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thepiece the idea of the people arrested had allall had a fake id cards which mr hunthad procured for them from thecia and that the although they were incarcerated theidentities of the accused was notknow he told me thatyes in response to my question of howling wind told me thatmr libby was some kind of a nutyou should have suspected that something like this would happenhe regretted that he had not insisted on firing himwhen he attempted to some weeks or months beforesoi believe that that was more than
evil inventors difficult to recall is tempering is lenowell icame lateri didn't haveto engage in the middle of something mr martindidn't come to find later that afternoon when you have a private discussionwith the mitchell and mr mcgrew mr mcgrew in this group asthe details of the events surrounding the greatcounselor just reminded me that was one other thing that i was informedthat time and that was that this was ani'm sorry maryand like there's a lot of previous question about the
only i believe that this was not thefirst break into the democratic national headquartersit is the sourceof his information and his first rick and mr libbywhen you get into a discussion on the eventsand yeswhenwe say mr mitchell mr mcgrew magruder in the room i and i can't say forsure that all parties are present at all times i can recalla discussion with these gentleman orsome of themi don't know
when i learned i learned it soon after we left the airport oras i recall our series of meetings startingeleven and anymoney in this regardless based solely on schedule which acopy of what you just affirmation ayler the us attorneys read itmr mitchell last event on the schedule was a press conference at one thirteenand i believe that press conference must've lasted a half an hour orso seeminglygot back to me beverly hills hotelto thirty to fortyfive hundred and forty i'm not quite sureafter we got back in thecar i would doubt it since and there was a driver
was a stranger was a hire car usingthat the brightest one of the purposesfor it was to fix about that hadbeen previously place in the democratic national headquarters that wasn't workingi don't recall any more input on the brake andas if that was there thatafternoon about the budget that had been approval attricks and black pants yes i believethat it was totally by mrat the airport hotel in my words one indoing everything and one of the items i think he told me there and then again i'm notcertain of the sequence of events but i believe that was the top
after too much we know what anydirect refer to could you just explain that i'm likeoh can't do the best i can i'd had never heard the expressionfour and i assume when they told meabout it but it was for black advancement i learned however thatblack advance was a counter advancethat was carried on against the oppositioncandidates or persons acting on their behalf no words an attempt todisrupt the advance schedule of the oppositioninform you whohad approved the budget for diddy dripping like thatoh yes and people leaving
the budget have been approved by mr mitchell and in this little letter that afternoonconfirmed yet approved such a budgeti like to put it this way this might thisrevelation i think the subject was disgusted he's even denythe eminently fairi feel it was because i was trying to get the facts ididn't know that's i hadn't heard black advance or dirty tricks and it certainlymust have gotten the discussion again that meanswhat is your best recollection as to
whether it was in the room when that was discovered that is my best recollection i'm tryingto be fair however when you ask about midiheard all types of meetings took place mr mitchell songs and other placeswith respect to mr mitchell's office anytime anybody walk in the roomas i understand it secretary would lobby and that was a meeting sometimes you walk in tosay that there was somebody else was then walk out and you attended a meeting that ihate to characterize formal meeting where he sat downin the negative that he had approved the black advance but that's my bestrecollection that he was president that i discussed andit usually anywayat youthank you it'sb mr martin well in california did you
receive an assignment of them as the metal regarding thewatergate matter to be more specificoh i did this little assign you to deal with the legal matters that mightarise in connection with the brightly isthat while in california that you made severalleading ibelieve that my record show thatwhich i've turned over to the committee and these are records of calls and iturned him to the committee to re elect the president does that italked to mr lydia on three occasions to look at three occasions the record showthree and there were three boys wanna was the record shows was not a color to libya's oil
you remember when he called that placeon saturday you're sending halfthe first time i thought there was to iti believe was on saturday that callsfor him to resignthat's why this revelation giveus a couple of the libyan sunday a couple of comedians sunday twicenow can you give us the best recollection you have thesubstance of these three telephone callstelephone calls a recall is an urgentdemand on the part of mr levy that i returned to watchit indicated in that cause i understand that mr mcgrew there was going to
