Youth on a four day trip; Why students crack up

From the 1968 Wisconsin workweek of health sponsored by the State Medical Society of Wisconsin and the Wisconsin physicians service Blue Shield will bring in the first in a series of programs designed for teenagers and taking as its theme. Youth on a four day trip today Dr. Jack S. Westman professor of psychiatry at the University of Wisconsin Medical School discusses the emotional problems of teenagers in a lecture in titled Why students crack up. Now Dr. Westman the times when what's going on outside of us. Cause us to crack up are pretty obvious times like if you live in an area where people are very unfair where you don't have enough to eat close to with where prejudice rains strong you can't get work and so on. Clearly that kind of outside world will cause some people to crack up. But as you know there are many people who live in very unfavorable circumstances who don't crack up. There are many

people who in spite of hardship that your right is as very strong. People. So I'd like to start with this notion that. It's. The most obvious and easiest thing for each of us to look outside of ourselves to look at the world and to say there is a cause of my difficulty today. And I'm coming back and saying that rarely do we deal with people who back up find this to be the root cause. So I'd like to spend the time that has been allotted to me. Talking about. What to us are the obvious causes. But I suspect to many of you are not seen because like Dr. Smith you know the idea that it was a power saw in addition to a chain saw has not quite gotten through. And I'd like to start

off by sharing with you. Some things. That Go on. In each of us here I'm sure. That arise from within our minds and our bodies. That lead each of us at some point. To feel. That we are suffering from something that ought to be taken care of by a psychiatrist. There isn't a boy or a girl or if we're honest with ourselves a man or a woman around today who hasn't at some point felt that they were cracking up or had cracked up. I've heard some people put it this way they say that being an adolescent is like having a disease you know. And when I talk with many just growing up type audiences I get questions from them when they talk to me about what can we do about teenagers and the idea that we're going to stamp them out or we're going to cure them or somehow

remove the problem from our midst. And I think this is a generally felt notion that being in your teen years this kind of a disorder or a disease in itself. Of course isn't true but maybe it is a little. And this is what I'd like to talk about now. Being in the teen years does have built into it some pretty crazy stuff. Now as I look at the there are some adults in the audience here but I look at as I look at the teenage faces here. I think if we were each of us able to talk alone somewhere. We could talk a little bit. About the times when you felt. Those crazy feelings and thoughts. And we could certainly talk about the times when your mom and dad have said look there's a movie about you or is that wrong with you. We could talk a lot about that. But what are these things

that are rather typical of these years of life that lead to concerns. Well the first and most obvious thing is that during the teenage years there's a very rapid growth in the size of the body and it's part. And when I say that. You can go over a two month period at a certain point your life and find that you're right choose to take your left shoe just right. You know. With the growth of the body in rapidity there also is the growth of the body in unevenness. So that one feels even though you're armed. Because if you develop athletic skill and so on you're very well-coordinated that the typical teenage boy or girl feels uncoordinated and feels awkward and feels clumsy. There is a part of the brain that we call the body image.

And it's sitting right up in a certain part of the brain and it has in it a picture of the body. And that is your mind's eye. Of your body. Now when your body changes slowly that mind's eye. Changes right along with the body. But when the body changes rapidly the mind's eye is a little behind. And the mind's eye of one's body can see it one way when in actuality it's another way so that you can feel as if hands face or other parts of your body are unnatural. Because your mind's eye has not yet caught up. To the rapid changes that are occurring. Well this is a long way to say that every adolescent at some point has times when he feels as if he isn't right as if there's something wrong with his body and the way it works.

Another thing that's going on during these years and that is of I think even greater importance. Is that we have occurring in the body. New things that never happened before. We have occurring in the body the development of glands and various organs that shoot out hormones and that shoot out various enzymes and other things within the body structure that cause peculiar sensations. And as I look at each of you today who are under the age of 21 or 18 for sure. I know that you and I could talk about times when your body doesn't feel right because of peculiar feelings and sensations you have in it. There are times when you want to not show feeling at all. And yet your face blushes and you have no control over it.

