March on Washington; March Reporting; Part 4 of 17

Well, I think we ought to call in Al Halson again because certainly most of the people are now arriving at the very steps of the Lincoln Memorial where most of this activity will take place now for the next two or three hours. Al, before we pause for station identification, can you give us another quick report on the scene from that point? George, while we have the moment here with us is Joyce Row, the press committee of March on Washington. Miss Row, how has the press reacted to this March? Well, I believe, I mean, statistically, this has been the greatest press coverage of any event in history. We have something like 1,300 out of town correspondence here for the March, plus the Washington Corps, plus the radio stations, you know, such as yourself, plus the American networks, BBC, Canadian broadcasting, French television, Japanese television, German television, and it's been requested that this bay relayed through your vision, the televised.

Is the voice of America carrying this? Yes, it is. Yes, it is. Yes, it is. We have several gentlemen here from USIA handling that. What were some of the problems you ran into in preparing for the press? Oh, God. It's specific now. I noticed last night at about 1 o'clock in the morning, telephone people were still patching in towards, preparing for the microphones and television cameras. I imagine they worked all through the night. They did, as we did, and as we've worked through several nights for the past week. It's been a little hack, Dick. George, this has been Joyce Row, the press committee, now back to George. Right now, we might add that the ERN coverage is being broadcast all up and down the East Coast and soon we'll be connecting to stations in the Midwest, and of course it's being supplied also to the CBC, so we hope you'll stay tuned as we continue its live coverage from Washington on the Educational Radio Network.

Interviews, field reports, highlights, just a few of the features throughout the day as WGBHFM broadcasts live the March on Washington. Stay tuned. You're listening to WGBHFM, 89.7 megacicles in Boston. This is George Geese, again back in Washington as the ERN continues, this March on Washington August 28, 1963. Andy Ferguson is standing by again right in the middle of this group at the corner of the reflecting pool. Let's switch to our ERN site at that location, Andy. George, I have a very little placard carrier, and his name is Keith Johnson, and he's from Washington, and Keith, why are you participating in this March? For civil rights.

For civil rights, and do you know what civil rights means, Keith? No, sir. But you're here. I might add, George, his placard is about twice his size. Something that might be interesting, George, is that at our particular location here, I noticed the picnic baskets have come out. As Cal mentioned that it's a picnic-like atmosphere in this corner, but we could see March is heading towards the Lincoln Memorial, and now we'll go back to George at AMU. Even though a lot of these people are in the process of marching by all these various routes and converging on Lincoln Memorial here in Washington, other buses are still outside the city limits, trying to get in, to unload these participants, so they might be here by 2 o'clock Eastern Standard Time when the official program on the steps of the Lincoln Memorial starts. And as Al Holson has told you, some of the dignitaries who will be seated there during the process and program this afternoon, some of these people are arriving. You wonder what is happening back at the monument grounds, the scene of earlier things this

morning, Malcolm Davis is still located by the stage on that area, so let's go back to him. Well, George, this is Kurt Whittig sitting in for Malcolm Davis for just a minute. Yes, Kurt. There are still lots and lots of people here, although we can't see the grass. There is a steady stream of people flowing down Constitution Avenue. You can't tell whether they're on the road or the sidewalk or the grass. They completely flow from the fences which keep us away from people and keep the cables free from getting tangled up for radio and television. And there are many, many signs. Many of the people are carrying signs which were printed and are uniform in their character, so it looks although there is a stripe of people walking down the street and floating over them, a stripe of signs of white when you look at them from the back and red and blue, mostly patriotic colors, as you look at them from the front. Kurt, are these signs that were kept there in that Marcia Quarter's tent as part of the

monument grounds? Excuse me, George, I couldn't hear you. Are these signs that were supplied to the marchers from the tent area there at the monument grounds? Well, we don't know if that is true or not. We haven't been able to get around much since things got crowded here. What are you going to do right here? I could say... Oh, I wanted to say something about the announcements that you've been hearing in the background every time you come up here. There are several groups of people up on the stage who, apparently, want things to be a little more lively. People are all moving slowly and it's not too noisy. It sounds a little noisy at this point. Of course, that was the perfect time for that. What they're doing is calling out several delegations from various states and asking them to respond. So, at various times, we hear cheering from different parts of the monument grounds. Some of the larger delegations from more near... KJ-0077, KJ-0077 in this space.

Well, we're having communications troubles ourselves, Kurt, and we thank you for that report, but I think we better switch to Andy Ferguson. Again, down at the corner, the reflecting pool right between you and our wholesome who's up at the steps of the Lincoln Memorial. So, Andy, would you come in with another report? Andy's gone off to catch something else. Yes, sir. This is how reporting. Go ahead. There was suddenly a great crush of people immediately outside the truck, and somebody yelled, here come the stars. And they did. Bert Lancaster, Charlton Heston, Archie Moore, they all went by, surrounded by marshals and National Guardsmen, and I assume they are now up at the memorial, and it was all very exciting. And these people were to have come to the parade route, but evidently, they snuck up along the grass area. They did, because they sure went by. At any rate, things have calmed down a bit now, although the marshals are doing a very tight job. Nobody was pushed or jostled that I could say. These marshals are actually policemen out of uniform from New York City. Not the ones down here, George. These are very, definitely, ordinary citizens, most of them quite young.

