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From WGBH in Boston this is the Emily Rooney show. It's Monday Nov. 28 2011 on Emily Rooney. After more than 30 years in office Congressman Barney Frank is calling it quits. It marks a stark turnaround from earlier this year when he said he had every intention of seeking another term. Frankly if you Sheen as someone who is leaving your point I don't want to really begin to learn what's behind the decision we'll take a look at Frank's career as we raise our Monday political periscope. Charlie Baker and Shannon O'Brien join us for more than four decades Rhonda has been bringing music and music legends to the Boston Airways including right here on WGBH. He joins us. It's all coming up this hour on the Emily Rooney show. But first the news. From NPR News in Washington I'm Lakshmi saying U.S.

investors are delivering a strong start to the holiday shopping season. The market opened the day sharply higher with initial reports showing a record number of consumers taking advantage of post Thanksgiving Day sales. Investors also appear to be more optimistic about Europe's prospects in getting its debt troubles under control. At last check on Wall Street the Dow is up three hundred ten points or 2.7 percent at eleven thousand five hundred forty two. Germany and France are accelerating a push to come up with strict new budget rules as the countries try once again to find a way out of the eurozone sovereign debt crisis. NPR's Eric Westervelt has details from Berlin. There is a core agreement between Berlin and Paris on the need to move faster toward more fiscal coordination and to impose strict debt limits. But the two nations disagree on details. Germany wants new fiscal rules security and changes to EU treaty. France says treaty changes will take too long. The countries hope to outline plans for deeper fiscal union among the

17 nations that use the euro. The head of a European Union summit on December 9th. The German finance ministry today dismissed a report that Germany and France want to float jointly issued bonds with the euro zone's for other top triple-A rated economies. A ministry spokesman says Germany wants a stability union anchored by treaty changes in which the budgets of member states must observe debt limits. Eric Westervelt NPR News Berlin. Democratic Congressman Barney Frank is expected to formally announce this afternoon that he will not run for re-election next year. The 71 year old lawmaker from Massachusetts was first elected to the U.S. House in one thousand eighty. He was among the first openly gay politicians to serve in Congress. And in recent years Representative Frank helped spearhead the most sweeping overhaul of the country's financial system. In response to the US's economic meltdown. The Democratic National Committee is out with a new advertisement that takes on Republican presidential candidate Mitt Romney. NPR's Brian Naylor reports the ad knocks

Romney for switching his position on a number of issues. The ad is airing on TV stations in five swing states done in the style of a movie trailer the spot pokes fun at what Democrats believe to be Romney's biggest vulnerability his changing views on a number of issues from the creative about running for office for peace. Say comes the story of two men trapped. One person is missing. I mean I goes on to show Romney's contradicting views on abortion and health care reform. It's a clear signal Democrats view Romney as the likely GOP presidential nominee and an indication of the line of attack Democrats and the White House are likely to take against him. Brian Naylor NPR News Washington. At last class the Dow was up 310 points 2.7 percent at eleven thousand five hundred forty two. This is NPR. A family is suing Florida A&M University for the recent death of a marching band member Robert Champion was found November 19th on a bus parked outside an Orlando Florida hotel

after the school's football team lost a game. Champion's family believes hazing was involved in the 26 year old's death. Attorney Christopher Chestnut says a death especially during the holidays was devastating. Robert just called to say he was coming home for Thanksgiving and so his family is it anticipate his return to land they thought he was coming home. They had no idea of anticipating he coming to Willie Watkins funeral home when he came back to Atlanta. Police suspect hazing but have not released further details. Michael Jackson's private physician Conrad Murray is in jail awaiting his sentencing tomorrow for his role in the pop icon's 2009 death. NPR's Karen Grigsby Bates reports that Dr. Murray's lawyers were denied additional tests on the evidence found in Jackson's room. Dr. Murray's lawyers asked Judge Michael Pastor to allow additional tests on the bottle of the anesthetic pro-football that was found in Jackson's bedroom on the morning of his death. But Judge Pastor refused the request telling Dr. Murray's defense team they'd had ample time before now to request extra tests. This exhibit has been around since the inception of the case the L.A.

Times quoted the judge. There is no justification for the court to respond favorably to this type of extraordinary motion. The possibilities for Dr. Murray sentence range from house arrest to a maximum of four years. Karen Grigsby Bates NPR News. The outlook for recovery in housing remains Gray. The Commerce Department found more than 1 percent increase in the number of new homes sold in October. But sellers are still having trouble unloading their houses median sales price has fallen to its lowest level this year. This is NPR. Support for NPR comes from the Joyce Foundation working to improve the quality of life in the Great Lakes region. Learn more at Joyce ftn dot org. It's live and it's local. Coming up next two hours of local talk the Emily Rooney show and the Kelly Crossley Show. Only on WGBH. Good afternoon you're listening to the Emily Rooney show it's Monday which means it's time to put up our

political periscope and see what's on the horizon this week. You know boy there's a lot so far in just about an hour Congressman Barney Frank is making an appearance at Newton City Hall announcing that he will not be running for a 17th term. It's odd because according to his most recent FEC filing Frank raise $700000 between January and September this year more than any other member of the delegation by a lot. We're going to start our political person discussion here. I'm joined by Charlie Baker who's of course the former Republican candidate for governor and former CEO of Harvard Pilgrim healthcare and Shannon O'Brien former state treasurer right speculation abounds here. What do you think Charlie running. Well I don't see a slew of ways not your district so not yet announced yet. Very funny. My guess is that it probably has a lot to do with maybe a little bit with the redistricting but I think a lot of it probably has to do with the fact that he's concluded the Republicans are probably holed out of the house and so a lot more fun to be a member of Congress when your team has the ball.