return but he did not want mr mcgrew to return hewanted to return he i wasvery reluctant to not only reluctantly refused to use thetelephone to discuss anything about watergate he did howevermakes derogatory remarks about mr mcgrewthat's all i recall about her stillif you go into the second and the third point i had told us to leave thatabout plants that i've heard that mr mcgrew is going to return i would communicatewith mr mitchell and i would let him knowand thefirst time secondtelephone calls a cause when i call tell him that i was not going to returnand that mr mcgrew there and let's have a cure
and what was the flood also telephonecallers with respect to car i got from poe morehomework call me on sunday i previously testified the scanner theseconversations testified originally that they were sunday i was told that they wereon saturday i wasn't sure i have notchecking records of the call he's got a place on sundaytell me that when it turns out theprevious day he said that he wantedme to know or mr mitchell to know thatmr libby had told him in hispresence a good report received a call from mr mitchellmr mitchell that instructed him to go see him if the crimesand to have missed the crimes get the
watergate burglars released from jailhe did not believe that these instructions came from listener joepeople literally that he should not contact with the findings that whenyou realize that he was in fact going to contact kleindienst he went withthat mr liddy made contact with thefindings of the burning tree country club and that in order to advisewith declining steadily he was not pay attention and instantly hesaid he stood by mr levy so that literally could not see him but thatled to findings and shook his headnohe told me that as the crimes and affected told us to live at goto hell and scientist at when i'm playing all
i've been called <unk> kleindienst i think i told mr mitchell aboutmr mitchell was amazing finally michael ithen called mr klein begins to tell him that mr mitchell they've given nosuch instructions mr kline this was told me ibelieve that he was satisfied that he hadn't given any instructions thatsaid keep that is an adjective away from ai then called mr liddy andreprimanded him told him that mr michel were given no instructionshe had the numbervery narrow part of the attorneygeneral with morrie and i want to read youa portion of this testimony that is
now at eighty nine one of the rockwe knew that was the morning on who is dale was a close friendof disability and anyone of us and with the metalmesh with the money i'm crammed with the lady and ask him tosee the attorney general the kurds attorney general thatas a possibility that mrmccourt to be really get that statement is not truethat morning and you suggest any reasonwhyi honestly i don't think mrmcgrew intentionally falsely testified the subject of thelady trip to see mr kleindienst was much discussedmr libby's position wasn't
actually called iti can'tfathom the reason that thats what came out in his memory i think mrlibby would be the one answer that question it's beenamazing i can't imagine why mrmcgrew would say that i was a friend of libyansclose friend of libyans would ever use to describe that i hadnot seen as juliet to my knowledge except possibly in the hallway or want topoison the time i was a committee and i certainly would be classified asoffended by anybody that knows me well it was thelady did not acted pursuant to request from you by telephone anew division el as to what the problem is the late night visitlondon's i can
give you seventy one wasasked i was asked to call it to see clientsmr mitchell would have instructed me to call climate myself i didn't evenintermediary for him is declining support for mrmorial when a truly don'twantand when youi've been unable to fixthat all i can recall my recollection my wife recollection is it was duskwhat would place in the neighborhoodyou go directly in the little oh yes
i say directly ashred of the lessons on the plane for five hoursand you know if i knewthere'svigilantes hasbeen as james hamilton interruptshis examination of robert martin for lunch and recess we're gonna take a shortbread publictelevision's coverage of the senate watergate hearings will continue after a pause for a station identificationon a bridge to coverage of these hearings is provided as a public service by themember stations of pbs the public broadcasting service
and that continues
its coverage of hearings by the senate select committee on presidential campaign activitiesyou again correspondent jim lehrer as we go back to that hearing senatorobama's about to reveal what everyone at the time thought was a resolution to the president's trip takesissue as you say however the settlement was short livedthe peoplecall me and asthat the president has decidedto make available to the committee katey sagalconversations may haveinherited wilco witnesses before thecommittee and which are welcome to the mouth with the