There are times when you want to be paying attention to you know all that wonderful and intriguing and interesting algebra. And you're just trying to keep your mind on that. But there are other feelings that are coming in your body because there's a boy or girl somewhere else in that room or down the hall or somewhere who hasn't called or has called or if you know the story. And that with the body sensations that go along with it take priority over whatever that poor teacher is trying to get through your head at the moment. So there are many moments many hours in those long boring hours you will remember when the sensations you have in your body are of vital importance and they get in the way of what you're trying to do namely learn or carry out some other activity. Now if you hadn't guessed already I'm talking in part about sexy feelings. And if any of you hadn't guessed that's what I'm talking about. Come and see me afterwards.

Right. Now we have sexy feelings that are coming probably for the first time in your life in an intense way that at times you have no control over it I think this is one thing that most of us adults don't realize that you know we all think when our son or my daughter is a man. My daughter. She's 15 and she's going out on her first date in my thoughts. I'm sure our like many parents thoughts. My thoughts immediately. Are along the lines of what they're going to do when they're alone in the car. My worries are of such a nature that I won't dare share them with this group. And from the point of view of the poor fellow in Galilee. They all know each other are going to go out to a movie or dance or something when they're going to talk and heaven sakes the things that I have in mind are the farthest farthest from their mind.

And I think what we need to understand is grownups. Is that there are many times in the lives of teenagers when sex is not the first thing in your head. And there also are many times in your life. When sex may be more in your head than you'd like to have it be. And this is one of the things of course that goes with growing up learning over time to channel feelings and impulses in a way that works your advantage rather than your disadvantage. So these sensations then. That can lead to embarrassment that can lead to the finest pleasure that can lead to trouble that can lead to creativity of the highest order are important. And ought to be recognised and do play a great role in your lives and let me get to the next point. And this is a hooker.

All these things I've been talking about that relate to the state of your body do not occur at the same time or in the same place with any two individual boys or girls. In other words the teenage years have built into them a tremendous range. Of onset of new things. So that. Between three and four years. Can normally exist as a difference between the onset of physical puberty or the sexual changes of adolescence. Within normal boys and girls. So if we take girls and we think in terms of the seventh grade we think in terms of girls who are 1 year at least I had. Of boys from the point of view sexual maturity. This is the average so that all girls grow up faster

than boys and do the men in the audience here that don't mean there's Markert or better. But it does explain why they bug us. You know so much so that junior high girls have interests that are ahead of boys and this is built into the nature of the species. Now within the sexes say within all girls some girls have the onset. Of puberty in the sixth grade maybe the fifth It's going down over time. Some don't have the onset of menstruation until they're 14. That's you know several years later. So that we have then within the normal range pick the ninth grade girls of the same age chronologically who are widely different in physical maturation. Now if you're the kind of girl who Turley and some of you are you went through that

period of thinking you were a sexual maniac you know a nymphal. Because none of the other girls were interested. Here you are running around bigger in all areas and so on. Well there's a big difference. You may also realize there are a lot of girls who are quite envious of that development that you have. Now. At the same time if you're a girl who's gotten aged you know on maybe pushing 15 or something like that. And you still find that you're behind other girls that you know you're feeling embarrassed and self-conscious and here all these years have gone by seventh grade eighth grade ninth grade U.S. and you begin to feel or something wrong with you that something biologically has gone wrong with your body. Well the same thing applies to boys only a little bit later so that puberty in boys can start at 12 perhaps.

And it can start with other boys. Maybe at 16 and there we've got that three four year difference in body size. Now we as grownups say well what's the difference. Three or four years one way or another you know that's to our life whether I'm forty or forty three don't really matter. We forget that four years or three years. Between 12 and 16 is tremendous. You know. There's a difference between a junior high kid and a senior high kid and particularly between a freshman sophomore senior whatever your system is these years are of exquisite sensitivity and difference to you. So what I'm saying is that many fellows and girls normally think either because they're early later or even if you're in the middle you still think that there's something wrong with you. And it is not at all uncommon during this period of time. For us not only to think maybe there's something wrong with us in a

heterosexual way but for us to think there is something wrong with us in a homosexual way too. So there are very few boys and girls who haven't at some point or another even on nobody else's thought they were queer because they found themselves liking if a girl or another girl or if a boy another boy more than they think they ought to do so from a sexual point of view then a big part. Of the teenage years is devoted to sorting out and working out these things that are occurring at different rates in different forms and built into this is the idea there is something wrong with me because I'm not like most of the other kids. Well we've talked about bodies. Let's get to things that are easier to talk about in one way and much harder to talk about it another way before we start diagnosing each other. The first thing we talk about are changes occurring within your body that lead you to