Yeah I'd have to agree I mean I think it's a lot. I think you would win if you ran. Again I don't think there's any question in my mind anyway. But I do think it was going to be a lot harder for him he was going to have to go out and meet new people he has a lot of great friends in New Bedford that have supported him through thick and thin over the you know several decades that he's been in office and ultimately at the end what does he win. I don't think that it's it's a lot of fun for him anymore. You know you know he was back in February he actually basically said to any CM to that point Charlie that the fact that the GOP was holding on was a reason he thought he should run Here's a little what he had to say. If we were still in the majority might have been a different decision. But I there were some things that I think are very important that are at risk with what I think is an irresponsible majority now in the house not the mainstream conservatives but people who I think you know want to go back to totally unregulated financial issues.

So he's basically saying I mean he can come around and say it but he thought well you know this there's a lot there to still fight for so he was talking about it sounded like he was talking about running for 17. But that was also before the redistricting I mean that's correct and yesterday was just last two weeks or so. So I think I do believe that he you take a look at what the extra work is required with the extra fund raising is your quality of life. And then you have at the end of the rainbow a prize that is really just I don't know there's probably not not nice words to say about it but not a great prize. And in his mind I think that it was the combination of what you win at the end what you ultimately get to do or don't get to do from his perspective. And it's going to be a more difficult race a more taxing race and he did lose a community in New Bedford that was solidly in his corner over the course of his history and had a bunch of issues that he really cared about I mean I. I actually commented during the campaign at one point last year that I thought Barney was the only person who was in office who was doing a heck of a lot of heavy lifting to represent the fishing industry down there.

I still think that and that's something to lose with the loss in New Bedford. Yeah I mean so what do you think I mean what's I think I'm going to. Well I think that child who's not really good looking I was already in the race this is certainly this is certainly a big bump I don't know her and I would expect that there will be a lot of other people who jump in. Some speculation that Dan Winslow might get in. Yeah Dan might get in but I he's having an awfully good time because you're going to Iraq and he's crazy because he might just choose to prefer to do that. He's also got a pretty decent law practice here. What do the Democrats do you think. Well I mean Mark but Chico has run for Congress before. I know that Tom Sawyer who is the newly elected mayor in Taunton you know be a rising star in the party maybe a little bit soon because he just got elected Setti Warren. You say why would he dare do that after. Look I this notion that you get elected to one job and immediately start running for another when I don't I don't have a use for people like

that I don't know I don't I think if you run you get elected you should serve the job you got elected to do period. I think that was interesting. How do you know anything Charlie you think the residents of Newton felt same way and I'm only teasing him about our former governor that is also good fun here. Which one. All of our four Yeah right. Well I'm talking to Mike Dukakis was running for president 10 minutes after he got reelected let's say for a couple of terms but he was he was there for him he didn't he serve at least three terms and yet he served three at least three or four maybe just felt like one he served two terms and then he lost and then he came back and that's right that's right. Let's see who else I mean John Peel that really gave Barney Frank the best run for his money since 1984. Margaret Margaret Hechler race where they're both fighting for one district is that was the last time we had. Not only do we have redistricting we lost a district same as this time so. So it should be I mean if you're if you're a Republican

he's like your dream candidate he's a former Marine He's Harvard Business School work for I Robot which is sort of your quintessential Massachusetts company likeable smart you know smile almost never left his face the entire time he was campaigning is good. You like that he enjoyed it. He raised a lot of money and I need to give Barney a room but in the end he lost. I don't understand. I mean again you know when you run for a congressional seat like this obviously there is a loose residency requirement but you don't have to be a resident of the district until you actually take office. We've seen you know stealing and other people so I don't really understand why he might have done is a little in the funny and literally Conan who ran for Congress against John over lived in Springfield. Well I'm just saying there there is a residency requirement but it's incredibly loose and anybody can move into the district to run and because these districts the lines have been shifting it wouldn't be out of the ordinary and statewide races.

Oh it's good to see the city. That's a really interesting observation. Yeah. Who else though I mean you know I don't know but I mean again Bill Bill Keating technically didn't live I mean he'd had a home fall many many years I don't gloss over. I think she may be interested in running for mayor again I think that there are some people who you know are talking to her about that. But I think that maybe more on her plate right now. Setti Warren of course has only been in office what was it two years now he was elected two years he was in November and he jumped into the Senate race last winter and then got out when it looked like it was with Warren was going to be the defacto nominee for the Senate race but he is somebody who's made it clear though that his political ambitions go beyond being Mary even though Charlie I mean as you noted a few minutes ago I mean I don't I don't think the president's Well we did some scientific surveys ourselves and you know nobody was enthusiastic about that but that doesn't mean he won't he won't try it.

