OnQ; 1058

Filled with lively conversation great music questions for even a listener quiz. Jim Cunningham with you each week for the weekend with Johnsons Thursday nights at 7:00 and again Saturday mornings at 10:00 on WQED FM by the Bayer Corporation broadcast of on Q magazine is made possible by the Howard K. Mellon Foundation Foundation the Pittsburgh foundation the Henry Gilman Foundation and the Jewish Health Care Foundation. Corporate funding is provided by UPMC health system making a difference in communities throughout western Pennsylvania.

Each and every day we go beyond our walls and reach out to the neighborhoods we serve UPMC Health System 1 8 8 3 8 3. Yuki NC and by the members. Next on cue it's clink versus Santorum in the fall. Any way you slice it our next senator is going to be from Western Pennsylvania to some election dissection next. We'll also look into the same sex domestic partners benefits controversy that's swirling around two of the area's major universities. Find out why Pitt says no. CMU is saying maybe members of the River City brass band are here to perform live Stay with us. Starts right now. How are you. Good

evening I'm Stacey Smith And I'm Chris Moore welcome to own queue. Tonight we'll look at the controversy over same sex domestic partner benefits. And a little later a live performance from members of the River City brass man. But first yesterday's primary only had an 18 percent voter turnout. Still the results turned out to be the big story today. And joining us now for some election dissection and our Hugh political analysts John Delano and Heather hydel ball. Well the next United States senator is going to be from western Pennsylvania. Last night when I talked with Senator Rick Santorum he said he was not surprised it was Ron Klink in fact a little known secret in the Santorum office they had a pool. He picks a claim to be the winner. Were either one of you surprised.

No I don't think there was a surprise that Ron Klink won but I do think there was surprise that he won by the 15 point margin statewide that he did. He did absolutely everything right in terms of that Democratic primary and even with the low turnout statewide it actually was higher in this area than it was 18 percent state wide that benefited him and he certainly was benefited by the votes that he got up in the northeastern part of Pennsylvania. It's actually good I think for Senator Santorum that represented Klink was elected because really when you talk to the people the polls as I did yesterday a lot of the Democrats said we would love to vote for Allison Schwartz but she can't get elected. And so really there were I think if Allison had been the candidate a lot of the Liberal Democrats would have come out really supported her mama terribly supported her by coming out to the polls and really work in the grassroots. I think Ron Klink in many philosophical positions not all but is close to Senator Santorum and I don't think they're going to get that grassroots. Really the workers of the party they come out and I think in the end that will benefit

Senator Santorum that's what I hear a lot of Republicans saying John's over they're going to take you he said No I asked but I I really don't think that's going to happen because I think there's such unity among those six Democrats who ran for this race to defeat Rick Santorum the number one agenda they have. Well I'll also I'm going to interrupt you right there because I talked with Katie KTVU is with the Schwartz campaign last night in Philadelphia and she indicated that the Schwartz's endorsement of Ron Klink was almost less than lukewarm. Well of course it is on the night in which you lose an election that's always lukewarm in a situation certainly a competitive race that she was engaged in. She very much thought she was going to win this election. But I think that when push comes to shove what you're seeing and we'll see in the Democratic Party at least is a good degree of unity organizationally to support Ron Klain. I do think that Heather may be right with respect to the money. And I think that to Ron Klink is going to have a tough time raising money in this election. He will never have as much as Rick Santorum who has what some three point six million dollars as we speak. And who's

clearly going to have some 12 13 14 million dollars before November. There is just no way the Democrats can raise that kind of money. Good candidates produce a lot of money. And Senator Santorum the Republican candidate well sure in the end you know you want to know every Clinton has a lot of money right now so I'm not so sure I think Senator Santorum is probably in the shadows compared to the money that she's been able to raise. But that's the Hillary Clinton race we actually have an effect on Pennsylvania because it's so close it's going to draw money out of money that would normally come into Pennsylvania in Philadelphia to a Democratic candidate. And money's going to be a big problem for Ron Klink and in today's world in the year 2000 if you don't have money you can't get out to the voters. Christine let me ask you a question but I wonder when we're on the subject of money one one further point here and I said this on our newscast tonight and that is that also it's going to hurt perhaps both candidates in a way is that they're both pro-gun and they both hold on the same line perhaps minor differences but they're both considered pro-life candidates. So you're not going to have a lot of pro-choice money coming in and the NRA is I may just split the money with them.

