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I'm Kelly Crossley. This is the Cali Crossley Show. Thirty six years ago a mindless eating machine with a deadly bite dominated the silver screen. We're talking about Johns that movie not only instilled an enduring fear of killer sharks It spawned the summer blockbuster following the widest distribution of its time. Jaws became the first film to top 100 million at the box office. This hour we'll explore how the summer blockbuster forever changed summer cinema. We'll look at the smaller films and art house gems that are being dwarfed by tens O-Town titles like Thor and Transformers 3. But first it's a full body conversation about beer from the Arno arboretum where hops spring eternal to the woman behind the new craft beer cellar in Belmont. Up next from Kraft brews to film reviews. First the news. From NPR News in Washington I'm Lakshmi saying President Obama is

expected to speak shortly after spending part of the morning meeting with Democratic and Republican lawmakers about the stalemate over deficit reduction and raising the debt limit talks at the White House reportedly were expected to include a plan that's more sweeping than previously indicated such as a possible White House compromise on Social Security and Medicare. Republicans say they would consider closing some tax loopholes if they were offset by tax cuts elsewhere. The newspaper at the heart of the mobile phone hacking scandal that has engulfed Rupert Murdoch's media empire and the British political establishment will publish its final edition this Sunday. We have details from NPR's David Folkenflik who is in London. The news of the world is the ukase top selling Sunday newspaper and it is a tabloid famous for scoops about celebrity gossip politicians high jinks and violent crime. The decision to close the title was announced by James Murdoch Rupert Murdoch's son his heir apparent who oversees all of News Corp's British operations journalists and private

investigators for the paper have been accused of hacking into the mobile phone voicemails not just of celebrities and politicians but the family members of crime victims. Officials are also now investigating whether the paper paid police officers for tips advertisers are dropping at a rapid clip. A spokeswoman for Murdoch's U.K. newspaper division said it was not yet clear whether it would launch a Sunday edition of the weekday Sun tabloid. David Folkenflik NPR News London. The White House is making a rare appeal for Texas to delay today's planned execution of a Mexican national who was convicted of the 1994 rape and murder of a teenager. U.S. and Mexican officials argue that Umberto defense could have been stronger had he been told he could access legal help from the Mexican government under an international treaty. Bad weather still looks likely to prevent an on time start for NASA's last space shuttle mission. Judith small saw reports from member station WFIU the space agency says there's only a 30 percent chance it'll be able to launch space shuttle Atlantis tomorrow morning

as planned. NASA's doesn't expect any hail or other severe weather that could damage Atlantis on the launch pad but clouds and rain will likely keep the orbiter from getting off the pad on time. Space shuttle weather officer Kathy Winters was downbeat this morning as she gave the forecast and already saw the Kennedy Space Center. The clouds are rolled in Washington you see some showers. We haven't had a thunderstorm show up this morning for a long Cocoa Beach so we are expecting more of this for the next couple of days. She says that's because there's a tropical wave moving through the area now so officials will take another look at the forecast in the early morning hours before deciding whether to start filling Atlantis's fuel tank in preparation for a launch. For NPR News I'm Judith's Mauser in Orlando. Dow's up 90. This is NPR News. Will stocks have been moving higher after the Labor Department reported a seven week low when the number of first time applicants seeking unemployment insurance last week claims fell by 14000 to a seasonally adjusted 400 18000.

However they're still at a level that suggests ongoing weakness in the jobs market. The government comes out with its monthly employment report tomorrow. The collapse of a soccer stadium roof in the Netherlands has killed at least one person injured at least 10 others. Teri Schultz reports a victims were construction workers upgrading the facility a section of the roof of a soccer stadium in the Dutch city of NCA to collapsed onto a group of workers after it's believe a crane smashed into the ceiling. The city's mayor said the victims were trapped under debris and even hours after the incident. Rescue workers were using sniffer dogs for fear there may still be people trapped in the wreckage. The stadium is the home of soccer club to get it and an extra tier of seats was being added due to the recent success of the team. For NPR News I'm Teri Shultz. Retailers have been open at least a year posting strong sales from June Wall Street's estimates were exceeded by a number of chains including Target and Costco however whether that trend will continue through back to school shopping season

is questionable because of higher prices expected on a wide range of items. Recapping our top story President Obama is calling today's deficit reduction talks with congressional leaders constructive Democrats and Republicans plan to meet again this weekend they're trying to reach an agreement on raising the debt ceiling before the government defaults in early August. I'm Lakshmi Singh NPR News. Support for NPR comes from plow shares fund dedicated to helping build a safe secure and nuclear weapon free world at plow shares ward. That's. Hot in Frankfurt. That's my. Motto. Thank you. Well. Good afternoon I'm Kalee Crossley This is the Calla Crossley Show. Today we're talking

all things beer from stem. Quite literally to Stein. Joining me today is Ned Freedman director of Harvard University's Arnold Arboretum. He oversees the growing a 15000 plants including hops at the Arboretum. He also bruises on beer. Also with me are Kate Baker and Susan Shiloh the owners of craft beer cellar in Belmont. Welcome to you all. Thank you. Thanks very much Harris. You can join the conversation at 8 7 7 3 0 1 8 9 seventy 8 7 7 3 0 1 89 70. What was your gateway beer to craft brew. Do you brew your own once you go craft can you ever go back to the likes of Bud and Colt 45. Baby why I'll be here this morning at 8 7 7 3 0 1 89 70 8 7 7 3 0 1 89 70 and you can send us a tweet or write to our Facebook page so Ned Freedman. I have to start with you. You're the new director

