In and About New York State History; 109; Pioneer Days in Adams

[Music Prelude] [Music Prelude]. The concept of Pioneer Days is very very exciting. This is the second week of Pioneer Days in Adams, New York. work here at the Historical Association building and I'm talking with the president of the Historical Assoc. of South Jeff, his name is Morris Hiram.And we're pleased to be here and glad that you're able to be here to allow us to walk around and enjoy this. [Guest]Thank you. [Host]Yea the idea is a the museum is providing a time for school children.And ah Time for them to get their hands on some things here. [Guest]:That's right. [Host]:So we have some things here we could spend hours out in of this part of the museum.Wherethis's the organ,for example from the Adam's Center Church. It's been used over 70 years and it represents some of the other artifacts that you have have in the museum here. [Guest]:Very true. [Host]:Including something about the I've heard about a Tyler coverlet.

[Guest]: Yes. We have a very extensive collection of coverlets in the museum. We also have a ah painting on the wall that shows the original house ah where these were made in the 1830s, 40s and 50s. uh This booklet here represents the (unintelligible) as well as one other that was made in the north country. One of the artifacts we're becoming famous for really who started this concept. [Guest]: Mary Ellen Bonano One of our workers in 1979 ah started days from reading in the state recommends before it became mandated for the ah fourth grade level to have local education in the schools. We had already had three successful years of Pioneer Days. [Host]: umhm So we has something a little different today we have 3rd and 4th grade level youngsters The 3rd and 4th grade the Henderson School being 3rd and the Valvo School here today is the 4th

grade level. [Host]: And you've been President of the Historical Assoc. some 4 years now. [Guest]: Since the spring of 1980. [Host]: And so you've ah I'm sure. [Guest]:Very much so very much so. [Host]: The nice thing about it the kids get a chance to do things and touch things. Everything that they do in every department they have pottery they make a ah rope jar. Every department we have as we'll see later. [Host]: hm hem. [Talking over each other].And but but I think certainly.[Host]: Even to a 1 room school house. [Guest]:That's true..[Host]:Yeah great. You have 3 buildings really the Historic Association building here right on Church St. and Adams that was behind of the [Guest]: The Fraser Brothers Machine Shop.[Host]:They're making butter I understand down that way. [Guest]:They're making butter and corn meal bread and also the pottery ware.[Host]: So there's losts of things to see and do. That's right. [Host]: 1of the things I'd like to do right now. I know you have a Richardson. [Guest]:That's very true. [Host]:A fascinating man. [Guest]:Yes

that's right.Wonderful historian. [Host]:What I'd like to do is ask Harvey to explain some of the old artifacts he's so familiar with. [Guest]:Yes. [Host]: That's in the basement where we are now. [Guest]:That's right. [Host]: I'd like to begin there. Very good. [Harvey] This is what they call the buzz saw. And years ago when I was a small kid we had to make our own toys and this is what they called a buzz saw.[Other voice]:All right. I make it go. [Laughter]. [Unintelligible]. Well you see it takes quite a bit of practice. Now the reason that I'm

showing this to kids is because you may take this home. Or you Or not this one, but you when you go home you can make one yourself and it's more satisfying to make your own toys. Just buy something that doesn't mean anything only make a noise. [Host]: Harvey Richardson is has seen 80 summers, is that correct? [Harvey]: Yes, that's right. That's right. And you're retired from the Coast Guard, I've learned. [Harvey]:Yes. [Host]:Because I asked you if you perhaps were a farmer or a lumber jack. type and you spent time in the service, the Coast Guard. [Harvey]: And I enlisted but. But I have been around a lot and I have learned a lot of things in these things that I have learned I've read. And as items I have done on such things as snail [?] track is one. And I have also diary copied. And it's in the museum. And it was of a Civil War boy that went from here. He went from Morris and he came back. And the sad part

the poor man went crazy. I see. Something about Harvey Richardson now the fact that you've lived with these things you've known these things you know these things use them over the years. Now you're able to pass this knowledge to these young people. [Guest]: That's right. [Host]: And they all seem to enjoy it. And you do too.[Guest]:That's right I like to do it. It's better than rocking. [Host]: It certainly is. We've talked about for example we have some children's toys.You talked about Ice Harvesting and that's fascinating. I said that I was when I was a kid I used to quit school every January. Long enough to help fill ice houses it's how come some experience.[laughs] And that's why it took me 6 years to go through high school. I never made it in the winter.[Host]: Right. For example that the housewife has to put up with and talking about that ringer there you warned the youngsters about that ringer. And there's a reason for that. You say you got your fingers caught in it one time.