Boys and girls, I would say, in their early 20s. And a few older people seem to be directing them, but they're doing a good job. And now things are quieting down, once again, here at the reflection pool, so I'll send it back to you. OK, we'll go back to Al Horson from his vantage point high on the steps of the Lincoln Memorial Al. Maybe in the background, you can hear a lot of cheering also in front of me, a lot of people are waving. Reverend Dr. Martin Luther King, Jr., president of the Southern Christian Leadership Conference, now on top of one of the television platforms, above the crowd, directly in front of me. I would say about a hundred feet from where the crowd begins at that green snow fence, I mentioned. He doesn't seem to be saying anything. He's waving. The crowd is waving back to him. They've taken the placards down so that now we can see way back to the street without any obstruction. Some of the other dignitaries are coming up the main entrance way to the Lincoln Memorial. This particular program is taking place a short distance from the statue of Abraham Lincoln.

George is getting more and more crowded here, but nothing exceptional is happening. I think we'll go somewhere else, George. We found out from police headquarters, and I reported down there that this Carl Allen, an assistant to Lincoln Rockwell, who was a member of this American Nazi party that was arrested, Carl Allen has been taken to police headquarters. He's arrived. He's been fingerprinted. A picture's been taken of him, and he is now going into a special court, which is being held today to handle all cases of demonstrators and anything else that might come up in the line that requires arresting, and this man was arrested on the monument ground. So he has now arrived at police headquarters and is being booked and going through the regular police procedure for a person who has brought in for some sort of a charge. He's being charged with speaking without a license, because if we said earlier this morning, no anti-demonstration licenses, and you would need a permit of this sort, would be allowed

in the Washington area. And since this arrest, and this person was taken from the group of the American Nazi party, reports show that Mr. Rockwell and the rest of the group did leave the monument grounds when over the 14th street into Virginia, and supposedly are headed for their headquarters, which is located in Arlington, Virginia. Before we go to New York for a five-minute report they have standing by at ERN Affiliate WNYC, we might also report that so far, hospital authorities say only three people have been submitted to the hospital and admitted. And these were for normal causes of sickness and really are not related at all to the coverage of the march and the things that might be related to heat prostration and that sort of thing. So casually so far, except we did hear of one person feigning on the monument grounds, but perhaps that wasn't too bad. And as we had report from along the march route, some people are sitting down and resting for a while.

But so far, official hospitals report only three people accepted, and that really isn't related to this march on Washington. Well, while the marchers continue, from the monument grounds, down Constitution Avenue, and before we go back to the Lincoln Memorial to pick that up, let's go to New York City and ERN Affiliate WNYC. We're speaking to the Assistant Commissioner of Licenses for the City of New York. Mr. Walter L. Kirshenbaum, who in just about 15 minutes or so, catches a plan for Washington DC from LaGuardia Airport to attend the demonstrations and all the activities in Washington tomorrow for the freedom march. How do you do, Mr. Kirshenbaum? How do you do, sir? Just why is the City official like yourself going to Washington? Well, I'm going, not only as a City official, I am going as a private citizen to participate with City officials, with other government leaders, with other citizens of oral ethnic groups who are going to Washington, not marching on Washington, but going to Washington to come out of favor of the President's civil rights measures to support the President in his efforts

to get civil rights legislation at this session of the Congress. It is all a feeling that what is going to take place in Washington is not a demonstration against, but a demonstration for, and that is the reason that I'm going, that is the reason that I know that other City officials are going, I know that the mayor will be there tomorrow, other high City officials of the Board of Estimate will be there tomorrow, but we're all going there, not because we have titles, not because we've been elected or appointed for our civil servants, we are going there because we are American citizens who are trying to tell the Congress of the United States that as American citizens, we do not believe in second-class citizenship, but in first-class citizenship for all citizens and for all people who reside within our borders.

Well, Mr. Kersenbaum, in your capacity as the CSN Commissioner of Licenses for the City of New York, have you had any racial problems, say, during the past year? No, we do not, and we have never had. Our department, and I can speak for our department, of course, has been one department that has consistently, and among all the others, and all the others have as well, I may add that, but our department has been, well, in the 79 or 80 business that we license, a man comes in and a finger printer, a woman comes in and a finger printer, and that, I would say, is the only qualification to get a license, good model character. We care nothing about the color of the person's skin, the churches in the garden they worship in. We just want to make certain that they are a good model, a good model character, and they will get a license.

No other reasons, and no other way, can a person get a license. No other words, they can't be discriminated against by a f***ing. We will not tolerate discrimination of any kind in the granting of licenses we don't, we don't operate that way. Neither does any other city department. Well, just whereabouts in Washington, will you be located during the March? Will you be with Mayor Wagner and the other city officials? I have been given an assignment by the March on Washington Committee to serve on the publicity and public relations aspect of it, and I'm going there now for a briefing, a press briefing, it's a wait-a-dice afternoon, and then for another press conference, in a wait-a-dice evening, this is the purpose of my going there, I will be working on a high echelon level, I have been working on a high echelon level with the organizing committee here with a fellow brand-off and with Cleveland Robinson in trying to help them, in any way that I possibly can, to carry out the marches purposes, so I'll be marching, I'll be walking, I'll be talking, I'll be helping, in any way I possibly can.