Yeah I mean I think that he probably will take a look at something like that. There are there are there are a number of state senators that are that are in that in that district but it takes a lot and you know it's really this scary thing is how few people do want to run for these higher offices. I mean you look at how few you know usually when there's an opening for a down ballot race Treasurer auditor or whatever you know there's multiple multiple candidates will be four five six candidates running in a primary. You don't see that anymore. It is so expensive and it is so bruising and it is so partisan. Once you get beyond state rep state senator I mean and it still is even at that lower level you have to really want something like that to put yourself out there to put your family through that and the commitment of time and resources and then the beating up that you get any and I can both attest to that. It's not a lot of fun when you look at this not only is this a statewide race if you look at it that way but it's a national race we were just listening to it was absolutely national radio and they had Barney Frank as part of the newscast I mean it's fascinating when you go back and you really look at some of this I mean he's

he's bold he's outrageous he's rude he's got a history there's almost no way no hyperbole to that that doesn't fit on Barney Frank. I mean I was in his district I couldn't believe the stuff he would say and get away with I mean going way back he had that incident with the with. You know a lover that was with him he was not center that was of course Gerry Studds but he had controversy in his in his career. Oh absolutely. And won re-election with 60 percent of the vote. Every time of the last one if you want pushback at have on that though is the way that district was drawn it was drawn in many respects for him to hold it I mean I think one of the things the legislature tried to do this past time which I give him credit for was they try to draw some districts that actually look like they might actually not really have struck and I didn't read it but I'm going to quote Barney when it was first drafted it was absolutely the opposite not drafted to help him. It was drafted to help a Republican Margaret Heckler because Barney was not in favor

with the Democrats in power running the House and Senate at the time. I remember I was a I was a young woman that was just for your you or your listeners this is like 1979 right. No it is 1982 because I graduated he's doing OK but I'm just saying it's a long long time ago but I was saying that's when gerrymandering was still director. But but Barney. Carney has in his in his own words has represented close to a quarter of the state. It has been moved left and right. He has run in every single district. But when they put that district originally together they put him in with Margaret Hackler fully expecting as he did that he would lose and she would be the last person standing. And he beat her so you know a lot of people have talked about gerrymandering as a way of protecting him when it was initially put together. It was to protect the honorable men and the only Republican of the district before that was put in place I think it was Joe Martin I think that's what was he was again that's I don't even remember I just just because there's just because there's a lot of bad behavior on both sides doesn't

mean you're right though that I just the district starts with that in Brookline which are democratic strongholds and runs a pencil thin line right down through a series of democratic towns with all kinds of Republican towns around it to Fall River New Bedford and then dropped a minute. I'm not disagreeing I'm just saying you have to look at a lot of people were casting aspersions about this being a Democratic seat it originally was gerrymandered to protect a powerful Republican and I whatever rate it's been you know and I agree with you Stanley Rosen and the others. I don't have sense for a change that the contiguous cities and towns I mentioned that well and you can. I think you can thank also a little bit John over for that because I think that you know made some of those decisions politically for some of those legislators a lot easier and I think that they do a lot of sense and they may have been going in that direction anyway. But I think it was I think they did a very good job. But there isn't a good story about that as I actually think the redrawing of the districts has a lot to do with why Congress is so partisan. I mean the old days most of these people had to represent a lot of

different points of view. But over the course of the last 20 or 30 years as we've gone through two or three versions of each district has become more Republican or more democratic and people started worrying no longer about whether or not they're going to be challenged in the general election they started worrying about whether they'd be challenged from the other side in their primary. And that's made people I think in some respects far less. Affected by this notion that you have to find someplace to agree and in fact just the opposite are you going to stand up and be the standard bearer for the for the base of your. Your point is why I mean Sean P. that really had no chance last time even though he was a good candidate he was a credible candidate he had no chance just for the reason that Charlie was talking I fear he talked some interesting statistics about this new district and you know I don't know if you want to share them but I think that they are you know very interesting this is a very competitive seat for the district is Scott Brown won at 55 45. I tied with the governor and 46 46 and Tim Cahill got seven I think.

And and the president when in the last presidential election won it 61 38 or something like that. And this is a presidential year we've got coming up here so. I mean I think it's certainly people are tired of that as with the president at this point. What do you think about why Barney Frank would have been raising money is just because he can. I think he made this decision very late in the game I think he made it after the redistricting again I think that maybe and I don't know this but you see town over Thanksgiving dinner. You've raised this money. You start looking at the map you start looking at what the year ahead is going to be like for your 71 years. And maybe you just say OK you know what do I win at the end and again what has been happening in the past month is not only did the redistricting happen but the stance the standoff with the super committee I mean at some point in time you go what do you win if you're if you're from Barney's you maybe get a job with Fannie Mae now maybe.

I mean that's a good one IMO. Thanks. Well I mean you have to admit this guy really understands the you know the financial workings of not only our government but you know the housing market. I mean he would be attracted to somebody I would think I don't know if he would ever be compromised that way. Do you mean to actually run that. Yeah I mean again we look at Elizabeth Warren and you know someone who is probably the most competent to run an agency who's been putting something forth was not able to pass congressional muster senatorial confirmation so I don't know what happened. Bill Weld couldn't get confirmation to be ambassador to where Mexico I mean you know the politics of it being qualified being able to do a good job being supported by your president doesn't always help you. You're listening to the Emily Rooney show I am joined here in the studio by Charlie Baker and Shannon O'Brien we're talking all things political this Monday morning. There's also a story in your district this morning truly about John Tierney six district congressman.

