thumbnail of 1974 Nixon Impeachment Hearings; 1974-07-29; Part 5 of 6
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the pain has been give a a summary of the kinds of items which support the various paragraph of the article we are not presenting the evidence i will vote against the amendment of the gentleman from california but i do hope that some of our draftsman who are supporting the article to our will it jot down some additional specific sum offer an additional men and so we can clarify the objections raised how does the party yemen that this article well not meet the fed has been given a pass to listen on the specific instances in which you are referring to in addition to the brake feelings office i think that particular to them it the night of the
convention just the five of the way that was so be activities involving the transfer of fbi records from of the fbi to the oval office at the direction of the president of the gentleman from missouri held herself in that regard as to whether it be in the position to delineate so no specific guidance on which he intends to rely on the town feeling language of four if you were refer the first few lines of that concern when you talk of concerning of the matter is he has failed to take care that the laws are faithfully executed by failing to act when he knew or had reason to know that explosive ordinance center now were talking of situations in which he should know orphan every good reason you know and as we've said earlier the backroom of impeachment to not really be very narrowly in finances brought to their kings
imagination asked me if you can find it closely another be somebody for your way around what about the findings don't situation the testimony evidence before the committee was that as i recall and we stated that mr klein the third will receive what we would call a chilling out from the president and a forceful clear language and then concerning a specific matter and then when he was before the us senate committee they were asked anybody had approached him confirms a matter it is our calling he in effect said well you might occasionally mention that i'm telling you the chilling he got was that you remember the watergate million certification by the remembered it now they'll be fine you know the president after that going for the american people and say you know there's a reason for the new yorker
an appalling testimony on the situation now there are other examples i'm tony and jaworski consideration in the fall so the doj wants these are the sort of things that would be covered here are you like opposition rally support and the reason i do is because we were specific an allegation and the first portion of that paragraph where we limited the
failure to faithfully execute the laws to be unlawful entry into the headquarters the democratic national committee now i happen to believe that the matter of the domestic windy spring the antitrust case might very well all within the provisions of the general obligation for reform but when words specifically the break in of the democratic national committee and we threw in just absolutely as an afterthought those last four words and concerning other matters and i have not at all and third and what i have thought to be the objective of my friend and my calling from california mr wiggins to limit their narrow this inquiry so precisely that the proof that could be induced would almost be prohibitive in our ability to produce it but in this instance i think we have strayed so far in generalities that we would be well advised to adopt his
amendment and we went in so doing in my view and you know violence to our standards of fairness and do no violence to our obligation to have an opportunity to consider and to introduce all proved necessary that bears upon impeachable offenses of the president's allies support nice job i think there's some frost what the gentleman says but i do think that we ought to take into consideration the point that has been made that in this daycare paragraph here are there other unlawful activities which took place from which the responsibility of the president ought to run and which ought to be provided as part of the proof with respect to this paragraph seems to me there's a choice available
between simply eliminating the claws and having nothing and developing a language that provides at a more definite standard than the language that is container at the end of this paragraph and i would suggest that the gentleman that if we could develop that language that would enable us to maintain the the substance of what we're talking about here which the gentleman from illinois referred to someone earlier and yet meet the basic thrust of the objection of the government compelled one i like it result of this everybody into narrowly defining the inquiry all this this on a particular and that it would invite you exclude
the cover up i'll be unlawful entry into the democratic national committee or at least the second stage of the cover up when what was then being considered was the flavor of the president himself to advise on the justice i'll be involvement which he knew how his own man and the cover up which occur the law and which as it would really if this amendment were not that would limit this failure to take care only to those acts are surrounding the unlawful entry in the headquarters of the democratic national committee if you were to head and the cover up their all it might improve the cement i ever that is not included in the effect that the amendment has adopted will end it around fort hood right
many times if a line wage is limited only to a consideration of events leading up to be unlawful entry i'm not frustrated the inquiry into events subsequently unlawful entry the cover up and i think his point is awfully well taken it was not over my understanding that the initial works were limited only to be unlawful entry and that we included a cover up in the words and concerning other matters if we had to include the cover up by putting in the phrase and concerning other matters is incredibly poorly drafted my own impression is an attempt to reaffirm to be awkward that the original words involving the break into the headquarters the democratic national committee included both the country as well as the cover up and concerning other matters has
nothing to do with the democratic national committee very entry or cover a famine thank you now when they substitute strike from some paragraph or the word matters and said no there are the following unlawful activity is mr chairman not only had such an amendment and mortar this primary and then the gentleman california pending and i would respectfully submit your amendment must be offered through the amendment or the man with the author of a major subject of the amendment and i don't believe it is so horrible frightening amendment which ignores the opinion and then goes back to the
original is in order say this is a second amendment in the presence of really other than one maybe two the car first time or a perfect game i do at five of perfecting amendments this is the first time i've ever seen a pending amendment taken off the floor in this manner i think you have to address something to the pending a memory or a substitute or something perfect yet pertaining to my poor analyst at a jurist at the reflecting
