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it'sbsaid documents i had to come up in my own mind with apersuasive argument as to why not eat six and destroydocuments i decided the best way to persuade and was dominantthe americanpeopleyes it was because itold mr weiner why did you suggest this ipo mrsafire ask i want to be able to testify that i turn everything orderthe fbi and subsequent when i came out and they were getting more
specific than that well what was the conversation in the office of thetime the documents were drawn there was aconversation as a semi ireceived with great plans tomeet with him and saidwhy didn't you reduce the meetingi have the impression of whitman was going to meet with mr graham something else andit wasn't specifically on this i think you suggested mr kohut momentof meeting with very determined documents alsoagain the remainder overthe open on it on a thirty or over the weekend that said there's a
delay here and co written on monday he said i'm reading this yearthis eveningyesterday he was calledup and the reception area a man mr ukman maybe nationalcommittee raised the matter and said that these are materialsfrom that you can say by billy beane has turned over other material to the beer directlyyou have a new discussion with proper documents and laid them on a coffeetable that i'm sure that wasabout this was you know this was a way that i believe we handle the situation if iwas nervousyou might be grilling
i was goingwith itmeaning polygamynow prior to his coming in the office understand that un generalassembly been done and my question is did you have any discussionsduring that time i want youto be it was for one understoodwhat the meeting was four so was misled have any extended discussionare very politically sensitive thatas i recall i call them political dynamite when i raised them with ragethat he should take custody of them and thati would be away and that far as the white house was concerned
that destroyed about thingsthe fbi fileswell it was because he was told that they should never be legally make publicsomething that did you discuss something to that effectbefore he came into officeyeah man if this was explaining himneed at that point in time there are placed the documents at asmall so the briefcase not really replace that moneyand legal briefcases that he placed the consent and seemed quite willing to
paint them you couldn't even say anything understand that maybe thiswas a proper procedure all unusual oneand what was preciselydefining said to mr gray about the documents waswhen i saw that they werefrom mr hans save at the right politically sensitive i've been explained inthat we've turned the restaurateur over to the agentsi think they really it would justbe a very serious problem for the president during a reelection year there'ssomething about the light conversationi think that they didn't comedianmy creative ideas that time at that time
that doesn't threaten us air strike me as one of my normalphrases well the best of your collection what did you say in this diversethat's a moment that i can't recall a precisewords that other than the fact that we are trailing come from one state to the best of myknowledge it'll make the watergate leak it would be used up in forpolitical dynamite that later became publicembarrassment and republicans did you ever promised tograb up these documents after that meeting i can recall calling him irecall that i believe yesterday i had one discusseswith counsel now that i had a conversation and some time and mr gray in hisoffice in which he told me he had taken of that mystic connecticut and he said he waseither going to read the law had read them and i i just cannotrecall which it was that he said because it was a passing conversation
you don't recall too conversations mrcurrier meeting with him in his office in your office or the fallasking him what he needsand he indicated to measking him what you've done now i'veread that they are that he had taken in connecticut we discussmeeting with and what was that there was a meeting i do notrico it could have been on the leak problems we're having now yourecall aig in a meeting of these documents ifyou're in its was a big date on what you might be righti do recall a median
grade of justice came out he told me had taken in connecticut i was not really said hehad read them always going to read them or something of this nature did you ever askyour creation yes i didi recallthe justice department that probably in early january and thattimeless ray came up to me and put the body on the said johnny depp tohang tight i'm not disclosing these governments must havenothing to him i said don't understand and others but i atthe time i had been questioned by the years i thought i had to tell mrpeterson if i was going to go forward and right that was going to come out that you hadnever asked him on many other occasionsat
the same timeso the conversationis never believedmm hmm areall the things i'm sure and everybody smiles at that if theyreally you know they give them not only is that one thing you don'tdestroy that's quite another another situation hoping that time i'd neverseen alive again might be interpreted as wanting to be destroyednot necessarily i'm sure that a lot of things in the bill that weshould never seen a lot and they had to destroy something else i see agreat distinction center and two let's go to the august press conference wereonly president referred to write the new report my
