Speaking of Rochester; 128; Steve Donner

How do you do ladies and gentlemen I'm Barber Conable and the program is speaking of Rochester wherein we try to explore of the past, a the present and the future to the extent we can of this great metropolitan area. Our guest today on the program is Steve Donner, Mr. Sports of Rochester. He a is the President and a CEO of not just of the Rochester Amerc's Rochester Americans, a but also of the Nighthawks and a the Rhinos. A a mixture of sports that we're going to talk about some today and what the future is. Steve, Rochester is a great sports town isn't it? [Steve]It is, it's got a great history. We've had great teams, great players over the years. A And a you know what we've tried to do most recently is just take what's been a great city and with new facilities and a little more energy take it to a new level. [Host] It a doesn't have any major sports here, but it's one of those

places where the support for the a the a lower level teams has been consistently pretty good, hasn't it? [Steve] Yeah, I think I would classify Rochester as probably the best secondary sports market in the country. A Even though we don't have a division 1 sports team in college or major league sports team, I think we have some budding major sports in soccer and lacrosse. A But you know the fans who've followed the Rochester Red Wings and the Amercs like they're major league teams for so many years and now with new facilities you know we have attendance records that you know I think actually rival major league sports right now. [Host] And pretty good teams too. [Steve] Very good teams. [Host]Yes a you started out in hockey. You're a Rochester boy aren't you? [Steve] Rochester born Yeah. You were born in the 19th Ward and you went to Aquinas.[Steve] Hm mm. [Host] And from there you went to Dayton University out in Ohio. Now why did you go there? Well 2 reasons ah. Number 1 I went to play hockey. I was recruited to play hocky. [Host]It was a good hockey team then. [Steve]It was a good hockey team at the time. And a there was an Aquinas pipeline of players that went from Aquinas to

to Dayton at the time it was already 5 players that had played with me here in Rochester who were playing there said great things about the city and the university and the team and a [Host]the word came back this is a good place for you to go huh. [Steve]a natural recruiting system and so I went there and and a spent 4 very enjoyable years there in school. [Host] And you did play hockey all 4 years? [Steve] Played 4 years as a goaltender [Host] as a goaltender [Steve] in varsity yeah and set some freshman records. I went through my freshman year as a undefeated unscored upon goaltender. [Host] Wow [laughs] [Steve]All went downhill from there unfortunately, but a it actually had 4 great years like I say and sort of spawned my interest in hockey moving forward as a career. [Host] But Dayton had a professional hockey team too and you were attracted to that were you? [Steve]Yeah they actually had a team with a lot of tradition called the Dayton Gems. A and if you think people out there were watching think of maybe slap shots that was a type of league that Dayton was in it was like a double-A Hockey League and I remember seeing the movie Slap Shot before I was involved with the Gems saying what a travesty this movie is after being a year in the

league I was like you know what the movie was pretty close to real. So it was a lot of fun and a it allowed me to stay around my schoolmates while sort of entering into the professional sports world. [Host] You entered into the professional sports world in a number of different guises though because it was a small team and they you had to be called out to do things including marketing, is that right?[Steve] Oh right. It was the ultimate experience for a young person trying to get into sports in the span of a 12 month period. You know I went there with all the intentions of being their number 1 goaltender. And I did suit up for 18 of the Dayton Gem games as a goalie. But also during that 12 month period I was a the trainer for 2 weeks when the trainer had mono.[Host laughs] I did color on the play by play broadcast. I was actually the mascot on 5 or 6 different occasions and I had to go out and collect bills because I was one of the bigger people in the office. [Host laughs] So you name it I did it. And a as you're trying to learn about sports what a better way than to do it at the grassroots level. [Host] So you are there for a year then you came back to Rochester again right? [Steve] I came back home. A I was actually the first marketing director in Rochester Americans history. It was a franchise with a lot of tradition but