[Guest]: Learn. But today it's gonna to be a disaster. With all this old equipement. Where it's open cogs; it's against the law to market Just the thing. So I always tell 'em that. And I hope it keeps 'em from a lot of pain. [Host]:One time. [Guest]: Yes oh yes I remember that from being a child. [Host]: Yeah yeah yeah. There's nothing secret in those days. [Laughter]. It's good talking with ya. I'm glad that you're part of this museum and I understand this very successful. [Guest]: That's right. Yes, well we have other days. I I'll make an appointment with anybody who wants to bring a group of kids in any time. And if they tell me ahead of time I'll make a program of just great Harvey. Yeah and you so you expect other youngsters throughout the day. This is only the early part

So before nightfall you'll have several groups of people in here.[Harvey]: Yeah oh yeah. Thank you very much Harvey. heard the same thing, you talk into one everybody else could hear this. Each one had a combination of rings. You called it. There was their number. Now this story his name I guess was Johnny and the girl's name was Mary. They lived about 5 miles apart. So Mary's ring was 2 shorts and 1 long. 2 shorts would be like this. [Rings]. And the long would be like that. [Rings]. Well everybody on that line would hear that ring and they'd know that that was Mary. And they'd run Take down the receiver. And they would listen.

And you know everybody on that line could hear that lover talk. [Host]: It was was kind of fun to attend an old one room schoolhouse with several grades in one room and one teacher for all. And the atheletic part of it was people let out at lunchtime and playing outside on the lawn and throwing a ball or whatever. But it was fun. We're learning something today. In the grange hall where a one room schoolhouse has been simulated. Let's listen. For 3 years and ah near the village of Remson, New York. [Host]: So this is very familiar to you. [Teacher]: Yes I had about 16 children the first year. One through six [Host]: One thing I wanted to know, would anyone ever bring you an apple for the teacher?

teacher? [Teacher]: Oh certainly. [Laughter] [Host]: What was that supposed to mean? [Teacher]: That meant would have a good day.[laughter]. [Host]: A little bribery maybe. [Teacher]: Maybe. You were talking about quills. I don't know if you're students used quills like this?[Teacher]: No these These were longer ago than ah when I was teaching. We had a wooden pen but we dipped it in the ink. Right. Right. [Host]: And when it was used up you sharpened it or threw it away. [Teacher]: We sharpened it again and again you know. And then They could be 3 years [unintelligible] and went on to college. The country school [Host]: Teacher. [Teacher]: I sure did. I had the same elementary

grades. [Host]: And what was her name? [Teacher]: Her name was Mrs. Williams,she used to live at Lauville [?] But of course, she passed away.[Host]: I would suggest she had a great influence on your life.[Teacher]: She did. She was the reason for my becoming a teacher. She was so kind and understanding that that I said when I grow up I'm going to be a teacher too. She made it very understanding. I mean it was interesting for us. Because we were all ages. And that's country school. So I was thinking maybe one of your pupils also went on to teaching.[Laughs]. Yes. I've had ah some of my ah former pupils who are now ah teaching. Teachers. [Host]: My thought is we had a large hill near our country school. And we

We did alot of skiing in the winter --every recess we could have a if we behaved ourselves. [Host]: Sounds like a healthy normal bunch of kids. [Teacher]: Yes they were. Thank you Ms. Krau. Jennifer Hayes. To cook and make things, learn about wood. [Host]: That's great.What did she what did you ask her? You asked her a question didn't ya? What did you ask her? [Pupil]: I asked her what would happen happen if children children didn't mind. [Host]: What did she say? Kids got home at night the parents will um just make 'em behave. [Host]: You never misbehaved, did ya?[Pupil]: Well a couple times. [Host]: We're talking with Belleville students; you arrived here this morning and will stay till 2 or 3 this afternoon. Right? [Pupil]: Yes.