committee is all rise investigate secondproblem was only that the president will meetwith me and it could be a town to meet with me aboutthat and made it at a convenient time nextweek and the greatest prestigious barclay's sothese tapes can be made available to the committeei was gratified this informationi think the information they were committed toexpedite its investigation and i think it was very wisedecision on the part of the pressas joan let's join in expressing mygreat delight at the decision of the president communicated you by secretary
shows i want to commend you as well and members of the committeefor handling this matter in a way that permitted this accord inthis agreement to take place and it had to leavefor war from trying to create a legal confrontationthat might have jeopardized the possibility of negotiating a settlement to this controversyit appeared that the white house says areshown it's so spirit of cooperation and responsei have nothing but commendation for the committee especially for thechairman for the president negotiating a rather diresituation involving most fundamental concepts that is lead actor separation of powerin a way that avoided a confrontation that willapparently give this committee access to parts of extremely importantinformation critical features of the simpler and
moreand thathas been made and we havebeen all for me and that investigatorshave been investigatingwe cite show unanimity agreement among the committee membersthat through the steps to be taken and whitmore one localcooperation it'sbigi'm rachel martinwe were
discussing theevening of june nineteenthat was present at that meeting this morningbased uponmy reconstructedrecollection i would say mr mitchellis to mrjean and i believe there was one a pieceof informationnow is there a possibility that theyard bird from the press spokesman actually met the audience didnot return commitment oh it's possible cause i don't have arecollection of that meeting we begin with the
meetingthe only two things i recall that meeting is that there wasa need for a statement from mayalso public information from mr mitchell i don't recalldiscussing ever participating in it i don't recall what the eventwas i recall discussing theneed for or obtain the resources ofa law firm because i believe it was announced thatday where we were informed that night that alawsuit was going to be filed the next morning by the democratic national committeeagainst the committee to reelect president and mybest recollection is that there was adiscussion as to who we should
replace him and it's you know the responsibility for securing the lawyersfor the spurs this year and what's a lawyer to eventuallyreturning for this it retained of mr parkinson in thisrobot that can all this are unable localauthorities of the us at this meeting was any discussionas to burning all a life destroying agents don'tfollow any other sensitive thought not in my presence and i never heard the word gemstonethis investigation the sheercame out i will say that i left that meeting rather really iwasn't very long i made numerous telephone calls at night so formy appointment calling local council people and i knew getting recommendations forlawyers late in the
evening but i called a number of lawyers and talk with themabout the relative merits of different law firms have different lawyersdo you remember this question of all of us to follow as opposed tothe destruction since the nose forportions of the testimony today anddistillers just wanted to of yesterday and received commentswere from the testimony phase one nine one three in one nine onefour these days if you have a meeting and that evening the evening of junenineteenth when you came back to washington an estimate of how the us needsto mitchell flew back that money with mystical room with the market mechanismthat mr dean of the morning to myself and the general discussion again wasthat well we're going to do about the problem it was again we had very little
information we did not of course know what type of investigation within the head and wetalked about types of alternative solutions one solution was recommended inwhich i was to of course destroyed victims don't fall so i calledmy operas and these days that solution came up as a result of thatmeeting well i think yes it was generally concludedthat that file should be immediately destroyed andnarrating from mr roose testimony yesterday atpages we're five eight nine or fire nineoh there's daschle said there's the group that i asked what he should doabout these sensitive files with ruby a certain as to date did heget a response to that as i remember there wasresponse from lisbon that all that itmight be a good idea if mr mcgrew had a fire in a previous to
