1965 National Association of Educational Broadcasters Convention; Federal Legislation and Educational Broadcasting

I see the entrance line is getting out a little bit and I suggest that in the interest of staying as close as we can schedule that we get this session underway. I find myself this morning in the position this position in relation to some first wild colleagues some of whom are more erstwhile than others and I never find myself in that position without feeling somewhat like a gentleman who was the sole survivor of the Johnstown flood. Perhaps some of you have heard about him because after the survival the condition of having endured and being a survivor of the Johnstown Flood occupied his entire life. He constantly repeated his story to new audiences and to old audiences and ad nauseum and ad infinitum. He told anybody who would listen what it was like to have endured and to be a survivor of the Johnstown flood.

Finally the man died and went to heaven upon being given initial clearance. Saint Peter informed him that he could now have his fondest wish granted. And he of course requested the opportunity to tell the people of him what it was like to have endured and be a survivor of the Johnstown flood. It was a somewhat unusual request but Peter made the necessary arrangements and all the vast multitude of Heaven was assembled. The celestial loudspeaker system was geared up until then and just before our friend began his address on the Johnstown Flood St. Peter tapped him on the shoulder and said I think I should warm you know what is in the audience. As we begin this session I have a feeling that there may be some

of you in the group. I'm sure there are some of you in the group who are the survivors not necessarily of flag but of previous efforts to understand federal programs of assistance and to achieve some measure of support under them. Not just a few housekeeping details first because we are a little bit crowded back here against the wall and I'm not going to ask our panel to sit through and enjoy each other's initial presentations. We rather make ourselves available up front but I am going to ask them to stand. OUT NOW so that when they come up we will recognize who they are. First of all we do stand up restore at the lowest of the. The administration of the aging and I like one of them the more completely later on. Here's Jack Wilson of The Bureau of research. Harry Phillips the Bureau of Elementary and Secondary Education and Santa's

helper in stand with us and plays assistant commissioner for legislation. The office of education. You will hear from each of them directly a little later on. Now the umbrella under which we're gathered this morning carries the title federal legislation and educational broadcasting. And that's a rather big umbrella. So before we start moving around under it it might be a good idea to describe our purposes a bit more particularly the motivation for this session can be stated roughly as a synthesis of these thoughts or ideas. First of all in the wake of the eighty ninth Congress as well as of previous Congresses there are a number of federal programs of assistance through which funds are available to eligible applicants in support of categorical projects in various areas of health education and welfare in the field of education particularly. There are more funds available now and in greater amounts than ever before in our history.

The second idea is that there are a number of ways or certainly ought to be a number of ways in which radio or television can be utilized at the local and regional level to help achieve the objectives of such projects. In the case of some legislative programs to be sure the possible involvement of radio or television is at best very remote. In other cases however radio and television are specifically mentioned as eligible activities and so the national convention of this nature which combines the special but varied interests of education and broadcasting should provide the opportunity to allow those ideas to converge. And that's why we're here and that's about the whole reason that we're here to discuss the nature and purposes of certain legislative programs and to explore with you some of the ways in which educational broadcasting.

Might play a useful role in fulfilling the purposes of the legislation and thereby gain some measure of financial support. At a time such as this so soon after the passage of much legislation there's bound to be some confusion some misunderstanding and if we achieve nothing else this morning we can hope that our discussion will at least help to clear the air of misconceptions and to provide enough guidance to give you a sense of direction in your future planning. Another comment I want to make before we get down to nuts and bolts deals with the selectivity of this session as indicated by the topics and the programs which our speakers represent in health education and welfare legislation. Alone there are many programs of assistance in which radio or television components might or might not be supported. We have at the time this morning to review all

the various possibilities. So we've limited our field of focus to include examples of legislative authorisations which are relatively recent and under which support for radio or television components is at least possible because they are at least eligible activities. And just one more point by way of boundaries for the meeting. We want to make time available after the presentations at which you can ask questions and perhaps get some answers. For that reason we will not attempt to outline each piece of legislation in full detail nor to explore in depth all of their provisions nor do we intend to design a provable broadcast project from the podium. Brother we have assembled a group of speakers who are familiar with the programs of assistance which they represent. We've asked them in seven to 10 minutes each to discuss the purposes of these programs to define who or what is an eligible applicant

to describe to the extent that they can. Such procedural matters as how an application is filed who approves it who administers programs and if possible to comment on the ways in which educational radio or television agencies may be able to participate in programs which fulfill the legislative intent to get things underway I'm going to call on the distaff side of our panel partly on the presumption that ladies should be first and partly because she's going to talk about a program that does not originate in education legislation. She's Miss Dorothy who was deputy chief of The Information Division of the Administration on Aging and her message for us this morning concerns the Older Americans Act of 1965. This is the probably the only chance I'll ever have to begin a program by saying

that aging is so very young so I will take that chance. The Older Americans Act was passed by the Congress on the 9th of July. It was signed into law by President Johnson on the 14th and then we existed and we were authorized but we didn't have the money. So we waited for the supplemental appropriation act and that came through and we had some money not very much not nearly as much as our wealthier brothers of the Office of Education but we had. Then we waited for a commissioner to be appointed. Confirmation of the nomination came that we waited for confirmation and it looked as though it was about to come several times and then it looked the Pauling lay as though it were going to come at all as Congress began to restart adjourn and literally a cliffhanger. The confirmation for Commissioner B chill came through in the last hour of the last day of the session. Then we waited for the swearing in ceremonies

and this took place yesterday at 3 o'clock so you see we couldn't be much newer or much younger and a lot of our rules and regulations of course were not really drafted yet you're coming to us in the formula formative stage. Of course a lot has been going on in preparation before the predecessor agency was the office of aging which is within the Welfare Administration of the department. It had no grant funds at all. The graph ons are actually the newest part of the Administration on Aging But in addition to the grant programs we are charged with serving as a federal focal point and central clearing house of information on quote all matters of concern to older Americans. And this is a pretty broad mandate. This text is across the lines of the education recreation health income

moment. The use of leisure time pre retirement preparation and really tremendous story because all of these things are so closely related. Sometimes tragically for older people or a great many contradictions. And later in life with life expectancy the line rises and the retirement age coming down there's apt to be a real politian unless there is some working out and adjustment some substitution for paid employment with part time activities and volunteer services and continuing opportunity for the use of talents and skills and experience as well as care for the frail elderly. So we have a large chore before we became the Administration on Aging. We tried to do much the same sort of overall. Provision of information. We

had to do it then by consultation the provision of information on issuance of publications and scrounging and them. We think we'll still have to do a lot of this in fact we hope that we can obtain a great deal of help from radio and television because we have a good story to tell and not just because we might possibly have some brand stars. We'd be very happy to use grant monies in this case but we do think we have materials for broadcast and we have tremendous community interest and we have been receiving. More requests than we've been able to handle for informational material to educational television and broadcast facilities when they would like to produce and develop their own programs. Now specifically for the act and the grants programs there are four titles in the Older Americans Act

which Martin have some application to broadcast facilities throughout the act. The necessity for dissemination of information on the situation of older people on the real picture of older people. Hateful words but a revision of the image of what it means to be old. That older Americans are not all one long group all alike but a great diversity of people and we are also concerned not only with the 18 million who are now 65 and older but with the 17 million between 55 and 65 who must be preparing for retirement period and for the 45 to 55 years old who face in the labor market at least the label of being old already. So Title 3. Provides for a lot means to be made into the 50

states every state gets the men among 1 percent of the appropriation which is only 5 million dollars this year. Once they know they get an additional percentage based on the relationship of their population at age 65 and over to the total national population. So you will get quite a ready state and lots these state allotments will be made by the administration of aging to a designated state agency. The governor must designate a single state agency to handle this program and they must submit a state. Why. May I say it's a more flexible state plan than many one one beauty of this act and one difficulty of this act is it is very flexible. And almost all things are possible. I'm not quite sure of the they can all be funded but there are ways to do this.