at the Harvard University Arnel arboretum. There are so many plants there already it's a beautiful place and you come and you say we got to plant some hops. Why. Well that's a very good question and there probably isn't a very good answer I just love the plants and I love watching them grow and I started brewing beer at home a few years ago and as a botanist of course the next thing I had to do was start planting hops and then I started watching them and observing them and we have this beautiful new research building and it had extraordinarily tall trellises that were planted with clematis and I said not good enough. So we had all the clematis ripped out and we now have our research building is surrounded by hops that are already about 25 feet up. Wow. They're spectacular plants and so you know when I think of because I know nothing so I'm starting from knowing nothing to feel free to correct me all through this conversation everybody here. I just figure one kind of plant clearly not. No actually it is a species of plant. It's a species of plant that's actually in the same family as

cannabis the candidate C and they're the two close most close that marijuana for people who are not. And in fact it's the same structure of the plant that's being used in both cases when you brew beer you're actually taking these chemicals that are out of the hairs on the flowering structures of the hops plants and you're using them for flavoring and actually for some aspects of preservation of the actual beer. And it's in the inflorescence So you wait for these cones to come out that look very very beautiful and they have lovely aromas and it's a bunch of chemicals that are probably there to defend the plant against insects. Now the reason that you wanted to you know replace the climate is actually with the hops is that it is a climbing vine so it's just as pretty just as a plant climbing it is and it's and it's more dramatic because it grows so quickly. So you can get 40 feet out of. A plant in the summer they grow all the through the summer then they die back to an underground rhizome and then they start the whole process up the next year and you can also watch you can actually see the tips of the stems as they actually

go around in circles as they search for an object to climb on in. Charles Darwin wrote the first modern book on how plants climb and there's a wonderful story that connects back to Harvard University Charles Darwin had a very good friend and confidant at Harvard it was a professor by the name of Aser Gray who was a botanist and one of the great defenders of Darwin in evolutionary thinking in theory in America in the 1860s. And he read a paper by Aiza grey on how cucumber like plants use their tendrils to grow. And it's just wonderful Charles Darwin. No matter what you think about him you see this old bearded serious man. He was the most enthusiastic most playful in some ways and absolutely curious person the first thing he does he goes out and gets some seeds of climbing plants after reeds is a graze paper and the next thing you know he's written a whole book. It is the first book on the topic and he's rowing the plant he had hops in his backyard. He calculated it took two hours and eight minutes for the tip of the hops

plant to go around in a circle complete the loop. He did all kinds of tricks he put little weights on the ends of them so it has a lovely story and connection back to Charles Darwin the botanist and so all of that came together to just make me very happy to have hops growing anywhere I am. Well we're glad to have for you and your enthusiasm that's my guest Ned Friedman he is the director of Harvard University's Arnel arboretum where he's growing hops among the 15000 plants that are there. Some other folks joining me today who are quite enthusiastic about hops but the kind that are bottled. Kate and Suzanne of the craft beer cellar in Belmont got to know how you guys got to the point of having your own shop. Doesn't everyone want to work for themselves. No I mean about craft beer though specifically. Well I was just going to say I think I feel like I just got a lesson on hops. Everything I ever knew was nowhere near what I just learned in the last five or seven minutes. I know hops from yeah from a beer perspective and the different kinds of hops and how they smell and how

they taste and I don't know we love beer. You know I mean we came from the restaurant business and I think that's where we fell in love with beer craft beer and I think that you know we sort of stumbled upon this idea that this was the thing that we noticed both from being a consumer and being on the other side of it that this was what was missing for us that there wasn't a store anywhere that was. They're focused on craft Yeah and whether it's because no one thought of it or no one thought it was important. No one was sort of brave enough to take that step to say we're going to focus on craft an artist and they'll be able to focus on the small brewers the people that are you know in this definition of what it all means. But we did and here we are and where as we say live in the dream we're having a great time. It's amazing to be surrounded by almost 600 awesome beers every day they change every week and really great people. I mean we're just having so much

fun. Well let me step back that was my guest Susan Shiloh She's co-owner of the craft beer cellar in Belmont. Go over to your you're co owner partner Kate. So for folks who are uninitiated it was a difference between just your regular commercial beer your bud was there or you're just rolling rock and and craft beer. Well it's essentially volume and process and craft beer brewer craft beer by definition is a producer that's making less than six million barrels a year. And it's also a small traditional and independent and there's a couple other things that go along with that but primarily that's what we're focused on. And those are the beers that we stock in the store. Other than that they're all brewing beer. It's just that craft beer has a much. You know it's much more honed in on you know more traditional methods being smaller being more of a even a family run business. Sierra Nevada brewing company is run by a gentleman and his son and his daughter and will continue on through the years they're 30 years old.