feel there's something wrong with your body or your mind or your feelings. Now there are also things going on. Around you that are very essential. And vital importance in terms of mental health. And I said before we can't blame the outside world for my trouble. But we can look at our families. And we can look at people with whom we live on a day to day basis. People whom we love the most. People whom we hate the most namely our moms and dads and our brothers and sisters. Things that go on in families are highly relevant to you. And to me those of us who are parents you know are driven to distraction by you kids. Those of you who are kids think that we're cruel and unfair and merciless and failing and understanding and these are obvious things but what are the not so obvious things. That we look at in family life today.

Well first of all family life at least as I have known it and have seen it as a clinician is not at all. Like people say it is. Other words. The first point is that we in America. The middle class America. Do not open up honestly. With each other. About family living so that most of us carry this idea that families ought to have a lot of togetherness in them that families ought to be happy places where we wonder our way through the turbulence of the teenage years in school that family living is a place where we refuel our tanks and after a wonderful evening at home we jump up to have

breakfast and kiss our parents and go off to the day with enthusiasm and vitality. Already I'm getting tired talking about it and I think you're getting a picture that the mess. That exists today is that family life is fun and games and happiness and where young ones learn from the older ones and the older ones take care of the young ones and are proud and pleased with their offspring. This is not true the divorce rate would indicate that certainly all of our crack ups and marriages are very common in our state one out of four in some states now approaching one out of three if not more so that marriages are cracking up all over the place. Marriages are getting started on very shaky foundations. Of the romantic myth of family living is precisely that.

That family living as I will hopefully get to is great but it's not at all what people say it is. And let me tick off some of these things that really go on in homes. We placed tape recorders and you see some of this is not just my opinion but we have some data for those of you who are data oriented today that they want threw punches and punch cards and computers and so on. And we played tape recorders in normal homes. To find out what really went on I'm just going to briefly refer to this because it was just a fascinating thing you know who would permit a tape recorder in our house. Things of this nature well people dead. And one of these families permitted the tape recorder in the house we incidentally got to because we were looking for normal families and want to study them one through a local high school got the teachers and principals opinion about who the normal children were. Our first one the. First one we called was the

student council president Dan the football star and actually a four letter man and his school was highly regarded by everybody we thought he's Jack Armstrong we're going to see what kind of home produce this magic miracle. And so we did and we called his mother and said Mrs. Smith this is Dr. West one from the stars of psychiatry and I kept talking so she wouldn't faint on the spot with a call like that and said that you have been selected by such and such a school and we're trying to learn about normal family life and we would like to come up to your house and talk with you. Don't mention the tape recorder first would talk with you. And see how you produce this and we'd like to find a time when you and your husband and family were there. She was very pleased and flattered and thanked me for the call and just delighted she liked John too. But you know. You know Dr. West and we we probably won't be able to do what you're asking. You see

I would have difficulty getting my husband to come we've been divorced for four years. You see. So the first normal family we got was a divorced family. And this particular series we had to go down three names to get the family that had a mother and father. And three children spaced by two years of fitting you know kind of the Mr. Molder of family life here. Well we placed these tape recorders and 17 families. And over time learned what went on in these homes. Now the first thing that we learned because this was done in a northern state was that the furnace floors make a lot of noise. We have ours furnace war. Incidentally another one of those things next time you're home you tune that out.

It is a loud noise a tape recorder picks it up and you tune it out for various reasons. Second thing we discovered is that the single loudest punctuating sound with the kind of homes that we had which were sort of branched our tape recorder in the middle would pick up through the whole home the single most prominent punctuating noises a flushing toilet. That there were human noises that were emitted and run when we tried to analyze and called the humanizes. But by and large the greatest amount of the human eyes it was a minute and we had to describe it that way because we couldn't understand a lot of it didn't want to understand some of it. It came from children and this was usually a one way kind of communication some kind of emitted sound that had no response and that it was either a scream going through the house or shouting from one and the other but it was