The globe has really been all over this story and when it first broke I think it's been almost a year that it's been a little over that. John Terry his wife Patrice was managing the family finances for her brothers who had been accused of running an illegal offshore gambling operation in the Caribbean. She served I think I call it marking a tremendous amount of money on a tax free but haven't any money I mean. And John Tierney has said he knew nothing about the Operation Yewtree said she would have what was her term I had blinders on or you know my willful blindness was lying. But now when you really peel back some of this her two brothers have been involved really with criminal enterprise since their teenage years I mean going back to drug deals and it you know it. The point being here that there seems to be a guilt by association that she had to

know. Therefore John Tierney had to know which could make him vulnerable this time around as well do you think so true. I think that look I think any time any incumbent gets tangled up in any kind of scandal given the fact that some portion of the voting population doesn't pay that much attention to this stuff until it's like closer to Election Day it's a problem but I think the bigger issue for Tierney is that a lot of the key issues up in that district. He just he's been absent. I mean the biggest one to me the fishing issue I mean the the folks that issue is something I really care about. And I. I spent a lot of time in Glasgow during the campaign and the people in glass doing the fishing folks up there don't think tourney's been particularly responsive to their concerns. He's kind of let Barney be the one to carry the water and Scott Brown on behalf of the delegation and that's a huge issue in that part of the state. I also think that it's a reasonably what I would describe as diverse district but there's a lot of folks in that district who care about things like balancing the federal budget in the federal deficit.

And on those issues I don't think tyranny is much of a track record either. I think he's he's partially vulnerable because of this but he's also vulnerable because of his record. Again anytime you're an incumbent and you're talking about criminal matters that has any shape or form in the other you know coming close to you it's not a good thing. And so I think it's going to be a much tougher race for him next year I would not be surprised if a potential primary challenge were. You know in the offing but again you don't see a lot of people challenging incumbents regardless of you know the opportunity there I guess that's probably a sort of a crude word to say but any speculation that he might not run. I have and I think you'll run. I do I think you'll run you'll get a lot uglier if he does. Well he's not so I mean if I may Bill who Jack's going to run again which I think the bigger issue for Tony is Richard to say he's running and I'm obviously supporting Richard he was my running mate when we ran when I ran for governor. But most of Richard Richard owns a

big piece of that district already from his days in the state Senate and the people in that district level. So he's coming into this with a real base and in redistricting to get back to that they also picked up some communities in that district that voted for Richard in me when we were in. And and I think the district as a result is probably more likely to lean in our direction than it might have been before I think that's OK. And it wasn't it wasn't a hugely Democratic overwhelming Democratic district to begin with so it has become a little bit more public and. All right you're listening to the Emily Rooney show we're going to have more later. Today's been a factor on Barney Franks decision to not seek reelection this afternoon he's having a press conference at Newton City Hall WGBH is Sarah burn bomb is there and she's going to be calling into the Kelly Crossley Show as soon as word comes in from Barney Frank on on why he has made this decision to take a short break when we continue more political news to sift through when we continue the Emily Rooney show. Stay with us. WGBH programs exist because of you.

And Newberry court a full service residential community for persons over the age of 62. Newberry court invites you to schedule a visit any day of the week including Saturdays and Sundays to schedule. You can visit Newbury CT dot org. And great performances Andrea Bocelli and David Foster as my Christmas. This popular PBS holiday special returns featuring Natalie Cole the Muppets and the Mormon Tabernacle Choir tonight at 9:00 on WGBH too. And the members of the WGBH sustainer program whose gifts of five ten or twenty dollars a month make up the most reliable income for the programs you love. On eighty nine point seven learn more about sustaining membership at WGBH dot org. Actor Danny Burstein has played a wide range of roles from casino owner lolly Steinman and HBO as Boardwalk Empire to his current role as Buddy Plummer in the Broadway revival of Follies. The new cast recording of follies with music and lyrics by Stephen Sondheim comes out November 29 on the next FRESH AIR we talk with Danny Burstein about his career in theater and television. Join us.

Tomorrow morning at 7:00 here on eighty nine point seven. WGBH. Holiday have a come and go too quickly. This year take some time to savor the season with a Christmas Celtic soldiery hosted by WGBH is Bryan and Donovan this live show combines traditional carols and dance with lots of wonderful surprise. Learn more and reserve two of the best seats in the house with a gift of $150 online at WGBH dot org slash Celtic. Welcome back to this into the Emily Rooney show it's Monday and we're talking all things political I'm joined here in the studio by former Republican candidate for governor Charlie Baker and

former state treasurer Shannon O'Brien we're going to move on now to some national politics over the weekend. The Manchester Union Leader and New Hampshire they love to make a splash whatever they do even if it's just to be quirky or a little different whatever anyway. They endorsed for the Republican nomination Newt Gingrich. When you make that Charlie just said he liked you. Yeah. Well they certainly made a splash with that one. I think it's. Look I think it's anytime you get the endorsement of any major newspaper in any race it's a good thing. But elections are ultimately decided by voters. And in New Hampshire it's got a 20 point 30 point lead depending upon which poll you look at over everybody else in the field up there and. And I think it would be shocking if it didn't end up one of them. What's their issue with Mitt anyway. I think the union leader is not conservative enough.