amendments and vote our the gentleman on the floor yelling opera house not there were the gerald state that what we've heard now the gentlemen from illinois will be recognized for is protecting them in an act and they question would take place on that second amendment does is to dilute the word matters and substitute the word unlawful activity is what we're talking about here really are unlawful act seventy two thousand cooperative during this period of prior to and subsequent to the democratic national headquarters break in and were involved in all these other unlawful like everything which we made reference to the other barbary about their feelings office of perjury with regret with respect
to mr klein these confirmation and a number of other matters to that there were aware of and i don't think there's any it was certainly inadequate on our part jewel recommend to the house of representatives that they consider only the bare of breaking into the democratic national headquarters when so many other more serious matters are things that we've investigated which earned baba which they can go if they should consider i'd like to call attention to the fact that this charge this article two is in the nature of a a a soul charge or complying and it's something which a college they responded of course is well aware this is dated with government knows there's no doubt iran certainly as to what we're talking about alicia many question as to the president being a prize of all what's involved in this a paragraph and if we're going put the word unlawful activity is it will include these other matters we don't have to delineate
along spring a long line of matters which are involved in the criminal conduct a lot twenty different people were engaged they're what we're talking about is a pattern of conduct or a pattern of misconduct and we code of course the initial break into the democratic national headquarters was these other things that are also involved in which we will be sending our failure to the house for their consideration in their judgment gentlemen you an idea for a question of the question i think i met was not doing your question that year and i was just wondering whether the gentlemen from illinois i felt making it really concerning other unlawful activities instead of concerning other matters really advanced as very far as far as specificity is concerned with jack and understood the general was concerned with the moment go well yes i'll say that it does because we're not talking about other matters are other kinds of conduct that are not unlawful or anything
the nature of a criminal act or some serious ongoing and so if we say that it's unlawful activity which were concerned with i think it prizes the president want he's involved with the galileo galileo made our life and get on my part that of the prefix that perfect moment of redemption a lot of it is on the rise the question occurs on the perfect one estimate for your memory spill the hard question
the question is the gentlemen from illinois there were further refinement which are being made in the affected areas and the foreclosure app of the photo that you know the gentleman would not be a packaging the question of paris on the amendment offered by the gentleman from milan on oreos are perfecting the man wasn't terribly sorry i also the eyes that it was the butler the photograph that
moment before the us gentlemen and i asked the parliament to make a parliamentary inquiry mr butler is in the throes of drafting a healthy strapping it quickly ah man will he have an opportunity at that point before we go on our the gentleman from california's main amendment only have a chance to offer his amendment lawyer just wondering if i could the regulations the gentleman's amendment illinois protecting
amendment the only amendment that hours before that committee is the amendment which was offered by the gentleman from california wrote mr chairman a wonderful memories he's been here my brow mentor encouraged chairman is this is mr butler's amendment is to be an r and b considered isn't it true that the rules require that this amendment b in writing that the agent on his cell and i would assume that this is about we have to write it and have a complicated reasons that before to be considered by the committee chairman reflecting a man the gentleman is like
at a man management recycling and at the end of such a paragraph or by employees of the executive branch or the committee to re elect the president of the gemini like a cocktail there are management is this ongoing at it and there's some paragraph or by employees of the executive branch with the committee to re elect the president or they carry on my reservation point one down and reserving and why were the chairman at the
challenges like i think it seems to me that the injections through the amendment raised by mr reagan's trip to the fair grab are not entirely cured by the perfect human moment reporting because crimes and unlawful activity go on all over the united states every day and at least we ought to try it down to those that were really concerned about and my reflecting amendment makes it clear that we're talking about other unlawful activity by employees of the executive branch or the committee to re elect the president which seems to me cover a knopf of the activities that are before us here to get in all of the evidence that we have been considering and that's why are from yemen the
harbor are lawful activities of all employees of the executive branch i assume that under your amendment if it were still a hundred dollars in a post office in indianapolis or someplace like that the big acts include well we have a record before us mr dennis that pretty clear what void i'm talking about man i'd like to suggest that the language concerning other on lawful activities does not need any further limitations sense it refers back to the language of the beginning of some paragraph or which are first a failing night when he knew it had reason to know that his clothes subordinates and never to impede and frustrate law falling quiet why do it constituted executive judicial and legislative entities concerning and then you have to concerning clause won the unlawful entry and the only be concerning
other unlawful activities but that would relate back to the activities of the explosive ordnance i would be consistent with the theory of this paragraph as i understand it has advanced up by the gentleman from normal the gentleman from on how you lead senate that is correct and i think that was a bit confusing initially accepted the additional verification on the record why i think that just clarify matters but there were standing alone other on lawful activities i don't think i've written a clear well a german when you further delay other unlawful activity is referred through the cloth subordinates and i think we won with great wealth without objection
the gentleman from california's all those in favor of the amendment please signify by saying ah follows apollo know the words connolly is in a huge demand in our local is in favor of the amendment say aye all those opposed no mr brooks no mr kastenmeier was chicano mr monte vista florida no no
no mr mendelsohn no the prehistoric the post reporter liz holtzman ms jones well with residents you know mr hutchinson lying mr mclaurin know mr smith i mr sandman i mr railsback mr whedon mr dennis
mr frank well mr mayne mr colburn well mr butler no mr cohen <unk> right mr verrilli mr martin i missed him as the long list of other night mr rodino know it is for german fourteen members of voters