from the children. The second most common source of humanoids seem to come from an adult female and this was the mother and her noise. Also it was largely in a one way direction with no response what going on. We couldn't tell direction but in all ways in the home and the least common source of noise that we could identify in these homes was that of a human adult male. We assume that the man was there but in some of the homes he indicated his presence very seldom through noise. Now the reason why I bring this up is that we discovered that one of the myths that we have is that you ought to be able to talk with each other at home and communication is wonderful. Only teenagers will talk with their parents or they would be fine if only husbands and wives would talk with each other and would be fine. And one of the things that we in mental

health clinics do is try to get people to talk to each other. We get a dialogue going on everything work out well. When this noise was analyzed from a point of view of communication as of our i've already implied most of it was one way. There was no dialogue. There was no conversation back and forth. And these homes when we averaged out the amount of two way conversation or communication then it was coded in this way that if the mother said Honey would you go out and buy me a loaf of bread and the father said Yes dear I'd be glad to. This occurred once. That's communication in other words there's a message going this way and a message coming back. Now when we analyze the noise from that point of view how much and these average homes and all these homes were normal homes as far as we could pass.

The amount of conversation are two way communication that occurred in these homes. Was slightly less than 20 minutes a week. 20 minutes a week. Now we're assuming that we missed a lot of communication in the bedroom and other places with hushed voices. But the amount of registered communication and certainly the total amount of noise that went on the house was very very small. Which indicates to us that if we believe. The talking together in this kind of thing is a greatest thing and goes on in all the other homes and if only my mother would understand me everything would be fine. The truth is it does not. The truth is that in most American middle class homes communication in a back and forth way does not take place in the way that we think it ought to. Now I'd like to spend the next five minutes before

we get to the questions and this is stimulated things that we haven't covered here. I would love very much to have you jot them down. I'd like to talk a little bit seriously about. Students who do crack up. Now. First of all. The number of students who really do have. Significant problems is small. So I indicated earlier each one of you has thought at one time you did and discovered later I hope that you did. 10 percent. Of fellows and girls your age. Are legally entitled to have a mental or emotional problem. And I put it that way because I think you have a right. Anybody who is on the verge of having difficulty to know that a certain percentage of the people do. And just as we can plot epidemiology or the incidence of the

commonness of disease in other areas we can do this with mental disorders too so that if we have a school in which it is held forth that we have no mental problems here then we know that somebody is hiding these problems they do exist so that 10 percent is the average figure and some schools will be higher. In other schools slightly lower this is the average. Now this means that that one out of 10 of you here are going right down the road or one out of 10. Is eligible to cash in. Having a significant problem. Now these problems that arise. Are problems that we define by looking at three things and the first step is if you think you've got a problem. First people to consult Are your parents not if you really have a problem you'll find that you can't. So the second line of defense is some other adult that you know and trust your family doctor to a counselor a school

teacher or the minister or priest or somebody who is available outside of the home who can give you a little objectivity. Probably the last person to consult at the first step is a psychiatrist because we think everybody that comes to us has a problem and that's because everybody who does get to us does have a problem. We're kind of the third line of defense. Now. When we look at ourselves and try to determine whether or not we have a significant problem we look at three things. We look at how we are doing. In school. And this has to do with whether you're working up your ability level and how you're handling the learning process. Now. I am the first to say that one of the problems with modern education is that we grownups are just as unfair as we can be. I am a teacher in a medical school. I am a physician. And some

of us here are teachers. If my boss or other grown ups your bosses expected us to work at 100 percent efficiency every day all through the year we'd quit. Yes I cannot work at 100 percent efficiency in other words if I were to be graded. Every six weeks on how I did that previous six weeks. I certainly would not have always nor would any adult yet because you're younger than your voice and heard too much and it will be and has. We expect you. If you have an IQ of 100 30 or 40 or something like that. To be a high B or a student all the time. And if you don't get all A's or all BS or CS or whatever it is that you're capable of doing. We say you're underachieving and you'd better get on the ball and it isn't just us it's those massive colleges and everyone else setting standards and admission criteria and so on.