I think that's true I also think though that because those issues those social issues are taken off the agenda with respect to this campaign that that could work to Ron Klink span if it he's going to talk about Social Security Medicare education health care issues those traditional Democratic issues that Democrats like to bash Republicans with and whether it will work in Pennsylvania remains to be seen. But at least there won't be a fight over abortion or gun control. Frankly it's going to have a tough time though because he's not known in the tea which is really what delivers the vote and he's not really known in Philadelphia. And the problem is is there's going to be a lot of discussion if if there is a chance for Bush to be president to hold onto the Senate to hold on to the Supreme Court. The larger issues in Santorum's now he's been in every county for the last six years every year. So does this mean that both of these western Pennsylvania guys are going to have some harder running to do on the other side of the state. The key to my selection. Yes I we I think we both agree on that the key to this election really I think the suburbs of Philadelphia the suburbs of Philadelphia where in the

past the Harris Wofford has won votes over over Riddick Thornburg Rick Santorum won those votes back in order to win election over Wofford in 1904. I think there's a real battleground in those areas of the state really beyond Philadelphia which is clearly going to go Democratic. And Pittsburgh which is clearly going to go Democratic this and the tea which is clearly going to go for Rick Santorum. So I think this is going to be a fascinating election and one which is going to go on and on and on for seven years. There are some other races that went on Michael Devitt most notably seems to be the guy who's going to take the lead for Senate to go out. Place where they're you know surprises in the way that those races came out. Well not as far as I'm concerned none whatsoever. I think everybody knew that Michael Devlin was going to win that race in the 22nd legislative district. I think the surprise or couple surprises perhaps the little heart. Well the most a hard race the caravan for a fourth congressional district where some thought that the really the Party endorsed candidate from

Washington D.C. Met man Geno would get the nomination. He did not. You know that's really a huge surprise because the the Democratic Congressional Caucus indorsed in a primary and gave Matt and Geno money. Now that candidate lost. So what does all of the endorsement mean so many things have happened in the past year in Allegheny County that have been at that egg a huge loss that the Democrats have to admit they they gave money in a primary which is almost something that they never do and their endorsed candidate lost. Why did the Democratic Congressional Committee not believe that Terry Van Horne could win. And some people are out there today saying Terry Van Horne is going to be the winner because it's such a heavily Democratic area. The Democratic National Committee or congressional committee knew something that we don't know and perhaps it is the comments that Representative Dan or I absolutely don't know what they're doing if they backed the wrong guy. Well you know what I do suspect. Well I think Representative Van Horn mean some comments about Dwight Evans using the N word and that's going to come back to haunt him and and perhaps

that's why they didn't endorse him. You're not a judge. Well I think that's right I think that the Democratic National Committee down in Washington certainly was aware of that but so were plenty of the voters in his own I disagree I don't think they were they were reminded of well it is nowhere in the press but Terry Van Horne has won re-election three times since that. Since he made that what he would have These are all political goals are all going to come out and he apologized on the floor of the house to Dwight Evans Dwight Evans accepted the apology as far as the Democratic Party people worked and yeah but you know as well as I may John that in the political campaign if that's fodder somewhere along the line that it hasn't necessarily been out there I'm not going to say I'm also going to use it whether or not you listen hard already talk about tomorrow I did use at least the Republican Campaign Committee today out of Washington issued the press releases that Heather is referring to a number of folks got those press releases today from the Republican Party in Washington. Let's face it hard. There's no con in this regime from the OR this race is so hotly contested in the fourth congressional that we've got all these folks down in Washington Republicans

as well as Democrats trying to meddle in a race in western Pennsylvania. I think it's going to backfire on both those parties because it's so crucial because they're united. We only have about 25 seconds left in the race I think is really going to be very interesting also is for state treasurer. Well you know Katherine BAKER No and Barbara Hafer are two very well-known women in this state they've been added in a way over the years. Certainly when Catherine Baker Noll over dropped out or couldn't run again her daughter ran. And there's a lot of personal stuff in this race and I think it's going to be it's I think you know that she's been out of politics I think she's lost some of her power. Well we'll have to wait and see. That one of the I just think is also going to be very interesting. Lots of good prices this year. Heather John thanks so much for being with us. And now let's head over to Carol ESPN. Well there is a major development this afternoon in a story we've been working for on cue. Michael Bartley joins me now with the latest. Now Michael this is about Carnegie Mellon University and the debate over this same sex benefits. Indeed Carol about an hour and a half ago the faculty senate at

Carnegie Mellon voted overwhelmingly to support a recommendation to extend health benefits to qualified domestic partners including same sex partners. It's now up to CMU board of trustees to decide the issue. As you know the University of Pittsburgh has been struggling with this issue for a while. In contrast CMU debated the debate over there has been held quickly and quietly and behind closed doors. But down the street at Pitt the issue has caused a loud and public debate on hunger strike lawsuits and protests. The latest protest came yesterday as students faculty and staff marched around the cathedral of learning. They accuse Pitts decision makers of discriminating against employees who have same sex partners of unfairly denying them same sex health care benefits.