This is Christine Dickinson. [Pupil]:No Jennifer Dickinson? [Host]: Why did I say that? Your name is Jennifer Dickinson. It says so right on your button there. There right. You having a good time? [Pupil]: Yes I am. [Host]:Are you learning anything? Something about. [Host]: [unintelligible] about old things you think you've heard about about? [Pupil]: Yes I've always wanted to see the school house I heard about a long time ago. [Host]: That's where we are now. The one room schoolhouse, but it had a lot of grades all together. [Pupil]:Yeah. [Host]:Yeah right. Are you Are you in fourth grade? [Pupil]: Yes. [Host]: Ok and David is here with us too. David, how're you doing? You enjoying the day too? day? [Pupil]: Yes, it's fun.

You get to make a rope jar? [David]: Uh ha. Okay, that's fine. Well I'm glad you came. What'd you bring for us today? [David]: Pizza, a sandwich, and pickled beets. Sounds pretty good. I like that. Yeah. You live in Adams or just outside or where.[David]: I live in Woodville. [Host]: Woodville, that's right near by. Thank you David. What's your last name David? [David]: Simmons.[Host]: David. David Simmons thank you. And this is the group from Henderson School. Right. [Pupil]: um hm. [Host]: Now what is your name? [Pupil]: Rachel. [Pupil]: Rachel [Host]: Rachel what? [Rachel]: Rachel Briggs. [Host]: Rachel Briggs is it? Very very good. Are you You enjoying the day? [Rachel]: Yeah. [Host] You're in 3rd grade. These are 4th graders in Belleville. You're in 3rd grade right?[Rachel]: Right. [Host]:Yeah. Yeah. What do you like so far what do you like so far that you've seen? That's in the back of this one room schoolhouse where we are now you are all having lunch and we're in the Grange Building.Right.[Rachel] Right.[Host]: Who are some of your classmates here now. [Kelly] Who is it? Kelly? How do you spell that? [Kelly]: K-e-l-l-y. [Host]: That certainly sounds like that alright.

[Rachel]: Kelly. [Host]: OK you having a good time Kelly? [Kelly]: Yeah. [Host]: What do you like best so far? [Kelly]: Weaving. Weaving too eh? Yeah, anybody like lunch best? Not this man. [laughs]. There's a couple Jason is that his name? [Other voice]:Yeah.[Host]: What do you like best Jason? Here you like it here? [Jason]: [unintelligible]. Over there. [Host]: That's the dying where they're doing their own dying. dying in the kitchen. Well we'll get a chance to see that. Ok the folks from Henderson thank you very much. This is Lila Bull and we're Doing some dying in the kitchen here at the Grange building and ah what from the materials are using? Uh I'm using little gold swatches [Host] OK we can hold that up like this. [Guest] That's after it's dyed. This is yellow is it, now would you consider it tan or yellow? [Guest]:You never get it's it's a tan. [Host]: Tan all right. And you have some sumac cooking in the kettle. [Guest]: I do have some sumac here in the kettle and you of onion skin over here right. It's interesting that you got two colors from

red and yellow, that right? [Guest]: A whole range of them. [Host]: If we can can ah pull these up here then um this is the yellow what appears to be and this is again dyed from onion skin. [Guest]: Those are onion skin, right. [Host]:Right now this says a little red that's also [Guest]: Rusty red. [Host]: from onion skin. [Guest]: Right. [Host]: So when they had to dye something in those days they had to go they couldn't go to the store they had to obviously get something like sumac or onion skin to dye with. [Guest]: Ah mostly they used vegetable things things. But for a good red they had to buy it and I don't know cottontail is the only thing I know of that gives a real good red. [Host]: How about beets? through fugitive. [laughs]. It doesn't last, but it does give a nice color if you can find the right mordent. [Host]: It seems like all the things they made yarn or what not was very colorful. So they found something that worked. [Guest]: They found something, right. Ah blue indigo. But they had to import it here. They couldn't raise Indigo here.