understanding is that you and again you indicated greatsurprise this so called the report because as i understandit you felt that you had not been conducting an investigationanytime the president andother states mentioned your name as a great surprise to be another example when thepresident shortly after the supreme court handed down the death penaltydecision iraq mr buchanan who's preparing the presidentpresident went on television and said i just talked to my counsel about thisdecision and he has his opinion and i was actually quite surprised to hear my name on televisionand i give them advice and turkey's decision one that had never talked about itas a great surprise to many another thing happenedsen dodd he will continue his
fine tooth comb survey of dean's testimony in a moment now to include a very detailedreviewer dean's meetings with president nixon we're going to take a little pause now andjust like you know that when we do we don't cut anything out there to stop a videotape for wow so you canhave a bit of a rest of your station can identify itself and we start running again is nothing cut out ofthese earrings public television's coverage all the hearings will continue after apause for a station identification on a bridge to coverage of these hearings is provided as apublic service of the member stations of pbs a public broadcastingservicefbfb
payfrom washingtonand vibe continues its coverage of hearings by the senate select committee on presidentialcampaign activities here again correspondent robert mcneil as we goback to the areas senator bernie wants to know about these alleged role in the watergateget station wabe herewhat we are doing all this time when youhave a need to at least on three oh two he was sitting in what witnesses from the whitehouse and the fbi interviewing who have moneycalls to people about it you talk to mr gray about it several times youas i understand it were courting joe halderman ehrlichman that you don't
call investigation what do you tell him well i participated in acover up i was giving my orders from my superiors anddoing what i thought was expected of me at that time and following those orders ornot you think that might have been interpreted by some people as a rather thoroughinvestigation in the past i think that iwould use anythingand every investigative means i could conceiveup and that i was not turtles not investigating all of themcertainly i never pressed mr strong own involvementi certainly was investigating the white house the only person i wasworriedinvestigation interestingly while as a
private investigations there was no investigation right by your question was adog you think that somebody else might have thought you were investigating from the activitythat i just described it i don't want totell you that all the members of the judiciary committee during the great hearings iswrong impression that you're conducting a rather large investigation was oneissue the same analogy i'm sure that a lot of people thought and the presidentrecited what the substance of the death penalty was thatthe president might have concluded that you're conducting an investigationwell really it was the homeowners they're out and one or the otherwere reporting to him what was going on as you testified to many timesin this is and i was just like i have no idea how this ended upin the book i had no conversations with various creativetime i don't know i have no idea what was happening i have just like
that but mr haldeman frequently made notes when i was reporting to himthe usual placesand i'm aseniormelissayou indicated greatsurprise and there's a rather consternationabout the fact that you were said about the president's conduct of
investigation i said pleasemr holmes rigid wings andin your name there's a national protest mrnasr well most of the otherslocked up in the middle of mymessage that feeling i said this bothers methat i mean i think it has todo it would've been asunni areayou suggested that
and i think that whathappened from what i understand is the problem of thecia may have already met a cia and they told meheyrachel i think that we shouldexplore the possibility of the cia and some assistants well i guessmy question for a major round up to you and then you brought up through allthisquestions i ask
operatives they couldn't anywaycia doesn't come up i don't really understand the whole world nowbecause even todaythere's some arrangement were the operative is taken care of that somebody does get in troublethis was discussed in this conversation that some of the people might well be operatives itwould be taking the cia might have a very legitimate interest in protecting themyou mean you thought this time though seven people who were caught in the watergateit wasquite cleari asked was that you knewthat the cia had nothing to do of what yes sir i was about what we'rewilling to try to involve the cia canbegin to explain what it for muggers the suggestion that these men