So there it's a smaller scale operation. I mean some of these breweries are bearing the number of barrels per year that other larger breweries are bringing in a week. And there's just you know there's no matching up to that. Well I certainly had the the owners and the beer makers of pretty things craft beer here. It's quite a popular local craft beer and also has a pretty bottle. If anybody knows I'm not a beer drinker so I just appreciate the craft and the art of doing this. And I got to know it more through talking to those the folks that run pretty things. So they're so great they're really awesome and we love them so much and what they're doing and and their beer they don't make a bad beer I mean everything they make I think everything they put their hands on is just awesome and flavor awesome and you know concept the labels the mission they're everywhere. I mean they are so supportive of their own beer. And that's I think that's why people are really

getting behind them because we've had a few tastings at our store. And Dan and Martha are always there and they want to be the face of their beer. So we think so much of them. Really awesome. 8 7 7 3 0 1 8 0 9 7 8 7 7 3 0 1 89 70. Put the bottle of beer down and give us a call. Solicit tweet or write to our Facebook page we've got the folks that are in the know about craft beer and also the very plant that helps make craft beer possible to you Ned Freeman of Arnold Arboretum. What do you think the trend of organic food has meant to like a greater interest in hops because I think when you the people that it would go to the craft beer cellar in Belmont are very interested in not only who's making the beer and where it comes from but the ingredients in that beer. And in fact if you go to beer brewing stores or you order hops online what you'll find is that there are now many different varieties of hops that you can get that are organically grown. So you find I mean one of the things that I think is wonderful about beer is it's local.

And if you make it yourself it's individual and you see the ingredient it's a variety it's a form of cooking it's like bread making a lot of other things you're using yeast fungi to actually create a bio chemical process to create the alcohol you're taking chemicals out of the plant leaves. It's just a wonderful experience and I think it is the difference between when you go to a small farmers market and you go to a large supermarket where you don't necessarily know the origins of your foods and so I always have a sort of a rule of thumb that because we now have such an amazing local set of breweries across the country the nice thing is when you travel always to get a beer that comes within 30 miles of where you're sitting and try it because it'll be a little different than what you get if it's Colorado where I used to be or Massachusetts or California. So I think the whole the whole sense of returning to smaller operations as as was mentioned by Kate and Suzanne the the concept of families that run breweries is just a

wonderful thing it's all about being local and it's about. Sort of knowing a little bit more about what you consume now what. Here's my question is there one kind of hops that's most popular to use in the making of beer. And I should let everyone know who's listening that it's interesting that Ned Freeman does make his own beer but says if the cake do not if you're too busy trying to sell the beer in your stores but so just from a beer make a personal home brew or a person like yourself in it in addition to growing the hops is there one kind of hop you find yourself drawn to more. I actually like trying different hops and I can't say I follow recipes very very strictly. There are some new varieties There's one called Sitra which is very interesting it's got a very great fruity citrusy kind of a sort of aromas that come out of it actually quite hard to get hold of I think it's become so popular if I understand you and correct me if I'm off the wrong track here and there but they're shaking their heads no I'm not you know yes oh ok that's good.

But but I you know that's one of the wonderful things. These are these chemicals that are in hairs and they're being bred by people all over the world to actually create different profiles of the chemicals. No more floral aromas more bittering elements and at the end of the day all of these chemicals get mixed up and then extracted during the brewing process and and so I have some favorites I tend to enjoy your beers as opposed to the multi-year ones I mean there's more hops and then more hops is slightly stronger and more bitter hops. And there are way various ways of measuring that and again I'm not the best person by any stretch to tell you Well I'm not going to get away and that they can tell you all about the system and how alpha acids and how you actually can look at bittering units and so forth but but it is I just think it's interesting because no two beers are the same and again it's that's one of the great things about trying different beers or brewing them yourself and and to me it is a lot like going to a bakery and no two bakeries are the same no two breads and it's the same thing yeast interacting with the

products you put in the pan or in the pot and into the into the kettle. And you go to it and you enjoy the outcome. How pure beers you like that better. Susan Love them. OK all right. Well we got way more to talk about on the other side of this break. I am very excited to be talking about beer even as I am not a beer drinker because I'm just very interested in this subject. From the hot sun to the beer stein and I'm joined by Ned Freedman director of Harvard University's Arnaud operate and he oversees the throwing of hops at the oar arboretum. Also with me our Kate Baker and Suzanne shallow the owners of craft beer cellar joined the beer banter at 8 7 7 3 0 1 8 9 7 8 7 7 3 0 1 89 70. Do you bring your own. Do you go brew and type group and join both a can of course and a craft beer. Stay with us we'll be right back after this break. Support for WGBH comes from you and from Harvard Extension School

for personal enrichment or professional development. Courses from accounting to Shakespeare. Registration begins August 1st. You can find more information online at extension dot Harvard dot edu. And from Davis Mall Monday August Dean P.S. attorneys at law at Davis mom they make your business their business on the web at Davis mom dot com. D S M A L M dot com. On fresh air you'll hear the questions you wish you could have asked to people like Tom Kenny the voice of Sponge Bob Square Pants. It didn't help to hear what your voice sounded like on him. You learn something about your voice you didn't know before. Yeah I learned that I don't really need the helium. It's pretty easy to flick that's the most interesting people in show business on FRESH AIR. This afternoon at two on eighty nine point seven.