by twenty four have voted no and madmen is not agree with chairman mao and all of the membership they understand not helpful in the process of this new amendment with phil gramm rudman that in case that will allow parents and then at a later time we get there if that is not in order thank you thank you all the votes have been going against the president's supporters have not given up their efforts to persuade their colleagues to vote as they think they should be voting and that's a videotape coverage of the house judiciary
committee's impeachment debate will continue short races pbs for public broadcasting service broken off in asia but you haven't told biggins political have gotten us in and that's pretty damn cool new actors fly well i have learned to walk again due to my sister and just wind of course kevin cathcart has been found shot dead who bought the priuses that thank you fb freak well
many many at the summer tennis tour will attract world famous players competing for top prize money stands on the lid on rod laver and bjorn borg view of professional championship from boston all right out on the stage and also nice nice
nice nice nice it is both it's b the house judiciary
committee's impeachment debate continues now as we go back to the year and the numbers are arguing over the language for a second impeachment articles that you and i went to the chairman there are pending at several religious right and i by reason of not calling about the fifth time in advance so that they would respect the entire article i hope that there is a waiver that right it would be my hope that we will continue to discuss the five minute rule and at the conclusion of that the member might be recognized that the general in may at any time to recognize the amendments are now distracted with that the
shadows recognize the only year that moment when mr wiggins enough when they substitute strike some paragraph true and i thank the chairman for yielding of members of the committee is when as we all know there is as we all know some paragraph two is directed primarily to the area of electronic surveillance or alleged of national security purposes says that subject is not been debated before this committee my motion to strike is to focus our attention on that subject i would hope
i would hope to yield to other members on either side who have fought with respect to that researcher marie operating under the unanimous consent of the senate and i should like to set the focus for this debate concerning electronic surveillance by recalling that these individual wiretaps the men's early in nineteen sixty nine and continued for approximately a year thereafter we have before us a series of specific wiretaps which form the basis of this allegation of abuse of power by the president they can be categorized i think into the following four groups first the seventeen wiretaps which were authorized by the
attorney general and at least the allegation is made by the president that they were instituted in the interest of national security in addition to that we have before us senators with respect to three other wiretaps instituted by mr erlichman concerning employees in the white house and with respect to that the evidence does not extend to any presidential involvement or knowledge and then we have to isolate of wiretaps with him i'll let the gentleman characterize ladies and gentleman characterize as they wished we have donald nixon and we have a wiretap of the bureaucrat that cover the evidence with respect wiretaps he was the clear about that evidence involves seventeen wiretaps work with her comments in the spring of nineteen sixty nine
i want to set the focus of the debate by making one assertion with i believe cannot be confident and that is that the law with respect to wiretaps which are genuinely and honestly international it is that the president does have that authority in nineteen sixty nine and he has that authority today it is improper to infer that it is illegal to install a wiretap which in which relates to national security matters the sole question is whether in fact the president had that modi or whether this was merely a subterfuge to install wire taps for some other purpose there can be no question that even today subsequent to that he thinks that wiretaps it's all by the ordination for national security purposes are authorized by congress at least i've not been prohibited by congress and have
not been prohibited by any decision of the united states supreme court that being the case with a german we should focus our attention on the evidence with respect to the bonafide he's the president in installing these seventeen wiretap if they were in fact brazil is concerned about national security interests they were awful and they cannot meet them in the city but if in fact they were installed for other purposes that i would concede that they would be probably unlawful and perhaps should be considered by this committee in an impeachment and that now back in nineteen sixty nine this nation was involved in a war in southeast asia this nation was also involved in sensitive negotiations with the soviet union with respect to arms limitation we have had evidently material that abundance in abundance
that there were leaks concerning the bargaining position of the united states leaving the soviet union which caused enormous confirmed by the president's top advisors and by the president himself there can be no question no question at all that henry kissinger was greatly concerned about these leaks and as a result of those leaks a system of wiretaps on possible sources of that leak those leaks were instituted by the president i'm willing to attribute goes directly to the white house and directly to the present those wiretaps were there and some of the ideas and i said you know that those wiretaps were yet each case approved by mr hoover was then the fbi director and in each case were approved by the attorney general i would hope they'd year after will focus upon the vote a findings of the president's intentions with respect to the insulation
and the gentleman from wisconsin has the miers recognized performance and conversation has really already begun this morning john malone's for holden i think this this particular section of article to his central theme of abuse of power but every country we have no higher courts and to protect really be more people against this sort of abuse of power which can come in a modern age in terms of the plea stage what we did as a congress in fact as a committee in nineteen sixty nine to limit use of electronic surveillance
wiretapping this follows in the omnibus crime control act of nineteen sixty eight which came out of this meeting six years ago we said that if any lawful authority is to conduct wire tapping or electronic surveillance it must have a court order except accept and i shall read that the power of the president take such measures as he deems necessary to protect the nation against the following threats mind you won the actual or potential attack or other hostile acts of a foreign power to retain foreign intelligence information deemed essential for the security of the united states three to protect the national security information against foreign intelligence activities
and lastly to protect united states against overthrow by force or other lawful means against any other clear were present danger structure or existence of the government the number of classes of wiretaps in california mr witte it is not necessarily an order time one of referred to by john of maryland that in nineteen seventy by the secret service on donald nixon which i agree any reasonable man have to assume kurd with the knowledge and sent the direction of the presidents health and subsequent wiretaps and buggy whether in watergate or implicitly in houston plan for those undertaken for the president by mr erlichman gentleness polluting forms to craft abroad or the seventeen wiretaps point to a pattern of use of taps which