could have been datenight thiswas looked at as a protest the way to deal with thesituation of things were by the needsabsolutelynothing to dowell initially though i had two after he made a very clear that hisknowledge and they did not have a problem it was about a whole but this would be asolution it was not a solution i continue to pursue it with them asking if there wasanything in fact i could go on all this isn't growingin preparation for my next question did you ever does occur in the united statessomebody was driving
and that was my reportingwell it's going to come back if wecan and the beginning of that eerie silenceoperation hangover iialicefordham in jerusalem well asi explained that i would carry a message for example when itwas when mr obama mr eckman agreed that thecia would be a very bad idea i took this information about it thereelection committee made them said what we have to do somethingnow mr thediscussion was that we need to come up from a no they knew that there's nothing i couldsay that would get us to come up the line and say they would get to come out the line
was asked about mr haldeman ehrlichman and see if they couldget they would administer security which they did and then ican make a message to must come up no noand itold her to come out while you come back you want thousands of luzon and twenty ninewhere you meet minimum of our hotel in the coffeeshop initially the coffee shop was too busy and i know i waseasily within a roomi wasabout a situation likethatmr
bateman yeahas usual you don'twell i don't know what i told him is that i had to conveywhy would he be interested in well ok whati would have picked that one time i was veryconcerned because they might be directed at the united states and that was thesisters is even though wellwhat did you tell him you needed him for to raise money for onethat's what it came to her one that is correct not want want want to dominatethe political sense these individuals areusually the reason you don't mind i would besurprised well i thought that the money and one for a number ofwomen of bail money and attorneys the tentative support of the
defendants in the family is there so some of thereasonsyou have mentioned that i can recall that when mrerlichman was asking me about some of my testimony said well i always assumedthis was for humanitarian purposes and i said now you know we talked about specifics iplay contains and the like the data supportedthe bale and the like to meet individuals who have beenfound in the democratic national committee who could begin unravelingthe whole matter i thinkyou understandi'm not sure i would've thought i think that would be every humanthing to do if you're employed some people got caught a minimal resourcesof that i would say that would be a fairly logical flying that you might raise
money to pay for these expenditures well senator i'msaying and i was quite sure that come up understood at what the purpose of hismission was he told me that he wanted to use that your last or with the library'sit if we're going to make such payments openlywhy not put it on the campaign expendituresyour testimony is raisingmoney oh support for tennesseeand you did not discuss specifically that this money was being raised the paper'ssize is that correct specifically whatthe white house and mr obama understoodgiven the whole proceeding that has been set up in houston a few last wordsthat this was not true for humanitarian purposes
rulesand he wentfirst what did you say an unplannedknow what was the understanding about the instructions that were going to be given to his comebackit isyou mentioned a meetingin a new office i don't recall the rescuecame with somalia's interimthe major disabilitiesmr camargo took notes and put into
his own code on a very small piece of paperthe information that mr mcgrew had an opposite of whatyou saw me to come up and askme if i really get me to my office and i said fineiti didn't really know what is at the white house and met personallywas equivalent of the us military or theanimositythis is truemeeting you didn't pay any attention to itall just talk amongst was when i would say i wasn't a i wasn'ttotally unaware that they were talking about it i can recall specifically the dollar amounts
i did take some telephone calls stump because the comeuppance wasbeing very careful and in deciding how he's going to decipher down the slaughter of the stimuluspolicy is himselflet's turn out of the september fifteenth meetingwith thepresident of the home and interest upon me from hertestimonyit was a very cordial circumstancesthe president asked me to sit down but mayor
bob hope and what it what i've been doing anappreciation for it and youknow immediately you have a iunderstandand i would have to go into greater detail did youdiscuss the criminal cases that were coming along for trial as we get there was that it wasthe criminal case that point there was the entire seven werebeingfarmers conference yesterdayto discuss the common core is so they haven't fallen common causethat is correct did you discuss the patent hearings that wereimminent that has any idea how long these discussions there
i would say that the entire meeting lastedthirty minutes or so forty minutesdid you or discuss any aspects of thewatergate that that meeting with the president for example if you tell him anything abouton the mainland on the menugood jobindictments had been indictments stoplady because the only other lincoln at the white house as we have discussed earlier andobsession with the mendenhall woman was was magruderunits remain new aboutwanting you have an orphanage and get into any idea that itwas bin laden maybe