Well the states then take this federal allotment and the state agency administers this. Your resource in this case would either be to contact these designated state agencies or to work with some local public or nonprofit private organization agency institution in your own originating community to develop a project because the study passes on grants to public agencies nonprofit private agencies administration organizations and institutions for individual projects. I'm not being very confusing about this when we get to questions I'll try to be a little bit more specific. Today only one state plan is in 45 of the states at last count had designated a state

agency that handled the program and most of the state lands are being drafted. I can tell you afterwards if you want in any of the cases where there been designees what the agency is under Title 4 of the Act grants program will be administered from Washington for demonstration and research programs in the very broad field of aging and under Title 5. When funds are available for training programs training of personnel working with or preparing to work with and for older people. There is a little provision which we look hopefully into in the future in Title Six under our own administrative forms. But at the moment these funds are so small

that I doubt that in this coming fiscal year anything will be available. But under this charge we ourselves and the administration will be able to repair the bell publish the 7 8 educational materials. This is again pretty broad and we think that educational television and radio should come in to us with programmes in the future. We might do want. Also both use of broadcasting particularly in television that has been mentioned is in the right more as a visual more of a successful project. This could be very useful. Oh we could go from one community to another perhaps to show what had happened in poor nation of services in one city and which could be adapted and adopted elsewhere.

So we are really wide open to suggestions under all of the titles except the draining grand section individuals may also apply for rent phones and in addition to actual grants where you are do your response for contract also and I think that's about oh no. Jeff thank you. Thank you very much god another ground rule of this session which I neglected to mention earlier is that we will reserve the question period until all of our participants have had the opportunity to make their presentations we can take a few moments now that allow the late arrivals to be seated and lots of seats up here. Why don't you get comfortable. If there are any older Americans among us the question is let's wait until a little later to put our questions to Mr. Morris. While

we're stating a late comers let me also suggest. That you drop your questions down on slips of paper that we've got so that we may cope with them in better shape later. We will not refuse questions from the floor we like the give and take a discussion. But there are at least two advantages to writing them down one is that they can come up here and we can make a kind of selection of questions which resemble each other. The other is some advantage to us particularly for those of us who will be working in one way or another with legislative programs for which the regulations haven't been yet fully developed we can take these questions back with us for what utility they may have in the staff work that's going on at the present time. Now if there are any among you who neglected to bring something suitable to write on. There's a lovely blonde who will pass among you from time to time. Mrs. Wallace and she will have cards suitable for that purpose.

The Elementary and Secondary Education Act of 1965 is our next focus of attention. I'm sure many of you are already more or less acquainted with its provisions and realize that in its five titles there are many complexities. It may even be presumptuous to try to cope with it in the 10 minute period. However certain provisions of the Act are of considerable interest to educational broadcasters and shouldn't be overlooked in a session such as this. I'm not entirely sure about this title Harry and you correct me if I'm wrong but as director of the program advisory branch of the division of plans and centers in the bureau of elementary and secondary education in the Office of Education Harry Phillips has worked as closely as any other individual with the development of administrative procedures procedures dealing with title trade which provides Of course for supplementary centers and services. So we've asked Terry this morning to concentrate on the provisions of Title 3. With such reference to other titles as you may consider appropriate.

Everything. Thank you Ray. I'm perfectly aware of the time limitations and certainly the time consciousness that prevails amongst this audience therefore I shall I shall desperately attempt to curtail my remarks to 10 minutes you call time on me if you will place at the beginning I would like to. To illustrate the kind of feeling and enthusiasm that is prevalent among the teachers and educators in general across this nation. At the beginning of this new school term in view of the fact that certain cognizance has been felt from Washington that the national government is interested as they have never been interested before in furthering and advancing education. To illustrate the situation may I take just one half of a minute to tell a little story. My teacher over in the Appalachian area of the nation fourth grade social studies.

It was observed and overheard relating to her youngsters in that class all of the virtues that are evident from the beginning of the great man as as she was illustrating from the presidents. And she was going along says now take Abraham Lincoln for example who came from a very humble beginning a log cabin. And then there was President Eisenhower who came from the. He was born in the white square frame farmhouse in the Midwest and then there was President Johnson. He was born in a manger. In the next 10 minutes in the next 10 minutes. I shall attempt to outline to you some of the major activities in which educational television broadcasters one engage themselves to bring about the realisation of the objectives intended in the single greatest national legislative act

ever passed to assist elementary and secondary schools namely this act. The Elementary and Secondary Education Act of 1965. Public Law. Eighty nine days. In some parts of this act you will have a direct participating an active role in either part your activities may be of a somewhat secondary nature. However I am sure your interest here this morning is in hearing some of the possibilities that we forsee in the various parts of this act for the participation of educational television and radio broadcasters Title 1 of this legislation for example authorizes more than 1 billion dollars annually for providing financial assistance to local educational agencies for special educational programs in areas having high concentration of children of low income families. The possibilities that exist in this title seem rather obvious for you. For example

you're already aware I'm sure of the activities of educational research which shows how well-developed series of television programs can be used in the preschool education of culturally deprived children. Another project has demonstrated how the principles of programmed instruction might be applied to the design of a film or television instructional sequences and using these as examples. I am sure that year and magination in your own ingenuity in your own creative ability can foresee many opportunities of bringing your resources to bear on the objectives of Title 1 eligible applicant. Of course for Title 1 funds is a local public educational agency. They submit the application to the State Department of Education and there it is evaluated and funded according to the rules and regulations of eligibility that are established for the title. The authority for are the types of services and programs that can be funded in

Title One is extremely broad. It is somewhat limited or narrow though for the target audience. That is to say we have here educational deprivation and economic deprivation with which to justify the request for funds for Title 1 programs. Title 2 of this Act authorizes 100 million dollars a year for the purchase of school library resources textbooks and other instructional materials the broadest possible interpretation has been given to the definition of the term school library resources and other instructional materials. For example televisions tapes kinescopes films film strips and recordings of all types have been included as eligible items for acquisition by local educational agencies under this program. I am sure that if your group gives careful and considerate attention to the production and design of high quality television programming Title 2 of this act will

be involved in the purchase of tapes and other types of reproductions of such programs. Title 3 of the Elementary and Secondary Education Act authorizes one hundred million dollars a year for this a part of supplementary educational centers and services. This is the title in which many of you will have the opportunity to become immediately and directly involved and probably represents the title which will most directly and indirectly relate to centrally to your interest in this title it is highly unlikely that requests for equipment to establish or expand their educational television broadcasting station would be would be approved particularly if assistance to the eligible applicants remains available under the provisions of Public Law 8 7 4 4 7. This is the educational facilities Act which Ray will speak to you about I'm sure.