do not conform to the laws passed by this congress in nineteen sixty eight and i submit are not otherwise authorized by any other decision the court or by law let us go back to the very beginning how did we ever get there in the first place called it the president happened to start engaging in wiretaps without any court order a lot of activity as you know in any event the procedure was at all perhaps would go through the attorney general of the united states or disapproval whether or not these are warrantless wiretaps and would be recorded carried out by the fbi billy recorded and as if that was later in the year nineteen seventy one sensitive about these caps mr martin
delivered this list the white house got back to the oval office the secret of the state one of the hall in nineteen sixty nine the family following a new york times article during the fall the study was published in the new york times on june eighteen nineteen sixty nine with all about our analysis of the soviet union's the peak strength and first strike capability and we consider is that each of these disclosures one of the most extreme gravity of communications of a government thinking on these issues they
provided the soviet union with extensive and fight as to our approach to the thought negotiations and severely compromised our assessment of the soviet union's missile testing an apparent inability to accurately assess that capability another leak involved the alternatives for ending the vietnam war one alternative to be studied with unilateral troop withdrawal from vietnam henry kissinger said considering this week this disclosure was extremely damaging with respect to the government's relationship of credibility with allies olivia mitchell troop withdrawal agreement with small the decision was extremely important and that it reflected a fundamental change in united states policy certainly this gave to foreign agents information concerning the united states and capability and plan which were harmful to our position
if the president of the united states have not taken steps to the terminal where the leaks are coming he would not have been carrying out his constitutional government that they care of our nation and its people i submit to you by one such a leak explain at a time when we are at war when our troops could lose their lives it is the responsibility of the president to find out where those leaks are coming from and stop it and that's just exactly what you get the seventeen wiretaps what is good for the purpose of discovering resources i know that and the testimony you've been given to our committee that was a cool question raised as to the effect of the wiretapping and farming really mr colson is live testimony before this committee answered that question he told us that as the result of
wiretapping we were definitely able to close one of the major leagues that occurred and therefore perhaps save the lives of many of our fruit and how the country for the future i think those grounds for impeachment of the weakness although the been brought up certainly no grounds to impeach the president of the united states in his attempt to save the lives of our troops and the safety of our nation's out you know i wanted to make a few observations about the reality is this matter has been before congress before congress is not legislatively i'll remember that the former attorney general rick richardson records testified before the senate the first thing is a thing that if in fact we are talking about national security
archives it was fully legal then and remains so today that merck is also my recollection of the testimony of attorney general peterson before my friend from wisconsin not too long ago when the subject was a euphoric for consideration i feel about that word on those legal situation and i was like where it gets very well we're talking here about what was legal in one of laughter as of the time it was made and as of the time they are now at the time of the wiretaps we're talking about i agree with mr wiggins the question is was a national security of all that's a factual question but the event was there was nothing
illegal about these wiretaps and it's very doubtful that there's anything illegal the day it had been a hero for instance in the third circuit that you could have a walk us national security wiretap used to stem the flow of information out of government and the contrary had never been held at the time we're not talking about now and you got to think of the climate as has been said we are adding leaks about the pentagon papers about the saul talks about the ant man man every guest enters the leaks about the troop withdrawals inspired the one minute moment from california at five minutes one minute remaining journalist alissa
the gentleman from the california chairman i rise in opposition to the motion to strike the seventeen wiretaps started in on may twelfth nineteen fifty nine as a result of the big your article in the new york times that tell the public about the secret bombing of cambodia a lot of correct the record right now the salt talks have nothing to do with that there's never been an allegation that the seventeen wiretaps were triggered by any salt lake city and that nothing in our evidence is so it became nor are did it have anything to do with the vietnam war nor did these talks have anything to do with leaks about the pentagon papers that encounter nearly two years later and my friend pointed out
that the facts be i think i'm really more important to point out that was done with the information that resulted from these lakes know from these these wiretaps they mr hoover the director of the fbi would send them to the white house to the president and a total in from nineteen fifty nine to nineteen seventy one that went on for more than two years there were a total of a hundred and four summer recess and what happened you know it was found that there had been only a confidential information from these hundred and four summer is nobody went to jail nobody was charged nobody lost their job nobody was transfer there were six or seven members of the national security council who have their telephones tapped for newsman
later and several white house employees most of these people have no access to any confidential information whatsoever and as i pointed out earlier summer has indicated that no leaks were going on well how was this information used by the white house on december twenty nine nineteen fifty nine mr hoover wrote to the president and said that former secretary of defense clark clifford was about to write an article like mcafee attacking mr nickson on his handling of the vietnam war and part of the first attack was to be regarding mr nixon's criticism as to chew well i immediately this triggered political action by the white house staffers immediately took action presidential assistant butterfield wrote the report the name of the game of course is just reward ourselves in a position from which we can effectively counter whatever different take