I think this is a sad. Mistake. So when I look at academic achievement I don't look. At. Just the grades and one's IQ. Look at all the other things that are going on in school. What he doing there is taking up your time is it fun or not. As an innovative and absorbing place to be and for most kids today I'm like those of us who are adults frankly going to school is fun. Most of us as adults do not remember school in that way before you get to today if you're lucky. School is fun there are a lot of things going on there it's very exciting and there are a lot of things that may not be correct. I'm based there a lot of things extracurricular wise a student government wise athletics music just a host of things drama. So I look at that. And if one is coming through in that area. Then this is a positive sign. The second thing we look at is home life.

And if home life is going reasonably well from the point of view you can stay there and you're earning way too much. From the point of view that there is a haven there where you can let your hair down and show your weak side. And that's really what home is a place for us to let our hair down and show our craziness a little bit shorter and Tori. And there's something there that one can go to with a feeling that this has a haven quality and that's a plus. And you can see I'm not asking for that happy relationship thing tween mother dad kids and everybody else. Now the third thing that I look at is how. Life is going at the broader community level. And this means you know if you're in trouble with a juvenile court or trouble with the police or trouble with neighborhood in a big way then there's a problem but if you're not. Then that's a plus. So if things are going reasonably

well in school things are going reasonably well at home things are going reasonably well in the community. Then you do not fall within the 10 percent. If on the other hand in any of these areas big things stand out then you're in the 10 percent. Now I'm not saying at all that you aren't entitled to having a problem if things are going well in these areas Sure. There are a lot of worries we have a lot of things that you can do better. You can be more comfortable when you are. But that's within the whole process of growing up and really isn't a psychiatric problem. Sometimes we as psychiatrists have to come and talk and say things. But there are a lot of other people who have just that good sense as we have. And just because you're insecure and anxious doesn't mean it's a psychiatric problem it could be a religious problem it could be a problem having to do with morals could be a problem having to do with understanding better how other people feel about you. And there are a lot of people who can really pitch

in and help you out there. Dr. Jack C. Weissman as he spoke to a group of teenagers in a lecture from the 1968 Wisconsin work week of health following his lecture Dr. Westman read and answered questions submitted to him by the audience. Here is a question. What is the best way to cope with mild depression caused by a bad image of the mind. Mild depression is one of the natural normal experiences not only of the teenage years but of later life too. So that when you get. What the Excedrin headache kind of thing or the feeling that everything has gone wrong and in fact half the things have gone wrong. And you're feeling out of sorts and down and out and want to be

alone. Oh boy that is for teenagers there are times when you want to be alone. There are times when you don't want to talk with everybody and when I speak with your parents I try to emphasize that there are times when you're entitle to a mild depression and some of this is your mind's way of adjusting to what's going on. It's a little bit like saying if you grow up in the country and you go to a big city and all of a sudden you get out of the train and there you are right in the midst of the terminal. And you just stand there you're overwhelmed by what's going on you know where to go or you're not used to this kind of excitement and so on. You will have what we call kind of a mental lapse as your mind adjusts to the new environment. The same kind of thing occurs during the teenage years are many things that you haven't experienced before and you will have kind of a low depressed overwhelmed feeling before the solution comes through.

Here are six on communication in the home. Why is the American father saying so little at home. Oh boy. I Brad Pitt is there I can't get a word in edgewise. Well part of this I think is sex difference. If you look at a three year old girl and you look at a 3 year old boy the girl will talk far more and even starts then you know. The 3 year old boy that females just have a vocalizing urge that is not present in a man. So although I think part of it is biologically determined. Sex difference. I think another part of it. And this sometimes leads to misunderstanding is that when dad gets home you know the whole story he wants a place where he can be quiet. Because he's been busy and active all day. And mother may have been home all day looking for somebody to talk to. And of course the two clash. One of the home.