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talking about here this hour from homebrews to Kraft Bros. I'm joined by Ned Freedman director of Harvard University's Arnold Arboretum. He oversees the growing of many plants and flowers including hops at the Arboretum. He also bruises on beer Also with me are the beer bottle mamas Kate Baker and Suzanne Shiloh the owners of craft beer cellar in Belmont Collin 8 7 7 3 0 1 89 70 8 7 7 3 0 1 89 70. How much is the beer aisle at your grocery store changed over the years. And do you even recognize half the brands anymore. 8 7 7 3 0 1 89 70 8 7 7 3 0 1 89 70 and Alex from Portsmouth. Go ahead please you're on the Kelly Crossley Show. Eighty nine point seven how do you do in five. Want to chime in about the the local movement for the craft beer industry I actually own a homebrew store up in Portsmouth New Hampshire and and supporting a local farmer in Hadley Massachusetts called Valley

Mall. The growing their own and melting their own greens and selling shares and we're helping them out here at our store and you get a thumbs up from Suzanne and Kate keep going. Excellent. I'm just very excited you know that. It's great to hear that the movement is getting some Preston publicity. Excellent. What do you find that people when you tell them what you're doing and they come in to get the equipment to brew their own. Is there any particular kind that they're going for is just they're sampling everything as Ned Freeman suggested people should do. Yeah I think it's kind of the same. They might be you know they're they're coming in and looking for recipes that are stimulating some of their favorite beers out there. You know the IPA beers and Belgian with beers as well at this time of year very popular. And so that's what we're selling a lot of the I mean you're And I imagine that a little change of seasons change will start getting more work and more porters and scout and and can you definitely see the trend toward craft beer. Oh yes absolutely. The craft beer industry has just

grown exponentially over the last you know 15 years and you know obviously we here in Portsmouth we have the Portsmouth brewery which is really huge and you know so a lot of people are coming here and we have so many you know as in Red Hook So there's definitely a big movement in the area which is really really fun to see. Well Alex thanks for calling in and Suzanne and Kate just gave you a big thumbs up for the Portsmouth Portsmouth brewery. So thank you for a homebrew supply thank you very much. All right. Jonathan from Manchester Massachusetts you're on the Calla Crossley Show Go ahead please. Yeah. Hi thanks. I did offer some years back and I want to track what kind of how I plan to get married how I might figure out what kind I'll crawl over my backyard now. All right Ned Friedman you're on the spot. I am on the spot. I have no answer for you. I also have hops that were growing in my backyard for many years and I had no idea where they came from or what they were. I suppose if you can get someone who really brews beers and is regularly testing batches

of hops for beer brewing you might get close but there are so many different varieties. Short of probably going to the DNA level and looking for a variation in the actual DNA of the organisms I think you're just going to have to enjoy what you have and not know. So you can like take a photo and like google it and see if it pops up somewhere that will work. No these there may be subtle differences and there probably are some differences even in leaf shape in a variety of other characteristics of the plants that you could look at and they would get you close. But growing conditions can also affect the way a plant actually looks and so. Best best case is to get someone as a real expert on the varieties of hops out to your backyard if you can convince them and and have them have a look but it might just get you close and that's about it. All right thank you very much. I'm going to break your record by and I'm going to just enjoy them. All right very good. Thanks Jonathan for the call Kate and Suzanne I want you both to weigh in.

One of the happiest beers these days and what Which ones would you say are seasonal right now if you were going to if someone came to your store and said gee I want to have craft beer of the season. Is this gentleman from Portsmouth indicated what would you suggest. Well I mean he's spot on with the Belgian whites in the beers and summer wheat beers. We can't keep enough of those kinds of things on the shelf right now. There's many many local favorites that we have. There's a beer from Colorado that we love right now that we just can't keep enough of it. And it's something that people just can relate to when you're out of the you know dregs of winter and you're getting into May and April and May. The breweries are pushing out these summer beers and people are ready to put aside this doubts and the porters and the darker richer beers and have something just a little lighter in body and character to kind of combat a day like today where it's pushing 90. So definitely I mean there's a not only there's a trend towards craft beer but there's a big trend towards more creative and seasonal beers that people are going to be really into pushing pushing the limits of time a little bit too with you know the pumpkin beers and October fest coming out a little earlier every year but now summer beers are right where it's

at at the moment. OK. Happiest beer Susan you know I think we're pushing the limits on hops and that can be defined daily differently. We've got a beer on our shelf right now I think of 21st Amendment brewery out of San Francisco. That it's a double IPA or an imperial and it's nine point seven and it's just so happy I mean what the exact tops are. I mean that's part of the fun is you know no no Brewer no consumer can actually drink that beer and define exactly what those hops are but personally I'm a fan of the citrus that was mentioned earlier on. And Simcoe is a big it's a big fan favorite right now Phoenix. There are just so many and they they all smell slightly different and they all have subtle differences and flavor and I think it also depends on their relationship with the malt and the beer. Sometimes you can have a beer that's really really hopping like this crisis is called Crisis. Yeah. OK.

That has a little bit more of a malt. Bill back. And so the interaction between the hop and the mold ends up creating just a bigger beer in general and sometimes you can have a beer that's a little bit lighter maybe a light copper color or just just a real looking light. That has four five six different hops on it and it can just be screeching and both bitterness and aroma and it can just be you know just a sort of power poncho hops you know from from the second you taste it until 10 minutes later you're still tasting it. I would be remiss if I didn't know that the two of you met while working at Cambridge common restaurant in Cambridge which I'm told features a lot of different beers and you sort of figured out hey we should do our own thing and have our own store and do that. And I raise that because people tend to think of beer as a masculine kind of thing and yet here you two women running this craft beer store and you're also involved in getting more women who are in beer known out there.

