A conversation with...; Jean Martinon, part one

A conversation with John Martino. This is another in a continuing series of programs each of which offers the listener a rare opportunity to hear an eminent musician informally discussing his own career and expressing his thoughts about a variety of topics related to the art of music. The regular participants in these discussions are Aaron Parsons and chairman of the department of theory and composition of Northwestern University's School of Music and program annotator. What a Chicago Symphony Orchestra and the George Stone program director for Zenith radio corporation's serious music station WEF am in Chicago. Mr. Parsons and Mr. Stone have as their guest on this program the distinguished French composer and conductor JA Martino. Music director of the Chicago Symphony Orchestra. Now here is Aaron Parsons. Mr. MARTIN Are we want to welcome you to this program we're delighted that you would join us on this occasion to talk about music to talk about your career as a musician

and to talk about aspects of your career which have led to the shaping of the musician. We might begin by turning back into the years and thinking even prior to the time you attended the Paris Conservatory. What sort of musical training I know you're a violinist and as a violinist you became interested as a composer and you became a conductor. My. Fresh reaction from when I was greeted by my father before he was I would sing my last piano or the beautiful song

and my mother and I was. And then I like you sing to me. Then the next day I started to say for my. And I waited. I was before I started that I went to the conservatory and deprived like what to do with it. I started but I from the beginning I

knew nothing about how to play. This was back when I was a boy I was a lot of the time in the black dog running of the piano. When I came to parodies they started to come to play. But really it's not a concept that comes out. But that I got my father's things and this product and get that planted we

became my teacher. He was at the school then. That's got to count or was it not about. Also the Pew study which you know much time that they have to make. Yes. And they went on with my study and I started thinking that one gets the impression and the compositions have been your first love from your very earliest childhood. Yes that's right. What about the after winning the prize and the Paris Conservatory. How how did it happen that you didn't

continue. After I started to care. And I I played quite a lot from. But I was not like enough to broaden and just before the war. I think we both like playing solo or so plain to an orchestra. And my composition. And then the war happened and Mike Carey I see there he's was going quite alright but because being stopped by the spin to hold together the last in between I should say it more that we should say for because it was

a big you know I was pretty you know that this was the right one came back and I got to ground more and the remaining make it to the end of that war. I started to have a chance I think I got the prize. The city editor asked for my hundred and thirty six. That was the one you wrote. Well you're a prisoner. You began it. Now you were fresh and later and so much more involved

and just had these moments that I started I thought it that my own way and that is how my carry started because now you have never been there. I wanted to buy you know nice to be a woman who was willing to be a conductor is as we look over your credits. It would seem you have willingly been drawn to every corner of the earth because by now I doubt that there is a major orchestra anywhere in Europe. Or in the Orient even where you have been conducted and you know I was reading the other day in preparing that script which I was going to do. A statement made by Rachmaninoff. For him it was a very difficult thing to be a performer and a composer.

He said that when he was performing as a pianist he couldn't comport and when he was composing he couldn't perform and when he was conducting you couldn't do either. But he felt that this kind of absorption in what he was doing was necessary and he said that some musicians are more fortunate than this. How would you feel about that. Well I agree completely with Frank Mann You know I think it's impossible to be completely and create something I think of other things to try. We interpret you from the past the center and the present time just go by the side and pick your own way. So that has been for me a great problem. First off all I gave up my own eyes. Exception I mean to place some time to music some time you know to play

with the orchestra. Some rocks but your instrument can match but really the kind one and the other side. I don't think it was possible to come back and forth so I would waste my time to try to spend. And the rest of the time when I come back sometime I can be with you know some orchestration is possible but I think impossible except be a more gifted musician that I am going to return when you are with

what kind of teacher was himself because he was not a significant figure along with the U.S. in the music of France. Yes Ruth said it was interesting. He was very much about with the stiction. You want to teach. I dare say any sort of student with any thought of your action. I used against people who was extremely conservative. Some of that was fairly nice line and some was much more and he has a great this is the kind to be able to direct all of those people in their direction without fearing

and some time he had been say that he was too much. You know you idea or I have to go like this you know and try always to have each of us in a different way and it was very interesting I think this was a something of the same attitude that he did not want his students to become his disciples and we should not forget that by the time that was said it was teaching you was really you have and you are still a little more. Yeah because even in the same time. But he was a man of the composer. A man disgusted by critics by the public and the house sometime about would seize on this stuff for months I swear and but he

understood. For instance you know you write music like that. But you know what I know what you told me privately that you thought that there was wrongdoing one way was too much looking for a beautiful sound but it was not you know a strong after action and feeling to express who but yet very very very much. Well it's a very interesting point. I take it from the evidence with good you at my work very much. I recall that you know we spoke earlier of the sort of the fifth anniversary television show. I recall that you used the spider's feast and of course one of yours spectacularly successful recordings with the Chicago Symphony Orchestra was

like you say oh yeah. So his music has figured importantly in things you have done in recent years. And does this indicate that your affection for him as a teacher also carries over to what he created. Oh yes sure I am very much and I am a story that's already on scene was only a small part of it was really true we don't know that never happened here. You know that's you know and being or I tell you it's unfortunate. You have been able to do a number of the symphony is no other. You know you've done the third and fourth and fairly recent. Yes I have done the last yeah. But I have done