Thus proposals under Title 3 to acquire television antenna towers and transmitters and for TV production equipment such as cameras film chains switchers video tape recorders and so far are to be used in a broadcasting station normally will not be approved except where the case is made very strongly that a desperate need exist and that all other possibilities for funding have been exhausted. This this title among other things authorizes a national advisory committee to serve the U.S. Commission or to assist in the development of policy and in looking at individual proposals. It is also the consensus of this advisory committee that proposals particularly beginning early in the program that are extremely heavily hardware oriented should have very low priority. The major emphasis should be spent on planning. It should be spent on human

resources bringing about as much of a change in American education as we possibly can. A proposal under Title 3 to establish a 20 500 mega cycle. In your terminology it's 2.5 Jigga cycles is that right. Might be approved on an exceptional basis where the use of such a facility is likely to demonstrate genuinely innovative application of television fix service to the provision of supplementary activities and services where costs are commensurate with their range in the scope of a proposed project. Therefore it remains that the most significant input that educational television may have in the Title 3 programme is to assist in the development of new exemplary and imaginative ways of using educational television and the programmes there are to assess the educational community and realising more benefit from

this very valuable instructional resource. The local educational agency in submitting an application under this title must exhibit evidence to us that they have been involved in their community in a broad cross-section of all the educational and cultural resources available to them in the planning and in the administration and the anticipated administration and in the anticipated operation of the project. I am sure that many of you have perhaps already been tapped as a. Cultural and educate and or educational resource to assist local educational agencies in planning their projects under this title I'm sure that in the future many more of you are also going to be tapped on this idea. There are far I hope that when your local superintendent approaches you on assisting him in the development and providing some consultation for the development of a Title 3 proposal that this will totally and will not be totally foreign to you. Title 4 of the Elementary and Secondary

Education Act is a broadening and an extension of the provisions of a program that we've had in the office for some length of time the Cooperative Research Program. Now the authority here is has been broadened considerably. The eligible applicants has the range of eligible applicants has been extended. The possibilities of the kinds of things that can be supported under the Act have been extended. There is a very significant bit of attention given to the dissemination of information related to the findings of educational research through the educational regional research laboratories and so forth. So I'm sure that educational television and radio broadcasters will have access. A considerable role to play in meeting the objectives and the intent of this title as time goes on. Title 5 of the Elementary and Secondary Education Act authorizes twenty five million dollars a year for strengthening

their leadership and the educational consultation and related roles of state educational agencies the association here directly perhaps is a minimal one. However I'm sure that many of you are quite interested in the kinds of leadership and the kinds of services that state departments of education are providing the schools throughout their state in the area of development and using your educational media in the instructional process. And I am sure that in the future we will see some possibilities of Title 5 assisting state educational agencies to better meet the need to provide some leadership and some direction and some orientation to their educational communities. Regarding the use of Educational Television Radio and all of the other media of communication.

So this is a very. Capsulized thumbnail sketch of the Elementary and Secondary Education Act of 1965 and Mr. Stanley pointed out to you earlier it has many complex cities. I'm sure that my conlang got Dr. hü brand here who played a very significant role of course in the passage of this legislation has never quite been subjected to such a simplified version of the Elementary and Secondary Education that. However I think throughout this act the intent is clear. We are here to try to assess states and local agencies in raising the sides of American education in improving it where the need is. In general the greatest I'm sure you as a professional group of educational and radio broadcasters will find a great many opportunities to facilitate the education of communities across this country in moving ahead to meet the objectives of this legislation. Thank you very much.

Thank you. Thank you Harry very comprehensive 10 minutes. The education legislation most recently enacted by Congress of course is the Higher Education Act of 1965. Several titles of this bill had little or no direct bearing on the purposes of this meeting. However educators who are concerned with radio or television as instruments of education will want to give particular attention to the provisions of Title 1 and Title 6 of this bill not because of the sand has the bill been signed yet. That's how recent it is it still hasn't really been signed. So you're must consider that all our remarks. About it this morning are provisional and conditional upon that signature. And because of that and the recency of the action of the legislation of course it hasn't been

possible to determine administrative and procedural details with anything like final precision that's what my script says. Change it to read initial position test groups in the office of education are now at work on that particular chore and for that reason we can consider the Higher Education Act. This morning only in the most highly generalized of terms with the suggestion that you watch for the implementing the materials when they are made available and study them carefully. As assistant commissioner for legislation in the office of education and as Harry has suggested Sam Halperin is closely involved with all education legislation. He's also a communicator of considerable competence and lucidity it's always a pleasure to work with him and we've asked Sam to outline for us Title One of the Higher Education Act. I'm sure we can find a better exponents and. Thank you Ray we've recommended that the president use his powers of pocket veto

on the average cation act on the grounds you had enough to do and so did Harry. But I don't think he's going to make it stop. As of about 9:30 our time which is only 7:30 Austin time the film hadn't hadn't been signed. I am reminded by your story of Noah's Ark of another biblical theme. And I just like to tell you about it because it gives you some flavor of the environment which we're operating. It seems three professionals we're debating which was the world's oldest profession and there was a physician an engineer a legislative specialist and physician said you know we were first when God created Eve out of the rib of Adam that was a surgical operation the physicians were first the engineers that all know long before that there was a massive engineering operation when the good Lord created order in the universe out of chaos. That was a massive engineering operation but then my people allege that especially said Who do you think

created the chaos. We're all kind of intellectually drains and we have a lot of trouble ourselves keeping track of Title 1 title 3 which Act which came first the amendment to this one and that one. And I just don't think I can do very much in a few minutes to try to do anything other than confuse you really about all of these new acts. I noticed the commissioner of education the other day in speaking with some visiting firemen just got all confused himself he was talking about Title 3 in the elementary act and then he switched over Title 3 in the Higher Education Act and as everybody was in pandemonium. So give us some some time to get used to our own responsibilities. I thought perhaps the best thing to do is to bring some outlines of the Higher Education Act of 1965 and I think there's a pile back in that corner and maybe there are enough to go around if not I'm sure Ray Stanley or my office will make additional outlines available to you. The Higher Education Act of 1965 Title One is called community service

and continuing education programs community service and continuing education programs. The debate on both sides of the hill and particularly in the conference committee between the House and Senate was so involved in the semantics got so tricky that we practically lost not only the title but the whole bill because on the question of what what is a community service and what is continuing education the conferees have many many different views. Thank you. For example I just jumping right in the middle here. We had intended that the program get an urban thrust since 70 percent of the people united states now live in urban areas. The Senate felt that nobody should be excluded from the services of this title. And so they had it in the rural areas as well. And then there was some controversy on the part of congressmen who said oh OK but the areas that are really getting shortchanged are the suburban

areas and particularly the non farm rural areas the small coal mining towns. So the Congress in its infinite wisdom brought forth a bill designed for urban suburban rural and rural non farm areas. We have excluded life beneath the seas and outer stuff in outer space. Then they got into a question of what's continuing education and continuing education is anything that a college says is continuing education that's the way that one turned out. And then they got into the question of Shall it be for credit or shall it not be for credit. And they said when it's a course it must be a college level but not necessarily for credit. And then do you have to be a high school graduate in order to get into these things and they say if it's a formal course you should be a college level but you don't have to be a high school graduate. And then they got into the question of for

example what happens with the TV. And they came up with this doozy and Mr. Pollin Mr. Morse collaborating in the year. I don't know why you find that amusing these gentlemen these gentlemen are the ones who pass these bills and give tremendous personal sacrifice to get these bills through and I mean that seriously. I came up with this kind of statement identical statement on both sides of the hill. The use of the phrase cost course offerings is not meant to preclude the use of Title 1 funds for workshops meetings or short term institutes held in conjunction with an institution's continuing education program nor is it designed to prohibit funding of an institution's educational television offering unquote. And we interpret this to mean that when you use a TV you can do anything really and it doesn't necessarily have to be of college level. It ought to be serious not frivolous. It ought to be related to the problems of our society and it ought to be

something that university feel that they can do without prostituting themselves to the almighty dollar. It ought to be something that is legitimate but that the limits here are very great much as they are in Harry Philips Title 3 or in the new Administration on Aging programs. This all began when the president said at a speech in Irvine California last year quote just as our colleges and universities change the future of our farms a century ago so they can help change the future of our cities. I forsee the day when an urban Extension Service operated by universities across the country will do for urban America what the Agricultural Extension Service has done for rural America. Recognizing that we've got tremendous problems of poverty of residential blight of polluted air and water of inadequate mass transportation health services housing services human relations overburdened governmental services and so on. The president and the administration sent up to the Congress a bill designed