I think we only are participating and I am so humbled by the fact that people think that we started you know women's organizations and beers but turns out there are women all over the country. And for a long time they were masked by their male counterparts that. Where were brewers or brewmasters as well. We have a brew master right here in Cambridge over at Cambridge Brewing Company and she's been there a long time and she is really really fascinating knows exactly what she's doing. I mean she's awesome her beers are fabulous and she's had great mentors in our lives so we started a social movement or a social group here and we've had people like Meghan Priti from CBC join and some other big names around the Boston area join in and it's really just a social group to say hey women like beards or you know don't put us in a pigeon hole don't look at don't look at me and see that I'm a woman and assume that I want to drink a strawberry Limburger. And I think that's important because all the advertising is is very male oriented is as though women do not drink beer.

Right right. It's just like you know big motorcycles and the guys and two cans and each a hand and all that kind of stuff and you know and yet we know hello people who are listening. That the women running of the household budget women run the household budget. You know so they've got to be buying the stuff I have. It's definitely changing now and though I can be watching you know a television program especially the sports programs they have all the big you know beer companies and I can get so frustrated with the big companies that have the millions of dollars to put forth in the advertising. I do have to say it's changed it's changed a little bit. Yeah and I think now people are recognizing that women do like good beer or do like beer in general. And now we just have to get them to break out of the fact that women don't just like you know for the Olympics or you know. Summertime wheat beers I mean there are there are a lot of women that shop in our store every day as well as men and they're they're buying an IPA. So by importers their pint starts there Brian barley wines. I mean there

are a lot of beers out there and it's just about palate it's not about gender. Yeah you know it's really been about gender. Yeah I agree. Well you know obviously I agree. But but I just had to put it out there because it's you know when you look at the advertising it's kind of odd. And I visited your store undercover I suppose. And there were all kinds of folks in there you know it was full and people were really enjoying looking around and sends us a lot of women. Yeah that's key too because I think we do have what we call the beer geeks and you know much love out there to our beer geek friends and fans that come over to our store because those people have followed us from Cambridge and they've been drinking beer a long time and they know a lot about it and they're the ones that are out on the streets every day saying you should try this beer you should try this beer. So we love our big French friends and fans but we also have you know single parent moms and dads that come in and say I don't like beer or I've never liked beer or.

And that's what I try it. Yeah. Yeah I just help me out. And of course it's important to us. I don't want to send somebody out of there with a hobby IPA that's going to blow their palate out of their mouth because it's so worth sitting for credit they're right they're going to try it and spit it out and they're never going to drink a craft beer again they're going to go back to that yellow fizzy stuff. Well I have a question then I'll go across the whole spectrum of people who enjoy beer whether they like the happy or not and that is the glass. The importance of the glass. We get you know a lot of people were saying does it make a difference when you're drinking beer. What kind of glass you have. Do you have a special glass for your beer. I do not. So you're are you paper cup are you doing a glass glass. No I like it poured into what a glass can that's all right OK. Brown paper bag you know. OK does the glass make a difference. It makes a difference. Yeah I mean there are some countries in Europe where if you poured the wrong beer into the right glass or vice versa it would be like well maybe a full pot belly. I don't necessarily drink my beer out of a bottle or can it. I don't even really use my

glasses that much anymore but I do enjoy even a red wine glass or a tulip glass just something that I can hold by the stem. Something that's going to you know allow whatever beer I'm drinking and carried a little bit or open up I mean beer opens up much the same as wine does depending on the kind of beer. So yeah I do like to use a glass and it's very important and in some places of the world cold to cold we need to answer these basic questions and we're at 8 7 7 3 0 1 89 70. If you have some questions like this as well 8 7 7 3 0 1 89 70. I know with wine I'm more of a wine person. You can get too cold on some chilling your wine. Is that the same thing with beer but beers images to be cold and crisp. Well let me just ask you if you've ever seen some of those commercials where things are like you know cold packed or whatever they are you know triple cold fermentation on the mass commercial and I think that's very funny because I think their message to people is drink this beer drink my beer. It's in the silver Ice Train bullet you know or whatever

the message is drink it it's cold and it's so refreshing. Well I beg to differ just a little bit because once you get it so-called Yeah it's frozen it's like frozen water. I mean you can't taste anything. Yeah. You know the the essence of freezing something or getting it so cold you just deadening the flavor so there's not a chill don't freeze. Yeah I mean you throw it in the fridge I mean that's where things go when you want to get them chilled and then you know depending on the beer and depending on one's expertise or not I hate using that word but like time and service or whatever with beer how long they've been drinking beer some people tend to want it a little bit warmer porters and stouts and maybe you want them to warm up a little bit. My glass I like is a brandy snifter. I don't know why but I like to drink beer out of a brandy snifter I don't care if it's an IPA or porter a stunt and the reason why is I can hold on to it and just by holding it in the palm of my hand I'm warming it up a little bit. And I'm getting it to more like cellar temperature as as we know.