the us are used a strong emotionalabout it nothuge businessestestimony inaugust well how can you say that thepresident knew all about peace and from a simple observation by him towalk but senator if your eyes and you know how your stuffoperates as an image of your staff understand how you operate andabout reporting requirements proceeddetails this was the hottest issue that was going inthe campaign i can't believe that the fact that we are going to contain
this does matter with total escape the president's attention andit was to me a confirmation an accompaniment to me that ihad done thisthankyoujuli niemann discussingdavidgreeneit isdiseases and i
want to follow my mind it's not a reporterbut our impressions of the conversation thatwell and the impression i had was that you know you'vebeen doingthese thingsfifteen isanything about itlet's turn to workers togravity was then you talk to him in june and advised himabout is that coming into view of the fbi that correcthe did
it and i presumed that you knowi'm his participation legally church thought he was notfully explicit that and that's why what was not until november iwent out and had a full interview with him to find out the dimensions of the involvement of mr chaikinhas just runi really domy reportingand that's itmany
of the writersthe purpose of the meeting with mrs regret it was to advise them to havean information from the fbi about strong and that'sabout ittwo fifteen thousand two hundred jobsnow where you are in charge of the money i can answerthat question i know that most astronomers to power partly on the week of junenineteenth twenty or thirty twenty first a relativelymr starr and mr richard hauerthese findings have nowbeen expanded yesterday to takecustody of that money
you have tohave moneyyou knowi was workingon this i had been given a couple of simon's dollars to get the menthat do that and also gets alot of music inthose daysromney
i didnot exactly sit down and plan this thing out and i realized i was not going to havemoney to pay that the honeymoon in their expenses are and that wasa very easy thing for me to do to reach in and take out what i thought i would need atime lowitwasforty eight hundred and fifty dollarstwo fiftyhow areyoui thought about two weeks down then
i also work at food expenses thegovernment and disturbing and travel expenses much in thecoveragei meani don'tknowi've got about two
thousand or be the honeymoon and no i didn't know what we would have peoplethat would be a serbian in mylife to be a safe amount virtually all my expenseswe're calling her testimony to seven tohave neglected or forgotten to get some money out of an account in new york and not wantedto go for four thousand eight hundred and fifty dollarsi needed moneythat's it you arecalling for is not anissuei've
made several attemptsto doi'm renee montagneare youi havenot sat down and tried to reconstruct it makes them a chair i might be possible to do idon't know in dealing with cash that iuse like i wonder if you were trying to do for the committeereconstruction anything toreplace iti have
no idea i only live without the money of mine put back inyour collegeand not just going toreconstruct their predicament is you doknow and then taking up another one of the legend knowonly the ones following the originalyou know i'm not aware whattime ago snowwell i hope they're very clear limited but there was no intention ofmy party never took them out i'd understood laterthat by the time i'd taken about money it's thatremote from the sixty eight primaries andfifty two
when i went to the governmentmr shepherd on the thirtieth of march and i don't recallexactly when we got a round of that we spent most time getting up atmy explanation of accidental shutting down in the details of that one time a poem ihad this money in it and a lot alsoas it werenono
the one time that i had a stick that that imagery and i said that's a dishonest thing to do andit won't be explained that i didn't make moneywhere is the money nowms peet if they are truehe said that some that i disagree withto know what is an adultcharacters as we have to like that definitionlike the situationas mike
milliganto dowhat's goingtobringonour first dog who was a newloretta lynn was the home and that hisadministration was going to do to home watching himto a lawyerhe wasi want the truth
council on howmr cohen who is also asuburban pakistan told him about the chapter i've known chapter from some yearsago we had a casual acquaintance turned warwick that autonomy how many yearsago three or four years and i'd like him when i met himi knew he had been a prosecutor and enjoyeda good reputation and then i also go on the twentyeight and twenty nine and several other friends to ask them who they might suggest as avery capable and assesses situation from for me i wondered about myparliament and anybody else's problem that had never been done based on the facts that i knewmr olsen at one
stage and he realized that when i my conversation been on a mike nichols and sohe withdrew and about that same time mr mcallisterwas retainedi thinkdavejosephall reimbursements and