sports marketing was just coming into its own in hockey at the time and so I was very proud to say I am that I was a very first marketing person marketing director hired by the Amercs in 1979. [Host] Well tell us about your career from then on. A you moved around quite a bit. [Steve]Yeah it's been a whirlwind since then. Stayed with the Amercs until 1982 a when we won the Calder Cup with Mike Keenan as coach. What a thrill that was for me. [Host] How many years was that? That you were [Steve] It was 3 years [Host] 3 years uh huh. [Steve] It culminated culminated my third year. And I can remember a winning the championships, getting the ring and saying you know I'm going to put this in my drawer because I'm going to have a career in the National Hockey League and have all these Stanley Cup rings. [Host laughs] [Steve] Well I went to a work for Buffalo right after we won the Calder Cup. I worked there for 10 years and for the first 9 years they never made it past the first round of playoffs. And so a it really was while I was in Buffalo in developing my skills there I realized that winning a championship on any level is very special and very hard to do. And then um from Buffalo I worked my way up from promotions director all way up to a executive director of marketing and then took on the

the biggest hockey challenge I could ever find a opening a new team down in Florida for the National Hockey League. [Host] Florida doesn't seem like a place for hockey does it?[Steve] Florida and hockey [indistinct] [Host] and yet it's important there. [Steve]Well it was an important step for 2 things. Number 1 it was a first significant step south for the National Hockey League which was looked upon as a Northern League at the time. Number 2 with the success of the team there I think many people thought well if hockey could become successful in Florida, it could be successful just about anywhere. So as I look at all the Southern and Western teams involved in the National Hockey League today I really feel I played a large role for not just Tampa, but for the National Hockey League in opening up the league as a truly national league. [Host] I think you did quite a bit of promotion for the Tampa team didn't didn't you too. You started with a very very poor facilities. [Steve]Well we were in a terrible situation. Ah Tampa did not have a hockey arena of any sort. The first year we played literally in the fairgrounds facility around the cows and in the fairs [Host laughs] and our biggest attendance was during the week of the festival. But when I went down there we had about 1800

season ticket holders. Ah we worked very hard to get that up to about 4 or 5000 our first year. We sold out every game in our first year of operation in a very antiquated facility and it was fun because not having any history you know if you're working in northern market like the Amercs fans have a long tradition. They know how to cheer they know the game. Down in Florida we were starting from scratch and so anything went. We tried every marketing idea possible and had an awful lot of fun sort of you know developing new hockey fans in Florida. [Host] And how many years were you in Tampa? [Steve] Oh I was there 2 years. The second year I was there we moved our operations from a small fairgrounds facility to what was then called the Suncoast Dome. It was built for the White Sox to move down to mostly [indistinct] [Host] They never did [laughs] then there was a big empty dome sitting there built for baseball. And we decided about 70 days before the start of our season to to move our whole operation there and to retrofit the building make it a hockey arena. And a I remember just turning our world upside down, but we did it. Our first crowd we set a record and it's NHL crowd of 28,000 people for a hockey game. It was about 8,000 more than ever had attended

a hockey game and then went on ta do that about 13 times during the course of that season and set all kinds of attendance records in the NHL they will never be broken because it's not a facility big enough anymore. [Host] You must have done an awful lot of promoting for that. [Steve] Oh gosh. I mean we did absolutely everything you can imagine; it was probably the biggest challenge. I probably spent more money in terms of a marketing budget than I've ever worked with in my life. And again a I had more fun and just to see fans turn on to hockey again or to new market for the first time. A renewed my enthusiasm for the game and realized what a great game it was. [Host] Now what brought you back here and and why did you come back? [Steve] Well I had been in the National Hockey League for 12 years: a 10 in Buffalo 2 with Tampa. And there's 2 things that brought me back home number 1. Working in the NHL as long as I did I was always on the revenue generating side of the page business and I saw that no matter how much revenue I was generating that salaries were getting higher and higher, ticket prices were getting higher and higher, advertising prices were getting higher. It was getting difficult for me to look someone in the eye every day and say it's worth it to spend