Meeting comes and I don't know. I would suggest this I think that every American home has to have some remedy to this disparity. Even with working mothers there still tends to be conflict between the parents and whether it be through cocktail hour or meditation hour or Children's Hour or just sitting hours something like that I think every family ought to decide what for them is a best way of handling this late afternoon time rather than just fighting over it in a continuous way. The other thing that occurs to me about the American father is something that I would appeal to you youngsters about. And that is your dad is a good guy. And is do him his best job. As he sees it as he can do it in his work. And it is in his community and in his world. And he has to maintain an image of confidence

outside of the home. American dads are lousy fathers with their boys and girls and wives for some reason we are not well oriented to being good dads with you. And we tend to show our indifference our weaknesses our irritability and this kind of thing with you at home so we can pull off this image of being confident in our work. So the truth is that we're confident as men in our work but many of us are failures at home and be kind to us. I plead with you because we need your understanding and I think you'll find that if we're sitting there not saying very much you may have ways of getting to us and we'll talk more. What was this 20 minutes into a conversation of the total noise actually 20 minutes is a long time. Well what do you think about this 20 minutes we've gone through here. But if it's a matter of talking back and forth you can say

an awful lot in 60 seconds. The 20 minutes was comprised of many many small units and actually had that problem solving things like who's going to drive to the soccer game and things of whole maintaining nature very little of it was problem solving in the sense of working on our job as a family or parents and this nature very little was on serious problems that confront and contain. Why do you think there is lack of communication within the family well I think. My point isn't Let me restate this my point isn't that we ought to be communicating all the time. My point is I don't think we need to communicate quite so much. Now there are some of us who do and certainly if you get to a psychiatric clinic there will be a real effort to get your talking together but I think for most people we will be much better off if we could accept each other as we are rather than trying to change each

other through negative at each other and trying to get the other guy to change and much of the communication that is kind of wheel spinning that goes on in homes when there is more than that 20 minutes a week is the effort of one person to change the other person. A hopeless task. How can we get more communication taking place in the home we need an institute to help parents talk together with their teenagers and with each other. Yes I have. I would probably agree with that. I think as I say that we don't need more communication in the sense of needing it each other. I do feel that it's very useful for teen age fellows and girls to have a chance to meet with their parents outside of the home it makes a lot of difference. With other teenage parents and kids it brings out a totally different side of you and I think good communication through better understanding through things that can occur

outside of the home are very useful in here things like the church school other community organizations can play a vital role. We usually find that if families can get involved in things outside of the home to. The life it home becomes much more of a haven has much more pleasure in it than if that's the only place that these people function after hours. Depression and Suicide. What role does suicide play in the life of a teenager today. Well everybody ought to try it once. I say that facetiously. Because I think most of us have had fleeting thoughts of suicide at some point in our lives. And if you hadn't or haven't had this yet you probably will now. One of these reasons is one of the reasons for this is that self destructive or pleasure in self pain or injury or what have you is kind of natural and normal. I don't know how many of

you are familiar with the word maze a chasm. But that is a technical term you might look it up if you have heard of it. There is a certain pleasure in suffering that we all have in its natural normal and certain amount of pain under certain conditions will not feel like pain. It will feel pleasant biting for example need not always hurt and many times will doesn't. So that kind of built in to the human organism. Is against the self. A sort of propensity and teenage boys know this probably more than teenage girls but there are times you know when you really get a thrill or could get a thrill out of flirting with death. And this comes through taking chances with dad's car or doing other things that seem kind of stupid and yet you want to try to do it just to see how it feels to take that risk. So the pleasure in taking risks. Is part of the male

organism and women to have a little piece of this. So there's a kind of propensity in all of us that leads us to think in terms of self-destruction. Now let's the natural normal part. Is point number two. If you really want to get the mom or dad or somebody else and you can't get too many other way just threaten to commit suicide. Girls and all that women know that so that whenever we hear about a teenage girl who's already killed herself and so on. And it isn't just a slang you know it's another illustration of what I was talking about before is we all have in our slang I could kill you or something like that you know or kill myself. But if a teenage girl starts talking seriously about killing herself we take that with a grain of salt because she might just be having a sort of a manipulative way of getting attention. This doesn't mean that we ought not listen to this but it is one of the things that goes on. Now within that 10 percent of people who have difficulty there are individuals who very

seriously. Come to a state of mind where it seems as though the only way out of hell really is to go to heaven in a way and that is to kill oneself. In other words somebody who is seriously thinking about suicide is not thinking about this as a bad or unpleasant thing. There may be in their head everybody's going to be sorry when I'm gone. But there is a positive attitude that this is going to solve something for me this is better than what I've got. So when we hear that kind of thing we listen. If you hear that kind of thing in yourself or others listen. Now if anyone is on the verge of suicide that person will have enough sense to let people know about. So if people talk to you or others about this in a serious way listen it may again not be serious in the long run but there are people who want to commit suicide as a gesture to