It 54 55 degrees maybe a little bit less 52 because when you get it to that temperature it's much like wine. Yeah it's so perfect and you can smell everything you can smell every ingredient and you can really taste the ingredients. All right. I want to let everyone know that Ned Freedman actually teaches it. Now hops in general but certainly the origin of hops and that Darwinism and the evolution of it in a class I mean you're really quite an expert on hops from the structure of it the sells of it the whole thing so you're not just a home brewer and a gardener in disguise you're actually. Yeah. It's in the classroom. And in fact will be I'll be teaching a course this coming semester where we'll be recreating many of the experiments that Charles Darwin did with his children with his butlers with his family in his backyard at Down House. And so one of the actual meetings we'll have is all about his observations will read his

his words about how we grew the hops what he observed and I'm going to have the students doing the same things. We'll have time lapse cameras so we can actually watch them twirl around rather rapidly will make our own primary observations. So yes I mean one of the great things about plants is if you just take a few minutes you step outside and you come over to the Arnold Arboretum and look at all the other 15000 organisms. If you just look carefully the most amazing things will pop out and this is the essence of something I think far too few people realize about. Charles Darwin is he just looked and he kept looking and he just sat there and watched these plants and he did this with so many different things and that overall added up to the remarkable insights that he had. But we are going to have these plants growing for our students and they're going to be making observations. They'll be using razor blades and putting them in the microscope with sections. They're beautiful hairs on them. Not just the ones that are glandular that actually contain the chemicals but they have hairs that are actually calcified and are grappling hooks that help them to climb and attach to surfaces. You put all this under the microscope and it's like

looking through a telescope. Things light up. They're beautiful symmetrical. So yes I mean we rely on for that's one of the great things of having the arboretum as part of Harvard's great sets of collections. We can actually take students and we do this through our public programs to our neighbors and to make a plane in Roslindale West Roxbury as well as the greater Boston area. We can take our plants and we can sort of show you a totally different side of what you may have just walked by a million things and then looked inside. And here's a here's a tidbit that I did not know until I was informed. You tell us Charles Darwin apparently did not drink beer. Well isn't that interesting he did drink a little bit. And this actually has a funny I'll tell a short story about this. This began when I started to brew beer because I actually also some of my research is on actually understanding how evolution as a as a set of concepts developed before Charles Darwin's time but I love Charles Darwin in terms of reading his

biographies and certainly his work is remarkable. But I actually called a colleague of mine here at Harvard who was a great historian and an Darwinist Janet Brown and I who has written the you know most wonderful biography of Charles Darwin and the question was essentially w w DD What would Darwin drink. And we wanted to know if we could recreate. A recipe that we could brew at home that would mimic what Towles Darwin would have drunk when he was in London or later when he moved out to down. We know when he was in London he did drink some beer and there's a wonderful would that be like meat or something that no one in the standard English beer. I can't tell you I know exactly what it would have been that's part of you know what yeast were being used and that would have been carefully tracked. This hops would have been a fairly standard set of English hops no doubt. But but the interesting thing is his father was a medical doctor and Charles Darwin through out his life especially from his thirties and I think had tremendous

problems with the stomach. He was often violently ill. We don't quite know what the illness was but his father was a medical doctor and his father somewhere in the I think the early 1840s it may have been a lady 1830s wrote him a letter suggesting that the good way to calm his stomach would be to drink in India ale. And so we know that his own father essentially is a medical authority thought that Aylward is son Charles's stomach and we also know that when he was living in down that there was a brewery there. I don't know much about the history of it we're trying to find out more. But it's entirely possible that the beer that would've been ordered it down house would have been for the servants for the people who maintain the housing content you did wasn't a regular drinker but he did know what taste he had always certainly tasted it and he also corresponded with brewmasters. He was extremely interested in yeast and he wanted to know about yeast life cycles and one of the questions he had at some later point in his life was whether the yeast had to be renewed at certain intervals in

breweries. And so he actually I mean he was so interested in everything. It's hard to come up with a topic often that he didn't think about Charles Darwin but in this case he did write brewers and he didn't want to know information from the brew masters in the London area in England and so he was in contact with it. He was growing the hops in his backyard and he certainly would have drunk at various intervals in his life. Well from Ned Freeman's story about what would Darwin drink. I have to ask Suzanne and Kate if we don't know what Darwin exactly drank what would what would you suggest to people as their gateway to craft beer. So you've been drinking the other stuff. You're not quite well be the one beer if there is one or two you might suggest that people start with. I don't think there is one. I think there is maybe a stile a stile gate way and it depends of course on what what time of the year this is Kate had mentioned earlier I mean right now we're in the midst of hot weather it's been a hot week were selling a lot of

people are drinking a lot of the beers whether they're American made or are German styled or Belgian styled. All of those beers have sometimes up to 60 percent wheat in them which is a real thirst quencher they're lower in alcohol. Those are good places to start. I mean those are not incredibly overwhelming beers that I think that they have a have a big you know boisterous roasted malt flavor that might be a little scary some people don't like their coffee to better and I would assume they don't like there or they wouldn't like their beer to better. That's a good place to start. Belgium makes a lot of great beers too. People can always start with the lamb beaks and you know the raspberry and they they put a lot of fruit in beer and. Those are easy drinking they taste really great. I think also these days of Darwin. Historically speaking people might have been drinking pails or you know lighter ales or maybe English bitters something like you know