$60 for a hockey ticket, it's worth it to spend, you know, $100,000 for an advertisement you know on the ice or something along those lines. So I thought number 1 you know my future I felt, you know, I've always enjoyed the fan part of this business and I felt that major league sports was heading in a direction that I didn't want to be part of anymore. Number 2, I was spending an awful lot of time in the office developing you know an organization for for someone else's gain. And it was thousands of miles away from my home, my family. And when you're putting that much time and effort into something you say you know what, why am I doing this. What am I giving back would I not be doing better for my family myself if I did it somewhere where I really cared, somewhere that I could give back maybe in an area like my hometown which turned out to be fantastic. You know where I can put my time and energy into some place that I care about. [Host] hm mm [Steve]And then last, but not necessarily least of all. Florida is a wonderful place to visit. I had 2 young children at the time two daughters who were a 8 and 10 at the time and I just felt that you know down south in Florida is not the environment long term I want them to grow

up in and I have very fond memories of Rochester and thought what a great place to maybe bring my kids back in and plant some roots firmly for the hopefully the last time.[Host] You a came back here and did you immediately become the CEO of of the Amercs? [Steve] I came back really with the thought of buying the team. A we were doing it under a very short timeframe, so we couldn't work out the details of the purchase.[Host] Ah. [Host] Who was the owner then? [Steve] The Buffalo Sabers and the Knox Family [Host] the Knox Family. [Steve] who had purchased the Amercs when I was working for the team in 1981 and it held ownership of the team all the way up until the time I came back and they were in the process a of rebuilding their market trying to build a new arena and rebuilding the Arena at the time. And just just felt that, you know, their core business had to be focused in Buffalo and Rochester which was losing a lot of money although it had been a proud franchise really needed some local ownership and needed someone to give it some love loving tender care and a yet they wanted to put it in the hands of someone they trusted and knew to maintain that bond between Buffalo and Rochester as an affiliate. So when I actually saw Mr. Knox at a meeting in New York City

he said, Geez I've seen you in USA Today and you know ESPN you're getting all these accolades down in Florida you'll never come back. I said you know what I'd love to come back north. And if at any point time you ever thought about doing anything with the Amercs I'd hope you'd let me know within 3 days he called me and said you know what I think we'd like to bring you back home. [Host] You weren't able ta to a buy it outright at that time [Steve] Right. [Host] Provide the private financing for it. But a but you did get into a a longer term deal that eventually brought you to the the management of it. [Steve] It became longer than shorter almost automatically almost immediately, I should say. What happened was I signed a 3-year operations agreement to be president and with an option to purchase the team you know sort of allow us to put together a group locally after 3 years. What happened was just 2 months into my tenure. The Sabers hired a new president Doug Mas as the first working president that wasn't part of ownership in the club's history. He did an analysis of the team operations and their subsidiaries and came to me and said you know what I think we'd like to sell the team right now. Can you put together a group right now--- not 3 years from now but

now. And although it was a a tough timeline to meet it was an opportunity of a lifetime. And so you know we put a group together of 6 local entrepreneurs and businessmen and people who cared about Rochester and sure enough we bought the team. Rochester cares about the Amercs they had a pretty good record a over won a number of championships over the life of the franchise which goes back to 1956 [Steve]Well outside of the National Hockey League. I don't think there's a team that has more history, more pride, more tradition than the Rochester Americans and the love affair they've had with their fans here. [Host] All right now Steve, how did you get from that over into lacrosse and soccer? And that's question's been asked of me about 35,000,000 different times and ways but truthfully a it went sort of like this. We inherited a team with the Amercs although they had great support a really had lost a lot of money over the years. We really felt that a we had to try to bring some new revenue streams to the building to try to help offset the losses of the Amercs had. [Host] What building are you talking about?