At least I don't think you could.[Laughs]. [Host]: Probably not. [Guest]: It grows from Virginia's but so far as I know we can't grow it here. [Host]: Ah what are the colors now? Is that about it or [Guest]: That's all I'm doing. [Host]: That's all you're doing right here. [Guest]: Yeah. [Host]: OK You want to step back over here again near the stove there so we can show the folks here what we have here. [Guest]:This one is a. weed. It's called cow parsnip. Ten years ago they were having a big thing about this in Watertown they couldn't find out what it is. The blossom is 14 -15 inches across. And it it's a noxious weed, but it does make a nice yellow dye. What do the youngsters say when they hear about creating these dyes by cooking on the stove. Always strange things, [Guest]: Um. [Host]: What questions do they ask? How does he do it? How did they do it? [Host]: So they do they want to stir a little bit?Do they? Ah Well I try to keep away from that because it is it is boiling. It should be simmering.

This is just about simmering, ah but it shouldn't be boiling for wool. Now the other fibers except silk it's ok to boil, but silk and wool it should only simmer. [Host]: OK thank you Mrs. [unintelligible] appreciate it. This is Helen Chatterdon and I enjoy your costume very much. What period would this be? Revolutionary War I would think. [Host]: And they were tying off close again for sure. I mean my husband has one that I made him too. At the same kind. [Host]: Things like this. [voices talking over]. Right. You're a very good with thread and needle then. [Guest] Well. Not too good but I do it anyhow. [Host]: You do very well. These quilts are products of some people here who you know. [Guest]: They aren't all mine. I don't know who made them all. Becky Ellis made this one. [Host]: All very attractive. Trying to tying off the quilt. That's you're doing over here right? Yes you either tie it or you um quilt it. This is quilting see. [Host]: I see.

See. How do the youngsters react to this sort of thing? [Guest]: Oh they love to do it; ah one group from Henderson last year went back and um made a wall hanging hanging. With all piecework, very pretty. Do the boys think this is sissy to do that? [Guest]: No they know. like it just as well as the girls do. [Host]: That's great. I'd say it's a different situation today isn't it? Yes. [Host]: the dolls the dolls that the girls play with, etc.. kind of got blended together today.[laughs] I think they do. [Host]: The boys playing with G.I. Joe, but they are tying off quilts that's fascinating this is the finished product when you tie it off. Yes yes. Then when we tie the 3 we tie the 3 pieces together you see there's three pieces is a lining and a top and then a filling. Now today we use um polyester they used to use wool bats things like that to make the tops where we it's more of an art today and they buy the clothe to make them.

This is on a frame now is it? [Guest]: Yes this is on a frame.Em hem. [Host]: That as I understand it it's get a bunch of ladies together and thye'd all tie off the quilt. [Guest]: They still do in places. It's called quilting bee. [Guest]: Yep um hm. [Host]: So they all help each other really and they all make a quilt they go in each other's homes and tie it off. [Guest]:We have a small one in our Community that sometimes we help each other. [Laughter] [Host]: That's good. How do you enjoy the museum in this kind of like a working or living museum. [Guest]: I like it very much. [Host]: Are you a native of Adams? I live in Mansville. [Host]: So that's not far away. [Guest]: No. All right in this. I was right in Jefferson County lower Jefferson County. [Host]:That's good. Thank you Helen for talking with me. Dorothy Thomas. was in charge of the weaving up here in the 2nd floor and were fascinated by what's going on here. [Dorothy]: Well thank you. [Host]: What are some of the questions the youngsters asked? Well they don't understand anything about where any of this comes from the you know they don't know about the threads and how they are made and they don't know the wool and the flax and we talk about that and then we talk about the loom how it is set up.