to turn the attention to face the resources the talents of the Universities and Colleges of the country both public and private colleges not just land grant colleges to go to these problems to these problem solving our needs. We sent up in our bill a laundry list of suggested items. Guidance and community plan economic and job market studies programs for the disadvantaged. Research and Development in educational problems training various kinds of personnel. The Congress didn't quite like that so they knocked the the laundry list out of the bill and the laundry list did include educational radio and television. Then they took the same laundry list and expanded it about three fold and put it into the reports. The point being that you can do all of these things plus anything else that seems to be important to a state and to its State's leadership in solving the problems of that particular society. You can have pilot projects seminars conferences TV programmes task forces actual course offerings you name it. In effect

what they're saying here is that two the two traditional functions of the university namely research and teaching. We should now institutionalize and help with some money a third function that community service and problem solving of course our best universities have been doing this for a long time. Now the federal government says here is some help to do it on a broader scale. Twenty five million dollars is authorized for the first year 15 million dollars for the second year fifty million dollars authorized for the third year the federal share is 75 percent of the cost of a state plan in the first and second year and 50 percent of the cost in the third year. This will then if you just look at the mathematics result in a rather tremendous increase in activities in this particular area. The Congress went home and at the eleventh hour as Mr. Lewis indicated they voted a Supplemental Appropriations Act which has been signed

into law so we've got the money with no authorization. As of this time I did vote 10 million dollars for this title 1. We hope that they'll be additional funds in January. Ten million dollars to get things going the way the act works. Every state sets up an agency a commission they can use an existing agency or commission if they so desire they can use their higher education facilities commission. They can use say a governor's commission on the problems of the state. They can designate let's say the University of Minnesota if they so desired to be the agency. But it has to be an agency which is broadly representative of the resources and talents in that state to deal with community problems and university and continuing extension problems. If it's a public institution for example which is designated then there would be an advisory committee consisting of private institutions that have competence in this area. They would join and help draw up a state plan. Our money then goes only to the state

on the basis of an approved state plan and a TV educational radio can participate in the plan indeed we hope will participate in the plan. But this has to be worked out at the state level. You have to show what you want to do what you can do how your resources are related to the particular problems of that society of that state and then you come forth and you get into that state plan and then we turn over the money to you. Ray I think I'm going to call it quits right there and wait for question. Thank you Sam and I'm sure there will be many questions for you. Now another section of interest to television minded educators but not necessarily broadcasters is contained in Title 6 of the Higher Education Act and it falls to my lot to discuss that section this morning. While I'm doing so Wendy. This might be a good opportunity just to wander up and down the aisles to see if there are any

questions that have been written out. Gather them and just dump them on the table here while I try to go through very briefly the provisions which are of direct concern to some of you in Title Six of the Higher Education Act the purpose of Title 6 is to improve the quality of classroom instruction in selected subject areas in institutions of higher education. This is a closed circuit. It's important I think to mention it in the context of this meeting even though it isn't directly related to broadcasting. There are two provisions in this title which are directly related to television and education and to which I would direct the earnest attention of persons at this meeting. These are the provisions which authorize federal funds to institutions of higher education for TV equipment to be used for closed circuit direct instruction and the provision which authorizes funds and support of media workshops and institutes in higher educational

institutions. Title 6 will also provide federal assistance for the acquisition of laboratory and other special equipment including equipment materials for audio visual centers funds are also available or will be to help defray costs of administration of state plans. For our purposes this morning and to stay within the general framework of communications I won't dwell in any detail on those two provisions. And I'm going to try to skip through this in order to save a little time just to hit the highlights the principal features of those parts of Title 6 which have a direct bearing on TV construction. First of all television equipment for closed circuit direct instruction section 6 0 1 C authorizes funds to enable the commissioner to make grants to institutions of higher education for the acquisition of television equipment and for minor remodeling. The authorisation is for two and a half million for the fiscal year

1066 which ends next June 30th. Ten million dollars for each of the next two fiscal years and such sums for the final two years as Congress may authorize. It should be pointed out that although two and a half million is authorized for fiscal 66 only one and a half million has been appropriated until next June 30 of what are eligible projects. Those which proposed the acquisition of TV equipment for closed circuit direct instruction in science mathematics foreign languages history geography government English other humanities the arts our education at the undergraduate level. The funds appropriated for each year will be allotted among the states according to a formula which is set forth in section 6 0 2. I won't attempt to

explain the intricacies of that formula except to note that the commissioner will allot one half the funds appropriated on the basis of the number of students enrolled in institutions of higher education in the state and the remaining one half. In accordance with a formula which takes into account the college enrollment of each States and its relative per capita income. The section also contains provision for a one year carry over of funds as well as for the usual reluctant possibilities we may have a chance to get around to that question in the next year. As you can readily see any time you've got just one and a half million appropriated or even the 10 million according to a formula for allotment there's going to be a wide spread in the amounts of money which may be available for this purpose. In any given state or among the states I should say it's important also to note that this is also a state blame program section 6 0 3

provides that any state desiring to participate shall designate for that purpose an existing state agency which is broadly representative of the public and of institutions of higher education in the state and if no such agency or commission exists the state shall establish one. The state agency or commission will be responsible for submitting to the commissioner of education a state plan for participation in this plan must provide that it should be administered by the state commission and so far as TV equipment is concerned. Now set forth objective standards and methods for determining relative priorities of eligible projects. For the acquisition of TV equipment and necessary instructional materials for use in TV instruction. Eligible equipment. By the way would include fixed service instruction that is at two point five digit cycles but not standard broadcast transmission apparatus.

In addition under the state plan the state commission must assign priorities to the legible projects submitted by institutions of higher education and must recommend eligible projects in the order of such priorities must determine the federal share of the project and start and sort of either the commission or the federal share of the project as provided in section 6 so floor B shall not exceed 50 percent of the proposed projects. Cept that a state commission may increase such error to not exceed 80 percent of such cost. In the case of any institution proving insufficient resources to participate in the program under this part and the inability to acquire such resources there is also a maintenance of effort provision in this section and institution of higher education which up things a grant Mr Creek must agree to expand for those approved purposes an amount at least equal to the amount expended the previous year for the same purposes. Now these are only the highlights or the principal features of that portion of Title 6 a part

a which relates to TV equipment for closed circuit direct instruction. It's a new federal program like I think I can honestly say at this point no final determinations have been made even with respect it was going to administer it so detailed information and precise instructions will have to wait until these things are ready. Now there is another provision of Title 6 which is of interest. Again not so much to broadcasters per se as to educators generally. This is Part B of Title 6 which is titled faculty development programs section 6 21 authorizes appropriations of $5 $5 5 million dollars per year. Under the apportionment formula that's not so funny. I think I think the Virgin Islands for example for fiscal 66 are a lot of thirty two dollars and a tenth of the $64 question.