War Memorial [Host] the War Memorial. They they actually redesigned the War Memorial some for you didn't they? Yes just most recently we went through a 2 year renovation and we'll get to that --it was a fantastic change for the betterment of our franchise for the future. At the time we were in the old setting a limited revenue streams and I had been successful in introducing lacrosse in Buffalo when I was with the Sabers and I said you know what I know the Rochester market will go bonkers over lacross because there is some history here with the Griffins and the Iroquois years years ago. And although many people thought we were crazy, so while Rochester's a conservative town. They don't like to support new things.Ah We thought well this is a good test to see if something new will work well in Rochester. [Host] Did lacrosse appeal to a different demographic group than the a hockey team? You know hockey had been a very family oriented audience. A we had our demographics were either very young or very old; we had a group of probably 3000 season ticket holders that have been with us for I'd say 15 years plus you know long time

support. [Host] Long enthusiastic fan club. [Steve]Oh exactly. And they've been through 6 championships and many many great players and great teams you know. Ah Lacrosse was a it was a Generation X type of audience that's 18 to 34 male and female; it's sort of like the MTV audience a so was someone totally new coming down to the arena and wasn't at all in really in conflict with our hockey audience and sure enough we introduced the team. We sold out every game in our first year and went to the finals of the league championship and lost; but we went to the finals. And the Night Hawks were born and it really the bubble and the light went off in my head to say you know what, Rochester will support new things if they're the right mix and you promote them properly in the right way. [Host] And then at a later point soccer came along. [Steve] Soccer came along and I think it was the success of the Nighthawks you know and then the the rising success of the Amercs' rejuvenation. That said you know we've got 2 great winter time sports. A there was a lot of talk at the time about a new stadium for the Red Wings. A and you know we made a courtesy call to

Jack Doyle in the county to say you know we are kicking around another franchise possibly a soccer franchise; we're not sure we want to go indoors in the winter time or outdoors in the summertime. Would there ever be any consideration of us using the new facility for soccer, as well as baseball. And they showed immediate support immediate enthusiasm to look at another tenant for Frontier Field. And a you know we decided right then and there with having 2 wintertime sports and only 1 summertime sport. What a great way to balance the Rochester sports scene by possibly introducing another summertime event. [Host] Now let's pause a minute there Steve and look at these sports. Um Is soccer one of the sports of the future for America? [Steve] If you ask our fans and you ask me in the you know the group that we're involved with absolutely yes. Where I think you'd have a mixed answer of yes and no around the country is that soccer has at the grassroots level is growing everywhere. At the youth level [Host] a lot of kids play soccer [Steve] lacrosse lacrosse[Host] their parents don't like them to play football because they get broken

knees and things like that but [Steve]Absolutely the number 1 participation sport in America right now. It just hasn't translated to attendance at sporting events in every market and I think what what's happening [Host] But about the rest of the world loves soccer; [Steve] Oh my gosh it's the number 1 in the world. [Host] it's the the big big deal all over the world, isn't it? [Steve] Number 1 in the world without question. So I think what's going on in our country is that there are parts of the country that are more advanced in soccer and more advanced in, you know, promoting soccer. I think we just happen to be on the front part of the curve which when, you know, you're involved in sports as I am and you look at the vision of the future Rochester is a secondary market. So for us to be involved in a major league sports say as Major League Soccer's developing now you have to get in when the sport is young. Just as Buffalo got in to hockey and football when the NFL was young and the NHL was young if they try to bring a team into Buffalo today the market is too small they couldn't afford it. I look at that for soccer. Soccer is going to grow in this country it's planning itself.