And a then the children are shown how to operate these little looms over here on the table and a they sit down and actually weave. [Host]: That'd be kinda fun. This is Debbie that is helping you today and Nancy Hogland also. Yes that's right. Mrs. Denny helps with this part. And this is somehow to use the little table looms. But then we all work together helping.[unintelligible]. How do you feel about the museum and this is a hands on Pioneer Days. We think it's wonderful. We think it's wonderful. [Host]: It give the kids a chance to really not only hear about it but to do something about it. [Guest]: Yes. Yes they do that's right and I think it means a lot to them because weaving is coming more in vogue now you know people a lot of people are weaving their parents are weaving and they see it all the time. And ah. It has more meaning to them. [Host]: There's something special about weaving that you have to remember? [Guest]: There are many things you have to remember about weaving, but it's not difficult at all. We have an adult class going here right now. [Host]: That's the beauty of it. It isn't difficult and youngsters

will take right to it. Right? Oh yes they do. The Monday last Monday's weaving class you were up here last Monday, remember? [Host] Yes I was. and saw these a children working; well we had some beautiful letters from them telling us a how much they appreciated and how the weaving how much they enjoyed the weaving. Thank you very much Dorothy. Ok. [Host]: If I could have a minute of your time, I know you're busy, mixing cornbread is it? Margaret. [Guest]:Yes we are. Margaret Schofield and you have a few folks in class are very interested in this food because they get to eat it. [Guest]: Yes they do. They really really enjoy it; especially putting the maple syrup on it. They really like that then they make their own. They're making shaking the the cream in the jar and making butter and this is very fascinating to the children. [Host]Any special questions, what do say, what do they ask you? [Guest]: Well they can't believe that they're gonna make butter in that a jar and they get.[Laughs] And she does. [Host]Some does and some don't. [Guest]Right but um. You know they're just interested in making the cornbread and we talk about the Indians and then they're very interested in the churn over there that their great grandmothers used and and how she did it and how many hours it took her to do it

and a they love the flavor of the butter you know. [Host]: To be sure homemade butter nothing better. [Guest]:That's right. [Host]Yea. You have to salt to taste. Is that the idea? [Guest]: Yes grand their great great grandmothers did they salt to taste and a they used a the carrot squeezer over there to color the juice from the carrots to color the butter. [Host]: Yeah. What about the old fashioned stove you have here? [Guest]: A, yes we have. [Host]:Oh Mario stand right here please. [Guest]: The cook's stove and ah our grandmothers used for the you put the wood in the cook stove and kept the temperature of the oven to 350 [Host]: Is a little hard to regulate? [Guest]: Ah you have to keep a good hot fire in it. Right. You have to keep it keep it stocked with the wood all the time. Yes. [Host]:My guess is you always have hot water there somewhere on that stove all the time. [Guest]:Yes yes and then the warming oven would help keep the food warm. Ya know she she'd get some food done ahead of time and she put it in the warming oven which is on the top there And Earl and Earl he's keeping it stocked with the wood all the time for me, so I don't have to bother with that. [Host]: That's great that wood What was for. Sometimes for the youngsters to keep the wood box supplied. [Guest]:Oh yes that was what the children's chore to keep the wood box always full it always had to be full. [Host]: Thank you Barb.

Yes. [Host]: Earl Lennox has a part of the show here today. This has to do with butter making. [Earl]: Yes Don. You talk about making butter. A now what the children ah actually is who over there a doing. They're not making ah butter you know a butter for a full week actually and this is what a we're demonstrating a this a butter churn here for a supply of butter for the week a full week and back then they say. We had a family and a big family and a little dab of butter wouldn't last a full week, so Grandma had to take and make a big tub of butter you know.[indistinct] [Host]: How much milk would that take? [Guest]:I to make a [Guset]Well, this here is actully somewhere around between 8 and 10 gallons. And a [Host]: And how much butter would that would make? [Earl]: Would make probably a fraction of a, Oh I would say probably a A pound a and a half. [Host]: And then the final product I guess was probably this mould wouldn't it? [Earl]Yes this mould a is a quite an item. This this