things that were a little less alcohol and not incredibly better I think that's what we're talking about and people come in all the time and say I don't like IPA is where I like stouts and I think what talking about is bitter and I like better. Well I think that also is the same thing with wine as well I hear that from people who say I don't like red wine and then you suggest something that might help them. It's usually lower in alcohol and less panic so same thing. Well this is been a really great conversation and the one thing I do know is that if you have any questions about it you can go to your store in Belmont and get some answers. And I now would like to grow some hops because I like climbing vines that I can control Ned Friedman and so I'm really interested in hops in a way that I didn't think I would be before. So I thank you. We've been talking beer with Ned Freedman director of Harvard University's Arnold Arboretum. He oversees the growing of hops at the Arboretum. Also with me our Kate Baker and Susan Shiloh the owners of craft beer cellar in Belmont. Up next a gerund Daily joins us for part two of our jobs and summer blockbuster conversation. If you missed part 1 you

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favorite WGBH programs that's online at WGBH dot org. Good afternoon I'm Kalee Crossley This is the Kelly Crossley Show the movie Jaws which hit theaters 36 years ago changed summer for ever. I'm not talking about instilling an enduring fear of killer sharks. I'm talking about the summer blockbuster. Joining me to talk about how Steven Spielberg and company forever changed the way films are seen and distributed is our film contributor film critic Karen daily. Gary welcome back. Well this is part two of our conversation because the first part we talked about how just sort of smashed everything and now we get transformers and Thor and everybody else in the summer. But what are these little films that are getting ignored because the other films take up so much space. It's not so much that they're getting ignored there's a whole thing out there called counter programming where if you're going to have the blockbuster there was part of the four quadrants as not being served next to people over 25 who have a little bit. They're not necessarily looking

for they have allowed the toys that make noise or the superheroes are looking for something a little class or for example Midnight in Paris is the big hit of the summer. It's the new Woody Allen film but it kind of put it in perspective. You know pirates pirates of the Caribbean On Stranger time has grossed nearly a billion dollars. Meanwhile the Woody Allen film which is the hot art film of the year has grossed less than 34 million dollars and it's considered a real success but it's probably going to have a longer time don't you think in the theater in the second run theaters. For the audience that you're talking about because out here let's just say my cohort might say I heard about that but I didn't rush to see it. I might see a little bit like that's exactly what happens with these films they find an audience and then the word of mouth associate wrong that they end up drawing people for a longer period of time. And the art houses love it because in terms of economics their film rental percentage goes down and they're able to make more money. Well that's good. One of the things there's no particular theme from some of the ones that you just wanted us to highlight but they are very they stand

out in their in their own way so I want to just let us take a listen to a trailer from the fantasy science fiction drama Another Earth. Production success. And I think there are some who say to ourselves but we like from ourselves. Like. To see. If we could stand outside the south of us. And look at us. Now when you think fantasy science fiction drama you do not thinking that somebody is asking you these kind of deep questions so I already you know it's a different kind of film it is a different kind of film and I tell you I just came back from interviewing the director and the writer and it all started with a concept a very simple concept. We have our inner monologues we talk to ourselves all the time. What if we met our own doppelganger and started talking to ourselves. That's the premise of the film and science fiction happened to be the vehicle to prove it. And this is a great story. But what's really interesting is you have these two young director and writer who are coming up this is one

of the reasons why you go see these films. You're going to hear about Brett Marling and Michail and the future and you get to see him in the very first film. Filmgoers people who love film love to be able to go and see the rising stars as before they become big Hollywood legends. Is it is it wrong to call these films sort of the thinking person's films or is that make them sound like they're dull and that's not what I mean. I think you should stay away from that because if I was marketing it I would not do that OK. You know what you want is you want to say this is a solid film this is a good film it's got a lot of intelligence behind it or it's got it's got something that will provoke a conversation. They're conversational forms that I've been reading that a lot of these indie films feels threatened not just because of the existence of these big films but because so much energy has gone to them that they're having a hard time getting the kind of distribution they might have in the past is that true. There's there's an element of truth in that and it's getting very scary out there when you look at what Transformers just did. And I want to talk about how much money it made where it made money its money

overseas and that's the big story this summer where these films are making a ton of money overseas. They're becoming global where these films are. Very idiosyncratic. You talked about another Earth. It's made in New Haven Connecticut so it's not like it's going to go over to Paris or go to someplace else and be translated you know into lots of languages and make a big scene over there. So there is that kind of threat. However if exhibitors are smart and their distributors are smart isn't very smart distributors out there you can nurse a film along and bring it along and develop its audience the importance is developing your niche and keeping the audience All right let's listen to another trailer. This is from the film beginnings beginners rather starring Christopher Plummer and Ewan McGregor. My parents got married in 1955. They had a child and they stayed married for 44 years until my mother died six months later my father told me he was gay. I'm sure he's gay the whole time they were married just

to be revealed to us. It's not Russia and there were. People half of them thinking straight after work out. Do you know how anything that you use. Now there seems to be some universal themes there that would sell well overseas as well. Yes it will suck but again we're not we're not talking about a billion dollars we're talking tens of millions of dollars. But here's an interesting thing Lou McGregor is and he is a big star. Melanie long run is and she's a big French star but who's going to see this film. The people who love Christopher Plummer. That's what's driving this film the people who remember him as Baron von Trapp from The Sound of Music are now seeing him in the later to later period and they make reference to the gay element but this is really a father son relationship that's very strong very well done very well directed. I highly recommend this film. What does this say. These films and how they maintain any presence and all about the role of the critic is the role of the critic diminished