I think it applies partially that I also think that use it. Well I think it's also part of it I think it's also just familiarity. You know he's been watching him for a really long time and sometimes the shiny new one is always a little more interesting than the old familiar ones and they've been whipping through the new ones faster than is like that ripped through every single one of the candidates now except Rick Santorum is sort of the flavor and Paul hasn't gotten him yet. Well I do think that they are very familiar with Mitt and I think that that's the problem I think that they've watched you know very closely when you know in 2002 in my campaign where he was a you know pro-choice pro-gay rights against signing a no new taxes pledge and they were able to see him flip on just about every sort of core issue that he spoke about during his campaign for governor. So I do think that familiarity can breed contempt here and I think that they are looking to make a raise and New Hampshire is an interesting place. Having not only worked on some campaigns but actually been on the ground making telephone calls. It's a funny funny state in terms of

how quickly people can and do change their minds we saw with Barack Obama and Hillary Clinton the polls. There was only one pollster I think was David Paleologos who said I think Hillary can win most pollsters had Barack Obama winning that primary fight New Hampshire the last time around. But I do think that people can and do change their minds there perhaps because they get barraged so intensely that they you know go to the polls and they get a good look at everybody the other thing I remember is New Hampshire is one of those primaries where the independents are allowed to vote whichever primary they want and they can be a big I mean most people would argue that we can do better there. Yes but most most people would argue a big part of John McCain's win was partially due to Republican support but also due to the fact that he got a ton of independent votes as well. And and I think when you have a contested primary on the Republican side which you have you don't have one of the Democratic side it means the independents who want to play are going to have to vote on the Republican side and they'll tend to join the moderates I think that helps Mitt Romney get your take on this whole ad war thing trolling last week.

Want Romney released an anti-Obama ad taking a comment that an aide to Senator John McCain had made about the economy and the quote is if we focus on the comany on the economy we will lose the state was made by an aide to John McCain. Obama was repeating it you know to some audience or other. He takes that clip as if it was Obama's own words puts it in the ad so that this week it looks like Mitt Romney is getting his own comeuppance with an ad that's focused you know specifically on his flip flopping his just a little bit. Look I was an independent during the time of Reagan Bush. I'm not trying to return to Reagan Bush the principles of that rug that Ronald Reagan espoused are as true today as they were when he spoke them. There you go again. That was really cute they use that little clip of you know from one of the great debates up in New Hampshire of Ronald your mind and I was there you go again. Jimmy Carter that was Jimmy Carter you know Jimmy Carter. So you know and the ad goes on and on and it's very cleverly done. You know

abortion usually are you know exactly so. Look I you know I find it fascinating that everybody in Boston is all a twitter about Mitt Romney's ad when and people have been running negative ads about Scott Brown that have nothing to do with Scott Brown's voting record for the better part of six months you know that EPA thing was still in the I don't even know what it's about. You know my my point here is that we're entering the political season we're going to see a lot of ads and and I've come to the conclusion that. If an ads against your candidate it's a negative ad if an ads against the candidate your candidates running against it's not a negative ad and we should all just get used to the fact that that's just part of the game you know I've talked about it we have I know I mean do you think a lot of the ads. I certainly don't believe that a lot of the ads are running against me everywhere particularly accurate and I'm sure you know feel that way about a lot of the ones I think you know I do think that this kind of steps over a sort of on this isn't there Brian I think it's a little bit different because he truly wasn't saying that. And it's one thing I think to sort of take a

sliver of your position. For instance I think that one of the complaints that the Romney people are making that Romney has talked about making certain cuts and changes in the future for Medicare Medicaid things like that. Well you know the way I put so much farther down the road than the president is on that issue is actually the sitting executive office and has taken no position so far and what he thinks we should do in the title means so is Oprah. So my letter but my but my point is that they're taking something that has a grain of truth in it and then extrapolating. I can understand that and that's probably what's happened to you I know that things have happened like that to me. But here he he it wasn't his sentiment it's not what he says. It's an absolute lie. I mean that's the only word that I can use to describe that particular ad. And I have seen some very funny ones. What you're talking about in the sound clip that you just made is a flip flop bad and that's a little bit different. I've seen them on the Internet where they did exactly to Romney what he did to Obama which is taking these little clips out of his mouth saying America is just a

country without a flag. I mean it with the flag. There are very very funny ones and if they do that to him I think that he does seem this does seem to be a different thresholds different completely an invisible line but it's I don't I think you guys. Well I guess I think that that invisible line where you draw that line is a function of who you support. And look two of the votes that I know that's got guiding down in that League of Conservation Voters passed the Senate 94 to nothing. All right. I'm sorry how you can call Scott Brown a polluter when two of the two of the votes that he took when he said that when I was at Iowa once he answers what do you call that. Yes I mean it doesn't matter I mean there are basically simple things many of them those answer. I just I think when you I know what they're talking about I think people get indignant about ads against their candidates and they think oh I won. Something about most of the ads I don't know and I guess that's true I've been very consistent and has been very sort of there but it's also the money again it's it is these these sort

of nameless faceless groups that are not held accountable in terms of their advertising that I think is the real problem not so much the content of them. But when you do start of get into this negative brush I think it just undercuts the entire fabric of our country of our culture when everything is run like this I mean I almost think that there could be an added rule that if you're going to spend these unlimited amounts of money through these corporate shells whatever that there needs to be some sort of a truth meter attached to it on both sides. I mean that's what bothers me it's the anonymous unlimited amount of money that's going into these negative ads that frankly just discourages people from the whole political process to begin with. Well I think the hard part about that is campaign finance reform tries desperately every time they pass it to make it harder and harder for people to raise money and spend it on TV and people get clever about how they can figure out how to do it. My view on all this is we should get rid of all that stuff and just make all the campaign stuff totally transparent. Absolutely. And get out of this business of trying to figure out how to regulate our way out of a First Amendment issue that we're never going to be able to solve by the Charlie Baker and Shannon O'Brien What did you make Charlie of