that testimony the schoolroom had testified that view atme these orphans' and i've read of the testimony that we'velet me refresh your recollection at what i heardtestimony images redness to dean's testimonythose discussions took placeand i think that wouldn't requirecertification that have taken place on a way of anytestimony promised the room and west of the river that you leftthe meeting before destruction of gemstone fall i don't think anybody asked him thatquestion and i don't think anybody asked is true when i ride maybe they get i don't know that youknow no statement by the group or rubio or otherwise that you werenot present at this meeting when the destruction of the general population
ms maureen did you indeed several days followingthings have an occasion for an interview with the late pianistand who elseand the civil war roots fifa or fivenine thought that this meeting was on june fourteen you canclear in that testimony nostated there is doubt in my mind asto what the date of that meeting i originally in response to questions put to meby the us attorneys fix that later that meeting as the twentyfirst or the twenty seconds they told me that the meeting tookplace on the twentieth we finally settled on the twentieth and
twenty first and i believe i told your committee that was thetwentieth twenty first i'm checking my recordsi would have to say in the meeting took place on themorning of again i could be mistaken the morningof june the twenty first one is theannual rock morgan that indicate do thaton the work she did which has been turned over yourcommittee i know that i got a call from gordon liddyand it coincides with my earliest recollection thati did not meet with mr levy at least on the firstday of my returni'm not saying that that's an absolute i just my recollection
was the twenty first twenty seconds and i think havetestified that it could be the daytwentieth and twenty first but i would have to say that that was the pointperson isthat your recollection of that meeting with disabilities who plays in the morningpeace is based uponthat call it looks to be the firstcall that i noted andmy recollection is he said he was leaving that day for los angelesi notice in yourown wayand one eleven and one it well that appears to have been
canceled out with this heavy load on the morning of thetwenty first guest to you that perhaps admitting to methat crossed my cousin indicated cancellation i thinkyou'll find that cross are going every monday wednesday and fridayit's post exercisei know that there's onefor instance i don't think imet with the gentleman twice on that day one is that it onlyscheduling andthe fact that a note of my book doesn't mean i kept the pointi'm trying to give you the best my best recollection isout of this meeting
that's really oddhe was reluctanthe wanted to read someplace else and we met and just to lose apartner and i believe that more than anything else was the basisfor my belief that it was mr doe <unk> therange of them at union indicatedwe could meet in his apartment the foreign element in your ownwords to you in some detail tell us whathappens and tell us what information that was really importantto you
forget itwereally came into the room franzenyes mr rew is whether or not have a radiojust to ruin the kid radio which was on the corner of the living roommr liddy went over and turn the radio areand asked me to sit by the radio in the chair he satin a couch as i recall it was next to an end table at theradio czar he apologized to me by sayingsomething to the effect that it's not that i don't trust you that thisconversation can't be recordingplace on the possibly something in the room
and again i'm going to have to say thati don't recall a sequence of events in which you related the sense to mebut i do call it he said that hewanted to hire me as his lawyers his personal attorneyi told him that i was acting as attorney for the committee thati could not believe myself that responsibility to representhim he then said it was imperative that he be able to talk to me inconfidence and that under no circumstances that idisclose what he told me i told him thatsince he was an employee of the committee and i was acting us attorney for the community to talk to me asa client to a lawyer and that i wouldmaintain his confidence but that i would have to be at liberty todisclose what he told me in his trilogy the first
openly gay marriageharr one of the things that hetold me was that he had a message for mr huntmr hunt of felt that that was the committee's obligationto provide money to get his men out of jail at that timethese people were incarcerated in a dc jaili was interested in finding out what had occurred and iinterrogated him as to the events for the eveningof january sixteen morning of june sixteenth morning in the seventiesand you know the tomatowhat had occurred about the break in and told me that they hadplanned as i recall to break into the mcgovern headquarters that same nightabout the arrest of three
thatfrightens meindicated to me that there was nothing to fear becausethe only person i could identify mrlibby was mr courtney mr mccourt would notdivulge his identity that the cuban americanswere all soldiers who were in the cia with histrademark since the bay of pigs and that they would never under any circumstancesdisclose ms johansson definitely and then theyhave nothing to fear in that regardi told him that based upon what herelated to me and the events of that evening about one of which included as irecall his sitting on the shoulders of
