Voices of Europe; Hermann Trittlewitz and Dr. Edith Pulewka

Voices of Europe Milton Mayer American author and broadcaster lecturer and professor in the Institute of Social Research from Frankfurt University continues the discussion of the problems of the Saar today inside our broken the central city of the star of that little piece of land which lie between France and Germany between the Rhine and Moselle rivers. In interviews first Dr. ated who left she has a son Lander born and brought up in the star of a star family and she is a dentist by profession. During the last world war along with all the other civilians in the city that are broken. Dr. Paul was twice evacuated by the German government. And while there was no actual street fighting infantry or artillery in the city of SAR broken the city itself was almost destroyed 85 percent of its buildings either partially or wholly knocked down by aerial bombardment. Here is Milton Mayer to interview Dr. ative doctor who left. You are sorry my anger. Yes but Americans don't know exactly what a sorry my ears oh to don't know

it. Who doesn't. You yourself also don't no doubt know it we were made to sign and there's dry ice in our history. Twice in my life. What do you mean by that you were made under SAR Landers twice even Baker I was sorry after the first of our nineteen hundred eighteen you're there. Our company was separated from Germany in CART sound and we are to us. With me said the where I started to learn that you were sorry my anorak had certify we have returned to Germany after the B-side and we will once again. Romance until 45. And 45.

We are once again separated from Germany and we are caught once again and the lender and what do you yourself think you are and I am german you're a German. You do not think of yourself as a Frenchman. No and do you know any sign of my hand or any of your fellow Tsar enders who regard themselves as Frenchmen. Now all Germans are not are Germans and yet to day. The SAR is under French control. Yes and your country has been separated from Germany. Yes and the French government wants you to be an independent country is that right.

Yes yes a separate country a separated couple independent company and they say that they only wish that disarmed would be drawn to miss firearms nomics things I see and to a way of saying that the North and we could live in things of kind of culture. The like in German manna. From you can keep your German culture yet but you must be joined to the French trans France economically economically and the country itself must be separated the government and the country must be separated from Germany. Yes you cannot be a part of just such say as the others such So say they are the allies they are right.

I would see that you must know that the people on the SAR is there are tired out because we have been since 1940 and never have had peace and we never had had dried to live because we always had to start a struggle about us and that I wasn't. There has always been struggle about the Southern Star. You say that the the French wish to make the Saar independent Yes but that seems to me to be very nice of the French to want to be independent. Don't you want to be independent. No. Weiner. You must know that our heart is in Germany and I bet there are much persons who are going to say nice that it would be good that there would be no phone between

Germany and firearms and CYA. Because they know that our economy you know immune to economic things must be united than that and far and Germany and the natural are sour and. Might not live. This this font Yes yes. And yet these people are the people who are supporting the movement of I think of to morrow night a united Europe. Yes. Are you in favor of a united Europe in favor of this movement to solve the problems of the Saar. If you were to me I mean a new United you up and our peoples would tell you the same. Rights. And even German or would have the possibility to live

or in this you up I rushed out of Tire and you up would you understand me yes would you be willing to give up your nationality as a German and just become a united European. I could see you. But I fear that it's that we are. You lost your last. Yes but it is only hope of the future to have you up and United you op out I noticed Dr. Paul left go when I just now asked you if you would be glad to give up your nationality and become a European instead of a German. It seemed to me that you hesitated a little you know what I mean by hasn't paid his date yes. Are you sure you would

be willing. No yeah I. Don't need to do a Karaite so me to give up my company. You must understand I am born into them and I love Germany and. To live this far and are the people of you all in peace. But if you say to me you can't find me. That's yeah difficult. That's asking a great deal. And also to ask that of a Frenchman. Yes it would be hard yes. And as far as the people you know are concerned you do know do you know any people in here and some are broken any Sarma Anders who really would like to belong to an independent country.

To a country I must be honest and I must say there are some people who wish to have peace peace peace and wish to work in peace and therefore they say a truce. It could equal equal to me where I rich condition I learn from. I wish to live too with my child to work and to build up once again which is destroyed. And they are for it to be honest I must say there are some people who say he's with me. If this is a price to have peace it may be that our comptroller may be independent country but are you one of these people. But I have no job and I must only think.