suggested methods of countering clippers article were sent a hole in the cheek political advisor to president nixon and included a proposed discrediting of the third id use of his prior statements or a powder article altman directed magruder to be ready to react and suggested finding methods of reaction the church alderman of political the key now is to how to lay groundwork and be ready to go and let's act <unk> ehrlichman characterize the different information that support that kind of early warning we need more and he noted the most alderman your game planners are now in every position to map anticipatory action the basic nature of the material developed from the seventeen wiretaps and sent to the white house was political and personal there were no leaks the fbi was presumably sending what the white house wanted and certainly the flow the information was not stopped by the white house
when the character of the mercurial became obvious material in addition to the political information on park lippert contain reports on how certain senators are expected to vote on legislation on the activities of credit for the administration policy on a campaign plans of senator must be incidentally to people who left the white house and went to work for senator i'm a mormon i'm chairman of the twenty nine the gentleman as four minute format you to mormon and on the social habits and political plans of white house employee the material had no conceivable relevant to national security i don't it could have political that i personally do many of the same and that the book the fbi sent to the press describing what was that over the home telephone's of those people under surveillance i wanna be careful not to describe any information such a way to get back to that or a place to the people involved the fight to save the conversations were those of citizens
their wives their children chatting on the telephone with acquaintances and close friends and fighting their joys their sorrows their anxieties about their personal lives and in some instances their observations about political social event for the united states if these the telephone call for like any calls between close friends were personal disclosure may only for the gears of the other and at the other end of the line and some of the information be terribly embarrassing for her by third party for some reason south of the strongest evidence of that wisdom is just a small description of wiretapping as a dirty business the president authorize these wiretaps he didn't stop it when they almost immediately found out that they were not productive he knew about them he discussed them with a jaunty not there were twenty eight nineteen seventy three he was talking about two of the men who were being kept he said to jogging incidentally didn't muskie do anything bad on these we show you how the
fbi felt about it this is what two agents at a memorandum on october twentieth nineteen seventy one they were talking about why there were no regular records kept of these attacks by the fbi but the two fbi agents that well it goes without saying that knowledge of discoveries represents a political sort of tremendous embarrassment to the bureau and political disaster for the nixon administration copies of the material itself could be used for political blackmail the rule a nation of mexico may join others general has consumed more minutes ten minutes now remain for those events going on than ten minutes remaining opposition i support that mozilo california that was clear legal authority for the warrantless national security
wire that time that the seventeen or that were conducted and the former attorney general mr ricketts i'm referring to castel all stated that the department of justice is justified and relying on the lower court decisions are making a national security wiretaps and let me say that i thoroughly agree with weapons said that here today that we must look at the circumstances do you justify that wiretaps on the basis of national security but i believe that the circumstances surrounding these wiretaps demonstrate clearly they involve national security adviser and we know the government at that time we must look that we cannot look at of the day the cover with faith with massive leak sensitive foreign policy information with the president without
beginning to establish policy the future relations with other nations relief began in the spring of sixty nine when president nixon with authorities the motions of the vietnam war these leaks were damaging to the diplomatic effort being made to end the war at that time and i disagree with the gentleman from california but worked at the wiretaps have nothing to do with the vietnam war and let's listen to henry kissinger and see what henry kissinger thought quote he simply about disclosures were extremely damaging with respect to this government's relationship and credibility with a lot without vietnam government to hear publicly of our apparent willingness to consider unilateral withdrawal without first discussing such an approach with
them raving very serious question as to our reliability and credibility as an ally and a great deal of philip morris according to myth and i think it's a party in this area some of the most damaging leak occurred with regard to the sorts of those tuitions and despite what the government california state with all of the station where npr there were twenty eight nineteen sixty nine when the president first took office he immediately corrected that and overall study be undertaken we got in the united states the force posture what the entire no use of the government and for the youth in the sort of official now that we're standing they need for secrecy of the study about the may second sixty nine ignition of a large newspaper reported five strategic up an
understudy these options were published in the press in advance before they were considered by the national security council damaging nature of the disclosures about it henry kissinger again he said each of the disclosure is one of the most extreme gravity at present patients of a government thinking on these key issues they provided the soviet union with expensive inside have to our approach the thought negotiations i say again they had a reference the wiretaps to the thought that both live here now but they favor of the wiretap
now we must realize that moment wiretap for my family they will pick up that noah adams that we're not interested in this particular case the results with successful been a number of instances the fbi reported that several of the national security council staff members had extensive contact with members of the press in particular two employees the first of many aspects of the internal workings of the national security council gentleman has consumed by the gentleman standing there a gentleman pennsylvania's recognize friedman chairman oppose the motion to strike or tool of national security is wrong
just that their assertion of national security one of delavan wisconsin has given the criteria and i think the members trimmed read for themselves and the criteria for themselves and i'm sure that the memory of these excerpts is present in the minds of all the members certainly i remember them very vividly impressed that reason mr nixon himself on february twenty eight nineteen seventy three that the tapes were joke that the us taps were joke that they'd never had to prove anything susan davis chairman that this was a new venture into the private lives of individual citizens not like discuss just what the use of wiretaps in secret listening devices means in a free society sure we'll remember these stories television movies and books about spying which has gone in nazi germany