one of the men at a distance i don't recall somethree hundred feet or three hundred yards shooting out the lightbehind the democrat senate committee headquarterspointed out to him that he was adamantly against her to be able toidentify him pointed out that he had spent thetoll was he spent some time in the room with these people in a hotel roomat that teams would beall over the place and he kept insisting thatthere was no chance he will betrying to convince him hewould be identified that's supposed togive himself up and wait for them to rescue
sophie scott is a possibilityhe did after sellingdiscussion indicated it was possible he could be arrestedthatis true the because of the news accounts of thearrest and they parrot bungled effortthat the possibility that someone in thehead at amine that they would be arrested toinvest the committee to reelectpresident he discovered this completely by saying thatthis group had been operating together for some considerable period
of time that they were all real polesthat they had engaged in numerous jobsand when i asked him what kind of jobs recently pulled to write under yournose and he saidno invaded the office of thepsychiatrist dr ellsberg and that they were theones who got the to do about it nowwith respect toit disappeared ask him because of the elves orbreak in what if anything they had obtained he told me that they had obtainednothing that surged all the files and couldn't find his
record i asked him one whose authoritiesoperating and i wish to be very careful here because i don'tknow that he used the name of the president but the ones he did usewere clearly meant to imply that he was acting on expressauthority of the president denied states with the assistance of the centralintelligence agencyi make some notes ofo i asked him what information they had obtained he told methat kelly told me that the purpose of making the centuryreally with this entry was not his doing that neitherhe nor mr hunt thought it was a good idea that they hadobtained it nothing from the book that they had previously implied it in
place he came from thatsomebody atthe democratic national committee was talking tosomebody at the democratic national committee was talking to thepeople so a person at the committee to re elect thepresident that industry can't or against the injury that causedthedestructionwhat's interesting
i think i was saying that to explain that neither hefelt that anything additional entries would befruitful but that he had made many untrue at theinsistence of mr mcgregori recall oilagain inquiring as to whythe stupid adventure seemed amelia roseridiculous oras a politicianhave political experiencethat i couldn't understand what they would hope to get out of the democratic nationalheadquarters before they even had a candidate muchless afterwards party headquarters at least republican party headquarters are very
still very disparate timeyou know he could not answer the question for meisboth what he wasoperating under i wasasked the question about the budget this morning i respond to both toyou and to the chairman and i statethat i had a wholea committee at least may bei
hear you i'mon the traini went to the jaili'm not familiarwith the secretary it willbe able to identify them so i just assumed that global markets rallyand a law and hemade a statement which i reported to the committee and the newsmedia are homeless of the microphoneand i'm a talent and be occasion when the counselwhite house thousands of commons that animal mrgao
investigation was made and that'scomplicated and say this show sothey're not the stated here that most of theconversation so all i have is obvious ball amile as stevie a place phonecall as follows that all humans have no reason not vote thisway because i have outpaced demandand i went throughhe was a realistand he had no conversations with metoday the level that it was somebody yelled at they'llthe conversation in the region about telephone is all it
was a rally calling us to tell me thatmaybe something about the white house revealed witnesses area concern ohyeah if youcontroloh mygodnot helpful not impartial and we saveour house counsel is that the president has the rest ofthe committee on station in the recent decision about tomorrowso all
we sawsomeonethepersonnowand there's a reasonit would be a fantastic yourdoubtful whether any of that hadto do with the greatest days hehopes it's been perpetrated on the committee the fact that it received in the capital palmacommittee room i would say in that credence to the call first question i can
fully understand the situation to transpirei would say for the record however that the banks that i expressed and theadmiration i expressed or the combination of both parties still stands as the advance paymenton what i hope will still happens to be acombination of this settlement permitted members of that still stands and out like anexpanded into the numbersand the opposite a widereceiver ilike thatthis weekms