Well, Mr. Kirshenbaum, just a digress for just a moment, I know you want to catch your plane, you're probably impatient and frustrated with having a phone call at the same time, from someone else here at WNYC, but I just wanted to say, what are the licenses do you issue? You are mentioning nightclubs, what else do you issue here in New York? Besides nightclubs, you have bingo games, the people, the consumer protection program of making certain that there are sales that are conducted in the fairest possible way that people are not jipped, we issue second hand deal with licenses, going out of business sale licenses, theater licenses, motion picture theater licenses, there are about 80 of them, I can enumerate them, but I don't think at that time we're taking a minute each to name them, because actually, I might point out, and I think this is of some concern, that our department, when we took over the licensing of caparrais and vansals, et cetera, and we had to issue ID cards, made certain that all forms that ought to be filled out,

do not have, and we made it a point, do not have, as other cities, by the way, do have. We made certain that we do not have anything, because color or complexion on our application like that was a strict order from Commission of Bernard J. O'Connell, right in the Commission of the City of New York. We are very, very tough on this subject, because we don't go out of, either, to pinpoint it at every moment, because we believe that as Americans, we treat our fellow citizens and the people who come to us as human beings, regardless of race, color, religion, or national origin. Well, it seems like the ideals of our department, and of our city of New York's principles and policies. Well, I must say, an easy man or an individual, Commissioner, we've been speaking to Assistant Commissioner of Licenses for the City of New York, Mr. Walter L. Kirshenbaum, who was kind enough to give it a few moments of his time, before he left for Washington

and the Civil Rights March. This is Bill Price again, here at WNYC in New York, and as a preview, for later on in the day, and this is also for George Geesey there in Washington, I have a 20-minute tape standing by, 20 minutes might seem lengthy, but the two people I'm interviewing on the tape are very important and have many pertinent things to say. One is Dr. Frank A. Hale, he's a practicing psychiatrist here in New York City, and member of the William Ellison White Psychoanelitic Institute, and also Dr. Elizabeth Davis, director of the Department of Psychiatry at Harlem Hospital, and Assistant Professor of Psychiatry at Columbia University here in New York City. Well, Bill, please be standing by with that because that sounds very interesting, and right now we'd like to cover more of the throngs that are approaching Lincoln Memorial, but hold that in advance. One more note. I'd like to mention the fact that Dr. Davis is also a Negro, that's why one of the reasons why I have her on the program, so she can state her side of the psychoanalytical questions at a rise.

That's the kind of comment we're trying to achieve, yes, for right? All right, good. And Bill Price, WNYC, New York for the ERN returning you to George Geese in Washington. We'll be calling on ERN reporters in other cities throughout the afternoon to bring you comments from their cities by officials and other leaders, both from White members and Negro leaders in this March on Washington. Right now the police estimate here in Washington is 110,000 people, and right now I think we should go to our site at the Lincoln Memorial to call in Alhorson who is still looking down on this group, trying to count the people I'm sure, and try to get some interviews from that area. Alhorson? That's the background noise from that site, of course they're trying to entertain these people as they file down Constitution Avenue and into the large circular area which faces the statue of Lincoln inside the big monument that we know as the Lincoln Memorial.

We've been informed that Alhors has left the microphone area and is climbing up some of the marble column aids to try to get a better look down on this crowd, so as soon as he can get a microphone to wherever he's climbed, we'll be back to that site. Jeff Gaelic is still standing by Midway on the parade route, he's at my tenth and Constitution and we'll see if Jeff can hear us at this time. He's probably right in the middle of the crowd. Well, we'll go back to the monument ground where I'm sure people are still leaving because certainly the multitude of people that are involved in this March haven't all been able to leave the assembly area and get on to Constitution Avenue or Independence Avenue. So back to our site by the stage on the Washington Monument Ground. Thank you George. Kurt and I have been looking over this situation and I think we are both agreed that the manner in which the people are leaving here right now is still extremely orderly. There are very few, I guess, a few thousand, yes, but they look comparatively few in numbers

to what we had earlier. One of the interesting things that I can talk about at present is that Constitution Avenue at this point is solidly blocked, the March is beginning, I would say, the actual Marching itself should be around about 19th Street where Jeff is, but at this area, there are so many people on Constitution Avenue that the column is standing right still and looking down in the other direction away from the Lincoln Memorial, as far as I can see this column is formed, but that likewise is standing completely still. We are at the Washington Monument. We have had representatives of the various cities and various boroughs in New York. They had delegations calling out from the Bronx and from Brooklyn and then in Chicago. There was an enormous response when the Chicago representatives would call out an enormous amount of applause from these people who are coming from those cities. The crowd is breaking up as I had said and they are all trying to get on to Constitution

Avenue. But as Kurt was saying a little while ago that you cannot see the grass or the sidewalk, it's a solid mess. Is that right, Kurt? Yes, Malcolm. I'd like to add some things. The crowd on the Monument grounds and cells, especially around where the Red Cross tents are and various public facilities have thinned out enough, so I was able to get out and try to gauge the demeanor of the crowd. And I find that almost the university, universally, people are smiling today. Apparently, they're very hopeful that something will happen or they'll know. But they are still moving down to the Monument here once again as Malcolm Davis. Right now, I'm still up on the stage and I'm sitting here with a member of the Washington DC Clergy Committee. Can I ask you your name, sir? Reverend Huey Rogers of Brooklyn, New York. You are from Brooklyn. I see.

I thought that you were from Washington, DC. No, we travel all the way down from Brooklyn to be at this grand occasion. This is stoic occasion. When did you get into town, sir? Get into town early this morning as we were traveling along the highway. Hundreds of cars were behind us. We surprised to find similar cars coming in from all parts of the nation. Can you tell me, sir, how impressed you are or not impressed with the manner in which this march is being conducted? I think it's one of the most orderly and one of the most outstanding demonstrations that have ever happened in this city. And I think it's because of the fact that the religious background counts with the fact that this is an orderly congregation. I have seen plaques here representing Catholics, Protestants, and Jews, sir. Are you part of that delegation? I'm on the Protestant faculty. Are you going to join the parades, sir, and go down to the Lincoln Memorial? I'm certain expect to. It would be an honor to. And what time do you think you will stay here, too? Well, I will stay here. We have some ministerial duties to attend. We'll have to go back to Baltimore and then back to New York. It will be until all the activities I support are over.

