Professional Training - Room 8 - Reel 3

He will be the same. Exactly why I cannot find I cannot find that she'd use the same techniques to hold occasional My Love Lucy show as you do on the economy are very solidly designed Lucy Well at least my paper only bought CBS report the difference the difference is what Frank suggested debacle that it you know he looked up something he so you've got to have a good program on the Vatican. They assume that your interest dissolves at. 20 while they are young they don't know the result they make no assumptions that you make an assumption that every member of the audience is going to is going to take part in some ongoing structure. That's right reply if they are going along you know at least quislings. You know what you're going to get but there's no there's there's no continuum here and there's no there's no compulsion on the part of these people to present a total picture.

In other words there's a great deal of difference between a course in social anthropology that CBS special on the TV a program and in the Alabama Tennessee game but there's a difference in folks like apology and physics too. But no I'm talking about a difference in terms of objectives and the kind of emphasis that must be made in social anthropology and it gives the if the case history is the TDA program in the Tennessee about 8 percent Asian social anthropology must be more concerned with accuracy with background and with your wife on the other hand. The CD especially is concerned with a headline type thing. These are the highlights the sorts of dramatic things and short the dramatic things hold your attention but they do not

teach you anything they are less than accurate the story has not been told. You have not word. You have just been exposed to somewhat for whatever works and great. One of our good teaching you don't think good teaching uses some techniques and they're not the same as I love Lucy. That's a point to make. But what really what you're saying is now that every listener must be motivated and so that regardless of the communication regardless that he wants to get that object and the professor standing there and running away people will pay no attention must get the constant wars. I don't think we're dealing with our united love the same problem with a different. You're part of you without it I think. If one were to keep broadcasting and film and teach from the heart of your capabilities of the instrument then. So then how do you become another. Thank you beautiful education or can reward work force. But what you first got written for you and this includes such things as the light dollar cuts all that because I think these are likeable

sometimes or sometimes rather when the really good educational television or the station closer than those of a better place for the most part of the people haven't bothered with these kinds of the last letter. Yes it was right here. We were right between the characters ducking out. To light. Yeah well you know that's true but I think if I understand what you're saying is that as long as you are true to the content and the context in which you're working that you can

apply these same same dramatic emphasis to the points that need to be emphasized are that are the areas that need to be highlighted in this area as well as you would in the entertainment area. And this I can agree but you do it for different purposes and therefore the techniques of application must be different. It must be subordinate to cutting it off. That must never be showing your TV and every show you were doing because that's right in your theatrical production or in your entertainment area. Right. You can do these to be cute. One of the most horrible problems that we have in people coming out of your schools of of broadcasting whatever they may be and wherever is the tendency to be cute pushing the buttons. There is more tendency to be cute. The more tendency to use dissolves and all of these things for the sake of the technique not for the sake of communication this is a definite point in the school

of writing for this stuff but you can call it the classroom teacher makes the same mistake when she first goes out the school you know she doesn't think she's got a word that you know that isn't the right into it. But just because the student has been part of some techniques of broadcasting and then this uses them in certain situations you know don't blame the school rather accept or accept the thing that I'm blaming the school of broadcasting that is the broadcasting corrections for is that what he's been taught these tricks. That's fine. I'm I'm on par with that with within reason. He hasn't been taught what he ought to do use those tricks far you see we disagree. Do you think he may not. Where you just come get this is the feeling like you're saying that style is really really good education and he made. I just wish redraws the table the same I said cuts and is offering pricing for it is a constant dissolvable phase and sume reason why it was and what have you. I'm not

important there only essential and what. You don't want to do that you get with the program money and it's truly beginning directors and you'll see you'll see the sins of your guy like 20 gauge was St. Louis or you'll see on commercial stations. These people are playing with their new found strength and they get out of their system after a while if only because of your program director Michael or that we do have so many people who have maturity will come running now and don't it's all just because you have this nice little clique and if you were filming the court you $83 it would take a week come back from the lab and you can do it all yourself. But I'm sure that every character Ali they had a broadcasting apartment well students do this and some colleges and universities the professor you don't get what I mean break it it's the face of the pleasures of a lot of credit for any of the broadcasting business. Well I neuer obviously said nothing. And all of it.

You assume that there's a there's an example here though that might point up just a little bit that's a field that I have to be very familiar with and that is the feelings of partners. Terry Cutler OK Frank thanks a lot. In medical photography you can be a very good photographer and you can know a deal about likes the exposure and the quality of the film. I was the sort of thing. But if you're going to be a medical photographer then you have to forget you know forget about exposure you're in you don't forget about that. The simple techniques are complicated cases and maybe photography. Your basic photography remains but you cannot take the best photographer in the country and.