and the soviet union we've learned that russia you must never have a serious conversation without turning on the water radio's of that conversation could not be heard by the secret listening devices for some action that the telephone as taps open russia everyone takes long walks in the park so they can communicate it's become an article of faith that russia big brother has arrived at the secret police are always listening now we learn that the late sixties and early seventies and possibly right up to the state secret police have been listening in america only now they had special equipment to eliminate the noise of running water were allowed really those in washington has become a sardonic joke to say that the phone is tapped whenever there's a strange noise on the line we become a suspicious people are pregnant or planning not be cross about what we say might prove that we've committed a crime and danger that national security but because our political enemies might use this information against us mr chairman the nixon white house make
this a complete reality united states the president in his men know what that what they were doing was so marla repugnant that they could not even trust the fbi keep records of their activities finally they could not even trust iran subordinates of the files were taken to the oval office the white house then locked in a safe at the second most trusted advisor as sharon in addition to everything else seems to me that the various crimes committed and we're discussing now seems to me not one of the least important one of the most important of the peach or fences and when it comes time for general but they don't have rib joints and point out some of the criminal violation of the law john has consumed only real a deeper than that and the record of the fbi show that the information over the name and by the white catholic but the good years to prevent further with and thirdly i
concur with the weapons that he had the day that the president committed no illegal act and if you go to any wiretaps and if indeed it would have failed in its responsibility if you did not attempt to prevent the disclosure of national security information and i for one the chairman at the site and that the president did not act to stop briefly in the interest of national security i would vote to impeach him gentle lady there is no question about the right of the president and to institute want less wiretaps even in the interest of national security we don't worry about that debate back in nineteen forty president roosevelt and then the molten is attorney general sachs and stating that it is in there the interest of national security to prevent those
subversive activities too instigated these waters wiped out but that's not what we're concerned about we can see the right to issue instigate that they're all lies wiretaps in the interest of national security the question is whether president nixon using those of forty and conformity with an income pointing where what bolero is what the law was at the time those wiretaps were instituted the fact is i'm controversy that mr nixon authorized wiretaps the threshold question is whether or not the law and the constitution nears complied where we had the nineteen sixty seven cups decision which said that wiretaps do come under the water now with against unreasonable searches and seizures we had the nineteen sixty eight on the bus on control and safe streets now what
i want to hear the opposition advice themselves is whether the omnibus ramsay street act which was signed in the motel in nineteen sixty eight was an act of the whole event and that absence all that flying regulations are a cloud of wine decision issued by the supreme court of the united states there is no such thing as a law at waging some clarification by the pool at the nineteen sixty eight decision was more and the president did not abide by raul malo with was in effect at that time these wiretaps nineteen sixty nine to nineteen seventy one are instituted i want to hear the opposition that stem cells not simply that those wiretaps which relate to perhaps national security council employees what one of all those which related the news man will certainly no i'm not but no nothing about state secrets what about those instances where wiretaps
were instigated on employees who had not the government and long sense had nothing to do with national security matters we read summaries of those wiretaps and you haven't heard a statement that was elsa and personal matters involved in some of the information activist i want the opposition to address themselves to all of that that is not that just those which may under some stretch of the imagination at had something to do with national security a climate of leaks do not necessarily justify and in my judgment do not in any canisters justify a violation of fourth amendment freedoms thank you the germans forced i would like to call attention to exactly what keith decision
which had not become law and were talking about you know and he was reinstated it was necessary to get a court warrant before instituting wiretaps in matters which involve only the domestic aspects of national security that was not and it down at that time we're talking about is back in nineteen sixty nine and the general assumption environmental circles was but you didn't meet a prior court order to institute wiretaps for the domestic aspects of national security at that time i'm sure you never really know but it's important to know what the key decision did not hold even when it was handed that i read from the opinion of the court we emphasize before concluding those opinions sage as stated at the
outset this case involves only the domestic aspects of national security we have not addressed and expressed no opinion as to the issues which may be involved with respect to activities of foreign powers or their ages in a footnote they say for the view that while the surveillance know impermissible in domestic security cases maybe constitutional where foreign powers are involved the united states versus man's saw and a great many of these wiretaps here were cases where foreign affairs we're certainly involved and where foreign powers were certainly and arrested and where some people might even have been agents of foreign powers and even under this site would still in all probability be lawful addressing what they're away from texas said the court said further
north as our decision rests on the language as section twenty five eleven or any other section of buying three on was prime to introduce a freedom act of the night dean sixteen annie that it does not appear to be fine or do many of the powers of the president to meet him as the threats to national security and the pie dough added to an ordinary crime so they didn't think any guidance from that they didn't speak were fired people were involved and they then held for the first time that strictly domestic national security required a quarter are now back in sixty nine there were a lot of important leaks in early march and i'm using now the books of our testimony both the presidents present asian and our own present day in early march of sixty nine and this is from the president's brazen think
your committee decision was reached to conduct the fifty two raids into cambodia they were conducted secretly and we had our testimony to to maintain the tacit approval a prince norodom sihanouk hour on may six sixty nine william beecher act to actually report these raise new york times jeopardize in relationship with porn cinema on april first sixty nine the department of defense needed troops study about withdrawing troops from the atlantic it had not yet been discussed with the south vietnamese government before it was just that without the economy's going on impulse at sixty nine mr frankel ran arcola new york times about it jeopardize their relationships with the south vietnamese government must reconsider so testified she filed and other similar manner all happened in sixty