Part D authorizes five million dollars for fiscal years 66 67 and 68 and such sums as Congress may authorize for the final two fiscal years of the program for workshops and institutes which are necessary to the development of faculty and media specialists in use of educational media equipment let me state it in the language of the act is a very short section. The funds are authorized to enable the commissioner to arrange through grants or contracts with institutions of higher education. For the operation by them of short term workshops or short term or regular session institutes for individuals who fit into one of these two categories one who are engaged in or preparing to engage in use of educational media equipment in teaching in institutions of higher education or two who are or who are preparing to be in institutions of higher

education specialise in educational media or librarians or other specialist using such media. And now that I've explained that let me add that there will be no funds appropriated in fiscal 66 That is until next June 30th for this particular program. Looking at it as broadly as possible that gives you a little time to plan for next year. This is a brief review which doesn't answer questions such as to whom do we apply how many copies must be five who approves when what regulations and guidelines be available. The staff work is going on at this time to the extent that we are able however we try to answer questions you might have a little later on. Now Jack Wilson is the last among our speakers but by no means the least and the legislative program which is his topic is certainly appropriate in the context of this meeting. Because it is among the foremost of those programs of federal assistance which are not

specifically designed to assist educational broadcasting but under which nevertheless projects can be and have been supported which have much present and future significance for educational broadcasting as a labor economist in the US Bureau of research. Jack has been closely associated with the administration of the Vocational Education Act of 1963 particularly with Section 4 s.. And here's Jack Wilson. I would like to move immediately into the topic of send me this morning the Vocational Education Act of 1963 and very briefly sketch for you a few other purposes in the scope of the act and then perhaps spend a little time on how this act applies to you and what it can mean for you in terms

of some research money. The Vocational Education Act is part of the public low eighty eight dash to 10 and in the declaration of the purpose of the act they very succinctly state board what its purpose and intent is and I'd like to read this to you. It is the purpose of this part to authorize federal grants to states to assist Lam to maintain extend and improve existing programs of vocational education to develop new programs of occasional education and to provide part time employment for you who need the earnings from second client to continue their vocational training on a full time basis. So that the persons of all ages and all communities of the state both in high schools those who have completed are discontinued their formal education and are preparing to enter the labor market. Those who have already entered the labor market will need to

upgrade their skills or learn new ones and those with special educational handicaps will have ready access to vocational training retraining which is of high quality which is realistic in the light of actual or anticipated opportunities for gainful employment. And which is suited to their needs interest and ability to benefit from such training. That's a long sentence but it nevertheless gets it pretty much the heart of what the Vocational Education Act is all about. Now to carry out this declaration of purpose. Congress has seen fit to appropriate substantial sums of money far beyond what were available in preceding years under two other acts. It's not using George Barton Act for example for the year ending June 30th nine hundred sixty six one hundred seventy seven million pounds of hundred thousand dollars will be unveiled. It will be made available for the act and far the year ending June 30th 1967 and each

year thereafter two hundred twenty five million dollars are going to be made available to the states to carry out this particular mandate. Under the Vocational Education Act these funds are allotted to the states on the basis of their population and their per capita income. And the states in turn have to submit to the commissioner of education a plan and this plan is drawn up by the state board of the occasional education for most states. And once estate plan has been submitted to the commissioner and has been approved land funds are made available by the states to carry out their vocational education program. So to summarize these funds made available to the states can be used for six different applications. One would be far the vocational education for persons attending high schools. The second would be a

vocational education for persons who have completed or left has school and who are available for full time study in preparing to enter the labor market. If third would be. Vocational education for purposes who have already entered the four persons they have already entered the labor market and who need training or retraining to achieve arre or advancement in their employment. A fourth up location would be to spend the funds some occasional education for persons who have academic socio economic or other handicaps set prevent them from succeeding in the regular vocational education programs. And a filthy application of the funds at the state level would be for the construction of area vocational education school facilities and a six would be France Larry. Services. And this is one area that I think educational television people could very well move into because these funds

that are earmarked for ancillary services which would be 3 percent of the state allocation can be used for the development of such things as instructional materials and so that if you are not working with your state director of occasional education this is a person who you might want to identify with then find out how your activities can fit into this particular segment. Now 10 percent of the funds that are allocated under the Vocational Education Act are set aside for use by the commissioner of education. So this means that part of the year ending the June 30th 1965 the commissioner had eleven point eight million dollars available for research purposes for research and training for experimental developmental and pilot programs. And then for the year ending June 30th 1966 the year that budget year that we're in now.

Seventeen point seven pounds million dollars will be available. And then for the year ending June 30th 1967 and each year thereafter. Twenty two point five million dollars will be made available to the commissioner of for the funding of research which will focus upon some of the real dire needs in the whole field of vocational education. Now to administer this research effort the as of as of June July 1 there was set up in the office of education a bureau of research and within the sphere of research there is a division of adult and vocational research which is in turn has several branches. The employment opportunities branch the human resources branch and the third branch which is concerned with crippling them and teacher training. Cetera. And so.

If you think that you would be interested in coming forth with some fairly imaginative research something that scent of it is something that has some generalizability beyond your own immediate community. We certainly would welcome perhaps a draft proposal that you might have in mind. Ari if you think that you would like to get some literature here which would give you the conditions and the procedures sparse and getting a proposal. You can certainly direct your inquiry to me and I'll see that you not only get the conditions and procedures but a copy of the act in some other supplementary information that will give you some guidelines on the kinds of research that we would be interested in funding. In the year ending June 30th we have funded about that over six projects involving educational television and I'd like to read these to you. To give you some idea of the kinds of projects that we have felt had some degree of merit.

One project that I have been the court nater of is called Project notify the needed occupational television instruction for you. This was a project that has been carried out and sent Bernardino Valley College which they have made a series of seven television 30 minute shows to show how this particular medium can be used as a valuable tool for disseminating occupational information to not only high school youth but junior college youth. This was a very modest budget involving only forty six thousand eight hundred sixty dollars. Another project that we have underway is a multimedia approach to communicating occupational information to non-college you which is with the University of Pittsburgh it's a hundred twenty four thousand three hundred twenty dollar project. Another one is is being carried on out in San Francisco by the Bay Area Educational Television Association KQED.

It's a $31000 project involving preparation for progress to the future. It would be the training of. The people of Latin American descent they do not speak English. To teach them how to speak English. A Another one here is the development of training lessons for pre service and initial in-service vocational teacher education recorded and presented through videotape and television with seminar discussion. This is $24000 $970 project with the State Department of Education Division of vocational education. St. Paul Minnesota. This gives you some idea of the tens of projects that we have funded and would perhaps indicate the kinds of projects that we would be interested in entertaining in the future. And so perhaps in the question and answer period I'd be happy to explore these particular projects in more detail

or give some verbal comments on the kinds of projects that we would like to see coming in. Thank you Jack. At least Jack's final remarks tend to support the conclusion that there's gold in them there are bills. Built Harley's trip up here was to request me to make the announcement which will be of great interest and sure to all of you. Confirmation has been received that Vice President Humphrey will appear in the park room at 3:15 this afternoon to greet the NEA the convention delegates I'm sure you'll all want to be there. Well this concludes our panel presentation and in just a few minutes we'll give you the opportunity to ask questions. It would be pointless for me to try to summarize the contents of the programs you just talked about. But in wrapping up this half of the session I'd like to suggest that

several ideas seem to emerge from these discussions which it might be well to know in a general way. First of all by and large programs of federal assistance are categorical. They're designed to provide assistance in leading categories of educational needs. It would follow that the broadcasting components of supportable projects must be entirely related to these categories of need. Secondly only with respect to equipment and educational broadcasters be direct applicants where most of the supporting funds are to be found. Educational broadcasters are not themselves applicant's but they may be participating agencies and or agencies which subcontract to provide services or activities in approving projects. It follows then that to explore the possibility of support under a federal program of assistance for

educational broadcasting it will be necessary for the educational broadcaster to get active on his home ground in several ways. First of all he obviously ought to become as familiar as possible with the programmes of federal assistance. And if this suggests that here and there we need to develop specialists on federal aid who are closer to you than say the State Department of Education or the State Building Commission it might be well to consider such personal development. Secondly it will be advisable to participate. As broadly and actively as possible in the local and regional dialogues which inevitably must be held among those agencies which are eligible to be Africans. And if this suggests that here and there some fence mending or even fence building may be required. I mean persons in education may need to get acquainted with each other then that may be the place to begin something called planning.