One last question, sir. May I ask you, how effective do you believe this march will be? I think it will serve very effective to dramatize the issue and also to wake up the concerns of America and also to build the morale of the people that have fought so long for you. Thank you very much, sir. George, I must say that from here now, it does appear that the people right up across this whole area, right up to the Washington Monument, are now going on mass to Constitution Avenue in two directions. Welcome. You just had an interview with a member of the clergy, Al Holson, wherever he climbed on the Lincoln Memorial, also has been able to reach somebody. Uh-huh. Let's switch back to those steps and call in Al with whoever he has with him. Right. With me here at the Lincoln Memorial is Brother Dylan of Catholic University in Washington. Brother Dylan, what is your role in this march on Washington today? I'm strictly of a participant, just taking part in the march. Could you tell us what the official position is of the Catholic Church on the march? Well, the bishops of the Church have recently come out in favor of the march and of course

in favor of a good civil rights law. How strongly have they come out in favor of this march? In other words, have the various dioceses asked their parishioners to attend the march or to what extent was it actually? Well, the bishops of the Church meet annually and at the last meeting about two weeks ago, they passed a resolution saying that they favored the goals of the march and the march itself. And the individual bishops have asked their people to participate in the march. For example, the archbishop of New York Cardinal Spellman has asked that representatives of every parish take part in the march here in Washington today. So what extent have the Washington people participated? The bishops in Washington has also asked all the people, all the Catholics of the city to participate in the march and the different religious houses and students of the houses to participate. You say your participant today, an unofficial observer, more or less? Yes.

What actually have you been doing? It's taking part in the march and we also worked in one of the parishes in the area to interest the people in the march. Did you march from the Washington Monument this morning? Yes. We met at St. Paul & Augustine's Church in march to the monument and from there to here at the memorial. There's been some debate here or discussion as to how long it would actually take. It took me about a half hour when things weren't too rushed. How long did it take you to get from Washington Monument? It took us about 40 minutes. 40 minutes. What is your reaction to the crowd? Do you find the crowd as proportionally white and black as you expected or not? Well I am a little bit surprised at the number of occasions or white people who we have taken part today. It's very encouraging. We don't see many oriental people here. Do you think this is surprising to you or not? There aren't that many around really to take part. Do you believe that they have a civil rights problem as well? Oh definitely. Pregnantists are so natural to people that I'm afraid it will always be with us to a certain extent and only demonstrations like this can really do an efficient job of combating

it. Do you expect that this will have any effect on Congress and passing a civil rights bill? I think so. Of course, many of the southerners who are quite conservative won't affect their vote at all. But I'm hoping that many votes that are more or less traded back and forth for different bills, a senator will say, well, if you will support my bill or support yours, well these wavering votes so to speak will now I hope be solidly for the civil rights law. What do you and what does the Catholic Church plan to do after today? After today, what it has been doing up until now trying to encourage civil rights law and a fair share and equality for all the people. Thank you very much. We've been talking with Brother Dylan at Catholic University. Enjoyed just a moment before we return to you. Charlton Heston has arrived, Sydney Potier and Harry Bellaflonte. Of course, we mentioned earlier that the Reverend Dr. Martin Luther King was here, Roy Wilkins is here and some of the others are arriving.

It probably has been mentioned earlier that James Palmer is unable to attend at last report he was in prison, but he will be represented by Floyd McKissick, the National Chairman of the Congress of Racial Equality. Please continue much as they were here. There is now brass showing once again in front of the Washington Monument, apparently the crowd is moving up toward the Lincoln Memorial. They are in the trees and they're as far back as I can see toward Constitution Avenue. I'll come back to you in just a second. You were speaking of Mr. Farmer not being able to be here because he is in prison. We reported earlier that Major Carl Allen who was an assistant to Mr. Rockwell, who is the American Nazi Party, was arrested earlier, and our ERN reporter, Mike Rice, who is at police headquarters, downtown in Washington, where all police activity is being coordinated, managed to talk to him just before he was arraigned. And just while you were talking to Brother Dillon now, we were able to get this telephone

report from Mike Rice and let's hear it at this time. Reporting from Washington Police Headquarters, this is Michael Rice. I have just talked with Major Carl Allen of the American Nazi Party, as police prepared to take him to the General Sessions Court. He asserted he was just trying to talk to the white people gathered with Lincoln Rockwell to tell them how detrimental today's meeting is to the nation. He was aware of the risks of speaking out, it was worth it, he said. Arrested once before in Washington for walking on a communist plague, Allen was disappointed with the small number of his sympathizers assembled today, about 125 he claimed. Most white people must be showing their disapproval, Allen speculated by staying away. The march is instigated by communist trained people, Allen accused Martin Luther King for one, he said, has a pinkish background. Other march leaders he declared, without identifying them, are members of the young Communist League. This group presents, Allen explained, that a group of people as he described them, can

take control of Washington for their own purposes. His group, which he claims represents the white majority of the country, has been denied the right even to prey in public, Allen complained. This he charged is the first stage of the communist revolution in America. This is Michael Rice for the E.R.N. returning you to George Geese. One of our sites of interest today is right at the corner of the reflecting pool, certainly in the weather in Washington today and in lighting temptation. Let's go to our site, right beside the reflecting pool, where Cal Nassiter has been making reports and see if she has any reports on whether anybody's fallen in or is making use of this reflecting pool, Cal? Nothing new at this point, George, are you reading me? Yes sir, go ahead. The marshals are still lined up at the side of the pavement, just beside the truck over the chain link fence. But thus far, there's been not too much more activity here to report on.