This wasn't the first protest and organizers promise it won't be the last. Even before the protest a rally was held inside the student union. It is time for the University of Pittsburgh to do what is right. Speakers accused ped of violating the city of Pittsburgh's gay rights ordinance by not extending same sex benefits to its employees under. So it is a step forward. Why do you think that. And even more to the level were low wage workers that are paid by the university. Yes it is everyones University. You know that I know that. Let's keep working let's keep screaming Let's keep fighting until everyone understands how I enjoy my job.

Yes I'm head of the frick Fine Arts Library. I work with a wonderful faculty and I work in with the graduate students an art history a 53 year old librarian RE M. Lockhart is smack dab in the middle of the same sex disputed pit. She joins six other pit employees suing for same sex partner health insurance. I joined the lawsuit because as you know I am a lesbian committed lesbian relationship with my partner and I feel that I'm being discriminated against and it's a matter of equal pay for equal work lacquered says she and her partner Diane on the right incurs $6000 a year and out of pocket medical costs while Reagan's health benefits at Pitt cover her medical expenses. Diane is on disability and her insurance doesn't fully cover prescriptions and overall medical care. Lockhart says while out of pocket medical expenses are a hardship. She's really suing Pitt because she feels she's a victim of discrimination that

heterosexual married employees get a better benefit package than non married couples for example I have good health coverage there at the university as an individual but a librarian sitting across the room from me who has a husband for example has a better pay package because she can put her husband and her children for example on her health insurance. And I'm not allowed to you know lock her story prompted protests like these. And just a few blocks away CMU is considering same sex partner benefits. But there are no protests and no lawsuits. Faculty and staff won't even go on camera. Some told me they don't want the sensitive subject tongue out in public that it could sway the decision one way or another. But it's by no means a done deal here at CMU. The final decision rests with the board of trustees which is expected to take it up in May. And

some CMU staff have expressed opposition citing religious beliefs opposed to homosexuality and concerns that same sex benefits could jeopardize what they call the traditional family structure. But a non faculty staff committee is urging CMU trustees not only to provide same sex partner benefits to gay employees but also to provide partner benefits to heterosexual couples who aren't married. If partner benefits pass at CMU it will likely be done quietly. While the fight gets more intense down the street at Pitt when we say right. By the way three other Pennsylvania University's Penn Swarthmore and Dickinson already offers same sex benefits to their employees on the local corporate scene. So to the city of Pittsburgh Bell Atlantic

WQED Pittsburgh and others. U.S. Airways is considering adding same sex benefits to its policy. I mean while the University of Pittsburgh battle is still being waged in the courts. And that brings us to tonight's guest can service as a spokesman for the University of Pittsburgh. Ken welcome and thanks it was good of you to be here tonight I know it's a sensitive subject over at the University I noticed you were at the rally there observing yesterday. I guess the first question let's begin with a few years ago how this all started. Why did the university decide not to offer health benefits to same sex. I mean it's basically the University's Health Benefits Program at that time was legal nondiscriminatory and virtually identical to those offered by every other university in college in the area as well as by most businesses. The use we provide health benefits basically every employee at the university regardless of race or sex or sexual orientation. We also use marriage as one of the determining characteristics for dependents of employees who can get extended benefits.

That use of marriage is actually something that's common I mean it's recognized by the federal government by every state government as a legal and nondiscriminatory determinant in extensive benefit programs. If you know if you attended the rally yesterday there were quite a bit of charges thrown out the university. You heard them the signs the homophobia of the university being unjust and so forth. How do you how do you justify that after several years of going through this. Well I think it's unfortunate that what has happened in a lot of this debate is you have on the one hand a legitimate social issue and that is how is Pennsylvania going to define marriage. You have on the other hand people who are unwilling to recognize that the University of Pittsburgh has some constraints on it in terms of its actions. The other universities that you mentioned that offer these benefits are all private universities as a state related University. We have to be sensitive to the policies of the state legislature and the executive branch I would argue of course the difference between Pitt and CMU is that it is public and CMU is private. We get one hundred and seventy million dollars in terms of state appropriation. There's been very strong

messages to us as well as to Penn State and the other state owned and state related universities that that state subsidy could be very much in jeopardy should any of those institutions provide these benefits. Well that let's keep riding that train of logic and let's say that at some point this is just you know conjecture on this point and at some point Pennsylvania recognizes same sex marriage. Now where would that put Pat. The university is a law abiding institution in the state of Pennsylvania changes its definition of marriage the university will abide by whatever the laws indicate. Let me the main thing that's keeping you know we've been trying to tell people is that the intent there to get Pennsylvania to change definition of marriage. It's not going to happen by using the Pittsburgh Human Relations Commission and the University of Pittsburgh as a battleground. This is an issue that has much wider implications really. You need to go to Harrisburg and talk to your legislators and talk to them about the issue if that's what you want to speaking of the legislature a few months ago the legislature put in the law of the University of Pittsburgh and other public statewide institutions didn't have to