martin i believe a minute ago we were talking aboutwhat business the lady told you about the budgetthat he was operating under i think they'reresponding to earlier this morning i mentioned thebudget matter in a conversationwith mr mitchell president incalifornia it'spossible that subject came up aftermy discussions with mr libbybecause mr libby told me and it may have been for the first timethat he was operating under a budget approved bymr mitchell and the white house during thatjune twenty first meeting if it is it
twenty years and just make the rocket clemmons body anddid mr liddy also say too that the operation said he had beeninvolved in such as the health their periphery andeddieasyou recall i cansay he's the statethat's truethat and that's the impression he left with methat they had been approved by the price ever do impressions yesan inability to mention the uk tradingdocuments are yes i'm trying to demonstrate to me that there wasno way of praising him he told me he had
shredded everything bit of evidence that would have linked himthis operation as well as our other operations he told me he'd even gonewrong yes i have a hobby i should say ofcutting so from the various hotelshe had taken the survivors often say this opensshep and shredded also properties he alsotold me that during this process he had shreddeda one hundred dollar bills we had in his possession that were new and serializedwe exalted the content of this meeting that likeyes mr mcgrew reminded me of anotherlike the tone was quite a bit that morning in may seem comicalmouth certainly didn't seem comical to us at the time he did make a
statement that the committee could be assured that he would nevertalk honestly doubted that the business who testified we wouldhave we would just telling what corner to stand on he was ready to beassassinatedwhat'd you do with this informationi went immediately i shouldn't say thatas soon as i could get access to mr mitchell i disclosedto him i may not have disclosed all of us to rememberitand you think it was the same day that you reportedyes mr mike counsel advised me that despite my notes ineglected to tell you a very important part of one anotherin explaining to me that
they weren't purely professionalhe told me thatwas the planet of the bay of pigs the chief plannerzahra call that hewas extremely popular i think he said like a garden implement cubancommunity of miami that this was anexplanation of why these cuban americans would follow him to death andthat alone would disclose anything as far as they were concerned thatare absolutely loyal work with him for a number ofyears i've been working with them in these operations thati don't wish to bring anybody else into itby implicationwhat he said he one of his
friends in the cuban committee and one of the leaders was a particular personi'm not sure if i used the identification or maybe identifying wrong personbecause it's step meetings i heard some a staff member start mentioning some namesare not even sure that the person was the character that i described he wasextremely wealthy and i told mrlibby i did not think mr mitchell would improve theuser committee funds to bail out the defendants a nation so advice was to huntand that seemed to me that i have mr hunt and socialconnections and the miami community at that they shouldlook to that community a love for the bail moneywhen you spoke witha little bit to transmit this request for whaling commissionincluded among other things
mr mitchell they told me that under nocircumstances would bail money be forthcoming and for me to call mr liddyintel and i did sowe tell us the rest of your conversation with mr meggs i don't want torepeat anything that you worked almost elated but i would like to know what was the myththat you areit'sbold he asked me if mrliddy i might say that mr mitchell heard thesincerely shocked as i was when i got this age here's amelialester liddy had disclosed any other
of the activities of thisgroup that had been arrested and mr hunt minister and himself andi i told him that he had nothad not disclosed any other stateit hadapproved a medical disability operationi don't think he didyou know he made no comment in any way as to whether or not he had approved thebudget not at that timethat discussion took place laterdiscussion and whether he approved a budget that was like well thediscussion that is done out in that vein that took place when iconfronted mr mcgregor i asked
This record is featured in ““Gavel-to-Gavel”: The Watergate Scandal and Public Television.”
1973 Watergate Hearings
Part 3 of 5
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Robert MacNeil and Jim Lehrer anchor gavel-to-gavel coverage of day 24 of the U.S. Senate Watergate hearings. In today's hearing, Fred LaRue and Robert Mardian testify.
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APA: 1973 Watergate Hearings; 1973-07-19; Part 3 of 5. Boston, MA: Library of Congress, American Archive of Public Broadcasting (WGBH and the Library of Congress), Boston, MA and Washington, DC. Retrieved from