attract attention and talk about it. And they try and they accidentally do. Some fatal suicide weren't intended to be that way at all. I'm thinking of one older lady who turned on the gas in her kitchen when her husband drove into the garage. Knowing that he would come in but he didn't. He went to visit the neighbor for an hour and then came back. And you can see there are accidental suicide so I think to feel that I'd like to give you is that it is a serious thing. But at the same time as with everything else it's a part of day to day living and it's a problem that we need to approach appropriately and with the guidance and counsel of those who know the business. Your counselors family physician or your ministers. How would you counsel a student who has no interest whatsoever in high school. Well first of all I would

say that there are very few people who have given a choice would be attending school regularly. I mean that I think there are very few of us who are working who have given a choice would do this day after day. So the first thing again is that not having interest in Heights High School is a part of each one of us but when a fellow or a girl gets to the point when it just has no meaning at all. I think this is a serious problem. And I think this is that number one area I was talking about the school area. That is not grabbing that fellow or girl. And there is a problem that could be resolved through adequate counseling and guidance and I know it's a vague answer but I would say this is when you call the counselor or the psychiatrist or psychologist or social worker. What is the best thing to do in pressure and tensions start building up with respect to school activities grades

friendship. And for girls. When the telephone doesn't ring. I'm adding that myself. And here's another one do you think a person should blow up once in a while and let everything out instead of keeping it inside. If you have problems is that better to put them in the open. And do you think you should. Or do you think you should keep them inside. Home is a place to put them in the open. Home is a place to have that one way communication we were talking about. I think you have a right to get mad and blow up. I think also you have a right to expect that people around you are going to accept you even if you do. And if you hear your mom and dad say all you're just one of those white teenagers I respect that because you are and you're not. You're entitled to show this instability. So my suggestion is yeah go ahead. And to the extent that you can in your own home do it they're not in the classroom not in church on

Sunday not in other public places but at home. Keeping these things along and up is not a useful thing. Although this question doesn't ask it let me get in a pitch. I'm a physical fitness walk. Now I was like I interest and yet I want you to understand that a psychiatrist is promoting for mental health purposes physical activity and kids because many of you youngsters are not getting enough in the way of exercise and this leads to physical symptoms we as doctors run across teenage boys and girls who have headaches and they feel dumpy and all that kind of stuff. And the simple fact is they aren't getting enough exercise. If you drive everywhere you don't walk enough and you don't have a vigorous outlet that your bodies need. So I feel that part of mental health is good physical health and part of physical health is getting as much in the way of activity as you can.

Run a couple miles every two days for a teenage boy ought to be in his life for that degree of exercise. Won't the idea of having home was a haven for letting our hair down possibly have a bad effect on other family members of they are too weird. Yeah shouldn't they act reasonably normally. Well that's or the give and take comes in if you're going to flip your gasket there. You got a perm at your parents to be kind of weird too and they're going to call you the weird teenager. You've got every right to call him stodgy old mixed up grown ups you know because they are. What can you do to convince your mother to trust you. I'm sure a girl wrote that it looks like a girl's handwriting and it's certainly a girl type problem although it appears that applies also to those of us who are followers. And I have a flip answer to this

that may or may not help. I don't think you can. I don't think you ought to have to. So you see right here I'm on the side. I don't think that if a teenagers in a situation where he feels he has to convince the woman who gave birth to him. The woman who shares his blood. The woman who has nurtured him or her from early life to the present time. And if during the teenage years that woman really feels she can't trust yours she can't believe in you. I don't think the responsibility ought to be yours. I think the problem is on Mom's side. And as I said very much in the beginning. We as parents have all kinds of worries you know. We assume that you're not trustworthy always kind and we have these things that go on in our head but I don't think we really mean it. I think it's part of our unwillingness to recognize that you're

growing up you know all that you don't need us and the idea you can go off and be well-behaved and do the right thing without us is kind of deflating. So I think part of our difficulty as parents in understanding you is our reluctance. In admitting you know in a way that we've done a good job. Now that. I think about that in one part of your mom's trouble she can't trust you. Has her difficulty in admitting she's done a good job. You know a lot of moms and dads around today can't give themselves credit. For what they've done right there's a prevailing attitude particularly in the Christian society. That is self demeaning. It's it's not right or it's not appropriate to recognize that you've done a good job. Now I don't mean we should go around breaking and I'm sure like with football players I would be not going to say gee I really didn't do a great job today is going to be modest kind of stuff. But