[Host] Well now there's another thing another factor here. There are lots of immigrants in this country and they all bring their love of soccer with them when they come and they are bound to affect the people that they they come in contact with here. [Steve] No question. And we've got a great mix if you go out to a Rhinos' game the demographic audience is probably the widest and most interesting group of people you'll ever see in an event. We have soccer moms in our kids. We have any type of you know ethnic audience that you want to put your arms around we have Italian sections and you know Polish sections and you know [Host] So you can you [Steve] Actually [Host] Actually exploit this this immigrant interest in soccer [Steve] Absolutely, you know the Italian clubs of Rochester, for example, they buy [Host] Great [Steve] tickets in clumps of 100, 150, 200 at a time and you know they come out in huge groups every single game. And it's just been a unique experience for us to get a different taste of a different fan base. [Host] Is there any chance of moving soccer up into a major league sport? [Steve] Well that's the quest we're in the middle of right now.

I'd say [Host] You have to have a commitment to a you buy the franchise isn't that right ? [Steve] Right [Host] You have to have a commitment to a certain size stadium. That's correct [Host] and that's where the problem comes. [Steve]That's the challenge right now. [Host] To get the financing? [Steve] Yes. [Host] And a and a you probably will have to do it largely privately. [Steve] That's correct. [Host] And but but you can finance it through a concessions and things of that sort that you couldn't do it Frontier Field for instance. [Steve] the right back were in the middle of a feasibility study right now where were trying to see just how much that we can finance privately of a new facility. And a based on the numbers that we've hired like[?] Mesa to do for us for a nationally known firm that analyzes these opportunities in sports; we've come to a conclusion that at the moment we can at least subsidize a about 21 to 22 million dollars on a new stadium on our own [Host] Hm mm. [Steve] without any public financing of any sort. The projects [Host] So that's a possibility for the future here. [Steve] A very distinct possibility. And what's nice about our situation. That oftentimes when you're speculating a new stadium you try to plug in numbers that you think you can draw to help your equation

work. Well, we're just taking the numbers that we're drawing currently. Both attendance and advertising plugging it into a new stadium and the numbers are already working for us quite well. [Host] You fill Frontier Field don't you when you have a soccer game there? [Steve]Well the capacity for soccer is about 11,800. Last year we are averaging 11,500 And so you know we are about as jammed as you're going to get in the facility every single game and it has been a wonderful experience. I truly believe if you recall at all. The first year we introduced the Rhinos that was the year the stadium was built. The Red Wings decided to stay away from the stadium because it was going to be open in mid-July and they wanted to wait till the following year. You know, to have a full year in the stadium for their operations and we decided to give it a try and go in in mid-July I think backhandedly was by the biggest single marketing, you know. Now I won't say gimmick, but the marketing tool that really launched the soccer team successfully because we had a half of a summer of a brand new stadium all to ourselves. [Host]Let me ask you the basic question here. Is Rochester ah

in the league with major sports centers, um, for instance, Buffalo has has a some top teams, the Bills, for instance. Buffalo is a bigger city than Rochester, but Rochester has a tremendous metropolitan area [Steve] Correct. [Host] and we can draw from Syracuse and Buffalo can't we? [Steve] Hm mm. [Host]So so it should be possible for major sports to come here, shouldn't it?[Steve] Well. Well you know when you take a the great support we have a here history of here in Rochester all by itself. Then you combine ah the outlying support of Buffalo and Syracuse into the mix. Number 1 as market size, say in Major League Soccer we shoot up to number 5 or 6 out of 12 teams as a market size. TV households same thing. And I think ah, you know, this could be a Rochester's niche. I mean, we never will have an NFL team because Buffalo, the Bills are our ball team. [Host] Yes. [Steve] You know, NHL has a very strict geographic, you know, boundaries as to where a team around another team can be. So we're we're you know we're very happy with the Amercs we're a very successful hockey team. And we'll never have an NHL hockey