The crowd is still very quiet and they are apparently waiting for the activities to begin. That's about it from here for now. Who's speaking now? Do you know? Can you recognize the voice? No I can't. Just a moment, I'll check and see if anybody else knows. Well, maybe Alan Holson, who is right up at the speaker's platform at the Lincoln Memorial Steps knows, Al, can we call on you again? Al Holson? Right to the stage where some instructions are being given. And Bacon Drive, there is a great deal of free space along the north bank of the reflecting pool. I can see what he's telling the group. Another reflecting pool is surrounded by a large grass strip. And although everybody at this moment is probably trying to get in as close as they can to the steps to see the faces of the movie stars and the other prominent speakers, it's necessary

probably to use the public address system to get these people not to approach any more the monument steps itself, but to really go down along the reflecting pool. Quite a long distance, perhaps four or five average city blocks long. A wide grass area, very well shaded for those who want to get out of the sun, and they're able then to perhaps hear, but not see as much as they're trying to push in right on the steps. And of course, this is something they don't want to have happen. And through the public address system, they're trying to urge these people to take spaces along the grass area. Now, Al, is that the way you see it from your point right there at Lincoln? He's not at his microphone, and we would hope from time to time he does leave it to go out and try to capture some of these dignitaries who are assembling there in the chairs. And we'll see if he can get back and bring us some of the people who are assembling there. We have a tape recording that was prepared earlier that has a certain reflection on what

this March on Washington today means to Roy Wilkins. Let's listen to that at this time. The year 1963 is particularly fitting for this explosion of concern on the part of Negro American citizens and their friends over the failure to attain a full citizenship rights in a full century. It was a hundred years ago that the amendments to the Constitution were enacted, the 13th, 14th and 15th, which granted citizenship, which granted equal protection of the laws, and which granted the right to vote. And the last hundred years have been marked by systematic, deliberate, and massive, and I might add, successful effort to negate the constitutional amendments.

The Negro never won his full right to vote in the South, has not yet won it. He is just now beginning in the last ten years to enjoy semblance of equal protection of the laws, and he has had affirmed only since 1954 the fact that the Constitution of the United States is colorblind because in 1896 the Supreme Court said that the separate but equal doctrine satisfied constitutional requirements. Now after the Supreme Court's pronouncement in 1954, the Negro waited rather patiently for the implementation of his new citizenship status, but it became apparent very shortly that an effort was underway actively in the South, and by a sort of acquiescence in the North, to defeat him once more on his aspirations with respect to the constitutional amendments.

So even though he had his status affirmed he was not yet to enjoy it, this was when the citizens broke out, and the direct action marches began, and the protests began to take the place of reasonable discussion around tables, and the slow processes through the courts and the legislative halls. And of course in that time the National Association for the Advancement of Career People functioned in what we consider to be a most basic way from 1959 up until 1954 it pains takingly, laid the groundwork in the law and in the Constitution for the Negro's liberation from the status of separate but unequal, and the long campaign was climaxed in 54, but in between rights were won as to voting, registration, housing, employment, picketing, and education, as

well as the administration of justice involving the servings on juries and equality before the law. The NAACP therefore laid the groundwork for the direct action programs of the past few years, it made it possible for picketing, marching, and demonstrating in behalf of rights, and the association has delighted that more than half of the citizens arrested, consisted of NAACP young people, and that bail money put up was put up by NAACP branches, and that along with other organizations it brought us to the spring of 1963 when Birmingham and other demonstrations over the south, and again in the north, pointed up the necessity of taking the case finally to the seat of government itself, to the Congress of the United States to Washington, DC, and it was thus that the march on Washington was conceived.

Its first purpose is to call attention to the disproportionate rate of unemployment among Negroes in this country, which is two and a half times, sometimes three times as great as that among white people, to their lack of training, to the failure of retraining programs to reach them, to their exclusion from apprenticeship training courses sponsored by unions, by the government, and by others, and to their denial of work opportunities in certain white collar and technical fields, and in the building trades and certain other categories. The second purpose of the march and close behind the first one is to support the enactment of the President's civil rights legislation which he proposed in late June. This consists of a package of seven titles, a title two of which has to do with places

of public accommodation and getting rid of racial discrimination in hotels and motels and theaters and restaurants and other public places. And one title has to do with protecting further the right to vote and extending the authority of the government to intervene in these cases. The title has to do with desegregation of the public schools and the granting of additional power to the Attorney General in this respect. Another has to do with permission to the President to withhold federal funds from areas that do continue to segregate and sundry other matters. Not included in the package is an FEPC bill, fair employment practice bill which we regard as being essential and which the march will support. And the whole demonstration in Washington is designed to impress upon the capital of

the nation and thus upon the people of the nation, the deep concern of American Negroes and their allies in the churches and unions and other organizations of the country over the continual denial of their basic citizenship rights. The march came about as I've indicated because of frustration over the normal channels of communication and attainment and redress of grievances. What will be the outcome? Well, it's hard to say. It couldn't, the future couldn't be any worse than the past because the Negroes have suffered terrible deprivation in the past. The little toll story of how they have been deprived of educational opportunity is one that if told would justify all the means they have employed to bring their plight to the