The mental medical laboratory and make a medical doctor follow because the emphasis and the total technique is different and this I've been through myself and I have learned to migrate this way that I wasn't even fit to set up the camera in this laboratory and I had a lot of other people students of mine went through the same experience. I think this is essentially what we're talking about when trying to say that to you there are general thing and technically perhaps we do have some common ground here. Certainly because we're using the common field. But I simply do not believe that you can blink brain on Broadway and Madison Avenue into the classroom. Whether this be a classroom of the air or general adult education in which we hope to improve understanding are going to be systematic education in the classroom the schools were caught. I think that there must be a difference here. And if there is a difference then there must

perforce be a difference in technique. Now these differences in techniques the various techniques may be great or small but they are there and I don't think that if we can serve our purpose of educational broadcasting at whatever level. By continuing to ignore them and assuming that we can do it one trainee people for employment in the BGB at ABC or whatever and next and expect them to come in and do the job here. I think we need a new breed of cat and I think this is what we're talking about that I wrote what I was referring to. For what there was for a lower place was it was not a one shot this was a complete course and actually it was LOL I'm a hearing where Mike Myers was for the following parable it was a book about the videotape war

and the same here. Farley wrote quite a bit of the history of our club universe with both the moderately each day had a different special code from various parts of the universe for why the change of pace and of course one of the great with with the course of the fight. Your talk radio project is. Actually the timing of what the White House was fighting with the president. Like hear me say that this is like that is a very you know it's like editing education where you put it in the old girl you don't like the way I don't quarrel with yours and it wasn't like the world I always

hated it that all all of our educational broadcast that we call education broadcasting is not within this context I think the point you made as well take it easy because I'm sure you are right when you know the number of viewing hours when youngsters about two years old so he doesn't watch commercials and watch you speak 5 0 relaxing now I'm reading in the school we have the same kind of you're there. Oh yes you feel there is a differentiation so we approximate close to the commercial. Then where's the learnings farces. So there is a point. Keep things simple without losing sight of the basic fact that he what he was talking about therapy to the dramatic values that all the basic answers and not just theatrical purposes this can't possibly keep coming back to what does

this say for our let's say undergraduate curriculum. How do we change it. You know to meet the kind of thing that you're bringing up not what we teach anyway that we're not already well to far I receive Christ right. Some of the with this statement he made about the differences. But I'm not at all sure that we know how to teach those differences and we have nothing to go on except the way they do it. I don't think our director is that we get to the NBC director's Aki dark glasses I'm not sure they can do any better in making this distinction than we could describe states. Perhaps this is a problem it will be like I'd like to go up a little bit to your question. We could assume you're a good man and we value talk about talking about. One more good Schumer example of people who are going to be crying are already educated option with legal they are on the wrong a graduate level

and not now facing all the way right now to matters that we think about I would think that we first talked to some way to expose these people to communications theory that I would take right now I would win the seat in the Great Society one step further. Show me any case projects like this are valuable for the community here the value of the teacher was also communicated and everybody else was really oh it was the one about general the man Jesus is a fresh start date below. Oh markets teaches a class first rate to a fresh look at the top rate they least exposed us in our case it will forgive you for that we do it this way but just to speak to the school that I would think we ought to do something right. Communication and society thinking and planning. And then I would think we ought to do something about about understanding immediately the site when it would be

ok what is radio or television or film and I was with are being bashed or ashamed and if I can all teach exactly what these things do I'm going my per production technique and the relative liberty issue how one lives better. Some tricky stuff for another late on the line and here's practically your wish to do and then the last thing I would suggest is correct we have some avenue to go in that problem now it has to be educational television or a long line of people how to do crafts and taking part of the curriculum or sort of occasion in some way come to know and understand the teacher instructor. So it's not so hard is that despite that he doesn't understand what the educators and if younger and did not wish to be an educational or educational bill or a shit radio that

you can do is study and worship. But I would think that one could conceive of greatly floozies for life. I'm not talking. Of course you know you get up and down the court on the phone to talk about what are the content you got to know I think I think you've got something there. The the only question arises minor like this isn't us isn't as pretty well highlighted in your statement that while you teach first was communication on the freshman level you're not sure that the freshmen know you anything but well of course this is this is approximate We hope we'll let you go from there. No formal course very difficult by a lot of people but we hope they're given the wherewithal to go on to appropriate course of responsibilities. Course a production course and most of us understand why they keep going back to this very process

again but we bring in is the same here not after the first introduction to a not as a formal course. More people they've been given the wherewithal to do it. This is more emphasis on the capabilities and limitations more conscious throughout. Oh I'm sure it's all what Israeli leaders talk this way toward what is relationship here between this communication course and teaching learning processes that are taught in Educational Psychology and cetera in schools for education I wonder. We don't need a new breed of cat. The change may have come when we need to consciously train at the college level. A television teacher or a book can sting teach undergraduate Well I'm not quite sure of the moment let me hear the fighters for a moment for cites. If we don't we're