For myself. Yes and I almost. Oh man I think that I would be true to my camp and to my nation. If you had to go to war again in order to have the sorrow I am joined to Germany would you be willing to do that to keep the Psion from being separated from Germany would you be in favor of going to war I man know and will have to know war. I didn't understand you. I say if. You want. You want the sun and to be part of Germany again. Yes but if France will not allow our will not permit the SAARC to be part of Germany again would you be willing would you be in favor of going to war against France

to make the Sinai and a part of Germany. Again you and you are wrong on your one second attacked war third war no. Then you would rather have peace and belong to France is that right. If journey were taped the Peace Corps or by the spies. Yeah but if Germany could have peace and France would have come easily and the SAR could have peace but the SAR would have to belong to France this would be the price of peace not to fly arms but in the government. But you know independent independent you would be willing to have the star and remain independent but I would never let it happen then until to my dose I had you know it would be a barrel that I have. Introduce a very you have a very

heavy burden yet for you yes that your country did not belong to you or me. Yes. Thank you very much Dr. Poleski and now also in the city of SAR broken Milton Mayer interviews Herr Hermann triple wits who until June of 1950 to was one trot our county commissioner a high official in the independent government of the star. Here is Milton Mayer air travel that is. How did you happen to leave the government. I was dismissed by the SA Government for my political opinions about as a state is and the form of future. Of this our territory.

And then what. In what way was it possible to dismiss an official of a government. Official A law a bollard at the appointment and the dismissal off of fishel of the SAR government. Give the government the possibility to dismiss an official who doesn't agree with the political opinion of the government. This is along the edge is made in the nineteen seven and which is. Until the day it is applicable and as a sovereign government. But this law in 1937 was made at a time when the star was a part of Germany. Yes this alarm was made by the

Nazi government in Germany to give the government the opportunity to dismiss all of these officials or these high officials of the state who doesn't agree with. OPINION The political opinion of the government and this Nazi law of 1937 is still applicable in the Saar even now are the Saar is now an independent country. Yes it is applicable in society and there are many laws from as a time before the guard are number two which I plead cable in the Saab. How did you happen to be appointed county commissioner in the first place. Character out of it. It draws a very American military government which

appointed me as a burgomaster in. Part of this county. In what year it was in 1945. Sorry months three weeks before the end of the Bob and then you were appointed to the higher position of line trot. By whom. I was appointed to two county commission a in 1946 by the professoriate or SA government. And this government of the sire was an independent government under that at that time or was it under the Allies not yet it was under the allies. Now up here total of it. What on what grounds were you opposed to the government.

Of the. To the government policy in the SAR. My opinion about all of that is if you would show and the body of the body teak of the sun rise. That I lead my opinion is that the silence is until now and out of Germany and that the government. In a Song our boy can governance. In what ways are all real independent state of which the few were taught to do just a very will be decided decided by a treaty between the allies. On the one side and Germany on the other side. Vert some of our staters has been they

cognized not get by the allies except by the French government. Which the government supports the sour government and what political party you belong to. I belong to a party which Not yet is permitted by the government a party which belongs with or which has the same opinions about politics as the SPDC in Germany. And the rich ones that. The sun returns to Germany. Now you belong then to the SPDC the Social Democratic Party. Which is for whose

existence is forbidden in the SAR by the presence of our government and this party is associated with the SPDC party in Germany. It has a same opinions as Z as PD in Germany. But because all of the socialist parties in you hope have the same. Program of the human rights and the same Borglum of the economic politics in the counties in Europe. Why then is this party which is recognised and legal help and is certainly supported by the American authorities in Germany. Why is it forbidden in the SAR. And are there any other parties which are also forbidden to exist in the SAR.