Herman Cain's Cain's claim this weekend that he's a victim of a media smear. Talk about you know because the news media was pursuing this. Charges that he had sexually harassed people when he was you know you know having been a candidate you know one of the rules you learn as a candidate is as soon as you complain about the coverage you're getting in the media. That's usually considered to be a bad idea Rast Let's call the rat a last refuge of scoundrels. You know in the media everybody who's ever run for office thinks they've been the victim of a media smear at one time or another and we have seen. Yeah right exactly. That's what I think you could do in a plane and sort of keep the chin up and forget about it. But that's all I mean that's the whole point is this guy just didn't count enough to to seriously be in the words of the press vetted. And there's always I can remember the first time I ran for statewide office and some reporter saying well you have to be vetted. I'm like what does that even mean and it was basically going through everything that you've done and trying to

expose any sort of negative nits and gnats and whatever they could find about you. He just never counted before and I think he fully believed that no one would do that to him and so I think that it's sort of a harsh awakening for a businessman who's not used to that kind of scrutiny and not used to that kind of hardball. But I mean he was one of the flavors of the month not just in New Hampshire but in other places across the country. And what was that all about. I mean I I. Never again for someone like that I think that that's also why he's really compelling research I know he speaks he speaks in ways where people listen and Huntsman whom of all the Republicans that are running right now I actually have perhaps the most sort of enthusiasm respect whatever for. He is just so plain vanilla he never breaks out so people go oh what is this guy saying. I do think that part of the part of the appeal of a guy like Herman Cain is he's just fun to listen to. I mean when he talks about stuff there's a real person there and I think that well you know you have to be your type of

candidate. I think it's always struck me as you know radical fringe but I could be wrong. But he says he says some crazy things that get people talking. He's good copy and that I think unfortunately is you know one of the factors that makes some of these campaigns move and gets coverage Huntsman's not not exciting. He's just there I mean and Newt has not I think been and maybe interesting I don't know Charlie what your take on this why you think he's just sort of evolved and run to the front because he's very smart. I think he's. Right. That's why he's moved because he's really smart and he's done really well. No waiting attention to his vetting yet. Well he's been vetted I mean other things will happen. People forget. Well I don't know I think for the media anyway you know you're right the first time and that's when they have event happens and with with Newt they've already done all that. So a lot of the stuff that they might choose to talk about you know Newt's campaign and even a lot of people in the media are going to say you know that's kind of oh yeah you know we

already that's already baked into the price of the stock as well when but if we're going to actually maintains momentum and then those over the whatever over the line out over the line ads against him start in South Carolina. I think you're going to see you know I think you're going to see people now being reminded of the stories that you know he's gotten out in front of that already you know. He did a whole tick tock on that thing with the first marriage and you know the media has picked up a story line which I I didn't actually realize was not true but talk about things that get repeated and repeated and I know exactly where he said that that he served divorce papers while his wife lay dying. And this was in the 80s Well guess what she's still alive. So you know that was and I don't know. We're going to meet the president yeah. So and there was just a big line by line on that what happened with the second marriage and I do think you know the way performances really have had a lot to do with his movement in the polls. He's been good I mean you're following the write ups that come from all the national

the national press who follow the race and almost all of them in every debate see groups that are really good just so. So what do you make of him and his position on immigration. And I thought that that was actually probably a very reasonable and rational thing to say I was a little surprised that he said it right. But what why is there such a pushback on that. You know basically he said that you can't just start deporting hundreds of thousands of people who have been in this country for 30 years have got a stablished families and jobs in many cases you know it's a network of people you can't just selectively tap people on the shoulder and he said I mean Romney said a few years ago but I think he's the only Republican except for maybe Ron Paul and Rick Perry I forget. But he's he's the only one who's actually talking about it right now much to the point I don't understand what happens in some of these more conservative states. I think the big issue is that most people don't believe that until you secure the borders and create a you know sort of almost like a. A consensus that there is no longer a lot of folks who are breaking the law coming into the country I don't

think anybody's going to want to talk about anything that solves the problem with the folks who are already here. But wouldn't most people not their heads and say Yeah the guy makes a point. I don't think anybody disputed that he was making a point the larger question is whether it's the right point or the first point or the first step the big the big issue as I've always seen this issue when it gets debated nationally is you know and it's not that much different to some extent than the super committee debates which is stop fix the borders deal with the people who are here right and the debate always comes down to people want to deal with the people who are here and don't want to fix the border problem while other people want to fix the border problem and not deal with the people who are here at some point you probably have to do both. But you're never going to win. When the debate on one side or another if you don't focus on both of those pieces. Right. I mean I do Charlie Baker and Shannon O'Brien for our Monday morning or afternoon I guess it is now political periscope Thanks for join us you guys. I think you've thank you soon I hope.

All right. You send us an e-mail. Emily Rooney show at WGBH dot org. Talk to us on our Facebook pages at WGBH dot org slash Emily Rooney. We're going to take a short break when we continue. Radio's Rhonda like USA radio at the book his radio with CNN about their radio my way. Goodness this is the Emily Rooney show Ron Della Chiesa is next. We'll be right back. Yes. This program is on WGBH thanks to you. And Russell's a family tradition for

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Join us and hear the World coming up at 3 o'clock here at eighty nine point seven WGBH. This season get the most out of your gift giving by placing a bit during the Third Annual WGBH holiday auction. Name your price on one of a kind getaway. Beautiful jewelry and other unique gifts while supporting public broadcasting at the same time. This year's big ticket item is a fully loaded 2011 Saab 9 for X premium SUV with cross wheel drive donated by your New England visit WGBH insights ideas and opinions about issues here in Boston who is now the park manager at the Cape Cod can now chose trails for new construction bicycles horses and off road vehicles. Local issues local time Boston Public Radio. Welcome back to this into the Emily Rooney show Rondo like Eiza has been a fixture of