attention of the American people for generations of young people, young Negro children, have been crippled for life and have had guaranteed that in 10 years or now they will not be able to function as efficient citizens. The outcome of the march is bound to be the enactment of civil rights legislation in line with what President Kennedy has suggested with some amendments. Of course, it's inevitable that the Congress would permit this package to go through as is, but we are hoping that the amendments will be for strengthening the package rather than weakening it. Another outcome of the march will be the enlightenment of white citizens of America on the continued plight of the Negro and a sort of new appreciation of the Negro status as a citizen. A third outcome will be the effect upon the Negro himself, he will be encouraged to become

a whole citizen and I'm confident that he will assume the responsibilities of whole citizenship and that he will become more so than he has been to date and he has been in many instances a very stable citizen, he will become a stable element in the community and his children will achieve and he will come to believe in the country not simply philosophically because he knows democracy is the best system in the world, but he will believe in it because it works for him and this is the strongest belief that we could have in this country and the strongest guarantee that our country will survive as a democracy. That was Roy Watkins executive secretary of the NAACP, one of the people that will be hearing speaking live this afternoon from the steps of the Lincoln Memorial as part of

this program. Before we switch to Boston for the latest news developments because other things are happening in the world today beside this march on Washington, which is so important to us today, let us give you some other information for one thing the temperature in Washington is now reached 77 degrees and this has caused some health problems, Dr. Heath of the Health Department announces that six people now have been treated at the DC General Hospital but nothing is serious. There have been several cuts used in the Red Cross tents for people who have weird along the parade route and there is one child separated from the rest of his family. We would like to point out that the police department urged the committee for this march not to allow anybody under 17 to participate in these demonstrations, in fact they told them to keep them home. But just in case some of them showed up and perhaps this is a local Washington youth, there is circulating among all the marchers a youth corps made up of young ladies and men who are looking out for children who might be lost and treating some of the younger

children that perhaps tire before the adults do in this long march. We just had a report that a man and a woman have fainted at Washington Monument grounds and of course are being taken to a Red Cross tent and then to a hospital. The police are refusing to upgrade at this moment at least their size or estimate of the crowd here. They now have 110,000 marchers and that's latest figures but the traffic reports from police headquarters indicate that buses are still bumper to bumper coming in Wisconsin Avenue from the northwest and coming up the south into Washington so there are still a lot of people who had hoped to be here by this time and who have not yet arrived. Before we go to Boston for the news, let's go back to Al Holson on the steps of the Lincoln Memorial. Just to mention George at the heat is beginning to take its toll here at the Lincoln Memorial. We've seen in the past few minutes several people being lifted over the green snow fence, put on stretchers and taken away to the first aid tents.

I believe none of these cases are serious, it's simply the heat and the closeness, the lack of air. The people are still coming in toward the memorial but at a very, very slow pace, the proverbial snails pace. But as far back as I can see in any direction in front of the memorial, there are nothing but people. Overhead, many helicopters are still flying. These are the police helicopters, the traffic control people and in some cases the newsmen. Those seem to be becoming a little bit hazy here but I don't think there's any sign of any rain. George, the dignitaries are virtually all on the stage. We can hardly see them however with the crowd of newsmen around here. It seems like the delay is being co-hosted solely by the news people. Cameras everywhere, microphones everywhere and as we heard earlier from the press secretary this is probably the biggest news coverage of any event that ever took place in Washington. We have with us, just before we go to Boston for that news, Dave Edwards, one of our reporters,

he's just come from the Washington Monument, Dave, how easy was it to get here? Took me about an hour and a half. Which way did you come? Well, I came down the walk by the Reflecting Pool which wasn't terribly difficult and then I ran into these hundreds of thousands of people, mass at what used to be the steps of the Lincoln Memorial. What comments do you hear from the marchers? Most people are hungry and thirsty and most people also want to move into the areas restricted for fortunate like those of us at the press who also can't move into the areas because of all the people who are standing around waiting to move into or hoping to move into the areas. I might mention that still another person has fainted here in front of the memorial and I think as the day goes on and as the crowd presses closer this will be a serious problem for the first eight tenths. Well, we've had reports and I wonder if you can see any of it, that some of the people who are weary from walking have taken their shoes off and are waiting in the Reflecting

Pool. Can you see any of that? We can see some ripples in the water but I actually can't see any people in the water. People have stuck their feet and lower legs into the pool while sitting on the banks of it. That's as close as anybody seems to have come to actually waiting in the pool. Let's be cooling. I'm sure it's much better than being up here under the hot sun at the base of the Lincoln Memorial. We'll be back to both of you after a while but let's go now to ERN Affiliate, WGBHFM in Boston for some of the other news that is making the headlines today. From WGBH in Boston, this is Rick Lee. First associated with the March, a Boston newspaper, the Boston Globe, reports that New England Civil Rights Demonstrators were refused service early today at a roadside restaurant counter in New Haven, Connecticut. The demonstrators run a bus bound from Boston to the March on Washington for jobs in freedom at the nation's capital. Globe Newsman Herbert Habad says the bus, one of 32 from Boston, drew up at the restaurant after five hours of travel and in his words, white waitresses refused to serve us at the

counter. One of the waitresses he reported pointed to the takeout counter where there was only one man behind the counter and snapped if you won anything, you'll have to get it there and eat it aboard the bus. In addition to the coverage you're hearing on the Educational Radio Network and CBC and Canada, the Freedom March in Washington today is being televised by satellite to Europe and also available for viewing behind the Iron Curtain. The National Broadcasting Company said the March will be transmitted on two consecutive passes by the Communications Satellite Telstar II. It will be picked up by the European Network Eurovision and be fed to Intervision the Soviet Network. The Soviet news agency TAS is giving the civil rights march wordage comparable to that which it devotes to the Soviet man in space flights. Peace officers are preparing today for possible trouble during rival demonstrations by civil rights marchers in Austin, Texas. The head of the Indignant White Citizens Council says he is bringing 3,000 members for a counter-demonstration to a march by possibly 4,000 members of a Freedom Now Committee on