Finally it is going to be necessary to become aware of and even help to identify the educational needs of the community you serve and the priorities among those needs. And then finally to discover what the TV or educational radio can do to fulfil those needs. It's been suggested perhaps in too convenient a definition that educational needs are literally unfulfilled goals. But if you find the goals of education which your community falls short of achieving that discovery may in fact lead to an identification of needs that may be too convenient or too simple a definition but if there's any truth in it it may be useful and in fact necessary to start the search for needs by indulging in a search for the objectives and the purposes that we call goals striving toward some area of agreement about what those goals are or ought to be.

Now we've been talking to you and at you for about an hour and we've promised you the opportunity to ask questions. And this is that opportunity so I will ask the panel to join me up here at the table which will give those of you who have no questions an opportunity to slip gracefully and quietly away. And then we'll undertake much of this would also be a good time to bring up any questions that have been written that are not here yet. Are you. A doctor. You're right this is. What.

I mean. Well. You're right. I mean you know. All right I think we'll get down to the questions we have only a limited time. Sam Halperin has just told me that he must be back at the office by noon which means he must leave here at 11:45. So I'm going to request that questions that Sam Halperin can answer for us so that you may wish to direct to Mr. Halperin. Take priority in this question period. I have

one here stand which might just start us off. What agency or agencies have been set up by the District of Columbia to administer the Higher Education Act you happen to know. Or I answer them and I say this as citizens and taxpayers you're entitled to. Copies of the sats committee reports outlines and all I can suggest is that you will write simply to the office of the legislation office legislation U.S. Office of Education. Washington D.C. We'll get to our office. Tell us what you want. We can't make them available in huge quantities we can make them available and I was trying these and we will send you the Higher Education Act of 65 when it is signed the outlines of this such as the ones that we wrote this morning. You know if you want we can give you copies of the occasional Education Act which you also runs out of them. So just

let us know and they will be sent to you without charge. Now as far as the Higher Education Act of 1963 my understanding is that the commissioners of this doesn't name the agency I do not have exact name higher education facilities commission that has actually been making grants for construction of college sillies in the district we do not know if that will be the same unit that we use for type 1. Allegedly the same year they will use six of the new hires. These people really do not know. You can write then to Mr. Trump. You're the commissioner you could be president and you can ask for the address. The easiest thing to do I think would be just calling this is the call of the switchboard and ask for the higher education. So all of these commissions were called the Bureau of higher education or my office and we'll track it down for

releases and the other questions for Mr. Halperin. I've gone through these and initially got Why don't you take a crack at this one Sam because you are going to get this relief to elementary and secondary education. Is it possible to acquire through the Elementary and Secondary Education Act title one the equipment necessary to twenty five hundred mega cycle installation. If it was to be made primarily as a means of transmitting instruction specifically designed for disadvantaged children attending public schools I think apart from the direct answer to this question that this might be an opportunity to explain the state federal difference between one of three short answers that question would be yes it would be possible. Title 1 as you know the bulk of the funds are. I was directed at the special educational needs of this event as children will be in the public schools the parochial schools and the nomination although private schools or

indeed whether the kids go to any school at all or be dropped off funds are made available by an object of formula. Some objective criteria the funds go to the states the states that make them available to the school districts school districts public school districts only have to come up with an acceptable acceptable to the state an acceptable plan which gives promise of being of sufficient size scope quality to reach to meet the special needs of the children. Now all eight local public school system decided what they want to have was a twenty five hundred mega cycle system. They wanted to have special kinds of programs which were geared to this event and this would be at least in the first season eligible then becomes a question does the state agree with the local public school system. If there is a direct enough to Leisha venture of these funds

which are still rather limited and the possibility that these children will read better rights or learn about his planes grew longer and in general remove their education. Thank you for the question is the twenty five hundred mega cycle programs. I'm probably not using the right terminology are going to be effective seemed to be effective in helping these children. Then the answer is yes they will approve the local school district. Application if of the local school district. It seems you're buying a lot of hardware and there is no program to put on to this hardware and into the hardware. Then the answer we hope will be no. You've got to be reach these kids and merely building classrooms or buying buses or vine your 25 home mid-cycle isn't going Azol going to help these children. Law Challenge title 3 we have a different arrangement as your looks can

explain better but basically we made the grant direct to a local public school system or systems are using the state reviews the applications and makes recommendations to us. We can only make the local public schools is the least. But again only when there is the involvement. As Harry Hill said of the educational cultural resources of the community which could include the TV news radio it's a letter. There are only there no reason why the ones of today. Right yeah right here. Yellow light where red and yellow many are there. Are you really you really don't know. Did you all get a chance to hear the question is basically the same question but with reference to

broadcast transmission apparatus on the standard frequencies rather than twenty five hundred mega cycle. In a case where they state limitation has been reached under the heat of the facilities Act and the short answer is again yes you have to go very much to the same intellectual process. If you're going to the school district has a allotment of $800000 and you're going to spend the $700000 there could be ongoing transmission tower. I don't think you've done right by the yeah. I don't think of them that he want to hire will verifiable relationship between building the TV tower and changing the lives of those children that are disadvantaged. I could see of using some of the money and then mommy programs but I think you just have to use common sense I hope just a few things. I'm sure Congress wants us to we're going to need that kind of hard hit with a car here and there what they're going to want to see is there is a correlation between years manager of these fines and

improved educational reform. The reason we're in trouble. Similar question here. Yes this has to do with the fact that already she has got a few days or three days of what happened where you usually deliver the war room. Schools from three states together to form a school television service for instructional purposes but you're dealing with three stages when you're in the room. Oh your how. Where do we go where the room the schools come together or because of structure. Hello I'm reading here. But since we represent in this case three states and we also get one where we are thinking are private primarily in terms of the Elementary and Secondary Education Act.

And under Title 1 of course you would have some sort of relationship to a relationship to a state agency. I think I'd like to ask Harry to take a crack at answering that in relation to Title 3 projects I think in time three the answer to your dilemma. You try hard to tell all three segments which they should be why each of the reasons we were Yeah why did not we did not have the authority to read in your state. Here is what I hear the question begging. Oh. My oh ow. Ow ow ow ow. Ow ow

ow ow. Ow. Ow ow. Ow ow ow ow. West Bromwich here. Very nice. Guy and he's very sorry that. We are not like I'm not entirely sure how the question relates to the interest of broadcasting here. Chan would you want to try a response to that. I think the question is yes it's own answer. Let me let me try. We have an

obligation under the law to make certain that federal funds are used for all children all adults for the program to be equally. The Civil Rights Act of 64 settled that and it's our job now to try to bring about voluntary compliance and an honest ministration of funds those vines belong to all the people in the here and we use them. Now there is of course always unfortunately a time lag between the passage of legislation and the change of behavior. And we know that and we know that we're up against a very difficult problem. I wouldn't presume to do all of them to offer you the passer's vital force many clients and so on. I can only tell you a lot of people that the Office of Education are giving you with all of their personal lives to try to bring about an actual situation in which the intent of Congress. Aside from the civil rights question which I don't need to avoid. It's a major problem we have you know similar kinds of problems of discrimination. Previous federal legislation in

vocational education for many years you could show rather graphically that all the funds were were not going to all the counties and all the school districts of the state. There was also a problem with matching money sometimes that federal funds were used to make the rich richer in the sense that those who had the matching funds to put up well tended to get the federal money. And this has nothing to do with the raiser has little to do with race it's a problem of economics as well. Now in his recent federal legislation matching is held to a minimum in the elementary secondary education where there is no merit to speak of which means that going to school districts in need are going to get that money. We have an obligation to work with the State Departments of Education and that we have an obligation to enforce rules compliance forms and I can tell you that we're going to do so when I don't return the situation to a very good. Thank you shine with that I think will excuse you because time has gone out of the point where you're going to have to

use the rest of the regular but. From. Mr Davis had a question from the floor here do you know they may be right. Are you Harry wanted to comment on the love I think a small agency is the I want you to let me know if you meant simultaneously to Washington and the other day you take part of education. Recently we were weighing approximately 30 days to receive the review and recommendation is their agency on each of those. Right after we got that recommendation and the recommendations of our own reviewers we shall try them out and then you as a writer and Dr. Ruth.