Boston radio for more than 40 years. He got his first gig at WB o s in 1959 and has worked all over town including of course right here at WGBH where he hosted Music America among other programs and as he tells it the only thing originally separating him from a long and successful radio career was a thick Boston accent. Mondello is here with his new book radio my way. So Ron I was going to first ask you how you got rid of your Boston accent and then I was going to say but I don't think it didn't really I didn't know you know you know it just doesn't run with me. It's loopback in it there's no r in Boston you know it actually hurts to say it. If I put my hand in the throat and said are you know it's just doesn't exist so what I did at it I had a tape recorder reel to reel tape recorder VM voice of music. And I teased my father for that record I drove it. Father and what I did was made a list of words like car bar before never later in the week I'd say them cab for late and never. And I just played it back over and over again until I got

it right. But I never really lost it. Now I'm back in Dorchester and it's it comes right back comes right but you talk about going to one of your first radio interviews and the guy recorded you and said you know Mr. Ickes if you have any arms or can't get high or higher you need to get in I did he did and that's when I went home and I got I get a fix I listen to all of these great network analysis you know Milton Cross. Dawn Wilson they're old as my idols and they never had an accent. They always had a neutral accent. Midwest Chicago supposed to be the perfect accent. So I worked on that by listening to them too. Over and over I get such a kick reading this book you talk about first I love the stories about your father being a renaissance man he was older when he became a parent and he got swept into the war you were a little kid you were four years old and he was gone for four years then but you got sucked into the radio as a really really little kid and I was going through you know the Lone Ranger Jack Benny Fred Allen you know the Bell Telephone Hour and then and the commercials were all so much a part of that you know who sponsored book brought you by

ovaltine and you talk about a great story where you you sent away for the rings were this ring that Captain Midnight. Secret Decoder Ring secret decoder ring and the message was always the same by Ovaltine as you always are you going to get a different message on your yucky ordering it was a con but you know I had my mother who is a very Catholic woman stealing Ovaltine labels for me. I mean you know I think so I could yet have so many oval tea labels to get the decoder ring and you know to this day I describe in the book I still get excited in the mail when it's a lumpy envelope because I think it's going to be a secret decoder ring as some kind of prize atomics spores used to glow in the dark. They really didn't when in the closet. They never glowed. Things like that but that it was such a great time because you know you could. It was you built the sets in your mind in radio. You know as you said you built a fake radio set in your own bedroom. This is how obsessed you were about radio. I did blue cardboard microphone. I had a turntable I played 78 records of all my own commercials and sat up there just talking to myself you know. Your dad introduced you to operate and you said he took you to lava when but you also said that your

friends had you they were all unified in a love for music that's unusual for young boys to have that kind of a range an interest in music. Yeah well I think it was my father who was a big influence he was a renaissance man came out of World War 2 and to change them completely you know he saw some really terrible things. But it was his painting and his love for classical music especially opera got him back got him back and straightened his his life up because you know he was really having a difficult time. But when he would sing these arias at home he had a natural voice he couldn't read music. But he used to sing along with Caruso and bureaux Ling and Julie he loved tennis and he really was an influence in me developing my influence in classical music my first symphony I attended with him. And you talk about how you were determined to work in radio. I mean since first when you were staring at the box at home and how did how did you break and how did you start knocking on doors and did people understand then that you actually had knowledge about music

that it mattered to them. Well my first job I went to Boston University and I was a student run station then. And a gentleman named Arnie Ginsburg when we will get there. He came in and he he liked what I sounded like he says I've got an opening at the station WBAY as it was and all ethnic radio station at night. So there I was sitting opposite. Call your school ski during the Polish hour to meet that audience during the Greek hour the Italian are and always always host bought their own radio time. And I would do the commercials in English and they would do their programs and you know their language. And that's how I started and I a good mutual friend the late John Henning and I saw the nature of the book with him he was there with he was there with me John started there too when what occurred what had beginning I was trying to run delic he is in his new book is radio my way. You talk about your relationship with a radio is as a love affair. I mean how did that get going you know a lot of people have an interest as a kid but they move on or are a lot of people who are in radio move on to TDE or some other medium.

Radio has always been your thing. Yeah and you know that I think also the fact that I was privileged to become the host of The Boston Symphony broadcasts you know for the past 20 years in a way. I mean where else could I experience that I'm kind of a member of the orchestra you know sitting up in that booth with my my producer Brian Bell my engineer Jim Donahue we've been together 20 years I mean. It's to me it's a lifelong dream to do that because it's a throwback to what I used to listen to on the radio voice of Firestone the Bell Telephone or the Metropolitan Opera broadcast the Toscanini broadcast on those great announces Ben Grauer that I used to remember and here I am doing it again so my love for radio my passion for radio I think it was always first and foremost you know. I've done television and I just wanted to be around here you know fund raising and the auction even had my own TV show for a while called dining around town. I ad just from the deal you know but radio always came back to radio.

And we should we should say that of course people who want to hear you can listen to you on ninety nine point five which is our classical sister station here at WGBH you nine point seven you've gotten to know a lot of really incredible and important people in the music world. Tony Bennett is a good friend Tony Bennett reminds me a lot of my father you know very similar. Tony Tony is an artist he paints. My father played as you know he painted Oh yeah his work is at the Smithsonian at the butler Institute. He was. He was a veteran of World War 2 so says terrible things in war too. He was in graves registration my father was in graves legislation as you can imagine with that many of them like both passionate about music he loves opera. So there's this I sometimes feel when I'm talking to Tony that my father's back in the room they so much alike they were in my father's very low key He's very low key. Interesting we have a little clip of an interview you did with one of the great tenors of all time. Pabrai is a while ago.