Texas Governor John Connelly's office. Congress will be in session this afternoon but there will be no consideration of civil rights legislation. The Senate is holding a routine meeting and the House will be battling the clock to pass the Senate approved bill aimed at forced stalling a nationwide railroad strike threatened for one minute after midnight tonight. Congressional supporters hope the March on Washington will stir enough public interest to cause some wavering lawmakers to vote later for civil rights legislation. They caution, however, that any violence in connection with the March could have an adverse effect. Opponents of civil rights legislation are firm. They say today's mass demonstration bill will not sway their determination to battle against the enactment of such a bill. A landslide victory has been scored by Lieutenant Governor Paul Johnson in the Mississippi Democratic Primary for Governor. The 47-year-old Hades-Burg attorney led from the start to defeat former Governor J.P. Coleman.

Johnson's victory is considered an overwhelming endorsement of his unyielding stand for segregation. The demonstration in Washington is being called a new concept of lobbying by persons' desirous of civil rights legislation. Some of the March leaders conferred ahead of the demonstration with Senate and House leaders of both parties. Senate Majority Leader Mike Mansfield called it a cordial meeting at which no commitments were asked and none given. Here today, President Kennedy will meet with leaders of the big demonstration. The White House says he has watched part of the March on television. His conference will be carried by this station. The civil rights march is having its counterparts in a number of foreign cities, where Americans and some foreign sympathizers are marching on U.S. embassies. Such demonstrations have occurred in Tel Aviv, Israel, and Akra, Ghana, for instance. In Tokyo, about 60 Japanese students held a sympathy rally. I have an obituary from Reuters, from Akra, Ghana. George, you can interrupt me if you have something more important at this moment. But Dr. William Du Bois, civil rights leader, former American citizen and one of the world's

great Africanists, died at his home in Akra, Ghana last night at the age of 95. Dr. Du Bois' death was announced with deeper regret in a government statement. Born here in Barrington, Massachusetts, he lived in Ghana for the past few years and recently became a Ghanaan citizen. At his death, he was working on a massive project and encyclopedia Africana. Dr. Du Bois, who was one of the early leaders in the Negro civil rights movement in America, died on the eve of a massive protest march on Washington by Negroes and whites. The sociologist and author was born February 23, 1868 of a Negro father and a woman of French Huguenot and Dutch descent. He was founder of the Pan-African Congresses, and it was at a conference of the Congress in Manchester, England in 1945 that he became friends with President Crumman and Krumma than a student. That's the Du Bois orbit. I also have an editorial from the New York Herald Tribune about the march today if you want it, George.

Would you like it? Go right ahead. Today's march on Washington is for a good purpose. The demonstration's objective is to obtain the redress of grievances. What Negroes want and rightly is a quality of citizenship without reservations. They demand the same treatment in jobs, housing, education, politics, and public accommodations. This is the freedom which is morally and legally undeniable. But let it be understood that the Negro leadership is not alone in advocacy or in tactics. The assembly in Washington will have white and black participation alike. Every major religious face will be there in force. The support encompasses every forward-looking element of national life. The only question from the beginning has been the practical wisdom of such a gathering. Whether Congress wouldn't resent this intense pressure, or if a crowd of 100,000 or more might not be touched by some accident of violence. Either development would harm the cause. Careful for thought, however, has been very much in evidence. There won't be any sit-ins in Congress, no senseless stunts.

The extremists have been overruled. The march will be for one day only and then everybody goes home. The organizers are determined on order and dignity, and government is fully prepared to prevent incidents and keep peace. The aim of the march on Washington is to dramatize the necessity of freedom for all. This day of equality is irresistible, it can't be blocked. What the marchers seek is to accelerate the forms of public opinion and speed the inevitable. Certainly they do not come to Washington to discredit themselves. That's why the march and the assembly at Lincoln Memorial, as an effective instrument of persuasion, must be peaceable. This places a severe responsibility not only on Negro leadership, but on everyone else along the lines of the march. One more thing, George, we have an interview with former Governor John A. Volpy of Massachusetts. We can play it now or we can save it for later. While you still are on the line, why don't you go ahead? Fine. The situation I might point out is still that the marchers are progressing from the monument grounds and are still trying to get as close to the Lincoln Memorial as possible.

But while they're still in the process of marching and the plan program is still being organized up on the Lincoln Memorial steps, go ahead and listen to this interview. Fine. Governor John A. Volpy, former Governor of Massachusetts, was interviewed in his office this morning by WGBH FM reporter Ted mascot. Governor Volpy, would you give us your opinion of the march on Washington? Well I would say that it is a legitimate expression on the part of a segment of our citizens who certainly have every right to the advantages of our Constitution and who for 100 years have been denied some of their constitutional rights. In plain pragmatic results, what do you think the marchers will accomplish? Well, it certainly is going to indicate to the Congress of the United States and to the people of the nation the great yearning of this large segment of our population for an opportunity or the opportunities to exercise first class citizenship.