team. Soccer, you know, I believe is Rochester's niche. It's a sport for everyone. You don't have to ah, you know, You know you know you don't have to come from a certain background, a certain neighborhood to like soccer I think that's our niche. [Host] But it's also a sport that's growing and going to become increasingly popular in this country it is often always easier to get in on the ground floor, isn't it? [Steve] It is and and when you're a secondary market you have to get in on a ground floor. I mean imagine Green Bay Buffalo and any of the small market teams: Kansas City trying to get an NFL franchise today. That's why we feel we're going to take our best swing right now to put us into the major leagues in soccer because we don't do it now, 10 years from now when the sport really grows ah it's probably gonna out grow the city. [Host] And I suppose there's some chance of ah public support a from the a a state or or other other governments in the way of awards that help you to supplement your [Indistinct]. [Steve] Well certainly there's no guarantee but I do believe the fact that we have come forward and have offered to invest you know at least 20 million dollars into the project and this is probably going to be about 30 million dollar project.

I think that enhances our chances greatly. A on top of that we're going to have to [Host] [?]Self-help[?]Sales[?] help usually impresses politicians. [Laughs] Well, you know. the first thing to ask, what's your own commitment and I think we can show a very strong commitment to the community in a long term commitment. You know, for soccer here in Rochester and I do believe with the support we receive with the national attention that comes along with you know the national TV contracts and we had the national women's team in here a year ago. There's an awful lot of reasons why a public support for stadium, you know, would enhance Rochester and the quality of life here. So I feel pretty confident about it. [Host] Is there anything else that's on the horizon that that you could think of or is this pretty much it? [Steve] Well, I will tell you. [Host]Are are you going to control all the sports in this area [Steve laughs] that's totally interesting question. [Steve] I've been waiting for someone to step up and a help me here a little bit, a you know I've really enjoyed the contributions I'm making. You know I certainly feel that our group is maximizing our potential right now and we don't want to take on too much where we can't do things properly. Very very happy with the mix we have. I think our goal with a new stadium and Major League Soccer is a big one for us and our community. Beyond that, you

know, I've learned never to say never. And I You know you never know when an opportunity comes along [Host] But you have to acknowledge also the need to focus.[Steve] That's right. That's right, [Host] I understand. [Steve] That's right and I think if we're able to get the stadium done and bring Major League Soccer here I I believe our work for the moment is done and we can really focus on something special and a great mix of teams both from a major league level. And again, you know, when I grew-up and and watched the Rochester Red Wings, the Rochester Americans you couldn't convince me they weren't major league. I mean the media, the fans, support the team like anything. [Host] And the quality [Steve] And the [Steve] Quality [Host] And the playing. [Steve] has been there for so many years. [Host] You wouldn't have developed the devotion of the sports fans in this area if you hadn't played well. [Steve] That's that's correct, that's correct, and and conversely the thing I like about the mix we have for our sports in Rochester, including Major League Soccer. Is that, you know, all of our sports are affordable, the tickets are affordable. The advertising is affordable, you know. I believe that what we have going in this special niche we have in Rochester is sports the way they were intended. High level very competitive teams, you know, very loyal support.

At the same time, you know, you won't break the bank trying to bring your family out to one of our games. [Host] Well, obviously Steve you have a very interesting and important future here in sports in Rochester. We certainly wish you well and hope you'll continue with that enthusiasm you've shown even on this program. [Steve] Thanks. [Host] for the work that that that faces you. A and I think Rochester a a being the traditional city it is with a deep and abiding loyalties of one sort or another will come forward if if you give it the opportunity. A ladies and gentlemen our guest ah today has been Steve Donner, the a CEO of 3 of Rochester's sports teams. A he's a a brought the enthusiasm of the organizing ability of a absolutely devoted sportsman himself to our city and it helped enrich our traditions. Thank you. [Background music] very much for being with us on our program. Ladies and gentlemen this has been "Speaking of Rochester". I'm Barber

Conable, thank you for listening. [Music] If you'd like a copy of this program send $19.95 to WXXI Post Office Box 21 Rochester, New York 1 4 6 0 1.