Well you did not agree with this but I swore it was right for you. And your question. They've laid it here Ed.. And you've switched the question a little bit from whether the apparatus is eligible to how

best to prepare the application. Anybody offering a course in how to prepare applications to do. What. Let me let me just try an answer. Let me try an answer to that. And if anybody else wants to chip in on it you're welcome. My recommendation would be that you know that if you believe that a request for equipment a considerable capital outlay has a chance in an application that you associate the equipment with a single project not try to split the equipment among various projects because if you apply too if you apply for one half of the equipment under one program and it is approved and you apply for the other half of the equipment under another program and it isn't approved Where are you.

In other words I wouldn't. I would attempt to justify to the extent that you are able on the basis of the manner in which your proposal serves the needs of the legislation. I forgot how I started a sentence but I would I would put all the apparatus in one package rather than split it between packages which need approval from different sources. Great music. Right. Also be used in the areas where. I think the answer is yes there's no bearing. Yes we would expect that yes. The project also has a heavy dimension or ergonomics and that the it but that would be purchased with primarily be pitched into the area

we're reading here and here and there are certainly we are not interested in whether you have any neighboring new greenfield but we are a year away. Any program that is revived. He wouldn't have to have the silk stocking schools turn their sets off a bit. Let me let me go to one of our written questions here because it represents another phase another aspect are public questions Harry entitled tool of elementary and secondary. The first one under title to mate Library TV tape and film materials be sought by school councils who serve individual schools participating in a television curriculum. We're going to state this. This is primarily left up to this thing and be in the development of the administrative procedures under which they are going. Minister time and time has the authority you know granted they're allowed to assist in the acquisition

that you know as to whether or not you still don't know whether local your local public library is the result of it here or else yet almost. They play how they write how they resent the robbery and another one related to Title 2 does title to cover development and production of the film. Unfortunately not you know because a few reviews are good that you did here and that was it. Nor can you buy raw tape under Title 2 fines if you are buying video tape it would be for the acquisition of say library materials in which the program was already recorded on the tape. Here's an interesting one Harry will a gift of $75000 worth of Shakespeare display from England. I don't know what that word is it might be received. Primal prime What it

Prime a center Grant. For total Shakespeare teaching. This I imagine is related to Title 3 supplementary centers rather than crime center green whatever that I like. I would suggest that we think this will involve this being an idea around us a community that developed and I agree and I think the find our cultural activity that you did your research with any grandmother of the year. Here's one relating to the Higher Education Act which asks under the Higher Education Act are funds for and approved the project allocated to the state agency or the applying institution. As I understand it so far the funds would actually go to the applying institution the state agency would develop a state plan wouldn't it. And here again it is

unclear what to review and make a specific recommendation on the priority of proposals. But as I understand it the grants would actually be made to the Applegate and advocating the applying agency. Here. You are in.

The second part of this question is addressed to me and suggest that I develop further. My statement on the possibility of local specialists and federal programs. That wasn't entirely it was a gratuitous statement and suggestion it wasn't entirely going to be facetious however. Obviously with the burgeoning. Legislation in assistance to education. It becomes important for everybody to know what's in the legislation to the extent that local agencies broadcasters public school agencies institutions of higher education can. You can do so. It is certainly to their advantage to have somebody close to them who is familiar with the provisions of the legislation and the understands the ins and outs of it. There's also considerable assistance available to you through your Washington representatives.

And I'd like to give Chuck the opportunity to make a comment on that if he wishes to. Die. May I say just in passing that the principal reason that we didn't include the E.T. The facility's act in the context of this session was that it's an older piece of legislation and in our experience there isn't there isn't a great deal of lack of knowledge about it. Furthermore we've had members of our staff here throughout the entire convention so that anybody who has questions relating to the TV facilities act should have had an opportunity. If you haven't

I'll be around the rest of the day please see me. With respect to the piece of legislation that we made a hundred thousand dollars available to each of the states that submitted a proposal to set up a research or making unit you know 25 or so states and they did not teach and we in turn fund these research we're in a unit and if a person is interested in submitting a proposal for a grant under the vocational. He said that I didn't think these researchers really knew that you're normally part of the State Department. He would be more than happy to work with the author of that in terms of developing a good proposal. One of the objectives were clearly stated that not all of you was wealthy. Rather it was good to go and listen building to the research design center and that you don't serve the people in our own your research will be more than happy to council with a person either in person or long

distance. Very often they'll have them come up with something that we think might have grown their own. Thank you Jack. Let me make this one comment more with respect to the 80 percent of these that we have two questions what constitutes matching funds and is there no provision in any title for equipment or expansion of facilities where the public schools stationed Well indeed there is. I'll ask the author of either of these questions to check with me later. And I think I can give you a satisfactory answer. Here's one area that I remember has gone the rounds several times before. Is the intent of Title 3 to provide actual physical centers for New Media at libraries or centers in the sense of coordinating offices to make better use of all federal programs. Well I think the question here is and it has to do for a few years ago in the 50s

without going into Iraq which is sort of the internet is running here to do it either. However I would guess that the big earlier if I was really there for your viewing this week Graham you're really looking at me right a center now be a facility in which a program our services operate or are read out and it may be insignificant and really quite see the structure the center is simply a result of the myth as a memory serves our regular. Your question related. Oh my God I want to get that title. Who they are. The acquisition of library video made obviously of the situation but what else were you have in there that you know that you think

you're right and it would hire people that you would wire or say well there are regional libraries that you know here and here they were read by lawyers you know they say oh listen I hope I mean they make you up so that is a very low base. What Haitians are ready to give you money you raise in the video area where you would feel like going to a very expensive way to acquire tade girl as you could read you know they are you know obviously Well presumably the source from which you got the tapes in the first place would be remaking them. If you're asking specifically can you localize component units of a serious I think the answer to that is no not under Title 2. There's nothing to prevent your going and localising it with your own. Some of these and

resources title too doesn't have production money in a guarantee of Iran and he's interested in Iran. I don't going to not leave this thing to her mother and I feel rich no might hear me right there. You know let me get a break today but I'd like to make the additional point that's a very expensive way of buying tape because you're going to in any purchase price you're going to pay the cost of the paper plus the charges that are involved in putting the program on the page that. You know where we are. Date the Center for the service that used to start through

through Friday three will leak out record and it moves just slightly out local here. Right now you're not reading the program news night and in that regard to Xander yet it is the fact that he is involved many people anything community to assist him and revive him right now in terms of what this program is designed to be working for a program for the for the instruction via a busy life with Ed. The love and you're right my every. They get rather gravitation If that matter in my beloved will reap

revenge on the receipt of credible funds to provide financial assistance if you can sell it. He had not yet lost in the last probe re. Re re re he. The commissioner reserved the right time. Three good projects that made me not recommended by the state in the way that no other words the the application route under Title 3 is from the applicant to the commissioner with a copy to the State Department. It is not automatic that a project which has or has not