so now that you cannot they can't get promoted to enough of the kind of audience that might be drawn to. Yes the answer is yes the role of the critic has been diminished for a lot of reasons. One is the studios wanted to because they did not want their films at the mercy of someone they couldn't control but also because criticism has been diluted by people who have opinions put them up on Rotten Tomatoes or whatever blogs that they want. So the criticism the quality of the criticism has diminished. And we as an audience are not willing to read a really good critic to find out what's going on. So yes that's that's that is that is an issue. The flipside of that is because the means of productions are so is so cheap these days. Anybody can go out with a hand-held camera and make a decent film for a couple hundred thousand dollars and hit it on their Mac book and get it into theaters. Let's talk about another of these guys just went out and did it for less than a hundred thousand dollars. They had more specs later on but they were able to make a film and have an impact. So even though there is been diminishment There's also been

the ability to make films cheaply and there is an audience out there. Well let me talk about the other side of my mouth and ask this question that is can the internet then be used to promote in a way I mean that's you know no critic is involved there but because people use their influencers whomever they may be to say gee you should make sure you see this is that working for these films. Some of that is and some of it is it really depends on a lot of different elements of the film. Sometimes as a distributor there are some distributors who insist that not only will you go in theaters but you're going to go day and date on the Internet and that that's what they insist on doing they figure that they can make a stronger market for it. Others insist that we go out to theaters first and do a traditional platforming of the film in select cities and expand and grow it. An example would be Tree of Life the new Terrence Malick film. There's only 200 prints and the entire country. Well that's small. That's very very small. It's they believe in the film but they also know that there's just so much of a market for there and keep their costs in line they're only going to make 200 or so prints.

Here's something else there's not there seem to be more interest in documentaries However you're defining them these days. Let's take a listen to one that I think is going to get some fair amount of attention this is called Chasing maid off. I. Led you to this pile of dung that is Bernie made up and stuck your nose in it and you couldn't figure it out. So what the FCC was paid to look the other way. I'm not participating in the current investigation. Due to the fact that a former employee married a member of the made off family and I attended the wedding. And all powerful people standing to gain a lot a lot of. Times like the more the crime. The rule. You know people know the Madoff story. I think they'd like to see the behind the scenes. Again we talk a little about this in the past. Part of the problem has been the mainstream media and cable media have failed to really address dear. I have considered there. Need to let inform people

and they've really gone to end rather than really information. The documentary has filled that need and there's like five or six really good ones coming out this summer. You just mentioned chasing Maida. There's magic trip directed by Alex get me to taxi to the dark side which is all about Ken Casey's magical bus tour. There is tabloid by Earl Morris from Cambridge which is a story about a young girl going to England and getting involved in a scandal got a lot of buzz Yeah there's Page One Inside the New York Times and one of them very high on that I do recommend you get a chance to see. It's called Buck it's out there now. It's a wonderful story about the original horse whisperer and how his ability to talk to horses has helped his life and other people's lives. Now you we've mentioned that there's this there's a target audience for this primarily that you can expand it of course. I just have to ask this question do you think that because in economic times of stress that people just want loud and noisy and no food and nothing that causes me to have to rise above an inch of thought. I would say the majority of the audience wants to go to a movie that they know they're going to feel very comfortable with

and they're going to get a certain kind of emotional response to it. But I also know that there are a lot of people out there and you can just take a look at any newspaper and look at the ads for all the art houses that are out there. There are houses in Concord that just opened about eight nine years ago. You know there are houses in Cambridge and Boston are doing well. There are people who are supporting these art houses because they want to be challenged. They want to be entertained on many different levels. So yes the majority of film goers are being assuaged by these wonderful big bang you know special effects easy to understand stories. But there again there's an also a very large audience out there and I think that if the exhibitors are smart they will start playing to that audience because that audience is going to be much loyal or then the you know the fickle Transformers Green Hornet Green Lantern kind of people. I note that Leonard Maltin of some note for many years on TV critic has now taken to the Huffington Post every month pointing out indie films that people should see. That's right you mentioned one book. Any others that we definitely should see this summer.

Well there's one it's a horror film that I'm very keen on called Attack of the Block it is from Engelen. But if you remember in Casablanca when Major Strasser is talking to Rick and he's talking about well what if the German troops were rushed into New York City and Humphrey Bogart goes. Well there are some parts of New York City that I wouldn't want to. Well Alan's envy of London and there are parts of London that they shouldn't go into. Whistleblowers another one with Rachel wise the debt guard Brendan Gleason. There are some very good films out there. OK we're going to put them up on the website so you can see what Garin recommends. We've been talking about the film just spawn the summer blockbuster. And I've been joined by our film contributor film critic Karen Daly talking about the small gems to keep an eye on. Thanks Karen. My pleasure. You keep on top of the Calla Crossley Show at WGBH dot org slash Calla Crossley follow us on Twitter or become a fan of the callee Crossman show on Facebook. We are production of WGBH radio Boston NPR station for news and culture.