training people to be teachers in a traditional classroom and then we say after you've had some experience in the traditional classroom then you come back to me and we will give you a graduate program in making a better teacher out of you and make such a good teacher out of you that he can teach. It would be better if you're selling me pretty well here I think you're coming in loud and clear. Maybe time this time to abandon that stout traditional culture and say The time has come when we need to teach someone who is a physics major and communicators minor who will know his physics so well you see I have learned English majors physics majors who knows his physics so well that he is acceptable to the physics department. But then he also is a new media communicator here that he can teach physics on

television without going through the physics classroom. I'm not sure I've sold myself on this I'm not sure SOME anybody else and I don't think anybody's doing the duck I want to know your counselor the one element that's missing there in your mind that is. Does he know how to communicate. Need to know how to communicate this to sixth grade. Is it different from you getting physics to a college kid. I would hope so. I'm just wondering how much time we're going to waste while he's in the classroom sitting on the desk and he's not alone. Let's hope for the week. Specialist the story. In other words you're missing in our team approach. That's how it was. Yes Lou my opening statement just before

dark when you mention the word psychology so much did it seem to me that maybe the psychology your approach might be the key to the difference between actual versus your educational approach what is the Berbers are you going to utilize your knowledge of human behavior to accomplish your educational system. You got detention you've got the rigors of bike racers the commercial television. You've got to get their attention. So once you take your kid with all your attention there is lightning I think LOL. You're free for you but it has been suggested here that the differential that

she was talking about and levels of understanding is handled or could be handled here in a team approach on this is something that has been mentioned this time that normally in classroom teaching are even to some extent and in the preparation of general material whether it's a documentary by a local commissar lecturer by some by Edward Teller. You were here having one person do the job. But when we get into television and this is true of course of good commercial television and it says this must be even more true. Why as of educational television on the whatever level you're hearing more than one person involved you're having this producer director you're hemming the teacher and at least in the organization that I have

anything to do with you have someone then that is a kind of a curriculum supervising specialist who has some basic understanding of grade levels. I'm going through this particular problem right now. So here is a team approach and maybe maybe this team approach ought to have some place in our in our a professional level education system here and I guess we're going to have a certificate for. We had an interesting development our speech for interdisciplinary communication. Our program as minor. For majors and speech are right there. So far just like in life here. All right Ari cation is applying to have certain other communication only Carse's double listed in education. They want communications courses themselves. So they're not I mean they haven't in

their structure right now any room for a minor in communications arts. But they feel it's neat. I really got over some of this. Closer to the dish where I can usually get a handle on. But each department offers a credit separate track that uses same teachers from courses and you know right. We are learning that history can actually be certain there or maybe it maybe this is part of the answer of the structures that you might think through that there that we don't just need to revise the curriculum or revise the course content with schools of communication or in schools of education but that maybe we need some mergers of some

kind. But I'd like to get back to this question asked back to why we didn't get a correct answer on because he'd gone off on another tangent up and let us assist. This is you know I'm paid attention which it did I would like to ask Dr. Hunter This may be where you analyze the difference and this is open to anybody answer that the audiences back at him in the way the game the jointness always has one wherein lies the difference in this course in communication communication communication and the psychology courses in education teaching learning process one of the basic differences here are are we are we just mixed up semantically world of the last time somebody gets although I'm not I was not particularly good at that.

Fighting Our basic problems all comes back to life like a girl said but we couldn't get you know intermarriage between partners so he can draw out springs from both. But I do say he's coming back. What stands out a lot of the others we've got to get well in our area we have more channels like educational television program to him and the boys picture you paint in five or 10 or 15 years is greatly supported that go along with it but in the meantime we've got all these hundreds of teachers bringing programs into their classrooms without one idea about how to use. I think we've got to get in these groups of education get hold of these teachers right and get them to make the best use of what they've already got and then plan kind of dress ourselves somewhere in the vicinity of the stranger's programs around charade so much about what we can get this is a problem or the money. Boy I was like. Like anything but that one was a real problem here is that if we don't really know the story or.

Say what unique is of course the site of course or something close to how we utilize television all the way to classrooms and what are you selling you know where are you going to get the money to hire me or cheat or lifelines and as you provide great course they already. Revised my course because already they are all right money of the one we want to meet Well your goal for all these little kids education in the U.S. right. Back seat of our radio television Bagley's that are nerds are concerned with primarily about teaching the other it up it originally come to very you know I was only going to teach it was a sure thing. Well if we don't lose weight you do it. I don't think the lighting order. Or at least we got it without any drugs they don't list it you delete it. I mentioned nation because we need to be in education. Well the one thing we're here we're here of course.