State Department recommendation will or will not be recommend given the chance I get discovery. You're. Entire one new life my new life. I mean Cheney cranks out the amount of money for each of the eligible local educational agencies in the nation. This is the ONLY by title that goes to the 16 and the eligible I have and of course is that local agency and it will be a little bit caught on your time. While I would guess far to form a union our local agencies bar I fired my application it's better to think of what the total package is than my the changes they apply for it. Hard. If you want a sharing. If you are sharing a range

now. Whatever is true for that lower wages you certainly will be subtracted from the title of that agency for that particular year. Yes I believe this would be the more logical way of working out a party arrangement among local educational agencies all type 1. They might very need not necessarily be there day 0. 0 0. Well it could certainly be considered an under Title 1 the application machinery should the state I'm not familiar with it Harry. Are you sufficiently acquainted with Title 1 procedures

in these I don't want to see here. They the state will lay down the guidelines and the general yesterday. I'll say anything. Title 1 project will be submitted. Now they should you should work directly with the agency on finding out what this procedure is here buglers day and bottling it as early as possible. If you choose to go the time ready route there will be two or three you're doing. One would be if you can get a quark needed room and between those three agencies that Boston for example should be eligible and should administer the grant in behind the creation. If you want to do it more formally in your bar I think letters like a mandate or. Establish body which will represent all three agencies as well so here's another question Harry relating to state Department of Education and several of our states. This has a special significance for broadcasting County State Dept. of Education be considered a local educational agency as

regards bt the where that department is the owner and operator of stations and the producer and provider of TV instruction to schools of the state. He has got you know the fallibility. I didn't mean anything. You are a liar. Not by many hours of our time early you program it with I mean the thyme and the Ganges Andriy right. Yeah we do it right around the year and the really hard at this day Asian like you see at this thing again. LOWRY in the in the other I give you the review and recommend that you do this right it should not be under any circumstances. Now if I'm allowed to receive great project I've read that you didn't hear it. I am not overlooking several questions simply bypassing them because I think the answer has been provided.

For example one of the possibilities of using Symphony Orchestra's in the Title 3 area of most a symphony orchestra might a symphony orchestra work with the school system of an E D and in a TV station to improve level of music appreciation the answer is yes and a similar answer holds true in the question as to whether a local arts council can participate in a project. Now we have one question here relating to Title Six of the Higher Education Act. The institutes and workshops include training teachers or prospective teachers and administrators either public school or higher education level for utilization of instructional media particularly the educational radio and television. Again I'm and I'm working on a reading of the act without the benefit of regulations behind me but it seems to me that the answer is yes and no.

That is to the extent that these training programs are designed to improve utilization of the elementary and secondary level. You know the language of the Act makes it clear that the media workshops and institutes are intended for people from the teaching point of view who are engaged in or preparing to engage in direct instruction at the close circuit direct instruction in institutions of higher education or media specialists who will be engaged in similar activities. Universities and colleges. Higher education not elementary and secondary. Question here. 0

0. 0 0. 0 0 0 0 0 0. Yes I think the answer is this. Did you follow the Aarushi train format in the guy and you

continue with. Funny possibility I need three seen years statement to the fact that he's right you know to continue in this manner or in the manner and yes he's our estimated budget for the second this show here now when I say I can destroy year rolls around we may ask you to submit a budget that time but only if it would reflect your reconsideration. My theory that places where you are already here. I don't want to take the time now to re read the legislation.

Undergraduate level of instruction is covered in the first part of Title Six In other words this would be the acquisition of TV equipment would have to be associated with direct instruction at the undergraduate level. I said simply don't recall the wording of Part B sufficiently to to know if it did. To answer your question that is I. I can't say right now where there are graduate institutes graduate fellowships would be ruled out. However the terms that would probably be relevant and dominant would be short term or regular session workshops or institutes and it depends I think on what becomes the meaning of those terms. As we go on like oh we're here right here at this moment made the remark

that is one that is one thing that obviously will have to be worked out in defining terms in the work of the task groups in the office present time and time. Three years operate. The law as they say here we expect to be able to prove nights on consideration to be stingy again the height below the root region there and I. See this kind of legal by we read this far at my hearing that is. I really think after the first year is that you know places well very rapidly is that there are so we cannot be caught in the situation where we

would authorize read mine too you know. There are even restrictions I read on. We envision a chain round. Here's another written question is it possible to aquire twenty five hundred mega cycle equipment for uses in training. High school pupils in vocational skills Offhand I would say the answer is if that's the only purpose. No. It's certainly a worthwhile purpose and provable purpose but it's a very narrow range purpose and chances are that it would not gain approval in competition with other broad range proposals through that area. Yeah OK here's here's one I could open up a whole Pandora's box I suppose under which title would payments by local school districts to a school TV service for instructional

television and other services be covered under which titles of all titles where there is the possibility of support for broadcasting. Would it would subsume payments of some sort. If what is meant by this question is the creation of a new program series then they pay the costs to produce educational broadcasting services would appear as a part of the budgeted costs under a contract to an arrangement. And this might be true under Title 1 under Title 3 of the of the SCA certainly. It might have to be also true under a grant that was approved. Well I guess it wouldn't apply to a local school district and they would have to be research oriented and see if what is meant by the question is can a school district acquire payments acquire money with which to pay its 50 cents per

head or dollars per head assessment of the stations I don't know the answer to that one. Do you Harry. I would guess there would have to be ya know more energy information required. Oh Taiwan time three for example. I think right away entire really great question Are you really through the service that will many an enhanced a huge occasion are you know that we use. Or are you simply taking over you know something that you would normally do otherwise with your own files there would be the latter of course we're hearing now that and I would guess that the same height to some extent will be an entire line because by this agency because there is a maintenance out financial acard provision in title as well as three. If that's not a sufficient answer if the author of the question wants to expand upon a this is the time well brought up so too much of it was

rigid. There are some who do this surely many many metropolitan here what do you do all of the services provided by these very cute services without. Therefore they don't get better right away. You could never say never the money. Why don't you write a letter to the men so well you know this. Maybe there are no more of this. Oh I oh you know him well you know he's like you know what we don't know and we really need this. But we just don't have the money. You know this is the reason why

I don't believe that that there's a very easy answer to that question. I think that kind of proposition under Title 3 might be submitted but it would probably be way down to the bottom of the barrel by comparison with other projects to create supplementary services centers innovations and so forth. It might be feasible under Title want working at the state level to funnel some of the funds into areas into school districts where there was genuine educational deprivation to allow them to partake of something that already existed provided that the educational deprivation and needs are met. This might be a possibility. We're getting very close to lunch now. I'd say we could take time for two more questions if there are any. There are that many. Dave has one. Finally we're going to get something that got going respond to.

That. Or oh great thing while you're thinking now. Program over there is not for you to be actually I'm probably around with that and there are a result that is you know what I mean. Me too it's over for me bro. This is like in the knees slightly before all remember from my reading with my right. Eye. And really it kind of

thing that would make the low people in my own communally for this kind of thing might be easy to do in the writing. So but it needs to be done so all rising letters we get you know are not from communities where services know you really know really good people you don't know things here and there right now. But you know you know me and you know you know nation they really know what happened. Oh we are only interested in talking with you on a wild ride. We go to the parking lot and direct broadcasting of programs to seniors founders of the things that they are. But this will require your special receivers are all good things and we're not reaching for them all.

I don't see another hand so let me express our appreciation coming for you I think the number of you who have stayed and intruded into your own own lunch hour indicates the degree of interest. I hope that next year's convention will provide the opportunity for another session of this sort in which those of you who have been successful with projects under the new legislation which involve broadcasting will have a chance to be up here and let us be out there to see how it works. Thank you very much.