if he's a reasonably comfortable guy he's going to feel satisfied because he did a good job. You see now this is where people differ. Some people can do a good job and feel oh yes I did a good job. Honestly I'm not going to go around and offend people by bragging about it and being obnoxious but I'm happy I did a good job. And there are many of us as parents who have trouble with. Kids at your age accepting the fact that we have done well and we kind of worry that maybe we didn't do well and we kind of worry because we didn't do well that you're not going to do well and you see the vicious circle that get started. I'm not sure I've been a good mother. When I talk with parents most of what I say is try to try to help them to recognize they are good parents and they come back with all sorts of reasons why they are. And I think this is what's going on with many moms who give you the feeling that they don't trust you. I think it's really they're saying I'm not sure that I did the right thing in raising their

really criticizing themselves. Now you can't go and psychoanalyze them and get them to understand this. But if you have this in your head maybe it will help you to recognize that the test of your trustworthiness is your own conscience not what your parents think or say. And there will inevitably be times when your parents will think that you have done something or that you have been involved in something and will act as if they didn't trust you. If you know you didn't there's no problem. Let's see. Why do grown ups and teenagers have such gaps of understanding. Grown ups know times are changing. Good This leads me to another general point. It is impossible. For generations to cross generational lines and understanding in a mutual way. In other words everything that we know all about from anthropology from

history from psychology from psychiatry indicates that there cannot be close mutual understanding between people of different ages. In other words the problems of being in the golden years are different from the problems of being in the middle years are different from the problems of being a teenager are different from the problems of being a child and this has always been true and always will be true. Because. Age produces different things in your bodies and minds. And the experience that each generation has had has been different. So there are always will be. A difference in generations and at this point my opinion is there always will be a conflict in generations because I think that the younger generation coming up must in evitable way threaten the older generation in order to establish itself. Those of

us who are older have developed a degree of comfort in a way of living that to us has been hard won. And that to us must be preserved. We don't want to have less money. We don't want to have less property. We don't want to have less influence. We'd be crazy if we did that. Anyone who really goes around giving up all these things now. The younger generation comes along and wants the things that we have or like it are better actually better. And in Abbottabad this is going to mean differences in opinion differences in points of view differences maybe at the level of physical conflict so that we find as psychiatry's that we come with what might be a pessimistic view in the eyes of others. But I don't think it's pessimistic I think it's optimistic because just as at one time it was necessary in communities for us to have family feuds with guns shooting at each other like in some parts of the country.

Now we have our conflict in communities through football games and through organized athletics. And our point is this that there are better ways of having conflict than killing each other better ways than creating destruction of a gross degree so that our view is that this conflict will ultimately hopefully come out in a constructive way and will stimulate change. I would very much be on the side of the youth for the teenager today who says listen to me I've got something to say. I want to participate. I'm also very much on the side of the older person who says yes I'll let you participate but look young man like this. But you're talking about now. We did before. And let me tell you how it worked out. You see there is the enthusiasm and brightness and

freshness and the new idea kind of thing coming up here. There is the experience for better or worse it's coming over here. And when the two get together a better answer can come out. So I'm on both sides of this fence. And again I feel that conflict for a while maybe violent but ultimately at a constructive level is a part of what we can stamp it out. The history of every civilization that I'm aware of has indicated that you're never been able to squash a rising generation. There are some of us who hang on to the power that we have until death takes us. But inevitably you're going to lose it. Younger people will prevail. You have been listening to Dr. Jack S. Westman professor of psychiatry at the University of Wisconsin Medical School as he discussed the emotional problems of teenagers in a lecture in titled Why students crack up. This was the first in a

series of programs drawn from the 1968 Wisconsin work week of Health a project originally designed for teenagers and held in Madison under the sponsorship of the State Medical Society of Wisconsin and the Wisconsin physicians service Blue Shield. These programs are made available by W agency the University of Wisconsin. This is the national educational radio network.