Thank God she could say I'm not alone and this is one of the problems in our less pollution is a problem of adding a course or is correct figure and this is one of the techniques one of the practical problem you better go back and revise the courses you've got not say the brick you want to call the police are going to do this and that is having an education that I can hardly speak my heart. Having education evolve. She wrote I think the right guy. It will probably have to be proved popular in Spanish on all the TV spines on television there is no reason to see some facilities beautiful on someplace. Like ours they are usually I get three free offer you get remark made over there this business of us myriad education courses the way we have all been doing so many years we've got to do our double take on that and we've got to support the

call you a person rather than rushing over here to this business if utilization in the classroom. And if we don't care so if we don't do the training who's going to do it. We've got to do this training because we're the ones that know how to do it at least made me think we are. It was absolutely nuts and I support it. Again we are confronted by the question what are we talking about again I am involved in this particular thing at the present time. We have people. Andy in the Samoan situation that come to us from good programs and they say Earl Yes oh yes yes I believe and educational television instructional television and I know all about it

and I'm for it 100 percent. And when we get them there and put them on the job they jump back at Har like they had just been bitten by a rattlesnake you know and they say why this isn't the way you do it. And you talk to them about three minutes and you find out that they're. Definition of instructional television is an enrichment program twice or three times a week and they are suddenly confronted with the total curriculum. Each course and the total content of each course being taught by television all day long and they've been backed by writers like you. My comment here was that the path to this kind of teaching may be the sixth grade classroom. It may be through a special specially tailored program designed to

provide them with content to teach with newer media for teaching. But what we found out of course in these in the three areas that are of enrichment that of supplementing the classroom instruction and this is true at school level is college level and of total instruction of course there's really no such thing as total instruction in one place or it's got to be some thinking and talking and research and everything else. But the problem comes in instructing the teacher in the classroom what he or she ought to do. With this program if it's a total so-called total program in which the concepts the great ideas are taught by television and the classroom is used for reinforcement in emphasis or whether it's the other way around the big ideas are taught in the classroom and are supplemented and reinforced by the television or whether the reinforcement and they and the great ideas are employed in the

classroom and you are provided with some enrichment materials that could be provided any other way as a kind of a super audio visual or service. Obviously you mean you need to use. You need different techniques in the classroom to use these at least three different ways and I don't I think it's I think that it's very possible that all of these techniques are going to be used continually in different degrees. So even if we come down to this who's going to teach it if we don't and if we teach it then what are we going to teach. Can we ourselves are we at a point where we can subdivide this utilization of the customers. I don't think I've gotten a clear cut answer to that. The moment I do this is something that we've got to go home and work on with schools of education and with subject matter areas and with the the people who know most about

broadcasting means for you to give people what you do. Would you agree that that there is this area of discrimination that must be considered. I think it's been a lot of we've been building somewhere them liars all over the place like ourselves you say just because we know some of it just because we know education. We know. All the rest. Well it was a gathering and you know when we say it's art are you called a teacher. Maybe so but I say we maybe have to go out and hire that other man that we don't know well you can find it hard to keep perhaps the teen isn't as anyone does anyone know with any situation in a college classroom in this kind either in education our communications work the team has been used to learn a specialist in one thing and another specialist another.

I. Could write anything but the thing you said is that you're thinking of using television as you may be on some or all of the foetal teaching device to be used. Whatever use was put at HMRC. Yes I mean if it were British then this implication of this of course is that the teacher is no longer the central source of the information that many sectors of the teachers job now changes rather than being an information source is not going to be a person who uses the Socratic method or some other method of obtaining information to write elsewhere and make yourself useful here. You kind of can probably go far better because it will reach teachers of one of their export jobs and you increase the enormous skill of the good teacher in trying to get people to understand that use of the Fort Lee Lee said. And all we've seen so far in the educational process. I'm certain this isn't happening just in some more. It's home everywhere everywhere.

The classroom teacher becomes the person who coordinates for Regis introduces us to the follow on I took with these phrases with a lot of physical action words by means of film by the film strips of tape and television and so on. The Russian teacher is no longer that the one source of information I think is rather interesting to know that I have to defend the situation in Washington the other day and where where we have this on the basis we have this total protection Mark teaching in the classroom and we insist upon having a 16 millimeter projector and an overhead projector and a slide projector available as screens and whatnot in the classroom. And some of these people nearly fit. They said what you're going right back in I don't know. We're going right forward.

But the teacher still only sees things to do the kind of reinforcement that's necessary the kind of the PC term. A while ago I forget what it was but it says it's the fault of the Socratic method of identification of yourself falling down down closed doors going along yes you don't like our ideas to what is the what's the schedule here in general. Well I think we had better read about the rescuer sizzling shit Zahra never lived there or the any longer or at least I'm sure Harry I haven't haven't found the United States it's going willingly for a foreign war service of a kind for getting together. Gad that clock at the Commodore carrying this is

a very nice little room up by the way and our size for me. But don't let this die here there are some things that need to be carrying out shall we.