abide by local ordinances as they related to health benefits that the city of Pittsburgh and its gay rights ordinance and so forth couldn't force the university to abide by it. It's sort of there were charges that it went and sort of a back door. Few people knew about it and all of a sudden we had to have you answer charges that the university had some to do with it and sort of tried to slip it in and Harrisburg. I mean the university had nothing to do with writing that legislation. I think if you look at it over the course of years it's not surprising that the legislature took that action three or four years ago the legislature enacted a Defense of Marriage Act. Earlier in last year in June the House of Representatives State House tried to enact legislation that would have penalized state universities if they provided these benefits. The executive branch has stated through their spokespersons how they feel that that the state does not provide these benefits to its employees does not feel as a result that state related institution should apply. So while we had didn't write this legislation I mean honestly we welcomed it because it

does help clarify what has been the situation that we're dealing with all along. But does it ever worry you that in this competitive market of colleges that and universities that are happening right now that you can't attract the talent that you would like to attract because you don't offer these benefits. I think actually if you look at what's happening at the University of Pittsburgh right now we are attracting more students and higher quality students than ever before. We are attracting research dollars in greater numbers than ever before we are attracting private foundation corporation and even dual donors money and greater amounts than ever before. Every indicator of the university's health and quality is on the upward cycle so I don't see any evidence at this point that this issue has affected the university adversely as anyone on the board of trustees or any other people involved with the university. Ever talked about. Could this be turned around someday is there talk that maybe the university might reverse itself. I mean this is really not an issue that has bee reached the board level. We are in a situation now where in legal action so we're really constrained there again kerning Raylan has been able to

look at this issue over the last four years free of any outside constraints such as being in court over the issue. So there are options that are taken away from you when you're being sued by people is it bother you that it's such a contrasting issue just a few blocks away from each other. Well I think again it is a basically a recognition of the public versus private difference. The University of Pittsburgh is a major public institution we conduct our business in public. Everyone has an opportunity to watch our ken service once again and good for you to be here. And I was going to be. Now here's a look at what's coming up tomorrow on tomorrow night's show. We're moving beyond convention tomorrow on Q First PNC Park in the new Steelers stadium and now the convention center the groundbreaking is tomorrow and will be there to show you the play. Could another Pittsburgh priest be on the road to sainthood. He is being beatified on Thursday at the Vatican. The story of Father C loss tomorrow on Cuba and the Frampton brothers are back and on kids gotta live in our studios tomorrow.

Joining us now is Dennis COLE Well he's the musical director music director of the River City brass band and they are tonight's musical guests thanks for coming and thanks for bringing your entourage that the group you brought is a much smaller section of the band director and these are some of the principal players it's a quintet the band actually is 28 members that we have five of them here this evening. OK before I ask you to introduce them do you sometimes feel like prophets without honor in your own land. Oh it's absolutely true Actually I often think that the city of Pittsburgh and its people are justifiably proud of this wonderful symphony in the ballet and the opera and well they should because they're all superbe but they can be proud as well of one additional group the River City brass band because by most measurements we are the most successful concert band of any type in the country and perhaps beyond. You play throughout the world in fact we do we get out of the country occasionally but heavily most of our touring and say words of sixty or seventy days per year is throughout this nation. I know people really enjoy you know they make you feel like that and that. Would you

introduce the people that you brought with you tonight. With pleasure from left to right the French horn player is Stephen peka. The two trumpet players Jeff naked Amos and Bernard Black trombonist is Carl Jackson and our tuba player is Neil to dwell and was the first song you know what I think the gentlemen are going to play the fanfare to pre see the ballet. Love Parry by Paul Duca. All right here they are. The River City brass band. You

guys have tons of CDs out where you playing now working people come out here. Well we're right in the middle of our April series actually that celebrates the music of the 1950s and we played in seven or eight this month seven sites we have actually eight different homes that we play in every month that's not out reach for us those are our subscription concert series films. And next month or last series of the season actually it's all about the music of the wonderful big band there. And this next song is you're going to play us out with I think the gentlemen have chosen an old time favorite by Fats Waller the lance of plenty of Fats Waller you know members of the River City brass band will be right back with that's a plenty. Musical guests are the phantom brothers but they're not brothers and their names aren't Frampton or have to talk to those boys tomorrow night.

Find out what that's about could be called Stage Names. Also we should note the passing of a legend of rock n roll here in Pittsburgh and the country Joe Rock who is the manager of the Skyliners and who wrote that brilliant song since I don't have you passed away yesterday. He's going to be missed. Also we should remember we remind you that we would like to hear from you on Cuba as your community TV show. Drop us a line or e-mail us at WQED dot org. Now back to the River City brass band West. That's a plenty good night good night. What do

you eat he's broadcast.