nine and my sense there mr homer agent solomon wrote in may sixty nine i thought you would like to know that faraway gone this morning to advise that they are releasing next day at least one leak will be respectfully the time of the gentleman has expired almost time in support of the amendment result is remaining four minutes those in opposition and then as our stringer articulate probably from texas ms gordon jordan indicated we are not here debating the president's authority to tap phones the national security matter nor week debating those areas where in criminal cases on a warrant phones maybe tap my good friends on the side of the aisle they'll forgive me
engaged in a shell game that trying to put the emphasis on whether or not there is wiretap a foreign what's that what's at issue here is illegal wiretaps now when the time magazine story was about to break the president was involved in the job about the wiretaps a program at the white house the president was involved in the creation of a fabrication that there was no such probe subsequently he publicly and acknowledged it and as late as july twelve nineteen seventy four in a letter to the chairman of our early she's a mini state quote i personally directed the surveillance including the wiretapping of certain specific individuals unquote that my friends are talking about the ellsberg leaked i share their concern about that i think it was reprehensible one of the greatest tragedies in all of this is that because of them is on top of the employees at the white house and the president himself ellsberg escape prosecution for leaking that
confidential information and i absorb that as much as anyone on this side of the aisle but there is absolutely no justification for some of the pew or the pure and simple illegalities involved in this area of the law the secret service has no authority statutorily to tap phones they did at the direction of the white house and obviously the direction the president tapped the phone of his brother with no statutory authority they say the cia was it was asked and sometimes they refused and sometimes they cooperated in the in activities inside the united states there are statutory authority is specifically forbid them to be involved in any domestic activities directing the fbi to investigate daniel schorr because they didn't like the kinds of things he was saying about the administration was another new issues of the president's power when it was discovered they said he was being considered for a job we had testimony here that that was a story which the president helped to fabricate he had no time was
under any consideration for a job now let's look for some a specific wiretaps the joseph pratt dr kraft wiretap if it was a criminal case they knew they had no war if it was a national security case they need the approval of the attorney general they had no approval from the attorney general he was not involved in publishing leaked material that was pure and simple an effort to get information on a so called white house md the it's been said many times about the former national security council employees who left their jobs and the wiretaps continued for a long time there's only one thing i wanna answer that indicative of what they had in mind here is that henry kissinger no longer got those wiretap reports for the additional month while you're working with animosity they then went to haldeman who wasn't concern directly with the national security council now another thing that disturbs me
about this is that alexander haig directed the fbi quote on the highest authority not to maintain regular records of the wiretaps and not to treat them in the same fashion that other national security gaps were treated by the fbi and the joseph crab trap went into that category so there were no records at the fbi so when the department of justice was asked in the ellsberg case if they had ever overheard him in any conversations the justice department director the fbi to check their file they came back and said no there's no evidence of any indication of wiretapping because the records were all of the white house is i indicated this morning they were personally delivered to blue oval office by marty direct presidential involvement and the gentleman has expired all time has expired and the question now carries on the amendment the view offered by the gentleman from california laws and they really
am and please signify by saying ay oh no found a mandate call the roll and they gaze in the nasal lot of all those in favor of the mammal you say i'll vote mr brooks no no no no you know
fb mr ayers busy memorial wall's been i guess because i ms tyrrell well mr reagan i was it was the goal was to me i was to know most about her goal
is to go until this july i was different role was the more i as ravi no no it's better ten members voted aye twenty eight members voted no madness and i've read you don't recognize that moment where mr cohen on page three some paragraph or
striking line seven and uncertain though there are the following new language national committee and the cover up they're up and concerning other local activities including those relating to the confirmation of richard kleindienst as attorney general of the united states electronics surveillance on private citizens of breakin into the offices of dr lewis fielding and that campaign financing practices of the committee to reelect president jowers recognized the gemini mike is pretty indicative of the long awaited moment myself calling for a writer specifics in the so art rap for i think we all agree the public that statement was to general administer within for attention too oracle perfected yet but i think that the views of the specific areas that would want inclusion under that's
a paragraph about that my colleagues to support it i would be pleased the gentleman from maine follow them there really a man and losing the time i said i was a follow the humanity and the gentleman from california's strike a paragraph three of their heart or really i'm a man and one is the way that one day such a two strikes some paragraph three how are you by the
way i don't really believe this particular paragraph is the one which makes in charge of setting up special investigations unit in the white house now i think that considering it is necessary to think of the background under which have the president made his decision or their background is so what the gentleman from north texas has referred to as the climate of leaks and that there is no question that there have been a series of very damaging seriously i worked for several years one has already been referred to by our mr moren yeah there's the league in nineteen
sixty nine of the secrets our estimates of the united states intelligence board alva soviet tv strength and particularly of soviet first right this was a highly confidential iraqi man but that if that was released five some official leaked that plan to a reporter and appeared in the new york times and unique scenes nineteen sixty nine stating our estimate of soviet first right our and then that became i will recite all the lakes that intervene but probably the most famous one was the release earlier an obligation of the so called pentagon papers which don't have to deal with our decision making process in viet nam ilo started to