I think certainly that it will go a long way in convincing many people who have taken and granted the fact that well these things will come little by little or in some century. I think they will realize that the Negro certainly has been patient and waiting as long as he has for some of these rights which it's about time they received. I think this will affect Congress either positively or negatively in special reference to the civil rights legislation before it. Well I would say that if the march had been on the Capitol itself and had been unruly in nature that the chances are it might have had a negative effect because of the enlightenment and certainly I believe the foresightedness of the leaders of the march, the fact that it is not going to the Capitol that is going to the Lincoln Memorial and being conducted

as we expected is being conducted in a completely orderly fashion I would say that it would have a solitary effect. And what about the effect of the march on the spirit of the National Negro protest movement itself? Well I think it has helped to galvanize the more responsible elements in the Negro community. As is true with any group in our nation there are the extremists and there are the on both sides and then there are the moderates and I think this movement certainly will serve to crystallize a great the mass of Negro citizens who are the moderates who want to achieve these ends a first class citizenship in a manner that isn't keeping with our constitution and with our laws and from that point of view I think it will serve a good purpose. That was an interview with former Governor John A. Volpe, Governor of Massachusetts between

1960 and 1962, interviewer was Ted mascot of WGBHFM. This is Rick Leive with the ERN returning you to George Geese at ERN Master Control. As was mentioned in that interview there are many people coming here today with the approval of President Kennedy and many members of Congress and in just a moment we'd like to bring you some of the comments by these distinguished congressional leaders but first so that you never are far away from the actual events taking place at the Lincoln Steps. Let's call in again reporter Al Holson. George at this time we've been able to get a microphone over to the podium and we have with us now reporter Dave Edwards to interview Norman Thomas. This is David Edwards and the steps of the Lincoln Memorial with me is Norman Thomas, many time candidate for President on the ticket of the Socialist Party and long known as a campaigner in the field of civil rights and peace. Mr. Thomas, you've been involved in a good many programs of this sort in your life. Have you ever been in anything quite like this?

Oh, nothing ever been quite like this to be in. This is a perfectly magnificent occasion I wish I could put in words. The impression one gets and stands looks at the people and the signs and the order. It is magnificent, it is a new kind of demonstration of what's ought to make the American public proud. I'll add to that that it's got to produce results at the letdown unless the Congress acts, the letdown unless the public gets some of this spirit will be a pretty serious thing. It might be the next steps that could be taken by average citizens and by the Congress. Well, of course, Congress compares civil rights laws. That's a simple question to ask if Congress can do and we can keep a continuous and entirely proper democratic pressure on Congress to do it. And if Congress does do it, it can become a major issue in the next campaign.

Every candidate for Congress should be put on record. What do you think is likely to happen in the Negro movement itself if this mass agitation should fail to produce satisfactory legislation? There's also to be very unfortunate. I don't want to put it in words how unfortunate I think it would be. But I want to advise my fellow citizens that it could be extraordinarily serious in my judgment in depression and in depression which speaks outlet in all sorts of ways. Here is hope expressing itself in the most magnificently ordered demonstration. In the course of your years, have you noticed a change in the attitude of the Negroes themselves? Oh, of course, the years and of course, almost of the months. What was the movement of a minority with a great deal of apathy? I speak from a great deal of experience and now become a popular Negro movement. I wouldn't like to give an exact date but the beginnings of it where the Montgomery bus

strike and the still more perhaps the students at Greensboro were their citizens. That began an awakening and a great turning point I should say was affirming him. What had been the growing then began to blossom out very rapidly and you have now a genuine Negro revolution in favor of the rights that all Americans should have and it has been a remarkably peaceful revolution so far. How about on the part of the whites, have you seen a significant change in the white attitude? Oh, yes. Of course, in my life, a perfectly enormous change. In the churches, for instance, the churches I used to say in speeches that the churches were the most Jim Crow institutions in America. Now, at least at the top, there's a very great change and for the better. There's also a change. I wish it were faster and more complete but there's also a change in the great many of

the labor unions and this is highly significant. Thank you very much, Norman Thomas. This is David Edwards at the steps of the Lincoln Memorial returning you to George Geese at the ERN. We've had another report from police headquarters where ERN reporter Mike Rice is standing by and he reports now that a total of 22,300 persons have arrived through Union Station and have been troubled then over to the March area and all the special trains which were due and which were running late have now reported into Washington but there are still buses and all the outskirts of Washington trying to get into the city and that is still a problem because the planned ceremonies at the steps of the Lincoln Memorial are due to start in about an hour from now if not before. Police also report a second arrest has been made from among the people either watching or participating. The second arrest was a 20-year-old white male Edward Schell, an Arlington resident who was arrested at the corner of 20th and Constitution Avenue.

This is along the parade route which is just along the route a bit above our reporter Jeff Geilig. This person was arrested because he went out into the street, took a sign away from one of the peaceful demonstrators and broke it and police felt it was necessary to arrest the man and the other person who was arrested of course earlier was one of the American Nazi team and his case will come up on August 30th reported now he was arraigned and fingerprinted as we reported and his case will come up on August 30th. It's almost time to pause for station identification and let the members stations of the Educational Radio Network who are bringing you this live uninterrupted coverage from Washington of the March on Washington for jobs and freedom. We've been on the air since 9 and will be on the air till midnight tonight to bring you all of the story of this great march on Washington which already shows signs of being one of the largest ever held in the nation's capital. Jeff coverage from Washington on the Educational Radio Network.

The March on Washington being broadcast live from Washington throughout the day stay tuned to WGBHFM for full coverage of this Negro Civil Rights demonstration. You are tuned to WGBHFM.