that that's kind of hectic too because it's packing bags and unpacking bags and you reach a certain position in life where you don't thank God I don't have to punch away that hard. I was up at the Concord many times packed the bag and went on to the NEVILLE e and then went to the Laurel in the pines and then ran over and I had one sock on a one shoe walk and I was running saying Yo yo yo yo dummy I don't know who I was insulting the driver I don't know what was. And it was pretty hectic and hopefully in this stage of my life and career I I don't have to rush to that I certainly am

open to it but right now I'm not looking to do it. It's what they call club dates which are very difficult. What's concerning your children. Do they ever have kids come up to him and say your daddy insults people or do you have your kids ever get any feedback because of the work you do. I was sure that a lot of the kids vote maybe my own son he thinks. Will. Has his whole life as you know to get up and Richard Pryor. He you know he doesn't I don't permit him to sing which is concerts I think he's 12 he's not ready for that but he thinks what surprise a riot and he reminds me of that every day. But what he doesn't know is that his name has been taken out of it well but Dad my daughter she is into soap operas she's 16 and very lovely girl. I call it the Jewish Jackie Onassis and that she's very into Gucci loves life thinks everybody lives as she does. But she's a good child she really is gone.

You forgive me but I have to interrupt and I don't want to but time's up and I quickly thank you for the always out there. Thank you very much. Thank you. How me and the story look and I look it is a long story and it worked. We're talking to Don Rickles

Don Rickles I think you might know him. He is Mr. Walsh is that right. That's right Charles. Thanks a lot and there's going to be a show with Sean and a lot of other people I hope you'll join us.