Because this party is by my opinion forbidden by the silence are taught it is because is has one different opinion about the future and the belonging of society. To Germany. The CDU and is it SPDC are the two the two parties in the south of which one that is Assad is really just a as a part of Germany and the C D U which is also forbidden. Yes in the SAR is the party of Chancellor adn our of Germany. Yes and which party is supported by the American government or approved by the American government in Germany and along with the SPDC is forbidden in the

SAR. Because these are the two parties. If I understand you which oppose the presence SAR government on the issue of whether the SAR is to be an independent nation or is again to be a part of Germany as it used to be. Tell me your title of it is the SAR and independent nation today. My own opinion and the opinion of the SPDC and the CDU is that as Assad is not yet an independent country because there is no way cognition on the government by the Allies. And no they cognition by Germany. There is only the recognition of the French government who will reject it rather is very

interested in their independent status of the South and the south. There are every year to be delivered 12 million tonnes of coal. And. More millions tons of steel and the French probably take doesn't want that these 12 minions tons of corn and some millions tons of steel are part of German economy. Now is there any opposition any legally recognized opposition or any opposition press which is permitted by the SAR government. You have the opportunity to go on and on this tree needs and ask the population of the SoC what every one sayings about the future of the sun.

Every one whom you ask and everyone who doesn't feel that he will have difficulties if he speaks with you about the truths and the bar to his meaning will tell you about his vision is. Of the return of the society of Germany. And what would your guess be. As to the proportion of the people of the Saar. Who wish to have a sign or a turn to Germany on the one hand or who wish that it should be an independent country on the other. A politician. Has. The difficulties to be a bollard the person Tahj of the. The voices of the for an election.

But the police of the CDU and Izzy and speedy are sure that if they have time only two or three months before our elections there will be more than 50 and more than 60 percent of the population who will give these until now I'm not permitted parties there Weiss's providing of course that in such an election campaign your parties were permitted to exist and to publish and to hold meetings. Naturally. The only opposite is oppositional party which exists in the silence. It's a communist party the Communist Party which speaks every day and form

the united Germany. From the peace and the rod is in a position to speak to the population of society by newspapers not by meetings the Communist Party there and is legal and is permitted by the SAR government. But the Christian Democratic Union the CDU and the SPDC the Social Democratic Party are far better. Yes. It's true but the must understand. That the Communist Party is no danger for the government of the South. The inhabitants of the South don't like succumb units there are not more than three or four are five percent of the population who would give their voice for the Communist Party and

therefore it's not dangerous to have an oppositional party and opposition or use paper forms this side of the communists and Assad but the government knows that an opposition from a judge from German parties from the SPDC and CTU would be dangerous font this German thought this SA government in South Africa. But here print all of it. If I understand correctly the SAR government is one of the signers of the United Nations Declaration of Human Rights which permits freedom of speech and assembly and political activity does it not. He is the son of a government. One comment there SPDM and secede CDU demands the liberty and the possibility to hold meetings to give to

make news papers to speak to the population. If these parties bored the. First question what promise but promise as a solid government then they need to be good to defend the starter's of an independent sun and under the United Nations Declaration of Human Rights. Is it permitted to suppress opposition parties like yours it is not permitted to suppress parties Ligers e SPDC and the CDU because of disease parties are Democratic or parties and these parties want to speak to the population on their democratical on the liberal way and they want to express their opinion about the South.

On the other hand these two parties I suppose it can be said that they threaten the independence of the Saar they are a threat to the independence of the sarin that they wish to have the PSI return to Germany. Yes because they want. Sure turn the sod to Germany they are not permitted but they just such a government. Doesn't think on run a reason which is good enough for the opposition parties. This government say's that Saddam is an independent country which is they cognized by the French government and perhaps also by the Allies.

But we know that the side can't really isn't that organized by all the allies and therefore every sour inhabitant has the right to discuss the future of this country and their form. Are all of the rights all of the human rights by all of the United Nations not permitted in this hour. Thank you very much Eric revolver's Milton mair American author and lecturer broadcaster and professor in the Institute of Social Research from Frankfurt University has been interviewing two star Landers in this program of the series voices of Europe. Dr. ative Polevoy a dentist and Herr Harriman triple it's formally a high government official of the SoC the program you have just heard has been made possible under a grant from the fund for adult education an independent organization established by the Ford Foundation. These programs are

prepared and distributed by the National Association of educational broadcasters in the interests of better international understanding. This program was introduced by Norman McKee and this is the NEA E.B. tape network.