[Earl]: This here is in very good condition very good condition and there was another thing also about this butter mold that we had to decorate uh a pound of butter for company more so and look at that nice uh [Host]: A pattern and isn't it? [Earl]: It's a pattern for the butter. But isn't that a a a pattern in there for a tradition? [Host]: That's attractive. [Earl]: Very attractive. And So actually. So when uh mother took and filled that she kind of tipped it over. You know this way here, and then she forced a pound of butter out to a you know to finish up the mold full. [Host]: Then she'd have a pound of butter and had this distinct decoration on it. [Earl]:Yes yes yeah this is uh a very nice attractive item Come here a very good. And you don't find a too many butter moulds are in good good condition. [Host] Thank Thanks a lot Earl. I appreciate it. This is Jan Dobbin and we're making rope jars, what is it? [Jan]: Coil pots. [Host]: I knew it was something like

Or something like that. [Jan] Each class each school is making their own coil pot and each student has a chance to make a coil coil and add to it. It seems fairly simple you roll it into a coil and a turn it you know make a form of pot out of it, is that it? [Jan]: And between each row they slip and score it so the pot will stick together. Hopefully. [Laughter]. [Host]OK now they're gonna fire this are they? And we'll have a product when they get done? [Jan]: We'll fire it for them because of of lack of time because this has to dry thoroughly and then we'll fire it to bisque and get it ready for them and get it to the school so they can see what they did. [Host]: Is this a natural things for kids to get their hands dirty? [Jan]: I find that we have clean kids today they don't want to get dirty. [ Laughs] [Host]: So they sometimes complain about that, do they?[Jan]: I found you know I think they're afraid it's not going to come out in the wash.[Laughs] [Host]: Well we assure them that it does. [Jan]: Yes it does. Is this probably an elemental type of project isn't it? [Jan]: um hm and this is one of pottery's the earliest stages is coil and slab and pinch pot.

pots you know it. After awhile they came to the kick wheel and then finally to the electric wheel. [Host]: In that case that's threw a hunk of pottery on the turntable and form it with their fingers and this way they rolled it out here and can you show us how you do that just make a coil or something.[Jan]: Um hem. [Host]:Take a clay what type clay of clay is this now some special clay? [Jan]: This this there's. There's different weight clays and I'm not sure what this is. Ah Julie Bettinger had this already for me. [Host]: I see. [Jan]: And you just form it into a coil like this. And then they add it on. [Host]: Ok are they still adding to this pot? What is this glue or? What is this now? [Jan]: This is slip this is liquid clay it's called slip. And it's a a would be a type of glue it's just the slip to help it stick together. [Host]: Ok is this about the size it's going to be? [Jan]: We have 1 more session for Bellevilles. [Host]Ok and that wilI finish it.[Jan] So yeah and this 1 will be a little bigger. I'm not sure how I ended up with this job. [Laughter] One of the young people handed me this jar. I assume we're suposed to have of butter. [Other voice]:That's right. [Host]: Yeah. We've enjoyed our visit today.It's been fun.[Other voice]: We do too.

We've had a good day, yes [Host]: Not only informative but just a good time watching these young people learn about some of the things they've heard about perhaps and never seen before. [Other voice]:That's right. [Host]:There were things that they get a chance to do hands on here that's kind of a fun thing to do. [Other vice]:Absolutely. [Host]: This is the 2nd a week now of Pioneer Days and I'm sure that you'll have another next year perhaps?[Guest] h yes. [Other voice]: Next year next fall. We'll do it again as we've done. This is our 5th year in a row now. Yeah. Now a anything new for next year you've planned to do something in the future? [Guest]: Not Not that we know of they like this setup that we're running right now very well and they don't ask us to change it at all. The only other thing we might do would be candle making but it takes longer to do that. [Host]: Right.o Some of the instructors may have to leave in other new ones to be included. But the main thing the Pioneers Day will be the theme will be the same. [Guest]: And the theme will be the same theme. [Host]: That's great, well we enjoyed the day. Thank you very much. Yeah. [Guest]: Thank you.