He's doing it with us on our program will channel puppy the new tenant with the Metropolitan Opera this year is creating quite a sensation. You mean the daughter of the regiment I understand you have an army that has nine high seat. Yes. 29 something very exciting for public you know for me when I say I have been in the sink. But before and during. I promise not to. Something something unbelievable to sing 6 high seas that was one thousand nine hundred one interview nine high season nine and I see you can just hear how he's struggling with English but yeah it certainly got a lot better later. He did but you know public thought he was. He did so much to bring opera into the world good or to make it in that you know accessible to everybody and everybody knew who he was that's through the Three Tenors and and he and he he he agreed to do well interviews with with you with

60 Minutes and he like that I mean a lot of people in the music world seem to have have always been such in the classical music world you know opera singers and people like that. They're not well-known because they're kind of you know your own world now or in a new era where we've got Yo-Yo Ma who is I mean he's like the pied piper you know they love him he's like a rock star. Everybody knows who you are. Everybody John Williams. I mean last summer at Tanglewood John Williams one of those nights with when he did his film music sold out. And John is he so laid back and you know when you consider John Williams There's not a country in the world that doesn't know his music. But there's no you know John Williams score you know Star Wars E.T. all those themes that he wrote. I mean he is and he was we his music will live on for for so many years. You know you followed in your program here on page one of the classics Robert J. What was he like. You know something Robert Shea. It was a very interesting guy. I think he was sort of to me a combination of Orson Welles and often Godfrey. But you know off the

air he was a fun person to be around and he did a lot of things and I wish I had a knowledge of my father worked for Arthur Godfrey and he was not a fun person to be around. No no and I remember meeting you know your father by the way and we talked about walking down the corridor and he said remove Palmeiras Dot and I said you were probably the only two people who know who email was great guitarist who worked in the coffee shop. Robert Jay we used to do imitations he could imitate Gabby Hayes. He could imitate almost birdcalls you know how to play the Rings and they'd heard that the more you do that when April fools day he opened up and did all the birdcalls himself so I think that the thing about him he became but he became a legend you know in the morning. He worked seven days a week doing that show. He said he was a wanted for people who don't remember had the great HA's is what you maybe you could imitate him I really can't. We will now listen to the music of telephone for them. Tell him on. It why couldn't I couldn't I couldn't do it.

I mean I just you know I turned it on and I said I can't do it. You know but he he he was because he was consistent. And he introduced classical music to thousands of people because he was on every day you know every morning he'd come in in a blizzard once and I remember seeing him I was working all night he showed up he looked like the abominable snowman standing there covered in snow like he'd come down from the mountain here. Ronaldo you know and he was there. You lamented All right. What's kind of taking place the last decade or so with classical music. I mean it's shrinking around the country of course here in Boston there were two stations now there's one. But what do you think that is. I think it'll always be it'll always be here it's like a great Renaissance paintings and you know music and has so much classical music and can act as a healing force in your life. It helped me through traumatic experiences that I write about in my book. And you know look it's

happening out in Los Angeles they've got this young conductor do them out I mean these young people are coming into the concerts. You know we're playing a lot of new music if you like the newer music. Yeah a lot of people don't like we had John Harbison symphony just last Saturday night Symphony Number Four and you know it's very jazzy he's influenced by jazz a lot of other elements Stravinsky he brings into that. So you know there are younger people who are coming into the hall I just think it's a question of saying hey come on and hear what's going on and hear something that you should be exposed to. What's interesting is that locally anyway even you talk about what a great hall there's no call in the world like Boston Symphony Hall but I look at what the MFA has done and how every time I drive by there and it's just packed They're just people wrapped around the building you know trying to get in there. But the same is not true. Going to see you're going to listen to a concert. Well I think that particular artist will do that Yo-Yo Ma for example you're not going to serve nice artists at a superstar's Itzhak Perlman will do that John Williams You know Keith

Lockhart is into it. Now he's made a lot of major breakthroughs with classical music introducing young people to classical music through the years because you know I mean he's a guy who. Grew up listening to Aerosmith as well as Stravinsky you know. Randall his new book is radio my way this is a great great trip through memory lane for anybody who's interested in radio and your life which is endlessly fascinating there's some great personal things in there that I did not know about you wrong and now I do thank you I will it's a pleasure to be with you have always been a admirer. Thanks radio my way so we're going to go out on a tune that's a little familiar they are from Frank Sinatra. All right and so anybody who wants to. Meet Ron by the way you can have a couple of opportunities this week to get his John Hancock on your copy of his new book. He'll be at the Brasserie Jo at the colonnade hotel on Wednesday around 5:30. They'll also be signing copies of the books at Symphony Hall on Thursday night before the concert so you can if you don't want to go the concert you could run and get a quick signature and then buy a ticket for another one. 7:00 p.m. that is. All right thank you

much Ron. That's going to do it for us this afternoon. Stay tuned now for the Kelley crosses show. More on the apparent decision by Congressman Barney Frank not to run. Alec Ross he's going to be joined by Sir Birnbaum is going to calling in from Newton city hall. And we'll have more on the story tonight and greater Boston. Yeah only really shows a production of WGBH radio on the web at WGBH dot org. Boston Public Radio I'm Emily Rooney have a great afternoon.