appear in the new york times on june twenty eight nineteen seventy one at a time land our troops are still involved in combat the indiana man at a time when that for kissinger was engaged in a sensitive negotiations to end the war and the other man in paris on june twenty eight nineteen seventy one dr ellsberg openly boasted in a public press conference so the newspaper i was reported for the president that that they're this man had been made i lay across the employee and the defense department during the johnson administration the idea was this other highly secret information of current validity endangered including art
our nuclear capability and the factory over in his press conference said invited others to join with him he was carrying on a publicity a propaganda campaign or asking others though also to join him in his opposition to the manner in which the administration was winding down the war in viet nam which did not mean that is real well this was a highly dangerous situation the president was responsible for the national security and a clear duty to act it had to do something it elected to set up this special investigations unit in the white house i don't happen to agree with me a way in which i think it would have been much show wiser for him to rely
upon the federal bureau of investigation which was me established agency with long experience in now at a national defenses security investigations but it's very easy for me and it's very easy for critics of the president with the benefit of hindsight to say it should have gone the other way but who is to say lennon and the charge that awesome responsibility as the main others saying to protect other security and i mean doesn't mean precisely practicing at the month and actually there now another very narrow goal for instance of national security leak occurred shortly thereafter wildly our special investigation unit was still are being implemented and that occurred on july twenty third nineteen seventy one in connection with the salt talks the strategic arms limitation agreement service stations in helsinki
there we were trying to negotiate the numbers of us round based and submarine based missiles and anti ballistic missiles which were to be constructed by us and the soviet union there could be nothing more vital so the defense of the united states and for the interests of the united states our ability to defend ourselves against nuclear attack i get it in advance we had leaked by some official or officials in our government are a fallback position and everyone knows that a negotiation you don't reveal our euro our final position you try to get the best the agreement for years i've mentioned and this is certainly true lot more i and national defense and anything else but in this article that appeared in the times they clearly rubio oh i'll let the americans were prepared to ask something
less if they're full american bartending at the job was now gerald resistance he says an early vote has been cashed in immediately to a point now that the committee members were censoring as they return to the markets making still another attempt to cut down the number of charges against mr nixon
and a committee recess and the gentleman from iowa mr maina consume five minutes in one of the amendment recognize the gentleman from new york is the fish opposition in the back of a chair and there's the german members the committee i think with the article two buildings that doesn't abuse of enormous park well the federal government against its citizens is an issue that is particularly important to a democratic people the illegal activities of the farmers is the subject of the third division which we are we have to force a motion to strike another settler talk on this on this particular paragraph and i won't have to be brave the new york times published the first installment the pentagon papers the president threw home and directed mr golson to their memorandum stating his recommendations on the pentagon papers
issue mr golson dated june twenty five recommended that the investigation successful prosecution of ellsberg was an opportunity for political gain and for the president by publicity discrediting this elsewhere as you know also mr wasn't it the genesis i suggest you all the plumbers was the pentagon papers in a meeting between a president assad minister michel on july six we have a discussion of forming a quote non legal group in connection with the pentagon papers of fear there is no question here of presidential knowledge the question has been raised and you really raised again however that the issue was national security from the start
this legitimize the formation of the plumbers and the effort to publicly discredit mr daniel ellsberg there's jenna i've asked you during his break a few minutes ago to find them a certain citations i recall conversations and principals news this matter that showed me clearly that it was a public relations effort there than mine and that national security thought in the pentagon papers case was not the issue could you refer to those are there the following items i want
it seventy one a meeting in the convent in the more industry calls that i say the president item number a reduced league staff all this is the way that it's also aired july first one meeting with president bears the following every label item number one espy an irish not involved in court cases and twenty nine and says this case rates of security will hold its closure without intent to commit espionage say maybe later note number thirty timing there and
not react to ellsberg case don't think in terms of spies july six nineteen seventy one the president fb fb
This record is featured in ““Gavel-to-Gavel”: The Watergate Scandal and Public Television.”
Series
1974 Nixon Impeachment Hearings
Episode
1974-07-29
Segment
Part 5 of 6
Producing Organization
National Public Affairs Center for Television
WETA-TV
Contributing Organization
Library of Congress (Washington, District of Columbia)
AAPB ID
cpb-aacip/512-rf5k93236v
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Description
Live and videotaped debate of the House Committee on the Judiciary, chaired by Peter Rodino, Jr., on the articles of impeachment against President Richard Nixon. This is day 4 of the Nixon impeachment hearings.
Broadcast
1974-07-29
Asset type
Segment
Genres
Event Coverage
Topics
Politics and Government
Subjects
Nixon, Richard M.; Watergate Affair, 1972-1974
Media type
Moving Image
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Credits
Producing Organization: National Public Affairs Center for Television
Producing Organization: WETA-TV
Reporter: Lehrer, James
Reporter: Duke, Paul
Speaker: Rodino, Peter W.
AAPB Contributor Holdings
Library of Congress
Identifier: 2403168-1-5 (MAVIS Item ID)
Format: 2 inch videotape
Generation: Preservation
Color: Color
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Citations
Chicago: “1974 Nixon Impeachment Hearings; 1974-07-29; Part 5 of 6,” 1974-07-29, Library of Congress, American Archive of Public Broadcasting (WGBH and the Library of Congress), Boston, MA and Washington, DC, accessed May 26, 2019, http://americanarchive.org/catalog/cpb-aacip_512-rf5k93236v.
MLA: “1974 Nixon Impeachment Hearings; 1974-07-29; Part 5 of 6.” 1974-07-29. Library of Congress, American Archive of Public Broadcasting (WGBH and the Library of Congress), Boston, MA and Washington, DC. Web. May 26, 2019. <http://americanarchive.org/catalog/cpb-aacip_512-rf5k93236v>.
APA: 1974 Nixon Impeachment Hearings; 1974-07-29; Part 5 of 6. Boston, MA: Library of Congress, American Archive of Public Broadcasting (WGBH and the Library of Congress), Boston, MA and Washington, DC. Retrieved from http://americanarchive.org/catalog/cpb-aacip_512-rf5k93236v