the government and that a reimbursement from the reelection committee for anexpenditure for the convention that those were the only reimbursementsoh my it had been a house or to gethim a river that doesn't like or has recently moved into my headi was in the neighborhoodfamilymm hmmwe knowit was very very very fortunate
in the whitehouseit isyoui don't knowtreuer
doyou think that isyesyou arethis reporti understand thatmr erlichman was unwilling to use mr zieglerand there was a meeting on september thirteenth that it would you wouldbe issued
turning to the author of a clemency to mr mccollumas i understand it you made the arrangements for the call that is a curtain anduncommunicativetheleague was made to invest in a car and i think interms like it comes from the highest authority in the white house is thatsubstantially fewer correct youknow survive explain my testimony i wasproceeding on a conversation that happens to them after that mrlippman indicated mr olsen also indicated that in about themattera meeting
it'sbeen it'sbigbefore this committee so it's a gutsy threehours total i would be surprised but idid see one section of the questioning and i believe we've beenquestioning them and which he made reference to thisi think what you're referring to is he referred to thefact that my memory had gotten suddenly funding i have never said thatbefore this committee understood what happened between with any clarity
between federal authorities and june seventeenand i was we were talking about that he i think he also wasreferring to a meeting on human and messy meetings and referring to the fact that onmarch twenty fiveand i was i did not want to engage in a discussion of my recollection ofmeetings that we gonna let people and i had made my decision by that time iswhat i was going to do and i didn't want to get into a debate on itlook back i take thatconversation that is not let me leave from his testimony hill anewbefore the committeeyou said i think
when was thiscan you reduce number that would've beengenerally it was before that meeting theharlem with holmes it must've been in the summer it was when heindicated to me that he did not know how the water the implant something theearth and i said john you're not remember something andi became concerned of course over that that the conversation because obviouslythat could be an indication ofthingssome place else now the recall libya had any conversations with himor was it the inaugural committee werebasically went around what he's going to do it with the one
thousand dollars the conversation it occurred notgoing to run for office hesaid that he was going to test the waters because he thought he had met somany people in a campaign ad if the financial backing and now was the time to move i gotthat without telling them he was the message has brought down the road in that churchit may be putting a lot of people who have gone out to back him and gabi and i tried tohe wasand he addedmy
jobthose were the energy was to have a job or a discussion then i cannot recalla specific conversation will leadand mark i when i was at camp davidand his resolve this is a wine exhibits i've submitted one when he wanted me to have areflection of what election leadingthe way hereand i said to himit's myrecord atcamp david
important newsyou and he were discussing i guess the watergate him what led upand then his impression was a viewerthink that ended i guess about threethese images office discussion of electronic logging withwhere do you fall out ofall herbut i was never clear on what happened betweenfebruary and june seventeenth i'vegot them on a number of occasionsit was a revelation to me
meaning moneyand youwhyis that i think thatstatement mentions that what i've seen in theirconversations the president rather nonchalant in dealing with a manwe discussedit doesmm hmm
if the presidentit waswell this meeting of the twenty first thejewish guy into the president's fall on you know about why i wouldsay with every detail because if you know it's taken mesix hours to read a statement to this committee which airsi thinki think that'sright
thank youasi was readingit and i wasrelievedfbthe
This record is featured in ““Gavel-to-Gavel”: The Watergate Scandal and Public Television.”
1973 Watergate Hearings
Part 2 of 5
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Robert MacNeil and Jim Lehrer anchor gavel-to-gavel coverage of day 14 of the U.S. Senate Watergate hearings. In today's hearing, John Dean testifies.
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Anchor: MacNeil, Robert
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Chicago: “1973 Watergate Hearings; 1973-06-27; Part 2 of 5,” 1973-06-27, Library of Congress, American Archive of Public Broadcasting (WGBH and the Library of Congress), Boston, MA and Washington, DC, accessed May 19, 2019,
MLA: “1973 Watergate Hearings; 1973-06-27; Part 2 of 5.” 1973-06-27. Library of Congress, American Archive of Public Broadcasting (WGBH and the Library of Congress), Boston, MA and Washington, DC. Web. May 19, 2019. <>.
APA: 1973 Watergate Hearings; 1973-06-27; Part 2 of 5. Boston, MA: Library of Congress, American Archive of Public Broadcasting (WGBH and the Library of Congress), Boston, MA and Washington, DC. Retrieved from