stories so it's a great opportunity in London to be nice. After all you had mentioned you and I were in the fourth symphony and before rocky start. I don't know I do. Let's let's go back. If we keep jumping out of this and then going back. But. What exactly did you begin to conduct. Yes I bet that for the first thing for peace you must immediately after. After my first symphony broke. Concept called me a few days before the show I could not

get your symphony. Why not conducting your salary management life. And I think it became enough and after the concept of the management has me thank we come back two weeks after the conductor was musing for some reason I don't remember but I have to think the problem has been previous and I accept that it comes. And like these concepts broadcast the next day I receive because you know from both you asking me if I wanted to go and the people also include me. So I went to Vado and then they add up to me there and I

know they can come setting this next season and meantime that that's open me the door. It could be but that was not my big chance my chance came the way I was by the time I was about these concepts that get lucky because of that and I mean and I got them back that somebody comes out and things like this but I was very inexperienced and you know I thought I was going down thought driving with me and the manager told me if I wanted to go and so I got a concept called to convert my gun that he bought a hood you know to play feed it I thought you should you should go. I guess you need a puppy to conduct.

I think my chance on that. No I give up my account though and I go to London comes that probably And just imagine one evening ménage could not come back and I was going to cut it and off while the program was ordered to me because it means the program included or not remember the program but into the debate on Saturday but I need to see if that pond he says paying his dues and something else I can't remember now. And not all of these you know what you imagine to be abroad and you know that to come back so I said.

You should give me an hour yes I mean it wasn't how it sounds and I remember perfect it was for me. 5:00. When I stopped at my earliest of which might be a nice way for me and 10 minutes after the manager came and said get them to stop because when you get before the content and we still have to meet you in the middle of the stage or the musician you know you could be more interesting to me that night and I connected to it and it really has been for me.

That success neither cut I was happy everybody left but we came back next week and should be from London. Me asking me if I wanted to conduct some people love that on them. And so they asked me to come. So I went to get one comes to point it out. There was a lot of it. But before I come back I want us to say that I think for these eight all 47 because for a lot of content and by the time I have you know the kind of the conduct of the

ordinary perhaps last time I was conducting a proud I mean London you know like the same brother. You must like Dublin because you believe it's good. Is has. I wish in the title is going to be simple. When I was 16 I was compacting and composition and I was very much interested by the I always wanted to reach the three main and really you know and then I could train a great beer

because you know nobody you know. But this I don't sing this I don't think so I you know we for these high place you know the big gains or morally that he savaged the people or so or so it was how they didn't step in that big town of course and if they if you know they need to you know when you even after a few weeks you start to believe fairy story and gloss kind anything you know and it doesn't brace me so mad that I decided to write this show to do again I would last possible to you before. Because they want us to sot off current completion tonight on one while strictly interested we've got Fatah

and what they used to do with the front a lot just making sure you know that evaluation and I did it but they were not clicking these photos and I see this symphony here and you just just give up the photo it's really not interesting. We can get nothing out of it and we wanted to do it because you know. Style it will be I know that. Yeah well that sort of thing that keeps us popular. To pick out something from it don't we. Mr. M. Do you mean in the literal use of themes from folk music or by using the flavor of Irish folk.

You know for instance in the symphony it DC and AC try that I will need it and I will never do it again I think because I know the danger. Now back to get powered off. One popular weaves apart I know that sometime we five or six times in complete that I can act at keeping that line for instance you know having a sawed off you know a very solemn and putting those knots exactly the same. But James incomplete There are stories of a man and trying to beat up another can I carry it. You know public speaking in the past and you know that they have thought that I'm using. That isn't human and trying to get back there and giving something back to financing one up in one of the part of the symphony

the big big huge stream and east V8 been constructed with five or six of their own fucked up now. I thought that was not you know I try or sell it to make it my own but he was looking like the fucked up left and that's what I wondered. And that answers my question. But I recently was making forty eight if my beggar's is correct and this was at about the time. Immediately before you began the regular association with the London Philharmonic apparently consumed most of your attention for a period of several years after which you went back to France where music directorship

back to conduct contact with having fallen out. When I saw when I was when I entered you were a student at the conservatory. I master nothing of that I think. And I think you know I haven't yet. And after that it was Israel right. I'm curious to know your reaction to the experience there in Israel you were there from 57 to 15 and a recent guest of Iran's and mine on this program said that he felt that his experience in Israel was unique because of the unparalleled enthusiasm of the audiences in Israel. Did you find that the climate for music there is exceptional.

Yes in one way yes. And you know it's interesting to know that you will have to repeat that and sometimes time the same to satisfy the audience in a smaller country after war. Remember we have to play six time seven time some time to time all three times and carries our name two times and sometimes it was some exact concept. I remember to have connected 12 times in two weeks you know sometimes they don't. But that's true. We should say that I actually cannot play modern music you know.

I try and I understood that that does get me back again. They're like the big romantic words and a suspicion they should not like it so much. Or the romantic and more down I tried. Well if I may pursue this just a bit further because if it was what you pointed out was what Mr. Giuliani said that this necessity to repeat the program in order to satisfy the the number of people who who wish to hear a given program. How did this affect you as a conductor I mean after how many

times particularly playing these big lush romantic works does it become difficult to get up there and do it again do you feel feel oh I wish we could do something. Yes for sure. You know we might make it a distinction. Yeah when I'm not traveling each evening we are playing in the front four and you did not matter if you were to be just same because each time between you you have to adjust and you just have to when you want and you know that you think you audience you add you don't for your routine.